Hi Jordan. Welcome to Direction Next podcast. Hi. Thank you so much for having me.

So

to have you here. Tell us a little bit about yourself. So I have been writing novels for. Ever really.

Yeah.

For a long time I was working full-time as a journalist and writing novels on the side. I wrote five YA novels that way. But a year and a half ago I made the decision to go full-time author. I quit my day job and I decided to use all of my new free time to explore an idea that I had four years. And that book was See you at the Summit? My adult debut and. Yeah, my upcoming queer rom-com about a woman who comes out as bisexual and then reluctantly falls for a straight guy.

Yes, I was telling you, it's such a nuanced book.

I'm so grateful.

that it's there because it wouldn't have worked 10 years ago, 20 years ago. But like in this 2025, it feels just like nuanced conversation about,

Bisexual

what it means to be, 'cause there's a lot of biracial,

even.

with the heated rivalry discourse that's happening, like there's a lot of, they're like, it's a gate. It's not. Queer

Because

Ilya is bi. Like it's

part of his identity, like there's

nothing wrong with it. So there's a lot of like nuance around that space. And specifically bisexuality.

and I think you're so right that, 10, 20 years ago, like we probably just would've had to be explaining what bisexuality even is. And so to be able to have this more niche conversation is. You know that it's exciting in a way because it does show that we've come far and yes, of course there is still so much work we have to do to fight back against by erasure. But it is really cool to be able to have this kind of conversation now. Yeah. And even Ryan's mom, like.

The fact that he's in Ally and he

to come up straight,

moms

that's a conversation that I wouldn't see it in my,

childhood.

it's a pretty I'm

I'm

my forties right now, so it's like interest, like part of it's just normal. Totally.

families come in different forms, different shapes,

It's also coming out straight in a peer family.

Own

hard coming out.

to getting that label.

Yeah, I wanted to, I was thinking about how, Ryan's experience could contrast Simone's really as much as possible. And Simone goes through the experience of coming out as bisexual to her pretty conservative family. And I was like, okay, what is the polar opposite of that? Okay. It's having this sexy straight guy have to come out to his queer moms at Pride. Yeah. Yeah.

So

So book is

said

in the winter, it's in.

Toronto. I know. We go to Whistler.

We have

skiing time,

Pride events, it's very queer very gay,

very

Very queer.

book that we have.

So what was like,

process of writing and like coming up with this story and setting it in Canada, not in the us which is actually unique.

Thank you.

quite a few books.

So I'm from Canada. I was born and raised in Toronto. I've written five YA novels before this and none of them took place in Canada. I decided that for my adult debut let's go to my hometown. Let's just in so many ways, this is the book of my heart, as a bisexual woman myself. And I was like, you know what? Going with that book of the heart theme, let's also set it in Canada. This is my first adult book and also my first book set in my hometown, my home country. The idea came, in part from my own lived experiences and also from the work that I was doing in my, former career as a journalist. For a long time I was the sex and Relationships editor at Men's Health Magazine. So much of what I was doing was reporting on, a gender and identity and how that shows up in our relationships. And so I did a lot of work on understanding conversations around bisexuality and specifically how by erasure was affecting our readers. And this was one of the ways that it was constantly showing up in the questions that we were getting from readers. Which was about, how do I embrace my bisexuality? If I'm in a heterosexual relationship, what does that look like? And so I know that, it's something that I, myself have experienced and I know that it's something that a lot of our readers were experiencing. And so that's why this story was really on the. I was gonna say the tip of my tongue, the fringes of my brain when I made that leap to go full-time author and when I sat down to pitch what that first book was going to be in this new stage of my career, well,

this, like it's a nuanced conversation that we continue to have and it's just a part of,

you know what it looks like, and I think especially, different generations probably confronted to. We have younger generations who felt that this is normal while older generations is just taboo.

And

even just confronting different identity, different evil,

different labels and

how do you actually show it to the world? Along with taking into place, there's a lot of homophobia, there's a lot of conservative,

christian

and all these different things trying to make this that they got

big, bad wolf

does not exist. And so I think this is really valuable conversation. I think especially the idea

idea

Of being bisexual and being in a straight looking, what conservative people.

would

Mm-hmm.

And

And you know what's, can be challenging about people in Simone's position is that yes, you have that horrible homophobia from. Some more conservative sections of society, but then you also sometimes experience discrimination from within the queer community, from people that you wanna trust because sometimes when you are, like Simone, a bisexual person in a heterosexual relationship, so you know, to somebody else, you might appear a straight person. That's really difficult too when you're trying to find your queer community. Studies actually show that. Bisexual people experience anxiety and depression at higher rates than lesbians and gay people. And part of that is, it's because of that, it's called double discrimination, the discrimination that's coming from outside the queer community and from within. Knowing that statistic from my work as a journalist was part of what I had in mind when I went to write this book.

I love this

And I hope you keep writing more for books. I have another one coming out next year, so not next year. Sorry, I have no sense of what year we're in. Yeah. See you at the summit. Comes out in 2026 and I have another book that comes out in 2027. Perfect. I'm so excited. So we gotta talk about one of your passions and probably hyper fixation.

which is high

Yep.

It's people, don't dunno what it is. I have an idea. It's a pretty intense

Yes. So talk to us about that journey

'cause yes, you work in immense health,

So you're.

familiar with the fitness and your journalism and stuff, but Hyrox is, it's a niche competition that's somewhere newer,

is.

space.

I have been describing myself as a nerd jock hybrid because I, write novels by day. But then I'm also low key, like a huge, meathead Jim Crow.

Yeah.

So for those who aren't familiar, high Rocks is a fitness competition. That combines running with strength and like high intensity cardio stations. So the way I explain it is like, are you familiar with like an obstacle race? Like a tough mutter where you run and then there's an obstacle and then you run, there's an obstacle. So that's the setup of high rocks where you run a kilometer and then you do a station, and then you run a kilometer and you do a station, and in total you run eight kilometers. And do eight stations. And the stations range from really hardcore strength things like pushing a really heavy sled to more cardio based things like rowing and like skiing on machines. So the whole thing, the best people in the world do it like in under an hour, but I, it takes me about an hour and a half to do it. And it's so difficult, but also so much fun. You feel so accomplished at the end. You feel so strong. And I also just love the process of training for it because you really bond with the other people at your gym that are going through the same thing.

So you're training at a gym,

training,

looks

because I see, I have a friend

I have a

I, a former fitness trainer that I used to.

take her classes, who's been training, has been participating in various,

Competition. I seen some of the training and some of the stuff. Is it specific

training,

a specific gym that practices

It's,

it? Would it look like, not prospect, but when you think about it is not ideal.

of like your

You don't specifically you don't have to go to a high rock specific gym, but I think there's a lot of overlap between, and I also don't train at a CrossFit gym, but I think from my understanding is there's some overlap between the things that show up in Hyrox and the things that show up at a CrossFit gym. I train at gyms that have more I do a lot of high intensity interval training, and then I also just do a lot of heavy lifting on my own. So what I love about High Rocks is that, unlike a marathon where if you're not like. I know that my body is just not built to run a marathon. It's not but it's also probably not built to be like an Olympic powerlifter, but CrossFit is designed for like people who are sort of good at everything. And I like to work out at a gym that lets me practice, all of those different things like from running to sled pushing or, lifting heavy sandbags. Yeah, right now my training looks like doing it, it's mostly high intensity interval training because during high rocks you really like your heart rate is just it's all over the place, and then, yeah, just doing my own like heavy lifts to make sure that I am still like muscularly fit for it. And then I will also start running when. I'll start running, like ideally I would be running now, but I actually tore my adductor muscle, so

no.

I was like, I did. My last HIX competition was in New York in June. I was like, wow, like I'm in a lot of pain. And it turned out that I had been working out on a torn adductor for who knows how long. So now I am doing the smart thing and in sort of a recovery mode and taking it easy on my lower body. But once I feel up to it again, I will start running as well in addition to all that other training. So how

did you land

did you land this particular modality?

Was it.

it was something that my, Know, I honestly, I've always just loved. I've loved working out, like growing up my mom. She used to work as a personal trainer, so like I grew up like being in the gym with her. So I was always super familiar with the gym environment and I joined a gym. I spent 13 years living in New York. I literally, I just moved to Miami a month ago, but in New York I joined a gym in my neighborhood as a way to get more connected to people, during COVID actually, they were doing outdoor workouts and I ended up just making so many amazing friends with this gym and. I kept training with them and it turns out the owners of this gym had done high Rocks before, so they were the ones who introduced me and all of my fellow workout friends to High Rocks. And so we all started training together. I totally fell in love with it, and when we moved to Miami, it was so important to me to continue being a part of the High Rocks community, and so I found. A High Rock's affiliated gym down here that specifically does High Rock's training and like I low key chose my apartment based on being within walking distance to this gym. That is how I got into it. Yeah, it all started because of my trainers at my previous gym, but now I'm just completely hooked. I have to tell you, I think we've probably crossed path as we talked about it, because I used.

to, before the books, I

Through classes

fitness classes between fitness

of New York City.

The spice

and I moved to Florida, actually I moved to Chicago. I chose Chicago because it was like closer to classes I wanted to take to because I was like, I wanna find New Studio. Mm-hmm. And funny out, I ended up in Tampa actually.

'Cause

moved right before COVID,

started.

I was like

in shutdown.

Not.

experience Chicago.

my gosh.

So basically when I moved to Tampa,

I

a process of

finding these studios and like testing out and finding different things. But I was

without

car for a long time, so I was like, I needed to find I,

moved to places where the studios were

yes.

go,

and I find that makes it so much easier to incorporate it into your daily life. If it's something that is like walkable. I also don't drive, so I couldn't go to anything further. But for, even for people who do drive, I think. It makes it so much easier if it's right there. It's, I actually, that was my biggest problem.

this week was the Pilate

So

re

doing,

the Thefor, the Leg Performer,

and there's a studio that was like

signed up

half an hour away and in the past it been in new,

New York 'cause

just like to travel to Upper East Side from Tribeca. You travel to Chelsea because there's a bunch of street in Chelsea.

Chelsea.

And I thought it was gonna be the same. And I was like no. I don't wanna drive 30 minutes.

to go

The free studio, like there's a free studio opening up

10.

like it's the same amount of time, but it's 20 minutes and it's like shorter,

stuff.

And now it's like

for

sense. Like in order for me to go, I need to make myself much more,

convenient to

Yeah. Totally. So wait, did you end up driving 30 minutes?

Yes, I did it for three months and I was like

no, not sustainable.

the problem with all the 30 minutes, it's like it's a rush hour traffic,

no. We can't.

minutes, you may be 50 minutes, and you there too early or too late. So I had to have the conversation with the gym today, and

I was like, it's just too far away. Yeah.

it's.

No, fair. I totally sympathize.

Yeah, so funny enough, the other library

Called me and they're like, Hey, we're opening up.

up.

Oh, here's a better rate. And it's it's next to the target. And I was like,

well, I can go to Target afterwards.

what? What more could you ask for? Honestly,

So yes,

you

But I think when you're thinking about like a routine or finding it like a fitness modality that You have to make it convenient.

Cannot make

virus to entry

as much as possible like you have to.

remove those as much as possible.

Alright, so let's have some book coordinations. I love one of your books, which is

seven

oh my gosh. I'm so happy you said that. I actually read that book like maybe last year, but I loved it so much. I was like, this isn't even a recent book recommendation, but I just need to put it on this list because I loved it so much.

No,

It's so good.

So

Talk about

what Turbo Psych

what is about, because I think it's a great explor polyamory

And it's a traditional

Yes. Publish that. I agree. And it makes me so excited that there is this traditionally published throuple book on in the market. As a, again, like as a sex journalist, somebody who's, my, my life mission is to help readers pursue pleasure without shame. And part of that is by de-stigmatizing. These, different relationship dynamics that really can be so beautiful. And we just are ashamed to explore them or talk about them. So this book does a fantastic job about, of that. It's a romance novel about a single person, a bartender who ends up falling in love with a couple. And what I think TJ Alexander, the author does so well, is that. Not only does the single person fall in love with the couple, but you know, TJ really dives into the relationships between, because a throuple is really like four different relationships existing simultaneously, right? Partner A and partner b. Partner A and partner C, partner B, and partner C, and then all three people together. And so I think that TJ Alexander did such an excellent job at showing all of those relationships at play and each one felt so distinct and so romantic and sexy, and I really bought into every little piece of that triad relationship. And I had just never read anything like that in the mainstream publishing world. And, from the reporting that I was doing on polyamory, I was so happy to see that carrying through into the fiction world.

Yes,

so good.

And

love their other books. They use great, they're actually, they're follow up. There's a lot of non-binary trans characters and like all types of.

relationships. And I think it's it's a great exploration.

Think you're a great author. If you're looking for some more, like

More

more d like a different point of view that you normally wouldn't,

see

Do. What other books do you tend to read? I know you read a little bit of like mystery, like thrillers. Yeah. I tend to bounce around between romance, historical fiction and thrillers, which are the three genres that I have. Published and one book that I read recently that combined all three of those genres was atmosphere by Taylor Jenkins, Reed. That was one of my favorite reads of the year. I actually listened to the audio book and it was done so beautifully. I need you to picture me walking down like the busy streets of New York City listening to this audio book and just openly sobbing at the ending. It's an incredible book. It's about the first female astronauts at nasa. And, it's a love story between two of them. And there's also a thriller element because there's a, there's an emergency and a space shuttle. It really ticks all of the boxes of my favorite genres and just the historical research that must have gone into this is. Totally staggering. And then on top of that, you have a beautiful, passionate love story. Oh my God. It's just so good. Like I, right now that's, I always have one book that I'm constantly screaming at people to read. That's my screaming at people book right now. I love this. And it's a book of the year. I think it's audio book of year or so,

from

a lot of list.

It's

perfect

I

audio.

is the way to go, but definitely prepare for the Kleenex 'cause we're gonna cry.

For sure. You have to be, if you're listening to the audio book while you go about your daily life, you have to be comfortable crying in public. Yes.

Not, maybe not do it in an airport airplane. Jordan, tell us, we get online,

Oh, I would be delighted too. You can find me on Instagram at Jordan H. Taylor, and Jordan is spelled J-O-R-D-Y-N. And then the letter H, and then T-A-Y-L-O-R. You can also find me at my website, which is Jordan h taylor.com, and in either of those places, you can find links to subscribe to my newsletter where I will share all the latest updates on my books, as well as some bonus content and other fun stuff. So yeah, find me there. Awesome. Thank you, Jordan, for being on the show. you so much for having me. This was so fun.

Thanks for listening to the What three next. For more book lists, cozy reads and library tips, visit the what three Next block.com. Your next great read might be waiting there.