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Hagai Mako I Skypa Business Development VP not the easiest name to say Hagai In Hebrew it's Hagai.

But I'm sure we'll make it work.

AV Nation what is going on?

And welcome back to the Pilot to Pilot podcast.

My name is Justin Seams and I am your host.

Today's episode is with Hagai from Skypath and what an episode.

Just great energy, a great conversation and just awesome to dive in to.

One Getting deeper into what truly fuels Skypath as a company and why they're creating, why they're going after everything and why they're just so successful and just the personal side as well.

Just figuring out who Hagai is, why he he operates the way he does, and just how he goes about his daily life.

I think there's a lot of good in this episode that came out of it.

Whether you're a pilot, whether you're just going throughout your day, and whether you just want to be successful in life.

I think this is a solid, solid episode.

So Skypath thank you Hagai.

Thank you, I appreciate it.

But AV Nation Hope you enjoyed this episode.

And if you do, leave us a review on Spotify or Apple Podcast and make sure you drop the Follow or Subscribe button.

I know that sounds very cliche to keep saying that, but Spotify is letting me know and doing a much better job of knowing how many people are following or subscribing to your podcast.

So go ahead and follow there.

Leave a comment as well while you're there and say that I sent you.

That works too.

But aviation.

I hope you enjoy this episode.

It's always fun talking to Skypath, so make sure you download their app.

There will be a link in the description as well as it's truly, truly, truly my go to app for turbulence.

And if I were to fly ga, I would have this as well.

Just because it'd be.

I know Christina would be in the back, be like, yo, why is it bumpy?

Tell me that.

And she could just see it, be.

Like, look, there's bumps.

Go away, go around.

But AV Nation, I hope you're having a good day.

And without any further ado, here's a guy from Skypath.

You have a lot of confidence in me, man.

You know, Americans are not good at difficult names.

Or not even difficult names, just names that aren't Chris or Justin.

So if I butcher your name, I do apologize.

No problem.

I used to.

I lived seven years in the US and when I ever go to Starbucks, I use Joe because there was no chance that anybody will get right the Hagai, Mako or any combination of those two.

I love it.

That's so funny.

Joe.

Joe.

Now, whenever I hear the name Joe at Starbucks, I'll probably go to Starbucks after this, honestly.

But if I ever hear name someone say Joe, I'm going to just automatically assume that's not the real name.

Exactly.

I assume there are a few Joes in Starbucks that are asking their coffee.

Yeah, probably.

Yeah, I know a couple Joes.

So probably.

But now it's ruined for him.

It can't be Joe anymore.

I'm just going to come up with a new name for him.

I'm going to call him Hagai.

How about that?

Sounds great.

All right, well, Hagai, hopefully I said it correctly, but welcome to the podcast.

This is another skypath episode.

So if you haven't listened to any of them before, we have.

We have two other episodes.

One with Maya, one with Guy.

They've been fantastic episodes.

They've been well received.

My editor has always liked it.

He's always enjoyed listening to these, and everyone that we've had on has Always had questions about Skypath.

So any chance I get to talk about a really cool app?

We always try to have it come on.

We always try to show the cool stuff in aviation that's coming out.

But we will get to Skypath later.

What I really wanted to touch on and what we do at Pilot to Pilot is tell personal stories as well.

So I wanted to share more about you and you and aviation.

So why don't you go ahead and tell me how you got in aviation and from what I've gathered and what I've heard, it's not necessarily the standard two year old, three year old looking up the sky be like hey airplanes, I love airplanes.

Yeah, it's actually quite the opposite on that part I have to say.

So I did, like many of the pilots and employees of Skypas, I did the flight school and flight academy in the Air Force and that was my segue to aviation.

However, before I joined the army, I actually wanted to go to the Special Forces and not actually the Air Force.

In Israel the Air Force has priority so they have the first filter to choose from the people that go into the army in general.

And if you either not, not relevant, not fitted to them, obviously you will be out of that pool or if you fail any of the testing on the way.

So again, unfortunately I passed some of those tests before the service and I got into flight school and still I had this bug into the Special Forces.

And I can tell you a story that I think at flight school.

At flight school the, the first cutoff is the basic flight testing.

That's okay.

My time was done on a Piper, on a small Piper and, and, and I remember my saddest day in, in flight school was actually the day I passed those testing because I thought that again they will kick me out.

You know, I was sure that I'm going to fail.

I was sure they would kick me out.

And then I said okay, I forces eventually I passed that and as a competitive person that I am, I continued, continued the flight school until I completed as an attack helicopter pilot.

Oh my gosh.

I just can't imagine you just being like I hope I fail these so I can go do what I want to do.

But you just can't let yourself fail from what it sounds like.

I remember I called my parents and I remember I had tears in my eyes during that time, you know, just because I passed and nobody kicked me out.

So I, you know, took the decision for me.

You know, sometimes it does help in life.

That's really funny.

Most certainly, yeah.

It goes to show that sometimes, you know, someone has other plans for you.

And it turns out if you're looking back, you're probably not as sad about what happened now.

No, not at all.

Yeah, not at all.

What was it like flying a Piper for the first time?

Was it for someone that didn't want to get in aviation?

Was there fear at all?

You know, a lot of people look at small planes like, I'm not getting that.

Or was it kind of like, it's kind of exciting, there's an engine on there, so some wings.

Let's go do some fun stuff.

Yeah, no, no, it was.

So the other nice thing that I actually enjoyed, I have to say, those testing.

One of the challenges in flight school and flight academy in the Air Force is the fact that everybody is having their eyes on you and testing you all the time.

Right.

And that usually creates a lot of pressure.

And beside the fact that affect your performance, it's also affect the enjoyment that you have from that experience in life.

And I have to say I actually quite enjoyed my first Piper flying again, not that I excelled there, I wasn't that amazing, but the experience and I didn't felt any failure feeling or something like that, or any high stress.

I just enjoyed, you know, seeing everything from above like that, you know, getting my checklist done and succeeding in some of the drills and skills that they ask us to do.

And it was, it's quite a.

It was a fun time for me.

That again, maybe that was of a reason I passed, you know, to a certain level, but I wasn't suffering that much.

Even though you're had a spotlight on you and everybody's testing you and giving you a grade for anything you're doing, that's part of the challenge of, of being a pilot in the Israeli Air Force, you know, in general, I would say yeah.

And you sound like a guy that, that likes the pressure, that likes the challenge.

You know, some people don't want to be between a rock and a hard place.

It sounds like you might thrive in those situations.

Has it always been that case?

I don't know if I thrive, but I can compete, let's say like that.

And I push myself in those situations.

I would say it like that, you know, it bring you to the edge.

So.

And a lot of the time that edging part brings the best of you, right.

And that's what you want in those kind of situations.

Do you think that was a learned skill or is that something you're born with?

Good question.

I think it's Both, I think you have to have like a baseline in your, like, genetics, in the skills that you grew up with.

But I think, and I can tell you quite honestly that flight school changed a lot in me, right?

It's kind of re education to a certain level, the whole Air Force experience.

And it's something that I take all the way today, right, to my job, to my hobbies, to my kids, you know, to analyze whatever you're doing, to find what you're doing good and what you're doing bad, to learn how to improve it efficiently, right?

Because one of the things, everybody can be a pilot, right?

Everybody can be a pilot in the Air Force that's like that.

Besides, everybody can be a pilot, but everybody can be a pilot in the Air Force.

The issue is how quickly can you learn and how quickly can you improve, right?

And will your.

Will you do again mistakes or errors that you did in the past, right?

Because you want to learn and improve from them.

And I think that's a challenge.

Eventually you want pilots to get better and better and better all the time and achieve and not get to their ceiling so quickly.

And that's part of the things flying an aircraft, basically, it's not the biggest challenge in life, right?

Everybody can do it.

Absolutely.

And I think part of the issue is just the mentality that you have when you're in there flying, right?

You have to be able to not be afraid to make mistakes.

You can't be.

You can't be hesitant.

You just have.

Sometimes not making a decision is the worst decision you can make, right?

Like you act, you make a decision and you rely on your training, you rely on your cfi and you figure it out.

This is something you gotta do.

And that's something that isn't easy for everyone to kind of wrap their brain around.

And another one is constructive criticism.

Understanding that constructive criticism will create a better pilot, a better person, more competitive in.

You don't take it the bad way.

If someone has a.

If you have a bad flight lesson or your instructor lets you know about it, you just got to take it, right?

You just got to sit there, you got to, you know, just take the beating up.

I don't have a better word for it, but take the beating and just, just come back the next day and realize that it's not personal.

They're just trying to get the best out of you.

And it's going to help you in flying and it's going to help you in your personal life.

But a lot of times, just figuring out a way to navigate criticism and navigate suffering and not doing great and adversity will help you become better.

And you, you'll do better in those situations when the more adversity you face.

No, I totally agree with that.

Totally agree.

Also, what to focus on, right?

In.

In same.

Like again, when you did your pilot training, you had a bunch of errors, right?

But you need to understand what should you focus for the next slide, right?

What was the three things that you can correct that will make you much better?

Because you have probably 20 things that you have to get them better or do them better.

Right.

And that's also something that you understand very well in, in the Air Force, in flying in general.

What do I focus on?

What do I look at at any time?

What do I do at any moment?

Right?

It's true for flight, right?

The issue, the challenge is what do you do in every segment of the flight?

What is the correct action I need to do?

You know, and then I think it helps you become a much better pilot.

Yeah, totally agree.

Now, for you, you sound like someone that likes to have more than just one thing to be fully satisfied, right?

Like where you are at Skypath now, what was it or how was your kind of progression into getting.

Not even getting to Skypath, but just you.

When you're in the army, when you're in the Air Force, when you're, when you're doing your training, what was your mentality like?

Were you, you weren't satisfied with just flying?

What were you wanting to do?

What was kind of your brain like?

What.

What was a guy thinking at that time?

During.

After flight school, you mean?

Yeah, after flight school.

Yeah, after flight school, you're flying the helicopter and you're just sitting there and you're.

You.

This isn't what you want.

Not all that you want.

You want more, right?

So what, what was coming next?

So again, I think I'm.

I'm a person that likes to try different things and experience different things.

And that was part of my service experience.

And so I started first of all at Cobras, and then I really wanted to switch to a more advanced helicopter, the Apache.

And that's something that affect.

And I had also other hobbies that I wanted to try and actually try them after the end of my service.

So, for example, transition into Apache.

I did it as a reserve pilot, and that's really rare.

It's a, you know, hard transition to do when you are actually reserve pilot coming usually once a week, twice a week.

Now you need to commit yourself for a few months and and, and transition to whole different aircraft while you are working, while you have family, while you have other obligations.

And so that was one challenge that I took and, and again helped me fulfill my life.

And the other thing, I had other dreams.

I actually, I had the long old dreams of farming and wrenching that I tried after the service.

Yeah.

And so I did some wrenching in Australia while I was there.

Yeah.

And I did a few working vacation, I would say like that during my backpacking.

So I did the wrenching and I did the dive master and dive instructor.

And by the way, one of the things I learned, I love the wrenching, but I found out that I enjoy more working with people.

Right.

And those creatures that walk on four, although they're amazing, amazing to grow an amazing experience still, you know, I, I needed the communication, right?

So.

So that's, for example, one thing that pushed me to my current career.

And even when I started to work at Elbit System, which is a defense industry company, I started as a system system engineer.

But try to touch all the different segments or different portions of, of any kind of business, right?

From development into testing, into a teaching, into marketing and opportunity again to touch all these different aspects of any good business.

And, and that helped me find out what will work better for me.

I would say that the biggest transition for me was at when we moved, my wife pursued their PhD and we moved to the US and then I actually transitioned from Elbit System Israel, small but nice, to Elbit US again, the same company, the subsidiary, the US Subsidiary.

And again seeing the US organization the way that they work.

And also that was my first role as a business development manager.

That had me the opportunity again to do exactly or part of what I'm doing now, understanding what hurt people, what affect people, and how can the product and the solution come and solve those problems and be direct with people, see what annoys them, what they require in order to improve their operation.

And yeah, it's exactly like that.

So those transition between the cattle, between the other diving instructor had the opportunity again to touch all these different aspects and find my way into Skypas.

Yeah, What I think is really cool is, you know, when you're young, you see social media, you see YouTube, you see Instagram, and you think that these people got, whether it's fame, whether it's money, whether it's success, you think it happened overnight.

And I'm guessing that if someone was to look at your Instagram, if you had one when you were ranching, your life would look much different than it does.

Right now.

So what I'm getting at is you took kind of every opportunity to kind of mold yourself into who you are now, like a well rounded person, you took all these different experiences, which some might not want to do ranching, some might not want to do this, but the point is, is that you were, you kind of took every opportunity you had and you learned from these experiences and you built this wealth of knowledge.

You know, you might take something that you learned from ranching, you might take something that you learned from diving, whether it's to communicate with people, whether it's teamwork, whether it's building.

I mean, when you're, when you're with the, a bunch of cattle, you got to figure out a way to get things done.

You can't talk to them like you said.

So sometimes you're gonna have people that you don't might necessarily connect with, but you still got a way to get it.

You have to get the job done.

But you were able to use all these experiences to come.

And what I'm getting at is when you're 18 years old, you're not going to be as successful as, I mean there's this one off 18 year olds, right?

Whether they come from the right family, whether they just had the right opportunity, but you have to kind of put in the work and you have to enjoy the grind.

Sounds like, I mean, I guarantee you if I asked you if you enjoyed everything that you did, you'd be like, it was the best time of my life.

I love ranching, I do it again, all that kind of stuff.

But you have to enjoy the grind, you have to enjoy the process.

And don't be afraid to say yes to something that maybe isn't going to be the normal decision.

Right.

Like I'm guessing all your friends didn't go ranching as well in Australia or become dive masters.

But don't be afraid to say yes to those kind of decisions that not everyone's doing.

And you never know what opportunities will come up in your, in your life and how it's going to be able to improve yourself and just become a better person.

Whether it's 5, 10, 15 or 20 years down the road.

No, no, totally.

And every experience take you to the next one.

Right.

And one example that relates to aviation, I told you I did a transition as a late, in late age to the Apache, which is an advanced helicopter, glass cockpit, different armament equipment, different systems.

A huge change for me, you know, and, and going back to a student, I was almost 30 at that time.

Going back to Be a student, you felt like you're going back to flight school.

Now, that's already a mentality that put you on the edge, right?

Put you in a corner.

Because, wait, I'm experienced pilot, you know, I did a lot of things, you know, so now I'm back to a student that somebody, the younger than me tells me how to fly now and things like that.

So, so, but, but those are experience that, that happened to you in life, right.

I moved to the US I had now a new company to work with, new people, new mentality, new culture.

This is a new change.

You need to learn how to adapt, how to fit yourself to those kind of environment.

And just that fact of changing an aircraft, to me, it was a similar transition.

Like that, learning how to adopt myself, how to adjust myself to that new situation, to that new mentality, by the way, without affecting my success.

Because becoming a student, you can also become, you know, the small student that's, you know, focused on the smallest drill and skill that you need to do.

But you need to look at the bigger picture.

Right.

You need to look, how do you get yourself better without, by the way, doing a safety incident?

Yeah.

Because that's always in flying, right.

That takes you back.

Every safety event that you have, you need to do to beat me or a bit more cautious now to take your, your, your spares.

And that's part of the challenge.

And that's a lot of things I learned again, just from transitioning from one aircraft to another and at the an older age and, and seeing how that experience can affect other parts of my life.

Absolutely.

I'm sure that was pretty humbling too, when all of a sudden you got this 21 or 18, how were they old?

They are teaching you how to fly something.

You're like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

I got experience.

You come to this new airplane, you switch airplanes, and whatever worked in the last airplane is not going to work in the new airplane.

You know, you're just kind of like, this is how we did in the old airplane.

We're like, well, hey, old man, this is how we do it in the new one.

All right?

Correct.

It's humbling and it's important.

Like you said, growth is huge.

You know, if you're not growing and someone else is getting better than you.

And we used to say, I played football in college, American football, I should say, not soccer.

But we always said that if you're not getting better every day, you're technically getting worse and someone is getting better than you as well.

So if it's important for you to grow.

And if that's a goal that you want, there's nothing better to do than change airplanes, change scenery, choose the hard subject.

Choose something that's difficult.

It gets you out of your comfort zone and puts you in a fight or flight mode and see how you do totally.

And also enjoy the road.

Right?

That's another thing.

If you only think about the peak that you will get eventually, most of the time you're climbing.

Right?

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See you there.

And now back to today's episode.

I want to talk a little bit more about Skypath now.

So how did Skypath come about?

Like you mentioned, you're in the US your wife's getting her PhD, you're working here.

Was it just like someone was like hey, a buddy from the military, hey, we got this new app working on, you know, it's aviation and technology.

We would love to have you here or how did that all come together?

So I think again at that time we returned to Israel already.

My wife finished her PhD and started position here in Israel and I started to work back in Elbit system Israel and I was managing now the international business development for the rotary wing division.

So I was in charge on a lot of new business and I had a good experience on that part and I felt like I'm missing a big chunk of business that I'm not experienced.

At that time Elbit had some organization change and Maya rco, she and I served together in the squadron, had the opportunity to work in LB together.

So we knew each other for a while and she convinced me that's a great timing, a good opportunity and did that leap as well.

And I said it's now, never right to a certain time time.

And I tried and I have to say same same as my other experience.

It's incredible experience to work in this kind of Industry, you know, a bit more cutting edge technology, apps, you know, the whole concept of software as a service, it's something that doesn't happen so much in the military aspect.

Right.

In defense industry.

So this is aspect of the market that I was exposed to and in this organization that I wasn't exposed in elbit.

And that's part of the reason I decided to do this kind of transition.

What excited you about Skypath or my ecology?

What was like kind of, not necessarily what did she say?

But was it the app, was it the technology?

Was it just the fact that you've been an aircraft, whether it's a helicopter, whether it's an airplane and you had turbulence and you're like, wow, I really wish I knew when this tournament was going to happen so I didn't have to come through this.

What was it?

I think like every good business, first of all I saw a problem that needs to be solved.

That's the first thing you like to solve problems, right.

If it's just for the fun of it, it's not the same.

So I saw first of all a problem that needs to be solved.

Secondly, I saw actually a valid solution, a very good solution patent, a unique solution that can actually, with the right distribution, with the right development, can actually solve the problem big time.

And that's what the, the second part and the third part, it was related to aviation.

So for me it was a transition was very natural, you know, to this aviation segment.

Again, different, not the defense industry, but still aviation, still related, still talking about, with pilots, still talking about flying, still talking about your day to day experience.

And, and I think that was the third part that connected me or hooked me into Skypus.

Yeah.

And how long, how long ago have you been there?

When, when did you make the transition to Skypath?

So I'm now closing three years in SkyPass.

Yeah.

So there is a while.

And, and we grew up quite dramatically in the last few years.

Yeah.

And we've been able to first of all grow in the commercial market.

Major carriers that started using us more and more and understood the value that we can provide them in a very easy and seamless way.

And recently we are also growing on the business aviation market.

Corporate aviation or business aviation that again, maybe they don't experience the same incident or the same amount of incidents that happen in commercial aviation, but their overall flight experience to their passengers, to their customers is crucial, maybe even more than, you know, in commercial aviation.

And that's part of the service that we provide or can provide.

Yeah, well, I mean Just speaking on a previous life of mine.

My last job that I was at Fractional, you know, mentioned the company.

But it's.

How do you make it the most personal flight possible?

Right?

Like, how do you put the personal touch on it without going too far?

Right.

There's a common line that you cross.

But just being able to be like, oh, my iPad says there's gonna be turbulence in 15 minutes.

Instead of just hitting like a seatbelt sign, you could be like, all right, you know, I'm gonna go back and talk to the passengers real quick.

Hey, this is Pre Turbulence in 15 minutes.

We recommend you go to the bathroom now or you sit down, put your seatbelt on.

And that just helps out a lot.

Or if you know, you have a.

If you know that the passenger doesn't like turbulence, then you can route around it and you don't have to say anything and you make it as seamless and as easy as possible.

And the best part was using SkyPath is we talked about this before we started recording.

As you look down, it doesn't take long to interpret what's going on, right?

You're like, oh, red's bad, orange bad.

You know, it's like, let's go away from that.

So the hexagonal squares make it.

Or circles, the hexagons makes it very easy to look at and deduce the color and see what's going on and be like, that's bad.

Let's go around.

One of the best stories I had during again the short time I hear we started with one of again of the bigger business aviation company in the US Working together with them.

And I think a few weeks or two weeks before the Super Bowl.

The super bowl is always like the busiest time of the year for those companies.

Insane, insane, insane.

And we had a random call that we talked about total other stuff.

And then one of their chief pilot told me, listen, you won't believe what happened in the last week or two weeks.

We started getting tons of phone calls from our passengers verifying if their crew for the flight to Vegas.

At that time the super bowl was in Vegas has Skypass app.

And for me it was incredible, right?

The busiest time of the year.

That company is getting phone calls from passengers and customers telling them, please verify that Skypas is part of the, you know, of my crew there or supporting the crew that's gonna fly me.

You know, there is nothing better than that from our perspective.

No, I agree.

I mean, and it just goes to.

We talked about in previous episodes.

It's just for A pilot.

And for decision making, it's the overall toolkit.

Right.

And adding another tool to that belt just makes things even easier.

There can be an infinite amount of tools that you have.

Being able to use the ones you want in the right time and be able to deduce information very quickly makes it very important.

So that's what Skyp does.

Yep, exactly.

I asked, I asked Guy this question.

I liked his answer.

I want to see what you do as well.

It kind of put you on the spot.

But let's say I'm a airline executive that you in skypath have been trying to kind of get after and be like, hey, you know, you need this app.

This is why you need it.

This is whatever.

But what is we're stuck in an elevator, we'll say we got like three minutes.

What's your elevator pitch to me?

How would you sell it?

I get it a lot now.

The elevator speech is a big thing now to say.

Yeah.

So first of all, again, I want to verify that you have a problem.

Right?

That's the first thing I want to say, that I'm solving something for you.

I will first verify that you experience what I assume is the problem.

You know, that's the first part.

Time start.

Are you suffering right, from those incidents, from those injuries, from that downtime, you know, from that flight experience, from your passengers?

Again, verify that that's what you have.

And then the second part is, what do you say?

If I can improve that dramatically with basically a download of an app?

That's it.

That's what you need to do, right?

Download app, improve your life, get the best information you have in advance without you on the way at all.

And that's part of the thing.

Our app is doing the work for the pilot.

You don't need to hold or move the iPad and verify that the iPad measured correctly, you can be totally busy with anything else.

And the app will notify you when you are encountering turbulence.

So that was the two part, from my perspective, verifying that you actually suffer from that problem because otherwise I'm not solving anything for you.

And then the other thing, tell me that's the distance.

It's downloading an app and go and try it.

And this app will change your life on that turbulence mitigation.

But that's the thing.

You have to be ahead of the curve with this kind of situation.

Right.

You have to envision where will the solution will be in one year, in two years, in a few years.

And I think that's part of the vision that we try to present to our customers and prospects as well, to show them that we are expanding more and more, that we are improving our solution more and more.

You said about football, right?

You can't stay the same every day.

If you did a practice and you didn't get better, you basically got worse, you know, and that's same with our solution.

If they pass here a day and we didn't get better with more data, with more capabilities, with more redundancy, with more automatic and more AI involved in that, we got worse.

And that's all of us.

When we are coming here to work every day, we are trying to get that better and better.

And eventually I think our customers sees exactly that.

They see that we are coming to work, we are coming to improve that, and we are coming, even the minor errors to correct and get them better.

Other.

Yeah.

As someone who, in a.

As a company that's doing very well in their space, do you find it that you all compete internally to try to create the best app or is it like an external competition that kind of drives and makes you guys want to be the best?

I think, right.

You have a few people from the Air Force here, so obviously we compete, Right.

That's the first thing.

We compete in everything.

Even in our, in our, you know, fun days that we have outside of the office.

There is some, some kind of competition involved there.

Yeah.

So we compete, but we keep it, I think healthy competition.

Right.

And not a bad competition.

I think that's a secret.

And by the way, that's true also for flying, right.

You want to be better or you want to even, even from your co pilot, for example, you, you want to be better from him, but you don't want to ruin his flight or damage his.

Whatever he's doing in order for you to look better.

Right.

So you need to find that right combination, still be competitive.

And that's.

We can't go around it, but have it a healthy competition and not something that will backlash to us and eventually affect the product and affect the overall company.

Yeah.

What's been your favorite kind of from the three years you've been there, what's something that makes you the most proud looking back on?

Is it, I guess give me two answers because I feel like you're going to say people wise, because it sounds like you like people, you like communication.

So I figure there's going to be kind of a personable story there and then also kind of a company technology or software story.

I would say two things that I'm very proud of first of all, we joined the rtca.

Rtca, Are you familiar with that organization?

Is that the Rotary?

I think maybe.

No, I don't remember the abbreviation.

But they basically defined global standards for the FAA and for the Eurocontrol.

Actually, actually.

Oh, cool.

And one of the things we did in two and a half years ago when I joined here, we actually joined their Turbulence committee and be able to share and improve safety for the overall community, you know, and again, as a business, it's not straightforward to do something like that.

Right.

Because you're wasting time and effort.

Nobody pays you for that.

Right.

You're wasting a lot of time and effort and trying to help everybody.

You are sharing a lot of your secrets and a lot of what you're doing.

And for me, getting there and being involved there, it's a huge success.

Being a crucial.

I think we are a crucial member of that committee, the two committee that I'm a member in.

And for me that's something we are very proud of that movement and that fact that we didn't look at ourselves, didn't look purely at the business success and wanted to share our knowledge, our information, our vision with the global community, whether they are Europe or us.

I think that's one crucial part.

I think the other part that I'm proud, the fact that we are transitioning now or exposing this solution to the business aviation, corporate aviation market again in commercial aviation, there was other solution.

You could install on the aircraft the software that will do very similar to what we are doing, but that require an actual software installed on the aircraft.

Okay.

And for the business cooperative segments, it's totally irrelevant with all the different aircraft they have.

So for me, that the fact that we open that market that we are exposing us of and the feedback that we are getting from customers, like that super bowl story that I told you that for me, the other major success that we be able to shift this boat a bit to that market as well.

And again, not look at the pure revenue line, but look at the overall advantage that we provide the community again, whether they are pilot dispatchers or even the regulator as the faa, air traffic control and so on.

So that's part of the change we are trying to bring.

Yeah, sounds like you started with the gold airlines.

Right now you're a business aviation corporate.

And then there's also a huge market of ga.

Whether GA and general aviation maybe is more an American thing than is others, but there's still some GA out there elsewhere and there's still very valuable resources and people.

I mean you can probably agree to this.

Not all pilots love turbulence, right?

It doesn't matter what you're flying.

If you're flying a Piper, if you're flying a 747, you know, over the ocean, it's like you want a smooth ride.

If you ask any pilot, they usually want the most boring flight possible, and that's a smooth ride.

So if I'm flying a Sirius, you know, it'd be nice to look down at app like, oh, turbulence, let's go this way.

So it's really cool to see what, what all you guys are doing.

What would you say is your favorite feature to use on the app whenever you get the chance to use it?

The favorite feature, I would say, again, the number one feature is the notification.

From my perspective, first of all, again, because the expectations is for a pilot to be, you know, to know everything around him and be on top of that and be ready.

But part of the advantage with today tools that, you know, the pilot can do whatever he needs to do, and the solution or whatever system can actually notify him, alert him at time and, you know, at the right moment in time.

Right.

We talk about it in the start.

You need to know what you're doing in each moment.

And the notification feature that we have, automatic notification without the pilot involvement working even in the background, to me, that's the most crucial feature, you know, because eventually the fact that the data is there, it's one level, but you want to bring the data into the pilot eyes, into the pilot view and verify he's aware of them and act accordingly.

Right.

And to me.

So that's the best and most important feature, that notification that we have.

Yeah.

And talking with guy, talking with Maya, talking with you, knowing that it's just like an overall team app.

Right.

So you can have dispatch, you can have pilots, flight attendants, maybe even.

I don't, I don't know for sure if there's a passenger version, but I feel like I remember hearing something about passengers as well.

So now maybe it's not best to give the passengers all the information.

Right.

But having the ability to know what, what they went through or what was right there or the decision that was made, you know, but it's an essential safety app.

Right.

Like we mentioned, the toolkit and the tool belt for multiple people to look at, have eyes on, to make sure what everyone wants when they fly commercially or whenever they fly private, is to have a safe flight and land at their destination.

So it's just a great tool to have and to be able to use.

Correct.

No, no, I agree.

It's.

And I think passenger is, is on the roadmap.

It will get there.

It will get there.

No doubt about it.

And I think you said something very true.

It's you need to bring the right information to the right person.

Right.

We talk about pilot, flight attendant, dispatchers.

They don't need the same information.

Right.

They don't need the same notification.

But each of them needs different aspect of the information and in the right timing, in the right method.

And part of the challenge is not only, again, not only presenting the data, not only bringing the data, but bringing the data at the right time at the right level to this specific Persona, you know, and that's what we are trying to do with all our solution.

And that include again the pilots, the cabin crew, the dispatchers and hopefully to the passengers very soon as well.

Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, yeah, when you talk about what dispatchers need, they could be like the amount of flights have deviated off this course, you know, then they can make that all right.

Well if there's 20% of flights are deviating, we should probably go somewhere else.

And pilots need to know what's happening now, what's happening in 15 minutes and the dispatcher can help look down the road as well.

So like it's a team effort and just having the ability to have multiple eyes on safety just makes a big difference as well.

Correct.

If we talked about notification in the notification feature for pilots we give something like about 10, 15 minutes notification, right.

And that's a reasonable time.

They need to take a decent decision.

But for the dispatchers, when he's maybe effective planning, we give up to one hour notification.

That allows him plenty of time to decide do I change route, do I notify, do I verify if the crew is aware of that or not and things like that.

So again, fitting whatever solution you are providing to the right person in the right time, I think that's a crucial part of any good solution.

Absolutely, totally agree.

And I think it's really cool what you guys have done.

You know, I have been a fan since I've used it.

We talked about it before, but Skypath's great.

I love to continue to see it get bigger, to continue to grow.

And as I mentioned, just seeing it in everyone's iPad, right.

Like whether it's GA and they're serious and they're, they're 152 whatever they're flying around, you know, I think it's me really cool to use as a tool or even in check rides, you know, hey show the examiner be like hey look this is what our, our route is going to look like.

This is what the turbulence looks like.

Just ease of mind for everything.

Checkride, flight, anything.

I think it's a, it's just a must have.

But yeah, I appreciate you coming on.

It was a lot of fun to talk with you and share your story.

I can tell from right away like you and I are very similar, competitive person.

You sound like the closer.

You sound like Maya calls you and be like he's like a guy.

We need you.

Come on in.

I'm gonna fly to Dubai to talk people.

We need to make this happen.

But I appreciate you coming on and your story is awesome and I love how well rounded you are and that you weren't afraid to say no to certain situations like to go be a rancher in Australia.

Which when I was leaving college I wanted to move to Australia, New Zealand so bad.

Not necessarily to be a rancher, but just to be a part of the culture and be down there and maybe surf a little bit.

But it was really cool to to hear your story and talk about Skypath and I can't wait to see where it goes.

Same here.

I appreciate the talk and all the good questions.

AV Nation that's a wrap on today's episode.

Thank you so much for listening.

Like I said earlier, if you are not following, if you're not subscribing, go to Spotify right now, Hit follow, subscribe, whatever that button is that they have.

And also take your dad's phone, take your mom's phone, your sister, your wife, your husband, whatever may be just hit subscribe as well.

You know, maybe they need some aviation in their life as well.

I said as well as a lot.

But I think it's time to go.

It's 10:46.

We just had to move back into our house after I was hanging curtains and a pipe burst.

Yeah, not a good story story for another day.

But we had to get our floors redone to say the least.

So Avia Nation, I hope you're having a great day and as always, happy flying.

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