You got questions going out of your mind. Someone with answers. Now that's hard to find, like the what and the why and the how stuff works or just where to go to avoid all the jerks. She's Gear Abby. Gear Abby. Gear Abby. Advice that doesn't suck. Gear Abby.

Hello there, my outdoorsy friends, and welcome to Gear Abby, where we tackle the controversial range, weird, obscure and taboo topics that other outdoor podcasts refuse to touch. I'm outdoor educator and writer Shawnté Salabert, and I'm here to answer your burning questions about our relationships with outdoor people, products, places and pastimes. And I want them all, because remember, there are no dumb questions, just smart advice. All right, here's how it works. You're going to send questions to dear gearabby gmail.com and I'm going to answer a couple each week here on the show. And, and as always, joining me today is my partner in Gear, the producer of Gear Abby, and a guy whose middle name is Hastings. A fact that I still can't believe. Colin True. Why?

Why can you not believe that?

It just sounds so fancy. I don't know. Colin True.

Don't you know how fancy I am?

Are you secretly a British lord?

Perhaps? Dear friend of the pod, Justin Halsman did just text me, obviously listening to last week's episode and all he wrote was Hastings. And I wrote, that's right. Bow before your English, Lor.

Oh, I love that. Well, speaking of Hastingsies, I do have a corrections corner today.

Love a corner.

I don't know. You do love a corner.

Don't I love a good corner?

I feel like I should, like. Do you like. Is it the facing inward of the corner, like Blair Witch style? Is that what you're into?

He was just like. Was he in the corner or was it more just against the wall? I think like spoilers for the bear of Blair Witch, a movie that came out nearly 30 years ago.

30 Year old spoiler.

But I think he could have been in the corner. Was Baby in the corner?

In my mind, Baby was not. They wouldn't let him put Baby in the corner. Baby was not. Baby was luckily kept out of the corner.

Have you, have you caught up on heated rivalry?

I haven't seen it yet. I haven't had time.

You really need to. It's. It's delightful.

I will. I've heard so many good things about it.

But I did see a meme that for those of us who have watched it, at the end where it's a shot of the two boys and it just said, nobody puts baby in the corner. And I'm like, yes. All right, let's blend Dirty Dancing, 1988 sneaky abortion movie with heated rivalry. You know, gay rights in 2026. This is great.

Let's go. This is the future I want. All right, so. So, as I said, I do have a corrections corner. This is corrections not in it. There are no babies.

Corrections corner. We're going to make some corrections on corrections corner.

I don't know if that one.

No theme songs. Okay.

I mean, I like a theme song. I'm not sure that's the one. Like, I need you to come up with something similar. I mean, I hope we don't have a lot of corrections corners, but I feel like you need something similar to Watson, your pack or whatever.

Corrections quarter.

Okay. All right. We can workshop it. So, like I said, speaking of Hastingsies, I have been operating on very little sleep these last few weeks, as you all probably know. Colin definitely knows. And I made a small error in last week's segment about bear canisters that I only caught after I sent the audio file to Colin for my recording. And I was like, well, you know what? This is a good opportunity. Introduce a new segment. Things I've screwed up. So. So, Bruce.

Things she screwed.

No, I mean, maybe so. So Bruce Hastings, who is not related to our Lord Colin Hastings, that we're aware of. So Bruce was indeed the grad student researching bare human interactions, but it was Barry Gilbert, the researcher who was supervising Bruce, who first saw that lion ostrich egg video that we can't figure out how he saw it. Like beta VHS or whatever.

Did Barry also invent YouTube?

Barry might have been. It's like Al Gore in the Internet. I think Barry invented YouTube. I mean, I don't want to have to. Corrections corner. So we're just going to assume. Yes, but by the way, he. Barry. Barry Gilbert. So the two of them were up in the Rockies conducting their studies before he moved old Bruce down to Yosemite or down to the Sierra. And he actually got attacked by a grizzly. Like, super gnarly, ripped off of his face, like, pretty rough stuff when they were up there doing their work. So that's kind of why he was like, go visit their tamer cousins in the Sierra.

Wow. Yeah. If you're not sure what we're talking about, go back and listen to last week's episode where we went through the history of bear canisters, basically, so that I feel bad that. That Barry had a. A negative encounter. Let's say that's putting it lightly. Right. That being said, it kind of adds a little bit more mystique to the movie we want to make about the creation of bear canisters. Like knowing that there'll be a full on DiCaprio revenant situation in in why these things exist.

I mean, do you think maybe he's available? This could be like a seque. He only has one Oscar at this point, so maybe this is second.

Leo, if we want to show a bear attack, we know you're our guy. So Barry Gilbert, let's.

Let's go, Barry. Nobody puts Barry in a corner. You know what I'm saying?

A corrections corner.

Unless it's a grizzly bear. Yeah, right. Bless. Sorry, Barry. All right. I also have a unique and new. We haven't done one of these in a while, but we got some listener mail that was. Is relevant to an episode a couple episodes ago when we talked about gators. So I am very, very pleased that listener TD sent not one, but two links to the to videos of the American alligator mating ritual.

Okay, I need to get on this email thread. I. I feel very left out that I've not seen banging gators, but I feel terrible. Check that one off the old Gear Abbey banging animal list.

Yep. Thank you, td. Thanks, td. This was actually interesting. So I watched them because, you know, obviously. And so the catcalls that the gentleman gators are using are these like super low frequency rumbles. And in fact, at a point it's just like that. Not terribly audible to the human ear once they're submerged. But what they do is the rumbles make both their bodies and the water around them vibrate hard enough that the water jumps up and dances. It looks like, like the Disney, you know, nighttime water light shows that they do fantasmic or whatever. Truly, truly sensual.

Makes a few other things hard too, if you know what I'm saying.

God, I didn't say it made anything hard. Colin.

It's a mating dance. Something better be, you know, it's a waste of time. You know, waste energy. By our pal the gators.

Oh my goodness. I'm so sorry. Here because I want to give everyone else who's not you some more rabbit holes to descend. No comments necessary. Colin. I just do want to read a little portion of TD email because it's written so well. It's. I kind of want to read this in a British accent because. Because this is the opening line.

We support an accent here on Gear Abbey.

I shan't wax too protractedly about crocodilians, right? But the American alligators, a rare conservation success story. This guy's probably from like you're probably.

Insulting that he's probably.

Talk. So. So he says the US worked very hard to save a slow moving, slow growing species from extinction. And only recently have we reached the point where large that's greater than 6 foot long, potentially problematic animals are seen again. I guess that's a good thing. We don't want them to go extinct, even though we don't want them to eat us. This means that those who live around gators have to learn some things that society has forgotten. For example, alligators.

I like that you're switching back into the English accent. You know, like you just can't even help yourself. You're trying so hard not to do an English accent.

I am trying so hard. Here's. I'm going to admit this to all of the listeners. We have a lot of listeners now. I'm admitting that when I edit my own writing work, I read it out loud in a posh London accent.

Okay. I need.

Because then I hear the errors. I don't know why.

If it works for you, like, who are we to judge? But it's also hilarious.

Thank you. That's what I try to aim for in this life, just hilarity. But yeah, listen, alligators are not lizards. That discussion, however, is too boring for normals.

Wow.

People should also know, as should you, to avoid stereotyping. We do have a crocodile species in the US and they are no more inherently dangerous than alligators. Although seen in proximity at times, alligators are solitary. They do not form gangs.

Is TD kind of. Are we getting chastised a little bit by TD here?

I think TD delights in this. TD is a wildlife or former wildlife biologist, I believe. Okay. I love these emails. Keep them. I do too, please.

More about them. That is interesting. I mean, I think you just, you know, obviously like you look at anything like an alligator, you think, oh, there's a big lizard. I mean it just. Right, right.

So big ass dinosaur lizard. That is really. I go deep.

Tell you what, td, if that makes me a normal, then I guess that's, you know, if the shoe fits. But no, that's really interesting actually. And we do have a crocodile species too. That's also interesting.

That's right. Nobody puts alligators in the corner. You know what? I think we're really in rare form today.

Yeah, we're off to a big. We're off to a hot start here.

We're real, real hot. Start. You're already singing. I'm doing accents. This is absolutely what people signed up for.

It's a best of episode.

It is. It is. Every episode is a best of episode.

That's right.

Two of us. I think we've got a lot of new listeners lately, so welcome. You may want to go back and review some of the past episodes to understand why we are the way we are. Yeah. But until then, we're going to get started with a question because that's what we do.

Okay. I think this is a good one. I like the way we're starting off today's episode because mostly of the intro, the salutation, if you will, of this email from this listener. Dearest Gear Abbey. Maybe does the British accent need to continue in this? Dearest Gear Abbey.

Okay, yes. Write me more letters.

Okay. Then they go on. Hot take. Posting photos of pretty places on social media doesn't actually convert anyone to become a conservationist or protect these places. People just say that to make themselves feel better. Prove me wrong. Signed Senor Haterade. There's another accent. I shouldn't have done that. That was a terrible, like, I'm glad you're like, am I getting canceled for that accent? I'm sorry.

I will personally cancel you.

Sign Senior Hater. At least seniors. And it's hard not to do a little. Senior Hater Aide.

Yeah, Senior Hater Aide. Is it you? I just need to know because it sounds like something you've written.

I'm jealous because it's not me. If I'm being honest, I would love a Twitter. Can Senior Hater Aide be my trail name? I think that would be y. I.

Don't think anybody who listens would deny that for you. All right, well, to the real hot take Haterado. Senor.

Oh, I like that name, too.

That's right. Just rolling with it here. So, first of all, I'm going to give you one thing and one thing only. Posting photos on social media is usually a selfish enterprise. Okay. Whether we realize it or not, we see a pretty place, we take our photo of the pretty place. We want other people to ooh and ah at the photo of our pretty place. Click like. Click like, right. That's kind of the vibe. So it. There is a vapid nature to a lot of what we post online, myself included.

Yep.

So, you know, I will say I'd wager that most people who are posting photos of delicate arts and horseshoe bend and all of that are not also talking about how to protect those places. So I'm going to Give them that. Okay, that's true.

I say the overwhelming percentage of folks are not seeking protection for these places. And more just going, look at me,.

Look at me, look at me.

And we've all done it. And if you say you haven't and you're on these platforms, you're a liar.

That's right. We don't kink shame. Except for that's not a Kinkham.

We photoshame, though.

We do, apparently. Well, here's the thing, though. This idea that beautiful images of the outdoors can't stir someone to take action is patently wrong. Okay.

Also true.

I'm gonna tell you why. Yeah. So photographs, paintings, even, I will say drone filmed videos, because I know, because I've been present during those. All of these things have been presented to state legislatures, to Congress, even to sitting residence as evidence of places that deserve protection. So to defend myself here, we're going to go back to 1871. You know, I like. I like a history lesson.

Y' all just put a little. Right now we gotta like, get some, like change the audio.

Wait, why? Do I sound decrepit?

No, because 1871, you're old, you know.

Okay. All I want to do is do the Katherine Hepburn voice, though. Welcome to 1871. All right, so a bunch of surveyors, scientists, artists, kind of that. This is how all these crews rolled back in the day they set out to document portions of the American West. This was happening a lot at this time. And during the trip, you had painter Thomas Moran. Moran. Moran. I could probably look up the pronunciation.

Moran. That's got to be Moran. M A N. Moran. We're going to say Moran.

Thank you. Thank you for spelling that. So he's out there, he's creating these massive oil paintings. And William Henry Jackson was out there taking Florida photographs using a giant. So one of those old timey wooden box cameras with the giant glass plates, like heavy stuff, large format camera, doing their thing. The images that they created on that trip were used to convince Congress that the landscape they captured was worth protecting, which led to the creation of Yellowstone National Park.

Okay.

Yes. So check one. Okay. So something very similar happened in Yosemite. Like, of course, we know John Muir's words for various publications were super instrumental in that park especially that park kind of expanded. And so was his direct lobbying of politicians. You know, he was taking, like, Roosevelt out and everything. But before that, there was an entrepreneur. We're gonna just give him that. Nice. He's. He's an entrepreneur. Okay. He's kind of. Listen, he's an opportunist, but his name was James Hutching, and he had a magazine called, very egotistically, Hutchings California Magazine. He's like, it's me. He's a very. He's a pick me. Okay. He would have been posting on Instagram if he was around in the day.

Can we just say he would. Born way too early, but also allows us to check our box of mentioning California in every episode. So. Thanks, James.

Thanks, James. You did a good job doing it for us from the grave. So. So this guy, James Hutchings, commissioned illustrations of the valley, Yosemite Valley, for his, you know, for his magazine, and that drew the first tourists to the valley, and later it would become the park. Very convenient for a guy who set up a hotel and, you know, worked to make a buck however he could. He had, like, a sawmill, all this stuff going on in there. So he's like, to this beautiful place and give me our monies. Ansel Adams, of course, had a role in all this. You know, he at one point created a book of a bunch of photographs he took in the Sierra, and he sent that to Congress, and that actually helped persuade them to agree to creating Kings Canyon National Park. You know, of course, all of these early examples come with a very big asterisk, and that is that all of those gorgeous paintings, the photographs, illustrations, all that stuff that we want to ooh and aah over, also helped push indigenous people off of their homelands. So since the government couldn't have actual humans encroaching on all this beautiful, pristine wilderness. That's not an oil painting. Yeah, seriously. So that. That's a topic for another day, and I would love to dig into that on the pod, if anybody wants to ask that question. Some question, any question. Yeah, there is kind of like this interesting reflection, we'll say, on the role that art actually played in that back in the day. So let's. Let's jump to the present. Photos and videos are still used to, you know, enhance landscape preservation, and they're still being shown to Congress to make the case for, you know, I don't know, not drilling the shit out of things or whatever, just. Just to give one example. But I do also think that even though social media can be a very vapid place, like I said, there is still merit to posting photos of beautiful places, even if it doesn't directly spur action. For me, I think it comes down to, like, we human beings, we need awe. We need wonder in our lives. Like it scientifically proven at this point, and There are far too many incredible places that exist for us to even visit a tiny portion of them. So social media does allow us to see places we might not otherwise see. It's kind of the modern version of flipping through your aunt's, you know, Encyclopedia Britannica set.

Right.

In a lot of ways. Right. So yeah, I mean, I, I do think people can be inspired even if they don't visit those places. They might be inspired to visit places closer to home and, and they might be inspired to learn more about them. I do think it's, that's going to happen more if you actually post something substantial in the words that are used in your social media post. You know, I do see people posting about whatever latest thing Congress wants to drill into and extract or deforest or build on top of. So that has been a good use of social media in the last few years, is rallying people to write and call their members of Congress. So I don't know. So I'd say like Colin. I mean, hater. I mean, no, just Colin. Regular Colin.

This is not me really.

It really is written like you. So, so since this wasn't you though, what's your opinion?

Well, yeah, I mean it is and I respect it. And look, as a, as a fellow contrarian, like, I loved, I love takes like this as well. This one though, it's like, you know, even if you're right, because I think you're probably in the day and age of so many more photos like, versus all the people you cited where it was like, hey, these were like the six people out here making these, these, taking these images. Yeah, you're probably right. But also how many of these people are trying to convert people to protect these places and you know, the people just say this stuff to make them feel themselves, feel better. I'm like, well, who.

Right.

I guess I'm sure there's a contingent of influencers who are posting like we gotta protect these lands, that kind of thing. I'm sure there are. It's a bit of a, kind of a, It's a take. I wouldn't really call it a hot take. I think it's a, it's a reaching take. Why don't we say it that way? A little bit of a reach, you.

Know, a Richie take.

It's a little bit of a reachy take because it's kind of like you might be right, but also, who cares? You know, I'm not sure this is something we need to.

That is a very calling answer.

Yeah. Respect the attempt though. Hater Aide. Send. Send more. Hot take. We love a hot take around here. Send it in.

Send more. We want you specifically, senor, because it's.

Fun to learn those things. I mean, Ansel Adams. I mean, come on. Like legend, right? We gotta talk legend.

Yeah, yeah. Photographs. Inspired. I mean, a lot of the people posting on social media are probably, especially in the Hipstamatic age, probably very inspired by Ansel Adams. I'm glad. You know what? We got a little early fish shaking in the episode. We've sung, we've done accents. We've got some fish shaking in there.

Listener fish shaking, too. Not like neither you or I. So this is. Yeah, I love that.

I love this. I'm so happy for us. Okay, well, I want the good vibes to continue. I don't know about you. Do you?

Of course I do.

Okay, good.

It's a podcast. We need people to stick around, see what's.

It was just a sad podcast. This is where you go to feel things.

Yeah, this is a terrible podcast. Stick around and listen to us complain. Welcome back to the Eeyore cast.

All right, ask me another question.

Okay. Hi, Gear. Abby.

Hi.

I like that they didn't do deer.

I like that we just got. We got two different intros, by the way. Dearest, we had.

Dearest.

I don't think we've had either of those before.

Okay. We have great listeners. Well done. Well done, listeners. Okay, I need your help. I start the PCT in a few weeks, and my best friend was going to join me, and she just told me she can't because she actually has to stay home and work this summer. Lame. All right, I'm freak. That was my commentary. I'm freaking out. We've been planning this forever. I've never hiked by myself, and I don't really want to. And the whole point was we were going to have this big adventure together before the next phase of our lives. I still want to hike because it's a dream of mine, but I'm just so sad and really don't want to be alone out there. I'm also kind of scared, honestly, because I'm a young woman and you just hear stories. So I listen to you and you talk about doing all this stuff alone on the show. So how did you get brave enough to do that? I feel like maybe this will be an opportunity for me to grow, but I need to get out of my head first. Thank you so much for your help. Signed, Sad Hiker Girl.

Oh, okay.

First piece of advice, don't sign a letter to gear Abby Sad Hiker Girl. Because now you do have your trail name, and forever you're going to be.

Sad Hiker, Sad Hiker Girl.

Or sh. Sug.

Sh. You could be Sh, though, on the trail, which is a cool trail name.

That's cool. No one will really know what it means.

Yeah, I'm going to refer to you as Sh for the rest of this. This segment of the show, sugar. Oh, sh. I'm sad for you. That's. That's a big deal. I would be sad, too. I would be so bummed out if I had plans with somebody to do something that big and they're like, jk. I mean, I was sad. My friend Jay bailed on me the day before we were going to Zion National Park. The first time I ever went there, and we already had the whole thing planned. It was like a four day trip at the. I was like, final go by myself. And I had a wonderful time, to be honest. Sorry, Jay, but listen.

Loser Jay.

Loser Jay's not. He's. He's nice.

Kind of like Suge's hiking buddy Jay and Jay and Shug's hiking buddy should get together and bail on other people, I guess, you know?

Yeah. Maybe they could just start a side business failing. Maybe people could pay. They're like, I don't want to do this. Can you bail for me?

Do you want to be disappointed by your friends? Call us. We'll walk you through it.

It. Oh, man. Well, listen, Shug, I'm sorry, but here's the thing. Your buddy dropping out does not have to be the end of the world. So let's, I want, kind of break this into two parts. So let's talk about aloneness versus not aloneness. And then we'll talk about the whole bravery thing, or at least perception of bravery. Okay, so first of all, you say that this is a dream of yours. So was that dream dependent on another person? Or is it something that's worth pursuing even when your plans get screwed up a bit? Because it just like, lives inside of you. Okay. And you want to take this amazing opportunity to go out and see the world in a different way and grow as a human being, and then write a book about it that becomes a major motion picture starring Reese Witherspoon. No promises, you know, And I. I don't know. So what do you think? Is it the latter? At least the whole, you know, dream, living within you part.

Then you're going, okay, is Rhys gonna start, you know, the Wild Cinematic Universe? So it's just only producing Movies about people finding themselves on the trail.

I. She would have so many movies to produce. It is just constant out there.

Okay, little one note though, right? Constant. Like, okay, you had a tough time, you're gonna go on the trail.

You don't know, but someone could discover out there, they could discover that they were once bitten by a radioactive spider and they've got powers or if we're.

Merging the Wild Cinematic Universe with the Marvel Cinematic Universe, I'm in.

Okay, great. Well, wonderful, Shug. That's something to aspire to. Think now about what kind of superhero you want to end up. But I will say you did say you've never hiked by yourself, but I wasn't clear if that was. You haven't day hiked or you haven't backpacked. So I do think it's worth trying out like a one night solo mission before you hit the trail if you have the time. And it sounds like you do because you just wrote this letter to us the other day. I think you'll probably learn a lot about what you actually feel anxious about and what is actually not a big deal just by even doing a one night trip. It's still going to be a little bit of a shock to get out on trail, but you do this thing called getting your trail legs when you start a long trail like that, and you either get them or you don't. And you go home if you don't. So you'll know in your heart what happens. As far as missing out on a hiking pal, I just would like to remind you you've chosen to hike the pct, the Pacific Crest Trail, one of the busiest trails in the world. Thank you, Reese Witherspoon. And you're going to be hiking during the heat of the through hiking season. So honestly, the only time I've ever camped alone out there is during the winter. And even then I usually at least see day hikers in most of the segments.

Yeah, trail families are real. You know they are.

I mean, not everybody gets one, but I'd say especially in that first week, that first hundred miles, whatever, people are so bunched up together at campsites, like you are bound to at least meet other people and then you could decide if you want to be trail family with them. You may not meet people right off the bat, but at the very least you're gonna probably run into the same people over and over and it gives you the sense of familiarity when you're out there. So it's, it's nice because it's like, hey, I I'm not in this alone. I have people to chat about, like, did you see this? Or where's the next water source? And if you don't feel that you're naturally meeting people while you're walking or even at camp, some of the popular resupply stops might be a little more fruitful. Staying at hostels or even trail angels that offer lodging is probably going to be better than getting a hotel room by yourself if you want to be social. I also feel like hikers congregate at any place that serves like pie, hamburgers, beer, and karaoke. So if you find a place like that on the trail and there are many, go on in and find your people. Okay.

They don't even need to be through hikers, just hikers will find those places.

It's true. Just anyone, really.

And non hikers do too.

That's true. You're gonna meet some locals while you're out there. You may not want to be friends with them. I don't know. So, all right. So you're not gonna be alone out there unless you really want to be. But let's talk about this whole bravery thing that you asked me about. So I'd say, first of all, are you worried about specific things? You kind of leaned on that. I'm a young woman and I get that. So if you haven't already, I'm going to suggest you go back and listen to the fourth episode of this very podcast. It's called how to Hike Alone, Pack a Raft, Walk on Ice, and still have Hope. It's. It is one of my favorite episodes we've ever done. It is one of our most popular episodes, and it came out on September 18 last year. If you need to look it up that way. I actually talk about worries and fears and being solo out there, and I. I shared some of my own stories, so I don't want to double up too much on that here, but it's worth a listen.

What I was every episode of Gear Abby. Email us at Dear gear abby gmail.com.

I didn't even have to pay him to say that.

Just jumped right up. We're just producing, guys.

Good job. Way to go, producer. That's my pig. Ah. All right. Well, what I will say is that bravery is not something I ever thought of myself as having. That is 100 honest. I was one of those kids that was like monkey bars. Hell no. I mean, I said heck no because I was a good goody goody. So, heck no, I'm not going on the.

I won't even swear about my fears.

I'm gonna talk like Katharine Hepburn instead. As a four year old. I was the four year old. Not Katharine Hepburn as a four year old. But I assume she sounded very similar, just in a higher pitched voice.

The young Katie Hepburn's Chronicles. Could we, could we make that happen?

Yeah. I mean, if it worked for Indiana Jones, right.

Would it be part of the wild cinematic universe?

Maybe we'll figure out the tie in. Somebody can email us the tie in if we can't figure it out.

African Queen. But babies.

Oh, I don't know. I don't know about the context of that. We're gonna leave that one on the table. We're gonna go back to bravery. Colin was very brave in that suggestion.

Thank you.

That was scary, I guess. Well, that, that Actually, you know what? This is the thing. All these things I talk about having done came with a lot of worry up front until I started getting more comfortable. I kind of have to learn to be brave on the fly. So like, oh shit, this is a really steep slope covered in snow. And my options are either turn around, take my on home, or look at like I have pause for a minute and take stock of the situation and remember, oh yeah, you know how to do this. You have the equipment for it. It's okay if I'm feeling nervous. I'm. I could scooch on my butt if I need to, but I'm going to try it. So I would say shug. There are probably plenty of times in your life that you've had to develop on the spot bravery without even realizing it. Just like Colin did on this podcast by sharing his opinions.

Exactly. Throwing it out there, guys.

Yeah. So listen, bravery could be standing up for yourself in a relationship. Giving a presentation in speaking up when you see something happening that is bad or wrong. Jumping into the deep end of the pool for the first time, like riding a bike for the first time. All those things take bravery in different ways. We just don't always think about it that way. So try to remember a time when you had to deal with something tough. How did you get through it? Like, that's what I would think about. For me, it is self talk. Okay, Shantae, this isn't as bad as you're making it. Let's break it into steps. And I.

Could you use your English accent like you do when you're doing your. You're proofing there. Can we try that again, please? Can we take another take? You know.

Oh no. I feel like it's gonna devolve into a cute. No, I don't know if I can do, like an intense accent.

You need to be brave. You gotta tell Shug how to be brave.

Damn it. Damn it, Colin. Okay, Shantay, this isn't as bad as you're making it. Let's break it into steps.

Love it.

See, that kind of veers into the kiwi. Because I can't help it.

That all works.

Apologies to people from both nations. Okay, and everyone in general and everyone that's listening, that is bravery is something you can turn up in any scenario. So finally. All right, not to get too therapy esque here. I did used to be a social worker, though. I want you to really dig deep and think about how you want to feel about yourself and how you want to see yourself at the end of your journey. So what do you want to be like when you finish this whole thing? How do you imagine yourself being and feeling? And that's whether you hike a week on the trail and dip out a month or the whole thing. Being brave in all the ways is going to help you move into the next stage of your life, whatever that may be. And it's going to serve you for the rest of your life. Like, this stuff stays with you. Everything I've learned in all of these scenarios in which I was brave has followed me throughout my life in, you know, in every scenario, work, relationships, whatever. So think about that. Harness that. Go take your little night out there, Shug, and go forth and become happy girl hiker. Okay? I believe in you.

Look, I don't know who your friend is, Shug, okay, maybe they really have something going on, but like, I gotta work. Like, you're talking about a like four to six month experience. And now like, ah, you know, that's one thing. If you're doing a weekend, oh, I can't go backpacking with you next weekend. Cause I gotta work. Like, I gotta do half the year to do this. Oh, I gotta work. So, like, that's number one. Number two is like, it's a bummer. I get it. All kidding aside. But you know, you've made the plans, you've taken. And I understand being afraid, but you know, go start, you know, it's not that far of a hike to the Laguna Mountains. And then at that point you've. If you're like, you know what? I'm just not into doing this myself. Go home. Right. But at least give it a shot.

Go big or go home.

Yeah, right.

Gear. Abby said that's right. Do you want to be part of The Gear Abbey Multiverse Cinematic wonder. What are we calling it?

Well, the Gear Abbey Cinematic Universe. I'm into that, too. So let's figure that out.

I'm into it. Acronym anything.

But it's. Yeah, I mean, you know, just give it a shot. And that's being brave, too. So.

Yeah. Channel your inner Lin Manuel Miranda. Today's episode of Gear Abbey is presented by the one, the only, the most delightfully alliterative outdoor retailer in the game, Garage Grown Gear. Want to see the latest and greatest coming from the coolest and newest outdoor brands? Head over to to garagegrowngear.com, click on the new button and all shall be revealed, including the following breaking news. Just added to GGG is the unofficial footwear of our very own producer and partnering gear. That's Pig, in case you forgot. Bedrock sandals.

Bedrock sandals. Love Bedrock sandals.

Well, you know what pairs well with Bedrocks?

No. Tell me. Gear Abby.

Okay. It's the Triple Crown Button Down Sundress by Jolly Gear. Oh, yeah. You can look fly in your Bedrocks because the Bedrocks may not do that for you. You may need the dress.

The best part of the model for the triple ground, the Triple Crown Button Down Sundress, is some kind of heavyset dude with a beard. It's amazing.

Oh, yeah. I love it. Jolly Gear is awesome. That's Jolly. He's the hiker behind it.

There you go.

So also, finally, if you're tooling around all day on the trail in your Bedrocks and your Jolly Gear dress, you definitely need a shelter for the evening. So check out the Pro Trek tent from Tarp Tent. Whether you're an ultralight backpacker or just an outdoorsy person who wants to see outdoor innovation at its best, you'll find something to love when you head to the official gear shop of gear Abbey, garagegrowngear.com All right, all right. Well, we have time for one more question. Whether or not it is poop related, we shall find out right now.

Okay, last question of the day. And they do spell your name wrong.

What the hell?

They spell Abby with an E. Should we.

Ed Abby. That's a different person. Did you mean to send this to the dead?

I mean, I wouldn't be mind. I wouldn't mind being compared to Ed Abby. That'd be pretty cool, but kind of.

A dick, but okay, totally.

But, you know, legend, legendary.

All right.

Yes.

Let's read the question. Colin.

Dear Gear Abby, I'm about to move to Tucson for work from Chattanooga, and I'm stoked about riding the trails out there. One of my buddies was being a dick the other day and showed me a video of some guy with all of these chunks of cactus. He called it Choyo, I think that's not. But anyway, I didn't know how to spell it. It was stuck all over his leg. And he told me I better watch out. That shit looked gnarly. I'm not stupid. I know there's cactus out there, but I've never seen anything like that. How do you deal with it if you get a bunch stuck on you like that? It looked like it hurt like hell. Sign Sean.

I love this. Oh, Sean. Sean, Sean, my friend Sean. This is great. I'm guessing you're a mountain biker just by the words you used in your, in your email. And listen. Yeah, people do crash out in cacti from time to time and I think anyone who spent time in the desert has had at least one encounter with. I think what you meant to say probably was choya.

Yeah.

C H O L L A In case you're wondering and want to google it. But if not, you know, many people have. So it is, it is a consistent presence in the desert. And so you know, for instance with me, I'm going to tell you a little, a little baby gear Abby story from back in the day. My very first time backpacking in Joshua Tree, I was doing an off trail trip led by my friend Saveria. She was not my friend at the time, she was just a trip leader. And I was a student in this class called the wilderness travel course that I then taught for like six or seven years. And she wasn't just leading this trip, she was actually getting evaluated on her leadership skills to get a certain rating for the Sierra Club, yada yada. There is a lot at stake on this trip so she couldn't screw up. So this is where I come in. I never met this woman before, never took a trip with her. Within five minutes of starting our hike, I stepped on a chunk of pencil cholla. Pencil cholla is kind of thinner and it's. The needles are just very aggressively angry like little knives. And it just went straight through the bottom of my booty. Which I have to say is amazing because I think at the time I was still wearing like keen targhees or something. Like they have substantial soles.

Don't call out potential sponsors. Keen has money.

Well, Keen, maybe now they have a anti cactus plate in their shoes. I don't know. No, I think really the idiot here was me, not the shoes. So listen, we all had to stop. She had to fish it out.

So you had to fish it out of your foot?

Dude, it was. It went all the way through the sole. We had to get it out. Like, even the little, just a little bit of the tip of the spine was.

This is like that scene from A Quiet Place when Emily blunt steps on the nail.

Oh, my God, it's gonna get worse. Colin, just wait. So it. So if you think that was bad, then, like, not even a few minutes later, I somehow kicked up a huge wad of jumping cholla which immediately embedded in the back of my calf.

Hike the same trip?

Yes, within like minutes of each other. So this thing, this whole wad just like stuck in the back of my calf. I just remember her face. She turned around and she just looked at me like, like, who are you and why are you on my trip? And can you please go home? It's like, listen, you're going to earn that leadership rating. I think later on she told me. She's like, I wondered for a minute if you were a plant. I was not. No one would do that willingly.

You can admit it now. I think the statute of limitations has expired on that secret.

They paid me large monies. No, no. I'm. I'm kind of mystified that she decided to be friends with me after that trip, but she is one of my dearest friends to this day. So I guess, yes, getting stabbed by a bunch of cholla is not a terrible thing all the time.

Have you been stabbed by cholla since that trip?

Yes, but not. Not as bad because I'm very good at watching for it because that was a little traumatic for me.

You learned your lesson?

I learned my lesson. I've actually also been on the other side of it, on saria side of it, when I was out with a group of college students from USC and we were doing a little like 1 mile quote nature walk through at Anse Borrego Desert State Park. They wanted me to take them on a hike, show them some cactus. So I gave them the talk. At the beginning of the hike, I'm like, listen, it's a short hike. The trail's kind of narrow. Just please pay attention to the choia because these things want to latch on and stab you in all the places. I even told them the story of the double choa and Joshua Tree, right? I'm like, listen. Warning, Warning. Red flag. So anyways, one of the girls on that trip just walked right into a choya. Like, right into it. Just like, probably just. Just like the guy in that video,.

Woman, she's like, yeah, you want to see?

No one tells babe. No one puts me in the corner.

That's right.

That's right.

This isn't gonna hurt.

It's women's empowerment. You know, I'm down with that. But yeah. So she just got this giant, like, wads in her thigh. And I think it took. There were about five of us working on getting all of it out. And then I. You not. She stood up and like, turned around to say something to somebody, moved maybe a quarter of inch right into another choa.

Oh, my God. My God.

She almost passed out the second time I felt.

So Sean is not moving to the desert after this response to his question.

We love Chattanooga.

It's pretty sweet here.

Listen, here's the thing, though, Sean. Cholla are not invisible. If you are a sighted person, you will see them with your eyeballs. Okay? Teddy Bear Cholla in particular. This is a form of jumping cholla. Get to what that means in a second. But. So Teddy Bear Cholla got its name because it looks fuzzy from a distance, because it's covered with hundreds or, I don't know, thousands. It feels like millions of tiny silvery little spines that kind of glow in the sunlight. Look all pretty. Beware. They are dangerous. So their branches, and I'm using the word branch very loosely here, they detach in segments super easily. It just wants to go boop. They. If you walk too close to that thing. And this is how it got the jumping choia nickname. They will take any opportunity to hitchhike. They're basically like giant ticks. Just like.

Oh, God.

There for the bloodletting. Okay.

Anything that's compared to a tick, which is maybe the worst thing in nature, really. Like a grizzly over a tick, probably.

At the end of the day, I don't. I don't know if Barry would.

That's right.

I guess he did.

He's like, I have a few notes on that assessment, sir.

Colin, I'll be sending you an email.

He just sends me a picture of his face.

He's like, don't do it. So sorry, Perry. Always lessons to be learned. But listen, Sean, I assume when you're on your bike, you're already scanning ahead, so you're. You're going to learn what choia looks like pretty quickly. You're going to try put it in your little mental photo bank and you're going to try not to crash into it. But if you do, do. Because you lose control, you know, whatever that happens. If you do and you get a bunch of these little doom daddies embedded in your body. That is. That's my official name. Doom daddies. Sounds kind of kinky. I don't know about that.

We don't kink. Shame on this podcast.

You're right. Doom daddies, okay.

Oh, it's like, are these, like, people in, like, you know, leather outfits that dress like Dr. Doom, or is this, like, is this another marvel?

I forgot to mention that all of the. All of the Teddy bear Choya also have harnesses.

Very, like, rivets and ball gags.

Yeah, it's pretty impressive. I don't know how they got them out there or they grew them themselves. It is quite, quite a scene. You can't miss them.

Listen, it's a lot of healthy sexual situations in the. In the cholla community, all right?

I mean, it's essentially S and M.

So they're looking just to hook up with you. That's all they're trying to do, literally. Yes. They're a very sexually forward community.

Yes.

Literally embedding themselves inside of you.

They want to be inside of you. Okay, I'm gonna keep this moving because if this happens, you don't want to just. You know, when you fall and you get choya on you don't then just suddenly try to get up because you may put more choia on you by doing that.

Oh, God.

So I have seen people put their hands down to push up, and it's like, oh, no, there's more choia there. So get yourself up carefully move away from the choia. Find an area where there is not choi. I don't know. That seems self explanatory, but as I've learned, it's not. So I would say also maybe don't sit down because there is a good chance there's cholla in places you don't even see.

Just gave me a shiver by the thought of what it would mean to not to sit down when you shouldn't.

Don't do it. Don't do it. So, yeah, listen, they are already a pain in the ass. Do not get them in your ass. So anybody who recreates in the desert, I always recommend carry a multi tool. I carry a leatherman with me that has pliers on it. And then also carry tweezers, scissors. In a pinch, you could use, like, a metal fork. You could use a comb. I've. I've used trekking poles before. Anything that can pull, pinch, flick, scrape off cactus spines and the chunks. So you want to. If this does happen to you, Sean get the big mama jama piece. Get that big doom daddy off of you as soon as you can. Whether or not you like it, whether or not you're into the, you know, ball gag situation, get it off you as soon as you can. And then, you know, you gotta just do it like ripping off a band aid. Okay? You have to commit to.

Don't be submissive.

That's right.

To the doom daddy.

That's right. That's. You are also, in this case, that you're the anti doom daddy. There's just two daddies. You're working it out. Just don't flick this thing at somebody else, because I've seen that happen too. I've seen any. Any choia.

Oh, my God.

Any choia. Accident that could happen, I've apparently witnessed. So just be careful where you fling them. Once those big chunks are off, then you gotta try to get all those visible spines out. And I'm saying visible because guess what? There's a whole bunch of other ones that are not visible. They're like little filaments. They're called glochids. Not like it's like, sounds like you're at a rave, but you're not. It's just terrible and evil. They will drive you to the brink of madness if you don't get the little ones off your skin. And they can actually cause irritation and infection. So once you get the visible big spines out.

Out.

Try to use those tweezers. Get the little guys out. I've also used. I've used duct tape sometimes if you really can't get them all out. I know people who put Elmer's Glue, not Super Glue. Do not put super glue on your body. Saying that as a. Listen, blanket statement. Elmer's glue. Let it dry. Rip it off like you're at the spa and getting them. Getting a wax. Yeah, I mean, he likes the wax. This does sound. We're getting deeply s m here. This. This could be somebody's thing. And if that's.

We're not king shaming.

We're not. We're not.

Yeah.

If none of that works, you could try soaking in vinegar, Epsom salts, and that'll kind of soften up those glucids. And the spines, by the way, they are barbed. Not just at the tip. Not just the tip. The whole thing is barbed. The whole thing is made up of.

Tiny little doom daddies. Don't play just the tip. All right?

They go, thank you for picking up that. That mantle, Colin. I left that there for you. Thank you.

You are welcome, welcome.

So, yeah, my pleasure. Sorry about all of this. Sean, if this ever happens, just clean everything up afterwards so you don't get insect, like, so you don't get infected. And above all else, Sean, make sure someone else gets this on video so you can show it to the next mountain biker who moves to Tucson. Okay? Do your job.

You know, the. This makes it sound like, I mean, if you've never been in the desert before, like, and these are.

I don't even think it's actually a.

Lot of time out there. Some of these things are, I think, kind of an amazing coincidence that you've had this much experience with choia. I definitely have had. So I have. Not personally, but I've been with people who went and they have had it. It happens. But I mean, everywhere has its things. I mean, I, when I having lived back east and mountain biking, I wrecked way more back east because guess what? You have slippery wet roots and you have those kinds of things. You're not following into cholla, but I definitely have more scars in my body from falling off my mountain bike in New England than I do from out here. And it's just, you know, so like, it's just every place has its own sort of unique set of risks when you're going out there. I love the desert, but. Yeah, you do. There's a lot of pointy pokey things in there that are looking to rip your skin off your body. So you do just have to be aware of it. That being said, I mean, tell you what, your buddies back in Chattanooga are gonna be very jealous of any non cholla involved mountain biking videos you send them after you're living in Tucson. Tucson's a pretty magical place.

That's right. That's right. Tell the doom daddies I say hello. Ah, well, that's it for this episode of Gear Abbey.

A very special episode.

Very special episode Colin is probably going to laugh at while he edits. Until next time, send your burning questions about cholla or your relationships with outdoor products people place burning.

Yeah, the doom daddies might be. I need some.

Just can't stop. Send your questions or your comments to colin to dear gear abbymail.com I'm going to do my best to answer them or find someone else you can. We've got some cool guests coming up and of course head over to your podcast listening service of choice and subscribe, rate and review to support the pod and make my day. And follow us on Instagram for the vapid photos we post in the meantime. Today's episode was produced by David Korstad and this guy, Colin True. Art direction provided by Sarah Genser. I'm Shante Salibair and remember, there are no dumb questions, just smart advice.