Welcome back to SCOTUS oral arguments and opinions.
Speaker AToday we round out the first round of criminal law cases that the Supreme Court plans to hear in October.
Speaker AWe already previewed Villarreal, Barrett, Ellingberg, and Bowe.
Speaker AThis case, case versus Montana, involves a Fourth Amendment search and seizure question that's generated massive interest among law enforcement, civil rights advocates, and emergency responders across the country.
Speaker AThe court plans to hear this case on October 15th.
Speaker BYou're right.
Speaker BThis case has drawn immense attention.
Speaker BWe're talking about 35 states weighing in, with 34 of them filing briefs against the petitioner's position.
Speaker BThat's extraordinary for context listeners when you see that level of state involvement.
Speaker BYou know, this case touches some fundamental aspects of how law enforcement operates day to day.
Speaker BThis isn't just abstract constitutional theory.
Speaker BThis could change how police respond to suicide calls, medical emergencies, and welfare checks nationwide.
Speaker AAbsolutely.
Speaker ASo let's break down what this case is about at its core.
Speaker AWilliam Trevor case challenged Montana's application of the emergency aid exception to the Fourth Amendment's warrant requirement.
Speaker AHe asked the court to curtail this exception and to make it much harder for for police to enter homes in emergencies.
Speaker BRight.
Speaker BAnd that's what makes this case so fascinating.
Speaker BConstitutionally, the emergency aid exception is well established doctrine.
Speaker BThe Supreme Court recognized it in Brigham City vs Stewart back in 2006.
Speaker BThe question here is what standard of certainty must officers have before they can invoke it?
Speaker BBefore we dive into the constitutional battle, let me read our listeners the key text that's at the heart of this dispute.
Speaker BThis is from the Fourth Amendment.
Speaker BThe right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers and effects against unreasonable searches and seizures shall not be violated.
Speaker BAnd no warrants shall issue but upon probable cause supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched and the persons or things to be seized.
Speaker AYou know, that text is really the crux of this whole case notice it has two distinct parts.
Speaker AThe reasonableness clause that prohibits unreasonable searches and the warrant clause that sets standards for when warrants shall issue.
Speaker AThe question in this case is whether those two clauses work together or independently.
Speaker BExactly.
Speaker BAnd while the warrant clause mentions probable cause, the reasonableness clause just says searches must be reasonable.
Speaker BCase argues that probable cause should be required for all home entries, even emergency aid.
Speaker BMontana argues that reasonableness is the touchstone, and sometimes that means less than probable cause.
Speaker ANow here's something really important for our listeners to understand.
Speaker AThe Fourth Amendment's text doesn't actually mention an emergency aid exception anywhere.
Speaker AThis is entirely A judge made doctrine that the Court has developed over decades of cases.
Speaker BThat's a crucial point.
Speaker BAnd as we discussed in our earlier coverage of Maryland versus Shatzer this year, we're seeing this Court sometimes take a harder look at judge made constitutional doctrines, particularly when they expand government power beyond what the text clearly authorizes.
Speaker BWe'll link to this episode in the show notes.
Speaker ARight.
Speaker ASo Case could argue that if the Framers wanted an emergency exception, they would have written one into the text.
Speaker AThe fact that they didn't might suggest that even emergencies should require either a warrant or at minimum, probable cause.
Speaker AThat's very much in line with this Court's textualist approach.
Speaker BOn the flip side, Montana would say that the emergency aid exception flows naturally from the reasonableness Clause itself.
Speaker BIf the touchstone is reasonableness, then sometimes reasonable action in an emergency requires immediate response without the delay of getting a warrant or developing probable cause.
Speaker ABut that raises a fascinating question about judicial role.
Speaker AIs the Court's job to craft practical exceptions that make sense in the real world or to stick closely to what the constitutional text actually says, even if that creates difficult situations?
Speaker AAnd given this Court's recent skepticism of some expansive judge made doctrines, Case might be betting that that the Justices will be receptive to his argument that the emergency aid exception has grown too broad and needs to be reined in to what the text actually supports.
Speaker BGreat point.
Speaker BI think that skepticism will bear out in oral arguments.
Speaker BAlright, let's start with the background facts because they're crucial to understanding why this case even exists.
Speaker BIn September 2021, William Trevor case called his ex girlfriend, J H while alone at his home in Anaconda, Montana.
Speaker BAnd this wasn't just a casual conversation.
Speaker BKayce was erratic and JH Assumed he'd been drinking.
Speaker BMore importantly, Kayce told JH that he was going to kill himself.
Speaker BHe became increasingly methodical about it, saying he was going to get a note.
Speaker BThen JH Heard something that made this an emergency situation.
Speaker BShe heard a clicking sound, which she identified as the noise made when cocking a gun.
Speaker BWhen she told Kayce she'd have to call the cops, he became more agitated and threatened that if police came, he would shoot them all too.
Speaker BAnd here's the moment that triggered everything.
Speaker BJH Heard a pop followed by nothing else, just dead air.
Speaker BShe believed that Kayce had pulled the trigger and immediately called 911.
Speaker ANow, the responding officers weren't going in blind.
Speaker AThey knew Kayce from previous incidents involving suicide threats, alcohol abuse and violent behavior.
Speaker AWhen they arrived at his home, they didn't immediately enter.
Speaker AInstead, they tried to make contact and looked for corroborating evidence.
Speaker BRight.
Speaker BAnd this is important for the legal analysis.
Speaker BThrough a window, officers saw what Montana describes as distinct objective facts that corroborated their belief that Case was at home drunk with a gun and had written a suicide note.
Speaker BThey saw Case's keys on the table, an empty paddle holster, empty beer cans, and a notepad with what appeared to be a suicide note.
Speaker BThe officers prepared for about 18 minutes getting ballistic shields and staging medical personnel before entering through an unlocked front door.
Speaker BDuring a protective sweep, Case emerged from a closet, pointing a handgun at Sergeant Pasha, who shot Case in the abdomen.
Speaker BThe officers then rendered medical aid.
Speaker AAnd that's where the legal case begins.
Speaker ACase was charged with assaulting a peace officer, and he moved to suppress all evidence, arguing the warrantless entry violated the Fourth Amendment.
Speaker AThe trial court denied the suppression motion, finding officers made the entry pursuant to an exigent circumstance.
Speaker ACase, was convicted and sentenced to 60 years.
Speaker AThe Montana Supreme Court affirmed in a 4:3 decision, but with a vigorous dissent that highlights the split we're going to discuss.
Speaker AAnd that split is exactly why the Supreme Court granted certiorari.
Speaker AThe court is being asked whether law enforcement may enter a home without a search warrant based on less than probable cause that an emergency is occurring or whether the emergency aid exception requires probable cause.
Speaker ASo we've got this massive circuit split that's been brewing for years.
Speaker ASome courts say officers need only an objectively reasonable basis and to believe someone needs emergency aid.
Speaker AThat's the standard from Brigham City v. Stuart.
Speaker AOther courts say that's not enough.
Speaker AYou need full probable cause to believe an emergency exists.
Speaker BLet me break down this split for our listeners because it's crucial.
Speaker BCourts requiring only reasonable belief include the 1st, 8th and 10th circuits, along with Montana and three other state supreme courts.
Speaker BThey apply what Montana describes as objective, specific and articulable facts from which an experienced officer would suspect that a citizen is in need of help.
Speaker BOn the other side, courts requiring probable cause include the DC 2nd and 11th circuits, along with Nebraska and Colorado high courts.
Speaker BThese courts hold that officers must have probable cause to believe that a person is seriously injured or threatened with such injury before entering a home without a warrant.
Speaker BAnd this isn't just academic.
Speaker BThe practical difference is enormous.
Speaker BUnder the reasonable belief standard, officers responding to a suicide call like this one might be able to enter based on the 911 call plus some corroborating observations.
Speaker BUnder a probable cause standard, they might need much more concrete evidence that someone is actually injured.
Speaker ALet's dive into Case's three main arguments because they're trying to fundamentally reshape how we think about the Fourth Amendment's relationship to emergency response.
Speaker BCase's first argument is historical and textual.
Speaker BHe contends that the Fourth Amendment, properly understood through its historical context, requires probable cause for all warrantless home entries, even emergency aid situations.
Speaker BSpecifically, Case argues that the common law that was in place when the Fourth Amendment was adopted required more than probable cause, not less, for warrantless home entries.
Speaker BHe claims the common law only allowed warrantless entries to stop violent affrays and even then, only if officers were certain that an affray was occurring because they could perceive it with their own senses.
Speaker ASo Case is saying the Framers would have expected an even higher standard than probable cause, essentially requiring officers to personally witness the emergency with their own eyes.
Speaker AThat would be a dramatic restriction compared to current practice.
Speaker ACase's second major argument focuses on the the Fourth Amendment's core purpose.
Speaker AHe argues that the Fourth Amendment's chief purpose was to restrain discretionary government searches of the home and that allowing entries based on less than probable cause would undermine this fundamental protection.
Speaker BThe logic here is that homes deserve the highest level of Fourth Amendment protection, and any exception should be narrowly construed.
Speaker BCase is essentially arguing that emergency aid entries have become too easy for police, creating opportunities for pretextual searches.
Speaker AAnd Case's third argument is about the nature of probable cause itself.
Speaker AHe contends that while Montana tries to limit probable cause to criminal context, probable cause as the Framers understood it, was a more general safeguard against all unreasonable searches and seizures, whether or not conducted with a warrant.
Speaker BIn other words, cases trying to expand probable cause beyond its typical criminal context and make it a universal Fourth Amendment requirement.
Speaker BThat would be a significant departure from current doctrine.
Speaker ANow let's look at Montana's response, because they're defending not just their own decision, but really the entire framework that's governed emergency response for for decades.
Speaker AMontana's first major argument is constitutional structure and history.
Speaker AThey argue that the Fourth Amendment's text, properly understood, makes reasonableness, not probable cause, the ultimate test.
Speaker AMontana emphasizes that the Fourth Amendment has two distinct clauses.
Speaker AAs they put it, the Amendment actually contains two different commands.
Speaker AThe Reasonableness Clause prohibits unreasonable searches, while the Warrant Clause sets standards for when warrants should issue.
Speaker AMontana argues these clauses can operate independently.
Speaker BThey trace this back to founding era practices where officers conducting searches without valid warrants did so at his own risk, since they would be liable for trespass unless the jury found that his action was reasonable.
Speaker BSo Reasonableness, not probable cause, was the ultimate test.
Speaker BMontana also provides extensive analysis of English common law, arguing it's much more permissive than Case suggests.
Speaker BThey contend that warrantless entries were allowed for pursuing felons based on knowledge or reasonable suspicion for hue and cry situations requiring only mere suspicion and under the doctrine of necessity for saving life.
Speaker AThat historical argument is crucial because it directly contradicts Key Case's claim that the common law was more restrictive than current practice.
Speaker AMontana is saying Case has the history backwards.
Speaker BMontana's second major argument is that Case's probable cause standard would effectively eliminate the emergency aid exception, creating deadly consequences.
Speaker BThis is where Montana gets really practical.
Speaker BThey argue that criminality inheres in the concept of probable cause because it's rooted in the criminal investigatory context.
Speaker BSince emergency aid situations typically don't involve crimes, officers literally cannot develop probable cause.
Speaker AAs Montana puts it, officers do not and cannot possess probable cause to believe a crime has occurred when responding to prevent a suicide, conduct a welfare check on an older individual who has been out of contact or help some someone who has fallen and suffered a serious injury.
Speaker ABecause no crime has occurred, there's nothing for probable cause to attach to.
Speaker AMontana warns that Case's preferred regime will turn American homes into the place where citizens who need urgent medical help died alone and in agony.
Speaker AThey emphasize that police are often first responders to medical emergencies, especially in rural areas like Montana.
Speaker BAnd Montana's third argument is that even if you applied some version of Case's standard, the officers here did exactly what the Constitution should require.
Speaker BThey corroborated the emergency report with on the ground observations and acted based on objective facts.
Speaker BMontana details how officers found Case's vehicle, confirming he was home, saw empty beer cans, an empty holster, and what appeared to be a suicide Note, all corroborating JH's specific claims about Kayce being home drinking, armed and preparing a suicide note.
Speaker BThe state argues this created an objectively reasonable basis to believe Case needed emergency aid, which is what Brigham City requires.
Speaker BEven under a heightened standard, Montana contends the facts here would satisfy it.
Speaker ANow let's talk about why this case is so significant.
Speaker ABeyond just the legal doctrine, this could fundamentally reshape how emergency response works across the nation.
Speaker AIf the court sides with Case and requires probable cause, it could make it much harder for officers to respond to the kinds of situations where people most most need help.
Speaker ASuicide attempts, drug overdoses, medical emergencies involving elderly people who haven't been heard from in days.
Speaker AAnd it's not just about police.
Speaker AIn many rural areas, law enforcement officers are the de facto first line of emergency medical response.
Speaker AMontana notes that every day police officers are first responders to calls involving suspected overdoses, strokes, diabetic comas and suicide attempts.
Speaker BOn the other hand, if the Court sides with Montana, it preserves the current system but potentially makes it easier for officers to enter homes based on relatively limited information that could create opportunities for abuse or pretextual entries.
Speaker AThe constitutional stakes are really about how we balance individual privacy rights against community safety needs, and Case represents the privacy side arguing for stronger protections, even if that makes emergency response harder.
Speaker AMontana represents the safety side, arguing that saving lives sometimes requires accepting some reduction in privacy protection.
Speaker BLooking ahead to oral arguments on October 15, what are you going to be listening for?
Speaker AI'll be really interested to see how the Justices react to the circuit split.
Speaker AThis is exactly the kind of issue the Court exists to resolve when lower courts can't agree on fundamental constitutional questions.
Speaker ASomebody has to provide national uniformity.
Speaker AI'll be watching for questions about the practical consequences.
Speaker ADo the Justices seem convinced by Case's argument that probable cause is workable in emergency situations?
Speaker AOr or do they buy Montana's argument that this would effectively end emergency aid entries?
Speaker BThe historical arguments should be fascinating, too.
Speaker BBoth sides are making claims about what the Framers intended and what the common law required.
Speaker BGiven this Court's emphasis on original meaning, those historical disputes could be decisive.
Speaker BPlus, I'm curious how the Justices will handle the fact that Brigham City is only about 20 years old.
Speaker BThat's relatively recent precedent, but it's also not so ancient that the Court would be reluctant to reconsider it if they think it was wrongly decided.
Speaker AAnd given Justice Kavanaugh's concurrence in Caniglia specifically noting this issue needed resolution, I suspect we'll get some probing questions about exactly what standard should apply and how courts should implement it.
Speaker BYou know, this feels like one of those cases that could have immediate nationwide impact if the Court changes the standard every police department in America will need to retrain officers on when they can and can't enter homes for emergencies.
Speaker AAbsolutely.
Speaker AAnd with 35 states weighing in, 34 of them opposing Case's position, you know, the practical stakes are enormous.
Speaker AState and local governments clearly see this as a threat to their ability to protect public safety.
Speaker BWe'll definitely be covering the oral arguments on October 15, so make sure you're subscribed.
Speaker AThanks for joining us for this deep dive into Case versus Montana.
Speaker AThis is a perfect example of how seemingly technical constitutional questions can have profound real world consequences for public safety and individual rights.
Speaker AAs always, if you found this helpful, please rate and share the podcast.
Speaker AAnd if you're a law enforcement officer, emergency responder, or civil rights advocate for, we'd love to hear your thoughts on how this issue plays out in practice.
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