you probably don't know

this, but you were probably

the inspiration as to why

I got into Passive House

with your Our Woods

project when it come out.

saw that come out and I

was like, oh, this thing's

possible and I was only

starting to learn about it.

So, who are you?

I am just one human trying

to do things better.

And when I did that

project, I was essentially

a soul practitioner.

, had moved away from

Melbourne to regional

Victoria, started up a

practice, fell into it.

I never thought I was going

to run my own business,

but I kept following my

gut and it was like, okay,

I'm running a business now.

And that project sort of

just turned up and the

right builders at the

right time, you know,

you guys know the vibe

when everything just

kind of syncs up in the

way it's meant to be.

the client and I met with

a bunch of builders, , but

Stuart Lee who ended up

building it said, Oh, I've

been thinking about this

whole passive housing.

Are you into that?

And I said, Yeah.

Yes, absolutely.

I've been so keen, but I

hadn't brought it up yet

because I didn't know any

builders who knew about

it and it's still so new.

So I turned up to things

like the passive house

conference and thought I

was so late to the party.

You know, I was 10

years behind because

we were so far behind

the rest of the world.

I seriously had no idea

that that was still

one of, the first.

certified passive house

homes in Victoria and

the country and that

we'd broken away from

kind of the German model

of a white box into,

hey, you can still do

something that has these

biophilic design elements.

You can have lots

of natural light.

You can have courtyards

and connection to the

outdoors and a bunch of

other constraints, bushfire

zone, all of these things.

And yet we could still

make it passive house.

So I think that's why it

did get a lot of attention

you said a term before

Talena, that some people

probably have heard of,

but probably don't know

what the definition is.

And I think that this

particular term is

going to become more

relevant, prevalent, And

people are going to be

striving for it more in

my, this is my opinion.

And I think, you know,

where I'm going with this.

Can you please explain

to the listeners what

biophilic design is?

Really, like it's a term

that was coined many, many

years ago , it's really

about our human innate

connection to nature.

And this really comes

back to the fact that

we are nature over many

years of colonization

and settlement and, how

we now live our lives.

A lot of us have lost that.

Deep, intrinsic knowing

that we are a part of

nature, we are absolutely

inextricably linked.

And so the crisis that

are happening with

the planet in terms

of climate change and

ecosystem and biodiversity

collapse, all of that.

That's all linked to us.

Our health is

all interlinked.

And so part of this

obviously comes to the

work we do around energy

efficiency and, reducing

carbon footprints.

But it goes way more than

that in terms of our mental

health is affected by

being Outdoors in nature.

And so if we are spending

up to 90 percent of

our time indoors or

whatever this local, you

know, latest statistics

are, it actually also

benefits us to have.

connection inside,

whether that's natural

light, fresh air and

good ventilation systems,

plants, uh, natural

materials, textures,

pattern, color, all sorts

of different things.

And it's also though,

really important to go.

It's not just about

the fact that.

Humans feel better when

we're in nature and we

benefit from nature.

It's actually a

reciprocal relationship.

It really is like the

more we are paying

attention and being a

part of, the outdoors and

caring for mother earth.

the more that it's this

feedback loop of, it's

caring for country like

that, all indigenous

people across the

whole world know this.

This is not a new thing.

So this is why when you

say it's gonna become

more and more important.

It is.

'cause it's, it's

a deep remembering.

It's not something new.

It's actually something

so, so very ancient , but

we've been so distracted

by modern technologies

and everything that

Yeah, we have to, we have

to come back to this.

And I think, you know,

in many ways it might

be the only thing that.

Helps save us all

in the future.

I think one of the things

that you've been doing

really well for a long

time, and you talked about,

, one of your first Passive

House projects that you

were talking about before,

that, you know, that is a

Passive House, a certified

Passive House project,

but you also said that

there's a lot of biophilic

design wrapped up in that.

If we're thinking about

Passive House to bring

back into control, like

the internal environment,

in my mind, they kind

of fight against each

other a little bit.

Can you explain to the

listeners how you as

an architect, I guess,

break down that barrier

and, and explain to us

how they can actually

, coexist with one another?

Yeah, I really hate talking

about awards, but I do have

to draw attention to the

fact that another house

we did, which is called

the Huff and Puff House,

recently also got a bunch

of awards, but particularly

, the biophilic design

award through the

living future institute.

, it shared its category

with, you know,

an incredible big

commercial project.

but the reason I'm saying

that is because often with

passive house, there's

this perception that.

The doors and windows

are always closed because

yes, we want to, , control

our internal environment.

But people often go,

Oh, but then I'm so

disconnected from the

outdoors and I'm not

going to be able to feel

in tune with nature.

So this particular

project, Huff and Puff

House is built of straw.

So it has all this

you know, beautiful

natural lime render.

It has lovely local

timbers, uh, exposed

aggregate in the

polished concrete.

It's got really lovely

material features that

give it that sense of

connection to nature, but

they also have these big

views out, which we thought

we won't be able to do.

South facing views, because

we all know solar passive

design, we have to have our

north windows, and south

facing windows are a no no.

So, one of the first things

about this was with the

PHPP thermal modelling,

we were able to get our

energy balance right,

and we were able to have

our big south facing

windows that had a view

and connection to nature.

you know, we've got every

single room has openable

doors and windows.

So yes, the client can

still open them up and step

outside anytime they want,

but they often don't open

them because it's windy

and it's hot and dusty and

the pollens and grasses and

everything's blowing in, or

it's frigging freezing and

they're in high country.

It's not a lot of snow

there, but it's getting

colder and colder in

winters, so they love

having that climate

control inside and their

favourite thing they

said was that birds and

echidnas and things come

right up to their windows

and their little dogs

inside and yapping away

and the animals on the

other side can't even

hear their little dog.

so they've got this

lovely relationship where

they are doing all this

bird watching with all

this wildlife because

the triple glazing is

an acoustic seal, but

not a visual seal.

But if they go and just

like open, you know,

crack open the kitchen

window, they can still

hear the bird song.

So they've absolutely

loved that it's actually

given them a closer

connection to wildlife.

But also they've had

snakes come to visit.

And so they've also

been very grateful that

their doors are open.

Always closed.

So the snakes

don't come in.

So I, I feel like this

project was another

little beacon of hope.

If you like to kind of

say, Hey, you can do a

passive house with straw,

you can do a passive house.

That's biophilic design.

You can still have this

connection with nature

and those clients are

still just singing.

It's praises to anyone

who listen about how

comfortable and healthy

it is to be inside.

you made a comment about

the open door thing.

it's a question that

I actually get a fair

bit from clients.

Like we like to keep our

windows open a lot of the

time, even during winter.

Are you finding that you

have clients that they

might say that and they

live with their windows

and doors open during the

year but when they move

into a healthy, comfortable

house, they actually then

don't open them at all.

So I'm finding hard to

navigate that conversation.

Like, it's hard to convince

someone up front that

you're not going to do it.

Yeah, and and we always

say yes, of course you can.

You can open them every day

of the year if you want to.

It's just probably

not very smart if it's

four degrees outside

or 40 degrees outside.

It's choice.

yeah, and look, some of

our projects, including

that the Huff and Puff

one, we're going to

be designed around big

outdoor areas as well.

But then they wanted all

the mosquito screens and

fly screens because it had

allergies and it's just

A hotspot for insects.

And so over the course

of the design process,

we designed that out

because they said,

Oh, actually, yeah, we

don't know how often

we're going to use it.

So that got drastically

reduced and they actually

spend more time indoors

in their beautiful,

comfortable living area.

And yet if they want to

go outside, they're out in

the veggie patch and out

attending to the orchard

and they're out on the

land, but not just sort

of sitting around getting

bitten by mosquitoes in

another kind of caged

outdoor space, which is

what it would have had

to have been otherwise.

So the house that you grew

up when you're younger,

did that influence you

into where you've got to

stay with your design or

the way that you design,

if that makes sense?

it did.

So it was a very old 1920s

weatherboard shack kind of,

you know, a wooden tent.

Have you heard of those?

I hear there's

a couple around.

So we had one of those.

Yeah,

my

bedroom was.

freezing.

Um, that house

was really cold.

But when I was five,

about five, my dad and my

grandfather built a big

solar passive extension

with we were sort of in

the Eltham area, which is

known for its mud bricks.

And we didn't have that,

but we had these handmade

bricks and all exposed

bricks inside and, you

know, lots of glazing

and the slate floors

and fully, you know,

hardwood timber kitchen.

So, you know, I've

got photos of me on

the building site.

I only remember a little

bit about it, but clearly

that helped influence.

My dad wasn't a builder.

He was a graphic designer,

but he drew the plans.

My grandfather

was a carpenter.

Um, so, yeah, they

were very handy.

So they owner built all

that and definitely,

yeah, had an, because

that, the new extension,

it was, it was lovely.

Probably didn't have

as much insulation and

as airtight and as no

double glazing back then.

But that was the.

Early 80s?

Advanced first time.

. Have you always wanted

to be an architect?

I think since building

cubby houses as a kid and

building Lego, like I get

Lego sets all the time and

I build it to the little

instructions and then go,

yeah, I can do better.

And I pull it apart

and build my own.

I've got floor plans.

I was drawing as a kid.

I wanted to be a interior

designer for about

five minutes and then

went, I want to do more

than just cushions.

Interior designers just

don't do cushions as

I know, I know, I'm looking

at my interior design team,

You know what, Erin,

Erin has just like,

the hairs have gone

up on the back of her

chest now and she's

like cringing right now.

no, no, no, my interior

designers are not interior

decorators, but I, I love

my interior designers

because they spend so much

time doing all of the.

Functional beautiful

sustainable things that

they do and then yeah,

I'm more holistic about

the bigger picture too,

because we have to be about

around the details and

the big picture, right?

So you made a comment

before, you said the

word volume builder.

And I had a question here,

why do you care so much?

But I think it's

pretty obvious why

you care so much.

And you're also probably

vocal about building

better for maybe less

vulnerable people.

As well, like I think

you've spoken about

that in the past.

At the moment, the volume

building industry does

not cater for that.

And then you see

their suburbs that are

popping up with these

volume builder homes.

And we understand that

to serve a purpose

because people need

to live somewhere.

What's your whole take on

that side of the industry?

I had this sort of uh,

argument with, uh, it

was an architect who was

working on a really big

sort of apartment building

for women and children,

you know, at risk, and

they were racing to get

it over the line and just

get them a place to live

because they were homeless

and said, but if you're

building that building

now, and it hasn't started,

why wouldn't you, Put

that money towards making

sure it's healthier now

and more comfortable.

There won't be

fuel poverty.

There won't be

paying too much in

heating and cooling.

Their kids aren't

going to have asthma

or other respiratory,

you know, issues.

I'm like, why wouldn't

you do that now?

It's like, oh,

it's a time thing.

We just have to get it

over the line now because

They're homeless and

need a home right now.

I'm like, I get that, but

if this wasn't to slow

things down you're built,

you're investing in us now

and really it's already

going to be out of date

by the time you build it.

It's already behind, you

know, it's on last year's

code or a building code

from three years ago and

that stuff just really

frustrates

isn't that a lot of houses

in general, like just not,

not the volume builder

side of things, because

I do, I do understand it.

Like, we actually need to

get these houses out there.

We need to provide a place

for these people to live,

but they're also the most

vulnerable and they're

also the people that

usually, unfortunately,

can't afford to build to

the standard that we do

design to, we build to.

Where's the gap?

the whole system sort of

messed up because anyone

who's working in sort of

the space of understanding

building science and

healthier buildings

knows that it doesn't

necessarily have to take

any longer or be more

complicated as long as it's

inbuilt into the process.

Like, yes, if you want

to tack it on at the end.

Sure, that's going to be

a bit more complicated

and yes, it would add

more costs because it

hasn't been designed

from the outset.

But if the system

changed to include

these things from the

start, it would be okay.

And

design for performance.

It's not a, it's

not a bolt And it's

They can spend what

they want on it.

They can live

how they want.

Isn't that the

whole argument?

It's my house, I'll,

if I want to heat

it, I'll heat it.

suppose that, yeah,

there's different things.

If you're talking

about someone who's

renting or yeah, they've

paid to live in it.

Like, yeah, there's a lot

of different scenarios, but

yeah, I do spend this time.

advocating and volunteering

and speaking where I

can because the systems

do have to change.

It's not fair.

And we can't fix it all.

We can't build

every building.

We can, you guys, we

can't design them all.

You can't build them all.

We want to see that message

spread as far and wide.

And look, if you think to

10 years ago, the message

has spread and it's that

ripple effect and it

is getting out there.

It's just not fast

enough, unfortunately.

Where do you think we

are in 10 years then?

I've been wrestling

with this a lot.

I've been reading

and watching and

paying attention.

we're going to have some

difficult times ahead.

I really do believe

that you know, we've

got the climate crisis,

biodiversity crisis, we've

got a housing crisis,

we've got affordability

crisis, potentially

political crisis

happening.

crisis right now, isn't it?

just,

divided.

there's so many things

happening and there

is this acceleration

if you start tuning.

Depending on your current

mental health, I don't

recommend diving into

some of this stuff.

If you're feeling okay

in yourself and We know

I got to a point where

I was, and I was okay to

sort of dive into this.

So there's definitely

grief once you sort of

learn a little bit more

about what's coming.

and there does have to be

different ways of living.

Definitely more, more

collaboration, more co

living, more, more care,

of course, more love, more

shared responsibility,

more reciprocation.

Like there's Yeah,

there is going to be

some tough times ahead.

I

Before we go down.

too much of a political

path and it is on

the topic of divided.

Recently, you became part

of Envirotexture, and

before that, you were

Talena Edwards Architect,

and Andy was Envirotexture.

You guys decided to join up

and I remember, I remember

when it happened, cause

you know, there was this

big kind of Instagram

push towards the end of

one year and I'm like,

what's going on here?

Next minute, you guys

have joined forces.

I would love to know

the reason behind that

because you were doing

amazing things as Talena

Redwoods and Andy has

been doing amazing things

for a long time as well.

What advantage did you

see bringing those two

organizations together?

we can do anything, but

we can't do everything.

And this was part of

me going, I never set

out to run a large

business on my own.

I got to a point where I

was employing five people

and that was kind of at my

capacity like this is, you

know, my kids were still.

Yeah.

Uh, in primary school at

that point in time um,

so we merged two years

ago, but Andy and I had

been talking about the

idea of merging for, uh,

the best part of maybe

four or five years prior

throwing the idea around.

So we met because at

one of the Passive House

conferences, he'd just

done the Thornley Passive

House and Elwood's

Passive House had both

been kind of certified

at exactly the same time.

It was a bit of a race.

Who won?

I think Andy did

cause he was pushier.

And we're both Leo's

we're born a day

apart, funnily enough.

So we,

Hang on, when's your,

when's your birthday?

When's your birthday?

I'm the 14th of August

and he's the 13th.

there's a reason why

we all get along.

I'm the 29th of July,

I'm a Leo as well.

Yes, both, both Leo's

and happy to stand up and

speak about these things.

And so we, like with

the Passive House

community, everyone sort

of finds their, their

little tribe and finds

who to phone a friend.

So we started doing that

regularly to, we talk

about windows, we talk

about fee proposals, we

talk about, you know, what

our clients were saying

around Passive House,

doing things differently.

And we called it mutual

mentoring because we were

helping each other out.

And after a while yeah,

I said, I don't want to

be expanding my business

on my own because I'm

going to lead to burnout.

I was probably close

to burnout at that

point in time because

you can't do it all.

And Andy had been with

EnviroTexture, uh, Best

part of 10 years, I

think, is he'd been there.

He went away and was a

sustainability consultant,

Cox Architects, while,

and then he came back

and became a director.

And Dick Clark has

been running or,

you know, founded at

EnviroTexture in 96, I

think it might've been.

So.

He's still very involved.

He's just stepped back

as a, as a director now.

he does so much

voluntary work.

He's on all these boards

is leading, you know, the

hemp movement and trying

to get that happening is

on the chair of renew.

So he does so many

things in addition to

in varitecture that he

wanted to actually take

a step back from, from

work, work, client work.

And focus a bit more on

the other things as well.

So, it was good timing that

he was about to retire and

Andy didn't want to run

EnviroTexture by himself.

And it really just came

down to this gut feeling

of going, Andy's a really

good bloke, Dick's a really

good bloke, they've been

running this for so long,

we had this really trusted

friendship, and there's

no way I would have gone

into business with anyone

else on a whim cause yeah,

we're good friends, and

we support each other,

we respect each other, we

trust each other, and the

motto we had at the time

was Stronger Together.

So how have you gone

doing their love jobs?

Because us in EnviroTexture

have a history of

doing love jobs.

And do you want to

speak about that and

explain what they are?

Yeah we're in the middle

of getting our website

rebuilt and the copywriter

wasn't sure about the

term love jobs, you

know, and said, Oh, maybe

it should be pro bono.

And we're like, Oh, like

we, we love all our jobs.

We do.

They're all love jobs,

but we have a particular

little category that's

over the years, they sort

of just pop up out of the

blue for various reasons.

And we do them.

For free and in fact,

I should have done this

for a very long time.

I've done, I did a bunch

myself when I was just

running my own practice.

And we also have things in

there like the little pot

of gold, which you guys are

familiar with, which became

a big research project

and, uh, a presentation

and a whole website.

So things like that

end up being a love

job because they are

hundreds and thousands

probably hours work.

Things that we don't get

paid for that we really

love helping out with.

So we've had a large

hempcrete house that was

for triplets that all

had muscular dystrophy.

So I wasn't

involved with that.

Dick and Andy did up

in New South Wales.

So it was about creating,

helping create a family

home for them, for three

kids that are wheelchair

bound and Electronic, you

know, wheelchairs, and

that's a very different

house to, you know, it

has to be a custom house.

been involved with schools

overseas I've helped

out with a community

garden so different

things come and go.

And something that we've,

that's sort of popped

on the radar at the

moment is A potential

co living space.

For, well, it's not,

it's not just for women,

it's for others as well.

But at the moment, the

people who are driving the

project are mainly women

and to go, how can we come

together as a community

and live a bit differently

and have veggie gardens

and be self sufficient and

just not, you know, women

not do it, having to do

things on their own in the

world, there are different

ages and stages of life.

So that's something we're

starting to help out with

a little bit to see how

we could potentially.

Do some prefabricated

Still frames.

Oh, we don't like

still frames, but

don't be cheeky.

So, you know, you look at

tiny houses, transportable

houses, pods, all

these things out there.

And if you try and buy

one, there's very few that

are trying to do any of

building science and the

Passive health principles

and all the good things.

We know.

I'm like, why have they

put a wood fire in?

Why is there gas in there?

Why is it still frame?

Why have they got

no insulation?

Why are they

single glazing?

It's cheaper.

It's also lightweight.

So if it is something like

a house on wheels, yeah,

you know, you can find

can find by space, but

also weight restriction.

So I get it.

There's a lot of

constraints, but it's

really frustrating that

so many of them that,

yeah, they're not even in.

built to quite like

they're, they're not,

I'm gonna say they're

not much better than a

caravan, but a caravan,

like they might look a bit

prettier than a caravan,

they might not function

as well as a caravan.

Yeah, so we're, that's

sort of a little thing

on the side that we're

looking at at the moment

because there's a need for

this kind of stuff out.

I'd love for you to keep

us in the loop of how

that, because I think

solving that problem

not only solves the

reason why you're doing

it in the first place,

but so many other you

know, flood responses,

bushfire responses, you

know, quick, quick, quick

accommodation that's

healthy and functional for

people in, in all kinds of

Distressed kind of places.

I'm just want to circle

back to, to, to the

little, the little pot

of gold study you, you

talked about for those

who want to actually watch

that, there's a bit of a

self promotion for SBA.

We've actually got

that sitting on our

website for you to go

and have a look at.

Can I talk about

mental health

and can I talk

about superpowers?

sure.

'cause I know, you know,

I'm pretty open about

my superpowers and my

mental health, and I

certainly think that for

me personally, it's a big

part of, you know, how

I've got to where I am.

Could you share a little

bit about your superpowers?

If you, if you

feel comfortable.

Yeah, absolutely.

So I think it was, uh,

two, three, probably three

years back now, my kids

started getting diagnosed.

They were, they were

not going to school,

having issues with

school, very bright kids.

But something was amiss and

it hadn't been picked up

until they sort of got to.

I don't know, early high

school and grade five,

whatever, you know, it

was nothing was diagnosed

or picked up early on.

And so it turned out that

they were both autistic.

And so I'm like,

they're normal.

They're just like me,

which is a common journey.

And so I went and also got

my own autism diagnosis

and ADHD diagnosis.

Let's throw them both in

there just for extra fun.

Hamish.

Okay.

Double spice.

Double spice.

Alright.

Woo.

I was at a point

where I love my work.

You can hear I'm passionate

about what I do, and

that's, that's partly

the superpower, right?

That you, you're

invested, you care enough

to wanna keep going.

It's this, it's not

always that singular focus

because there's other

things as well, but for

me, it's just like, yeah,

I want this to be right.

Why would you do something

and not do it well?

So for me that, that side

of thing is absolutely

a superpower, but trying

to do it all and getting

super exhausted and not

understanding why it was

like, why can't I keep up?

And from the outside

people would say, but you

were doing so much more.

I'm like, I'm not really,

I don't, I didn't feel

like I was doing more than

the average person, but

this is the whole thing

you don't really know

Are you high

functioning, are you?

well.

Well, see, this is

the thing, right?

High functioning.

Um, I was trained to

be a perfectionist.

I think as a kid, I

just do everything, but

I get exhausted and I

wasn't acknowledging and

I suppose taking that

time out because when

do you take the time out

when you've got a family

and, running a business?

And so I think the

diagnosis actually

came after the merger,

so it wasn't and pop.

And, you know, I've

always been very open

around all those things.

So nothing really changed

in, in, well, it's

nice to have supportive

business partners , and

a team that grew bigger

so that we could hire

more people and run

things more streamlined.

If you've got more

people, you know, you

can diversify in terms of

who's wearing which hat.

So that has

been incredible.

And wonderful, but separate

to that alongside of that.

I realized that okay, so

I can spend my weekends

doing nothing and sometimes

you need to do that,

but more importantly, I

can spend weekends going

for a three hour walk

in the bush and then

I'm just filled back up.

I'm calm.

I'm good.

I've got more energy.

I've reconnected

with my intuition.

I've turned off all

podcasts, all music,

don't listen

to our podcast.

not when I go

walking sometime.

So for a quick

after work, Sure.

But if I do a big walk

on the weekend, no, you

tune out and it's amazing

how rarely us as humans

take that time out and

it was a game changer.

Do you just find when

you just tune out that

you're just like, well,

I'm back home now?

Like, where did the

last three hours go?

Yeah, yeah, and I

just get all this, um,

intuitive insights just

pop into your brain and

you're like, huh, huh.

Like all the answers kind

of come because you've cut

out all the social media

and all the distractions

and all the noise and

all the emails pinging.

And it's just so

important that we do that.

But without the diagnosis,

I probably would have kept

being really hard on myself

and not knowing that it is

technically a disability.

So yes, high functioning

in many ways, but low

functioning in others

in terms of needing

more headspace, needing

that rest, needing that

decompression time.

I'm very social.

I love being a part

of events and things,

but you know, after

going to a conference

or a talk, I need like

a whole day to just.

No one talk to me.

No one.

Do not

disturb.

I remember you and I

having a little bit of a

chat at the Passive House

Conference this year and

it was quite funny because

we were both kind of in

the corner and this may

come to a shock to some

people because I'm a pretty

outgoing kind of person.

I've got no problem

standing up in front

of, you know, a thousand

people and talking.

I get really

energized by that.

But when I'm in a

crowd, I actually

will pull to the side.

Because I need my own

space and I think you

and I were having this

conversation like in the

corner together and we were

both like, we love being

here, but I can't wait to

go back to the hotel room

because this is really

overwhelming right now.

Yeah.

and I don't know if

you feel this too.

I, gave a presentation

at the Passive

House Conference.

All I wanted to

do after that

presentation was leave.

And I had all these

people coming up and

chatting and it was great.

Like I loved it, but I

get so overstimulated

in those environments

and I just need to

go away for even if

it's 10 or 15 minutes

recharge and come back.

So like on one hand, this

is this amazing superpower

that you can get up,

be passionate and be

energised and get people

on board and what you're

talking about, but you

just then need to go and

fill that cup back up.

Absolutely.

That's exactly the thing.

And I remember those

conversations as well.

We had, there was a

few of them at a few

different conferences

too, I think, especially

post post lockdown.

I think this happened

with a lot of

people too, because

things are changing.

Prior to that, you didn't

really think about it.

You just got up and went to

these things all the time.

That's what you did.

And then you were forced

not to go anywhere.

And all of a sudden coming

out the other side, it

was like, Oh yeah, crowds.

That's a lot.

And I realized, like, I

feel everyone's energy.

And as you say, like

they come over and they

want to talk and that's

flattering and wonderful,

and you have great

conversations and it's.

It's yeah, it's amazing,

but that energy exchange,

it's like I've got to be

switched on all the time.

I'm concentrating and am

I saying the right thing

and oh, don't slouch.

I don't know.

And whatever it is,

like you're switched on

and have to be there.

And so, do then take

that time to go walk

around the block or sit

under a tree and just

a few deep breaths.

Yes.

just for the record,

if anyone ever wants

to come up and have a

chat with me, please do.

Don't think that I know

this is, this is off,

this is off limits because

yeah, we want to have this

conversation, but there

might be times I must go,

Hey, I need five minutes

and I'm sure you, you'll

be the same to Lena.

Absolutely.

But it's it's learning

to acknowledge that about

yourself because so many

people don't have that

self awareness because

you just haven't like

you've gone through

life not even stopping

to think, Oh, hang on.

How am I feeling right now?

And it's really so

important to tune into

that and honour that

and then you feel a bit

better with yourself.

thanks for sharing

all that information.

Actually, it's awesome

listening to the two

of you talk about.

So I'm going to tell

you a little bit

about your experience.

Talena, I just want

to know how you then

became to be so open.

Like, was it a journey

when you first found

out all this, was it

something that you kind

of kept to yourself?

Or from the start, were

you just like, I'm going

to tell anyone that

wants to know about it?

Like, well, how did

that journey play out?

Yeah, I suppose they say

one of those things around

autism is no filter.

but I learned to self

censor many times over the

years because I got told,

you shouldn't say that.

I'm like, why not?

Being honest and open,

but yes, it's this

fine line between

too much information

um, being honest.

like one of my values

is, is around honesty

and, and authenticity

and, and that integrity.

So I don't.

Like lying.

And I think it's

important to be open

and honest about these

things because there's

so many people out there.

Who are in similar

situations or questioning

or it's amazing how many

conversations I've had

with folk in the past

couple of years You've

got kids in the same

situation as me or they're

going through something

similar or they're like

Oh, I had no idea or

since you've mentioned it.

I've now got a diagnosis.

So I think it's Yeah,

really important to have

all of these conversations

and be honest about

your own limitations.

It doesn't mean, at

first I was like, Oh no,

I'm a disabled person.

What does that mean?

Does it mean I'm going

to be seen as someone

who can't do my job

and I'm not competent?

Whereas I'm sure most of

the world from the outside

looking in sees how much I

do and how much I produce

and I am competent.

I don't think that anyone

for a second Would think

that it is some kind of

disability for you to, and

if you do an amazing job, I

guess I would say if one of

your friends or a couple of

your friends have recently

been diagnosed with ADHD

or even autism, it'd be a

good opportunity to maybe

have a little bit of self

reflection because neuros

typically attracts neuros.

So yeah.

Yeah.

and you, trying to

try and go, Oh, now I

understand why I like

that human so much.

Yes.

Our brains, but look,

part of the passive house

community is a little

bit like that, like all

the engineers, all the,

all the nerds We love,

I say we, but you know,

a lot of us get together

and want to talk about

this stuff non stop.

We don't want small

talk and the footy or

the weather or I don't

know what small talk is.

I hated small talk.

So if you can get me

talking about this stuff,

you can't shut me up.

And I think that's what

happens with a lot of

us and that's why we are

all so passionate and

that is a good thing.

So this, this probably

leads onto a question then.

And I say this in

a way that isn't.

In a way degrading, I

don't know if that's the

word, but do you think

that because we talk in so

much detail about Passive

House and so many nerdy

conversations, that that is

the barrier and therefore

we can't sell it that

well to the market because

we want to go into such

great detail, we can't

do the small talk that

appeals to the average

Well,

person.

I think, I feel like I've

been on a bit of a mission

since first, you know,

getting into the Passive

House space of always

communicating it in a way

that, you know, a five

year old could understand

or anyone can understand

because I remember one

of my very first little

presentations about it.

when we were surrounded

by the engineers and the

data nerds and, you know,

love them to bits and they

had great presentations

and all have great

information to share.

But I remember being at

some of the conferences

going, Oh my God, as an

architect and my brain,

I'm like, kill me now.

Like

I,

know that feeling.

where's, and I, I

can't read that graph.

And I'm like, if I spend

maybe a few more minutes

on it and you explain it

to me, sure, I will get

that graph and I get the

numbers and I get the

PHPP, I made it really

clear to everyone there,

like, you're going to

lose most of the audience

if you are only speaking

in those terms, you need

to be talking about the

benefits, how it's going to

feel to be in that space.

So I spend most of my time

doing that with clients

and in presentations

and things and, and

people understand that.

But I did have some

new potential clients

the other day speaking

in all those terms.

And,

Are they engineers or

well, he.

He wasn't an engineer,

but he'd been sold solar

panels before about the

payback period is like,

what's the payback period

on on passive house?

And what's the data?

What's the numbers?

I said, I'm going to

give you Andy's number.

So call my

business partner.

He can talk to the cows

come home about the data

as well as the other

stuff, but if you really

want those numbers, I

said, I'm sorry, but

that's that's not how I

usually talk about it.

And so that's fine.

If you want to get

into that nitty gritty.

So, yeah, he had a

chat with Andy and

they came back and

they said, we loved it.

We're sold.

We understand that.

We went and

visited a place.

Now we get it.

but now we're going to go

and work with someone else.

That's okay.

You can't

win them all.

It just happened they found

a Passive House Builder

who has their own design

team and they're kind

of like, well, we're not

going to need you anymore.

But thank you for

convincing us.

We think you're great.

I, I think I, I do, I do

think it is the barrier

for new people trying to

get into this side of it.

They're trying to explain

the nerdy stuff whilst

they try learn about it.

Like I know Hamish, you,

what is your, your motto

line for your business?

Like?

We do build beautiful,

high performing energy

efficient homes, and we've

slightly changed ours to

be something along the

lines like building better.

Like healthy, optimized,

and comfortable.

I think about it to

my mom and dad, like

they don't care about

me running through the

you value window or

anything like that, but

comfort and healthy.

I can listen to that.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

We've just had to get a

new tagline for the new

website and oh my God,

that, you know what it's

like when you care about

words, you care about

semantics, you care about

how it's going to come

across, but our copywriter

was brilliant and well,

she came up with something

that we've been saying for

years, but we just thought.

Isn't that obvious?

Isn't everyone doing that?

And the more we tell

people, they're like, yeah,

no, it's not that obvious.

So it's designing

brilliant buildings

for people and planet.

That's,

that's that's our values.

That's what we do.

And then you can ask,

well, what does, what do

you mean by brilliant?

And then we can

explain.

thank you so much

for coming on today.

I think as I opened up

and said that you're

an inspiration to show

what is possible in our

industry and definitely

gave me confidence and

I'll probably speak on

behalf of Hamish there too.

Keep doing what

you're doing.

I love listening to

you talk every time you

get up that you get my

attention straight away.

really take my hat

off to what you've

achieved and then also

merging to a business

and continuing that

success is, great to see.

So anyone that wants to

reach out to you or your

team, how do we get, how

do people get onto you?

Well, if you wait till

the new website's live,

which should be very

soon and it's just

yeah, Envirotexture.

com.

au.

And you'll see

that new tagline.

Thank you.

Thank you for coming on.

Yeah, you're very,

very welcome.

It's always great having

a chat with you guys.

We could let out on

this stuff all day.