This is an AI transcription, apologies for any typos.

[00:00:00] Arjun Shah: First, it's like I don't fit into my clothes, which then goes to, I don't look very good, which then leads into the insecurity of like, how will everyone else perceive me?

[00:00:08] Alex Melia: Welcome to Stories of Men Beneath the Surface. I'm Alex, me. Join me as we discover what it means to be a man in the modern era.

Everyone knows what it feels like to suddenly not fit into one of your favorite shirts or pair of trousers. But the reality is that process isn't sudden at all. It's the result of weeks, months, or even years of making daily choices. Argent Sha loved going to weddings, being part of a Hindu family and community in Hartfordshire.

He would regularly attend huge gatherings to experience a rite of passage with friends and family. Complete with singing, dancing, and extravagant outfits. Then one Saturday in July, 2012, his attitude changed after years of having no structure around both his fitness and healthy eating.

[00:01:08] Arjun Shah: I don't plan anything in my life, let alone what I'm gonna wear to a wedding. And so I hadn't been to one in a while and I thought that the outfit that I'd worn the year before or whenever the last wedding was, was gonna fit and was a point in my life that was much more conscious about where I was and how I looked.

And as, as you do, I'm sure a lot of people go through it, my outfit didn't fit. And you've gotta imagine like it's, it's a cultural outfit or what you call a, so. It's a very long purple sequined kind of one piece with some very baggy white trousers, but, you know, like got sequined, very pretty looking and quite fitted as well because it's, it's a lot like a, uh, a suit that you'd use to, to perhaps like a Christian wedding or something along the lines of

got outta bed, brush your teeth, shower, then try and put on this outfit. Most Indian men, I have the same issue, which is I have a. I have a stomach on me. Most men know what it's like when something doesn't fit. You know, the stomach doesn't fit, but neither the shoulders 'cause fat goes everywhere. And then like everything squeezes you in, like really tight.

So your head just looks massive in proportion to what you're trying to wear. I, I ended up borrowing one of my dads who, which did fit, and we drove to this wedding at a. Cultural Center. It's called the Ashwell Center. It's a white building with all the arches and trimmings that you'd expect from like a, a beautiful cultural center.

In potter's butt, and I just remember feeling like shit the whole way there. Like just negative thoughts First it's like I don't fit into my clothes, which then goes to, I don't look very good, which then leads into the insecurity of like, how will everyone else perceive me? Everyone's getting outta their cars.

There's like, uh, aunts and uncles and like people from both sides of the family talking to one another. As the groom arrives to the wedding, he usually comes with a party. And so if you've ever seen a doll, which is like that, that drum that is worn around the neck, that plays those, the, the rhythm that that Punjabi mc rhythm, I guess is the easiest reference points that most people have, which is like, no, no, no, no, no, no.

So that will go on. One of the most exciting things about the morning is being able to just hear that coming and it's loud, like the point is just to like, Usher in the groom, and so you have cars beeping horns. You have like this massive procession of music and dance coming towards you. I love being extroverted.

I love dancing. I love doing anything that is to do with these weddings. Like it's, it's a very cool thing. Like all the men get involved, all the women get involved, loads of dancing and happiness. I just remember carrying away, away. I already, I feel like shit about how I look and, you know, photographers everywhere.

Do I want to get caught on camera with my fat ass just to then relive that moment in HD six months down the line when the photos get delivered. And I remember very specifically an aunt, her kids are married and it was worded as a piece of fun. It wasn't like in a malicious. Oh, when are you getting married?

It's, it's more, oh, when's it your turn? It it what? What was meant to be a playful? When are you getting married? What's next? And I guess the answer now these days is, Oh, you know, it's coming. Whatever, at the time felt like judgment and just like, not like a fun question to be asked. And I just remember internally just being like, I don't freeze very often when talking to someone.

I just, just kind of brushed it off as one of those questions that you don't really wanna answer. I remember just feeling. Not like everyone else. I'm probably one of the la not probably, I am one of the last ones, one of the youngest in my family, uh, bar, the much younger generation that's not married. And so it's like, it's, what's wrong with me?

What's wrong with me?

[00:05:00] Alex Melia: The problem is that you were quite young back then. I mean, this was 10 years ago, so you, your, your maturity levels, your understanding of other people. Grows as you get older. It's very interesting the way that we look at ourselves and the way that other people perceive us, and we have this feeling of they're just thinking about me and they're just judging me.

But actually in reality, they're probably just thinking maybe you are judging them and they're thinking about the way that they're being perceived. Did you think about that upon reflection? So I wasn't thinking about this stuff. 10 years ago, for example,

[00:05:33] Arjun Shah: I've had comments about my weight and my looks from my family, which has made it harder for me to think or accept that they don't think about that when they look at me.

For me specifically, there's been like small moments where you'll be like, oh, you won't, you won't get married to anyone if you do that. Or like, the words aren't as specific as, you won't be good enough if you look like this, or you do this for a career, or whatever it looks like. But it's, it's the intention behind it, which is less focus on being happy and more focus on being.

Not even culture, just normal or a perceived version of

[00:06:04] Alex Melia: normal. That's the important thing. Is it? What's the intention behind it? Yeah, I'd like

[00:06:09] Arjun Shah: to think that everyone wants the best for me, but I think everyone's version of what's best for me isn't, isn't actually what's best for me has been the learning.

Like, you know, I know what's best for me. I'm

[00:06:20] Alex Melia: me. Sometimes it's difficult to separate, for example, If we take into account our parents' expectations of us e

[00:06:27] Arjun Shah: even to this day, there are the, the people who I hold closest to me. And I imagine yourself as well hold the most power when it comes to who you, I self-identify as.

Like if my mother was to tell me, you are this, you are the people who know me best, and if you are saying that, then people who don't know me must have an even more negative view of me.

[00:06:47] Alex Melia: It's really interesting. I was just thinking back to the fact that you walk up in the morning and immediately you didn't feel good at all.

And I've had that experience myself. When you wake up, you have a negative thought. Then it expands, gets much bigger. Before you know it, your whole day is an absolute write off, but you've made that decision to actually have a bad day because it just snowballs from there. So you've made that decision, and I actually had this experience last week.

I woke up, had a headache, was not feeling great, had a few difficult jobs to do that morning. Had a really bad cough, pulled a muscle in my neck and shoulder the day before in the gym. Didn't warm up properly. I was doing my shoulder exercises, felt it straight away, pulled that muscle. So I had all these things conspiring against me.

And I do remember listening to a podcast by a guy called Naval Ravikant, and he talked about meeting a guy from Tony Robbins's team, you know, Tony Robbins, the personal development guy. And he said that he could see that this guy in Tony Robbins' team was just happy all the time, just laughing, joking, make you feel people feel good about themselves.

And he went over to him and said, what's your secret man? Why are you so happy all the time? He said, I've had a lot of difficult things going on in my life, and I just made the decision to myself one day. I want to be the happy guy. Why can't that guy be me? So I just make the decision to be happy every day, and I thought that's really simple concept.

And in this situation now with my headache, with my, my neck and shoulder not feeling good, my cough, the difficult tasks that I'm doing that day, I'm just gonna decide to have a good day. And it sounds a bit cheesy, but I did it and actually I had a great day. So I think sometimes I've thought to myself upon reflection, I've just decided that I'm gonna have a shit day, and then guess what?

I got what I asked for and had a shit day. So it seems like you had that experience, you made that decision subconsciously, I'm gonna have a shit day.

[00:08:48] Arjun Shah: When you're talking about things like weight and like, perhaps even like where you are in life, I think I made the choice weeks, months, years in advance to have a shit day that day.

What I intend to say is that, like, solve problems before they become a problem and what, what happened or is I didn't foresee, just not feeling like I look good, becoming a problem, which I should have solved. Weeks, months in advance. 'cause you know, there's nothing I could have done it. Like there's no amount of preparation I could have done the day before.

To look better the next day, or be it a very va vain metric, but it's a real thing, you know, like you should be in good shape. Uh, in most ideal scenarios, at least the way I framed it over the following years is like, if you're choosing to look that way, don't be sad because it's not one choice that you're making.

It's, it's multiple, like every time you eat too much at breakfast or like you fucking don't go to the gym, it's just another choice that you've made to end up where you are. You're

[00:09:42] Alex Melia: absolutely right. It's about taking a hundred percent responsibility for yourself, isn't it? And I think what we do as people, we leave things to the last minute.

We're not thinking about this wedding 3, 4, 5 months in advance, looking at ourselves and going, you know what? I'm not in the shape that I want to be in this outfit is not going to fit me. We're not thinking about that. Or if we are, we're, we're kind of burying our heads in the sands, in the sands in the sand, thinking that.

If I go to sleep tonight, wake up in the morning, everything will be okay, or you're just wanting to just forget about it completely and just erase the idea in your mind that I've got this big family wedding that I need to go to in three months, four months. I'm not going to try and lose the weight, so I'll just keep I.

Doing what I always do, which is perhaps eating unhealthily or not exercising, et cetera. But it is a, it is sort of an extreme ownership issue, isn't it? And I've experienced this before. I've had times where I've got a, I've got a belly going on and not feeling good about myself and increases in size decreases, and it's, you have this yoyo effect, like eating

[00:10:48] Arjun Shah: for me is a coping me well.

It has been a coping mechanism. So you don't, you know, I'm not thinking about the next time this is gonna be a problem because actually. My problem isn't what the, the most active problem is, call you, eat too much. But like the deep problem is why am I so stressed that I'm turning to food? Or like, why am I even turning to food in the first place?

Which is what's causing me to have that reaction. And you know, I'm sure you have this too, which is like you have a certain experience and you'd be like, well, you know, How far can I go back to like pinpointing the cause of this? And it's usually, well, if I didn't do this, didn't do that, and then you can go back weeks, months, years to be like, you know, if I didn't meet this person back then I wouldn't end up here.

[00:11:25] Alex Melia: It's a really interesting point that you mentioned about the coping mechanism because I would say 90, 95% of my days. I'm doing a seven or eight out of 10 in terms of happiness. You know, I'm pretty happy with the way things are going in my life, and definitely that's not been always the case on a rare day where I actually review it at the end and think I actually had a bad day.

What I do is I'll go, I've had a tough day, so I'm gonna have this chocolate bar. I'm gonna have this. Unhealthy takeaway. I'm gonna have a couple of beers because I feel like I deserve it. Um, I definitely feel like I also use food and drink as a coping mechanism as well. So it's interesting. We, we, we seek comfort because we've had discomfort with our day, whether that's through our perceptions or the way that we've thought about the day, or if it's actually in reality being a difficult day.

Over the last

[00:12:14] Arjun Shah: maybe few years, it's been learning just to feel those feelings and then figure out what they mean later. Like, uh, I don't think I've, I. I have a very few friends that I go to and trust with everything because at the same time, like I don't, I don't know. I don't think I've got the either courage.

There's a lot of talk about vulnerability and just being more vulnerable. I don't know how safe that is. Like you should never tell everyone anything is one of the rules that I, I've learned. And because you never know what someone else's intentions are with your information. So I've got a few cousins that I treat, like brothers who know mostly everything.

Mostly everything.

[00:12:54] Alex Melia: I feel like I could be vulnerable more so around women than men. I do share vulnerable things with male friends as well, but I just feel more comfortable around women. There's just a beautiful, there's a beautiful energy about women in terms of understanding, in terms of listening, not passing judgment, that kind of thing.

In my, when one of the episodes that I talked about where I was the guest I talked about, Being attacked in Mexico and immediately telling a few female friends and they immediately said, oh Alex, I'm so sorry this happened. What can I do for you? If I was around you right now, I'd give you a massive hug.

And I told some male friends and they said, oh shit man. Sorry to hear that. They then followed it up with, I can't believe you didn't get any punches on these guys as a joke. So it just shows the difference between men and women.

[00:13:47] Arjun Shah: Yeah. I mean, it depends what you want to hear. I, I agree. Like, you know, I agree with you.

I, I will, I get, I could definitely be closer with female friends, but, uh, or more vulnerable with female friends, but I can be more vulnerable with male family and in the truist, like people that are, like people that I've grown up with. But if I, if I'm ever going through something where I need to speak to someone who's not, like my direct.

That I've, I've known for years and years and years. Yeah, women are far more understanding of those situations because I feel like it's just with the boys. The way that we show love is we'll rip the shit out of each other.

[00:14:27] Alex Melia: This episode made me think about the subconscious decisions that we make, like with Aja not wanting to go to the wedding, that these can become a real self-fulfilling prophecy. And it can build and build and build to the point where you say, I'm not interesting. I'm not smart, I'm ugly. I'm this, I'm not that.

How would things have been different for Arjun if he'd have just embraced his weight gain? All the other factors in his life that weren't going the way he wanted, culminated in this huge beast. Causing negative feelings and negative emotions. It got me thinking if he wasn't unemployed, would he have felt so strongly, so negatively about his weight gain?

I've learned that one uncomfortable feeling in my stomach can create hundreds of hurtful, crazy, and intrusive thoughts that just spiral out of control. What we resist. Persists, as they say. It's well known that power, status, and control, which are really important attributes to men lay in the stomach area.

It's fascinating because I noticed a while ago that sometimes when I felt like my power or my control was threatened, I would almost subconsciously rub my stomach, which was a kind of a protection mechanism. It was to say, don't worry, Alex. Everything's okay. I'm gonna look after you. And I realized for many years, I'd rubbed my stomach in this sort of magic hope that I'd acquired a six pack in some way without actually doing any of the work.

I realized it was definitely a protection thing and I'd had trapped energy there. Our egos lie in our stomach and it's where our need for shiny things, cars. Watches jewelry, like I feel like one aspect of it is about decreasing our preoccupation with how we look and comparing ourselves to other men out there, which is difficult when we are bombarded with men with six packs on social media, films, television, if we're always optimizing every area of our health.

Whether it's diet, strength, training and so on, what's the cost of doing all this? What's the cost to other areas of our lives as well? I did an Ayahuasca seven day retreat in Peru last year in November, and if you've not heard of it, it's a plant medicine that originated in South America. After taking it, it initially made me hyper aware of others, constantly comparing myself to other people.

And it's taken a lot of counseling to really reduce those triggers and to not make me feel so aware of it. It's led me to the conclusion of how do we find the middle ground of happiness? Well, I believe it's about balance and not taking things to the extreme. This is something that I've made the mistake of doing many times in the past, and I know I'm gonna have one friend in particular listening to this episode saying, I've been telling you this for 15, 20 years, Alex, that it's all about balance and you had to go to Peru and do ayahuasca to find this answer out.

So perhaps it's a lesson that you should always listen to your friends. It's also about mindset and what you want in life, because there might be many people out there who've got the same body shape as AR and are completely fine with it. Horses for courses, we might not always want the conventional things that are on offer.

We might be happy with what's been given to us or what we've created.