00:00:06 Archita: There's a quiet moment many men experience, but rarely talk about that pause between reacting the way they were taught and responding the way they wish they could. Somewhere in that space lives empathy. Not the soft kind we stereotype, but the steady kind that changes how we lead, love and show up. Tonight we are staying with that space.

00:00:30 Archita: Welcome to Inner Night, a space where we slow down and explore what it means to live and lead from a more honest, connected place. I'm Marcia and today I am joined by Trevor Stevenson. Trevor is a dad, partner, coach and guide who has spent over two decades helping men and leaders develop emotional intelligence without losing their grounding or their humanity. Today, we are talking about breaking cycles, what it means to grow up male, how those early lessons shape us, and how empathy becomes a choice that can change not just individual lives, but generations. So welcome to Inner Light. It's it's great to have you here today.

00:01:16 Trevor Stevenson: Uh thank you Arteta. It feels wonderful to be here, and I'm grateful for the work that you're doing and the light you're spreading.

00:01:27 Archita: Mm. Yeah. I mean, it's it's honestly such an honor to have you in our show today, because what we're going to be talking about is so important. And it's really important for young men, especially to listen to this and to understand empathy better. So yeah, I think a lot of, uh, people will also relate to you. So without wasting any time, let's dive into this conversation. And Trevor, before we talk about leadership or empathy, I'm curious, when you look back on your early years growing up male, what messages about emotions or strengths stand out the most now?

00:02:11 Trevor Stevenson: Yeah. Thank you. Uh, it was a bit of a unique situation for me in that I grew up on a big farm and the youngest of six kids. Six kids in eight years. And um, also my parents both worked full time. And so this, this big farm was a bit of a side hustle. So there was there was lots of work and, um, it was a bit of a command and control environment. And for a young child who just wanted to play and fool around and have fun and express himself, um, that that didn't fit the mold so well. Um, neither with older siblings or with my father specifically. And so I learned quite early to that, that expressing in those ways that were natural for me would draw, um, physical and emotional abuse And so to toughen up to all of the things that needed doing on the farm was almost a survival tactic. Um, both, you know, physically and emotionally and with those emotions comes a, a dampening of that empathy and that, that authenticity. And so those lessons were along the lines of, if I show up in the way that feels good and fun, I won't be accepted. And so we, uh, I learned to, to toughen up, to speak when spoken to, to work until the work was done and, um, to kind of toe the line.

00:04:16 Archita: Amazing. I mean, I can I can only imagine how difficult that must have been for you to navigate through your emotions at at that age, with all, with your siblings, with your family dynamics. It must not have been easy at all. But I'm also very curious to know how you know you. You began your journey and I think, uh, yeah, this really sets the tone for this conversation and that that also, um, makes me wonder to avoid that, you know, there's this persistent idea that empathy somehow weakens men, that it makes them less decisive or less respected. I'm curious how you have seen that play out, both in yourself and in the men you work with?

00:05:04 Trevor Stevenson: Um, yeah, very often that exists. I, you know, part of that Perfect storm of upbringing was growing up in a small town where, you know, ridicule was the part of the communication style, and if you weren't the one ridiculing, you would be ridiculed. And so empathy, uh, in that circumstance or. Yeah, empathy with respect to understanding other people's emotions and stuff was set aside, uh, again, for, uh, a sense of acceptance or belonging with the tribe. You know, your peers at that time and later years and in leadership, I just saw it continue to be prevalent both in men and women, you know, women trying to fit into this men's world and toughen up and kind of show no remorse and drive forward for results, because those are the things that get rewarded in our capitalistic society. And so but what I would also see is that those leaders who are able to express empathy for others predominantly, are doing that for themselves. First self-emptying passion. And when they are leading in that way, they are getting the best results. They are having the least turnover and the best engagement, and creating psychologically safe spaces where people are willing to show up as them, as their whole selves. And those are the leaders who stand out in organizations. And that's sort of the good to great leap.

00:07:02 Archita: Absolutely. I mean, I definitely agree. And this, this misconception persists in our society. It has persisted for quite a long time. Actually, I think that's where the idea of toxic masculinity, you know, stems from. And what I'm hearing from you is that empathy doesn't remove strength. It refines it. It changes how power is expressed, not whether it exists. So I believe that a lot of men are being aware about it. Um, now, uh, so I think that's a good thing.

00:07:40 Trevor Stevenson: I, I fully agree. You know, there is a shift happening. I mean, um, but we also see globally what's going on. And so there's a bit of a recession of that empathy and kindness and respect. And so all of us light workers need to continue to do the work.

00:08:03 Archita: Exactly. And we need more men like you to come out and make other men aware about it. And let's let's stay with the roots for a moment. Growing up male often comes with unspoken rules about silence, toughness, responsibility. So how do those early patterns quietly shape adult leadership and relationships?

00:08:31 Speaker 3: Well, they they have.

00:08:33 Trevor Stevenson: Us not, uh, seek help. They have us feel that we are responsible. You know, part of patriarchy is the man saying that I will do it. I will get it done. I will make it work. I will create a solution which has obviously created a lot of harm to civilization in general, but also to themselves. When a man can't admit that he is hurting when he is sad or scared or feeling lonely or embarrassed. The acceptable emotions have been anger. We see the violence in the world and joy, you know. So we limit ourselves from the plethora of the hundreds of emotions that that one could communicate and express. It's distilled down to a couple that are acceptable for men to show, and you know that we don't have then the the strategies to deal with all of the emotions. And so we erode until we explode and we push that down. And that exploding can come in quite a variety of ways. Maladaptive patterns that strategies for for dealing with what's going on inside versus the communication skills and the the psychological fortitude to be able to understand what's going on within me and then deal with those in healthy ways with other people. And so the cycle just continues, because then, you know, we all try to do a little bit better than the generation before, but there's cycles of this not knowing what to do with it. There's still no education, formal education that is given either to the parents or in our school system to help people understand their emotions and be able to regulate those when they need them most.

00:10:46 Archita: Definitely. I definitely agree because it feels like, you know, many men are in choosing disconnection. They're repeating something they were never taught to question. So there needs to be a lot of unlearning to be done for, um, men to really understand this better. And I think it comes from a lot of conditioning also. Like you just said, because if they were never taught how to navigate those emotions, then it's going to be, you know, it's going to explode one day. So yes, that is that is very important. So, uh, yeah. So Trevor, uh, when empathy is underdeveloped or shut down, how does that actually show up day to day in in teams, partnerships or families?

00:11:37 Trevor Stevenson: When that empathy is shut down. Uh, it, it how it shows up is harm for others. First we see it a lot. There's there's distances created. There's reactivity in relationships. I think of my own parenting in the early days, in my marriage, in my business, when I would get stressed. Whether that was frustrated by workload or money fears, I would turn into that farmer mode and I would just like what I grew up with, and I would just be saying, go, go, go, everyone. And I was full sort of dictator, um, management mode. And that creates the harm externally that pushes people away, that creates, uh, distance and an unsafe environment where people don't feel comfortable sharing what's real for them and any challenges that they're having or even questioning authority, what's not being seen. So the underlying is that the harm that I'm doing to myself and the fear and then so I may have maladaptive practices that and for anyone it could be turning towards overwork, over drinking, over drugging, over shopping. All of these, um, these things to try to cope and self-soothe because I don't know how to actually take care of myself. That empathy has been lost for myself and in my lack of awareness about that, I'm just acting out these patterns. How that shows up in organizations is high turnover, poor engagement, poor results, and lack of clear and strategic decision making for leaders because they're acting from this, this amygdala hijack, you know, the brain is in a threat state. And so they're acting from either fear or frustrated place.

00:13:53 Archita: Mm. I mean it's it's actually very fascinating to hear all of this from a male perspective. But you have explained this perfectly to I mean, um, these things can have such, uh, such big impacts in your everyday life, in your relationships, your professional life in, in, uh, you know, teams everywhere basically. And I have seen, uh, this lack of empathy destroy so many families before. So, yeah, I mean, that idea of non-harming leadership really stands out here not as perfection, but as awareness. So thank you for for sharing that revolve. And, uh, for men listening who sense that there is another way to lead and live but don't know where to start. What's a grounded first step towards empathy that doesn't feel overwhelming or performative?

00:14:54 Trevor Stevenson: I love that we have to start small and where we're at, which is a very, uh, minimal exposure to emotional intelligence. Uh, and I was on my men's group call last night. Fundamental. And there was, you know, it's a repeat process because we have decades of reacting in situation a certain way. And so what we practiced is just thinking of a situation that happened that triggered a response within me where I felt something that I don't know how to name often. You know, we can go to the anger one because that's what we're most aware of. And if we can just sit, it's often after the fact, because in that moment we're so heated, we're in such a pattern of reactivity that that we don't know how to control it in that moment. So now, if you're men in a good place. You're out on a walk or something. Think of that conversation that didn't go well with your wife or your child, or your second in command at work, or just in your own head when you saw the the quarter end results. Just sit with it and notice in your body. Notice what you feel. This is tricky because we're not used to, especially man. We're so cerebral. We're trying to think our way out of the problems, and we're trying to create solutions immediately without feeling what's actually going on for us. And that's what we actually need in that moment. And so if we can sit and feel in our body that tightness in our chest, our raised shoulders, our clenched jaw, whatever it might be, that that weakness in the pit of my stomach, and we can just sit and observe that and just observe and not attach ourselves and recognize the thoughts. So what thoughts was I having just before that feeling came on? And all we have to do is close our eyes for a second and think about the situation. The the words that my wife said, the thing that my kid did or didn't do me looking through that quarterly report, what thoughts did I have about it? Because it's not the thing itself. It's our reaction to it. Right when my wife said, I want you to show up more in our relationship, what did I think that means? My thought was like, oh my gosh, I'm failing. My kid leaves their shoes at the front door, right in the mat where everyone walks in. Is it the shoes or is it my. My kids don't respect me. They don't do enough around here. These are the thoughts that are mostly imperceptible because it's just the water we swim in. And so if we can become aware of the thoughts and how those thoughts lead to our emotions, then we can start to. That is empathy. That is our awareness of how our thinking is creating our emotions. If we can just get there, if I can get your listeners to just understand that they have a whole bunch of different emotions, then we can talk about strategies and what I need in the moment. Oftentimes we we need a state change, something that will just create calm for me. And so then we can go to okay, well if I need calm, what are all the things that I can do right now for calm. Well I can I can stare out the window. I can go out for a walk. I can do some push ups or burpees. I can phone a friend. I can watch funny cat videos. I can read the beautiful messages that my kid wrote me at five years old. You know, there's a whole buffet of things that we can do to create a state change. But first is to get over the amygdala hijack. And that's what the calming and the breathing and the noticing the energy in the body will do for us. So to all of your listeners, it's just to to think about a situation that is probably and quite likely a patterned response to something and start to untangle what's really behind it.

00:19:21 Archita: Wow. I think what you just said, um, it really resonated with me, and I'm sure it resonated with a lot of our listeners right now, whether male or female, because, you know, how you, um, how you just said that so many men are, you know, taught to problem solve everything. Like, they they see something happening and they are instantly like, oh, I have to solve this, and which is pretty useful in a lot of situations. But that's also not always necessary. And it's important that men understand this because yes, like you just said, it's really, really important for them to first understand their feelings like and ask themselves, what am I feeling right now? And how is this making me feel? So I think, uh, the I think the first step is just to begin somewhere with their emotions, and then they can start gradually, uh, you know, developing a healthier relationship with their emotions. And, yes, it's it's very powerful to hear that growth doesn't have to be punishing to be real. So I think just start from somewhere. Yeah.

00:20:32 Trevor Stevenson: Absolutely. And I just want to put a footnote on that as well. Um, is that it's it's not anything outside of us that's making us feel a certain way because we're all so quick to blame. You know, the traffic or my ex-wife or, um, the the government or something for the way that we feel. And that is giving up our power and our agency to feel well, because if if we are allowing our emotional state and our wellness to rely on something and be governed by something outside of ourselves, then we're absolutely giving up our power and our inner light. And so to just know that it is it is within me and my responsibility and opportunity to recognize and then govern how it is that I'm feeling and that that is the work. I don't mean to diminish the the level of effort required, but it's just that is the path.

00:21:35 Archita: Exactly, exactly. I mean, your emotions is always your own responsibility. Nobody can make you feel something. You. I mean, it's all inside you, just like you said. So it's. It's really how you control your emotions. Uh, you know, the kind of relationship you develop, uh, over time with your emotions. That's what really matters. And. Thank you so much, Trevor, for, you know, making us all, um, you know, realize the importance of all of this. And to hear all of this from a male perspective, it is really needed. It is really important and also quite refreshing because all the time we see women complaining about men not being, you know, more, um, emotionally available. But then, um, you know, it's it's it's nice to have someone like you who understands all these things. We've been through all of these things and helping other men, uh, you know, uh, become better versions of themselves through empathy. So it was really great. And I have learned a lot from you today. I've learned about empathy, about relationships, emotions and yeah, I mean thank you again. So for listeners who feel drawn to this work and want to explore it further, where can they find you or learn more about what you offer?

00:22:57 Trevor Stevenson: They can. Anyone is welcome to reach out to me. I love having these conversations. I love connecting with men who are trying to work on this and know that that they can be their own catalyst for it, and bringing guys together to have more open and more real conversations. The website is easy, just Trevor Stevenson. Com. My LinkedIn is a great place. That's Trevor B as in Bryce Stevenson and Instagram is fun. Road to freedom all one word.

00:23:36 Archita: Amazing. So I'll have all the details on my show listing so that our listeners can feel free to reach out to you whenever they want. So for the men listening who feel caught between who they were taught to be and who they are becoming, here's a question for you. What might change if you allowed curiosity instead of judgment to guide that transition? Empathy isn't a departure from masculinity, it's an evolution of it. So thank you for bringing your honesty and humanity into this space today, Trevor. And to our listeners, may you carry this conversation gently with you, not as something to fix, but something to notice. This has been inner light. Until next time, keep listening for the quieter truths. They often hold the deepest light.