Speaker: 00:00:02

Hi, I'm Leila Ainge, psychologist and researcher.

00:00:06,714 --> 00:00:17,269

Welcome back to Psychologically Speaking, a podcast all about human behavior, bringing

together fascinating research, insights and real life experiences.

00:00:17,269 --> 00:00:26,892

This season, we're exploring goals with guests and we'll be following them into the new

year to see how their beliefs, behaviors and actions shape those intentions.

00:00:31,522 --> 00:00:35,584

I'm very excited to introduce our next guest, Dani Johnston.

00:00:35,584 --> 00:00:42,035

Dani is a data and an AI consultant, but she also owns a documentary production company.

00:00:42,035 --> 00:00:46,026

I can't wait to hear all about Dani's goal for 2026.

00:00:46,026 --> 00:00:48,826

Dani, welcome to Psychologically Speaking.

00:00:49,272 --> 00:00:51,944

It's so good to have you here.

00:00:51,944 --> 00:01:04,962

Dany tell me a little bit about the work that you do and in terms of where your goals are

going to be set, what's most important for our listeners to understand about your work

00:01:04,962 --> 00:01:06,824

life and where your goals are sitting.

00:01:06,824 --> 00:01:24,320

m Okay, so m I do have a uh Masters in Documentary and I am doing a PhD in m Human Rights

and Data Privacy and they sound like they're completely polar opposite things m but

00:01:24,320 --> 00:01:32,213

basically in life documentaries aren't really going to pay the bills for you so I have

00:01:32,524 --> 00:01:41,046

two and a half decades of working in business transformation, delivering multi-million

pound international programmes of work.

00:01:41,046 --> 00:01:43,858

And I moved into the data and AI space.

00:01:43,858 --> 00:01:47,960

the PhD joins those two things together.

00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:55,091

I started my production company eight years ago and it's just been slowly building.

00:01:55,091 --> 00:01:57,985

But the consultancy allows

00:01:57,985 --> 00:02:01,228

me to feed money into into the film production.

00:02:01,228 --> 00:02:20,498

The PhD is the intention is to produce a film as well as the right up for the PhD um to

try and educate lay people on how the advent of you data harvesting and AI development is

00:02:20,498 --> 00:02:23,289

impacting their human rights.

00:02:23,590 --> 00:02:26,892

So yeah it sounds like I do

00:02:26,892 --> 00:02:43,352

completely different things which I kind of do but I'm trying to bring them together so my

goals for 2026 are to move myself a little bit more just edge a little bit more to the the

00:02:43,352 --> 00:02:49,805

end state which is to be hopefully one day a full-time documentary filmmaker

00:02:50,657 --> 00:02:54,931

I just think the work that you do is amazingly interesting.

00:02:54,931 --> 00:03:05,201

I mean, to look at human rights, I think this is such a hot topic for lots of our

listeners at the moment, especially for people who freelance like we do or contract.

00:03:05,201 --> 00:03:08,044

You know, there's a lot of concern that...

00:03:08,044 --> 00:03:16,491

AI is eroding, jobs and capabilities in the marketplace and that's a scary place to be for

some people.

00:03:16,491 --> 00:03:20,734

And then the fact that you're doing a PhD, which is delving into the human rights of it.

00:03:20,734 --> 00:03:25,569

What was it that drew you to researching that as a PhD?

00:03:25,569 --> 00:03:41,655

I think that my exposure as a consultant, you know, I've worked with teams in the IT

space, teams in the business space, cyber security, and you you hear these stories, you

00:03:41,655 --> 00:03:48,457

hear the developments, and em it was just becoming more evident that...

00:03:48,788 --> 00:03:54,331

We weren't thinking about it in terms of how we're developing society.

00:03:56,252 --> 00:04:03,896

It's human nature, we're constantly striving, aren't we, to build the next shiny thing and

to do the next interesting thing.

00:04:03,896 --> 00:04:15,443

Developers, academics, policymakers, they're constantly trying to em challenge and strive

for bigger and bolder and better.

00:04:15,443 --> 00:04:17,855

But actually, you know,

00:04:17,855 --> 00:04:30,383

if you think about the concept of constructionism and sociology, and I will absolutely

destroy this by the way, I'm not a sociologist, but it's the idea that, you know...

00:04:30,383 --> 00:04:36,354

the environment that you're in helps construct society as we develop.

00:04:36,354 --> 00:04:50,609

And we're creating technology without considering, well, okay, that's great, for 12 months

you'll get this benefit in kind of financial benefit, this return on investment, this

00:04:50,609 --> 00:04:57,142

return for shareholders, but actually how does that turn into a contract?

00:04:57,142 --> 00:05:14,232

for how we live as human beings and what impact is that having on the next generation it

can be frightening the way AI data is being manipulated.

00:05:14,481 --> 00:05:23,228

m for ends that don't serve society to manipulate us to gain money basically.

00:05:23,529 --> 00:05:33,325

So it just fascinated me and the idea that I could then also have a conversation about

well how do we engage

00:05:33,637 --> 00:05:45,475

the general population in this conversation because I mean I do it myself you get to the

cookies section and you go for the love of seriously and you just click pass or whatever

00:05:45,556 --> 00:05:58,786

and even if you say no to a lot of these things no don't share my data there's no real

trust there is there you know you're like well will this tech giant actually honor that em

00:05:58,786 --> 00:05:59,668

or will it be

00:05:59,668 --> 00:06:02,720

honoured to a point where they think they can't get caught.

00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:11,627

Like, I mean, and that's not being unfair, that's just, again, human nature, there is

always going to be the negative side to the positive.

00:06:11,627 --> 00:06:20,653

em So, through documentary, I wanted to explore, can we take quite a complex...

00:06:21,105 --> 00:06:24,958

What is quite dry and boring to most people.

00:06:24,958 --> 00:06:26,289

I get excited about data.

00:06:26,289 --> 00:06:28,580

I do not expect other people to.

00:06:29,322 --> 00:06:36,467

But how can we put that in an engaging and interesting way to get other people into the

conversation?

00:06:36,467 --> 00:06:45,194

Because, you know, as I said, the developer community, the investors, the tech builders

are very small.

00:06:45,265 --> 00:06:57,505

community and then policymakers tend to be reactive to what's already been done and we've

got the other 99 percent like what do they want to say about how the world is developing

00:06:57,505 --> 00:07:04,139

and and how that's going to impact their family and their future and and their their

legacy basically.

00:07:04,930 --> 00:07:14,867

it's such an interesting point that you make there technology was always seen as an

enabler for the context we're already in.

00:07:14,867 --> 00:07:22,121

But the cyber-psychology world, and certainly your world, and that sociological lens, is

saying no.

00:07:22,121 --> 00:07:34,529

technology creates or is constructing the next context and I don't think I've ever really

sat and thought about it that way what excites me about people like you is that you're

00:07:34,529 --> 00:07:37,660

very clearly passionate about data and so am I.

00:07:37,660 --> 00:07:40,161

I wouldn't be a scientist otherwise but

00:07:40,805 --> 00:07:53,843

you bring this creative lens and space to the work that you're doing and I'm really

fascinated then around why did you get into documentary making where does that come from?

00:07:53,843 --> 00:07:56,664

I first went to university to do animation.

00:07:57,246 --> 00:07:59,699

I went on to actually do a degree in...

00:07:59,699 --> 00:08:16,089

archaeology and classics because I felt like the animation wasn't scratching enough of an

academic itch for me and I just grew up, my mum always had um so many books around history

00:08:16,089 --> 00:08:25,415

and ancient history and she was always an avid reader of mythology and things like that.

00:08:25,446 --> 00:08:27,662

So I thought, well, that might be interesting.

00:08:27,662 --> 00:08:33,566

And I also came from a very Catholic family and that wasn't where my...

00:08:33,566 --> 00:08:35,141

00:08:35,141 --> 00:08:40,759

where I was leaning in terms of how I was m viewing the world.

00:08:40,759 --> 00:08:42,922

And I kind of wanted to understand.

00:08:43,414 --> 00:08:56,354

where they were coming from a little bit so I actually did biblical archaeology because

you know that's not random and and so I got to 40 and I thought you know I've been doing

00:08:56,354 --> 00:09:11,714

IT for the last 20 years and whilst I love doing it well not necessarily IT it was program

management and business transformation but usually in an IT space and I thought you know I

00:09:11,714 --> 00:09:13,721

love it but is this

00:09:13,721 --> 00:09:20,263

I want to do for another 25 years if I'm lucky to be able to retire then.

00:09:21,544 --> 00:09:26,377

So I did the documentary masters because when I...

00:09:26,377 --> 00:09:30,009

um so I'm neurodivergent.

00:09:30,009 --> 00:09:36,951

I have ADHD, I didn't discover that till 45 but it explains my absolute love for lists

apparently.

00:09:37,752 --> 00:09:45,666

So I wrote myself a list of all the things that I really enjoyed and all the things that

kind of bored me and didn't shine a light for me.

00:09:45,666 --> 00:09:46,938

And...

00:09:47,490 --> 00:09:54,235

What I realised was the reason why the animation and the archaeology and classics, it was

the storytelling.

00:09:54,235 --> 00:09:57,536

I'd always written poetry, I'd always written short stories.

00:09:57,697 --> 00:10:08,212

So the documentary kind of fitted, because it gave me the academic lens to be able to

hyper-focus and research a topic, but also then tell a story and do something creative

00:10:08,212 --> 00:10:09,233

with it.

00:10:09,613 --> 00:10:12,194

So I absolutely loved that.

00:10:12,254 --> 00:10:14,215

And I think that...

00:10:14,406 --> 00:10:20,090

That is kind of where I want to get to where I'm doing that full time.

00:10:20,090 --> 00:10:31,159

But again, you have to pay the bills and I'm very, very fortunate that I'm able to find

work so I don't take that lightly.

00:10:32,033 --> 00:10:44,003

I think what I'm intrigued in then is where your big goal for 2026 is sitting what's the

output of this goal for you in 2026 around the documentary make?

00:10:44,003 --> 00:10:45,004

So I have two.

00:10:45,004 --> 00:10:56,474

em So one of them is very much uh leaning on the uh PhD and the academic side and the

other one is about the documentary making.

00:10:58,256 --> 00:11:08,676

My um limitation is that em I have an abject fear of judgment.

00:11:08,838 --> 00:11:11,779

And that's why I like to be behind the camera, not in front of it.

00:11:12,880 --> 00:11:25,507

And so if I give you an example, just before COVID, I was in New York for three weeks

filming for a series of short films.

00:11:25,507 --> 00:11:27,159

They still sit on my hard drive.

00:11:27,159 --> 00:11:28,251

I never released them.

00:11:28,251 --> 00:11:32,373

and so I have to learn how to get out of my own head.

00:11:32,373 --> 00:11:42,179

um the kind of big goal for me is about not just producing the work but actually releasing

the work.

00:11:42,179 --> 00:11:52,984

So by the end of the year I have to put myself out there for the exposure because

everything I've done that has had exposure up until now has been for someone else, it's

00:11:52,984 --> 00:11:57,946

been for charitable groups and things like that, whereas this one has to

100

00:11:57,946 --> 00:12:04,809

be for me and it has to be about me creating something and that I am prepared to let the

world see as well.

101

00:12:06,500 --> 00:12:12,293

it's interesting that you use that that kind of phrase, something I'm prepared to let the

world see.

102

00:12:13,250 --> 00:12:19,497

A sense there that it's you that is holding yourself back for that fear of external

judgment.

103

00:12:19,497 --> 00:12:22,050

And that's something that we've spoken to offline

104

00:12:22,050 --> 00:12:30,432

So how are you thinking that you want to build the goal up and what will the goal result

in?

105

00:12:30,432 --> 00:12:33,094

How will you know you've achieved this?

106

00:12:33,225 --> 00:12:39,409

So I'll now have achieved it when I have submitted it to the festival circuit.

107

00:12:39,409 --> 00:12:49,795

there are a multitude of festivals that m take documentary content and I need to have

those submissions in by the end of the year.

108

00:12:49,795 --> 00:12:54,097

The creation of the piece is less...

109

00:12:55,409 --> 00:13:12,265

difficult for me, so not to say it isn't a massive amount of work, what is my measure of

success, my measure of success is that it's released for assessment and potentially

110

00:13:12,265 --> 00:13:14,956

acceptance to the festival circuit.

111

00:13:15,608 --> 00:13:20,001

When we talk about the what, is that stuff, the New York stuff?

112

00:13:20,001 --> 00:13:21,231

stuff you've created already?

113

00:13:21,231 --> 00:13:22,493

Or brand new?

114

00:13:22,493 --> 00:13:24,853

I'm gonna go brand new.

115

00:13:25,604 --> 00:13:30,515

I am going to the Arctic Circle in the end of June.

116

00:13:30,515 --> 00:13:34,015

So I am going to film the entire thing.

117

00:13:34,015 --> 00:13:37,926

So there will be 12 people on a boat.

118

00:13:37,926 --> 00:13:40,828

Not people I know, I know two of them.

119

00:13:40,828 --> 00:13:44,339

But yes, so it's a...

120

00:13:44,339 --> 00:13:46,770

I want to give it a fancy name, it's an expedition.

121

00:13:46,770 --> 00:13:48,891

eh It's an adventure.

122

00:13:48,891 --> 00:13:55,734

em And yes, so we're going to go to the Arctic Circle and we're going to sail around.

123

00:13:56,254 --> 00:14:03,108

I guess the other big challenge for me is I'm going to be in front of the camera instead

of behind it for a change.

124

00:14:03,108 --> 00:14:04,755

Why the Arctic Circle?

125

00:14:04,755 --> 00:14:06,514

Why couldn't you just go up the road?

126

00:14:06,514 --> 00:14:09,367

Oh god why not the Arctic Circle?

127

00:14:09,367 --> 00:14:14,042

It's been on my bucket list for years.

128

00:14:14,042 --> 00:14:24,913

I love to travel, I love to travel and I love boats, I love the idea of doing something

that is not...

129

00:14:25,765 --> 00:14:31,597

I'm not great at sitting on a beach and having a holiday that is about relaxing.

130

00:14:31,597 --> 00:14:33,347

It's never worked for me.

131

00:14:34,027 --> 00:14:42,512

So whenever I travel, I tend to go to slightly more off the main street kind of places

132

00:14:42,512 --> 00:14:46,536

and the Arctic Circle just feels like just the next level on that.

133

00:14:46,536 --> 00:14:52,731

It's yeah how many people are saying that they've been to the Arctic Circle so yeah why

not?

134

00:14:52,930 --> 00:14:53,971

Not many.

135

00:14:53,971 --> 00:14:57,626

And you have my vote in terms of doing big and bold things.

136

00:14:57,626 --> 00:15:04,163

So you're going to the Arctic Circle, you're going to put yourself in front of the camera,

you're going to produce a documentary.

137

00:15:04,163 --> 00:15:07,796

Is that documentary then linked to human rights and use of AI?

138

00:15:07,796 --> 00:15:09,532

Okay.

139

00:15:09,532 --> 00:15:25,455

I have taken your advice, Leila em So I am trying to rethink about how I frame things and

the internal voice that keeps holding me back.

140

00:15:25,455 --> 00:15:26,746

So.

141

00:15:27,583 --> 00:15:40,634

I'm thinking whilst we are talking about the end goal, what is the measure of success, I'm

going to try and reframe this as just absolutely the love of the journey, right?

142

00:15:40,634 --> 00:15:49,405

And every step is just about experiencing that particular moment and the film will make

itself and then I need to worry about submitting it.

143

00:15:49,405 --> 00:15:53,187

So, know, yeah, I mean...

144

00:15:53,187 --> 00:15:58,988

I mean I've forgotten the question because I just got lost then in the whole idea of the

trip.

145

00:15:58,988 --> 00:15:59,733

146

00:15:59,733 --> 00:16:03,355

was asking what ultimately is this going to be about human rights?

147

00:16:03,355 --> 00:16:06,438

And you're saying, no, I'm making this easier.

148

00:16:06,438 --> 00:16:10,761

It's already going to be a project, isn't it?

149

00:16:10,761 --> 00:16:22,131

Going on this expedition, this adventure, putting yourself in that exposure place of being

in front of the camera and then committing to submitting this to the festival circuit.

150

00:16:22,131 --> 00:16:23,011

That's the goal.

151

00:16:23,011 --> 00:16:26,575

So it doesn't really matter about the content and actually taking that pressure off

yourself.

152

00:16:26,575 --> 00:16:34,646

is a really compassionate thing to do, When you're already pushing yourself out of that

comfort zone and sailing across the sea to do it.

153

00:16:34,646 --> 00:16:35,627

it sounds amazing.

154

00:16:35,627 --> 00:16:46,658

It's such an exciting and different thing Tell me, what do you envisage is going to be the

easiest thing about this goal?

155

00:16:46,658 --> 00:16:49,257

The easiest thing, gosh.

156

00:16:52,758 --> 00:17:03,633

I guess the run up to the trip is probably the easiest thing because I do well in terms of

I just focus on, you know, I've got to this thing done, you know.

157

00:17:04,365 --> 00:17:07,366

the planning of it and the execution.

158

00:17:08,107 --> 00:17:12,898

I think the filming of it will be more difficult for me because I'll be uncomfortable.

159

00:17:12,898 --> 00:17:15,729

I appreciate that.

160

00:17:15,769 --> 00:17:23,732

The editing, mean, editing isn't easy, but I enjoy it, so that's fine.

161

00:17:24,933 --> 00:17:26,313

So yeah, mean...

162

00:17:26,504 --> 00:17:31,968

Yeah, I guess that I guess it's the run-up to it is the is the easier part for me

personally

163

00:17:31,968 --> 00:17:40,252

So that helps then doesn't it to think in terms of where you may want to scaffold some

support around your project.

164

00:17:40,252 --> 00:17:51,115

So if we're saying that the run up to it and getting there is you're going to be running

on positive energy, then it's thinking about what scaffolding you've got in place for when

165

00:17:51,115 --> 00:17:51,875

you are there.

166

00:17:51,875 --> 00:17:54,966

And you mentioned that there's two people on the boat that you already know.

167

00:17:54,966 --> 00:17:59,299

So who have you managed to put around you as that support system?

168

00:17:59,299 --> 00:18:01,884

So I have roped two friends in.

169

00:18:01,884 --> 00:18:07,273

um One of them, she travels with me all the time.

170

00:18:07,273 --> 00:18:07,886

Mm-hmm.

171

00:18:07,886 --> 00:18:11,568

So we're very comfortable in each other's company.

172

00:18:11,568 --> 00:18:15,989

You know, we are used to each other's idiosyncrasies.

173

00:18:16,290 --> 00:18:25,464

The other friend has never traveled with either of us, uh but he is coming purely from the

perspective of holding the camera.

174

00:18:26,805 --> 00:18:37,750

and the beauty of his company is that he is an extremely enthusiastic, open person who

would be like, you need to suck it up and

175

00:18:37,750 --> 00:18:38,864

get out of your own head.

176

00:18:38,864 --> 00:18:54,061

like get on with it so so he's gonna be I think he's gonna be great company on the trip em

and yeah there's six months running up to it and we're doing training so to get him really

177

00:18:54,061 --> 00:19:02,897

comfortable with the camera equipment and everything else and and I guess that there'll

still also be some kind of fitness

178

00:19:02,897 --> 00:19:06,678

training because there's a level of fitness that we have to be able to to meet.

179

00:19:06,678 --> 00:19:10,320

um So yeah I mean...

180

00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:22,103

So this expedition then, so in my head, you're going on a boat to the Arctic Circle, but

what you're really describing is it's gonna be quite a physical, intense time.

181

00:19:22,103 --> 00:19:31,062

So potentially change in lighting, sleep habits, eating habits, physical exertion.

182

00:19:31,171 --> 00:19:32,021

Yeah.

183

00:19:32,462 --> 00:19:35,786

But you see, you see, I think that's the joy of it, right?

184

00:19:35,786 --> 00:19:41,511

Because, the idea that I'd had was, I was going to go on this trip anyway.

185

00:19:41,511 --> 00:19:46,098

m And I thought, you know what?

186

00:19:46,098 --> 00:19:48,320

I'm 50 in February.

187

00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:49,461

That's why we're going on the trip.

188

00:19:49,461 --> 00:19:50,813

189

00:19:50,813 --> 00:19:58,175

We, as women, know, I'm sure men experience this too, but as a general rule, I see this,

right?

190

00:19:58,175 --> 00:20:02,837

As women, as we age, we get somewhat discredited.

191

00:20:02,837 --> 00:20:17,419

So it's a, well, you've kind of lost your societal value in that you are now not going to

produce children or you're not as pretty or, and I'm sure, like, please, like, hashtag not

192

00:20:17,419 --> 00:20:17,859

all men.

193

00:20:17,859 --> 00:20:19,839

I completely get that.

194

00:20:19,992 --> 00:20:22,985

But there is an element of that goes on.

195

00:20:22,985 --> 00:20:35,373

So what I wanted to do, I kind of was thinking about it and I thought, wouldn't it be nice

to actually film all of this and create something quite beautiful because of the backdrop,

196

00:20:35,373 --> 00:20:38,215

you know, the scenery and everything else.

197

00:20:38,215 --> 00:20:46,882

But to capture that, number one, the chaos because I can be chaotic at the best of times,

but this kind of...

198

00:20:46,882 --> 00:20:48,730

this embracing the...

199

00:20:48,730 --> 00:21:04,158

life isn't over, know, so what 50 and I've got my friends and I've got my beautiful kids

as well but I've got my friendship group, I've got these adventures that I can still go on

200

00:21:04,278 --> 00:21:12,622

and if that inspires even one other person to go on an adventure, like how fab would that

be?

201

00:21:12,622 --> 00:21:17,604

So I thought, right, okay, I'm gonna film it and yeah.

202

00:21:18,398 --> 00:21:32,480

and I'm going to look at it as rather than a film to preach uh an idea, know, a lot of the

films because they're human rights based, you're not preaching but you're trying to teach

203

00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:33,792

constantly.

204

00:21:33,792 --> 00:21:43,050

Whereas this isn't, I'm not trying to teach anyone anything, I'm not trying to convince

anyone of anything, I'm just trying to show people how...

205

00:21:43,081 --> 00:21:51,353

joyous life can be and what adventures we can still go on and do something that's a piece

of art, hopefully.

206

00:21:51,353 --> 00:21:52,105

Hopefully.

207

00:21:52,105 --> 00:21:54,158

It sounds amazing.

208

00:21:54,158 --> 00:21:56,551

love the idea and the thinking that's gone into this.

209

00:21:56,551 --> 00:22:02,790

I'm interested because I know that we've spoken a little bit this year about exposure.

210

00:22:02,790 --> 00:22:08,884

Do you think this is something that you would have attempted at the beginning of this year

in 2025?

211

00:22:09,336 --> 00:22:12,128

So what has shifted for you?

212

00:22:12,128 --> 00:22:20,606

Because if anyone was to say to me, think about the most exposing thing that you could do,

this would be it.

213

00:22:20,606 --> 00:22:32,607

I think you really have gone for that extreme goal which is going to push you right out of

your comfort zone and potentially, you know, out of other people's comfort zones as well,

214

00:22:32,607 --> 00:22:33,698

your lucky friends.

215

00:22:33,698 --> 00:22:35,312

But what shifted?

216

00:22:35,312 --> 00:22:48,435

em I think that, you know, I've actively tried to source therapy, coaching, know, those

kind of things.

217

00:22:48,435 --> 00:22:54,741

Obviously, we've worked together and you've helped massively and I do appreciate that.

218

00:22:54,741 --> 00:22:59,405

I think that there's also an element of I'm 50 next year and...

219

00:22:59,405 --> 00:23:00,597

220

00:23:00,597 --> 00:23:04,393

I have friends who didn't get out of their twenties.

221

00:23:04,393 --> 00:23:13,195

So, you know, how fortunate I am to have a beautiful life, you know, a lovely home that,

you know...

222

00:23:14,274 --> 00:23:28,777

beautiful children, a crazy dog, know a career and these opportunities to do creative

things and then for me to hold myself back like that it's just insane so at the start of

223

00:23:28,777 --> 00:23:40,065

this year my intention was I I know the only person holding me back right now is me so I

have to get out of my own head so there is that

224

00:23:40,065 --> 00:23:55,305

conscious work and it's something that you have to do every single day you don't just go

oh that's the fix and now I you know all done and off I go and live my best life every day

225

00:23:55,305 --> 00:24:05,116

you've got to go right okay well yesterday I wasn't great at that okay well we'll just

it's a fresh day start again try again and just keep doing that and keep doing that and

226

00:24:05,116 --> 00:24:20,519

So yeah, I mean, it's a journey that I know that I'm constantly gonna be battling against

myself to an extent, but I have to and how selfish would it be?

227

00:24:20,519 --> 00:24:21,384

228

00:24:21,384 --> 00:24:38,030

to waste what I've been so fortunate to have been given if nothing else in my life the

fact that I'm still here after 50 years like so many people don't get that like so so why

229

00:24:38,030 --> 00:24:40,286

waste it why waste it

230

00:24:40,286 --> 00:24:42,317

interesting way of framing it.

231

00:24:42,378 --> 00:24:47,342

I think you're going to really get on with another guest of mine, Emma Thomas.

232

00:24:47,342 --> 00:24:52,086

She hosts a podcast all about this messy middle of life.

233

00:24:52,428 --> 00:24:55,102

she set her goal with me this morning on the podcast.

234

00:24:55,102 --> 00:24:57,115

So we know what's gonna be easy.

235

00:24:57,115 --> 00:25:01,407

let's talk about then what is going to be challenging.

236

00:25:01,407 --> 00:25:07,581

And I know nothing about documentary making, but say when I'm looking to do a podcast, for

example.

237

00:25:07,581 --> 00:25:16,127

I have to have a bit of a rough idea about what I'm going to do, like a storyboard is that

something that you then have to do before you get to the Arctic Circle?

238

00:25:16,127 --> 00:25:19,388

how does that work if you don't know what you're going to expect when you get there?

239

00:25:19,439 --> 00:25:35,172

Yeah, definitely also my comfort zone on this in the sense of I don't think there's very

much I can prepare for other than, you know, we can prepare for the kinds of equipment

240

00:25:35,172 --> 00:25:45,839

we're going to use and the kind of environment that we think we're going to be exposed to

and therefore, you know, how do we adapt, how, say we record sound.

241

00:25:45,839 --> 00:25:47,691

242

00:25:47,691 --> 00:25:50,542

So there's a lot of prep in that.

243

00:25:50,542 --> 00:26:06,373

I think that there's an element of we're going to Svalbard two days before the boat leaves

and we're staying for two days after so that we can do a lot of panoramic shooting, a lot

244

00:26:06,373 --> 00:26:08,085

of kind of B-roll stuff.

245

00:26:08,085 --> 00:26:21,180

we can prep that but once we're on the boat I pretty much know day one they're gonna teach

us to sail if we want to learn to sail, day two they're gonna teach us to see fish maybe

246

00:26:21,180 --> 00:26:33,170

we can catch dinner em and then they have a rough itinerary of where they want to get to

em but it is so dependent on weather em

247

00:26:33,170 --> 00:26:48,364

the environment around us and the world and nature is unpredictable so you have to kind of

respond on the fly a little bit so we'll be as prepared as we can be em and I'll probably

248

00:26:48,364 --> 00:27:00,143

have more equipment than I need than is necessary em but yeah it's definitely out of my

comfort zone it's not something I've filmed before so

249

00:27:00,390 --> 00:27:04,711

But listening to you speak there, sounds like you've thought about some of these things.

250

00:27:05,213 --> 00:27:14,495

when we talk about goal, achievement and setting and motivation, we talk about these three

ideas of autonomy, competence and relatedness.

251

00:27:14,495 --> 00:27:21,927

So you've got the autonomy to be able to go and do this and to follow that expedition,

that adventure.

252

00:27:21,927 --> 00:27:25,278

You know, that's something that you're tying into your 50th year.

253

00:27:25,278 --> 00:27:27,531

You've got the competence.

254

00:27:27,531 --> 00:27:33,774

so that you're training somebody else up in being able to support you so you're not just

doing all of this on your own.

255

00:27:33,774 --> 00:27:45,618

And the relatedness is you're taking some familiarity with you, so you've got a traveling

companion who you're very comfortable with, and that feels really sensible and very savvy

256

00:27:45,618 --> 00:27:51,141

given that you're going to be in an uncomfortable space yourself for moments of this trip.

257

00:27:51,141 --> 00:27:55,602

So I love the way that you've thought this goal through.

258

00:27:56,775 --> 00:27:59,058

is your goal starting right now?

259

00:27:59,058 --> 00:28:01,431

or are you waiting for the 1st of January?

260

00:28:01,431 --> 00:28:19,586

em So it is starting now and I got in touch with a friend of mine who she runs the

equipment stores at the University and so I've asked her if she could organize some just

261

00:28:19,586 --> 00:28:29,558

some refresher training for me because like I say you know that kind of run-and-gone m

sound is not something that I'm m

262

00:28:29,558 --> 00:28:47,718

particularly strong in so she's very kindly arranging training and just so I can sit down

and as well the equipment changes so my intention is to buy a new Blackmagic 6K camera for

263

00:28:47,718 --> 00:28:52,869

this and whilst I've used it, not, not.

264

00:28:52,869 --> 00:28:56,093

in anger, I've used other cameras.

265

00:28:56,093 --> 00:29:08,106

So just really trying to be very confident in myself in terms of the equipment so that

when em I'm working with my friends and making sure he's confident as well that I'm not

266

00:29:08,106 --> 00:29:10,588

giving him a bum steer on that one.

267

00:29:12,070 --> 00:29:13,492

Teaching him bad habits.

268

00:29:13,492 --> 00:29:14,933

269

00:29:14,945 --> 00:29:20,387

like a lot of this is just you're trying to, I suppose, prep for everything that you can

control right now.

270

00:29:20,387 --> 00:29:22,528

It's such a useful strategy.

271

00:29:22,528 --> 00:29:26,809

So I'll check in with you in the first week in January.

272

00:29:27,030 --> 00:29:33,681

I'll ask you for an update offline and then what you share back I'll do an episode where I

do a roundup of a couple of guests.

273

00:29:33,681 --> 00:29:42,956

But we're also going to bring you on to a recording and we're going to talk about how far

you've got so far, what you're excited about.

274

00:29:42,956 --> 00:29:48,851

Yours will come just before you set off on your big expedition, so it'll be really

interesting to hear how you're getting on.

275

00:29:48,851 --> 00:29:59,813

And then we'll probably catch up with you further into 2026, hopefully after you've been

on the expedition and you can tell us what the documentary has unfolded as.

276

00:29:59,813 --> 00:30:04,458

I'm really intrigued about the storytelling and where that story goes for you.

277

00:30:04,458 --> 00:30:06,551

Yeah, yeah.

278

00:30:06,551 --> 00:30:07,582

So am I.

279

00:30:11,089 --> 00:30:11,750

Who knows?

280

00:30:11,750 --> 00:30:15,045

Like I say, I'm nothing if not a little bit chaotic.

281

00:30:15,045 --> 00:30:18,640

I'm like, squirrel.

282

00:30:20,086 --> 00:30:28,422

You've already identified one action which is you're off to the university to get a

refresher on some of the training equipment.

283

00:30:28,422 --> 00:30:31,437

there any, so I like to think in threes.

284

00:30:31,818 --> 00:30:36,533

Two more actions from you that I can ask you about in that first week in January.

285

00:30:36,533 --> 00:30:51,228

Okay so I've also roped another friend in and he has just he's left IT funnily enough um

and he is now he owns like a fishing

286

00:30:51,380 --> 00:31:04,232

equipment store and he teaches people to fish and he's worked with charities teaching

underprivileged kids how to fish you know so they have another outlet and something like a

287

00:31:04,232 --> 00:31:17,163

hobby and he's an absolutely wonderful human being and so I said to him he got his new

shop um about eight weeks ago I said I've had a genius idea

288

00:31:17,555 --> 00:31:28,088

I said, why don't you teach a group of 40 plus women, not 40 women, aged 40 plus women, to

fish?

289

00:31:28,088 --> 00:31:31,979

And we'll go fishing and we'll drink Prosecco.

290

00:31:31,979 --> 00:31:46,496

and you can use it as promo material because it's out in the cold and around water and

things like that uh and at first he was like god this is going to be chaotic isn't it?

291

00:31:46,496 --> 00:31:56,901

said yes it absolutely is and I said please ask your wife if she wants to come with us and

at first she said no it'll be cold and wet and then she went there's Prosecco okay yes

292

00:31:56,901 --> 00:32:01,453

I'll come too and so there's going to be a group of us but it's another opportunity

293

00:32:01,453 --> 00:32:13,693

to just again it's you know we're around water it's in the cold there'll be some night

shooting and they'll be it'll be a bit chaotic I'm quite sure with my friends and so it's

294

00:32:13,693 --> 00:32:25,593

just like you know keeping that movement and and just a bit of a practice for my other

friends to be able to use the equipment so that's that's gonna be around April so we're

295

00:32:25,593 --> 00:32:26,315

gonna do that one

296

00:32:26,315 --> 00:32:28,879

The only question I've got here is how do I sign up for this?

297

00:32:28,879 --> 00:32:30,463

It sounds amazing!

298

00:32:30,463 --> 00:32:32,141

I will!

299

00:32:32,141 --> 00:32:33,412

so good.

300

00:32:33,412 --> 00:32:34,993

Imagine.

301

00:32:34,993 --> 00:32:36,814

I feel sorry for my friend, right?

302

00:32:36,814 --> 00:32:41,478

Cause he's just the most kind laid back human being.

303

00:32:41,478 --> 00:32:54,398

And then I'm just going to descend on him with like a group of half drunk women that I

don't want to, I've already said to him, I don't want to touch base if it moves.

304

00:32:54,398 --> 00:32:56,139

I don't, that's not happening.

305

00:32:56,139 --> 00:32:57,380

306

00:32:57,380 --> 00:32:58,971

of have to get into that kind of stuff.

307

00:32:58,971 --> 00:33:08,057

Really weirdly, when I was younger, where we grew up, there was a pond near us, and it's

called the fish ponds, obviously, very normal name.

308

00:33:08,057 --> 00:33:10,128

There was a bottom pond and a top pond.

309

00:33:10,128 --> 00:33:17,461

And when you got to about the age of, I don't know, 14 or 15, it was the place to go in

the summer holidays because there was no mobile phones.

310

00:33:17,461 --> 00:33:20,412

And it was the place where the guys hung out.

311

00:33:20,412 --> 00:33:35,420

So probably for about two or three years, summer, I spent most of my spare time in summer

holidays around fish ponds and around people who did fishing.

312

00:33:35,420 --> 00:33:36,751

No, absolutely not.

313

00:33:36,751 --> 00:33:43,174

I was definitely there for distraction and I probably was more of a hindrance than

anything else.

314

00:33:43,174 --> 00:33:47,092

But the idea of trying a new skill is always a good idea.

315

00:33:47,092 --> 00:33:52,518

I am under no illusion I will be a hindrance on these filming events.

316

00:33:52,518 --> 00:34:07,289

Okay so you're going to refresh on your equipment, you're going to get some real-life

practice around cold, wet stuff and when's your trip to the Arctic?

317

00:34:07,761 --> 00:34:08,712

End of June.

318

00:34:08,712 --> 00:34:11,192

So you've got that in and what about a third action then?

319

00:34:11,192 --> 00:34:13,878

What third action can you be working towards?

320

00:34:13,878 --> 00:34:16,017

gosh, third, action.

321

00:34:16,017 --> 00:34:20,468

Oh, well, the third action is going to be the training, I guess.

322

00:34:20,468 --> 00:34:22,629

just I do go to gym.

323

00:34:22,629 --> 00:34:29,802

do do train anyway, but I'm more of a uh weight kind of person.

324

00:34:29,802 --> 00:34:40,195

So I need to build up that cardio strength and just because, you know, they'll be trekking

and stuff like that.

325

00:34:40,195 --> 00:34:41,966

So whilst I do hike.

326

00:34:41,966 --> 00:34:43,656

327

00:34:43,656 --> 00:34:45,130

I wouldn't say that I...

328

00:34:45,130 --> 00:34:46,545

329

00:34:46,545 --> 00:34:47,806

uber healthy.

330

00:34:47,806 --> 00:34:51,687

So I am trying to put together a bit of a training plan.

331

00:34:52,028 --> 00:34:57,141

I do have a PT at the moment if she hasn't lost the will with me.

332

00:34:58,542 --> 00:35:06,317

So yeah, just putting together a bit of a training plan just to make sure that that cardio

level and strength is there.

333

00:35:06,317 --> 00:35:10,498

that, the last thing you want to do is get an injury or something.

334

00:35:10,498 --> 00:35:15,332

Can you off at sea and there's no, you know, there's a first aid box.

335

00:35:15,332 --> 00:35:16,807

Nothing else.

336

00:35:17,363 --> 00:35:31,825

So I'm going to reflect on the fact that you've got three very prep-like actions I'm going

to suggest an action for you which is really just tipping your appetite for exposure a

337

00:35:31,825 --> 00:35:32,406

little bit.

338

00:35:32,406 --> 00:35:39,481

So your goal is an approach goal, it's an approach in June with a release after that to a

certain community.

339

00:35:39,481 --> 00:35:43,324

But by recording this podcast, we're doing it in video today.

340

00:35:43,885 --> 00:35:48,219

I will be sharing this video and I'll be putting you in front of the camera.

341

00:35:48,219 --> 00:35:52,963

So just confirming that this is part of it and that will happen.

342

00:35:53,105 --> 00:36:02,273

And my action for you is to embrace it, is to engage with it and try not to run away from

it.

343

00:36:03,271 --> 00:36:06,421

I can do that as long as I don't have to watch it back.

344

00:36:07,257 --> 00:36:10,332

I think watching it back will be really helpful.

345

00:36:10,332 --> 00:36:18,480

So Darren, who was on the series earlier on, he said to me, he said it was a bit cringy

listening back to it.

346

00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,263

But after a few listens, you kind of get over that.

347

00:36:21,263 --> 00:36:23,164

It's a bit like exposure therapy.

348

00:36:23,164 --> 00:36:24,266

You've got to keep...

349

00:36:24,266 --> 00:36:28,245

watching yourself back and listening and it does help.

350

00:36:28,245 --> 00:36:29,417

Yeah, okay.

351

00:36:31,086 --> 00:36:32,511

I'll do whatever I'm told.

352

00:36:32,511 --> 00:36:33,935

353

00:36:36,157 --> 00:36:38,037

I think you have to be uncomfortable.

354

00:36:38,037 --> 00:36:39,869

You can't plan for everything.

355

00:36:39,869 --> 00:36:41,710

You can't mitigate everything.

356

00:36:41,710 --> 00:36:44,851

It's going to get uncomfortable, this goal journey.

357

00:36:44,851 --> 00:36:47,131

You've set yourself a big challenge.

358

00:36:47,232 --> 00:36:49,644

I'm interested when we catch up again.

359

00:36:49,644 --> 00:36:55,856

is to explore what coping strategies you're going to put in place for when it feels too

uncomfortable.

360

00:36:56,603 --> 00:36:58,633

this has been fabulous.

361

00:36:58,895 --> 00:37:03,418

It's been an absolute delight to have you on the Psychologically Speaking podcast.

362

00:37:03,418 --> 00:37:06,380

I wish you all the best with your goal for next year.

363

00:37:06,380 --> 00:37:11,744

And we are here to support and challenge you as you go through that journey.

364

00:37:11,845 --> 00:37:15,318

And I look forward to catching up in January to find out.

365

00:37:15,318 --> 00:37:18,766

how things are going with that prep and also with the exposure.

366

00:37:18,766 --> 00:37:19,840

Yeah, no probes.

367

00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,548

Thank you Leila Really appreciate it.

368

00:37:26,989 --> 00:37:30,801

I hope you are beginning to see what I'm seeing.

369

00:37:30,862 --> 00:37:33,785

Everybody approaches goals differently.

370

00:37:33,785 --> 00:37:38,798

sometimes we pitch our goals a little lower than the dream we actually want.

371

00:37:39,099 --> 00:37:44,980

We keep momentum modest because we think we need strong foundations before we're allowed

to scale.

372

00:37:44,980 --> 00:37:50,996

And we worry about failing especially when what we're doing can be very visible publicly.

373

00:37:51,377 --> 00:37:56,221

So in January, I'm opening up something new to help you move beyond that.

374

00:37:56,221 --> 00:37:59,683

And it's called my 2026 Goal Sprint.

375

00:37:59,683 --> 00:38:08,520

It's going to be a live 60 minute session where we're going to use my prompts to craft the

best goal for your 2026.

376

00:38:09,380 --> 00:38:19,814

You'll get weekly live check-ins to keep your momentum going, and especially past that

second week in February where most resolutions quietly melt away.

377

00:38:20,124 --> 00:38:27,839

You'll get access to a Slack group And I will be in there every week to give you the

strongest psychological start to your year.

378

00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:40,987

you can join us for just £79 and the link is in the show notes or you can go straight to

www.leilaainge.co.uk/goalsprint forward slash goal sprint.

379

00:38:41,111 --> 00:38:43,136

I'd love to see you there.

380

00:38:48,301 --> 00:38:49,283

That's all for today.

381

00:38:49,283 --> 00:38:54,316

Thank you for listening to Psychologically Speaking with me, Leila Ainge.