1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:04,120 Welcome to Heaven Earth Church. 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:06,040 My name is Ross Stackhouse. 3 00:00:06,040 --> 00:00:09,040 I'm the founding pastor of Heaven Earth Church. 4 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:13,280 From the beginning, our heart was to be a church for people who 5 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:15,040 don't fit neatly into church. 6 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:19,200 Our heart is to meet people where they are, to learn their stories, 7 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:20,720 to honor their stories. 8 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:23,840 Because in every human story is God's story. 9 00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:27,840 In this podcast, you'll hear more about the people who now call 10 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:29,400 Heaven Earth Church home. 11 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,420 Their stories, in many cases of misfits who are discovering or 12 00:00:33,420 --> 00:00:34,700 rediscovering faith. 13 00:00:34,860 --> 00:00:38,140 If you want to know more about us, you can go to heavenorthchurch.org 14 00:00:38,620 --> 00:00:41,660 Otherwise, we invite you now into the story. 15 00:00:42,300 --> 00:00:43,180 Hello good people. 16 00:00:43,180 --> 00:00:47,900 Brad Miller here, the producer of the Heaven Earth Church podcast. 17 00:00:48,300 --> 00:00:51,940 One of the main benefits of being a part of the Heaven Earth 18 00:00:51,940 --> 00:00:57,980 Church community is our Sunday morning conversations taught by founding 19 00:00:57,980 --> 00:01:00,100 pastor Ross Stackhound. 20 00:01:00,180 --> 00:01:04,900 You can watch and participate in the Sunday morning conversation 21 00:01:05,460 --> 00:01:13,940 this Sunday morning, 9:30am Eastern time at YouTube.com heavenerthchurch. 22 00:01:14,980 --> 00:01:19,860 The audio version of the Sunday morning conversation is available 23 00:01:19,860 --> 00:01:24,580 here on the podcast, which you can find at Apple Podcasts, Spotify 24 00:01:25,260 --> 00:01:33,580 and on the website, which is heavenearthchurch.org now with the 25 00:01:33,580 --> 00:01:40,944 message on fire the Holy Spirit in each person from June 29, 26 00:01:41,176 --> 00:01:50,930 2025 is heaven Earth Church Pastor Ross Stackhouse. 27 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:55,400 Lord, help us to be aware of your presence here with us. 28 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,360 Help us to be aware of your Holy Spirit. 29 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,480 Guide our path going forward, even today. 30 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:04,560 Help us to hear something that we could not hear on our own, to 31 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,880 see something and to ultimately do something to live out 32 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:08,520 our faith. 33 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:11,960 In Jesus name, Amen. 34 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:14,520 So I have a question to start for you today. 35 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,510 It's similar to a question we've asked recently, but a little 36 00:02:18,510 --> 00:02:19,030 bit different. 37 00:02:20,230 --> 00:02:24,030 I don't want you to give me an answer based on what you think the 38 00:02:24,030 --> 00:02:25,110 answer should be. 39 00:02:25,190 --> 00:02:28,830 I would like for an answer based on how it has been and how 40 00:02:28,830 --> 00:02:30,070 it is for you. 41 00:02:30,230 --> 00:02:31,830 How it has been and how it is. 42 00:02:32,230 --> 00:02:37,430 Do you tend to operate with the assumption that faith is more 43 00:02:37,430 --> 00:02:41,030 about compliance or more about companionship? 44 00:02:41,590 --> 00:02:44,990 So again, don't answer in terms of what you you're like, I 45 00:02:44,990 --> 00:02:45,830 know what it should be. 46 00:02:45,910 --> 00:02:48,390 How has it been for you in the past? 47 00:02:48,950 --> 00:02:53,310 Have you had that like kind of the you've operated with this kind 48 00:02:53,310 --> 00:02:57,750 of motivation that it's more compliance or companionship make 49 00:02:57,750 --> 00:02:58,150 sense. 50 00:02:58,870 --> 00:03:02,390 Charles feels like his life's kind of been on a spectrum from like 51 00:03:02,390 --> 00:03:07,750 really compliance, formulaic and now moving more towards relationship 52 00:03:07,830 --> 00:03:08,790 companionship. 53 00:03:08,870 --> 00:03:09,750 Has faith. 54 00:03:10,660 --> 00:03:13,620 Have you been motivated more with a mindset of Compliance. 55 00:03:14,260 --> 00:03:18,580 So there, there are rules or regulations, you know, with. 56 00:03:18,660 --> 00:03:19,220 With it. 57 00:03:19,220 --> 00:03:21,060 I need to be compliant with those. 58 00:03:21,380 --> 00:03:26,500 Or have you operated more with the mindset of companionship relationship 59 00:03:27,140 --> 00:03:28,020 in your faith? 60 00:03:28,660 --> 00:03:32,020 Growing up, there was a lot of compliance in your mindset. 61 00:03:32,500 --> 00:03:36,100 But companionship mindset got you through hard times. 62 00:03:36,650 --> 00:03:37,050 Okay. 63 00:03:37,130 --> 00:03:38,730 With Christy, there's been both. 64 00:03:39,290 --> 00:03:42,290 She has the feeling that approaching with the companionship 65 00:03:42,290 --> 00:03:44,010 mindset brings more freedom. 66 00:03:44,810 --> 00:03:45,450 Okay. 67 00:03:45,690 --> 00:03:49,650 So again, the tug of war between sometimes I find myself or 68 00:03:49,650 --> 00:03:53,850 I felt myself following the rules or being compliant with the 69 00:03:53,850 --> 00:03:56,170 rules to earn something from God. 70 00:03:56,730 --> 00:04:00,570 But then sometimes I felt myself in the flow of relationship. 71 00:04:01,610 --> 00:04:02,810 But there's a tug of war. 72 00:04:02,810 --> 00:04:03,290 There's. 73 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:03,920 What else? 74 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:04,880 Online people. 75 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:05,440 Hi. 76 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:05,880 Hey. 77 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:09,760 You tell us, you're here. 78 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:11,200 What's your answer? 79 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:14,160 What else? 80 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:15,560 Compliant. 81 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:16,800 Oh, Natalie in the back. 82 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:22,920 Maggie Smith is more guided by a mindset of companionship when Joanna's 83 00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:25,440 mindset was more Paul's. 84 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:26,960 We've got a second for that one. 85 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:30,440 Maybe in earlier years, thinking more compliance, trying 86 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:34,930 to follow the rules and maybe not being able to follow the rules 87 00:04:34,930 --> 00:04:35,370 so well. 88 00:04:35,370 --> 00:04:36,450 Is that what you said, Joe? 89 00:04:36,850 --> 00:04:44,130 So you were precious angel, but being more. 90 00:04:44,930 --> 00:04:49,130 But when you stepped into a companionship motivation, you found 91 00:04:49,130 --> 00:04:54,570 yourself almost more naturally doing better with the rules that 92 00:04:54,570 --> 00:04:56,130 you were trying to follow in the first place. 93 00:04:56,770 --> 00:04:57,170 Right. 94 00:04:57,980 --> 00:04:59,340 So we have another vote for Mike. 95 00:04:59,340 --> 00:05:02,860 Starting more with a compliance mindset and then growing 96 00:05:02,860 --> 00:05:07,620 into more of a companionship and letting that inform your actions. 97 00:05:07,620 --> 00:05:08,140 Jason. 98 00:05:09,820 --> 00:05:10,220 Sure. 99 00:05:11,580 --> 00:05:15,860 So for Jason, in earlier years when he was married, he was self 100 00:05:15,860 --> 00:05:16,180 employed. 101 00:05:16,180 --> 00:05:18,740 At the first of the month, he'd write two checks, one to the 102 00:05:18,740 --> 00:05:22,140 church, one to this sort of organization serving folks dealing 103 00:05:22,140 --> 00:05:22,940 with homelessness. 104 00:05:23,870 --> 00:05:25,790 One action felt more like compliance. 105 00:05:26,030 --> 00:05:26,990 That's interesting. 106 00:05:27,230 --> 00:05:31,230 How many of you felt that with giving to the church in your career, 107 00:05:31,790 --> 00:05:36,030 like I must give to be a compliant Christian. 108 00:05:43,310 --> 00:05:45,150 Angela and I once had a fight. 109 00:05:49,630 --> 00:05:52,670 Do we tithe off our gross income or the net income? 110 00:05:59,550 --> 00:06:03,550 That is a compliance minded question for sure. 111 00:06:03,870 --> 00:06:04,590 Natalie. 112 00:06:04,670 --> 00:06:05,470 Hi, Ellie. 113 00:06:06,270 --> 00:06:07,150 We miss you. 114 00:06:07,790 --> 00:06:08,750 Ellie's coming back. 115 00:06:08,750 --> 00:06:12,190 Everyone's so like, sorry, Paul. 116 00:06:12,270 --> 00:06:16,190 When you have companionship with the Lord, it's easy to be compliant. 117 00:06:16,750 --> 00:06:18,270 It's kind of what Joanna said. 118 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:20,040 Exactly. 119 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:21,160 No, you're exactly right. 120 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:24,720 If you guys just keep going, you'll take care of the sermon for 121 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:25,880 today so we can. 122 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:31,000 All right, I guess I'll do something a little bit today. 123 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:34,840 I want to show you something that. 124 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:35,880 Yes, sir. 125 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:36,640 Yes, sir. 126 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:38,160 He said, I wore the perfect shirt. 127 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:39,000 We are the church. 128 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:40,280 These are Jesus's. 129 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:43,240 I've shared some of these with you before. 130 00:06:44,690 --> 00:06:50,290 There are four gospels that are the accounts of Jesus's life 131 00:06:51,010 --> 00:06:53,490 in the Protestant version of the Bible. 132 00:06:53,490 --> 00:06:58,050 There are 66 books of the Bible, Old Testament, New Testament. 133 00:06:58,370 --> 00:07:01,330 New Testament is like the Jesus movement and thereafter. 134 00:07:01,330 --> 00:07:04,050 But Jesus said, I came to fulfill the first section, too. 135 00:07:05,330 --> 00:07:09,490 Those four gospels, they mean good news, are Matthew, Mark, Luke, 136 00:07:09,490 --> 00:07:09,890 and. 137 00:07:11,260 --> 00:07:12,820 Sorry, I'm in a trivia mindset. 138 00:07:12,820 --> 00:07:15,540 We were on our way home from Milwaukee yesterday, and I was like 139 00:07:15,540 --> 00:07:19,860 the trivia game show host for Michael and Shane versus Joanna and 140 00:07:19,860 --> 00:07:20,540 Angela. 141 00:07:21,180 --> 00:07:24,020 And in the end, I made them both lose, get down to zero. 142 00:07:24,020 --> 00:07:26,060 They wagered all their points, and they lost. 143 00:07:26,940 --> 00:07:32,140 Because my question was there are letters and numbers etched above 144 00:07:32,140 --> 00:07:33,980 the door right outside this building. 145 00:07:34,860 --> 00:07:36,420 What are the letters and the numbers? 146 00:07:36,420 --> 00:07:37,820 And they both struck out. 147 00:07:39,170 --> 00:07:46,210 MECO 4, which stands for Methodist Episcopal Church, 1904. 148 00:07:46,210 --> 00:07:49,090 Because this building was built in 1904. 149 00:07:49,490 --> 00:07:51,650 This stained glass is from 1904. 150 00:07:51,810 --> 00:07:54,130 This has nothing to do with the sermon. 151 00:07:54,770 --> 00:07:55,330 All right. 152 00:07:55,810 --> 00:08:01,650 John has a section at the end called the farewell discourse. 153 00:08:02,210 --> 00:08:07,130 Jesus's farewell words to his closest friends and followers. 154 00:08:07,610 --> 00:08:13,890 He's preparing them for his departure and for them to take the 155 00:08:13,890 --> 00:08:14,970 movement forward. 156 00:08:15,370 --> 00:08:19,250 Have we been talking about, I think, how he gives each of us a 157 00:08:19,250 --> 00:08:20,090 role and a gift? 158 00:08:20,090 --> 00:08:21,690 I think we've been talking about that. 159 00:08:21,850 --> 00:08:24,530 He's preparing them to carry the movement forward. 160 00:08:24,530 --> 00:08:27,370 And here are some words that he says to him in chapter 14. 161 00:08:29,210 --> 00:08:32,700 If you love me, you will keep my commandments. 162 00:08:33,180 --> 00:08:33,900 Compliance. 163 00:08:34,300 --> 00:08:36,220 You better follow the rules, Dave. 164 00:08:37,020 --> 00:08:38,940 If you love me, you'll be compliant. 165 00:08:39,100 --> 00:08:43,820 Oh, I will ask the Father and he will send another companion who 166 00:08:43,820 --> 00:08:45,260 will be with you forever. 167 00:08:45,660 --> 00:08:46,060 This. 168 00:08:46,619 --> 00:08:47,180 Sorry. 169 00:08:47,180 --> 00:08:47,820 Now you. 170 00:08:48,140 --> 00:08:53,020 This is the spirit of truth whom the world can't receive because 171 00:08:53,020 --> 00:08:55,100 it neither sees him nor recognizes him. 172 00:08:55,100 --> 00:08:57,650 You know him because he lives with you. 173 00:08:57,650 --> 00:08:58,810 And he will be with. 174 00:08:59,130 --> 00:09:00,170 He will be with. 175 00:09:00,970 --> 00:09:04,410 That word that gets translated, companion is an example, 176 00:09:04,410 --> 00:09:07,490 a great example of a word that's in the original language that's 177 00:09:07,490 --> 00:09:08,970 impossible to translate. 178 00:09:09,210 --> 00:09:11,650 All these different translations have given it their 179 00:09:11,650 --> 00:09:12,210 best shot. 180 00:09:12,210 --> 00:09:14,810 The common English Bible and a couple other translations. 181 00:09:15,450 --> 00:09:19,210 Translate it to companion translation for me today. 182 00:09:19,850 --> 00:09:23,860 Jesus says, I'm leaving, but I'm kind of not leaving. 183 00:09:24,020 --> 00:09:25,380 I'm getting out of the way. 184 00:09:25,540 --> 00:09:26,900 Think about Jesus here. 185 00:09:27,700 --> 00:09:30,860 How many leaders do we have in our world who'd be like, I need to 186 00:09:30,860 --> 00:09:36,100 move out of the way so somebody else can take center stage? 187 00:09:36,100 --> 00:09:38,900 How many leaders, like, do we have that in our. 188 00:09:39,300 --> 00:09:40,100 In our time? 189 00:09:41,540 --> 00:09:45,140 I need to get out of the way so I can lift up somebody else. 190 00:09:45,380 --> 00:09:46,380 Jesus does that. 191 00:09:46,380 --> 00:09:47,380 Oh, go ahead, Emily. 192 00:09:51,090 --> 00:09:51,330 Ah. 193 00:09:53,970 --> 00:09:57,530 Emily says we have a lot of them, we just don't see them because 194 00:09:57,530 --> 00:09:58,690 they stepped aside. 195 00:09:59,890 --> 00:10:01,490 Great point, Lucy. 196 00:10:01,650 --> 00:10:02,250 He does. 197 00:10:02,250 --> 00:10:02,930 Lucy. 198 00:10:04,290 --> 00:10:05,970 No, that's exactly right. 199 00:10:06,290 --> 00:10:10,010 It all depends how we read these words oftentimes will be determined 200 00:10:10,010 --> 00:10:12,730 by the mindset and presuppositions we carry into the 201 00:10:12,730 --> 00:10:13,170 reading. 202 00:10:13,170 --> 00:10:14,660 We, we could easily miss that. 203 00:10:14,660 --> 00:10:19,260 It starts out with if you love me, I want to give you an example 204 00:10:19,260 --> 00:10:20,180 of the difference. 205 00:10:20,180 --> 00:10:24,220 Okay, if we live always in a. 206 00:10:24,540 --> 00:10:27,820 Compliance, for the record, is not a bad thing. 207 00:10:28,060 --> 00:10:31,620 There are a lot of scenarios in our world where following the 208 00:10:31,620 --> 00:10:34,300 rules is a good and life giving thing. 209 00:10:34,780 --> 00:10:39,580 My roommate is the director of compliance for a company. 210 00:10:40,210 --> 00:10:41,290 I wasn't going to say it. 211 00:10:41,290 --> 00:10:41,890 Christy. 212 00:10:43,570 --> 00:10:49,490 Christy said, and our house, my kids were once asked, and by once 213 00:10:49,490 --> 00:10:52,770 I mean in the last like eight days, what's daddy's superpower? 214 00:10:53,250 --> 00:10:55,730 One of my children said, he's easy to bribe. 215 00:10:59,410 --> 00:11:07,870 I'm not the Director of compliance, but in her case she resources 216 00:11:07,870 --> 00:11:11,190 insurance companies, member companies, so they know what new 217 00:11:11,190 --> 00:11:15,750 statutes have come out in the insurance world so that they stay 218 00:11:15,750 --> 00:11:18,510 in compliance with those statutes and regulations. 219 00:11:19,070 --> 00:11:22,030 Every single one of us in this room wants that. 220 00:11:22,190 --> 00:11:23,230 It's good for them. 221 00:11:23,390 --> 00:11:24,430 It's good for us. 222 00:11:24,910 --> 00:11:29,230 Compliance can very much be good and life giving for us. 223 00:11:30,910 --> 00:11:34,270 But the question is, what is motivating us to be compliant? 224 00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:36,120 Is it so that we earn something? 225 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:40,200 We earn in our heads some better approval rating from God or 226 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:43,400 better approval rating from our friends or people around us? 227 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:47,400 What's moving us to quote, unquote, follow the rules? 228 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:51,200 Now today we're going to leave aside how we got the rules that we're 229 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:53,080 following, we'll leave that aside for today. 230 00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:55,800 Compliance can be a good and life giving thing. 231 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:59,480 But if we live in a world where everything is about compliance 232 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:02,120 because the rules are like an ultimatum. 233 00:12:02,990 --> 00:12:06,790 Follow these rules or else we're going to constantly live in 234 00:12:06,790 --> 00:12:12,550 an environment of fear and doubt and judgment and human beings 235 00:12:12,550 --> 00:12:14,350 don't tend to judge themselves. 236 00:12:14,830 --> 00:12:19,070 In a world of fear and insecurity and doubt, who do we judge 237 00:12:19,390 --> 00:12:20,030 Each other. 238 00:12:21,070 --> 00:12:22,590 I don't feel good about me. 239 00:12:22,590 --> 00:12:24,670 The way I'm going to deal with that is to judge you. 240 00:12:25,070 --> 00:12:26,190 We're funny people. 241 00:12:26,510 --> 00:12:28,630 We're funny, funny group. 242 00:12:29,510 --> 00:12:30,070 We are. 243 00:12:31,430 --> 00:12:32,710 Let me give you an example. 244 00:12:34,150 --> 00:12:37,910 Our kid, the director of compliance for the Stack House household, 245 00:12:38,230 --> 00:12:42,230 would like our children to be in bed and asleep by 8:30. 246 00:12:42,390 --> 00:12:44,870 The older two, don't judge us for our rules. 247 00:12:44,870 --> 00:12:45,230 Okay? 248 00:12:45,230 --> 00:12:48,030 If you're like that's too late or that's too early, don't judge 249 00:12:48,030 --> 00:12:49,590 us we just talked about judgment. 250 00:12:49,590 --> 00:12:53,710 Okay, well, when the not director of compliance is putting 251 00:12:53,710 --> 00:12:57,360 the children to bed, how often do they get to bed at 8:30, do you 252 00:12:57,360 --> 00:12:57,640 think? 253 00:12:59,560 --> 00:13:00,560 Even last night? 254 00:13:00,560 --> 00:13:04,000 Daddy, can I please just put these glow stars up on the wall before 255 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:05,000 I go to sleep? 256 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:06,920 You can do two. 257 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:13,320 I didn't say I'm a great, you know, great parent all the time, 258 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:19,400 but let's say I was a dad who was all about an atmosphere of compliance. 259 00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:20,600 Here's the thing. 260 00:13:21,630 --> 00:13:25,550 Jesus criticized his contemporaries, his other religious 261 00:13:25,550 --> 00:13:29,310 leaders, because they had a compliance mindset to the hilt. 262 00:13:29,390 --> 00:13:32,030 There's a fancy word for it called legalism. 263 00:13:32,030 --> 00:13:33,230 Have you ever heard that word? 264 00:13:33,390 --> 00:13:38,270 It's when religious leaders make the rule itself the point. 265 00:13:38,510 --> 00:13:39,710 It's a subtle thing. 266 00:13:39,950 --> 00:13:40,590 We're almost. 267 00:13:40,590 --> 00:13:43,550 You're creating the rule, you're writing the rule to see. 268 00:13:44,110 --> 00:13:45,470 Like it's almost a game. 269 00:13:45,710 --> 00:13:47,590 Let's see if they can follow it or not. 270 00:13:47,590 --> 00:13:48,270 Let's watch. 271 00:13:49,270 --> 00:13:52,390 If they don't, we're gonna be prowling around like lions to go 272 00:13:52,390 --> 00:13:52,950 get them. 273 00:13:53,990 --> 00:13:57,470 And so religious leaders in Jesus's time were watching, like 274 00:13:57,470 --> 00:14:01,030 in the, in the plants, like hiding, like it. 275 00:14:01,030 --> 00:14:03,830 Was Jesus gonna do something he shouldn't on the Sabbath? 276 00:14:03,990 --> 00:14:05,990 They ate on the Sabbath, go get him. 277 00:14:07,030 --> 00:14:08,550 The rule itself was the point. 278 00:14:09,030 --> 00:14:12,550 They didn't ask, like, did he do something life giving. 279 00:14:13,510 --> 00:14:16,750 For example, one time Jesus healed someone on the Sabbath, which 280 00:14:16,750 --> 00:14:18,870 by the letter of the law, you are not to do. 281 00:14:19,670 --> 00:14:24,070 The Old Testament scriptures, first five books, there are regulations 282 00:14:24,310 --> 00:14:26,310 of things you don't do on the day of rest. 283 00:14:26,310 --> 00:14:27,310 One of them is not. 284 00:14:27,310 --> 00:14:29,030 You don't do any acts of healing. 285 00:14:29,350 --> 00:14:33,470 Compliance officers in that day, the Pharisees, not all of them. 286 00:14:33,470 --> 00:14:35,030 Some of them were watching. 287 00:14:35,910 --> 00:14:38,230 And Jesus said, now let me ask you guys a question. 288 00:14:39,590 --> 00:14:45,430 If you had one of your, like, animals fall into a well on the Sabbath, 289 00:14:46,170 --> 00:14:47,130 would you draw him out? 290 00:14:47,610 --> 00:14:50,250 He knew the answer to that because he'd watched him do it. 291 00:14:50,250 --> 00:14:52,490 And so his question was, I just healed a human. 292 00:14:52,650 --> 00:14:53,690 What do you got to say? 293 00:14:53,770 --> 00:14:58,130 An example in my life would be with my son at 8:30 if I made the 294 00:14:58,130 --> 00:14:58,890 rule of the point. 295 00:14:59,210 --> 00:15:02,009 And I was standing outside of his door at 8:30. 296 00:15:02,970 --> 00:15:04,170 What's he doing in there? 297 00:15:04,650 --> 00:15:07,050 Let's see if he can follow that rule or not. 298 00:15:07,050 --> 00:15:10,650 If not, I'm gonna go get him because we're about rules here. 299 00:15:10,890 --> 00:15:13,290 And then I hear him up there, which he always is doing. 300 00:15:14,110 --> 00:15:16,590 I hear the sounds of tinkering past 8:30. 301 00:15:17,390 --> 00:15:19,550 Legos, Nerf guns. 302 00:15:20,590 --> 00:15:23,630 We call him Hector the Collector because he just keeps Everything 303 00:15:23,630 --> 00:15:25,870 in his room and he's going through his treasures. 304 00:15:26,430 --> 00:15:29,630 And what if I broke in at 8:30 and was like, I caught you, man. 305 00:15:30,350 --> 00:15:31,870 What did I tell you, boy? 306 00:15:32,590 --> 00:15:34,030 8:30 is the rule. 307 00:15:34,350 --> 00:15:36,510 Who do you think you are, breaking my rules? 308 00:15:37,550 --> 00:15:38,750 I run this house. 309 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:40,960 Angela's like, this sounds great, Ross. 310 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:42,120 Can we start doing this? 311 00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:50,160 You know, the whole, like, while you live under my roof, what 312 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:50,600 is it? 313 00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:53,400 You obey my rules. 314 00:15:54,200 --> 00:16:00,600 And now, now all of a sudden, I make the rule of the point while 315 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:01,720 crowding out the person. 316 00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:03,480 And so I get what I want. 317 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:05,480 My son is afraid every night. 318 00:16:05,810 --> 00:16:08,170 He doesn't have the fear of God, but he has the fear of dad in 319 00:16:08,170 --> 00:16:08,450 him. 320 00:16:08,610 --> 00:16:11,010 And so he starts getting in bed every night at 8:30. 321 00:16:11,010 --> 00:16:13,010 Now I do that with every rule in his life. 322 00:16:13,650 --> 00:16:15,970 I make the rule the point while crowding out the person. 323 00:16:16,290 --> 00:16:17,730 And so I get what I want. 324 00:16:17,810 --> 00:16:21,410 He follows the rules and he's afraid the whole time. 325 00:16:21,650 --> 00:16:22,690 What have I achieved? 326 00:16:23,730 --> 00:16:26,530 I've achieved creating a scared boy. 327 00:16:26,690 --> 00:16:28,450 A scared, compliant boy. 328 00:16:28,530 --> 00:16:32,140 What has religion done now? 329 00:16:32,860 --> 00:16:34,700 What if I make the boy the point? 330 00:16:35,820 --> 00:16:38,820 I still try to keep the rule as the director of compliance would 331 00:16:38,820 --> 00:16:42,700 like me to, and I sit down with him and I make him understand, 332 00:16:43,020 --> 00:16:46,860 like, here's why we want you in bed by 8:30. 333 00:16:47,180 --> 00:16:48,540 Sleep is good for your body. 334 00:16:49,420 --> 00:16:50,620 It's good for your mind. 335 00:16:50,860 --> 00:16:51,780 It's gonna help you. 336 00:16:51,780 --> 00:16:54,860 When you're on the verge of having that outburst tomorrow, you're 337 00:16:54,860 --> 00:16:57,740 gonna have a better job of controlling your anger. 338 00:16:58,180 --> 00:17:02,380 And when I center the person and explain why the rule is good 339 00:17:02,380 --> 00:17:04,580 for him, will he go to bed at 8:30? 340 00:17:04,740 --> 00:17:05,540 Probably not. 341 00:17:06,340 --> 00:17:09,140 Honestly, he probably won't still. 342 00:17:09,940 --> 00:17:12,580 And that's when, like, hey, authority still matters. 343 00:17:12,740 --> 00:17:18,780 I'll find a way to like, hey, now we're going to have some consequences 344 00:17:18,780 --> 00:17:19,740 if you don't comply. 345 00:17:19,740 --> 00:17:20,420 Remember what I said. 346 00:17:20,420 --> 00:17:22,380 Compliance is not the worst thing in the world. 347 00:17:22,380 --> 00:17:24,500 It's like the mindset with which you approach it. 348 00:17:24,899 --> 00:17:25,139 Right? 349 00:17:25,539 --> 00:17:27,219 That is true with us, with God. 350 00:17:27,539 --> 00:17:31,139 What Jesus says is this whole thing, the Holy Spirit coming to 351 00:17:31,139 --> 00:17:36,939 us, is that we would live a life of continuous companionship 352 00:17:36,939 --> 00:17:38,499 and friendship with God. 353 00:17:38,979 --> 00:17:43,459 God's greatest desire is not that we would be compliant with him, 354 00:17:43,619 --> 00:17:47,779 it would be that we'd be companions with God. 355 00:17:48,019 --> 00:17:53,170 In this case is our friend, the Holy Spirit, smarter than us, 356 00:17:53,250 --> 00:17:55,690 wiser than us, have authority over us? 357 00:17:55,690 --> 00:17:56,530 You betcha. 358 00:17:57,090 --> 00:17:58,450 But that's what God does. 359 00:17:58,930 --> 00:18:03,890 God empties himself of power and authority and becomes a peasant 360 00:18:03,890 --> 00:18:10,690 alongside us to earn our trust and invite us to compliance to some 361 00:18:10,690 --> 00:18:14,930 great commands that are good for us, good for our neighbors. 362 00:18:15,090 --> 00:18:16,370 Jesus comes to show us. 363 00:18:16,370 --> 00:18:18,930 Here's what it looks like to live by these rules. 364 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:20,480 I'll follow him. 365 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,160 First, Jesus says, I'll show you how to love God with all your 366 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:26,000 heart, mind, soul and strength and to love your neighbor as yourself. 367 00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:28,320 I'll show you why it's so good to do that. 368 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:33,200 And then when I leave, I will ask my Father to send his very presence 369 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:34,960 to dwell inside you. 370 00:18:35,279 --> 00:18:41,320 So that this beautiful life giving relationship breathes into 371 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:42,240 your compliance. 372 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:46,560 So that you want to love the Lord your God with all your heart, 373 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:47,360 mind, soul and strength. 374 00:18:47,360 --> 00:18:50,320 So that you see your neighbor as I do. 375 00:18:50,790 --> 00:18:53,110 That you see yourself as I do. 376 00:18:53,830 --> 00:18:59,350 God's goal, my friends, is not to create scared, compliant Christians. 377 00:19:00,390 --> 00:19:07,110 God's goal is to create inspired, loving companions of Jesus. 378 00:19:07,350 --> 00:19:08,630 He invites us to this. 379 00:19:10,470 --> 00:19:12,230 That's why he says these words. 380 00:19:12,230 --> 00:19:15,470 And his last words to his disciples, he says to them, basically, 381 00:19:15,470 --> 00:19:19,520 I'm inviting you to a lifetime of friendship. 382 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,960 He says in John 15, I'm going to skip to John 16 in a minute. 383 00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:27,680 He says, I don't call you servants, I call you friends. 384 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,120 All of you know my business, as if we're on the same level. 385 00:19:31,360 --> 00:19:33,400 And people who are my friends, what do they do? 386 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:34,560 They keep my commandments. 387 00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:36,560 And he says, what's my number one command? 388 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:38,480 What's Jesus's number? 389 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:40,640 This isn't a regulation, it's a statute. 390 00:19:41,120 --> 00:19:48,040 Love others and as I have loved you, throws a little curveball 391 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:48,520 in there. 392 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:53,000 And there is no greater love than this to lay your life down for 393 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:53,560 your friends. 394 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:55,240 And what did I tell you? 395 00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:59,200 He says, give me just a minute and I'll show you what it looks like 396 00:19:59,200 --> 00:19:59,800 to do it. 397 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:02,040 Give me just a second and I'll show you. 398 00:20:02,120 --> 00:20:06,800 And so he says, then again in John 16, I assure you that it's better 399 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:07,920 for you that I go away. 400 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:13,170 Look at this weirdo leader Jesus is, I need to step aside so 401 00:20:13,170 --> 00:20:17,290 this companion will come to you and dwell inside you. 402 00:20:17,450 --> 00:20:20,330 I've done my role as God in the flesh. 403 00:20:20,890 --> 00:20:24,250 I'm going to step inside so God in the Spirit can live in you. 404 00:20:24,330 --> 00:20:27,290 And of course, hey, if you feel confused by what I'm saying 405 00:20:27,290 --> 00:20:29,530 right now, you're like, none of this makes sense. 406 00:20:29,770 --> 00:20:32,850 These disciples, I promise you, as they're saying this, as Jesus 407 00:20:32,850 --> 00:20:36,130 was saying this, they were looking at him going, I just wish 408 00:20:36,130 --> 00:20:37,130 you could talk normal. 409 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:38,240 What is he saying? 410 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:39,400 I don't know what he's saying. 411 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:40,840 But later on they got it. 412 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:44,520 They just kept walking it out and they grew in These things. 413 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:49,440 So what do you want to live a life of companionship or a life of 414 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:50,120 compliance? 415 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:52,440 Actually, I think the answer is yes. 416 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:58,080 I actually want to love the Lord with all my heart, mind, soul 417 00:20:58,080 --> 00:20:58,760 and strength. 418 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:02,920 Because through companionship, I keep learning how he loved me first. 419 00:21:03,990 --> 00:21:08,390 I want to be compliant with that law because he loved me first. 420 00:21:08,790 --> 00:21:10,790 I want to love my neighbor. 421 00:21:11,110 --> 00:21:11,990 I really do. 422 00:21:11,990 --> 00:21:13,430 It keeps growing in me. 423 00:21:14,230 --> 00:21:17,510 I keep having these surprising moments where I see people differently. 424 00:21:17,590 --> 00:21:18,630 It isn't from me. 425 00:21:18,790 --> 00:21:20,630 It's from the companion inside me. 426 00:21:20,710 --> 00:21:22,070 That's all I have to say today. 427 00:21:22,230 --> 00:21:23,590 What else do you have to say? 428 00:21:24,310 --> 00:21:28,510 So your starting place with the rules you set for your kids is 429 00:21:28,510 --> 00:21:30,830 not the rules themselves, it's them. 430 00:21:31,310 --> 00:21:32,350 You center them. 431 00:21:33,070 --> 00:21:35,430 You want them to have a happy life. 432 00:21:35,430 --> 00:21:36,670 You want them to flourish. 433 00:21:36,910 --> 00:21:38,270 That's what the rules are for. 434 00:21:38,270 --> 00:21:42,790 And you see God's rules in that same light with you, that it's 435 00:21:42,790 --> 00:21:44,670 for your good and for his glory. 436 00:21:44,750 --> 00:21:45,230 What else? 437 00:21:45,230 --> 00:21:49,070 What's this making you think, feel, want to do? 438 00:21:50,510 --> 00:21:50,990 Jill. 439 00:21:51,630 --> 00:21:54,590 Jill told a story for those online about when she was a resident 440 00:21:54,590 --> 00:21:57,310 and there was a person in palliative care who wanted to be 441 00:21:57,310 --> 00:21:58,030 baptized. 442 00:21:58,930 --> 00:22:02,010 And a bunch of people on the medical staff conspired to break 443 00:22:02,010 --> 00:22:03,810 the rules so he could be baptized. 444 00:22:04,050 --> 00:22:04,930 Is that a fair? 445 00:22:05,490 --> 00:22:08,770 I don't want to make you out to be a law breaker, but yes, man, 446 00:22:08,770 --> 00:22:12,210 Jesus will lead us into some holy trouble. 447 00:22:12,850 --> 00:22:14,130 I hope I'm about it. 448 00:22:15,010 --> 00:22:15,450 What else? 449 00:22:15,450 --> 00:22:18,770 What's this making you think, feel, want to do? 450 00:22:19,890 --> 00:22:22,290 Everything is an opportunity for companionship. 451 00:22:22,450 --> 00:22:25,130 When I get up in the morning, I'm not trying to go to my prayer 452 00:22:25,130 --> 00:22:26,290 time to be compliant. 453 00:22:26,570 --> 00:22:30,090 I'm learning to want to spend time with my friend Jesus. 454 00:22:30,490 --> 00:22:31,770 He made me his friend. 455 00:22:32,010 --> 00:22:34,970 When I read the scriptures, I'm looking for the heart of my friend 456 00:22:34,970 --> 00:22:35,450 in them. 457 00:22:35,610 --> 00:22:39,130 I'm listening to the companion inside me help me understand when 458 00:22:39,130 --> 00:22:42,090 the Bible in all of its weirdness makes me confused. 459 00:22:42,410 --> 00:22:47,530 But isn't it weird how if the Bible makes you confused and it makes 460 00:22:47,530 --> 00:22:50,850 you ask a question to God, it has worked because it's drawn you 461 00:22:50,850 --> 00:22:51,850 into a relationship. 462 00:22:52,190 --> 00:22:52,470 What else? 463 00:22:52,470 --> 00:22:54,590 What's this making you think, feel, want to do? 464 00:22:54,990 --> 00:23:00,670 Ralph said it gives him sadness and anger about how faith 465 00:23:00,670 --> 00:23:07,190 is often introduced with with the rules first and not not as an 466 00:23:07,190 --> 00:23:08,750 invitation to relationship. 467 00:23:08,990 --> 00:23:12,350 Yeah, the faith has been hijacked. 468 00:23:12,350 --> 00:23:13,550 It is hijacked. 469 00:23:13,630 --> 00:23:14,830 And I can do it too. 470 00:23:15,630 --> 00:23:20,850 I can exploit this beautiful thing for my my personal wants, but 471 00:23:20,850 --> 00:23:23,730 I can also be guided back to this beauty if I will. 472 00:23:23,730 --> 00:23:24,170 Listen. 473 00:23:24,410 --> 00:23:24,930 What else? 474 00:23:24,930 --> 00:23:26,970 What's this making you think, feel, want to do? 475 00:23:27,050 --> 00:23:29,410 If you don't know what it is, we can talk about another time. 476 00:23:29,410 --> 00:23:33,810 But there was something in the 90s that became popular, became prominent 477 00:23:33,810 --> 00:23:38,090 in the church called purity culture, around sex and sexuality. 478 00:23:39,530 --> 00:23:42,810 And Angela said it was a great example of making the rule the point 479 00:23:42,810 --> 00:23:46,670 that you may have achieved the end that you wanted, but in the process 480 00:23:46,750 --> 00:23:50,270 you created people who were afraid and who were ashamed. 481 00:23:50,510 --> 00:23:54,110 If you want to hear more about that, listen to There's a podcast, 482 00:23:54,350 --> 00:23:57,990 the dancer who with whom I danced in Johnson County, Dancing 483 00:23:57,990 --> 00:23:58,550 with the Stars. 484 00:23:58,550 --> 00:24:05,710 It's her story this week Approach We've been in a series called 485 00:24:05,710 --> 00:24:07,550 On Fire the Holy Spirit in each Person. 486 00:24:08,430 --> 00:24:13,740 Begin your day with the mindset that this is all about friendship 487 00:24:13,740 --> 00:24:14,380 with God. 488 00:24:14,780 --> 00:24:19,740 Everything is your prayers, scripture coming here today. 489 00:24:19,980 --> 00:24:23,740 I hope to God you didn't come here just to check a compliance box. 490 00:24:24,060 --> 00:24:25,540 Hey, if you did, you showed up. 491 00:24:25,540 --> 00:24:26,380 God is graceful. 492 00:24:26,380 --> 00:24:28,060 You made it cool. 493 00:24:28,860 --> 00:24:31,260 You can even reframe it now you came here. 494 00:24:31,260 --> 00:24:35,500 We come here to pursue friendship with each other and to 495 00:24:35,500 --> 00:24:37,820 celebrate and pursue friendship with Jesus. 496 00:24:38,470 --> 00:24:38,710 Right? 497 00:24:39,030 --> 00:24:39,790 Think that way. 498 00:24:39,790 --> 00:24:43,350 This week, let the fire of the Holy Spirit dwell in you, the presence 499 00:24:43,350 --> 00:24:46,470 of God dwell in you as this holy friend who is always with you, 500 00:24:46,470 --> 00:24:49,870 always guiding you, always helping you, helping you to become 501 00:24:49,870 --> 00:24:53,230 more like Jesus and helping you to become more like you, the 502 00:24:53,230 --> 00:24:54,629 person God created to be. 503 00:24:54,710 --> 00:24:55,510 Let's pray. 504 00:25:00,950 --> 00:25:02,790 Lord, I just ask for your help. 505 00:25:03,030 --> 00:25:04,230 Help us to do that. 506 00:25:04,770 --> 00:25:09,010 Help us to see your love for us, how you have pursued us as your 507 00:25:09,010 --> 00:25:12,530 friends, how you have forgiven us, how you have dealt with the forces 508 00:25:12,530 --> 00:25:15,370 of evil and darkness and sin on our behalf. 509 00:25:15,370 --> 00:25:18,050 Because you love us as your children and you treat us as your 510 00:25:18,050 --> 00:25:19,170 friends, not your enemies. 511 00:25:19,170 --> 00:25:21,730 Even when we've made ourselves your enemies in our minds. 512 00:25:21,890 --> 00:25:26,530 Help us to walk with you in all things ordinary things, simple 513 00:25:26,530 --> 00:25:26,850 things. 514 00:25:27,250 --> 00:25:29,250 In Jesus name, Amen. 515 00:25:30,860 --> 00:25:35,140 Thank you for participating in the conversation happening at Heaven 516 00:25:35,140 --> 00:25:36,220 Earth Church. 517 00:25:36,780 --> 00:25:42,060 Your next opportunity to do so live is this Sunday morning, 9:30am 518 00:25:43,100 --> 00:25:47,660 Eastern Time either at the main campus at 309 East Main in Whiteland, 519 00:25:47,660 --> 00:25:51,660 Indiana, or online at YouTube Live. 520 00:25:52,060 --> 00:25:56,950 That's@YouTube.com Heaven Earth Church. 521 00:25:57,590 --> 00:26:03,590 The audio podcast is always available at Apple Podcast and on 522 00:26:03,830 --> 00:26:04,470 Spotify. 523 00:26:04,950 --> 00:26:09,270 You can help others find out about the Heaven Earth Church podcast 524 00:26:09,590 --> 00:26:14,390 by going to Apple Podcasts and or Spotify and leaving a five star 525 00:26:14,390 --> 00:26:18,670 rating and your review instructions on how to do just that 526 00:26:18,670 --> 00:26:20,710 and links are in the show notes. 527 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:27,360 You can always find out more by going to the church website heavenearthchurch.org 528 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:28,920 we. 529 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:31,120 Want to thank you for spending time with us today. 530 00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:34,640 My name is Ross Stackhouse, the pastor to Heaven Earth Church, 531 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,360 and you may think out there that your story is over, but in fact, 532 00:26:38,360 --> 00:26:41,440 your faith story may just be beginning. 533 00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,520 If you want more information about our church or you're interested 534 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:48,650 in the next step, you can go to heavenearthchurch.org Otherwise, 535 00:26:48,650 --> 00:26:51,810 we look forward to being with you next time at the Heaven Earth 536 00:26:51,810 --> 00:26:52,810 Church podcast. 537 00:27:13,060 --> 00:27:13,300 SA.