1 00:00:00,166 --> 00:00:01,266 Hello everyone. 2 00:00:01,296 --> 00:00:04,056 Welcome to this week's Scaling Expertise, 3 00:00:04,236 --> 00:00:06,680 where we talk to experts who have scaled 4 00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:09,500 their expertise and also have some tips 5 00:00:09,500 --> 00:00:12,033 about how you can scale your expertise. 6 00:00:12,246 --> 00:00:14,496 I'm very excited for my guest this week. 7 00:00:14,620 --> 00:00:16,208 The Jill James, I love that. 8 00:00:18,201 --> 00:00:21,381 Who is a business consultant who helps 9 00:00:21,381 --> 00:00:24,307 her, founders go from founder to CEO. 10 00:00:24,437 --> 00:00:26,803 So welcome Jill, so much. 11 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:27,930 Thank you, Erin. 12 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:28,890 Thanks for inviting me. 13 00:00:28,950 --> 00:00:30,960 I'm very excited to have you here today. 14 00:00:31,303 --> 00:00:32,923 you talk about is so applicable to 15 00:00:32,923 --> 00:00:34,903 this audience, but before we dive 16 00:00:34,903 --> 00:00:36,493 in, would you introduce yourself? 17 00:00:36,748 --> 00:00:37,198 Sure. 18 00:00:37,228 --> 00:00:39,208 So I'm Jill James, as you mentioned, 19 00:00:39,208 --> 00:00:40,528 my company is called the Jill 20 00:00:40,528 --> 00:00:42,418 James, not gonna get lost there. 21 00:00:42,525 --> 00:00:45,015 so my focus is kinda in three areas. 22 00:00:45,015 --> 00:00:46,305 I'm a business manager, I'm 23 00:00:46,305 --> 00:00:47,685 an operator, and I also have a 24 00:00:47,685 --> 00:00:49,035 background in wealth management. 25 00:00:49,182 --> 00:00:50,772 so that makes it a little bit unique 26 00:00:50,772 --> 00:00:53,102 in that, I mostly work with self-funded 27 00:00:53,102 --> 00:00:55,503 people and, whole different set 28 00:00:55,533 --> 00:00:57,863 of, Tools that we have when you 29 00:00:57,863 --> 00:00:59,513 are not having venture investors. 30 00:00:59,513 --> 00:01:01,183 So that's really, an area that I've 31 00:01:01,183 --> 00:01:03,133 chosen to focus in to help people who 32 00:01:03,310 --> 00:01:04,843 wanna self-fund their businesses and 33 00:01:04,843 --> 00:01:06,613 grow them to the right size for them. 34 00:01:06,613 --> 00:01:08,623 So I think our conversation today is 35 00:01:08,623 --> 00:01:10,993 gonna be very applicable to your audience. 36 00:01:11,237 --> 00:01:12,315 Absolutely it is. 37 00:01:12,315 --> 00:01:14,115 And I'm gonna jump right in with what 38 00:01:14,115 --> 00:01:15,525 you mentioned there about your target 39 00:01:15,525 --> 00:01:17,672 audience, about them being founders 40 00:01:17,672 --> 00:01:19,712 that aren't gonna take VC funds. 41 00:01:19,995 --> 00:01:21,555 And we're gonna talk about scaling, 42 00:01:21,555 --> 00:01:22,755 we're gonna talk about intellectual 43 00:01:22,755 --> 00:01:24,868 property, but I'd like to just start 44 00:01:24,868 --> 00:01:28,585 with how the misperception generally. 45 00:01:28,820 --> 00:01:30,680 That when we talk about scaling, 46 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:32,720 we're talking about VC funding 47 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:34,447 and we're talking about software. 48 00:01:34,447 --> 00:01:36,037 We're talking about these things 49 00:01:36,257 --> 00:01:39,047 that we read about in magazines 50 00:01:39,107 --> 00:01:40,247 as opposed to the things that 51 00:01:40,247 --> 00:01:41,837 we do every day in our business. 52 00:01:41,948 --> 00:01:42,980 Have you found that kind of 53 00:01:42,980 --> 00:01:44,360 general misperception when 54 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:45,320 you're talking to people? 55 00:01:45,547 --> 00:01:46,207 Yes. 56 00:01:46,267 --> 00:01:46,357 Mm-hmm. 57 00:01:46,407 --> 00:01:48,387 in my working background, I come 58 00:01:48,387 --> 00:01:49,767 from investment banking, wealth 59 00:01:49,767 --> 00:01:51,627 management, and venture backed startups. 60 00:01:51,627 --> 00:01:51,717 Mm-hmm. 61 00:01:51,987 --> 00:01:54,327 And you can see I am not in that world. 62 00:01:54,387 --> 00:01:54,687 Right. 63 00:01:54,687 --> 00:01:54,927 So it's. 64 00:01:55,257 --> 00:01:57,177 What can we take from that world? 65 00:01:57,505 --> 00:01:59,907 But if we follow that playbook, and 66 00:01:59,907 --> 00:02:01,227 that is a lot of what you see in 67 00:02:01,227 --> 00:02:02,667 the press, that is a lot of what you 68 00:02:02,667 --> 00:02:05,037 see on social media is the get big 69 00:02:05,037 --> 00:02:07,748 fast playbook or the assumption that 70 00:02:07,748 --> 00:02:09,638 there is unlimited capital or you've 71 00:02:09,638 --> 00:02:11,708 just been handed a chunk of money. 72 00:02:11,956 --> 00:02:13,795 And you can go try some stuff out 73 00:02:13,795 --> 00:02:15,325 and figure out how it works before 74 00:02:15,325 --> 00:02:16,975 you have to sell anything to anybody. 75 00:02:17,205 --> 00:02:18,465 that isn't the real world 76 00:02:18,465 --> 00:02:20,265 for 98% of businesses. 77 00:02:20,270 --> 00:02:20,400 Mm-hmm. 78 00:02:20,540 --> 00:02:21,855 So, you know, as much as we look 79 00:02:21,855 --> 00:02:23,325 at, we hear about these venture 80 00:02:23,325 --> 00:02:24,975 capital businesses and it's sexy 81 00:02:24,975 --> 00:02:27,105 to say, oh, they got 1.2 million 82 00:02:27,105 --> 00:02:28,155 in funding, or they got mm-hmm. 83 00:02:28,395 --> 00:02:29,355 You know, 50 million in 84 00:02:29,355 --> 00:02:30,645 funding, whatever it is. 85 00:02:30,791 --> 00:02:32,321 sometimes that's just to figure 86 00:02:32,321 --> 00:02:33,641 out what are we gonna sell? 87 00:02:33,701 --> 00:02:34,001 Yes. 88 00:02:34,031 --> 00:02:34,181 And 89 00:02:34,181 --> 00:02:36,641 that isn't the reality for 98% of us. 90 00:02:36,641 --> 00:02:39,431 And I think in particular, if you are. 91 00:02:39,578 --> 00:02:41,238 a non-traditional founder, or you 92 00:02:41,238 --> 00:02:42,918 didn't go to a certain set of 10 93 00:02:42,918 --> 00:02:44,358 or 12 schools where you met the 94 00:02:44,358 --> 00:02:45,438 people who are gonna fund you. 95 00:02:45,703 --> 00:02:45,959 Mm-hmm. 96 00:02:45,959 --> 00:02:48,059 you are going to start your business with 97 00:02:48,059 --> 00:02:50,789 money that you earn by selling things, and 98 00:02:50,789 --> 00:02:52,709 then you're gonna earn the right to borrow 99 00:02:52,709 --> 00:02:55,573 money from other people or from banks 100 00:02:55,663 --> 00:02:55,753 mm-hmm. 101 00:02:55,784 --> 00:02:57,674 To accelerate the growth of your business. 102 00:02:57,901 --> 00:03:00,194 It is a very different playbook and I 103 00:03:00,194 --> 00:03:02,304 think, what I am seeing is more people 104 00:03:02,304 --> 00:03:05,844 are evolving to, I want to keep control. 105 00:03:06,068 --> 00:03:08,648 Of how this business grows and I wanna 106 00:03:08,648 --> 00:03:10,748 do it at a pace that's right for me. 107 00:03:10,748 --> 00:03:10,838 Mm-hmm. 108 00:03:11,018 --> 00:03:12,992 And not what somebody else dictates. 109 00:03:13,232 --> 00:03:15,475 And so when you choose that path to 110 00:03:15,475 --> 00:03:17,635 be self-funded, we have to be very 111 00:03:17,635 --> 00:03:19,855 intentional, especially from about. 112 00:03:20,376 --> 00:03:24,216 250 to $500,000 up to about 5 million. 113 00:03:24,369 --> 00:03:26,439 we have to be extremely intentional 114 00:03:26,439 --> 00:03:28,329 in how we step through that time 115 00:03:28,389 --> 00:03:30,849 to help you grow, without falling 116 00:03:30,849 --> 00:03:32,229 into some of the traps that are 117 00:03:32,229 --> 00:03:33,879 gonna start to come into your world. 118 00:03:33,879 --> 00:03:35,799 Around seven figures, where lots of 119 00:03:35,799 --> 00:03:37,809 people start to say, oh, I can help you. 120 00:03:37,809 --> 00:03:39,429 Now you made it to seven figures. 121 00:03:39,429 --> 00:03:40,539 You're in the big leagues. 122 00:03:40,539 --> 00:03:41,674 Well, let's get you on 123 00:03:41,674 --> 00:03:42,754 this different playbook. 124 00:03:42,907 --> 00:03:44,947 the foundation that it takes to build 125 00:03:44,947 --> 00:03:47,287 a self-funded business and to set a 126 00:03:47,287 --> 00:03:49,790 playbook for yourself is really what we 127 00:03:49,790 --> 00:03:51,350 work on with founders in my business. 128 00:03:51,860 --> 00:03:52,730 Thank you for that. 129 00:03:52,730 --> 00:03:53,270 Thank you. 130 00:03:53,517 --> 00:03:56,334 So having set that framework, 131 00:03:56,334 --> 00:03:58,164 let's go back a little bit. 132 00:03:58,164 --> 00:03:58,854 You okay. 133 00:03:59,034 --> 00:03:59,664 Mentioned you came 134 00:03:59,664 --> 00:04:01,384 from, the venture world. 135 00:04:01,580 --> 00:04:03,397 How did you make that transition 136 00:04:03,397 --> 00:04:04,657 to where you are today working 137 00:04:04,657 --> 00:04:06,032 with this population of clients? 138 00:04:06,650 --> 00:04:07,280 Yes. 139 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:08,420 That is a good question. 140 00:04:08,420 --> 00:04:11,030 So for a long time, being in, I think 141 00:04:11,030 --> 00:04:12,770 I worked at seven different venture 142 00:04:12,770 --> 00:04:14,480 backed startups over my career, 143 00:04:14,630 --> 00:04:15,860 and been through lots of exits. 144 00:04:15,860 --> 00:04:17,060 And so I was always looking 145 00:04:17,060 --> 00:04:18,770 for what is that big idea? 146 00:04:18,820 --> 00:04:19,690 what is the idea that 147 00:04:19,690 --> 00:04:21,100 would get me venture? 148 00:04:21,250 --> 00:04:21,340 Mm-hmm. 149 00:04:21,580 --> 00:04:21,730 And 150 00:04:21,730 --> 00:04:23,620 I had a lot of other ideas. 151 00:04:23,635 --> 00:04:25,495 That I didn't follow because they 152 00:04:25,495 --> 00:04:27,325 would not have qualified for venture 153 00:04:27,325 --> 00:04:28,975 and they were probably all really 154 00:04:28,975 --> 00:04:31,045 legitimately good businesses where 155 00:04:31,045 --> 00:04:32,575 I would've made a lot of money. 156 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:32,845 Mm-hmm. 157 00:04:32,845 --> 00:04:34,015 But I did not understand 158 00:04:34,015 --> 00:04:34,975 how that worked yet. 159 00:04:35,005 --> 00:04:36,745 I understood the get big fast model. 160 00:04:36,745 --> 00:04:36,985 Right. 161 00:04:36,985 --> 00:04:38,275 That was business school. 162 00:04:38,275 --> 00:04:40,195 That was all the businesses I worked in. 163 00:04:40,387 --> 00:04:41,227 That was the goal. 164 00:04:41,377 --> 00:04:42,877 So when it finally came down 165 00:04:42,877 --> 00:04:44,497 to it, I ended up leaving. 166 00:04:44,497 --> 00:04:46,507 I was the COO of a venture 167 00:04:46,507 --> 00:04:47,527 backed tech startup. 168 00:04:47,855 --> 00:04:49,572 And I was seven months pregnant there 169 00:04:49,572 --> 00:04:51,042 was a conversation about maternity 170 00:04:51,042 --> 00:04:52,722 leave and it did not go well. 171 00:04:53,045 --> 00:04:53,885 And so it was about 172 00:04:53,885 --> 00:04:54,095 no 173 00:04:54,095 --> 00:04:54,455 leave. 174 00:04:54,455 --> 00:04:56,675 Maybe it was, it was about no leave. 175 00:04:56,675 --> 00:04:58,145 It was about no leave. 176 00:04:58,459 --> 00:05:00,919 So I waddled my little self out of there. 177 00:05:01,122 --> 00:05:03,102 I took a minute to get organized and 178 00:05:03,102 --> 00:05:05,037 I had had a number of people, I had 179 00:05:05,037 --> 00:05:07,070 partnered with more, Founders who 180 00:05:07,070 --> 00:05:08,870 had come from a place of knowing how 181 00:05:08,870 --> 00:05:11,434 to sell, having a good idea about, a 182 00:05:11,434 --> 00:05:12,934 community or a business that they could, 183 00:05:12,984 --> 00:05:15,787 establish, but no operational expertise 184 00:05:15,817 --> 00:05:17,432 in how to set up and run a business. 185 00:05:17,450 --> 00:05:19,490 So I had, self-funded founders who had 186 00:05:19,490 --> 00:05:21,710 seen me do that, and they had left the 187 00:05:21,710 --> 00:05:24,110 door open of, if you ever wanna do this. 188 00:05:24,522 --> 00:05:26,082 Fractionally or maybe would take 189 00:05:26,082 --> 00:05:27,852 a side job where you're not all 190 00:05:27,852 --> 00:05:29,052 consumed with building somebody 191 00:05:29,052 --> 00:05:31,049 else's business, I would hire you. 192 00:05:31,199 --> 00:05:32,879 So I called a couple of those people 193 00:05:32,879 --> 00:05:34,499 and I said, this is the situation, 194 00:05:34,725 --> 00:05:36,165 and I'm gonna be having a baby. 195 00:05:36,315 --> 00:05:37,995 But you know, until then. 196 00:05:38,209 --> 00:05:39,379 We can start something and 197 00:05:39,379 --> 00:05:40,309 then we can pick it up again. 198 00:05:40,309 --> 00:05:42,229 And they said, any help you could 199 00:05:42,229 --> 00:05:44,419 give me, I would just so appreciate 200 00:05:44,419 --> 00:05:46,619 having someone look over my shoulder. 201 00:05:46,619 --> 00:05:47,609 Help me out with this, 202 00:05:47,661 --> 00:05:48,741 and whatever we can do. 203 00:05:48,941 --> 00:05:50,351 And I really appreciated that 204 00:05:50,351 --> 00:05:52,001 because the first couple of years 205 00:05:52,001 --> 00:05:53,561 in my business I've worked very 206 00:05:53,561 --> 00:05:55,736 flexibly, more like a fractional COO. 207 00:05:55,876 --> 00:05:56,296 Mm-hmm. 208 00:05:56,631 --> 00:05:57,441 I think this is. 209 00:05:57,488 --> 00:05:59,168 Part of the process of especially 210 00:05:59,168 --> 00:06:01,288 an expertise business, is you're 211 00:06:01,288 --> 00:06:03,238 gonna try out a bunch of stuff. 212 00:06:03,408 --> 00:06:04,138 I tried to work with 213 00:06:04,138 --> 00:06:05,308 different kinds of people. 214 00:06:05,308 --> 00:06:07,338 I worked on an hourly basis. 215 00:06:07,338 --> 00:06:08,091 You know, I just kind of 216 00:06:08,091 --> 00:06:09,591 figured out like, what is this? 217 00:06:09,591 --> 00:06:11,121 What are people asking me for? 218 00:06:11,271 --> 00:06:12,921 You know, that was almost my investment 219 00:06:12,921 --> 00:06:14,601 in finding my product market fit. 220 00:06:14,755 --> 00:06:16,645 in the evolution of that, about two 221 00:06:16,645 --> 00:06:18,835 years in, I saw an opportunity with 222 00:06:18,835 --> 00:06:20,995 lots of women who needed flexibility. 223 00:06:21,151 --> 00:06:22,935 Who are establishing businesses because 224 00:06:22,935 --> 00:06:24,915 of that often around caregiving. 225 00:06:25,111 --> 00:06:28,461 And so I redesigned what I was doing 226 00:06:28,461 --> 00:06:30,441 to make it a little bit more package 227 00:06:30,441 --> 00:06:32,451 driven, knowing those women were probably 228 00:06:32,451 --> 00:06:34,701 not going to get venture just given 229 00:06:34,701 --> 00:06:36,471 the numbers and the kinds of businesses 230 00:06:36,471 --> 00:06:38,235 they were establishing moved more in 231 00:06:38,235 --> 00:06:40,085 a direction around, how do I work with 232 00:06:40,085 --> 00:06:41,765 self-funded founders and what does that 233 00:06:41,765 --> 00:06:43,895 mean and what's my unique expertise? 234 00:06:44,060 --> 00:06:45,500 That I can bring to that area. 235 00:06:45,500 --> 00:06:46,900 Like what have I learned and 236 00:06:46,900 --> 00:06:48,460 the people around me, how can 237 00:06:48,460 --> 00:06:49,990 they help these people as well? 238 00:06:50,126 --> 00:06:52,046 so that was really the evolution. 239 00:06:52,086 --> 00:06:53,151 This was 10 years ago, right? 240 00:06:53,151 --> 00:06:53,391 Mm-hmm. 241 00:06:53,471 --> 00:06:54,306 My son is nine and a half. 242 00:06:54,306 --> 00:06:56,586 It was almost this time, 10 years 243 00:06:56,586 --> 00:06:58,596 ago that this conversation happened. 244 00:06:58,626 --> 00:06:58,716 Mm-hmm. 245 00:06:58,810 --> 00:07:01,150 10 years later, I have a very defined, 246 00:07:01,293 --> 00:07:02,553 this is who we are, this is what 247 00:07:02,553 --> 00:07:04,640 we do, this is who we're for, and 248 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:05,990 these are the reasons that we do it. 249 00:07:06,155 --> 00:07:07,805 All of that is very well developed at 250 00:07:07,805 --> 00:07:09,625 this point, but I went through a phase 251 00:07:09,625 --> 00:07:11,665 of experimentation initially where I 252 00:07:11,665 --> 00:07:13,465 just got paid to show up and mm-hmm. 253 00:07:13,705 --> 00:07:17,135 Do my old job as you know, my business. 254 00:07:17,185 --> 00:07:17,965 And that's a perfectly 255 00:07:17,965 --> 00:07:18,955 legitimate way to start. 256 00:07:19,223 --> 00:07:19,883 Absolutely. 257 00:07:19,883 --> 00:07:20,963 Thank you for sharing that 258 00:07:20,963 --> 00:07:23,106 because so many of us, you know, 259 00:07:23,550 --> 00:07:25,110 there's so much information now. 260 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:25,320 Yeah. 261 00:07:25,620 --> 00:07:27,390 And it is really easy to get 262 00:07:27,390 --> 00:07:30,170 caught up in all the different, way 263 00:07:30,170 --> 00:07:32,723 offers and ladders and all these. 264 00:07:32,903 --> 00:07:34,943 Things, and I have 265 00:07:34,943 --> 00:07:36,113 absolutely suffered from it. 266 00:07:36,113 --> 00:07:37,963 I'm, post corporate who mm-hmm. 267 00:07:38,331 --> 00:07:40,146 now works with a different population and 268 00:07:40,146 --> 00:07:42,606 it has taken, it is, I'm still evolving. 269 00:07:42,606 --> 00:07:44,450 Frankly, I'm, I'm not 10 years out 270 00:07:45,620 --> 00:07:47,000 working with this group of people. 271 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:49,610 learning who your best client 272 00:07:49,610 --> 00:07:51,950 is, the best way to help them. 273 00:07:51,950 --> 00:07:53,510 Our expertise can be used in lots 274 00:07:53,510 --> 00:07:55,126 of different ways, but you know, 275 00:07:55,126 --> 00:07:57,106 the more we work with people, 276 00:07:57,106 --> 00:07:58,966 the more we hear their pains. 277 00:07:59,153 --> 00:08:00,230 The more we start to speak their 278 00:08:00,230 --> 00:08:03,000 language, the more it makes sense. 279 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:04,470 Like we can start to drill down on 280 00:08:04,470 --> 00:08:06,033 the best way to help them, and that 281 00:08:06,033 --> 00:08:07,173 you're probably not gonna just. 282 00:08:07,413 --> 00:08:09,103 Come straight out of, this corporate 283 00:08:09,103 --> 00:08:11,043 for most of us, and go straight 284 00:08:11,043 --> 00:08:14,043 into the final product, so to speak. 285 00:08:14,043 --> 00:08:15,063 So, yeah. 286 00:08:15,220 --> 00:08:16,660 Yeah, I think that's a great point that, 287 00:08:16,710 --> 00:08:18,480 there is going to be an evolution in 288 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:20,440 your entrepreneurial journey even if 289 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:21,940 you're a product-based business mm-hmm. 290 00:08:21,940 --> 00:08:23,470 The first idea that you have. 291 00:08:23,568 --> 00:08:25,188 If you're very lucky, it 292 00:08:25,188 --> 00:08:26,238 will be the successful one. 293 00:08:26,238 --> 00:08:26,328 Mm-hmm. 294 00:08:26,568 --> 00:08:28,248 But in most cases, there's a pivot, 295 00:08:28,410 --> 00:08:29,631 there's some amount of learning, 296 00:08:29,631 --> 00:08:31,131 there's a change in the market. 297 00:08:31,341 --> 00:08:33,741 And so we have to continue to look 298 00:08:33,741 --> 00:08:36,278 for the opportunity and move toward 299 00:08:36,278 --> 00:08:38,018 it as we learn more about, you know, 300 00:08:38,018 --> 00:08:39,548 ourselves and what our capabilities 301 00:08:39,548 --> 00:08:41,168 are and, who wants to work with us. 302 00:08:41,386 --> 00:08:42,406 Now when you think, of course, 303 00:08:42,406 --> 00:08:43,816 this is a scaling expertise Yes. 304 00:08:44,266 --> 00:08:45,136 Uh, podcast. 305 00:08:45,376 --> 00:08:47,726 So, a lot of people have a very narrow 306 00:08:47,726 --> 00:08:49,616 definition of scaling as being mm-hmm. 307 00:08:49,811 --> 00:08:51,886 You know, selling books or courses 308 00:08:51,886 --> 00:08:53,056 or software, things like that. 309 00:08:53,225 --> 00:08:54,796 But what does scaling mean 310 00:08:54,796 --> 00:08:56,806 to you and your clients? 311 00:08:57,051 --> 00:08:57,561 Yes. 312 00:08:57,651 --> 00:08:59,541 So scaling in the self-funded 313 00:08:59,541 --> 00:09:02,061 world is a very intentional act. 314 00:09:02,091 --> 00:09:02,181 Mm-hmm. 315 00:09:02,385 --> 00:09:04,605 It's about milestones and it's 316 00:09:04,605 --> 00:09:07,065 about knowing what are those 317 00:09:07,065 --> 00:09:08,355 points of investment and the 318 00:09:08,355 --> 00:09:10,035 next place we're going to land. 319 00:09:10,215 --> 00:09:12,405 So scaling often as you start 320 00:09:12,405 --> 00:09:13,755 as a self-funded business owner, 321 00:09:13,815 --> 00:09:14,955 there's the problem of where is 322 00:09:14,955 --> 00:09:16,638 the money gonna come from, right? 323 00:09:16,638 --> 00:09:18,108 So we need to be intentional of 324 00:09:18,108 --> 00:09:20,268 looking at where are we going next? 325 00:09:20,308 --> 00:09:21,778 How much money is it gonna take? 326 00:09:21,808 --> 00:09:23,458 What are we gonna have to sell? 327 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:25,410 who else do we need on the staff? 328 00:09:25,510 --> 00:09:27,190 What other resources do we need? 329 00:09:27,272 --> 00:09:28,633 And sometimes that means there's gonna 330 00:09:28,633 --> 00:09:30,613 be a dip where we need to move forward 331 00:09:30,613 --> 00:09:32,083 and we don't have the revenue yet. 332 00:09:32,330 --> 00:09:32,420 Mm-hmm. 333 00:09:32,660 --> 00:09:34,408 So, where are we gonna get that capital? 334 00:09:34,438 --> 00:09:35,668 Is it, from a bank loan? 335 00:09:35,668 --> 00:09:36,808 Is it from a line of credit? 336 00:09:36,808 --> 00:09:38,188 Is it a seven a loan? 337 00:09:38,417 --> 00:09:40,877 Learning that world of places that you 338 00:09:40,877 --> 00:09:43,517 can borrow for growth, that you know 339 00:09:43,517 --> 00:09:45,407 you can pay back because you're moving 340 00:09:45,407 --> 00:09:47,957 through a point in time and not stuck 341 00:09:47,957 --> 00:09:49,607 in, I don't know how to get out of this. 342 00:09:49,607 --> 00:09:50,897 Let me borrow some money. 343 00:09:51,164 --> 00:09:52,937 it's meant to accelerate you. 344 00:09:53,237 --> 00:09:55,277 So I think that is, the thinking 345 00:09:55,307 --> 00:09:58,517 on scaling is not how fast 346 00:09:58,517 --> 00:10:00,917 can we get, how big, but. 347 00:10:01,117 --> 00:10:03,097 What's the next iteration of 348 00:10:03,097 --> 00:10:05,317 this business where we can be 349 00:10:05,317 --> 00:10:08,287 profitable at this size and deliver? 350 00:10:08,287 --> 00:10:08,377 Mm-hmm. 351 00:10:08,823 --> 00:10:10,413 And how long is that gonna take? 352 00:10:10,413 --> 00:10:11,133 How quickly are we 353 00:10:11,133 --> 00:10:12,123 gonna move through this? 354 00:10:12,273 --> 00:10:13,833 Because what I see is when you 355 00:10:13,833 --> 00:10:15,663 don't know what that next point 356 00:10:15,663 --> 00:10:17,134 of profitability is going to be. 357 00:10:17,704 --> 00:10:19,373 You get stuck in a trough. 358 00:10:19,447 --> 00:10:19,597 Mm-hmm. 359 00:10:19,642 --> 00:10:19,882 Where 360 00:10:19,987 --> 00:10:21,157 you are having to make extra 361 00:10:21,157 --> 00:10:24,037 investments in operating expenses in 362 00:10:24,037 --> 00:10:26,047 people that you can't pay for yet. 363 00:10:26,197 --> 00:10:27,397 And you meant to move through that 364 00:10:27,397 --> 00:10:28,687 in three to six months, and all of a 365 00:10:28,687 --> 00:10:30,367 sudden it becomes two years and the 366 00:10:30,367 --> 00:10:32,797 debt becomes unsustainable, right? 367 00:10:32,797 --> 00:10:32,887 Mm-hmm. 368 00:10:32,887 --> 00:10:34,237 And then you get really stuck. 369 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:34,570 Mm-hmm. 370 00:10:34,575 --> 00:10:36,820 So you have to have a plan for 371 00:10:36,910 --> 00:10:38,770 what is the next milestone. 372 00:10:39,008 --> 00:10:40,778 What do we need to do to get there 373 00:10:40,962 --> 00:10:43,002 what's gonna be the uncomfortable stuff 374 00:10:43,002 --> 00:10:45,042 that we have to do in the meantime? 375 00:10:45,222 --> 00:10:45,312 Mm-hmm. 376 00:10:45,604 --> 00:10:47,194 Um, to get us through this phase. 377 00:10:47,591 --> 00:10:50,141 then you can be there and say, I like this 378 00:10:50,141 --> 00:10:52,331 size of business and this is great for me. 379 00:10:52,331 --> 00:10:53,321 I love it here. 380 00:10:53,561 --> 00:10:54,221 Or you can be like. 381 00:10:54,486 --> 00:10:55,536 That wasn't so hard. 382 00:10:55,739 --> 00:10:57,239 I think I wanna go for the next one, 383 00:10:57,239 --> 00:10:58,829 and then we need to look ahead and 384 00:10:58,829 --> 00:11:01,309 say, not just based on the revenue 385 00:11:01,309 --> 00:11:03,412 number that you wanna be at, but what 386 00:11:03,412 --> 00:11:06,112 is the right size of your business at 387 00:11:06,112 --> 00:11:09,176 the next iteration where we hire the 388 00:11:09,176 --> 00:11:11,456 people, we have the profitability, you 389 00:11:11,456 --> 00:11:13,406 get paid what you wanna get paid, you 390 00:11:13,406 --> 00:11:15,086 keep the culture that you wanna keep. 391 00:11:15,249 --> 00:11:16,419 What's that next point? 392 00:11:16,509 --> 00:11:17,829 Okay, let's move toward that. 393 00:11:17,859 --> 00:11:18,849 What's, how long is this 394 00:11:18,849 --> 00:11:19,959 next phase gonna take? 395 00:11:20,134 --> 00:11:20,909 But I think it's the 396 00:11:20,909 --> 00:11:22,739 stepping stone approach. 397 00:11:23,347 --> 00:11:25,057 Making sure we're just moving 398 00:11:25,057 --> 00:11:26,737 through an investment phase to a next 399 00:11:26,737 --> 00:11:29,587 point of sustainable profitability. 400 00:11:29,754 --> 00:11:30,984 That's the way that we scale 401 00:11:30,984 --> 00:11:32,304 a self-funded business. 402 00:11:32,544 --> 00:11:34,314 You know, I think that even with the 403 00:11:34,314 --> 00:11:36,474 expert, certainly one who's relatively 404 00:11:36,474 --> 00:11:38,471 new in their business and they're not 405 00:11:38,471 --> 00:11:40,721 even thinking in terms of profitability, 406 00:11:40,721 --> 00:11:42,894 they're thinking in terms of matching 407 00:11:42,894 --> 00:11:45,796 their old salary and I'll say, you know. 408 00:11:46,304 --> 00:11:48,949 When I first started, being self-employed, 409 00:11:49,159 --> 00:11:51,049 I was not thinking about profitability. 410 00:11:51,049 --> 00:11:52,039 It was literally like, how much 411 00:11:52,039 --> 00:11:54,386 do I need to make to pay my bills? 412 00:11:55,106 --> 00:11:56,366 It was not about, you know, 413 00:11:56,366 --> 00:11:57,626 what does it really cost to me 414 00:11:57,626 --> 00:11:59,552 to generate this much revenue? 415 00:11:59,891 --> 00:12:01,871 and so there is a like kind of a, 416 00:12:02,201 --> 00:12:05,114 a foundational misunderstanding 417 00:12:05,114 --> 00:12:06,824 or lack of understanding, I think 418 00:12:06,961 --> 00:12:09,577 for some, experts about just that, 419 00:12:09,937 --> 00:12:12,247 about profits as opposed to just. 420 00:12:12,732 --> 00:12:13,332 Revenue. 421 00:12:13,842 --> 00:12:14,562 So Yeah. 422 00:12:14,592 --> 00:12:15,882 Yeah, I think that's a great point. 423 00:12:15,882 --> 00:12:17,592 There is definitely a transitional moment 424 00:12:17,592 --> 00:12:19,512 when you're that expert solopreneur. 425 00:12:19,512 --> 00:12:19,602 Mm-hmm. 426 00:12:20,042 --> 00:12:21,992 To moving into, I'm going to 427 00:12:22,022 --> 00:12:24,362 run a scaled business now. 428 00:12:24,362 --> 00:12:24,452 Mm-hmm. 429 00:12:24,692 --> 00:12:26,582 And other humans are involved, whether 430 00:12:26,582 --> 00:12:29,162 they are employees or contractors or 431 00:12:29,162 --> 00:12:30,692 other businesses that you work with. 432 00:12:31,006 --> 00:12:33,316 How do I go from how I do it myself? 433 00:12:33,316 --> 00:12:33,386 Self. 434 00:12:33,386 --> 00:12:33,476 Mm-hmm. 435 00:12:33,746 --> 00:12:35,126 And to take most of the money 436 00:12:35,126 --> 00:12:36,416 and put it in my bank account. 437 00:12:36,416 --> 00:12:36,656 Right. 438 00:12:36,656 --> 00:12:38,426 And just be tax smart about that. 439 00:12:38,486 --> 00:12:38,696 Right. 440 00:12:38,756 --> 00:12:41,356 And how do I set things up so other 441 00:12:41,356 --> 00:12:43,276 people can replicate what I do mm-hmm. 442 00:12:43,636 --> 00:12:44,926 At this level of quality 443 00:12:44,926 --> 00:12:45,976 that I wanna sustain. 444 00:12:45,976 --> 00:12:46,066 Mm-hmm. 445 00:12:46,306 --> 00:12:47,656 Because people still need to, 446 00:12:47,656 --> 00:12:49,496 you know, still mostly me, right? 447 00:12:49,496 --> 00:12:51,356 And so how do I bring in the right people 448 00:12:51,642 --> 00:12:53,442 and then how much is that gonna cost? 449 00:12:53,706 --> 00:12:55,806 I think that that is a point where. 450 00:12:55,981 --> 00:12:57,361 We really have to think 451 00:12:57,361 --> 00:12:58,411 through what you charge. 452 00:12:58,411 --> 00:12:58,501 Mm-hmm. 453 00:12:58,831 --> 00:13:00,541 And how many clients you need, or 454 00:13:00,541 --> 00:13:02,281 how many sales you need, and what 455 00:13:02,281 --> 00:13:03,901 that next investment is gonna be. 456 00:13:04,057 --> 00:13:06,967 Because bringing on people is a big leap. 457 00:13:06,997 --> 00:13:08,347 It is expensive. 458 00:13:08,347 --> 00:13:08,348 Yes. 459 00:13:08,507 --> 00:13:08,627 Yes. 460 00:13:08,627 --> 00:13:08,957 Right. 461 00:13:09,017 --> 00:13:10,277 They come with a lot of rules. 462 00:13:10,277 --> 00:13:11,177 I'm in California. 463 00:13:11,677 --> 00:13:14,377 Ah, yes, you had one part-time employee, 464 00:13:14,497 --> 00:13:16,147 you better have a retirement plan. 465 00:13:16,147 --> 00:13:17,407 You better be thinking about 466 00:13:17,407 --> 00:13:18,937 all of your compliance, right? 467 00:13:18,987 --> 00:13:20,727 that is that one human being 468 00:13:20,727 --> 00:13:22,377 for more than 10 hours a week. 469 00:13:22,377 --> 00:13:23,337 We have to do that. 470 00:13:23,571 --> 00:13:24,404 So, you know, there are other 471 00:13:24,404 --> 00:13:26,481 places where it's not that, really 472 00:13:26,481 --> 00:13:28,581 do have all of these other layers 473 00:13:28,581 --> 00:13:29,931 of operating and administrative 474 00:13:29,931 --> 00:13:32,331 responsibility once you start to scale. 475 00:13:32,451 --> 00:13:32,541 Mm-hmm. 476 00:13:32,584 --> 00:13:34,174 And do you want your expertise to 477 00:13:34,174 --> 00:13:36,244 become, I wanna get really good at. 478 00:13:36,589 --> 00:13:38,209 operating a business. 479 00:13:38,239 --> 00:13:38,329 Mm-hmm. 480 00:13:38,569 --> 00:13:39,949 Or I wanna get really good at 481 00:13:39,949 --> 00:13:41,269 going and finding customers 482 00:13:41,269 --> 00:13:42,679 and telling them my story 483 00:13:42,799 --> 00:13:42,889 mm-hmm. 484 00:13:43,129 --> 00:13:45,229 And aiming my business in that direction. 485 00:13:45,259 --> 00:13:46,459 And I think that's one of the 486 00:13:46,459 --> 00:13:47,989 challenges of people get really 487 00:13:47,989 --> 00:13:50,659 bogged down at that next phase of. 488 00:13:50,837 --> 00:13:52,576 I don't know how to do any of this stuff. 489 00:13:52,576 --> 00:13:52,666 Mm-hmm. 490 00:13:52,979 --> 00:13:54,479 And it's really hard, and I keep 491 00:13:54,479 --> 00:13:56,906 getting letters and they're scary 492 00:13:57,126 --> 00:13:58,626 and I don't wanna like, and now I'm 493 00:13:58,626 --> 00:14:00,636 spending time on, on hold, trying to 494 00:14:00,636 --> 00:14:02,466 figure out what's going on and like, 495 00:14:02,466 --> 00:14:04,206 who do I need to solve this problem? 496 00:14:04,216 --> 00:14:06,412 the sales stop, you stop selling, you 497 00:14:06,412 --> 00:14:07,942 stop focusing forward and you stop 498 00:14:07,942 --> 00:14:09,712 innovating and you stop trying stuff. 499 00:14:09,782 --> 00:14:11,582 that is one of the big pitfalls 500 00:14:11,582 --> 00:14:13,472 of going from a single expert. 501 00:14:13,732 --> 00:14:15,952 Into a scaled business setting mm-hmm. 502 00:14:16,192 --> 00:14:18,312 Is, we rise to the place where the 503 00:14:18,312 --> 00:14:20,952 administrative stuff overwhelms us. 504 00:14:20,982 --> 00:14:21,072 Yes. 505 00:14:21,312 --> 00:14:22,729 And then who do you get 506 00:14:22,729 --> 00:14:23,869 to help you with that? 507 00:14:23,929 --> 00:14:24,019 Mm-hmm. 508 00:14:24,019 --> 00:14:24,199 Right? 509 00:14:24,199 --> 00:14:25,549 How do you get good at that a lot 510 00:14:25,549 --> 00:14:26,209 faster. 511 00:14:26,449 --> 00:14:26,539 Mm-hmm. 512 00:14:26,545 --> 00:14:26,779 Right. 513 00:14:27,006 --> 00:14:27,396 Yeah. 514 00:14:27,396 --> 00:14:29,429 I'm a huge, Proponent of division 515 00:14:29,429 --> 00:14:31,229 of labor, there's something I 516 00:14:31,229 --> 00:14:32,399 don't even wanna get good at. 517 00:14:32,399 --> 00:14:32,489 Yes. 518 00:14:32,789 --> 00:14:34,529 Like for me to go from, the, uh, what 519 00:14:34,529 --> 00:14:36,449 is it, the zone of genius, go, yes. 520 00:14:36,929 --> 00:14:38,999 Not even adequate to decent would be 521 00:14:38,999 --> 00:14:40,879 like, that gap is, for some things 522 00:14:40,879 --> 00:14:43,012 is huge for me versus going from 523 00:14:43,012 --> 00:14:44,872 good to great, you know, which is 524 00:14:44,872 --> 00:14:47,046 where I'm trying to spend my time. 525 00:14:47,232 --> 00:14:49,562 So you mentioned, having a 526 00:14:49,562 --> 00:14:51,152 scalable, sustainable business. 527 00:14:51,369 --> 00:14:53,019 And from my perspective, you 528 00:14:53,019 --> 00:14:54,789 can't do that without developing 529 00:14:54,789 --> 00:14:56,522 some intellectual property. 530 00:14:56,672 --> 00:14:58,742 Not necessarily software books or courses, 531 00:14:58,742 --> 00:15:00,885 but you know, making sure we're capturing 532 00:15:00,885 --> 00:15:04,929 our expertise putting it in a form that 533 00:15:04,929 --> 00:15:08,045 it can be replicated by other people. 534 00:15:08,225 --> 00:15:10,145 You know, as founders, we are the most 535 00:15:10,145 --> 00:15:12,185 expensive resource in our business, 536 00:15:12,365 --> 00:15:14,969 so how do we have less expensive 537 00:15:14,969 --> 00:15:17,459 resources deliver some or all of that. 538 00:15:17,639 --> 00:15:18,989 Value to our clients. 539 00:15:19,232 --> 00:15:21,902 And so I get too many questions 540 00:15:21,902 --> 00:15:23,612 about like, I'm worried about people 541 00:15:23,612 --> 00:15:26,355 stealing my intellectual property and. 542 00:15:26,576 --> 00:15:28,076 one of the things that you do 543 00:15:28,106 --> 00:15:31,016 is you have a ask me anything. 544 00:15:31,256 --> 00:15:31,346 Mm-hmm. 545 00:15:31,486 --> 00:15:32,896 Where you let people come and you 546 00:15:32,896 --> 00:15:35,566 give away your, expertise for free. 547 00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:38,103 some people and I do a lot of that 548 00:15:38,103 --> 00:15:39,543 as well, and people are like, why you 549 00:15:39,543 --> 00:15:41,013 give so much away, but where do you see 550 00:15:41,013 --> 00:15:43,799 the benefit of sharing your expertise? 551 00:15:44,204 --> 00:15:45,584 well, most of the things that I know 552 00:15:45,584 --> 00:15:47,444 you will eventually learn, right? 553 00:15:47,444 --> 00:15:47,534 Mm-hmm. 554 00:15:47,722 --> 00:15:50,357 I was a proud business auntie earlier this 555 00:15:50,357 --> 00:15:52,887 year as one of my clients got on stage, in 556 00:15:52,887 --> 00:15:54,717 front of a group of other women and said 557 00:15:54,717 --> 00:15:56,937 things that I know I said to her, mm-hmm. 558 00:15:56,937 --> 00:15:57,865 She said them to these, 559 00:15:57,903 --> 00:15:58,893 bigger group of women. 560 00:15:58,893 --> 00:16:00,153 And I was just like, yes. 561 00:16:00,153 --> 00:16:01,653 Pass on that message. 562 00:16:01,653 --> 00:16:01,654 Mm-hmm. 563 00:16:01,828 --> 00:16:03,048 We all can get better at this. 564 00:16:03,048 --> 00:16:03,448 Mm-hmm. 565 00:16:03,688 --> 00:16:05,473 So I think, I come from a place 566 00:16:05,473 --> 00:16:08,450 where innovation is the ip. 567 00:16:08,615 --> 00:16:10,145 Creating an organization that will be 568 00:16:10,145 --> 00:16:12,305 curious and continue to learn, continue 569 00:16:12,305 --> 00:16:14,811 to try new things continue to really 570 00:16:14,811 --> 00:16:17,715 move ahead to new opportunities and 571 00:16:17,715 --> 00:16:19,545 being smart about what we need to 572 00:16:19,545 --> 00:16:22,005 protect in that and what is protectable, 573 00:16:22,195 --> 00:16:23,335 Because innovation in and 574 00:16:23,335 --> 00:16:25,165 of itself is a discipline. 575 00:16:25,165 --> 00:16:25,555 Mm-hmm. 576 00:16:25,795 --> 00:16:25,885 Is 577 00:16:25,885 --> 00:16:26,460 not protectable. 578 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:27,410 Right. 579 00:16:27,410 --> 00:16:29,210 The product of your innovation 580 00:16:29,330 --> 00:16:30,680 might be protectable. 581 00:16:30,926 --> 00:16:32,636 The question is like, is it relevant 582 00:16:32,756 --> 00:16:34,537 for a long time, if it takes 583 00:16:34,537 --> 00:16:36,337 several years to get a trademark, 584 00:16:36,437 --> 00:16:38,771 or it takes, utility patent, right? 585 00:16:38,891 --> 00:16:38,981 Mm-hmm. 586 00:16:39,251 --> 00:16:40,001 Is that. 587 00:16:40,001 --> 00:16:41,766 A useful investment for you? 588 00:16:41,766 --> 00:16:43,116 Is that something that's the 589 00:16:43,116 --> 00:16:45,246 product of your innovation mm-hmm. 590 00:16:45,396 --> 00:16:46,806 That you need for a long time? 591 00:16:47,012 --> 00:16:47,102 And 592 00:16:47,102 --> 00:16:48,872 so a lot of what we're doing in 593 00:16:48,872 --> 00:16:50,342 our intellectual property is really 594 00:16:50,342 --> 00:16:51,992 that special sauce of how do we 595 00:16:51,992 --> 00:16:54,082 make our business ours, What are 596 00:16:54,082 --> 00:16:55,882 the operating procedures we follow? 597 00:16:55,882 --> 00:16:55,972 Mm-hmm. 598 00:16:56,032 --> 00:16:57,202 How do we think about who 599 00:16:57,202 --> 00:16:58,612 we bring onto our team? 600 00:16:58,852 --> 00:17:00,622 Other people can't replicate that. 601 00:17:00,712 --> 00:17:00,802 Mm-hmm. 602 00:17:00,837 --> 00:17:01,942 And I think also that 603 00:17:01,942 --> 00:17:03,832 curiosity, did it move forward? 604 00:17:03,981 --> 00:17:06,009 Most organizations are not that. 605 00:17:06,009 --> 00:17:06,189 Mm-hmm. 606 00:17:06,429 --> 00:17:08,139 So you know that aspect of 607 00:17:08,139 --> 00:17:10,089 we will continue to evolve. 608 00:17:10,749 --> 00:17:12,759 Versus, you know, often people 609 00:17:12,759 --> 00:17:14,139 with intellectual property think, 610 00:17:14,299 --> 00:17:16,309 I've got my thing now I'm gonna 611 00:17:16,309 --> 00:17:18,289 milk it for the next 75 years. 612 00:17:18,509 --> 00:17:20,699 And that might be true as you capture some 613 00:17:20,699 --> 00:17:22,379 of these things, put copyright on them. 614 00:17:22,379 --> 00:17:22,469 Mm-hmm. 615 00:17:22,741 --> 00:17:23,579 Absolutely. 616 00:17:23,626 --> 00:17:25,156 There are things that, you know, might 617 00:17:25,156 --> 00:17:27,076 live well beyond you where your heirs 618 00:17:27,076 --> 00:17:28,576 can continue to get money from them. 619 00:17:28,576 --> 00:17:28,666 Mm-hmm. 620 00:17:28,906 --> 00:17:30,106 And understanding what those 621 00:17:30,106 --> 00:17:31,816 things are are really important. 622 00:17:32,096 --> 00:17:33,356 and where those fall in. 623 00:17:33,356 --> 00:17:34,706 But I think sometimes people get. 624 00:17:34,866 --> 00:17:38,069 Too attached to, I protected this 625 00:17:38,069 --> 00:17:39,869 thing so that nobody else can use it. 626 00:17:39,869 --> 00:17:42,629 And it's really the defense of that, 627 00:17:42,629 --> 00:17:43,889 that they haven't thought through. 628 00:17:43,889 --> 00:17:43,979 Mm-hmm. 629 00:17:44,429 --> 00:17:46,739 Like, do you wanna become an organization? 630 00:17:46,937 --> 00:17:48,794 That is defending a copyright 631 00:17:48,794 --> 00:17:50,174 or defending a trademark. 632 00:17:50,234 --> 00:17:50,294 Mm-hmm. 633 00:17:50,344 --> 00:17:51,844 Or do you wanna be this 634 00:17:51,844 --> 00:17:52,654 thing in the world? 635 00:17:52,774 --> 00:17:52,954 Mm-hmm. 636 00:17:52,984 --> 00:17:54,214 so I think that's the kind 637 00:17:54,214 --> 00:17:55,624 of the balance of you have to 638 00:17:55,624 --> 00:17:57,487 understand what intellectual 639 00:17:57,487 --> 00:17:59,377 property will and won't do for you. 640 00:17:59,407 --> 00:17:59,527 Mm-hmm. 641 00:17:59,747 --> 00:18:00,917 I think one of the things that I do with 642 00:18:00,917 --> 00:18:03,287 my clients is we look at insurances. 643 00:18:03,357 --> 00:18:04,377 if intellectual property 644 00:18:04,377 --> 00:18:05,472 is important is mm-hmm. 645 00:18:05,552 --> 00:18:06,507 How do we form a legal 646 00:18:06,507 --> 00:18:07,677 defense fund mm-hmm. 647 00:18:08,007 --> 00:18:08,307 Using 648 00:18:08,307 --> 00:18:08,997 insurance. 649 00:18:09,492 --> 00:18:09,732 That 650 00:18:09,732 --> 00:18:11,922 gives us the right to say, not only are 651 00:18:11,922 --> 00:18:13,572 we gonna write that cease and desist, but 652 00:18:13,572 --> 00:18:15,762 when you think you've, you know, scared us 653 00:18:15,762 --> 00:18:17,832 with a big lawyer, we have a bigger lawyer 654 00:18:18,067 --> 00:18:19,692 and we're gonna write a nastier letter. 655 00:18:19,807 --> 00:18:20,892 ' cause we have a legal defense 656 00:18:20,892 --> 00:18:22,422 fund that you didn't know we had. 657 00:18:22,522 --> 00:18:23,812 I went through this with a client 658 00:18:23,812 --> 00:18:25,252 a few years ago where, you know, 659 00:18:25,252 --> 00:18:26,692 there's like a major manufacturer 660 00:18:26,692 --> 00:18:28,552 that thought they would scare her off. 661 00:18:28,672 --> 00:18:28,762 Mm-hmm. 662 00:18:28,851 --> 00:18:29,181 And she. 663 00:18:29,791 --> 00:18:31,561 It was like, I have insurance for this. 664 00:18:31,651 --> 00:18:31,741 Mm-hmm. 665 00:18:31,981 --> 00:18:33,091 I'm getting a good lawyer. 666 00:18:33,121 --> 00:18:33,451 Right. 667 00:18:33,451 --> 00:18:34,891 And went ahead and like, wrote 668 00:18:34,891 --> 00:18:36,031 back the letter and they were 669 00:18:36,031 --> 00:18:37,981 like, oh, oh, she's for real. 670 00:18:38,431 --> 00:18:38,551 Right. 671 00:18:39,001 --> 00:18:41,197 So I think there are things like that not 672 00:18:41,197 --> 00:18:42,637 just the intellectual property, but the 673 00:18:42,637 --> 00:18:44,377 defense of intellectual property mm-hmm. 674 00:18:44,647 --> 00:18:44,767 Yeah. 675 00:18:44,767 --> 00:18:46,551 Is a thing as small business owners, that 676 00:18:46,551 --> 00:18:48,981 there are tools that we can use mm-hmm. 677 00:18:49,221 --> 00:18:50,391 To make us run with 678 00:18:50,481 --> 00:18:51,741 against bigger companies. 679 00:18:51,741 --> 00:18:52,881 And I think that's a big thing 680 00:18:52,881 --> 00:18:53,991 to think about if you are 681 00:18:53,991 --> 00:18:55,761 gonna be an IP driven business. 682 00:18:55,791 --> 00:18:56,061 Yeah. 683 00:18:56,299 --> 00:18:58,579 I love that, and I will, people 684 00:18:58,579 --> 00:19:00,682 probably forget this about me, but 685 00:19:00,822 --> 00:19:02,592 the, my brand name Think Beyond 686 00:19:02,592 --> 00:19:05,426 IP was about kind of not just. 687 00:19:05,857 --> 00:19:07,707 copyrights, trademark patents, it was 688 00:19:07,707 --> 00:19:09,897 about all kind of intellectual capitals 689 00:19:09,897 --> 00:19:11,307 I called it, you know, which it is 690 00:19:11,307 --> 00:19:13,574 called, but which nobody wanted to hear 691 00:19:13,574 --> 00:19:15,794 me talk about, which is yeah, what my 692 00:19:15,794 --> 00:19:17,624 evolution was like, okay, nobody really 693 00:19:17,624 --> 00:19:19,724 wants to talk about intellectual capital. 694 00:19:19,857 --> 00:19:21,657 but it's exactly, of course, I didn't 695 00:19:21,657 --> 00:19:23,327 put it the way you put it, but about. 696 00:19:23,572 --> 00:19:26,592 Culture, innovation, all those things. 697 00:19:26,592 --> 00:19:29,166 Insurance, there's a whole, ecosystem 698 00:19:29,326 --> 00:19:32,596 of how we create a business that, 699 00:19:32,749 --> 00:19:35,119 is differentiated, that people wanna 700 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:36,679 work in, that clients wanna work with. 701 00:19:36,679 --> 00:19:38,359 It's not just about, what is 702 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:39,949 filed in a copyright office. 703 00:19:40,177 --> 00:19:41,317 and those things are all. 704 00:19:41,517 --> 00:19:42,057 Absolutely. 705 00:19:42,057 --> 00:19:42,657 So important. 706 00:19:42,657 --> 00:19:44,427 So thank you for putting it that way. 707 00:19:44,487 --> 00:19:45,777 I feel I feel better about, 708 00:19:47,522 --> 00:19:48,597 I'm so glad to hear that. 709 00:19:50,277 --> 00:19:51,087 I feel so much better. 710 00:19:51,407 --> 00:19:54,081 So tell me how, your clients 711 00:19:54,081 --> 00:19:56,091 know, Hey, I need to call Jill. 712 00:19:56,241 --> 00:19:57,231 Like, what's happening 713 00:19:57,231 --> 00:19:58,071 in their businesses? 714 00:19:58,221 --> 00:19:58,581 Yeah. 715 00:19:58,821 --> 00:20:00,021 Yes, yes. 716 00:20:00,161 --> 00:20:02,101 so often with my clients, like you 717 00:20:02,101 --> 00:20:03,601 ask me about like why I do so much 718 00:20:03,601 --> 00:20:06,014 stuff for free and I consider like 719 00:20:06,044 --> 00:20:08,384 I want to be Mackenzie Scott level. 720 00:20:08,544 --> 00:20:09,914 Giving Right. 721 00:20:10,064 --> 00:20:12,374 And not keeping what I have, right? 722 00:20:12,379 --> 00:20:12,419 Mm-hmm. 723 00:20:12,504 --> 00:20:13,544 And I want lots of 724 00:20:13,544 --> 00:20:14,744 people to be successful. 725 00:20:14,934 --> 00:20:17,234 So my business model, what I've 726 00:20:17,234 --> 00:20:18,734 settled on for my own growth 727 00:20:18,734 --> 00:20:20,504 is more of a freemium model. 728 00:20:20,509 --> 00:20:20,604 Mm-hmm. 729 00:20:20,604 --> 00:20:22,334 Lots of people are on my newsletter. 730 00:20:22,394 --> 00:20:24,344 Lots of people come to my free stuff. 731 00:20:24,524 --> 00:20:25,909 We work with 10 or 12 clients a year. 732 00:20:26,514 --> 00:20:27,474 And a lot of those clients 733 00:20:27,474 --> 00:20:28,674 stay on for multiple years. 734 00:20:28,674 --> 00:20:29,844 So really, when it comes to 735 00:20:29,844 --> 00:20:31,864 new clients, we're taking on 736 00:20:31,864 --> 00:20:33,454 four to six new clients a year. 737 00:20:33,459 --> 00:20:33,639 Mm-hmm. 738 00:20:33,719 --> 00:20:33,839 Right? 739 00:20:33,839 --> 00:20:33,840 Mm-hmm. 740 00:20:34,024 --> 00:20:34,324 Until 741 00:20:34,324 --> 00:20:36,004 they phase through and hire, 742 00:20:36,054 --> 00:20:37,164 permanent people mm-hmm. 743 00:20:37,224 --> 00:20:39,207 if they get that big to take these 744 00:20:39,207 --> 00:20:40,737 on permanent jobs, all of mm-hmm. 745 00:20:41,007 --> 00:20:42,117 You know, four or five, six 746 00:20:42,117 --> 00:20:43,077 things we're doing for that. 747 00:20:43,082 --> 00:20:43,262 Mm-hmm. 748 00:20:43,659 --> 00:20:45,424 So I think the point that people end up 749 00:20:45,424 --> 00:20:48,784 calling me is they either say, Hey, I've 750 00:20:48,784 --> 00:20:50,524 been running this business for a while. 751 00:20:51,051 --> 00:20:52,821 I have an idea of like how to take it 752 00:20:52,821 --> 00:20:54,951 to the next level, but I need someone to 753 00:20:54,951 --> 00:20:57,861 help me think through what is that right? 754 00:20:57,861 --> 00:20:59,151 Like what are my options? 755 00:20:59,151 --> 00:21:01,301 How could I do it And then how do 756 00:21:01,301 --> 00:21:03,071 I stay true to me while I do that? 757 00:21:03,131 --> 00:21:04,901 What are the centering principles that 758 00:21:04,901 --> 00:21:06,761 matter that we're building this business 759 00:21:06,761 --> 00:21:08,817 around, what are the forms the business 760 00:21:08,817 --> 00:21:12,091 could take that don't trade off who I am? 761 00:21:12,366 --> 00:21:15,546 What matters to me getting paid, right? 762 00:21:15,546 --> 00:21:16,776 Because none of us can go to zero. 763 00:21:16,776 --> 00:21:16,866 Mm-hmm. 764 00:21:17,106 --> 00:21:17,916 We gotta get paid while 765 00:21:17,916 --> 00:21:18,996 we build these things. 766 00:21:19,236 --> 00:21:20,886 And when I get to the other 767 00:21:20,886 --> 00:21:22,536 side, is it still a business? 768 00:21:22,536 --> 00:21:24,396 I'm gonna be happy running. 769 00:21:24,526 --> 00:21:25,486 is it still a thing? 770 00:21:25,486 --> 00:21:26,626 Does it become somebody else's 771 00:21:26,626 --> 00:21:27,856 thing or is it my thing? 772 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:29,319 And so I think when you're having 773 00:21:29,319 --> 00:21:30,719 thoughts like that's the moment to 774 00:21:30,719 --> 00:21:32,159 call me as a thought partner and 775 00:21:32,159 --> 00:21:34,349 a strategist of what could it be? 776 00:21:34,556 --> 00:21:34,736 Right. 777 00:21:34,736 --> 00:21:36,086 Let's talk about what it could be. 778 00:21:36,299 --> 00:21:37,949 and that's like kind of bringing in 779 00:21:38,136 --> 00:21:40,566 the structures and, you know, different 780 00:21:40,596 --> 00:21:41,946 capital models and things like that. 781 00:21:41,946 --> 00:21:42,786 And that's where I draw a 782 00:21:42,786 --> 00:21:44,316 lot on my venture background. 783 00:21:44,346 --> 00:21:44,436 Mm-hmm. 784 00:21:44,676 --> 00:21:45,636 And also what I know about 785 00:21:45,636 --> 00:21:47,406 money management of like, how 786 00:21:47,406 --> 00:21:48,936 would we make that happen? 787 00:21:49,152 --> 00:21:50,082 The other piece that 788 00:21:50,082 --> 00:21:51,552 people call me for is. 789 00:21:51,754 --> 00:21:53,984 All I'm doing now is admin, Like I 790 00:21:53,984 --> 00:21:56,274 really wanna get back to, focusing 791 00:21:56,274 --> 00:21:58,224 on the, the growth of my business, 792 00:21:58,254 --> 00:22:00,384 selling things, talking to customers, 793 00:22:00,384 --> 00:22:03,024 running my team, and I'm so bogged down 794 00:22:03,024 --> 00:22:04,464 in all this other stuff and I don't 795 00:22:04,464 --> 00:22:06,504 even know the right questions to ask. 796 00:22:06,534 --> 00:22:06,959 And also. 797 00:22:07,754 --> 00:22:09,854 I know I'm getting these giant tax bills. 798 00:22:09,884 --> 00:22:10,724 I know they're more, I 799 00:22:10,724 --> 00:22:11,924 know I could be smarter. 800 00:22:11,924 --> 00:22:13,034 I know I could give more 801 00:22:13,034 --> 00:22:14,414 benefits to my people. 802 00:22:14,571 --> 00:22:16,641 I tend to work with very generous founders 803 00:22:16,641 --> 00:22:19,101 who do more than the law requires, right? 804 00:22:19,131 --> 00:22:19,221 Mm-hmm. 805 00:22:19,461 --> 00:22:20,871 They wanna share all the 806 00:22:20,871 --> 00:22:22,251 rising tide lifts, all boats. 807 00:22:22,251 --> 00:22:23,091 That's the attitude. 808 00:22:23,121 --> 00:22:23,211 Mm-hmm. 809 00:22:23,451 --> 00:22:25,124 So, how could I do that? 810 00:22:25,124 --> 00:22:25,994 What's good for me and 811 00:22:25,994 --> 00:22:26,864 what's good for them? 812 00:22:27,107 --> 00:22:28,937 So, you know, that's very often of 813 00:22:29,177 --> 00:22:31,637 how do we fix the running it part of 814 00:22:31,637 --> 00:22:33,437 the business so that you are doing 815 00:22:33,437 --> 00:22:34,997 the running it part that you want. 816 00:22:35,142 --> 00:22:37,107 And we take all that stuff that, you 817 00:22:37,107 --> 00:22:38,397 know, when you say something like, 818 00:22:38,532 --> 00:22:40,767 Hey, I'd like to implement this in the 819 00:22:40,767 --> 00:22:43,857 business and I just see 11 to 15 things 820 00:22:43,857 --> 00:22:45,567 we're gonna need to do to do that. 821 00:22:45,651 --> 00:22:45,921 Right? 822 00:22:45,921 --> 00:22:47,421 You don't have to go through the trial 823 00:22:47,421 --> 00:22:48,951 and error of what are those things. 824 00:22:49,364 --> 00:22:51,344 We make a checklist, we step through them, 825 00:22:51,344 --> 00:22:53,714 we prioritize them, and we might, you 826 00:22:53,714 --> 00:22:55,934 know, in many cases, just do them for you. 827 00:22:56,211 --> 00:22:57,771 So I think that part is like an 828 00:22:57,801 --> 00:22:59,571 operating partner, an experienced 829 00:22:59,571 --> 00:23:01,864 operator in so many different 830 00:23:01,864 --> 00:23:04,417 areas of running, small business. 831 00:23:04,417 --> 00:23:05,587 And when I say small, like. 832 00:23:05,747 --> 00:23:06,497 You know, that's up to 833 00:23:06,497 --> 00:23:07,907 like $15 million, right? 834 00:23:08,237 --> 00:23:09,497 I'm just talking about a hundred 835 00:23:09,497 --> 00:23:10,667 thousand dollars businesses here. 836 00:23:10,879 --> 00:23:12,674 There's a wide range of small business. 837 00:23:12,679 --> 00:23:12,809 Mm-hmm. 838 00:23:12,867 --> 00:23:15,087 But I think that's, the point of when 839 00:23:15,117 --> 00:23:16,917 the operating of the business has 840 00:23:16,917 --> 00:23:19,581 gotten overwhelming for you, but it's 841 00:23:19,581 --> 00:23:21,331 still cost prohibitive to bring in a 842 00:23:21,346 --> 00:23:23,385 really experienced operating partner. 843 00:23:23,629 --> 00:23:24,889 That's the other time to call me. 844 00:23:25,764 --> 00:23:26,814 That's fantastic. 845 00:23:26,994 --> 00:23:28,614 So speaking of how you work with 846 00:23:28,614 --> 00:23:29,844 your clients, is there anything 847 00:23:29,844 --> 00:23:31,374 new and exciting coming up in your 848 00:23:31,374 --> 00:23:32,484 business that you'd like to share? 849 00:23:32,852 --> 00:23:33,482 Yes. 850 00:23:33,532 --> 00:23:35,362 I'm really investing in my newsletter 851 00:23:35,362 --> 00:23:36,712 and my community around that. 852 00:23:36,742 --> 00:23:38,032 something that's free. 853 00:23:38,032 --> 00:23:40,382 We have lots of resources, I don't want 854 00:23:40,382 --> 00:23:42,992 anyone to fail in starting a business 855 00:23:43,105 --> 00:23:45,145 because they didn't file a piece of paper. 856 00:23:45,620 --> 00:23:46,460 Or they didn't know they 857 00:23:46,460 --> 00:23:47,330 had a deadline mm-hmm. 858 00:23:47,570 --> 00:23:49,370 Or they got behind on their taxes. 859 00:23:49,610 --> 00:23:49,790 Right. 860 00:23:49,790 --> 00:23:51,260 All of those things that you just don't 861 00:23:51,260 --> 00:23:52,880 know when you first start a business. 862 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:53,090 Mm-hmm. 863 00:23:53,330 --> 00:23:54,560 So, you know, the newsletter and 864 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:56,660 the community around that, are free 865 00:23:56,660 --> 00:23:58,370 and it's, you know, just something 866 00:23:58,370 --> 00:24:00,050 that I want as many people as 867 00:24:00,050 --> 00:24:01,610 possible to get to the place where 868 00:24:01,610 --> 00:24:03,020 they could be become my clients. 869 00:24:03,170 --> 00:24:03,500 Right. 870 00:24:03,500 --> 00:24:04,430 Like, that's all. 871 00:24:04,430 --> 00:24:04,550 Mm-hmm. 872 00:24:04,795 --> 00:24:05,810 Uh, so we're really, you know, 873 00:24:05,810 --> 00:24:07,190 focused in on like, what else 874 00:24:07,190 --> 00:24:08,660 can we do for that community? 875 00:24:08,830 --> 00:24:10,445 Of self-funded small business owners 876 00:24:10,445 --> 00:24:11,735 to help them get to that point. 877 00:24:11,959 --> 00:24:13,049 and I think on the other side of the 878 00:24:13,049 --> 00:24:15,209 business, I'm really leaning more into, 879 00:24:15,259 --> 00:24:17,389 some of the wealth management aspects of, 880 00:24:17,479 --> 00:24:19,189 you know, that's kind of a hidden aspect. 881 00:24:19,189 --> 00:24:20,569 I was a registered investment 882 00:24:20,569 --> 00:24:22,655 advisor, for several years. 883 00:24:22,655 --> 00:24:24,005 And so like I've been through all 884 00:24:24,005 --> 00:24:25,645 the training on, personal wealth. 885 00:24:25,795 --> 00:24:25,885 Mm-hmm. 886 00:24:26,125 --> 00:24:27,145 Uh, and that's part of it be coming 887 00:24:27,145 --> 00:24:28,285 from investment being as well. 888 00:24:28,285 --> 00:24:29,575 when you're in a pass through entity, 889 00:24:29,575 --> 00:24:31,525 when you're an S corp. When you're an LLC. 890 00:24:31,810 --> 00:24:33,010 The opportunities of how 891 00:24:33,010 --> 00:24:34,120 to compensate yourself. 892 00:24:34,120 --> 00:24:34,210 Mm-hmm. 893 00:24:34,210 --> 00:24:35,950 And what your world are look very 894 00:24:35,950 --> 00:24:37,840 different than when you have an investor 895 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:39,520 who said you take a salary mm-hmm. 896 00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:40,150 And you're gonna work 897 00:24:40,150 --> 00:24:40,870 for a long time mm-hmm. 898 00:24:41,110 --> 00:24:42,130 Until you get paid out. 899 00:24:42,265 --> 00:24:43,735 I think the piece of like, 900 00:24:43,825 --> 00:24:46,345 especially in the flux of the current 901 00:24:46,345 --> 00:24:49,594 administration, I. How can we not be 902 00:24:49,594 --> 00:24:51,844 afraid and operate in a smart way? 903 00:24:51,844 --> 00:24:53,614 And that additional piece of, 904 00:24:53,644 --> 00:24:54,934 you know, your responsibilities 905 00:24:54,934 --> 00:24:55,744 as a business owner mm-hmm. 906 00:24:55,984 --> 00:24:57,634 But also your opportunities. 907 00:24:57,844 --> 00:24:59,130 That's a new layer. 908 00:24:59,130 --> 00:25:01,197 I think that's really, more people are 909 00:25:01,197 --> 00:25:03,507 asking about in our operating work. 910 00:25:03,822 --> 00:25:06,085 Ah, well, I will say I'm going 911 00:25:06,085 --> 00:25:07,525 through that right now, so that 912 00:25:08,605 --> 00:25:10,549 is definitely hitting home for me. 913 00:25:10,575 --> 00:25:11,865 So, very interesting. 914 00:25:11,865 --> 00:25:12,825 Thank you for sharing that. 915 00:25:12,985 --> 00:25:14,575 And you answered my last question, 916 00:25:14,575 --> 00:25:16,862 which is first steps for people to get 917 00:25:16,862 --> 00:25:18,572 going on this journey, but signing up 918 00:25:18,572 --> 00:25:20,745 for your newsletter and getting access 919 00:25:20,745 --> 00:25:23,342 to, all of the, generous information 920 00:25:23,342 --> 00:25:25,875 that you share, I think is fantastic. 921 00:25:26,085 --> 00:25:27,495 We'll make sure we have links 922 00:25:27,495 --> 00:25:29,530 to everything in the show notes. 923 00:25:30,069 --> 00:25:31,659 Where else can people find you, Jill? 924 00:25:31,955 --> 00:25:33,875 So my website is the Jill James. 925 00:25:33,935 --> 00:25:35,239 If, you wanna join the newsletter, 926 00:25:35,239 --> 00:25:37,639 it's the jill james.com/newsletter. 927 00:25:37,689 --> 00:25:39,549 I also have a booking link on my website. 928 00:25:39,725 --> 00:25:41,105 I know people are a little hesitant 929 00:25:41,105 --> 00:25:42,275 to use it, but I'll talk to 930 00:25:42,275 --> 00:25:43,926 anybody for 20 minutes and mm-hmm. 931 00:25:43,931 --> 00:25:45,005 And brainstorm with you. 932 00:25:45,005 --> 00:25:46,662 So, you know, feel welcome to use 933 00:25:46,662 --> 00:25:48,072 that if you know you've heard some 934 00:25:48,072 --> 00:25:49,632 things here that you wanna talk about. 935 00:25:49,735 --> 00:25:52,375 I'm on LinkedIn Threads Blue Sky. 936 00:25:52,375 --> 00:25:52,435 Hmm. 937 00:25:52,634 --> 00:25:55,134 And Instagram, as, the Jill James. 938 00:25:55,194 --> 00:25:55,284 Mm-hmm. 939 00:25:55,404 --> 00:25:56,544 the company is, and then my 940 00:25:56,544 --> 00:25:58,704 personal LinkedIn is Jill d James. 941 00:25:59,004 --> 00:26:00,444 I'm curious about your use 942 00:26:00,444 --> 00:26:03,374 of Instagram for what you do. 943 00:26:03,404 --> 00:26:04,426 Like, do you find your 944 00:26:04,426 --> 00:26:05,476 clients there or have? 945 00:26:05,476 --> 00:26:06,286 Do you use Instagram? 946 00:26:06,616 --> 00:26:07,906 Instagram for me is more of 947 00:26:07,906 --> 00:26:09,541 a credibility, uh mm-hmm. 948 00:26:09,681 --> 00:26:12,056 Step, I talk to a lot of people of like. 949 00:26:12,253 --> 00:26:13,483 Various ages. 950 00:26:13,543 --> 00:26:13,753 Mm-hmm. 951 00:26:13,759 --> 00:26:13,968 Right. 952 00:26:14,113 --> 00:26:17,653 And one of their checks for, especially 953 00:26:17,653 --> 00:26:19,633 for some of the more creator driven 954 00:26:19,633 --> 00:26:21,373 businesses that I work with, is 955 00:26:21,373 --> 00:26:23,173 they go to my Instagram page first. 956 00:26:23,386 --> 00:26:23,473 Mm-hmm. 957 00:26:23,479 --> 00:26:23,528 Mm-hmm. 958 00:26:23,608 --> 00:26:24,883 And they wanna see that I'm legit. 959 00:26:24,913 --> 00:26:25,003 Mm-hmm. 960 00:26:25,063 --> 00:26:26,653 And that I've made an effort. 961 00:26:26,996 --> 00:26:29,126 So we don't do a lot of original content. 962 00:26:29,126 --> 00:26:30,836 Like we repurpose a lot of the newsletter 963 00:26:30,866 --> 00:26:32,666 content and just repackage it, with 964 00:26:32,666 --> 00:26:34,466 graphics for Instagram, or I'll make 965 00:26:34,466 --> 00:26:36,506 short videos, or we'll take an a MA clip. 966 00:26:36,636 --> 00:26:38,286 but it is an important. 967 00:26:38,511 --> 00:26:39,351 Credibility. 968 00:26:39,351 --> 00:26:40,526 I treat it like a billboard. 969 00:26:40,526 --> 00:26:40,846 Mm-hmm. 970 00:26:40,926 --> 00:26:42,501 Like it's a live billboard for me. 971 00:26:42,621 --> 00:26:42,711 Mm-hmm. 972 00:26:43,071 --> 00:26:44,421 Of when you pass by. 973 00:26:44,751 --> 00:26:46,161 Is there something useful there 974 00:26:46,221 --> 00:26:47,931 and do you know how to contact me? 975 00:26:48,111 --> 00:26:49,011 So that's really, that's 976 00:26:49,011 --> 00:26:50,271 the role for Instagram. 977 00:26:50,321 --> 00:26:52,151 you're right, it's not driving mm-hmm. 978 00:26:52,211 --> 00:26:53,651 Business directly. 979 00:26:53,651 --> 00:26:55,841 But I do hear a lot of people say, 980 00:26:55,986 --> 00:26:57,458 Hey, you know what, I really, I 981 00:26:57,458 --> 00:26:59,138 found you because you put something 982 00:26:59,138 --> 00:27:00,458 interesting on Instagram and 983 00:27:00,458 --> 00:27:01,778 I wanted know more about that. 984 00:27:02,263 --> 00:27:03,763 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 985 00:27:03,763 --> 00:27:05,953 That is why I haven't used, what could 986 00:27:05,953 --> 00:27:08,110 I do, that would be catchy enough 987 00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:09,850 for Instagram, which I feel like 988 00:27:09,940 --> 00:27:11,290 needs like kind of another level of 989 00:27:11,290 --> 00:27:14,453 creativity than say LinkedIn and so 990 00:27:14,513 --> 00:27:16,013 yeah, I've been thinking about that one. 991 00:27:16,250 --> 00:27:17,579 And then, do you use TikTok or. 992 00:27:18,268 --> 00:27:19,588 I don't use TikTok. 993 00:27:19,638 --> 00:27:21,678 I have all the security concerns about 994 00:27:21,678 --> 00:27:23,328 that and I have from the beginning. 995 00:27:23,408 --> 00:27:24,998 so yes, I've had many people over 996 00:27:24,998 --> 00:27:26,408 the years say, Hey, this is new. 997 00:27:26,408 --> 00:27:28,388 You could be the blank of TikTok. 998 00:27:28,553 --> 00:27:29,648 And I was just, you know, 999 00:27:29,648 --> 00:27:30,518 I've had things like that. 1000 00:27:30,518 --> 00:27:31,808 I've, my business has not been 1001 00:27:31,808 --> 00:27:33,488 on Facebook and we've been off. 1002 00:27:33,883 --> 00:27:36,133 What X since 2017. 1003 00:27:36,433 --> 00:27:36,523 Mm-hmm. 1004 00:27:36,763 --> 00:27:36,823 Yeah. 1005 00:27:36,823 --> 00:27:38,293 And I think this is part of, you 1006 00:27:38,293 --> 00:27:40,273 know, my centering principles is if 1007 00:27:40,273 --> 00:27:42,253 the only way my business can make it 1008 00:27:42,253 --> 00:27:44,203 is by being on platforms that I don't 1009 00:27:44,203 --> 00:27:46,663 wanna be on, then I'm okay if I fail. 1010 00:27:46,993 --> 00:27:47,233 Hmm. 1011 00:27:47,503 --> 00:27:48,403 That's a great way to look at it. 1012 00:27:48,403 --> 00:27:48,583 Yeah. 1013 00:27:48,826 --> 00:27:49,846 Well, this has been a 1014 00:27:49,846 --> 00:27:50,956 wonderful conversation. 1015 00:27:50,956 --> 00:27:52,636 Thank you so much, Jill, for generously 1016 00:27:52,636 --> 00:27:55,426 sharing your wisdom with the audience. 1017 00:27:55,656 --> 00:27:57,666 And, to everyone, please, make 1018 00:27:57,666 --> 00:27:59,396 sure you get on Jill's, email 1019 00:27:59,456 --> 00:28:01,000 newsletter list and, 'cause. 1020 00:28:01,610 --> 00:28:02,720 Of information shared. 1021 00:28:02,913 --> 00:28:04,563 And thank you again. 1022 00:28:04,783 --> 00:28:06,343 yeah, hopefully we'll do it again soon. 1023 00:28:06,523 --> 00:28:07,153 Thank you, Erin. 1024 00:28:07,153 --> 00:28:07,753 I would love that. 1025 00:28:07,753 --> 00:28:08,623 Thanks for having me. 1026 00:28:08,623 --> 00:28:08,653 I.