Welcome to another episode of the genius podcast.

My name is Karen, your host and founder of the genius project and

initiative for Catholic women designed to support and resource them towards

growth in all aspects of their life.

Professional, personal spiritual.

Now we seek to do this through online courses, our genius project master.

Catholic women, the genius podcasts and our live virtual events.

Now we have some really exciting news here at the genius project this week in that

we're going to be announcing the dates for our next live virtual event, which

is coming up in just a few short weeks.

Now these live virtual events are next level.

Ladies.

They adjust not another zoom call because if you're anything

like me, you're totally.

Stop from zooms.

This platform is incredible.

I have been using it to run my husband's live virtual events for Catholic

teachers in the U S and it is amazing.

So this is not a zoom.

It's going to be a great event where you can come and gather with other women

from all around Australia and the world.

And you're going to receive some really amazing input, just come and have

your souls fed by the amazing lineup.

Speakers that we've got coming to share and serve you over the weekend.

So anyway, check it out on the website, the events page, www dot genius,

project.com and on Instagram genius, underscore project underscore daily.

And there'll be a link in the bio there on this week's episode of the genius podcast.

I'm joined by my beautiful friend, Laura K Roland from the

east coast of the United States.

Now, as many of you would know, Laura came over and was one of the.

Speakers at our sisterhood national Catholic women's conference.

And so today she's joining me and we're going to be unpacking this topic of the

seasons of a woman's life, but she has a bit of an interesting take on this.

So I'll let her explain that for you.

So sit back, relax and enjoy this conversation with Laura

Roland, Laura, you for joining us on the genius podcast today.

It's so exciting to be able to see your beautiful face.

Well, I've been, so looking forward to this, Karen, thank you for having me back.

And, and, um, I just love that we get to have these wonderful conversation.

I don't know about you, but I leave it.

Like almost giddy when we're like, if we started a great conversation

between girlfriends, you know, like sisters, like really talking something.

Right.

I love, I love it.

I love you.

You've been one of the greatest gifts that God's given me over the past few years.

It's just amazing.

You were on, I think.

Four of season one of the podcast.

So we're now into episode two.

So for women who are just joining us, Laura and I connected when

you wanted to book my husband to speak over in Washington, DC,

back in four years ago, 2017.

Yes, 2017.

He, he came out of it.

Um, like late September, early October.

Yeah.

Yep.

Was, um, that was great.

I don't remember just chatting to you.

And we talked to told, I thought, oh, this woman's like kindred spirit

because you were helping out in the Catholic school's office at the time and

organizing Jonathan speaking to them.

And we got talking cause I handle his travel.

And then I was like, would you like to come over to Australia and speak at

the Catholic women's conference here?

And you said, yes.

I did, but I think it took my breath away and I was like, are

you sure you're talking to me is I'm not so sure about this.

And I remember I had a couple of moments where you really had

to journey with me through the doubt and the anxiety around it.

And I'm not really prone to anxiety a lot.

So we knew it was, it was not of God.

Um, and, um, I mean, what a while?

I mean, I, I still think back to that event and, um, it

changed, changed my life forever.

Not to put too fine of a point on it, but the women I met the spending getting

to spend time with you and your team.

Um, certainly, but, and then going to Australia was just a

dream come true for me in general.

So, um, it was, uh, yeah, it was just, uh, just an anointed time.

It really was.

And then we've had this friendship ever since I know God is so

good because I think like we've only seen each other in person.

But we were hanging out for these dumb pandemic to finish, so I can get over to

the U S again, I feel like that's for us.

So that's going to be our prayer that we can have that have that time together.

And, um, and you know, and really see what kind of, of, uh, trouble we get into.

Yes, absolutely.

And it was just, it has been a friendship.

We would speak every couple of weeks wouldn't we miss each most weeks.

So that has been such a joy and a blessing.

So it's wonderful to have you, so now I can share you with

all the women on the podcast.

You are so generous.

You really are.

For those of you that don't know Karen and don't, you dare

edit this out of the podcast.

I mean, I could repeat, I mean, control the spirit of generosity about you.

Um, and there is a spirit of just, um, speaking truth and love to others.

And I think that you are so good at recognizing the giftedness

of others and encouraging us.

So, um, I know for me, I've been the recipient of.

On numerous occasions.

Um, and I just love that, that that's the friendship and the sisterhood

that, that God's carved out for the two of us to, to experience.

Um, so I'm grateful.

Plus we just laugh a lot, which is funded my late night, go to women because

when everyone's asleep in Australia, I don't need to talk about Laura I,

you around and you're just waking up.

So, and usually, I don't know, I'm a night owl.

So it does work for us.

We have lots of great and healthy conversations.

A lot of times we don't talk about anything heavy either.

We're just like, how was your day?

Tell me all the things and yeah, it's I just love, I just

love what God's done with this.

It's been a lifesaver for me.

So Disha a hundred times.

Well, look today in these podcasts, what we're going to share and talk

about is the seasons in a woman's life because you and I both at different

seasons and we've, you know, Obviously matured along the journey and, and gone

through with it, all of the seasons.

And it's an area that I think is really helpful for women to have

insight into because sometimes we can hit a particular season and go, oh

my gosh, what the heck is going on?

And we found a, we can also fall into despair and hopelessness if

we don't understand the season.

And also importantly that we don't understand that seasons are cyclical

and they pass, they come and go.

So often.

I think we feel like we get stuck.

In a particular season, but I think it's that hope in Jesus, where we realize this

isn't going to last forever and you don't.

Yeah, you've done a lot of work around these area of seasons

and identifying this season.

So can you share a little bit with me about that work that

you've done before we dive in?

Sure.

So, um, with the, uh, women's ministry that I co-founded, um, back in 2018

and grace, we run, um, small group studies, um, with, we have to do groups

of women, two cohorts, if you will.

And this latest one that we did was called seasons and they're five weeks.

And, um, it's always rooted in scripture.

We always do Lexia Divina and that, and, um, spend time.

Praying together, um, and then really unpacking different topics.

So this time around with seasons, and the reason we brought that together

was based on our three years with these walking in journey with, with these women

accompanying one another and really.

Getting to know where everybody was and what we kept hearing was,

oh my gosh, this stage of life that I'm in this stage of life.

And I kept thinking it's not quite as stage, right.

A stage has a very, um, has very specific characteristics and there

is a clear beginning and a clear end.

And so what I, what I use the example is you are an empty nester.

Your last child leaves your nest and nobody returns for a period of time.

And so that is, you know, that is a stage of life and empty nest stage.

I see, even of life is, as you said, cyclical, and it, it can, it can

last a very short amount of time.

It can.

For years, right?

Or you can go through little mini seasons within it, and you can

experience many seasons at a time.

And when we, when we sat down to really think about which ones we

wanted to talk about, cause you could, you could package these in any way.

But the five that we chose were a season of discovery, a season of

wait, a season of sorrow, a season of abundance and a season of content.

And Riley those.

Yeah.

They, they really kind of, um, overlap one another in some ways.

And then the way that we approached it with the women in unpacking, it

was, we looked at, well, we looked at the definition of each one of those

words, which was really interesting.

Um, we looked at some synonyms so that the ladies were like, oh, I haven't

thought that was the same thing.

And we're like, okay, so you were sort of on the right track.

And then we looked at, um, what that particular season might look like.

And, um, what that season might feel like we looked at, um, how we

experienced that season based on whether we are rooted in the gospel.

Or if we're not rooted in the gospel, because those seasons look very different.

And then, um, then we looked at how do you know if you're coming out of that season?

Because so many of us think like, oh, I'm stuck.

Like you said, and stuck in the season forever.

Well know this is how, you know, you're kind of getting out of it.

Um, and then sort of what comes next and, um, And it was really fascinating

to watch the ladies sort of unpack these things because they're like,

oh, I want the season of abundance.

Or I want the season of contentment, you know, everybody was picking their sides,

you know, like I can't wait to get to this, but what we realize is depending on

where we are and relationship with Christ, where we are in that, um, I said, you

know, whichever side of the, of the church door, you're standing, so to speak, right.

A season can look very, very different.

Right?

And I love that you use the word hope because that was what came out of the

discussions about the season, where that if we are rooted in the gospel,

no matter what season we are in.

If we are rooted in the gospel, hope is the, is the overarching, um, it's

a thread that just runs through it that keeps us connected and keeps

us, um, keeps us grounded and it gives us something to hold on to.

Yeah.

Um, so it was really a fruitful I'm intended.

I was going to say no pun intended by the unintended, you know, seasons

growing, all the kinds of stuff.

Um, and so really to, to see the women sort of embrace where they

were and be like, okay, I got this.

I know exactly what I'm doing.

I know exactly.

Maybe some tweaks that I need to make.

Or I'm settling in for the, for the journey for the little bit.

So it was great.

Good.

Before you such a, the, um, women's ministry that you developed

encountered grace is beautiful.

You do so many amazing studies and deep dives, and I think

that's one of your great gifts.

Laura is your ability to just put these beautiful language

around a person's experience.

And I think that that has been such a gift to me.

I know it was at St.

Stoic.

So, yes, I'm excited about these seasons.

So thank you.

Thank you.

I feel like it's something that I've grown into.

Um, I think having other people tell me this is a gift that I see that you have

has given me that courage to step out and to step out, um, not in, not in,

in, from a place of fear, even right.

Some of us step out and we're like, oh, what's going to happen.

But it was more like, um, Am I really gifted in this way.

And so to have the encouragement and to have that, that validation

is, um, has been really amazing.

You know, it's often said, if you walk away from something you've done

it and you feel energized, right.

And you feel excited about it, then you know that you're in, you're,

you're working from your giftedness.

And that, that really is, um, you know, Hoping I'm honoring God by using it.

Well, you ma

you're, you're such a good encourager without wellbore.

Tell me, I'd love to hear more about each of these seasons.

So you identified five seasons.

Can you run us through each of them?

Sure.

Yeah.

So the first season was a season of discovery and discovery,

um, is sort of like you are.

Curious you're you want to learn some more things.

Um, you have come to terms with, with this idea that you

don't have it all figured out.

You don't have it all solved.

And when I, when we talk about seasons, I think an important

distinction to make is you can look at a season as a secular season.

So maybe at your work life, maybe it's something going on in your family.

Um, it could be any one of those things, or it could also be a season

that you're experiencing in your faith.

Right.

So what my faith like with Jesus, so any of these seasons can be experienced

in both ways or one or the other.

Right.

So just to kind of give you that clarification, that

those parentheses around that.

But when we talk about this season of discovery, it is you

have this yearning of desire.

You're sort of like, is there something more out there?

What else do I need to know?

What else do I need to have for me?

Um, when I am in a season of discovery, I get a little restless.

I get a little like there's what else are you doing with me, Lord.

Okay.

There's something that you want me to learn?

There's some new skill.

There's something new.

I need to discover about myself.

Um, maybe it's I have a new thing to discover about my kids, right.

Or I learned, or I meet a new friend or I tried something new.

And even if it's not successful, I always am learning something.

So that season of discovery, um, it can be a really exciting time.

Right.

Um, if you are not rooted in the gospel, a season of discovery

can feel very disruptive.

I like my box.

I don't want to get out of my box.

Right.

And so season of discovery, where the Lord, maybe your holy

Spirit's maybe urging you out of your comfort zone a little bit.

I got nothing else I need to learn.

And so unless we have an obedience and obedient heart, and unless we

are in a, in a posture of surrender, a season of discovery can be really

disconcerting and produce anxiety for us.

So, yeah.

Um, pardon?

I'm sorry.

When it goes on for a long time, when it goes on for a long time in discovery.

Yeah.

It's like, what else, what else have I done?

What else do I need to do here?

Like I thought, I, I thought I'm doing what you want me to do.

Yeah.

And so in it again, that's why I say it all depends on which side

of the church store you're on.

Are you rooted in the gospel or not?

And the way that you know, that you're coming out of the season of discovery

is you no longer feel so restless.

You no longer feel so disconnected and you feel tethered and excited

around the new information that you've learned, whatever that is.

Um, so that's discovery and it's funny because it's, the women were

like, I'm exhausted, like hard work.

I'm like the seasons are hard work and discovery is a very, very active season.

And it can also, um, start a lot of emotional, um, things that you

have to get sorted out, right.

Things that you need to learn.

Right.

Can can also bring up some things that, you know, feelings about that.

Um, so it, it can be a difficult season, um, and it can also be a

very lonely season cause you're sort of on your own learning it.

Um, so that's where the surrender comes in.

Lord send me the right people to accompany me on this.

The next season is a season of wait and nobody wants to do this season at all.

People are like, I want to avoid that.

Yes.

I don't want all cost.

And the thing about a season of weight, the more, um, you

know, speaking with women and.

You know, and just my own seasons of weight is that this is the most productive

season that we can possibly have.

It all depends on it, which if we're rooted in the gospel or not.

So it comes down to, in my opinion, right?

My experience is that when we are in a season of weight,

you, things are happening.

The Lord says yes, but not yet.

Common girl, I got you.

It's coming.

I promise you.

But you know what girl, like, you're not quite ready yet.

And I don't want you to fail.

I need you to be successful.

And so during the season of weight, I'm going to prune you.

I'm going to help you grow.

And that's why you can also have this Susan it's discovery during this time.

It doesn't sound good, but it it's so beautiful because what really

takes place is if this transaction of the heart space, right?

It's an opening of your heart to say.

Okay.

God, where it show me, show me where show me what I need to

learn so that I'm not successful.

The devil is going to want to bring you down if God brings you to it and

you're not ready, he's going to use that very thing that you haven't bound, but

ever needs to be whatever woundedness you have, that you have not bad.

And, and, and surrender, he's gonna use it and he's going to use it in very big ways.

And he's also, he used it really subtle ways, right?

So that you're not successful and God doesn't want that.

He wants you to be successful.

So that time of weight, it's sort of that time of, of him forming you, the diamonds

that you're supposed to become, right.

The second way that we experienced a season of weight.

And I think it's the harder one is where the Lord says, no, I

have something better, but we never hear that second part.

We hear no.

And we hear an authoritative father slamming a door and with that, no.

And with that slamming of the door, we hear you're not good enough.

You're never going to be a nod.

You're too.

This you're not that you're good.

You're all the things.

Right.

So, but if we just give it a hot second and we trust and we surrender

and we say, Lord, what do you mean?

And he says, I have something better for you.

I delight in you so much, you are worth so much more than the limit

that you're putting on yourself.

So if you just trust me, right, you just trust.

I promise you it's going to be better than you can ever imagine.

So come with me on this journey.

And that's a hard season.

The weight that is crossing every single with every single

ounce and fiber of our being, I'd experienced both seasons of weight.

I don't like either of them.

Right.

Cause then I look back and I'm like, I don't even want to look at what you did,

God, like that was so you were right.

You were right.

And so, you know, in that season of weight, we have to really

have that, that posture of.

Of really trusting the Lord in what he's doing.

And then we have to be open and to what it is that he is trying

to reveal about ourselves.

I love the idea of, you know, when he says, no, I have something better for you.

I always think of, well, he's already there.

Yeah, like he's already there.

He's already moving all the pieces, sees it, he sees it.

And what we see is just this, we just see this view, the immediate what's right in

front of us, but God sees like the hope.

And I think that's what you're saying is that we have to lean into trust that his

ways are higher and better than what we could possibly want dream hope or imagine.

Yeah, absolutely.

And, you know, I heard it said, and this sort of gave me that perspective.

I hadn't really thought about it and, you know, Jesus or God planted the tree,

but Jesus was gone with crucified on that planted that tree, knowing that

that would be the tree that blew my mind.

And that really sort of put all of that in perspective for me.

Right.

He already is there.

He already knows.

Yeah, he's moved all the pieces, like you said.

Oh, it's it's that it's really does come down to that.

So, and you know, you're moving out of a season of weight when you have that.

Um, when you have a sense of, I got this.

Okay.

I see the picture now I'm good with, with what this is, and you can kind of

look back with hindsight and sort of rest in the gift that he, that he gives you.

Um, So that's that season of weight, it's decent.

It like to say when you're going through the difficulty, the grief,

um, whatever it is, the hard stuff, it is really hard to trust and

believe, but there's a gift in that.

That's what we did last week.

And we were speaking about just, well, actually, nothing was Mary Lindenberg.

We were talking about.

The first sin in the garden was actually to doubt the goodness

and the faithfulness of God.

And so even in the hard stuff, we still have to be trusting and leaning into the

fact and the truth that he's always good.

And he's always faithful despite what's happening.

And then he's always doing something like all things work for.

Good.

For those that love the Lord, Romans that he is at work, you will make beauty from

the most horrific ashes in our lives.

We just have to have that receptivity.

Yeah, the RESA.

I love that word.

The receptivity to it.

I think too, that, you know, people think that nothing, like you said, to your

point, nothing's happening in a season of weight, it feels like it drags on, but

there's so much work that's happening.

Some of it's big work and some of it's little work day by day by day it's

surrender to me, surrender surrender.

Right?

Yeah.

So one of the things that I learned from a season of weight that I experienced

recently was that, you know, we need to look at what our prayer is.

Right.

And so, because God already knows the answer because he already knows what he

wants from us and what he wants for us.

Right.

Um, and this idea of what is it that we're praying in so many people,

and I include, you know, pointing, I'm pointing at myself, it's a

very specific prayer Lord, please.

I need, I need to make X amount of dollars at this job in order to be

able to do whatever it is I want to do.

I need.

And that's the prayer, right?

Day in and day out and really what the prayer should be is Lord, send

me, send me where I can do your wealth and you'll make it enough.

And so when you flip that prayer yeah.

It puts it all back on God, right?

Where it needs to work, where it comes from.

Then you get these release from anxiety when you do that, because you realize

it's actually not up to you like to strive and hustle and to make it and force it.

But when we just surrender it and we, we believe, and we trust that

he's in control, then there's a grace and a peace that flows from that.

So, absolutely.

Well, fear is fear is our I'm sorry.

Anxiety is fear of the future.

It's that what's going to happen.

What's going to happen.

What's going to happen.

And then, you know, so if we can, if we can surrender that part of it, like

you said, and just find that trust and, and we build that trust day by day,

it doesn't come all in one big smooth in it's it's a daily, it's a daily

like, oh, look at what you did, Lord.

Thank you.

So we have to be on, we have to receive it.

We have to be on the lookout for it.

It's a whole different way of interacting with the Lord when

you're in that season of weight.

Okay.

What's the third Chaisson season to season of sorrow and really nobody

has to be in sorrow and there's some good seasons there as well.

They're all actually good seats.

You're thinking about it.

Right?

Cause I think there's good fruit that's born.

Um, so a season of sorrow, most people think of it as it is this

endless depressive state of, you know, Nothing goes right.

And it's just, you know, poor me, poor me, poor me kind of thing.

Right.

We have our own little pity party in the corner.

So when I look at sorrow, I look at it.

I kind of come at it from like a side door.

Right.

So, um, I never do things head on when you kick it around the corner.

I wait, look over here.

We have.

So when we look at sorrow, sorrow is based on two things.

So sorrow really is, um, where we are grieving the loss of something.

And that's something could be a person that's, something could be a job.

It could be a relationship.

It could be a material thing that we've lost.

It could be what we had hoped was going to happen and didn't happen.

Right.

We get something completely different where we don't get anything at all.

So when we're in a season of sorrow, what we have to acknowledge is what is it

that we're, what is it that we've lost?

And I would, and I would pause it that everyone has lost

something in the last 18 months.

We've lost a dream.

We've lost travel opportunities.

Some of us really have lost, loved ones.

Um, you know, either through death or illness, we couldn't see people,

you know, all of that stuff.

Right.

And the thing is, is that, unless we take that opportunity to really grieve.

It just stays with us.

And the more it stays, the more layers on, because one thing kind of

leads to another leads to another.

So, um, Thomas Aquinas talks about, uh, CS, uh, about

farro and he talks about that.

There are two ways that it manifests itself.

Number one is anxiety.

And I'm not talking about people who have a clinically diagnosed anxiety disorder.

That is something that, you know, people seek medical help for that

medications are there for counseling is there for, and that is all good.

And holy and I, so I'm talking about just like in the moment in the season of style.

Okay.

Um, so when you're, when you're feeling, I mean, that anxious, right?

That anxious state, it's that fear of what's going to happen.

Because all you've known is that nothing goes according

to plan, nothing is happening.

Right.

You've lost every last thing.

And unless we can stop and take a hot breath wow.

Pops back in and say, wow, that was awful.

Right.

I lost and grieving that loss.

And I'm sad about that.

Right?

And so now we have to differentiate between emotions and feelings and

we all have emotions, which then we get up in our feelings about

them, how we choose to emote.

Express those emotions get us into feelings, which leads us on a whole.

We could do another whole podcast about that.

Right?

Right.

So you've got anxiety is one way that a season of sorrow can build up.

And the other way is something called tour, poor T O R P O R.

And if I'm not pronouncing that correctly, please somebody send me because I don't

want to sound like an idiot moving forward, but I think it's to our poor.

Yes.

Core core is just the feeling of like leather G um, you don't really want to

interact with people and that's even like introverts like me who then really,

really, really don't want to interact.

Um, it's appealing of just like you can't get out of bed.

It's like, I'm just, I just want to lay around.

So it's sort of a depressive state, and again, not somebody

that's clinically depressed.

This is coming on as a result of this unresolved grief or

unacknowledged grief that we have.

And I always like in core core.

So hopefully people will, if this reference, but the movie inside out, it

was a Pixar movie that came out several years ago and it was all of the feelings

and the emotions were sort of having this, this interplay and core pour

was sort of the round looking woman.

And she just like dragged along the bottom everywhere.

And she just brought everybody down and, and joy.

The, the, um, emotion, joy was like, you need to, you need to move so I can come in

and she's like, no, he needs to experience me so that there is room for you.

Cause I take up a lot of space and joy is like, Ooh, like up and down,

like, like a rocket and depression is sort of like big and bulky and

it just fills up all those spaces.

And so this idea of torpor then is.

That's sort of like the, the anxiety turned inward, right?

It's like it's so we stuff it down and we stuff it down and we stuff it down.

Right.

Hoping it just sort of goes away.

Yeah.

The thing about sorrow, no.

And the thing about sorrow is it's going to come at you.

You're you're going to, it's going to get you one way or they.

And so we have to be really, we have to understand that it's a season

and that there are ways around it.

I love that's about the way, say St.

Thomas Aquinas.

I think, yeah.

I'm pretty sure it was him.

He said, um, he's like, you know, take a warm bath and have a nap seriously.

Like that was one of the things that he recommended all those

years ago, a little self care.

And he also said, you know, it has pity on somebody.

Well, it means you have compassion towards them.

So give yourself that compassion that you would have somebody else.

So in a season of sorrow, you know that you're starting to come out of

it when the Tor port sort of lifts, or you're not anxious about the future.

And you just feel a little more in balance, but you have to give yourself

that time to grieve what was lost.

And people will say, well, you know, it was just a job.

Like why do I need to know.

You had an expectation and there was some emotion wrapped around that you

need to greet that, even if it's you sit and, you know, you have, for me,

it's, you know, I just have a little cup apart and I have a good cry.

And I love that.

You often say that have a come apart.

I have a come apart.

Yeah.

So, so when we have a come apart, right, we, we crack.

Right.

And what, what shines through the cracks?

Light?

Joy?

Happiness can come in.

I like to think that God fills me with his super glue that puts

me back together in a little bit of a different, a better pattern.

And, you know, there's that, um, the physiology behind actually crying it's,

it's scientifically proven it's important.

Cause that act of crying, that act of lamenting and grieving actually

releases that within your body.

I mean, as you know, I've shared on a couple of podcasts ago, we just

had, um, two suicides of young males.

You know, 13, 16 that my kids knew.

And my daughter particularly said to me the other day, she goes,

well, when should I stop being sad?

And I said, well, you just have to do these things that release that grief

and so that you can keep moving through it so that you don't become stuck.

And I thought, gosh, it's interesting to teach her about how to do that.

Exactly what you said, have a bar care for yourself.

Pray talk, walk, you know, just those little things that do keep

you moving, so you don't get stuck.

Yeah, exactly.

What was recommended.

Those were all of the things, right?

So this has been, the season has been around as long as humans have been around.

Right.

And so it's just, it's understanding and acknowledging, and we

have to allow ourselves to do that to be, to become healthy.

Absolutely.

So the fourth season then is abundance and everybody's like, oh finally, I'm

not a Saara I get to get, like, I get to live abundant land, like, well,

you know, here's the thing about it.

Yes.

I know where you're going with this.

We had these conversations.

Yeah, we did.

We did so abundance as, as we talked about was that sometimes, you know, we think

of abundance as all of the good things.

It's like, ah, finally, Things go my way.

It's a day of green lights, you know, I get, they get my coffee order.

Right.

And, you know, I had extra points, so I get it for free.

And you know, it's just a day where everything goes, right.

And we think finally I'm in a season of abundance, but the thing is, is

that we can also have a season of abundance of the not so good thing.

So hello.

Right?

And so people wouldn't when we brought this one up and I said that

they all went, you are such a dream squasher I know, I know I get it.

But again, it depends on, you know, if we're rooted in the gospel, right.

If we are rooted in the hope of the gospel, we see it all as good.

We see all of the good things that we get as a gift for no

reason, then God gifts us things.

And we see the bad stuff as gift, because we know that something is happening.

We think it's a season where nothing's happening and we can just sort of float

along and whatever, but really, you know, we are, it's sort of that this

too shall pass mentality of someday.

You've got it all together.

And then other days it feels like you have nothing and you can have the season

of abundance of, you know, of feeling that way of the too much of the not

good and too much of the good, right.

And so we're always striving to kind of even all of that out,

but the reality is that we're humans and life is messy in chaos.

Thanks Adam and Eve, that's sort of where it all started.

And so it's this.

Yeah, it's this idea of, you know, we can look at abundance as, um,

as you know, it's just my turn to be, you know, to have more today.

And of the good stuff.

And tomorrow it'll be my turn to have the not so good stuff.

And if we see it as gift and that there's fruit, that will be born of

it again, it's that idea of which, you know, how rooted in the gospel are you?

The season of abundance teaches us if there is a fruit, if I could name a fruit

for this particular one is it's a fruit of detachment detaching from the outcome.

It doesn't matter what you have.

Or don't have you have too much of whatever it is, detaching from that.

And just saying, thank you, Lord.

Thank you.

I know that you're going to use the, for your, for your good and your glory.

Thank Therese of Lisieux.

You know, everything is grace.

Everything is give to a perspective that no matter what comes the good, the bad,

the ugly, it's all pure gift from the Lord that he's at work in all of it.

Yeah, absolutely.

So it's, it's, it's, it's a season of, of active.

On your part and detachment, and God is doing some amazing things in that.

And we just, our job is to sit and sort of just appreciate it all.

And that's what we do the last season is a season of intendment and.

Okay.

Anthony took abundance away from me.

I just read, are you going to take content run away from us too?

Maybe this podcast people don't want to listen to?

No, I look, I think it's good because you know, in Australia as we've shared,

like we just didn't look down like it, all the states can't leave the country.

Can't leave.

You stay people in many states can't even leave their home.

So I think this is really very tight.

So please tell us how it can be.

Right.

So contentment means to be happy and it needs to be content, you

know, season with contentment or.

Kind of coast along a little bit.

Right.

But this idea of contentment, um, on the surface, it's we

feel like we're resting, right?

Like, like we're just sort of in that I think of it like a swing, like

you're not on the teeter-totter where you're up one and down the other rate

you're like in that fulcrum part, you're like in the center and you're

just sort of like hanging out there.

Right.

And that is a good place to be.

As long as we are using that time of contentment, you.

Do you use it as a thief in the praise as well, right?

Like to make sure that we are praising and giving thanks.

And we're using it as a time to sort of reflect on the seasons

that we've just been through.

If we're not doing that, which means we're not really rooted in the gospel and we're

not really in, and our relationship with father, son and holy spirit, what that

does is it breeds complacency, a laziness, a slothfulness, and all of that starts

to lead to a little bit of comparison.

Hmm.

Like she's got a little bit more than I have.

I thought I was content, but so we're sort of like, if we're not looking

carefully at the right thing, we're looking around us because now we've got

all this time on our hands kind of thing.

Right.

And we're looking over our shoulder and we're going, huh?

Chuck, she got this and I didn't get this.

And you know, and then that sort of can lead to some jealousy going on.

Right.

And jealousy in and of itself is not a great thing.

We don't want to be there.

That's where the comparison hits.

But all of that leads to the end.

And envy is the most diabolical sin because envy is no longer

wishing the good of the other.

And we have fallen so far at that point.

And so it's a very slippery slope if we're in the season of contentment and we're

not recognizing it for what it is and what God wants us to do in the season.

So we're resting that's because we're resting up for the next season and

the next season is usually discovery.

So you're sort of like content and then all of a sudden you're like, If

there's a new book, I should be reading.

And, you know, I heard about this, I'm coming out of a season of contentment.

It scares me a little bit because I feel like I've just done a lot of work.

Um, but this season of discovery was like, huh?

I think I need to read some books on the saints and specifically St.

Catherine of Sienna, she's been stalking me lately.

I'm like, I think I'm supposed to read St.

Catheters standards.

So now I feel like I'm in this, I'm on the season now of discovery.

What am I going to find?

And what is she going to do?

You know, what's the Lord going to do with me with this with me and, uh, St.

Catherine's spending some time together.

So.

Um, so coming out of a season of contentment is you start to get restless.

You start to get curious about things, if you're rooted in the gospel, right.

And then you have hope like, oh, what else does God going to do?

Like, what's next?

And so we, we look at it that way, as opposed to.

Clutching that feeling of what we think is peacefulness, but it really isn't.

It's going to eventually start to grate with us a little bit.

Great.

Um, mindset shifts, I think, because similar to what you're saying,

I find in my life, I know other people are sharing the same that

there's this holy curiosity about.

What, what is God doing in the midst of all this, but all the pandemic and

personal lives and loss that people are experiencing, what is the Lord doing?

And I think that holy curiosity does help us to walk the path and the

invitation that's there before us in the situations that we find ourselves.

Absolutely.

So I think if we can look at each season as what is the work that's actually

happening and we can be like, okay, I think I'm heading into a season of weight.

But I know that there's some good infertile work coming.

We're not as fearful of it.

And we sort of just, we work alongside the Lord, right.

Work we're partners in that.

And, um, and that keeps us more, that keeps us on a better.

Mindset a better pathway.

I think that is fighting it.

I just, as you speak, I'm reminded of St.

Augustine's quote that he, who created you without your corporation, who won't

save you without your corporation.

And so there's this sense and there's a mandate on us to be co-creators with God.

But that also means co-creating.

The shape of our life through our choices.

And John Paul too beautifully says in his letter to artists, that you are

to work with the Lord to craft of your life, a piece of art, a masterpiece,

something that's really beautiful for God.

And so in each of the seasons, there is that invitation

to be co-creating with God.

Like you said, walking alongside cooperating with him to shape.

Through our choices, what we focusing on, how we're perceiving

what's happening in our life.

And I think that's immensely powerful.

Like you said, it comes back to being rooted in the gospel

and that is a game changer.

Yeah, it's, it's taught me, you know, how I, how I interact with, with the Lord.

Um, you know, am I going to him with a laundry list of, uh, things like, here's

my, here's my list for you today, honey, to be a Reverend, but you know, it

sorta feels like a honeydew list, right?

Like this and this.

And if you could send this, that would be great.

Um, but I think that if we can come at him from that holy curiosity of

love that phrase and, and be more like, you know, board, how are

you going to surprise me today?

Changes that conversation.

It changes that relationship.

It's all about an excitement and an awareness of who's really in charge.

Um, and that, that is so freeing.

It takes a lot of work to get to that point, but also venture to say, if you.

You know, if you can make that part of your prayer.

It doesn't have to be so hard.

Does that make sense?

Definitely does.

And I think, I mean, I really relate to this at the moment.

And I shared on previous podcasts just the past 18 months for us

personally been a lot of loss.

And last year, the online learning was just like, really tested me.

But this year I'm in a different space where there's still the loss.

There's still a lot happening around us, but interiorly, there is this.

The Lord is really close.

And like he said, it's just this detachment actually from outcomes.

And just it's like what's left is me and the Lord, you know, in that interior

self, that interior cloister of my soul.

And then everything else can continue to happen around me.

But there is a deeper abiding pace then.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I think that can only happen when you've experienced loss.

So when you've experienced the difficulty, because that's what he's

doing and that's the beautiful fruit of these different seasons in our lives.

So many people, I mean, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off.

I just really want to encourage the women listening to this.

If they do find themselves in this season, too.

To pressing into learning to trust that he's good, he's faithful,

and that he will bring us through.

You will, there will be beautiful threes through our yes.

And our cooperation with him.

Absolutely.

I just had dinner tonight with, um, some cousins I come from my mom's side

is very, very large family and, and several of the women have recently

experienced the loss of a, of a husband.

Um, one of the, one of them.

Second or third cousins, her mother just passed away and her

father was very ill, so lots and lots of this loss and whatever.

And we were the happiest table in the restaurant.

We were sharing stories and we were, um, you know, there was just so much hope and

you can have joy in the midst of sorrow.

You add the two can indeed co-exist you know, because what the joy does is that

it re you're remembering the goods.

In that moment.

So if you've experienced, so, you know, like we said, like if we're leaning into

it, if we can understand that you can have joy in those moments, you can find them.

While going through some of these cyclical?

No, that's that that's being rooted in the hope of the gospel

and that's just so important.

Well, I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Laura.

She is such a beautiful friend and she has so much.

Jim to share across a whole lot of topics.

So if you'd like to listen to some of her earlier episodes, scroll back.

I think she was guest number four or five last year when we

launched the genius podcast.

And you can check out her ministry for women encounter grace in us.

If you like what you're hearing on the genius podcast.

Please ask you to leave a review and share the link with your friends.

We also have the live video recordings on YouTube.

So check that out.

The genius project, YouTube channel has just gone live in the last few weeks and

we came to share the message on that.

As I mentioned at the start of the podcast, we are having our

virtual Catholic women's event.

And I would love for you to join with us.

We had over a couple of hundred women last time, and it was amazing.

We had beautiful speakers and we're bringing you this

event on incredible platforms.

So make sure you check out that link.

Have a beautiful wait ladies and God bless you.