You don't get to choose which state you're in.
In this episode, the Polyvagal Ladder, Deb Dana's metaphor for how you flow
through the autonomic states, why you can't skip rungs, why you don't get
to choose which state you're in, and what that means for the way you've
likely been blaming yourself for past reactions or lack of reactions.
I'm Justin Sunseri, a therapist, self-regulation coach, and Polyvagal
Institute editorial board member.
You're listening to Stuck Not Broken, Book One: Trauma and the Polyvagal Paradigm.
This is an audiobook, and it's meant to be heard in order.
Each episode obviously builds upon the one that came before it.
So if you're just finding the show now, welcome, uh, but also go back and
start f- from the beginning, especially if this is new material for you.
It'll make a lot more sense, uh, that way.
The Polyvagal Ladder.
The Polyvagal Ladder is a metaphor from Deb Dana.
It helps us to understand how we move through our primary autonomic states.
Just as with a ladder, our active autonomic state shifts
up and down sequentially.
The active state does not skip rungs of the ladder.
It moves through them one by one.
Also, like a ladder, there's a top, middle, and bottom to our primary
polyvagal states, quite literally.
The safety pathways, ventral vagal, connect our brain stem to our
heart, neck, and facial muscles.
The safety state is the highest point of the Polyvagal Ladder,
and it's at the top of our bodies.
In the middle rung of the Polyvagal Ladder is the flight-fight system,
sympathetic, and that's located in the spinal cord and the chest.
At the bottom of the ladder is the shutdown system, dorsal vagal,
and that resides in the gut.
If you aren't literally safe, you lose access to the safety pathways
and drop down your autonomic ladder into the flight-fight system The first
sympathetic impulse is to escape danger, to create space and get to safety.
But if that doesn't work, the second sympathetic impulse is to use aggression,
closing space to get the danger to back off, and then create space by fleeing.
If aggression doesn't work, you drop down further into your shutdown
system at the bottom of the ladder and collapse in immobilization.
This is a seq-sequence of shifts, not a choice that you make.
Like a ladder, you climb down and climb up in a sequence.
Same with our autonomic states.
We shift through them in a sequence, not as a result of choice.
The reverse is also true.
If you exist in a shutdown state, you need to climb your polyvagal ladder
through flight-fight and back into safety.
You don't skip flight-fight from shutdown and then enter your safety state.
Let's illustrate the polyvagal ladder metaphor through two scenarios.
The first is a more obvious one, uh, focusing on actual survival.
The second is a human example not directly related to survival, but
shows how we still use these pathways.
Example one, gazelles.
Imagine a herd of gazelles on the open plain, grazing and chatting with
each other about recent herd events.
They feel relaxed and connected in their safety states.
They hear something, though, moving in the brush, and they turn to the sound.
One of them says, "Did everyone else hear that?" They nod,
for they did indeed hear it.
"Okay, here's what we're going to…" Suddenly, a lion springs out of the
brush, sprinting toward the herd.
The herd members each drop out of their safety state into their
sympathetic flight-fight state and run as fast as possible.
But the lion catches one of them, pouncing and dragging it to the ground.
Its flight activation was insuffec- insufficient, and it could not
act on any aggressive fight impulse that it may have had.
The gazelle collapses limply into its shutdown state, not dead,
but immobile and playing dead.
The lion pauses to breathe, panting as it recovers from
using its own sympathetic energy.
Its enormous body desperately needs oxygen
A pack of hyenas approaches the scene, opportunistically seeking out the kill.
The lion growls, "Back off before I make you back off," to the hyena
pack, and they respond, "You and what army?" The lion is stumped.
Its brain freezes, unable to respond to the hyenas' retort.
During this mental standoff between the hyenas and the lion,
our gazelle friend unconsciously detects an opportunity to escape.
It uses its power and sympathetic fight state to push off the ground
and swing its majestic gazelle head around, creating space.
Then, as the hyenas and lion reel back, the gazelle sprints for
safety using its flight activation.
It reaches its herd, and they greet each other with whatever greetings gazelles
do and re-accessing its safety state.
Indeed, a beautiful sight, surely, I assume.
I really don't know, but you get the idea.
Look, it's, it's just a made-up example of… to illustrate the polyvagal ladder,
and I think it's entertaining too.
Example two, you're at work.
Imagine you're at work feeling relaxed and engaged with your colleagues.
Now, I said imagine for a reason, okay?
You're in your safety state at the top of your polyvagal ladder.
You are collaboratively working and sharing ideas, smiling, and everybody
is just absolutely enthralled with you and everything about you.
Suddenly, you're informed that you must give an impromptu presentation
to the entire team, including your higher-ups, in just a few minutes.
Not only that, but your job and your livelihood depend on your success.
Your state quickly shifts to flight activation.
"Oh, crud," you exclaim to yourself, but also, unfortunately,
loud enough for others to hear.
Your heart rate increases, your palms get sweaty, and your mind races as you
desperately attempt to think of a way out of the situation, but there is none.
You get angry, entering your fight state.
"How dare they do this to me? How dare they bombard me with this unlikely
and happenstance situation? This is an outrage of the highest order."
You say these words to yourself, keeping your fight energy inside.
And obviously, it would be inappropriate to say aloud and would likely result in
your termination from your position and the loss of your colleagues' adoration.
You clench your fists and march forward into the conference room.
As you begin the presentation, you feel overwhelmed by the staring eyes
and the importance of the moment.
You find it hard to focus, and your voice falters.
You think about losing your job, about being booed by your colleagues,
and tomatoes being chucked your way.
Why are they bringing tomatoes to work?
You have entered the shutdown state, feeling disconnection and numbness.
But somehow you make it through the presentation, seemingly on autopilot.
After the presentation, you receive some positive feedback.
Your colleagues say, "We had no idea that you knew so much about
whatever thing. Great job, colleague."
"Really?" you say nervously, looking at the ground.
Your eyes dart up at them briefly.
"You really mean that?"
"Indeed we do," they each say simultaneously.
"I was so upset. Wow, what a relief." Energy comes back into your system
as you laugh nervously with an awkward smile, feeling on edge and
unsure if you trust the feedback.
"No, we really mean it. You have incredibly extensive knowledge
of whatever thing, and you present it very well. Great job."
You smile, you take a deep breath, and
exhale slowly, relaxing into your safety state.
"Hey, colleagues, let's all spend time together doing something
social and smiling," you say.
And so you do.
Remember, these states are functions of the autonomic nervous system, the ANS.
These autonomic shifts operate largely outside of our
conscious awareness and control.
The ANS constantly regulates vital functions like heart rate,
digestion, respiratory rate, and more.
In response to our environment, the autonomic nervous system seamlessly
shifts between states of safety, mobilization, and immobilization,
but it does so sequentially up and down the ladder, not randomly.
These shifts are not choices that we make.
They are autonomic responses that evolved to enhance the potential of survival.
The ANS adapts to perceived threats or safety cues by transitioning through
different physiological states.
This process occurs without our conscious input, which means we don't
get to choose the autonomic state that we are in at any given moment.
Our capacity for social engagement, or lack thereof, is inherently
tied to our autonomic functioning.
The same applies to other reactions like running away, fighting back,
collapsing, appeasing or freezing.
Shifting into and out of these states is a dynamic, fluid process.
Understanding the lack of conscious control over these shifts is important,
and I can't stress this enough.
This is foundational in creating a new narrative for yourself.
Autonomic states are not under your conscious control.
You cannot choose to switch states.
Our reactions to stress or traumatic incidents are not a matter of choice
or character, but rather the result of deeply ingrained biological processes.
And, yeah, a healthy dose of nurture along with nature.
However, these autonomic responses can become dysregulated.
One can actually get stuck in a defensive state, making movement through that
polyvagal ladder much more difficult, including accessing the safety state.
There are some pieces of good news that I got for, for you.
Number one, even though you can't consciously control and change your
autonomic state, you can consciously set yourself up for a greater
likelihood of shifting up your polyvagal ladder toward regulation.
Number two, you can also consciously experience your states
as they are and as they shift.
Number three, you can consciously feel and experience more safety in
your body and then extend it further.
And number four, you can consciously reduce obstacles
to polyvagal ladder climbing.
I discuss all of these pieces of good news in books two and three in a lot of depth.
Applying this to a possible new narrative.
When we look back at things we've been through, we often blame ourselves
for how we did or did not react.
Like, "I should have blank," or, "If only I didn't blank."
But again, our polyvagal states are not an issue of choice, neither are the behaviors
we have access to from our state.
Ladder climbing is a sequence of events, not a menu of options.
No one is picking their autonomic states or how they react to
potentially traumatic situations.
As I share this basic level of polyvagal theory knowledge with my therapy clients,
I often see a gloss, I'm not sure how to put it, come over their faces.
Their affect goes flat, but not in a disconnected way.
Their minds go to some memory, and they rapidly piece together a new
understanding of what they went through.
Instead of blame, there's now an opening for understanding
and maybe even self-compassion.
I hope you build that for yourself as well.
I invite you to objectively look at what you have learned so far and
apply it to yourself as best you can.
Objectivity with ourselves is not easy
That's the polyvagal ladder.
The Polyvagal Current.
So that was the Polyvagal Ladder.
Um, and that is Deb Dana's metaphor, and it's a great one for
understanding the overall sequence.
I've used this extensively for years.
And there are other autonomic models out there, like the stoplight one.
But I also created my own that does something that the others don't, and
that's show the fluid changing nature of the autonomic states, as well as how
they interact with each other, as well as how adding or taking away safety
influence affects the entire system.
I call it the Polyvagal Current.
It's free on my site, and you can interact with it today.
There's a page dedicated to it, plus two more pages that teach you
how to apply it to your own life and how to apply it to unstucking.
Go to stucknotbroken.com/polyvagal-current
to get started or just tap the link in the description.
Next time, as we continue Stuck Not Broken Book One- Neuroception, the unconscious
mechanism that triggers your state shifts up and down the polyvagal ladder.
What it is, what it's trying to detect, and why some of us struggle
with detecting safety accurately.
Thank you so much for listening