Julie [00:00:08]

John, it’s interesting as we continue to live longer with the advancements of of technology in medicine and we have these great lives and we seem to talk about longevity and aging. And it’s really exciting to think about all these years that we’ll have in retirement. But, you know, Ryan Frederick, who we’ll chat with here in a moment, talks about the idea of healthy longevity. And I really am intrigued by the pairing of those two words, because you don’t usually hear about healthy and longevity together. And I know in the work that you and I do, John, and a day to day basis, we really think about that. But how do we age? Well, how do we continue to stay safe? How do we access things that bring us joy, like things like an ice cream cone? And it’s just really such an important concept. And I think for those financial professionals that are listening and are having conversations with their clients or conversations with their family members, the idea of aging well and staying healthy at different ages and stages of life is so important. I don’t know. John, Is that something that you’ve been thinking about lately?

John [00:01:18]

Yeah. You know, it’s interesting talking to our friend Joe Coughlin at the MIT AgeLab. He often talks about he has his own kind of Maslow’s pyramid, right. Where what he often talks about is as we age, people seem to think we need we just need our physical issues taken care of. We got to be physically safe. We have to physically be able to access things. We have to physically be able to get ourselves places. But as you go up the pyramid, we know that real well-being has not only to do with our physical needs, but also our mental and emotional needs. And I think that’s what this conversation about healthy longevity is really about. It’s not only physical well-being that’s really important, but it’s also about the emotional factors, the social factors that all weigh in. So, Julie, what I loved about this episode was I got to ask Ryan a couple of questions that financial professionals are often asking me about. What do I do about this situation? Or if I were thinking about it kind of moving to a different place. What are some methods I should think about employing? And I think, you know, coming up with new directions, new thoughts around the importance of where we live and how we live and why we live there is really important.

Julie [00:02:37]

I agree. I think it is a really important and these are conversations that are only going to be more and more prevalent. And I think having more conversational tools and more thought processes for all of us. I know that even in my my personal life, I have these conversations with my parents, it seems like on a weekly basis, thinking about their own longevity. And and I know that I’ll be using some of the ideas and conversations that Ryan shared with us today with them probably in my next conversation. So I’m really excited to share with our audience today some of Ryan’s insights.

John [00:03:11]

So, Julie, if you would, would you introduce our audience to Ryan Frederick and why it is that we asked him on our podcast today?

Julie [00:03:18]

Absolutely. Ryan Frederick is the founder and CEO of Here. He focuses on the intersection of place and healthy longevity and is the author of Best Selling ‘Right Place, Right Time The Ultimate Guide to Choosing a Home. For the Second Half of Life’. His work has been featured in CBS News, Forbes, Kiplinger and other national outlets. Ryan is a graduate of Princeton University and Stanford Business School. He lives in Austin, Texas, with his family.

John [00:03:46]

So down come along with us as we listen to the conversation that Julie and I had with Ryan about really what it means to live not only to the later ages, but live with healthy longevity.

John [00:04:00]

Hi, I’m John.

Julie [00:04:01]

And I’m Julie.

John [00:04:03]

We’re the hosts of the Hartford Funds Human-centric Investing Podcast.

Julie [00:04:07]

Every other week we’re talking with inspiring thought leaders to hear their best ideas for how you can transform your relationships with your clients.

John [00:04:17]

Let’s go.

Julie [00:04:19]

Hi, Ryan. Welcome to the Human-centric Investing podcast. It’s great to be with you today.

Ryan [00:04:24]

Thanks for having me Julie.

John [00:04:25]

Ryan You know, one of the things that we talk about quite often, Julie and I and our other colleagues on my team is when we think about extended longevity, uh the importance of where we’ll be living. We, we we always couch it in terms of the MIT AgeLab’s question, who’s going to change my light bulbs? Right. But it’s more than just about light bulbs, obviously. I know from your book right Place right Time, that the average American typically moves 12 to 13 times during their lifetime. And I think sometimes early in our lives, we don’t have a lot of control over that. Maybe we’re pursuing a job, a family, whatever that may be. But, you know, as we age, sometimes a client may have the sense that they’re not in the right place. And as a financial professional, how do you how do you begin to address that? You know, sometimes in our business, we’re always that we kind of go by the mantra, you know, we help with people’s hopes and dreams. But the problem with hopes and dreams is they’re not exactly concrete and they’re not very easy to plan for. How would you take someone that says, you know, I’m not sure this is the place where I’m going to be for the next 20, 30 years and help them begin to get their arms around that.

Ryan [00:05:52]

Yeah, John, It’s complicated. He’s complicated for all of us. With. With living longer and that phenomenon a particular issue for those who are college educated. And that’s because if you’re college educated, you’re more likely to plan. You’re more likely to invest in some of these lifestyle habits that that matter. And but in many respects were were pioneers. You know, if you look at generations before us, they either didn’t live very long or they embraced the more traditional retirement model where people tend to leave their job, in some cases leave their place and then live more of a life of more exclusive leisure. And when you look at the research around healthy longevity, that’s not what you’re supposed to do. You know, you’re supposed to have continued purpose that’s greater than yourself. Doesn’t mean you can’t enjoy golf. That’s not what I’m saying. But to have environment, which is 100% kind of cut off from from reality without not having purpose and so on. And of course, in a world today where pensions are less likely to fund that kind of life, life matters. So I think that there is it’s it’s I think a lot of financial professionals, they’ve got a little bit of fork in the road. Do they want to have that conversation or not? Am I only going to just talk about financial information? I’ll give you the updates. But I think that’s going to leave some clients wanting more. And and I think for those that decide to lean into this bigger conversation, even if brief, then I think it creates an opportunity for some frank dialog. You know, the assessment that I have in the book that’s also online at the here.life website is a is a first effort for people to get a self assessment. Not someone, not a not a spouse, not a kid, not a parent saying, okay, I know you got to move. So your perspective in these different measures. So so I think there is an important element of of just taking stock in your life and then recognizing that the opportunity costs, I think, we don’t talk enough about I don’t think what’s the opportunity cost of not doing a better thing. And and I think that’s significant in some of these conversations that financial advisors financial professionals may have with their clients. Because if someone’s not in a good situation, they kind of recognize it. That has implications for your life, especially as compared to being in a better spot. So it’s it’s you kind of have to go down a little certain path of, of of little of opening up maybe certain conversations that are non-financial and then seeing where that where that path may take you.

Julie [00:08:55]

Brian, have you seen situations where financial professionals have taken the assessments at your website here dot life for themselves and maybe had any aha moments in their own lives or situations and then been able to engage clients or prospects in the conversations based upon their learnings or you know the changes or adjustments maybe they’ve made in their own situation.

Ryan [00:09:21]

Yeah, it’s a good question, Julie. I think one that is happening, particularly leaders of financial organizations that have been in this business for a while, they tend not to be in their twenties. They’re in there themselves in this stage right now where they’re wondering, well, what what is the next chapter for me? So it’s it is powerful when you first experience life as an individual, as a consumer, and then you then you can apply back to your practice. And so there’s a couple wealth advisor groups I’ve been working with where that’s exactly what’s happened. The one of the senior or maybe CEO of the wealth advisory firm is seeing it in their own life, and then they’re recognizing that only optimizing for financial well-being is not good enough. You know, and sadly, you hear stories of situations where people are financially well off and they I mean, it’s really sad, but they you know, they take their life. You know, after retiring, they’ve just lost this sense of purpose and thriving in their best days. They’re convinced or behind them when that may not be the case. So I think for so that’s all to say that Absolutely. I think it’s I think it’s most powerful when principles of of wealth advisory firms see it in their own life and then say, okay, what does that mean for me? But also what does it mean for our practice? What does it mean for potentially upskilling some of our our professionals so they can be comfortable having conversations and then armed with with the right set of tools for for people to not just, again, thrive financially, but really thrive more holistically over a longer life.

John [00:11:12]

So Ryan I have a tough question for you. Sometimes it’s financial advisors who have asked me. Sometimes it’s adult children of people who are growing older who will say, John, my 89 year old father says he is never moving out of his house. He lives on a giant farm where he can’t maintain it anymore. And what would I say or how do you know most of the time Ryan I’m like, I’m not sure you can say anything at this point. It may cause more harm than good, but obviously I think it points to the need for a continuous conversation. But what would your advice be to someone who’s dealing with an aging relative who really soon is not going to be able to maintain things by themselves? Any tips on how to have that conversation or is it an ongoing conversation? You know, what would Ryan Frederick say about that situation?

Ryan [00:12:08]

Yeah, So I’ve turned the book into a workshop and course and one of the things that’s happened in that, John, is this recognition that everyone’s a snowflake. That doesn’t mean that everyone’s, like, soft and withering. That’s not the implication. Everyone has this very unique situation. And in order to properly handle what you’re talking about, there’s a lot of context behind it. There is. What’s the dynamic of your relationship between the parent and the adult children? What what’s their what are their personality traits? What’s their financial situation? What what are their two dynamics of their four walls, but also the place more broadly? What I found generally to be true is if an adult child forces change on an adult parent, that that can be really challenging. Because that chapter when when when someone, you know, moves from an environment that they’re used to or they that is home to them and they feel like it was a forced move driven by a loved one that can that can create a lot of resentment. And also it’s resentment that they carry oftentimes they can carry with them to the next chapter. So even if that you know, that new chapter is maybe objectively, it’s a beautiful community you’re part of and the people are friendly and, you know, your your physical place looks beautiful. There’s a this resentment you bring with you. So you never really it’s difficult for people to fully embrace with this new chapter because it wasn’t yours, You didn’t deside it. And so I think that there is a lot around listening to each other and then and then planning, getting the facts out together, but recognizing that ideally that decision is it really should be made in conjunction with or ideally driven by, you know, the older adult. Now, when you’re in situations where you’ve got a compromised mental faculties, you know, that’s a different path,.

John [00:14:29]

Right.

Ryan [00:14:29]

Where, you know, they’re not in a position to to make make good decisions. And also you can find situations where people’s there, the universe of options they consider is far too narrow than it really is. But it’s a complicated one, John. It’s but also it’s a fairly common one, which is one of the reasons why I’ve really been advocating. I’m hoping to really spark a movement around if you have if you if you’re financially planning for a long life, awesome. I think you should also have a place plan for a long life because you’re going to be situations where your where you live is aligned in in your health and wellbeing. But then there’s situations where it’s not going to be alined. And sometimes that happens because your preferences needs to change. Maybe your partner’s needs and preferences change or maybe places change. There are a lot of variables once it’s out of whack. It is a reminder that, okay, maybe I should be thinking about what is that next chapter and how to execute on it?

John [00:15:31]

It’s probably the best answer to that question I’ve ever heard. Ryan, I appreciate that.

Ryan [00:15:36]

Well, I’m an author novel.

Julie [00:15:37]

HAHA.

John [00:15:37]

It worked!

Julie [00:15:41]

You know Ryan. It’s interesting, too, that you rarely see the word healthy paired with longevity. Right. I mean, we hear longevity and we think about longevity. But I love the way that you put those two words together to. Will you bring us into your your mind on you know, when we talk about healthy longevity, obviously Place has so much to do with it. But kind of give us your thought process on that as you as you think about that as well, and kind of as if I’m a financial professional having conversations with clients and if I’m talking to them about their own healthy longevity and some of some of the factors and the things to consider and the questions to ask ourselves if we’re inside of your head, what are we to be thinking about when we think about framing up the idea of healthy longevity? Because like I said, it’s just you don’t usually hear those two words together. And I just I love it and my mind is spinning, but I would love to hear what what is spinning in your mind.

Ryan [00:16:41]

Yeah, well, thanks, Julie. I mean, I think you you hit on a big point and. And. It is. I like to think of it as the bonus longevity that we that we received in the 20th century is one of the biggest accomplishments of the modern era, and that was largely driven by really improvements in in managing a number of diseases. First of all, it was it was handling the mortality rate for babies. That was a key driver, was also the eradication of polio and other things that we were able to create kind of vaccines for. But when we look forward, this is like the craziness hasn’t really happened yet. It’s like, you know, you look at some of the research, people predict that 50% of kids born in the U.S. or developed countries will live to at least 100. And so this century life that Joe Coughlin and others talk about is Stanford Center longevity, that they’re anchored on this. This is a new reality that that many people aren’t prepared for or institutions aren’t prepared for, companies are prepared for. We’re all pioneers in this. But, Julie, to your point, longevity is not enough. And that’s what I think individuals and wealth advisors need to focus on is just living to a hundred, lets say, does not necessarily mean that’s a good outcome because if you this is why it’s so important to start thinking about not just longevity but also the healthy peace. Healthspan So its lifespan Healthspan also Wellspan do you have the financial resources you’re looking for? Because I’ve seen studies where people have asked, been asked about skilled nursing. People feel fear, skilled nursing more than death itself. And that is really an outcome of people saying quality of life matters. So if we if we take longevity and add healthy to it, it then says, well, how do I get to that outcome? How do I get an outcome where I’m not just living longer, but I’m living better or a high quality of life? And the good news about that is, again, point of the research is we have agency about that. Our, our, our genetics only account for about 20% of our longevity. So it’s much more about do we have purpose, are we socially connected, are we physically active and so on. And I think that’s the good news. But it doesn’t happen by happened by happenstance. Like this is where planning is key. In fact. Joe Coughlin to back that for a moment, John, your comment? Joe wrote an article a few months ago and it was on place and he said, what’s the biggest predictor for your happiness level? It’s your zip code. And the reason is we we are more sculpted by our environment than we sculpt our environment. Are we we catch the lifestyle habits of our friends friends. So if our friends friends are obese, we’re more likely to obese. I live in Austin, Texas. If your friends friends, you know, eat tacos, you eat tacos. So, you know, it’s it’s this. And take it one step further for a moment. This idea of our future self. That we’re crafting is influenced by place. You know, the John that may live in the South might look different than the John that lives in the Pacific Northwest. Like, you will become like a different person. The way that we’re sculpted by it. So any. Julie There’s a lot there. But I’m hopeful that as individuals and also within the financial professional community that we do lack lack kind of grab hold of healthy longevity that’s closer to what we’re looking for.

John [00:20:32]

So Ryan, question about that planning portion is I put on my certified financial planner hat um and I’m starting to think about this changing lifestyle. I’m starting to wonder if I should be talking to my clients about setting aside a pot of money almost as a transition support. And behind that question is a question for you. Oftentimes, I’ve heard people say, look, before a change is made, make sure you experience that place first, maybe long term rent for a period, maybe see if you can live as close to your intended location as you can in the off season, in the in season, in whatever. And so it would seem to me like having some funds available so that I wouldn’t have to make that crack decision. I sell my house today and I’m somewhere else tomorrow. In general, is that a is that a practice you recommend that kind of road test your next place?

Ryan [00:21:26]

It is a it’s a great idea, John. And and this I talk about this a bit in the book. I talk more about it in the workshop and and course and it’s really around design thinking. And so design thinking is a is a way of testing things out and thinking that number of companies, innovative companies, have used some universities and their innovation departments around how, how do we come up with ideas but not be fooled by our overconfidence? You know, we talk about this sometimes in the investment community. You can fool yourself for being overconfident about the attractiveness of an investment. Well, the same is true about ourselves. We can think, Oh my gosh, I know if I move to this place, if I’m just by the beach, all my problems are solved. Well, we it’s it’s much safer. It’s more advisable to go test out these hypotheses to see if they’re true or not. And on a real quick story of this, in Austin, Texas, we have an acquaintance in our neighborhood. He and his wife say they decided they want to downsize it to a down downtown, sold their house, moved down, bought a condo, outfitted it, loved the first month or so. But after a year, they’re like, whoops, made the wrong decision. So their condo tried and they eventually did find a house back where they were before. Very expensive decision. Took a little bit toll probably on their relationship, too. So they would have a bet much better off just renting or Airbnb-ing or finding some ways. That’s really what we want and rather than making big decisions. So I love the idea of creating space financially like you’re describing. Also some time to do things like that. That’s that’s certainly wise a lot of the long term.

Julie [00:23:10]

Well, Ryan, I think that these are such interesting concepts and and really putting all of the pieces together and thinking about not only longevity but a healthy longevity and how we factor in place and time and really have those meaningful conversations not only with clients but also with ourselves and with our with our families and those that we care about. So we can’t thank you enough for helping us think through these concepts. And for those that would like to learn more about Ryan’s ideas, please don’t hesitate to visit his website here dot Life and we can. You can visit his assessment also, because this is the Human-centric Investing podcast. We would not want to miss the opportunity to ask Ryan some of our lightning round questions. So, Ryan, if you’re up for it today, we love to segway into our questions. So whatever answers are, top of mind, if you’re willing, will launch into the lightning round. So here we go.

John [00:24:14]

Would you binge watch a TV series or rather, watch a movie?

Ryan [00:24:19]

A movie.

Julie [00:24:21]

What was your favorite board game as a kid?

Ryan [00:24:25]

Monopoly.

John [00:24:27]

Especially important to place dogs or cats?

Ryan [00:24:31]

Dogs.

Julie [00:24:32]

Are you spontaneous or a planner?

Ryan [00:24:35]

Both.

John [00:24:38]

What is your favorite holiday?

Ryan [00:24:42]

Thanksgiving.

Julie [00:24:44]

Pepsi or Coca Cola.

Ryan [00:24:47]

Neither.

John [00:24:47]

City or country.

Ryan [00:24:54]

City.

Julie [00:24:55]

Well, thank you again, Ryan, for being here with us today on the Human-centric Investing podcast. For more information from Ryan or to take the right place assessment, please visit here Dot Life. Ryan, again, thank you for being here with us. We can’t tell you how much we appreciate you.

Julie [00:25:12]

Thanks for listening to the Hartford Funds Human-centric Investing Podcast. If you’d like to tune in for more episodes, don’t forget to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and follow us on LinkedIn, Twitter, or YouTube.

John [00:25:27]

And if you’d like to be a guest and share your best ideas for transforming client relationships, email us at guest booking at Hartford Funds dot com. We’d love to hear from you.

Julie [00:25:37]

Talk to you soon.

John [00:25:40]

The views and opinions expressed herein are those of the guest who is not affiliated with Hartford Funds.