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Sana: Welcome back, listeners, to the BizBlend podcast, the show where we explore real stories behind leadership, resilience, and mindset shifts that shape how we live and we work.

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Sana: Now, listeners, there is a narrative many of us absorb without even questioning it.

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Sana: The life… that life peaks somewhere in midlife.

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Sana: The energy fades, relevance fades, ambition fades, and after a certain age.

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Sana: We are meant to quietly step aside.

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Sana: In fact, I also do believe in the same.

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Sana: But then, just imagine, what if the story, this story, isn't just inaccurate? What if it's actively limiting how people live the second half of their lives? Isn't that interesting, listeners?

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Sana: So today's conversation is about resilience, but not the kind that comes from the hustle slogans, or forced optimism, or toxic positivity. It is about resilience shaped by loss, by grief, by aging.

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Sana: And by choosing not to disappear quietly.

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Sana: And let me tell you, listeners, my guest, Chris Moore, author of Age Out Loud, he has spent years working closely with seniors, and his perspective on aging was forever changed after losing his wife to lung cancer in 2022.

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Sana: And that experience sharpened his awareness of how brief life is, and how much potential remains, even in its later chapters.

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Sana: And Chris believes that aging doesn't have to mean shrinking, physically, emotionally, or mentally. He challenges the idea that getting older automatically means getting weaker or less relevant.

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Sana: And he invites people to rethink what's still possible. So with that, let's begin with the conversation, and Chris, welcome to BizBlend, and I'm really, really honored to have you here with us.

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Chris Moore: Well, thank you so much for having me, and for that wonderful introduction. You clearly have taken some time to look into my story and, understand my message on a…

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Sana: On a pretty deep level, so I appreciate that.

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Sana: Thank you, thank you so much, Chris. And, I, I… I'm a… I'm a not firm believer, I would say, but at least I have this,

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Sana: fear or anxiety driven by aging. Like, you know, when I see people around me, probably my parents or people who are in that same age bracket, I have this idea, and more than an idea, that it's that fear that when

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Sana: I am in that midlife, you know, 40s, 50s.

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Sana: I'm going to get weaker. My employability will…

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Sana: completely get down. Nobody will hire me, people will think I don't have any energy left within me, I'll physically get weaker. So that… that energy, that…

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Sana: vibrance, that vivacity, everything will kind of, you know, go away. So I think it's a very valid fear that almost all of us have.

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Sana: But then, before that, let's, talk about resilience through loss, Chris, because this term, it is often talked about as strength or endurance. Like, if we go into details, it's often that how much… how many times you can face all your challenges and still be there to face more challenges. But your resilience, it was shaped by losing your wife.

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Sana: And, I mean, it's a kind of loss that doesn't come with neat lessons or quick recovery, so if you can tell us, how did that loss actually change the way you understand resilience?

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Chris Moore: Yeah.

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Chris Moore: So, many years ago, when I was in college, I had a canoeing instructor, and he had a saying that he would repeat over and over and over, and it was…

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Chris Moore: went like this. He said, suffer. It builds character.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: you know, we all thought that was ridiculous, and, you know, we spent more time tipping our canoes over and upriding them and getting back in than we did paddling. But at the time, as a young person, I was like, this ridiculous suffer. It builds character.

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Chris Moore: But in my life.

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Chris Moore: I have found that to be the absolute truth. It is during the times of suffering. It is during the times when we are broken, when we are shattered, and there's nothing left of our ability to

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Chris Moore: move forward.

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Sana: that…

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Chris Moore: We discover, deep down within us.

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Chris Moore: That we are able to accomplish so much more.

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Chris Moore: then…

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: We ever thought or imagined.

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Chris Moore: And in my experience, I had been a caregiver for my mother, who passed away, and my father, who passed away, and…

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Sana: I thought I knew something of…

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Chris Moore: loss.

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Chris Moore: And of grief.

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Chris Moore: But when my wife died, it was… a pain… That goes beyond what I had ever…

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Chris Moore: Experienced or thought of.

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Chris Moore: And it was during that time, and that…

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Chris Moore: grief where I felt no purpose. What was my purpose? What was my reason to get up in the morning? What was my reason to… to keep living? I had been a husband for 33 years. I had been a caregiver for 33 weeks.

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Chris Moore: And now, what was I?

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Chris Moore: Who was I?

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Chris Moore: What was my purpose?

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Chris Moore: And it was during that time of struggle.

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Chris Moore: where I found myself

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Chris Moore: walking through what the Bible calls in Psalm 23, the valley of the shadow of death.

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Chris Moore: I was in a valley. I was… my life was in the shadow.

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Chris Moore: Of my wife's death.

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Chris Moore: And during that time, it occurred to me one day, because she was 55 when she died.

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Chris Moore: And not long after we married, When she was 23,

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Chris Moore: She was diagnosed with encephalitis, which is a viral infection of the lining of the brain.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: And it is often fatal.

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Chris Moore: And in cases where it is not fatal, The patient often experiences Complete loss of short-term memory.

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Chris Moore: And my wife, at 22, made a full and complete recovery.

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Chris Moore: From encephalitis.

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Chris Moore: And so, when she was diagnosed many years later with lung cancer, I was sure that she was going to make a full and complete recovery from that as well.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: But after she passed, it occurred to me, if someone had come to me.

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Chris Moore: At the time, when she was 22,

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Chris Moore: And in the grip of this

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Chris Moore: Disease, and told me she's not going to die, she's going to live for 33 more years, and bury you 3 more children.

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Chris Moore: I would have been ecstatic.

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Chris Moore: And so I realized in that moment, I had a power that I did not realize that I had.

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Chris Moore: And that power was choice.

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Chris Moore: That power was that I got to choose what my response to this loss would be.

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Chris Moore: I could choose to be broken and distraught and melt into a puddle on the floor because she died at 55.

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Sana: Or…

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Chris Moore: I could choose to be grateful.

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Chris Moore: For the 33 years.

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Chris Moore: that I got to spend with her.

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Chris Moore: And that realization changed my trajectory.

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Chris Moore: That realization changed the way that I processed

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Chris Moore: Not only the grief of my wife's passing, But every event and experience of my life.

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Chris Moore: And I realize that all of us have this power.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: To reshape our perception According… To whether we frame the experiences of our life In…

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Chris Moore: Light of what aspects of that experience can we be grateful for?

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Chris Moore: Versus what aspects of that experience Are we upset about?

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Chris Moore: Or sad about, or mad about, or angry about, or… just unhappy about.

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Chris Moore: And I think that's where resilience, true resilience, comes from.

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Sana: Yeah.

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Chris Moore: Not that we're just powering through the difficult times of our life.

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Chris Moore: But that we are reframing The events of our life, according to… our perception.

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Chris Moore: And by looking for and searching out those aspects of our life that we can be grateful for.

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Chris Moore: Even in the midst of… Great setbacks, in the midst of great trauma, in the midst of great disappointment.

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Chris Moore: There are always aspects of that experience.

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Chris Moore: That we can be thankful for. If… We look for them.

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Chris Moore: And oftentimes, we have to look back in order to perceive that, because in the heat of the moment.

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Chris Moore: Sometimes it's very, very difficult to see anything. How can I possibly be thankful for anything that I'm going through in this… in this circumstance?

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Chris Moore: But not everything that feels bad to us is harmful, and not everything that feels good to us is helpful.

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Sana: And so, oftentimes, when we look back.

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Chris Moore: At a time in our life that we thought was… insurmountable.

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Chris Moore: We are able to see Oh.

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Chris Moore: That's where I've grown. That's where I've become the person who is able to take on the next challenge that came down the road. That's where I became the person who was able to use this pain and suffering as a way to help others.

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Sana: Yeah.

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Chris Moore: Rather than just… A cesspool of suffering.

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Sana: I mean… Chris, honestly, that makes just more than sense, because… And that's exactly what was…

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Sana: Going on in my mind when he mentioned about, you know, how your canoeing instructor mentioned that suffering builds up character.

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Sana: I think… there's a nuance in there. It's not just that suffering, by default, will…

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Sana: make or break that character, it's a choice that we have. Either we can wallow Or just sit down.

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Sana: And get completely consumed, maybe, in that…

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Sana: grief, or shock, or shame, or fear, or anxiety, or we can make that choice, and…

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Sana: Try, put the effort, or take that action, take that step, that first step, to get out of that loop, and make a choice, and get… maybe try to… or begin to get set on a different path.

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Sana: So I think the choice here is the key word that you beautifully, beautifully emphasized upon.

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Chris Moore: Yes. It's our response that we can control. And ultimately, in the final analysis, that's the only thing we can 100% control in our lives.

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Sana: Because…

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Chris Moore: People get sick and die.

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Chris Moore: In business, there are, you know, there's timing. You know, there's times when you go into business, and then there's an external change of circumstances that radically

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Chris Moore: alters your position in the business world, and so you have… you have a setback. There's a… there's a financial downturn, there's a new product that comes to market that, you know, renders your product, irrelevant and obsolete. There are any number of

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Chris Moore: events that can happen in our personal lives, in our business lives, in our relationships, that are beyond our control, and there's nothing we can do about them. But our response

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Chris Moore: is something that we can do about. People say, he made me mad.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: And think about that.

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Chris Moore: Why would you give another person that power?

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Sana: Yeah.

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Chris Moore: He didn't make you mad. He did whatever he did.

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Chris Moore: And your response to that was to get mad.

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Chris Moore: Maybe that's an appropriate response, maybe it isn't.

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Chris Moore: But either way, it's your response.

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Chris Moore: It's your choice. It's your… Response to their action, And…

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Chris Moore: Don't give anybody that power over… over you.

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Chris Moore: Maintain your integrity and your power to

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Chris Moore: Respond and to make choices in accordance with Your desires and your agenda, and your… Principles and values.

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Sana: This is such a powerful statement that you have made, Chris, because often… Our responses are reactive.

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Sana: Than proactive. We react to situations, we react to people.

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Sana: And…

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Sana: I mean, it takes, it takes a lot of time to even realize that, you know, we are driven by

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Sana: Or dictated by the external circumstances, or people, or our surroundings, or environment.

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Sana: We do not know how we can take everything back in control. And it doesn't mean that we have to…

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Sana: We have to be… we have to be a dictator, or we have to have that main character energy that, you know, people are right now popularly mentioning, that main character, but at least…

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Sana: We can take back that agency, that control in our own hands, and maybe we can make some difference in the reality we see, because to a lot extent, our mindset, our mind, our brain kind of…

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Sana: Creates the reality that we see through our eyes.

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Chris Moore: Right.

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Chris Moore: And I'd like to key in on what you said about reactive versus.

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Sana: proactive.

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Sana: Because my book, Age Out Loud.

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Chris Moore: Came about in large part

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Chris Moore: through my work as a remodeling contractor. I have been in the construction industry for 40 years, and I have, been involved for almost 2 decades in aging-in-place remodeling, where I

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Chris Moore: Modify homes to make them safer and more comfortable for people who are experiencing.

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Chris Moore: Some sort of mobility impairment.

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Chris Moore: And many people, when I talk to them about doing this, they have a visceral reaction of.

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Chris Moore: You're calling me old. I'm not ready for that yet. How dare you suggest that I need a grab bar in my shower, or that I need handrails on my stairs? You're… you're cutting me down. And that reaction seems so strange to me.

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Chris Moore: And over time, I began to see that that reaction

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Chris Moore: Comes, in large part, from people's negative perception of what it means to grow older.

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Chris Moore: They have allowed the cultural narrative that says getting older means getting weaker and sicker.

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Chris Moore: to create this resistance saying that if I admit that I'm getting older and need some of these accommodations, then that means I'm getting weaker and sicker.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: But then I looked around, and I met people who were… 80, 90.

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Chris Moore: 100 years old, And who were not weaker and sicker, and who were living full and vibrant lives.

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Chris Moore: And I began to study what it… what is the difference?

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Chris Moore: What is the… what is the difference between people who Are at an advanced age.

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Chris Moore: And their eyes are bright, and they're active, and they're involved in life, and they are…

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Chris Moore: Productive, and they're creating, and they're collaborating, and they're contributing to the world around them.

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Chris Moore: And those who are… simply… Waiting for their time to expire. Who are fading quietly.

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Chris Moore: And what I discovered was that it all goes back to mindset. It all goes back to what our expectation is.

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Chris Moore: If we expect that

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Chris Moore: At a certain age, we're not going to be able to do whatever it is that we would really like to do.

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Chris Moore: Then we're not going to try.

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Chris Moore: If we don't think that

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Chris Moore: Exercising and eating well and getting plenty of sunshine is going to improve our life, then we're probably not going to get off the couch.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: But if we believe… that… As long as we're here, we're not finished and we have work to do.

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Chris Moore: We were… we were… each one of us was put on this earth for a specific purpose.

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Chris Moore: We all individually have talents, we have connections, we have abilities, we have insights and understandings that no one else on this earth has.

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Chris Moore: And so there are people that we can reach and have an impact on that no one else can reach.

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Chris Moore: And it is our… job. It is our responsibility to…

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Chris Moore: Make an impact on the world around us.

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Chris Moore: And that does not expire.

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Chris Moore: The idea that… You know, we peak at 40 or 50 years old, and it's all downhill from there.

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Chris Moore: is ludicrous.

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Chris Moore: And until you start noticing it, and until you start looking for it, you don't realize how deeply ingrained in our psyche that it is.

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Sana: Hmm. You know, it makes a lot of sense.

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Sana: But then, Chris, you know.

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Sana: People would also say that, yeah, mindset is there, but then if we really look at, you know, like, if we consider the practical world in here.

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Sana: There are certain other factors as well. You know, sometimes, the…

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Sana: Economic conditions, or maybe the trials and tribulations one has to face.

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Sana: Maybe the environmental factors, they can also contribute a lot, because aging, it's a physical world that we are looking at. Of course, there is the mental, the spiritual aspect here, the emotional aspect here, but it's more interpreted

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Sana: better in the physical world here. So, what's… what's your thought on that?

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Chris Moore: I do not discount The fact that…

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Chris Moore: We live in a physical world.

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Chris Moore: And in the physical world, we have something called entropy.

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Chris Moore: An entropy says that all things, when left to their own devices, Gradually fall apart.

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Sana: Yeah.

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Chris Moore: If we take an automobile and park it in a field, and don't touch it for 100 years, and come back, it's not going to start.

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Chris Moore: If we move out of our house.

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Chris Moore: And lock the door, and come back in 100 years.

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Chris Moore: The house will not be habitable.

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Chris Moore: And our bodies are the same way.

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Chris Moore: If we neglect our bodies, If we neglect our minds.

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Chris Moore: If we neglect our soul and our spirit, they're going to decline. That's the natural order.

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Chris Moore: If we do nothing about it, our bodies will lose muscle as we age.

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Sana: That's a… that's a fact.

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Sana: Hmm.

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Chris Moore: But…

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Sana: Cheers.

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Chris Moore: But… Right?

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Chris Moore: if we… Walk every day, if we lift weights, if we do cardio exercise, if we

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Chris Moore: constantly learn new things, and engage our minds, and keep our minds fresh and active, and we form new relationships. We seek out people of different generations, and of different backgrounds, and of different, cultural,

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Chris Moore: history.

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Chris Moore: Of different cultures. And we forge relationships with people who are different than us, so that our horizons are widened, and we… we question some of the assumptions, maybe, that we have. And we're constantly growing physically, and mentally, and emotionally, and spiritually.

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Chris Moore: Then, this natural decline

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Chris Moore: will be arrested. It will be halted. It will be slowed. Now, am I going to suggest that

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Chris Moore: you know, I'm going to live for 900 years, No.

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Sana: No. No.

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Chris Moore: No.

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Chris Moore: But I have far more…

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Chris Moore: choice, and I have far more control over my habits and my lifestyle and my mindset than almost anybody

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Chris Moore: thinks that they have.

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Chris Moore: In the process of writing my book, I read a book called Breaking the Age Code by Becca Levy. She is a Yale professor, and her studies

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Chris Moore: showed that simply by having a positive perception of what it means to grow older, I will add an average of seven and a half years to my life.

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Sana: Oh.

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Chris Moore: Seven and a half years.

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Sana: Yeah.

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Chris Moore: Just by changing how I think about aging.

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Chris Moore: And, if I change how I think about aging.

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Chris Moore: then I'm probably going to change some habits and some lifestyle in my life.

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Chris Moore: To line up with that mindset.

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Chris Moore: Where… if I don't think that exercising and eating well is going to help me because I'm old, then I'm probably not going to bother

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Chris Moore: Exercising and eating well.

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Sana: Yeah.

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Sana: Super. Chris, in the interest of time, I wish we could have gone on and on this.

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Sana: This is such, such an interesting and very, very crucial, I must say, but if listeners, they would like to further dive deep into this, they would like to share their own thoughts, maybe experiences, they would like to get ahold of your book as well, connect with you, what would be the easiest way?

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Chris Moore: Okay, so the book is on Amazon, it's Age Out Loud.

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Chris Moore: My website is AgeOutLoudBook.com.

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Chris Moore: dot com.

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Chris Moore: And we will have,

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Chris Moore: More activities and more groups evolving over time for people that want to go further.

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Chris Moore: And then I'm also on Substack, Substack.com, Age Out Loud, as well.

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Chris Moore: So, I, I would encourage anybody that, that would like to,

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Chris Moore: You know, find out more, get a copy of the book.

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Chris Moore: read the book, let me know your thoughts, and let's take this journey together. I think we can change the face of aging.

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Sana: Absolutely, absolutely. It is possible, and listeners, as I always do, I'll have all the links mentioned in the show notes, so connect with Chris.

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Sana: And, get ahold of his book, and refer to all the details, all the links. They will be attached along with this episode. And, I believe what stands out here, listeners, is that

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Sana: It's not just the idea that aging Can be powerful.

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Sana: It's the honesty behind it.

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Sana: I mean, loss, grief, limitation time are not brushed aside here. They are acknowledged, and then they're met with choice. So, Chris, thank you so much, it was such a powerful

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Sana: very, very energetic take on aging. I really loved, you know, what I learned from it. I'm very hopeful that our listeners will also get the same from this conversation, so thank you.

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Chris Moore: Thank you very much for having me.

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Sana: And to all the listeners out there.

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Sana: If you're feeling that quite pressure to shrink, or to step back, or to lower expectation of yourselves, I hope this conversation is an invitation to question that narrative, not with force, but with curiosity. So whether you are 30, 50, or 70, 80, 90,

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Sana: The question isn't how old you are, it's whether you are still willing to live out loud. Until next time, this is Ehosana, and I'll catch you in the next episode of the BizBlend podcast. Stay tuned. Thank you.