So what's going on, everybody?

Hey, everyone.

This is Derek, this is Matt.

And we are here today to do something we haven't done in a while.

Yeah, we're breaking back into the random.

So we have our.

For those who have been listening for some time, you know that we've done a few episodes where we have our cards of random things.

We don't know what they are going to say, and we pull a random one and it gives us something to talk about.

We had a different idea today.

Originally, we had planned to do a different episode, but we decided to do this instead because it sounded like fun and we hadn't done one in a while.

Yeah.

So we're going to start, I think, with the one color of card.

There's four different types of cards.

We're going to start with one color and see how far we get.

Like, we're gonna just draw one of each kind of a thing as we go along.

But we are gonna.

Yeah, we're just gonna see what happens and it'll be totally up to God to see.

See where we go.

It's been crazy in the past when we've done it.

You check out.

We had an episode when I wasn't here.

Yeah.

And it was random chance.

Random chance.

And it was a card that was randomly drawn.

Yeah.

About random chance.

So we talked about that for a full episode, actually.

Yeah.

And it was.

It was a good episode, too.

It was good to listen to.

Yeah.

So, yeah, we'll see how it goes today.

We'll grab a card here in just a few moments.

But nope, we're just glad to be on here today.

And like we've been talking about recently, you, you know, we had launched our Patreon and we've got a few subscribers.

And that's awesome.

We keep, you know.

Yeah, we've got three paid and one free subscriber.

So we've got four subscribers as of right now.

Yeah.

And so that's always.

That's awesome.

We appreciate your support and everyone who listens.

We love that you tune in every week and help us not only because you like hearing us, hopefully, but also you help get our algorithms out there that we're a show.

And, you know, the only way we can make a difference is if we get help getting it out there.

So that's awesome.

And we're hoping that as we continue to have conversations at either random or planned or whatever it is, that this stuff can continue to get out there and maybe be helpful for someone, whether it is helping them into faith or Helping them with their faith or whatever the situation may be.

So we thank you for that.

And then also, I just want to go ahead and promote that.

This guy's wood business is amazing.

The stuff that he's coming up with has been outstanding.

He got to sell a few of the pieces at our recent Winterfest event, and they looked awesome.

And so, I mean, if you like wood signs or different designs, reach out to Derek, because, I mean, his.

I mean, he's just taken off, but, like, it is awesome.

So don't forget to hit him up, because it is just strider.

Strider design.

Design.

Right.

Strider design.

It is.

It's cool.

So do you have your website up?

Not yet.

So he's working on that.

But yeah.

But I currently am using the email address striderdesignmail.com.

that's an easy way to get me.

I have a phone number, too, which I will.

I'll put that stuff in that comment.

In the comments or link or whatever the links in the.

But yeah, it's.

It's an info.

It's awesome.

So.

All right.

But, yeah, we're gonna take our random chance today and see what happens, right?

Yeah.

Right.

Do we want to draw before?

Let's draw before.

Draw before.

Yellow.

Draw yellow first.

Yep, yellow first.

Random yellow card says, what would you like prayer for?

That's a good one.

All right, so actually, why don't we do that now and then kick into prayer here in just a minute?

Oh, that's.

That's good.

So what I'd like prayer for.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, there's obvious things like I'm always learning prayer for the student ministry because we want to continue to grow these kids inwardly within themselves, but we also want to continue to grow outwardly.

We want more kids to get involved and the program to continue to grow so we can do even more cool stuff.

So that is at the forefront.

Personally, I would pray.

So my wife has been starting a new medical practice, and there's a membership thing that's with it.

It's pretty cool.

She's a holistic person.

She does nutrition, and she does.

I'm terrible at this new.

She's a natural nutritionist.

Yeah.

And not just the voodoo oils, which is a joke.

For not just the essential oils.

That's what I call voodoo oils.

She actually does a lot, and she can help you figure out what's going on with your body, especially when it comes to what actually your body needs and what it's holding in it and all that stuff.

She does all these cool tests with hair and stuff.

Anyway, it's pretty wild.

I don't mean this in a disrespectful way.

I was shocked that it worked.

That some of the things like we had the tea that she.

Oh man.

She had this, this concoction that was amazing.

So be, be looking out for that too because that's gonna be a thing.

I mean, that's the thing.

It's a thing.

All part of it.

And so she, she's.

That's.

It's been a thing that she's doing and growing and so I'm praying that that continues to take off.

So honey, if you're listening, I'm praying for you.

I am.

And now everybody knows about it.

Good job.

So that's two things right there.

I'm praying for student ministry and praying for my wife's new practice or venture or whatever you want to call it.

Awesome.

Yeah.

Mine is that I'm able to apply what I'm learning.

I'm in a place where.

I'm in that wilderness where God speaks to his people.

And I've been brought to a point of humility that wasn't like a, you know, knocked me off my high horse kind of a humility, but just God brought me to a place where I was willing and able to just have open hands and be, be willing to absorb whatever knowledge people are giving me.

So my prayer request is that I can apply the things and retain the things that I'm learning and in all different aspects spiritually.

The new laser engraving company that I, I've started, family life, all, all of it, the church stuff that I'm doing, like, so I've been, I've been in that spot.

But also just man, my, my family back home, like they're, they're doing good, but it's been a real rough year for them this last year.

And so just for healing spiritually, emotionally and just the ability to move forward in a positive manner.

Okay, so that's what we're praying about.

Cool.

So welcome to the Truth response.

So Matt, you want to pray for us today?

I would love to.

Alright.

Lord, thank you for today.

Thank you for everyone who's tuned into this and for the fact that you've given us the ability to be on here doing this.

Just continue to guide our conversation even though we're using what to us is random, but for you, as planned when it comes to our conversation and just pour into us and allow us to use the right words, the right thoughts that just help us discern the right answers to whatever Comes for everything that we talked about before the break.

When it comes to things we are praying for, we ask your will into that, that you can help us with all those things.

And all this we ask in Jesus name.

Amen.

Amen.

All right, so ready?

So we already pulled a card.

Yep.

And so yellow card down, so.

Well, first.

Yeah, we want.

We want you guys to also let us know.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

What would you like prayer for?

Like, be interactive with this.

I'm gonna put this over here.

I'll take a picture of it later.

So.

Yes.

What would you like prayer for?

Okay, so now we have.

Do you want to go to green?

Blue?

Yeah, let's go green.

Let's just do it.

What do we got?

You pulling it?

Yeah, I'm pulling it this time.

You pull it.

You pull it.

What's it say?

Ooh, this one.

This one's one.

I like.

Are there any circumstances in which it is appropriate for a Christian to judge others?

Is there.

Okay, so let me.

Are there any circumstances in which is appropriate for a Christian to judge others?

Now, I.

I think we're gonna have to define some terms.

Well, perhaps we shall.

We've done something like this.

We have, but.

So any circumstances which.

For to judge.

But what kind of judgment then?

That's what I'm saying.

Yeah, we need to.

So I would say, as far as, like, condemning someone.

Absolutely not.

Right.

You know, like, that's.

That's.

God's already done that.

Jesus said that, you know, if you.

If you believe you're not condemned, if you don't believe you are condemned, period.

That's.

That's into the.

It's not anything that you're currently doing.

It's.

It's whether you have Jesus or not.

So as far as that goes.

No, I think.

Yeah, I mean, like, I think that as far as being the judge of others, I think there's.

There's several circumstances in which that could look like judging, one of which we can go to an easy example first.

Right.

Like elders and pastors and such, having to be the disciplinarian, I guess you could say, of congregants or each other, depending on.

I mean.

Yeah, that works.

Right?

So whether.

No matter what, like, if we.

To being.

Maybe if you're looking at judgment as, like, if you see something and that makes you feel like you need to call something out a little bit, sometimes that's needed.

For instance, we could start by.

If anybody on the ministry staff, if we thought that they were, you know, having extramarital relationships, you know, and Luckily, I don't think anyone would even come close to that, any of our eldership or.

But you never know.

Like, sometimes crazy stuff happens.

And so we'd have to sit them down.

Like, we'd have to call that out.

We'd have to.

And that requires some judgment, discernment, but judgment.

And I think the two go hand in hand is properly being able to discern a situation if you're gonna put any kind of judgment into it.

Same thing as, like, we would.

And it falls under judgment.

But it's not as sticky as, like, trying to condemn people.

But if somebody wanted to get into ministry and something in their life wasn't, you know, right.

We'd probably tell them, hey, look, if you want to do that, that's fantastic.

But you need to fix.

That's one of the questions.

That's one of the questions I ask all incoming elders for their, like, interview right before they're voted on or where we put them up for vote.

Is that like, are there any skeletons in your closet?

Because if there are, it's best that we just talk about them now so we know what, what's going to be fielded.

Because if not, somebody's going to bring them out.

Yeah, right.

And we, we learned that the hard way, unfortunately, with someone.

And it was bad reaction on our part.

So actually it was bad reaction on everybody's part.

But so since then I learned to ask, you know, like, are there any skeletons in the closet?

Is there anything that could.

Somebody could be like, this doesn't look good or this is a problem or whatever.

And let's talk through it.

Let's see how we can approach it.

Let's see if it's something that we should maybe wait a year or so for you to, for you to come on.

Or is it something that we can be proactive with and hit head on, or is it just something we need to see if it comes up, you know, like, but, but know ahead of time.

That way we can have each other's backs.

That's, that's the biggest thing, is having each other's backs with things and just being up front about things.

Because when you get into ministry, there's a lot of eyes on you.

There's a lot of eyes on you.

But also, like, things can get nasty.

Yeah.

And who we put into certain positions reflects on what we believe.

And so when I remember when.

So Sadie and I were.

When I was really starting to struggle with going into ministry, Sandy and I were just, we weren't married yet, so it was one of those things, like, well, you know, you guys, you're going to want to be married, you know, especially because at the time, you know, we were living in the same house.

You know, if you're going to represent Christ, living like, that's not representing him well.

So it was an interesting, like, moment of.

I mean, we were.

I mean, when I really started to start to look into pursuing ministry for real, even though I was kicking and screaming a bit, that was something that was brought up.

Well, you know, that's cool.

They wanted me to, but this is, you know, you got to take care of this.

And we were already going to be at that point when they brought that up, she and I were already engaged.

This is going to happen.

And so we did actually come to find out that the guy that did the ceremony for us told one of the people that I was going to be, I guess, doing ministry under.

That I was going away.

He was getting ready to leave to go do something else in ministry.

And, and doing the wedding for me was a going away present for the other guy because that meant I can go into ministry.

So that was kind of an interesting thing.

I was like, wow, that's.

I guess that's a vote of confidence.

But yeah, so, I mean, certain things you just have to take care of and actually.

Sure, you know, it's realistic, you know, to like, as you said, are there any skeletons, Is there anything out there, hanging out there that you might want to tighten up, you know, or just.

Even things that could appear.

I mean, there could be nothing, nothing wrong with what happened or the situation, but it could appear that way.

And you just need to kind of have things on the heads up.

You know, we have systems in place for checks and balances just so there can.

There isn't things.

So like, for instance, like I was talking to Nick about this that, you know us in a pastoral role.

It's, you know, we just got all these new cameras installed in the church, which we have like, coverage over everything now.

Yeah.

Which is amazing.

And so I told him, you know, it's wonderful now that we have that extra eye on things.

So, you know, if we need, if someone needs counseling, whether it's a female regular congregient or one, even one of my students who's like, there's everything can.

Everybody knows everything's on the up and up.

I mean, it would have been regardless, probably with him and I, but we.

It's good to make sure that there's no way that there's any possible thought that things could be Doing differently.

It keeps everybody accountable.

Accountability is important in ministry.

It's important in life.

It is important in life.

But in ministry, we want to make sure that there's accountability.

This is a place people need to be able to trust us.

And there's been plenty of churches and church peoples over the history, as everybody knows, that have taken advantage of those things.

And we.

And we don't want that.

And we don't want anybody, you know, we don't want the opening for it, even in jest, even in curiosity, for anyone to be like, well, what's really going on there?

We don't want room for that.

We want it to be, you know, on the up and up.

So, yeah, so.

And that requires judgment in itself, where it's like, okay, we need to play offense here, you know, and so that we can get ahead of these things.

So just.

So there is nothing stumbling, no stumbling blocks in place for anyone.

And.

Right.

And.

And we say judging, like, all of it.

Everything that we do should be done in love.

Everything.

Not just.

Not just when it comes to judging, but just everything we do should be done in love.

So if.

If you are judging someone, right, in love, it looks different than if you're judging someone like the world does.

Yeah, it looks different.

Okay, so, like.

But we should do everything in love because we want.

The purpose of judging is for reconciliation and growth.

Right.

We want whoever that is to be reconciled with the church, with whoever's in the place of accusing or whatever.

We want that reconciliation, and we want for them to then be able to be free, to grow.

Right.

And so, like, when it comes to that, I know judge to judge someone or judging someone has.

It carries a negative connotation for sure, but I think that that act doesn't need to.

And I like what you said earlier about the idea of we're not there to condemn someone.

First off, without salvation, we're all condemned without Jesus.

I mean, it says it plainly in John.

Right?

Also, Scripture makes it clear that this is a gift.

This is grace, this is mercy, and this is given to us freely so that no one can boast.

So just because you have accepted and received that grace and mercy doesn't mean you get to hold it over anyone's head either.

So that being said, there's nothing there.

If you're judging someone because you've come to Christ and they haven't, first off, they've already condemned themselves.

They don't need you.

You should be encouraging them.

That's what you need to do.

You need to be trying to help them and be the mouth of Jesus, not the other way around.

That's important.

In fact, when it comes to judging, I think judging the positive way, that should be Christians and Christians, right.

We're not playing by the same set of rules, unfortunately, if it's Christian and non Christian, I mean, God's rules are universal, but they don't know that.

So it's kind of hard to hold someone accountable to something that they don't agree with or believe in.

So when it comes to that, it should be Christian on Christian and it should be for the purpose of building up and encouraging.

Because when you're judging in that way, there is no condemnation because you are both in Christ.

Right.

So therefore there's no condemnation.

So you know that whole bit.

But that's my take on it.

Yeah, I mean, I think that's pretty conjure.

Other than that, I mean, like, I'll tell you this, my last thing on judging others, you are not.

We're not judging in a comparison is not okay.

Your journey, no matter if it's with Christ or without, is not the same as someone else's.

How you come to Christ, how you live your Christian walk, all that stuff.

So no one's better than another.

No one's more innocent than another.

It's just a matter of, you know, look, we should always be encouraging each other forward.

The only reason you should look in your neighbor's bowl is to make sure they have enough, not to see if they have more than you ever.

And that's something I.

That's just something I tell my kids like.

It's never about trying to see, you know, if someone's better or worse off than you.

It's about, hey, can I help them?

Or do.

Yeah, are they not.

Are they good?

And that's fine.

And so, yeah, other than that, like, yeah, judging.

If you're out there doing anything that you're thinking less of people because of it, check your heart there.

If you're trying to condemn people and their actions, check your heart there.

Remember that you were condemned once as well.

Remember that you fell short without the blood of Christ as well.

And so this isn't about trying to put people down, it's about trying to raise people up.

Yeah.

Also just along those lines, remember what Jesus has done for you in that.

I read a devotion not too long ago, and I think we may have talked about it on the podcast recently too.

I don't remember, but it was about the dying of the rope.

There was a rope that had red dye.

The question Is how do you undy that rope?

You know?

And we're like, you know, you can't, right?

But Jesus does that for us.

And so it's as though it never.

It never happened.

You know, we still deal with consequences.

We still deal with that.

Well, what has happened because of said thing, but it doesn't exist anymore.

And so we have to remember that when we're.

When we're dealing with other people, that Jesus loves them that much too.

So.

Yeah, very good.

Cool.

The blue card, which is what.

What is the blue cards?

Blue card is personal beliefs.

So this will be fun.

Oh, yeah.

Oh.

Oh, man.

I swear, these are completely random.

So how important.

How important is it for Christians to give money to the church?

Should it still apply to us today?

Oh, boy.

All right.

How important.

How important is it for Christians to give money to the church, and should it still apply to us today?

Well, scripture tells us to pay our teachers, right?

Well, yes.

I mean, I'm just saying.

Oop, yeah.

So that's.

I mean, even if you don't go into any of the rest of it, one of the things it says is to give your.

Give to the teacher, right?

The rabbi, the whoever, what's due, you know, but at the same time, like, we were not under the whole necessarily 10% rule like they were in the Old Testament, but to live a life for Christ, I would say sacrificial period.

Not just when it comes to finances, but just across your life and whenever Christ gets a hold of you, that's.

Giving money to the church helps ministries do the things that they do.

It helps people get equipped because that's really what pastors are there for, is to help equip you and to help you navigate how to do this whole Christian walk thing.

Not that they're perfect, but that's, you know, that's their main, main task.

But man, like with finances from the church, for instance, we as.

As rise.

We are helping fund missions in.

In Honduras, right.

For instance, and Africa as well.

But.

But in Honduras specifically, like we.

We are.

I mean, there's people being fed and clothed and people being brought to Jesus by the love of the normal everyday things that they're able to get because we are faithful to giving to them.

A lot of people that see the church taking in money, there's more to it.

There's more things going on than just somebody getting a paycheck.

You know what I mean?

So I would say it's very important that we give to the church today because the church's money is God's money and your money is God's money and he's going to take it whether you want to give it or not.

So yeah, I mean, at the end of the day you can't take it with you.

Right.

So I don't know, I just, I feel like for, for, for myself, it's something that I don't think about.

I just, I give because it's, I know what it's going to, but I mean you're looking at everything from mission stuff to.

Yeah.

Paying salaries for you guys to, you know, field phone calls and be counselors to people and you know.

Alright, so my thoughts on it and I spoke about this in a sermon actually a little bit.

I didn't overemphasize it too much, but because I'm not one of those guys.

It's all that just preaches money.

But anyway, it has its place.

Is it important for Christians to give money to the church?

Let's break that down first because should it apply to us today?

Yes.

And here's why.

Let's take the first part.

Is it important for Christians to give money?

Yes.

First, let's realize that it's not part of obligation as much as it should be part of your worship.

It's really about recognizing that everything that you have comes from God.

We know that he supplies us in all things.

We know that he takes care of us.

We know that when we seek kingdom, first he makes sure we have the things we need.

Part of giving in its truest form is a recognition of God's provision and kind of just a thankfulness.

It's an act of worship.

When we give to him and what he's doing now, there's lots of ways you can give.

Here's a question of is it important to give to the church?

I would say yes.

And that's not because I work in one.

Are you sure?

Yes.

And here's why though.

If you are at a church and it's important if you're at a church that's making an impact for the kingdom, if you can see that they're doing something, that they're growing, that the message is helping people, that people are getting baptized, that people are making steps of faith, people are coming to faith for the first time, people are understanding their Bibles better.

If it's producing fruit, if you see a ministry that's producing fruit, invest in that ministry.

Help them on their way.

So I have some scripture I brought up because as you were talking, I was like, this is awesome.

Here's the thing about doing that is that we get to participate in what God's doing then in a way that's real, by giving gifts of any kind to your church or to a ministry like that, whatever you're involved in.

What Paul says in Philippians 4, and this is Philippians 4:17, he says, not that I seek the gift, but I seek the profit that is increasing to your account.

And now that's an amazing statement there.

What he means is that because the Philippians have been helping him with, whether it's finances or the needs that he has, that means that they're helping him go and do the ministry that he's doing and all the ministry he's doing, then it gets put on their account.

Just as well it's on his.

That's pretty amazing.

At the end of this life, the idea that we have participated and given some of ourselves, we've sacrificed a from ourselves.

And sometimes it's easy to give a couple dollars in the plate, but to give to where you can feel it, to where we know that we're investing in God's kingdom, like that, that money, how that gets used.

And that's why I say if you want to make sure you want to give to a church that you know is responsible with it and is going to do good things with it, and look, sometimes things don't work out the way you hope.

But the idea is that the good things that are coming from this are put on your account as well.

God can take that little bit that you give no matter what it is, and he can do God's impossible math and he can multiply it in ways that you've never thought of.

And one of the ways he does that is maybe that church does something with that, and because of that, someone else comes to Christ.

Well, that person's.

Now that's also credited to you.

And then the idea is that that person could do something and it could multiply in ways that you've never even thought of.

Think about this.

The church in Philippi that we're helping.

If you want to say sponsor or give to Paul's ministry, think of everything that Paul did because of that.

And the fact that we're still reading the letter to Philippians as part of our 66 books of scripture today is still making an impact today.

That's 2,000 years of impact that has happened because some Philippians made sure that Paul could keep going and doing the things he was going to do.

And it's all to their account.

But it didn't end at the Philippians because we still wouldn't have it today if it wasn't for other people giving to the church to re.

You know, to copy and all of that.

That's what God does.

He's able to take these things and help move them mission forward, and you get to be a part of that.

And one of the things about giving also is that it's one of the rare things, the rare things that God says you can test him in by putting your trust, of your finances, of your gifts, whether it's your time, talent, or treasure, putting that forward.

God says he can test him in that, and he will not be.

It won't be for naught.

You'll be rewarded for that.

You'll be compensated for that.

He'll make sure your needs are met.

The first person that really challenged me on this in a way that I thought was crazy was a mentor.

His name was Charles.

Charles was like, man, you know, I didn't give 10%, and then I gave 10%.

And yet somehow my bills were still getting paid.

And then I gave a little more, and bills kept paying.

I just kept wanting to see how much more I could give.

And the bills were.

Kept getting paid.

And I was like, you're nuts.

But then a couple years later, the person that really helped push me over the edge ended up being my wife, Sadie, who was like, you should go push that little bit forward.

And so we did, and somehow our bills kept getting paid.

And so it's like, wow, you really can do more now.

Like, it's.

Some people are like, well, yeah, but then I can't save as much as I want.

But would you rather save up treasures on earth or treasures in heaven?

I mean, if we get another problem with the banks or something happens, things are more electronic than ever.

Can you imagine if something happened and suddenly all your money is gone?

Yet for that, that you invest in the kingdom?

That's never gone.

That's something that's eternal.

And I know I'm getting kind of preachy because my hands are moving, but I mean, this is real stuff.

This is stuff that we can get from scripture.

And so, yeah.

Is it important to give money?

Yes, it is.

Is it important to give to the church?

Man, if you've got a church that's working, work with them and help invest in.

I've never heard of anybody testing God and money and it.

Them not being blown away by it.

Seriously, like, yeah, I've never heard of that.

So, yeah, me either.

The people who God does not put.

If you put your faith in God, it doesn't come back empty.

Right.

Well.

And some people might even say, well, you know, if you're giving, you become tighter with your money, and therefore wasn't God that did it, but God gives wisdom, too, you know, like, God allows you to be wise and discerning with the rest of your finances as well.

And that's all a gift from God, you know, so as far as that goes, it's like, you know, I would rather see what God's got for me by giving him what I got, you know?

Yeah.

You know, it's one of those things that, like, if, you know, Sadie and I pushed each other to get into a spot where we were doing it like we do, and, you know, since then, what God's done with our lives has been nothing short of amazing.

I mean, not only do our bills get paid, which is, you know, awesome, but, like, he's allowed us to do things we never thought we'd do, including being able to answer the call and come down and live in Florida, like.

Move to an exuber.

Expensive place to live.

Yeah.

Crazy.

We were in Maryland, so, I mean.

I've never lived there, but it's expensive.

But, yeah, it was crazy.

Like, when.

When.

When we were first talking to take the job down here, I was like, I don't know how this is going.

Going to work.

God's going to have to do something crazy.

And then somehow things just started falling in place, which was wild.

But like I said, just put your trust in God.

Your trust is not going to come back empty.

And if you trust your money more than you trust God, then there might be a heart problem.

So think about those things.

Yeah, there you go.

I'm there.

I'm there with you.

All right, last color is red, which is what.

What are we?

Red is Bible truths.

Bible truths.

All right.

Oh, boy.

Oh, my goodness.

This has been a.

This is a.

Well, I mean, it's not like a.

It's not like a hard thing, but it's.

It's one of those, like.

I feel like you're gonna be in your pasture mode here.

Oh, man, I already got into it a lot.

All right.

How many sacraments are there and what are they?

How many sacraments and what are they?

Yep.

Different.

Down.

I mean, let's see.

Let's see.

Let's see if you're correct.

If I'm correct, I.

Based on the card.

Because the card has an answer.

Does it?

Yeah, you can't have it.

No.

Oh, I've got the answer.

I mean, I think, too.

Well, I mean, I don't consider.

Yeah.

I mean, the people demand a final answer.

You have communion and baptism and I mean, of the things that are required for us once we've come to faith, that's pretty much the big two.

I mean, other stuff's.

I would go with two.

The two are.

Those are the focus.

Final answers too.

I'm going to.

And you're saying baptism and communion.

Yeah.

Are you sure?

Yeah, you're right.

All right.

That's what they've got.

I mean, there are some that believe there's other things you should do, but I mean, that's really what the Bible tells us to do.

And the thing is, even in the Great Commission, therefore, go and baptize people.

Yes.

Father Nature, Son, Holy Spirit.

But we're also told.

That's one thing we were told to do.

We're also told do this in remembrance of me.

And he's speaking directly to communion meal, or as I like to call it, Passover meal, 2.0, but 2.0.

Yeah, it's, you know, he's the new.

You're such a nerd.

And that's the new Passover meal.

And we're to do it in remembrance just like that one was done.

So.

Just saying.

But yeah, it's really.

Those are it, you know, now when it comes to.

I mean, we can talk into them a bit more.

But yeah, I mean, baptism, for instance, you know, I'm baptism.

You fall into one or two categories.

Well, one of three.

Some people go the.

Go the, the route of baptism doesn't matter.

And I think that if you're serious about your, your Christian faith, you don't fall into that category.

But I also know that there's two other categories, and that is baptism is what saves you versus baptism is an act of obedience.

That.

That is your statement to others that, you know that you are changed.

Yeah.

How do Baptists say it?

It's an outward.

What an outward expression of an inward experience or change or something like that.

So, yeah, okay.

So, yeah, for the people who say, okay, so I'll answer the first group and the.

So the ones that.

It doesn't matter, or the ones that.

Believe that your theology, if your theology includes, like you, you don't have to be baptized to be saved.

I would agree.

I would agree.

But here's the thing.

So for instance, I always include the thief on the cross.

The thief on the cross, he didn't come down, be baptized.

He didn't go to a Bible study.

He didn't go and learn scriptura.

Or anything crazy.

Okay, I want to rebut that here in a second, though.

Hold on.

Okay.

Yet Jesus told him he would be with him in paradise.

Now, the other thing is that he didn't have time to walk the Christian life and to go and do those things.

It was the faith in who Jesus was that's at the forefront of everything.

The faith of who Jesus was is what saved him on that cross.

Had he had time, though, had he been able to come down and start living the Christian life, I think it would have been important for him to be baptized.

Because the rest of the people in the early church, that's what you see.

You see coming to faith, you come seeing getting baptized, even whole households in which.

And so it's not, do I think baptism for that middle group, do I think baptism is what saves you?

No, but I think it's your faith who saves you.

But as you're walking Christian life, that is one thing we're told to do, given the opportunity that we should do in obedience.

It's a way of saying yes to him in that.

It's like one of the first yeses of who knows what kind of a lifelong yeses that's going to be required of us.

But it is an act of obedience.

And it's also.

It is.

I think it's an outward showing.

You know, I tell people when I'm back in the.

Back in the baptizerie room with people, I make sure that that's what I tell people.

I said, it's not your faith, it's not your baptism.

It's the faith is going to save you.

But this is what we're told to do once we have that.

And I tell them, this is three things I said, this is us a symbol of us kind of dying to our old life and rising to another Christ.

It's also a symbol of us dying into Christ's death and rising into his resurrection.

Those are two things I always go.

But ultimately I said, this is also kind of a public display of our faith.

We're now living this live in front of everyone.

We're not backing down.

This isn't a secret thing.

This is for real.

Because there are people that get nervous.

Do people really have to watch?

Yeah.

Your faith is not a secret.

Well, yeah, especially when scripture is also clear that if you deny me before man, I'll deny you before my Father.

And if you proclaim me before man.

This is a public proclamation.

And so it's awesome.

It's a beautiful thing.

I remember when I needed to go and do it myself.

I was having emotional experiences watching people baptized.

And I'm not really that person, but it was moving me in such amazing ways until God's like, alright, it's your turn.

I also was one of those people who, I was christened as a child, I was baptized as a baby, so to speak.

And people ask me that question.

Well, a lot of us get asked that question all the time.

Well, if I was baptized, baby, do I need to baptize an adult?

And here's the thing, I always answer the same way, whose decision was it?

Was it yours or someone else's?

And I doubt it was yours.

So this is your decision now, your proclamation, not somebody else's.

This is you stepping into your own faith, in your own walk with Jesus.

So yes.

So okay, since, since we are doing random questions, we are allowed to do a little bit of rabbit trailing, I'm gonna let you off the hook on the whole thief on the cross thing.

So what do you got to say about the thief?

Alright, so some would say that the thief was still under old covenant because Jesus had not died, been buried or resurrected yet.

The veil was not torn yet and so he's not under that new covenant.

Couple things, couple details there.

Number one, Jesus died before he did and the veil tore when he died.

They broke the other guy's legs for him to die.

So he died.

BAAL was torn.

The pathway to God is open at the death of Jesus.

The resurrection is the proof that he didn't need the proof.

So that's where I'm at on that.

You could call it whatever you want, but Jesus said, you're going to be there with me.

The guy believed in that through his death.

He's there.

If Jesus says it, then I'm good with it.

So okay, here's a follow up to that question because I agree wholeheartedly with everything you said, but I just have that one thrown at me a lot.

Here's the follow up.

So does that mean that Jesus could not have gone to hell to get the keys to hell because he was there with him in heaven that day or in.

First off, what's travel for him?

Number one, I'm just, I'm I'm just asking, I'm just asking if that has any implications because like that's one of those things that, okay, but one thing follows into another.

I'm just saying.

So I mean, some of that there's.

A rabbit trail, some of that could be metaphorical.

But also, you know, our time is different.

God's outside of time.

You know, once he got out of that body, he's outside of time how long that took.

And remember, like I said, he died first.

So I mean he could have gone gotten them and gone back up.

Ushered thief on the cross up there.

He's good to go.

Then like, alright, I gotta go back down.

And he's like, why?

Because I gotta come back down.

Who knows how it worked?

You know, his body did not ascend to heaven until he was in it.

And you know, the time came for that.

But you know, these are questions that we can debate, but it's ridiculous to.

Debate, but they're questions that are going through people's heads.

You know, I don't think it's any.

Thing that contradicts each other in those.

Things, but it's good to state that.

I think that it is important, especially with a mixture of.

Man, I keep hitting my computer, sorry guys.

I think with a mixture of people who are listening and the backgrounds and the different churches that they belong to or whatever denominations, I think it's important to have that discussion.

Even if it's just as simple as.

Yeah, I don't think it contradicts because you know, what is like you said, what is time to God?

What is travel to God?

You know, like.

But I think that it's important to, just to bring that to light because, you know, if you've got someone who's die hard Catholic, they might be like, well, you know, but wait a second, how does that, you know, so it's things that might run through people's.

It's running through my mind.

Right.

So yeah, I, I agree, I agree with you on it.

I have no qualms with it.

I'm just saying if it hits my brain, it's probably gonna hit somebody else's brain that's listening.

And so it's good.

So.

And these are the kind of things that I, I don't mind being asked because.

Well, I mean, you think about, I think about it very.

I don't know if I want to say, maybe logically, but like you look at it on the whole spectrum of things like this is how I see it fitting within all of Scripture.

It's like one of those things, like you can take a line out of scripture and just focus on it, but if you don't see where it fits into where its context is and in the scripture as a whole, then are you really understanding that line of scripture?

And I think it's good too to show that sometimes the simple answer is not always Right.

But sometimes it is, you know.

Yeah.

Sometimes the simple answer of, like, God's God, like, that's good enough because we don't really know, you know, like, that's how that doesn't.

You know, we have no idea how that works.

Right.

So I think it's good to voice that because some pastors, some.

Some Christians, they.

They would be afraid to even approach that topic.

You know what I mean?

Like, I don't.

I don't want.

I don't ever want to be afraid to approach a topic, you know, it's not really.

I don't.

I don't think you're afraid.

I just.

I'm saying, like, afraid of those things.

That, you know, sometimes people are like, no.

And I'm like, well, okay, well, there's gonna be times where I have to just disagree with someone.

Sure.

To settle on the fact that it's not an agreement.

But, you know, for the most part, I have a place I'm gonna land on it and.

Or at least temporarily, like, well, this is where I'm at with this.

Sure.

Because I've had different people over the years.

Even lately, people challenge me on things like, what do you think about this?

I'll either realize that I'm one way this way or kind of in the road.

So I start to investigate it a little bit and try to figure out where I'm at.

Usually where I'm at at that moment is like, well, this is how I'm viewing this.

But yeah.

When it comes to baptism, though, the way I look at it is like, you hear people in churches and it gets muddled sometimes because people sometimes think that when we say that you can be baptized today, that means that's how you're going to be saved today.

That's why I usually do my little thing in the back and make sure people are at where they need to be.

Have you ever had a situation where you took somebody back to the back and they definitely weren't.

Weren't ready for any of that?

Like, they were really off base?

No, actually, luckily.

Well, perhaps blessed that I haven't.

I mean, most people are there or when I've said those things, it either helps them just in that moment, but most people are there because of faith.

It's not because this is what's going to save me that day that I've run into.

I mean, it could happen at any.

It could happen this Sunday.

You never know.

Right?

But, yeah, I mean, but that's why I kind of make sure I say something ahead of time.

I don't want there to be.

I don't want someone to think that they were understanding the wrong things or told the wrong things or something like that.

Adults, that's a little bit easier to navigate.

Kids are harder.

Every child.

Yeah, yeah.

We, we put our.

And I've said this before on here.

We put our kid through the ringer.

She not only had to answer a bunch of, you know, non pointed questions to me, but then she had to do the same thing to her mother.

And then she had to go before Nick, who is our pastor here, like, and do the same thing with him.

Because it's like, I want this for her.

So I don't want to seem biased, but he's gonna get the arrows if, if anybody has an issue.

Because there's lots of people that have issues with, with kids.

Yeah.

So my youngest daughter, for instance, she keeps going, I want to be.

And I'm like, well, okay, where are you at with this?

What's this mean?

And sometimes she's got some really great answers, but the consistency is not there enough to where I can go.

I think you really got this.

Yeah.

That was the thing that blew me away with serenity though, was that her answers to me were the same as her answers to her mom.

To the same as they were to Nick.

And they were simple, but they were, they were right.

You know, they were like.

They were well thought out.

Yeah.

You know.

Yeah.

I mean, it doesn't need.

For a youngster.

Yeah.

It doesn't need to be complicated.

Right.

But just to know that you understand.

I mean, my youngest faith, she's got some really great understanding on some things.

Yeah.

But I'm like, I'm trying to put it together for like, if that's where you are heading, then we can help you get there.

But you need to, I want to make sure that you really have it before.

Because a lot of kids do it because it looks like fun or some churches so I can have communion or whatever or.

Because the head nods and the shake in your head to all the answers.

Do you want to be saved?

Yeah.

And they're nodding their head yes.

And I mean that's, that's something that a lot of churches do that to the kids.

And you know, I want my kids to know, like, I want it to be their genuine decision to follow Christ for genuine reasons.

I don't want it to be for a superficial reason.

And unfortunately that's to their detriment as well.

It could be, you know, like that if that means that they don't choose it.

It's heartbreaking, but it's their decision.

Yeah.

And that's the ultimate, like, where it's at.

Yeah.

So.

Yeah.

So it's just a matter of talking through it.

And look, hey, when it comes to baptism, by the way, I've learned as I've gone, when my oldest son, my first son was young, I guess we baptized him, he was very small.

I mean, small to the point where he didn't quite know a lot, but old enough to where he kind of remembers it happening, but not really why.

That being said, I've encouraged him.

It's like, wayne, you got to make this decision your own now.

Because that was mine.

And I've tried to sit there and explain to him what the difference is and why.

The difference is, my son, he's at a point where he speaks very well of Christ and faith, and he understands it all.

What's strange is that he's like, yeah, I don't know about the whole going back in thing.

That's gonna be him.

You know, I can't make him.

I'm not going to make him.

You know, it's like, well, and then.

That'S one of the things.

Another pastor here, Derek Tennant, he.

He tells people, you know, do you.

Are you.

Are you feeling convicted like.

Like that you.

You know, that it wasn't right the first time or whatever, like, in a situation like that, because if you're feeling like God's calling you to do it because you didn't do it right the first or, you know, you were somebody else chose it for you or whatever that might be, like, then do it.

But if you're not like, you know, like, it's one of those things that's.

Like, yeah, I don't want anyone to do it for the wrong reasons.

Right.

And then you have, you know, communion.

Communion, like I said.

I mean, this is something we do, and it's got such a meaning for it, and, you know, people will try to come up with interesting things to put in front of it, and I don't fully.

I'm not.

So go ahead and put it out there.

I know what you're talking about, but I don't.

Okay.

So I look at communion.

This is a basic way of putting it.

I look at communion as a faith act by you taking the bread and the juice or wine, and your understanding that this represents the body and the blood, and your understanding that this body broken for you means that he was put on that cross for you.

He was beaten for you.

He took your punishment and his blood was spilled for you.

If you can think about those things and you understanding that you're doing that in remembrance of that, that's a faith act.

And I don't put anything in front of a faith act.

I don't put any things in front, like, there's nothing.

You have to do this before you can do this.

If your faith is there, if the faith is there, then do it.

That's where I'm at.

Well, I mean, so the one thing that I hear, at least in most biblical churches that might conflict with that is the whole, like, this is for believers.

Okay, yes, but in that, I just.

I'm saying, like, so that that's what.

What other things besides that are you talking about?

Just to be clear, I.

If any church is like, you have to be.

Okay, there's.

There's this crazy stuff to me.

You have to be a member of this church first.

No, that's.

I've heard that too.

Yeah, you're right.

Especially, like, there's been some big name to denominations that I'll leave out that have done that.

And I'm like, that's ridiculous.

I'm gonna leave it out.

Don't leave it out.

I'm gonna leave it out.

No, don't leave it out.

I'm gonna leave it out.

Don't leave it out.

Dude, it's.

It's our responsibility to call these people out.

And we're not saying specific churches.

I just mean like the Catholic Church, for instance.

Like, if you're not Catholic, you're not doing the things that you need to do.

You're not supposed to take communion.

I'm like, what are you doing?

The other thing is.

And if you are Catholic and you do believe that, we'd like to know why.

I mean, genuine.

I'd like to know why.

I mean.

Well, okay, but.

No, no, no.

Okay, don't dismiss that.

Then there's.

There's the.

Well, have you been baptized?

I'm like, well, first off, you're confusing two things again.

Because some churches, well, if you haven't been baptized, then you can't.

What if they believe?

That's the whole point.

So.

Yeah, yeah.

So things like that, that are just ridiculous.

I don't put.

Put roadblocks in front of someone's faith.

I try to be as roadblock free.

I agree with you.

We do.

The one thing with the whole baptism thing, because it's part of this conversation still, is that it's one of those weird.

It's the one weird thing that is both a Primary and secondary doctrine, because some people do believe that it is, that that is the point of salvation is when you're dunked, right?

There's a lot of people that believe that.

And some people believe, like what we've stated here, you know, that we believe.

And it's like that is a weird, a weird category doctrine.

There's not any other doctrines that I know of that are accepted among, you know, biblical Christian churches and denominations.

That could be either, either or.

Because if you do believe that is the point of salvation, it is a primary doctrine, you know, but if you, if you believe that it's that act of obedience, you know, then it's a secondary thing.

It's not less important, but it's not like salvation y at that point.

Let's talk about one more thing.

When it comes to communion, for instance, let's talk about on a personal basis, on an individual basis, you, by taking part of that, are doing that in remembrance of what Jesus did for you on the cross that he took on that for.

That's great.

But when you do it in communion, when you do it with the church, you're doing it and saying that we all agree on that.

There's people that try to take some things out of context and make some things like, well, if there's certain things between people, if they don't agree completely with somebody, da da da, da, da da, then you can't do communion with.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

First off, communion, you're coming together for that.

You're supporting that.

You guys are coming and eating the bread together.

You're taking of the juice or the wine together in remembrance of what Christ did for you.

And you're believing, you're all saying as one that this is what we believe in.

That's communion.

Right?

I think, I think something though, that's important.

But we're also making sure, like Paul is really quick to say, well, make sure you're, you're doing it properly.

When it comes to everybody's getting the same kind of bread, everybody's getting the same wine.

You're not putting it higher status for some people versus other people, those things.

Absolutely.

I think it's a both and man, I really do.

Because I think that, I think that it's important when it comes to the whole, like, leave it, come back after you reconcile.

I think that's because it's an important thing because you are declaring this while you're not living it at that point.

You know what I mean?

So I think that's why the encouragement is to leave that and reconcile.

I think when it comes to what the communion is, I don't think so.

It's one thing to have an issue with someone and be trying to work that out.

Another thing to what do we agree on the most essential thing, that Jesus died on a cross.

Yeah.

Okay, then you're good.

See, that's the things that we need to.

We always make little fights about things and we create problems with things that don't need to be fights about things.

You see what I'm saying?

And so, like, I get it.

Sometimes there's tiffs.

Sometimes you've got an issue with someone, sometimes the situation hasn't been fully resolved yet.

I get it.

But when it comes to communion, when it comes to declaring that Jesus is Lord and we're in that remembrance of him, then that's what we're doing.

See?

Yeah.

And this is one that we don't fully agree on.

I'm just saying.

Because.

I'm just telling you, like, because that's.

One thing that you take it really extreme with it.

I'm not willing to go crazy extreme with it the other way.

But I think that there is the both.

And in this, that it is important to both.

Keep in mind that this isn't for the splitting to click it off, that he is addressing a specific issue within the church there.

But there is a broader thing too, the importance that is placed on it.

I think the ultimate importance is the fact that, like I said, it's a faith act towards Jesus.

That's the biggest thing.

I look at the most essential things of the faith often and go, well, this is where the core is at.

There's plenty of things we can debate about, all kinds of things.

And people do every day argue about things all throughout Scripture and church practice.

And some of which.

And I think to some degree it's important to argue about some of that stuff.

But I think there's.

I'll put this.

I think the majority of things people.

Argue about are ridiculous, but it also depends on, like.

So, like, if you and I are arguing about something with Scripture, it's.

It's not gonna hurt our friendship.

You know what I mean?

So when it gets to the point.

When it gets to the point where it's.

It's hurting relationships or it's looking bad on the church or, you know, it.

You're not representing Christ well, that's where it becomes a problem.

And that is where.

That's where you're talking about.

Because it's okay to disagree and have Those conversations and arguments.

If there's someone that's doing some crazy stuff, you might be like, look, man, you need to get yourself together.

But right.

Even then, wouldn't you view the idea of taking communion as a step of faith forward?

I think that is it just because you're in the same room?

I mean, like, that's one of those things.

Like, we'd have to start picking apart scenarios.

Sure.

That could get tedious and ridiculous, but, yeah, could be fun.

Who knows?

Who knows?

But that's.

We don't have time for all that today.

We don't.

But no, I mean, realistically, like I said, it's.

The idea is that it's what we're doing, why we do it.

And like I said before at the beginning, this is our second Passover.

This is kind of.

I'd say I'm going to go as far as to say it's the Christian's version, the replacement of the Passover for the Christian to a degree.

Some people don't like that.

But here's what I mean.

At the Passover, when the Israelites were in Egypt and the final plague was coming, they were told to take a lamb, sacrificial lamb, and to spread its blood.

And by its blood they would be saved.

But they were supposed to take and eat the lamb that night.

They were supposed to feast and eat the lamb.

Then after the Passover event, they were to continue to have that feast at a regular time to commemorate that and remember that.

Great.

Why I call it Passover2, if it's not obvious at this point, our Passover lamb, Jesus at Passover, no doubt.

Okay, just putting those two together.

Hadn't figured that out.

And I'm not trying to be mean.

He was also Jewish, so he's doing these things as well.

He laid his life down.

By his blood, we are saved.

And he told us that by eating of this representation of his flesh and drinking of his blood, then we are to be saved.

And he said that those who do would be and those who don't.

Those who don't.

There are people who say that if you don't take communion, then you can't be saved.

I think, once again, look at the thief on the cross.

But I think as you're walking the Christian walk, this is something we do to remind ourselves.

And I think it's important in that.

Yeah, I agree.

I agree wholeheartedly with you on that.

So the two things that I want to bring up for this one, the first question is what?

What do you want?

What do you want prayer for?

What would you like prayer for?

We would love to hear your responses on that.

The other one is I want to leave you with questions that don't necessarily need to be answered through comments, but just leaving it with you is first one on baptism, are you baptized?

If you are, sweet if you're not, or you have been, but you're not sure or whatever.

What's your next step?

Talk to somebody.

You can reach out to us, we'll talk with you about it.

We have a listener out there that one of our very first conversations that actually led them to this church was over that exact topic of baptism and whether or not, well, they were baptized as a kid or whatever or somehow and then should they be baptized now that it's their choice and that sort of thing, that whole conversation led to them coming to church.

That is one of those things that it's something you should think about.

What's your next step if you are baptized?

Not just great, but who are you discipling into the faith?

That's the question for you guys.

The second thing is for the Lord's Supper, we can stand on the fact that it's an important thing for us to do and it's a uniting thing for us to do, but we can also stand on the fact together.

I think that if you've got something that is a problem between you and your brother or sister in Christ, like deal with it.

I'm not saying stop communion and deal with it, but just it is so much better to just go ahead and deal with it.

And so what is your next step in that?

And where do you go there?

Do you need help approaching that topic with someone?

Do you need somebody, a third party to be there because of whatever reason?

Like be, be thinking and mindful of that as well.

So those are the things I want to leave you with today.

Don't forget, you guys, like showed up big when it came to the rabbit hole episode that we released that was kind of like a, you know, it wasn't supposed to be released to you all just as a poll, but we screwed up and didn't have some episodes ready.

So I was like, ah, this is a little treat we'll throw out to you.

You guys showed up huge, actually, just not on YouTube.

On the other stuff, in the first week we had 97 listens to that one, which is crazy.

So that's not including YouTube is what I'm saying.

So.

So wild turnout.

How can we break that record?

Let's just blow it out of the water.

So that's.

There you go, share, share, share.

But if you want more of that, which we're getting ready to record one here really soon that we're gonna put out, if you want more of that, you got to subscribe to the Patreon the at the minimum, $5 a month.

So.

So that's the minimum subscription level.

And so you'll also get the men's and women's video podcasts, which I know we didn't have a women's podcast this month.

There's been a lot of sickness going around so we missed that altogether.

But we are going to try to release two next month, so be watching for that.

Yeah, and we're gonna have, we're preparing some behind the scenes stuff as well when it comes to some talks that want to air.

Really?

Yeah.

Sweet.

I'm excited to hear these because I haven't, I mean I was a part of them, but I mean some of it's ridiculous.

Some of it's ridiculous.

Just little things that we can get out there so you guys can see a little bit.

Because here's what I'm talking about is that oftentimes before a show gets recorded, right before we get started, we kind of do a little warm up conversation with each other.

And it's usually ridiculous stuff that we talk about, but the stuff that's.

Some of it's serious though.

We could have some serious conversations.

Some of it's worth editing into its own little clip and putting up there.

So we're hoping that you'll enjoy those bits as well.

Yeah.

Also, if any of you have the talent of doing short clips, like videos into short clips or whatever, we don't have all that time to figure that out or the funds yet.

Although with Patreon maybe we'll have the funds to just go ahead and you know, get a subscription to something.

But if you have that talent and desire to help out, we'd love to hear from you.

Just reach out to us.

We'd love to give you a way to serve in that, in that way.

Shout out to my sister for the Wednesday, would you Rathers and, and the other posts that she's been throwing up there has been really good.

Thank you guys for your interactions and man, like subscribe, comment, ask questions, give us topics, whatever it is that, that you guys are wanting to hear, we want to bring it to you.

So thank you.

We love you guys.

God bless.

Hey, thanks for joining us.

Make sure to subscribe and give us a like on itunes and Spotify so that you will never miss a show.

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You don't want them to miss out on the truth, because we are all about the truth here.

Thanks for joining us this week and God bless.