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Hey, good morning, good afternoon, good evening wherever you may be.

Scott luton and Rick McDonald here with you on Supply Chain Now.

Welcome to today's live stream.

Hey, hey, Rick.

How you doing, sir?

It's fantastic to be here with you, Scott, and with the Buzz audience worldwide.

And I really appreciate the invitation.

Same, you know, we're breaking records here today.

So Rick, as you know, we've got a stable of incredible co hosts here at Supply Chain now you, in a multitude of appearances previously have been our Hollywood rock and roll premier guest.

But today, Rick, you are officially a co host here on the Buzz.

And Rick, I'm tickled pink.

I'm excited about it, too, and I really do appreciate the invite.

And yeah, it's going to be a great show.

We got Matt Fain coming on with us.

So you're letting the cat out of the bag.

That's right, folks, take it from Rick McDonald.

We've got a wonderful addition of the Buzz here today where, you know, every Monday at 12 noon Eastern time, we discuss a variety of news and developments across global supply chain and business.

And that's right, we've got a wonderful guest, Matt Fain, CEO of Pop Capacity, joining us here in about 10, 15 minutes or so.

So stick around for that.

But beyond Matt, Rick, we're going to be talking about a Gartner supply chain symposium which was last week.

We're going to be gaining a cscos.

That's right, a chief supply chain officer's view of supply chain leadership priorities right now.

And we're going to be getting an update on the warehousing industry, including the bonded warehouse space.

That is just booming, isn't it, Rick?

It's going crazy right now.

It sure is.

So great show.

Great show.

And again, take it from Rick McDonald, you're going to stick around for this edition of the Buzz.

All right, so Rick, for all of our folks out there, I've got two things before we jump in.

We got a couple items we're going to get into before Matt Jo number one, folks.

Hey, give us your take in the comments like Prasad here.

Great to see you, Prasad.

Via LinkedIn, let us know where you're tuned in from.

And as Tricia says, happy Buzz Day.

That's right, let us know where you're tuned in and where you're watching from.

And you can do that via LinkedIn, YouTube X Facebook Twitch, no matter your social channel of your choosing, just let us know what you think.

And secondly, Rick, attendance here comes with a money back guarantee, right?

It is free to attend, folks.

It's free to attend.

That's a joke that keeps on giving.

But if you enjoyed today's show folks, we'd love for you to share with friend and your network, maybe your Aunt Edna up in Iowa, they'll be glad you did.

Rick, we all gain by sharing market intel with our network, huh?

We absolutely do.

And you know, I, I found a lot of value in reposting and linking and commenting.

I'm getting back way more in terms of things that I need to know, insights, clever people doing clever things than you know that if I hadn't reached out to them.

So I definitely prioritize that.

Outstanding, Rick.

That's right.

And in today's world, probably ever.

But in today's world where the velocity is just that much incredibly faster, we've got to learn something new every hour it feels like.

So it's great, great stuff there, Rick.

Hey Scott, just a quick one on that.

I don't think the cycle of the velocity is going to change anytime soon except it might get faster.

Yes.

You know, none of us are going to give up the conveniences that we have learned to accept and same day delivery, second day delivery, drone delivery, all of that is speeding up buying cycles and putting even more pressure on the supply ch, isn't it?

It sure is.

Lots of pressure on not just the technology and the processes and the, the whole ecosystem and all those partnerships, but most importantly, pressure on our people and you know, the beautiful human element that really makes supply chain happen every day.

So as we continue to lean into these hookah times, you know, finding ways of taking friction out, taking pressure out off our teams so to help them do their job even easier and more successful.

I think that is one of the golden priorities right now.

And by the way folks, if you've seen Rick McDonald on our earlier shows here at supply chain now, you may be familia mayor with his background and if you're new, this is the first show you're joining us where he's joined us here, then you should know that rick spent over 30 years doing big things with the Clorox company, including almost four years as chief supply chain officer.

So Rick, as always speaks from a been there, done that perspective.

And Rick, we need more folks helping the rest of us from a been there, done that perspective, don't we?

Yeah, those experiences count for I don't know how many dog years it is, but those experiences add up in a hurry, but they give you a lot of insight into potentially things that are coming, maybe how to deal with them and how to address them.

That's right.

All right.

So folks, great show here today.

We're going to tackle two things before Matt Fain with pop capacity joins us.

I want to start with this.

We published over the weekend our most recent edition of our almost weekly newsletter.

With that said, now, Rick, we focused mainly on few key takeaways from Gartner Supply Chain Symposium, which again was held last week in Orlando.

We spent a great better part of three days conducting interviews, taking in presentations and catching up with a variety of industry dynam and movers and shakers, much like Rick McDonald.

So I want to share a few of these nuggets and then, Rick, I'm going to get you to respond.

I'm sure you got your finger on the poll so you might share your own key takeaway or two.

Let's see here.

Starting with this, get this, Rick.

Gartner research projects that by 2028, 60% of supply chain digital adoption efforts will fail to deliver promised value, mainly due to a lack of investment in learning and development.

How about that?

That was from a keynote by Tom Enright with Gartner.

Rick, you were about to say something.

I was.

That number sounds, I mean, it's, it's extraordinarily high in my point of view, but I don't have any reason to doubt it.

But I think part of it is people pick the wrong problems, they don't understand the problem, maybe they get sold the wrong gear.

And almost every case when those things don't go well, it's because they fail to do proper change management.

That's such a huge component of all these initiatives.

So true.

So true, Rick.

That's from Tommy, folks.

Stay tuned.

As we're going to be releasing, we got about 18 interviews from Gartner we're going to be releasing over the next probably three or four or five weeks, including one with the one and only Tom and Ryan.

I tell you, he is a walking fountain of knowledge, I'll tell you that much.

All right, so Rick, I'm going to share a couple of these others and then we'll get you to comment here.

Jenny Stotaker, vice president, supply chain with Salomon.

Now, she said, quote, to be in the same rooms as some of the finest supply chain leaders in the world and discuss common ambitions and challenges, really enforce that we do have better skills to manage volatility than we had five years ago.

That includes tech skills, scenario planning and prioritization of outcomes.

But most importantly, you could feel the attitude to tackle today's challenges with rigor and a winning mindset.

End quote.

Now that is almost poetic.

Rick, you're nodding your head.

Would you generally agree with Jenny?

I absolutely would.

And you know, just reflecting on my time leading the Clorox supply chain through Covid and hyperinflation in the US Then we had a cyber attack shortly after that.

All those things, you know, you build up your battle scars, you build up your resilience, if you will, and your capability to take on more.

So things like that just don't phase you when the next one comes your way.

That is right.

All right, I'm gonna share two others and then we'll get Rick to pick his favorite element out of these.

I stopped for a chance.

Me and Catherine here with Supply Chain now.

We saw Noha Samara with Gartner.

No ha is a rock and roll star, much like Rick here.

We had her on a webinar a couple months ago and the feedback we got was tremendous.

So I'm a paraphrase what she shared with me, Rick, But I think this is a good one.

She spoke about a powerful takeaway that came from a keynote she sat in on where basically the message was that we as Supply Chain leaders, sure it's important to help our team members learn new skills, new tools and.

But she said arguably it's even more important that we help our people learn to let go of old ways of doing things.

And I love that.

And as I shared with her one of my favorite long time quotes, let go or be dragged.

An old proverb from somewhere.

And then finally you got one more from Jake Barr, AKA the John Wayne Global Supply Chain.

That's great to see Jake down there.

He said two key takeaways.

The consequences of insights should be your objective in utilizing AI.

I love that.

All about focus.

And then secondly, the critical importance of the leader's role in creating calm from the chaos.

I love that.

All right, so Rick, between NOHA and Jake, anything else that you heard here, your thoughts?

I love all three of those, Scott.

I'm going to go with the one from Noha specifically around people letting go of their former ways or current ways of working to move on to something different.

That is one of the hardest concepts for us as humans to latch onto and to move forward with.

You know, none of us really like all that much change.

Some of us are a lot more adept at it.

And we tend to lead in that space.

But most everybody else likes getting good at what they're doing, becoming really proficient, becoming really efficient.

And when you ask them to change in substantial ways, especially if it involves, you know, using digital assets.

I'll go back to my change management comment a second ago.

And you don't do proper change management.

It's a fearful situation for a lot of individuals, and I think that's why they're reluctant to move forward.

And of course, that slows the rate of change down.

It slows the organization down.

You don't get the outcomes you want.

Well said.

And, you know, picking up my fear comment, you know, the fear of the unknown.

And fear is not a bad word, I think in our bones as humans, I think there is a fear.

And it varies from person to person of the unexpected and the uncertain.

And, you know, I think supply chain leaders, Rick, we've got our work cut out for them in terms of not just, as Jake said, creating calm from the chaos, but also helping to prepare and manage through that fear.

We're getting it by the truckload, I'll tell you.

All right, so Rick, kind of put a bow on that, folks.

Check out.

With that said, it comes out almost every weekend.

We're approaching.

Let's see, we're over 27,000 subscribers.

That's terrific.

So check that out and let us know what you think.

And you can also always, we always include our live programming so you don't miss that for the week ahead.

We include other tools and advice and perspective that hopefully you'll find valuable on your own journey.

So check out.

With that said.

Okay, Rick, we're about to bring in Matt Fain in a moment or two, but I want to pose one more question to you.

And I love your take on these takeaways, as it were.

But as I mentioned, all of your incredible time doing big things out in the global supply chain, including as a chief supply chain officer with one of the world's most beloved brands, enjoyed.

I think before we met, I enjoyed touring the Stone Mountain production facility at Clark's.

It was a pristine, incredible environment as you connect with supply chain leaders that are fighting a good fight out there in this Buka market.

Now, folks, if you know me, you know that acronym buca.

Volatility, Uncertainty, Complexity and Ambiguity.

So, Rick, what's a couple of your observations from what supply chain leaders are doing?

I've got a couple things for you, Scott, that the leaders are doing.

It's really setting them apart.

And then I got one thing that I think is under attended at the moment.

I'll get to that.

Third, the overall topic and category is this idea that there's a shortage of talent and a shortage of the skills necessary for companies to maintain their competitiveness.

I'm not just talking about in digital spaces, I'm talking about across manufacturing, logistics, procurement, so forth.

It's really a worldwide challenge and all of us are working in service of trying to operate at the speed of the consumer, at the speed of the consumer, not our speed, not somebody else's speed, how fast the consumer wants to go.

We talked about how those cycles are continuing to increase.

And so I see two things that leaders are doing.

The first one is they're inventorying their top supply chain challenges.

They're identifying the financial or reputational risk about solving those challenges, picking digital tools that might address those, and then creating the roadmap that puts those tools into their workflows.

So that's number one.

Number two is, and this is really a tricky and challenging one, but they're assessing and addressing digital capability on their team.

So they're looking at digital fluency.

You know, do their leaders have advice, vice presidents and directors in their supply chain organizations?

You know, do they really understand the Internet of things 4.0 and all the elements of it and how they can use them?

They're upskilling and reskilling their current employees.

And then when they go outside for talent, they're trying to hire tomorrow's talent today.

That is a hard thing in an ultra competitive environment.

So those are the two things I see leaders working on with a lot of energy and urgency.

The one area that I think could use some more attention, it's a little bit underattended, is this idea that you got to bring your team along with you.

You mentioned it a little bit ago.

And it's the trust, the authenticity, the shared experiences that leaders have to have with their teams to bring them along this change journey, to eliminate the fear, to make sure that they're telling the story of what the change is about and so it doesn't get made up someplace else in the organization.

Because that's exactly what will happen.

If you don't tell the story, somebody else will.

It'll likely be worse than it actually is.

So I think those are really important elements and those three deserve a little bit more attention by leaders as they move in this digital space.

It's fine to get enamored with the right shiny object over here, but at the end of the day, it's the humanity of all of this, it's going to make those tools work the way you want them to work to deliver the return, give you the outcomes you want, and have the right partnership between the human assets, the people and the digital assets.

Well said, folks.

I'm glad we're recording those last three or four minutes because we need to replay that message in our ears a couple times a day.

In particular, the digital fluency comment you made, Rick, and how imperative it is that we are able to assess just how fluent not just our supply chain organization, but the whole organization is from a true digital fluency standpoint.

If I'm on your team, you've got bigger challenges from a technological standpoint, folks.

Just keeping it real.

But Rick, a lot of good stuff there.

Appreciate you sharing.

All right, so Rick, we've got an outstanding guest here today, don't we?

Outstanding guest, folks.

Our guest today is a logistics expert that's been doing big things in global supply chain for years now.

He's based in Atlanta and he is a self described tech guy, family man, and get this, a fellow supply chain nerd.

Now in his current role, Matt Fain serves as CEO with POP capacity who helps supply chain leaders make well informed decisions with detailed warehouse insights.

So join me in welcoming Matt Fain, CEO with pop capacity.

Hey.

Hey, Matt, how you doing?

Hey.

Hey, how are you guys?

Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful.

Now Matt, as you were in the green room back there, did you just hear the brilliance that came from one Rick McDonald?

Yeah, we talked about the digital fluency, but he was talking about the trust and authenticity that any leader, any organization has to have as we get through these uncertain times.

And that's whether in terms of us relating to our team members or our supply chain partners out there.

But Matt, did you get any of that from Rick?

I heard him preach.

I mean for everybody out there listening, you gotta listen to this guy, right?

The things in his brain you can't read in the textbook.

The experience he's had, you can't read in a textbook or learn from.

So it's just, if you're listening, hone in on what Rick has to say because it's gold.

It is gold.

But if that's gold, Matt, you're silver or bronze.

Today we got some good stuff coming from Matt Fain with pot capacity.

But this is where we're gonna start.

Rick and Matt, this is where we're gonna start.

We've got a fun warm up question because did you know on this day back in, gosh, almost 100 years ago, May 12, 1941, in Berlin, Germany this thing right here was rolled out.

Now I'm mentioning a picture we have on the stream here.

Conrad zeus presented the Z3 to the world.

The Z3.

Now this was the first programmable, fully automatic and operational computer.

Its average calculation speed for multiplication was a whopping three seconds.

Its data memory was 64 words.

64 words memory.

And that's of the 22 bit variety.

And it was highly portable, that is if you had a train because it weighed over a ton.

So with all this said, as we celebrate history and we'll celebrate the Z3.

Matt and Rick, I'm gonna start with you, Matt.

What is one computer or device that made an early impact on your journey?

Oh, that's a good one.

So I'm a 80s 90s baby.

Right.

So I grew up in the 80s and 90s.

I'm gonna have to say like Oregon Trailed.

Everybody remembers that game in elementary school.

So excited one of the Oregon Trail and then it slowly like went into like Sims.

Yes.

You start building buildings and cities.

I'd like to say that kind of helped me on this journey at a startup.

Right.

All those little things I picked up in my adolescent years.

Okay, but Matt, you did not pick up dysentery on Oregon Trail.

Right.

Because that's what all the characters would, would pass away from.

And I'm not making light of that.

If you've played the game, you know what I'm talking about.

Trisha also says, I loved Oregon Trail.

I think all of us did.

And whoever came up, I can't remember the company, they must have struck the best deal possible to get that game in all the school computers across the country right.

Now, Rick, you also, I think, were a fan of Oregon Trail.

I think you were relating to what Matt said.

What about your own answer?

What's one of the earliest devices computers that made impact?

Yeah, for me, and I'm just a little bit older than you guys.

I remember the first Texas Instruments calculator, first video game was Pong.

But the one that really influenced my career to get into the supply chain was I had to program in Fortran on punch cards and draw pictures and solve problems and fight for computer time at midnight at the computer center, Georgia Tech.

And that convinced me that was not going to be my career and I had to get into supply chains.

That was a, that was a seminal moment for me.

Yeah, same, same.

I started my college career in computer science and the programming and those compilers back in the day and, and having to do your homework hours and hours.

That's how you learned.

I knew I was not cut out for computer science so I share that with you a little bit Rick but I'm going to add one more Matt and Rick Y ones the old Apple computer, not the Apple IIe but like the first really successful Apple home computer that had Claris works on it.

That was my first word processor back in the day and from a gaming standpoint while Sega Genesis probably that nor Nintendo was like at the peak of my gaming now my son has taken that baton from me but the Intellivision was my first at home console and you see some games, some folks still are big fans of Intellivision back in the day now but Rick and Matt.

Matt, what a great look back and now we're going to fast forward to the present.

Matt, Rick, we got a lot to get into here today and Matt, I'm so glad you're with us.

Really admire what y' all been doing at POP capacity but I want to make sure let's share a little bit about yourself and your organization with the folks here.

Tell us a little more Matt yeah, absolutely.

So I started my career in this wonderful world of supply chain and logistics as a transportation broker.

I started a franchise based brokerage doing LTL truckload movement.

From there I sold that went into the asset based side.

So I wasn't running 53 foot dry vans across the country we operated a small network of box trucks and sprinter vans primarily for time critical freight so we weren't cheap.

But during that journey I was challenged with finding a warehouse for one of my clients.

That client was a well known social media company and I knew they had the resources to accomplish what they were doing.

So I thought but when they tapped me for that challenge of going out and finding a warehouse I quickly realized that Google was my only resource.

Google or the network of supply chain logistics leaders I met which required a phone call or an email or favor call in.

There had to be an easier better way than that.

So drain my 401, drain my savings account, put it all into the product and kind of this vision of creating a digital platform to find 3PO warehouse capacity did it in the onset of a pandemic.

So 2020 got our start.

Honestly I thought that would be the most turbulent times that I'd see as a startup founder.

But now I'm questioning that, staring down the eyes of tariffs and all that that.

So that was my humble beginning.

You know I, I love supply chain.

I'm fascinated way things move and how things are imported, exported and just how important the supply chain is to all of us.

We don't even know it, right?

Not until the past five, 10 years have really people been focusing on the well, why don't we have toilet paper on the shelves or what is the Suez Canal and what a container getting wedged in there and make a difference.

We start feeling the impact of some of these challenges and all of a sudden we direct our focus to okay, well, supply chain.

ORTON and what can we do better?

Matt I love that.

Always love.

Rick.

When entrepreneurs take a problem, they experience firsthand in this case, as Matt was a supply chain practitioner, and they build successful businesses and platforms to help solve that same problem for the rest of industry.

Rick, it's my favorite element to Matt's story besides the Oregon Trail.

But Rick, your comments.

Well, it's just such an incredible space and such a dynamic space.

Everything good or bad that happens in anybody's supp all ends up on the tail end at the customer facing into things, whether it's a warehouse or in transportation.

And as a former leader of the Clorox distribution center network, I would have given lots of money to be able to have a platform like this where I didn't have to drive around in a car with two other people, you know, walking in warehouses, kicking the tires, staring at the clear height, looking at the utilities, trying to figure out if the dock doors were going to work.

It's fantastic.

I think it's those kind of insights that make it a lot easier for supply chain professionals these days.

Well said, Rick.

Folks, we all need to get time back.

That's one thing.

And the great thing is we can lean on technology to almost literally I said that from my high school sophomore to literally create time for our teams.

And so folks, check out popcapacity.com you can learn more about the platform that Rick and Matt are speaking to.

And we're going to dive more into some great warehousing insights with the panel here today.

All right.

So Matt, actually I want to share this interesting read that I caught over the weekend.

Weekend, folks, let's take a look at the bonded warehouse boom.

This story comes to us from CBS News.

Now for some of you out there that may not know, I'll be the first to tell you, I've never dealt with a whole bunch of bonded warehouses.

But let's level set on what that is.

Simply put, it's a secure facility where imported goods can be stored without having to immediately pay import duties or tariffs.

That last word.

Hence you know why they're booming, right?

Because business is booming.

Now this story here from CBS News focuses on Lynx Logistics.

That's a high tech security warehouse in Fremont, California.

Now, a portion of their facility is serves as a bonded warehouse.

And get this, Matt and Rick, the demand is so high that the company has plans to triple its bonded space to 15,000 square feet.

Approval by U.S.

customs is required.

Right.

These are highly regulated environments.

Hey, the government's not getting their bucks.

It's going to be regulated right now.

As Lynx Logistics CEO Shane Salazar shared in this article, this approach allows companies to stretch their cash flow in their dollars and only pay tariffs as they pull items from that secure and supervised bonded warehouse space.

Several sources are reporting massive new demand for bondage space here in the US and in Canada.

While we all wait and see the details and potential implementation of the recently announced US China trade deal.

And we're all waiting to see what's all in there.

All the details.

Right.

Well as of this morning, Rick and Matt, one last thing.

Get y' all to address this.

The Wall Street Journal reported just a couple hours ago that both countries, China and us have agreed to drastically reduce new tariffs to as low as 10% over the next 90 days while negotiations continue.

So Matt, your thoughts on this whole bonded warehouse space and some of what we're seeing?

Yeah, I mean my opinion on it is this is a short period of time, right.

It's a reactive type scenario.

We're seeing that all the stuff that's on the water, all the stuff was setting sail, didn't have a destination now.

Right.

It needed to go into a bonded facility because it's not going into the traditional distribution center of going to all in a hope to delay things and enter the States at a more advantageous tax rate rate.

You know, I think anybody who kind of follows these type of decisions right.

At all.

We knew things were under negotiation.

We knew that the 100 plus percent tax wasn't going to be digestible for China or any other countries that were impacted by it.

But we had to start somewhere.

So interesting see and we have our team right now looking into the data to figure out, okay, since the recent announcement, is the dynamic going to change?

Are people going to say, well we don't need bonded, just find us traditional warehouse space?

Because I don't know if people really understand what's going to happen.

We're still under negotiation.

So I think that's the big question mark here is do we continue to come into bonded facilities and groves for that kind of unknown.

Now we got a little bit of the picture do we make adjustments?

It all boils down to data and visibility and just ingesting the information as you get it and trying to make the best decision possible.

I think that's all we're trying to do.

Matt, well said, very measured commentary there.

One of your last things you mentioned, and Rick can get your take here, is the details, the definition of the prompt problem in the fullest sense.

We're not quite there yet, but to Matt's point, we're getting bits and pieces and we've kind of had to rely on our less than functional crystal ball to kind of map out the interim strategy here.

But Rick, what are you seeing?

What'd you hear from Matt or your own take with what we're seeing in the bonded warehouse space?

I fully agree with Matt that this is a short term temporary situation.

You know, I've been talking with lots of people and you know, anywhere from the end of Q3, calendar year, Q3 to Q4 is when they think things are going to break loose.

A lot of these negotiations will be completed.

Of course the US and China neg negotiations started on the 10th and you know, some of the early output has the market abuzz.

You know, stock market was up 2% today.

But I think here's the thing, I differ a little bit on what's going to happen on the back end.

Bonded warehousing space is really expensive and I think as soon as importers can get out of there, you know, they can't afford to have a whole lot of cash tied up on their balance sheet with excess inventory.

At the same point in time they're trying to hedge their bets against paying tariffs that in a week, a month, two months they won't have to pay.

So there's a little bit of a hedging game going on here with these imports.

But I think ultimately the amount of bonded space will probably be about what it is right now, assuming there's not this ongoing tariff game being played.

Rick.

That's good stuff, Matt And Rick, I would just add in here sheer conjecture, right?

Sheer conjecture.

I am glad that the folks that really have been there done that in the supply chain industry that their voices were heard by those driving policy because it's just me, me.

But it seems like a month or so ago the appetite with some of our policymakers, they are willing for a longer fight and I am so glad that approach seemed to shift a bit because the bonded warehouse market may have been prepared for a much longer run had the finesse not been applied.

So we'll see we all, I'm sure, want to see what's in this deal that's being touted over the last couple of days when US and China, but hearing good things now, we just got to see it for ourselves.

And you know, Scott, if I could real quick, I put all of what you just said under the category of negotiating tactics and strategies.

These are all sort of laying the ground and the foundation for.

Yeah, it's going to be a long fight.

It's going to be really hard.

It's going to be really difficult.

Our economy is built to withstand something like this.

Although it wouldn't be fun and great, we could withstand it other countries, it's almost immediate impact.

And so I think there was a lot of negotiating ploys going on behind the scenes.

I think smart money would agree with you, Rick.

A lot of good stuff.

All right, so Matt and Rick, let's see where are we going from here?

And by the way folks, check out this read.

You know, you may have never dabbled in the bonded warehouse space, but at least now you know.

Now you, you don't know the next disruption.

I'm not wishing for them, but you never know the next time you may need to look into the bonded warehouse as a lever.

Okay, so Matt, you and Rick, certainly you've got your finger on the pulse of the warehousing industry like few do.

And so Matt, what are a few other key topics that supply chain leaders should be more aware of when it comes to the warehousing sector?

Your thoughts?

I mean, what we're seeing is a lot of people doing planning, planning for modern supply chain.

And Rick alluded to this earlier, the convenience factor is not going away.

Right.

Maybe the one day, same day, maybe we don't expect that because we kind of dealt with Sheen and Temu and TikTok.

That got us what we needed at a really discounted price, but at a longer period of time.

But I think the convenience of that will never go away.

So with that, an easier means of finding supply chain solutions.

Right.

And is there enough visibility and data to acknowledge that this is the right solution?

Solution.

The reality is there's a lot of noise in the supply chain room.

Supply chain logistics.

There's a lot of players out there that make claims to do a lot of different things.

But how do you know, how do you truly know that solution is valid until you get in, have a conversation and go through that?

And this goes from warehousing to trucking providers to packaging materials providers.

You have to go through a formal process to vet them.

With technology and the access to visibility and data, that conversation is not necessarily needed until it's actually needed, until you've gone through the vetting, the discovery and done your diligence.

And I think that's one of the things that most supply chain leaders are facing right now, is we know what we need, but we need a better way of finding it.

Relying on my old school Buddy or the 30 plus years of network that I have may not always give you the results you're looking for.

Right?

I mean, you could be a Travel agent for 30 years and you still don't know all the vacation rentals that Airbnb has in their platform.

Platform.

That's technology, convenience, data visibility.

So that when you make the decision, it's the right decision with the right person.

You didn't have to waste a ton amount of time on it.

Scott, you alluded to this time, time, time.

If you've been in supply chain logistics long enough, there's not enough time in the day for us to do what we need to do, right?

So it's if we can get some of that time back and it's done in a way that we didn't have to deploy a ton of resources or, you know, a lot of financial capital involved in that, that I think that's what everybody's looking for.

So in the warehousing world is like, what do I do and who are the players and how can I make the right decision with the capacity that's available now in the unknown?

Well said, Matt.

Rick, tech enabled planning and you got planning of course in supply chain in a formal sense, but then you also have it in a broader sense, which, you know, Matt's kind of speaking to, especially as it relates to finding the right warehousing footprint that any organization needs.

And why do it, Rick?

Why do it an old fashioned way?

That's so time consuming and there's no guarantee of.

It's not data driven.

There's no guarantee of success.

I mean, it's 20, 25.

Goodness gracious.

But what'd you hear there, Rick?

And what are you seeing out in the warehouse space?

I think Matt's exactly right on all of that.

I would add maybe just a couple things.

First of all, the platforms that have great data that can be sorted and sifted and curated to create insights fast are going to win, in my opinion, because it allows for better decision making, more certain decision making and orchestration of the supply chain versus just having to try and react to something that happened five minutes ago or five days ago.

This idea is advancing leaps and bounds whereby either through the use of digital twins or, you know, millions of scenarios being evaluated at one time, as some platforms offer now, you can actually get to really optimal solutions in a very short period of time and have a good degree of certainty that you've picked the right thing with the assumptions and the variables that you have layered into that platform.

I just think there's going to be continued growth there.

And it speaks well of, you know, platforms like Mat's, who have all that great data and can help somebody make a decision quickly about how to move forward.

Forward.

I agreed.

And as you were sharing your thoughts there, Rick, I gotta admit, I was multitasking.

I've accumulated several truckloads of tomatoes from my local farmers market and I want to enjoy them year round.

So I'm over here on popcapacity.com and I googled Newark and looking for temperature controlled warehouses of at least 50,000 square feet.

And just like that, I've got four options plus another 21 options ready to go.

How about that?

First off, Matt, are you a big fan of homegrown tomatoes this time of year like I am?

I'm not being raised in the South.

My wife kills me for this.

She'll eat a tomato sandwich.

Just cut it up.

I can't, I can't.

Okay.

I love tomato.

It's the consistency thing for me.

Okay, hey, fair enough.

Fair enough.

Rick, can I count on you to like those homegrown farmers market tomatoes as much as I do?

100%.

100% born and raised in the south.

And that's.

That's just a staple.

Oh, it sure is.

Oh, it tastes so much better.

All right.

But anyway, Matt, I'll give you the last thought here before I shift gears and we're going to talk about your entrepreneurial journey.

Let me ask you this.

What has been a eureka moment again?

I love your personal journey and the problem you had.

Finding the right space as a practitioner and how you've built a great, forward looking and innovative platform to solve that problem.

As you're having conversations with folks that are new, that are maybe looking@popcapacity.com for the first time.

What's a recurring eureka moment that you're like, oh my go gosh, you mean it can be this easy?

What about.

And I've been doing it wrong all this time.

What's the eureka moment that you see regularly, Matt?

That websites are not always as accurate as you think they are.

Right.

And I think this is common practice across all the supply chain.

And look, I was in the transportation brokers too, and I did it all.

Flatbeds, overhaul, step decks, truckload, you name it, I could cover it for you.

Which is not necessarily the truth.

Right.

I had a sweet spot.

I know what I did.

Well.

But to make money and to give people consolidated solutions, which does have value, you start to go that way.

But your website tends to read that way, too.

So if we didn't have bond.

Let's just use this as an example.

If by chance I didn't have bonded space in a certain market and I was forced to go to Google to see if we're missing, you know, somebody in that particular market, there were dozens of people that I ran to in those markets.

It all claimed to have that service.

But when you got them on the phone, oh, well, they.

That expired back in 2022.

Oh, but it's only 500 square foot behind a small little cage.

Oh, we're only insurance bonded.

We're not tax bonded.

You start reading through and then this is where in.

In its entirety would pop, right?

You start peeling layers of onion back and you really start understanding who the actual service providers are, what they marketed well.

So onions, tomatoes, what's next?

Watermelons and cantaloupes maybe?

Matt, you're making me hungry.

You're making me hungry.

But kidding aside, Rick, he's dialed in on.

I'm looking forward to seeing what's next for the.

For Matt and the pop capacity team.

And Rick, I'll give you the final word before we kind of switch over to his entrepreneurial story.

But Rick, your final word.

Why should folks, why must we do things differently?

Like it's 2025, not like it's 1985.

Well, I think there are two big drivers.

One is we all have to operate at the speed of the consumer.

You both have said it during our time together here, the convenience, the speed, our expectations are just not going to change.

In fact, you know, we might even want things a little bit faster.

So that's number one.

Number two, the balance between people and digital assets, human assets and digital assets is going to have to shift.

There just aren't enough people with the right skills, not enough people total and not enough people with the right skills.

And so those digital assets are going to have to come into play.

And by the way, in many cases, they're going to take on work that people don't necessarily love doing.

It's highly repetitive.

It's got a lot of data.

They're banging away at a keyboard eight hours a day.

That's not super fulfilling work for a lot of folks.

So I think there's a huge upside in some of that as well.

And there will be jobs created by these digital assets that don't exist today.

So that's the other upside to the equation.

Yes, appealing, fulfilling jobs created based on the incredible golden age of supply chain tech.

We just have to evolve with the times and supply chain logistics in particular.

We're humans, right?

And supply chain is a very, very good example of that.

It worked, it wasn't broke.

So don't fix it.

Right.

And now we're seeing that by fixing it is going to make our job so much easier, is going to free up a little capital and time and, and open up some intelligence and data.

So.

I agree.

And a grease sandwich with a little slice of homegrown tomatoes and maybe an onion ring or two.

We'll see.

All right, so Rick and Matt, one last thing.

Rick, you were touching on the human element again and I love that as a big common theme in today's edition of the Buzz.

Heard of Factoid.

So last week I spent some time with my friends at Enable and Enable is a modern day technology company that helps create rebates amongst supply chain ecosystem in very innovative, forward looking ways.

It's not like in 1985 in the rebate landscape.

Some really cool things we're doing and I was at their customer conference called Catalyze last week.

Matt and Rick and I cannot remember which speaker shared this data point but it was from a recent research and it was two key points.

First point was recent surveys.

Overwhelming majority of Americans want more manufacturing here in the states, right?

Over 80% in this one survey which doesn't surprise anybody, right?

Manufacturing creates lots of wealth not just in the US but around the globe.

But then the second question was do you want to work work in a manufacturing facility?

And 70% said no.

Over 70%.

And to both of yalls points, different points you've made that really illustrates one of a thousand reasons why we've got to reinvent how work is done.

Because the ideal, all the great talent out there, they have very certain things they're looking for in roles, right.

And they don't want to work like it's 1985.

So we've got to turn whether it's in this case we're talking warehouse procurement or many other cases, how we change how we do supply chain.

I love data points like that Rick and Matt, because it really speak speaks to the heart of a variety of our challenges here.

And the why that we need to change how we do work.

Okay.

So Rick and Matt.

Matt, I want to, as a fellow founder, I would love.

I was reading your commentary.

I think it was on LinkedIn a couple days ago.

You were talking about bootstrapping your tech startup in a very transparent and genuine manner and I love that.

One of the points you made in terms of what you've learned from bootstrapping a tech startup was this quote.

Lean and mean equals smart and efficient.

Efficient.

You don't have to hire a thousand people to create something amazing.

Find the right people and treat them right.

End quote.

I love that.

So Matt, be it related to funding or anything else, share a piece of advice or two for our potential supply chain industry founders that may be tuned in here today.

Yeah, absolutely.

We're bootstrapped so we're not backed by Silicon Valley or any big VCs.

We saw instant success right out of the gate that created monetization that have prohibited us from going and raising capital capital.

With that said, it allowed us to really build this thing authentically, strategically.

Not having $10 million sitting in a reserve account to deploy towards technology advancements that may or may not work.

It created a really tactical mindset and with that we were able to find people that also believed in that tactics, believed that we didn't have to have an abundant amount of cash to create something super important.

That the pain point that we found could be solved with what we deployed.

Void and finding the right people to follow that passion, that vision.

Right.

A lot of times it's hard to find people that see outside of just money.

I believe this is going to be a multi billion dollar organization one day.

But it all starts from somewhere in the beginning.

Finding those people that are seeing what's happening in the current state.

Still believing in the vision.

Don't have all the resources, we don't have all the things that you'd properly need to scale an organization.

The way that we have, what we do have is open dialect, great conversation and real decisions.

Real challenges that money can't solve.

Well, it could if we had it, but just make me think a little bit different about the people by the processes about where you deploy capital, just everything.

It just makes you a well rounded entrepreneur.

I love that perspective and you know, you never know what's right around the corner.

But to your point you were making just now and what you shared the other day, I think when you're bootstrapping your organization and growing day by day kind of with your own resources, you look at the business Differently.

You look at how you spend every dollar different, differently.

And oftentimes they can be smarter, more disciplined decisions.

Matt, which is one of the points you're making.

Rick, what'd you hear there from Matt and his advice to supply chain founders out there?

I heard a lot of greatness, you know, and a lot of perseverance.

If you think about the origin of the company and when they started right at the beginning of COVID I mean you don't always get to pick your timing, but that had to be one of the toughest periods of time.

And lots of companies who started that are not still around.

And so it speaks to Matt and his team about their perseverance, their smarts, the technology platform that they' and they're meeting a need, they're solving a problem.

And that's one of the key, I think, for all the technology founders.

He also said, you know, scarcity is good.

You don't have to hire a whole bunch of people or buy a bunch of gear to be really good at what you do.

And I think all that combined has made pop capacity what they are today.

And I'm kind of curious, Matt, what's next?

What's the encore here?

Where are you heading?

Oh, I wish I could tell you that Rick.

I'd let the cat out of the bag.

No, we just released B3 back in Thanksgiving of last year.

Year.

Right.

We've seen a huge increase obviously Terra Stroke, a lot of that being able to filter different 3pls, but it's driven a ton of data into our platform, information that we can use to build a better product.

There's different ways you can search things right now I think that you can get on your phone and use three different AI search related tools to search generic things.

You can use it to create pictures of your kids as cats if you want to.

You start thinking about the modern day technologies we have and you can simply text a prompt in and gain results.

Results.

Now start thinking about that in supply chain.

And the only reason why some of these GPT type platforms don't yield great results for supply chain logistics information is because it's pulling from websites and data sources that are inaccurate.

We're creating a really authentic data source that does have some accuracy behind it.

So now if you start typing in certain props, I'm able to provide you realistic solutions very similar to how we're starting to engage in this GPT world where like make me a picture of my son as a cat or tell me how many warehouses are in North America and just like that it scrubs all the information and gives you a result.

Over the course of time the results are starting to get better.

That means the data sources reaching into are being more accurate.

Supply chain is still not there.

Ask any generic question, it's going to pull you something you probably could have found on Google from an opinion of somebody.

It's not necessarily concrete data, informed information.

So.

So a lot of cool things coming on the search functionality, consolidated services, something I say this on every conversation I have.

It is called the supply chain.

We're all linked together and over time we've been fragmented and silos have been put around us.

But yet we're still act to function as a chain fluently with all these blockers in front of us.

So how do we create a more consolidated synergistic supply chain?

And I believe that's what data, information and access to what's available.

Well said.

All right, Matt fan, I wish we had more time with you.

CEO of Pop Capacity.

Matt, I bet you just you welcome and you're tickled to sit down and talk shop with folks.

Whether it's questions about your platform or questions about the warehousing space.

How can folks connect with you in Pop capacity?

Yeah, obviously.

Follow us.

We're on every social media feed, so LinkedIn, X, Facebook, Instagram, even TikTok.

Catch some of our funny little shorts there and then reach out to us via email.

Hello, popcapacity.com It'll hit all of our team members including for anything, questions, insights, information go into the platform.

Guys, it is free for everyone to use.

I want people to use it.

The more usage the better.

Love it.

And as I mentioned folks, earlier in today's show, took me 27 seconds to type in a couple things and get specific options of those homegrown farmers market tomatoes that we're going to convert Matt at some point.

We're going to convert Matt.

I'll eat it in a soup.

Hey, Big thanks.

Matt Fain, CEO with pot capacity.

Matt, we look forward to having you back soon.

Yes, thank you guys.

Thank you so much.

Thank you, Rick.

That was good stuff.

Wow, good stuff here.

Fascinating what Matt and the team are building over there at Pop Capacity.

I want to share a couple quick comments and we got a couple more things for you actually Rick, let's start with you before I get into comments.

Rick, if you had to pick one of your favorite takeaways from the segment there with Matt Fain, what would that be?

I love his mindset around find people who believe in what you believe in.

As an entrepreneur, leverage a scarcity mentality, kind of in concert and follow your dream.

And they've been doing that for, you know, five years now with some really outstanding results.

I love that approach.

I do too.

I sure do too, folks.

We Already shared the URL popcapacity.com.

you can also connect and you'll want to connect or follow Matt special LinkedIn.

I enjoy his again, his transparent take on his entrepreneurial journey.

And you'll get a kick out of that too.

Okay, got a couple of comments here.

Eric Wilhelm.

Eric, hope this finds you well, my friend.

I want to say the disruptive CEO CEO was how I'd introduce you years ago at a industry event.

But Eric says, hey, the question we should be asking is do you want to work somewhere where your voice is heard, you're part of a family.

You have unlimited upward potential and are rewarded for your ideas and hard work.

Manufacturing, sales, tech or ag, doesn't matter.

First who and then what?

Size does not matter.

Good stuff, Eric.

Good stuff.

And great to see you here today.

And then this is Andrew from Shropshire.

I got that city wrong the first seven times I tried to pronounce it right.

Shropshire, Andrew, good see you.

Says digital liability is across the supply chain, but there is a low level of maturity in understanding the impact data risk has.

That's a great call out, Rick.

Generally agree with that from Andrew.

I do.

I think it's a great call.

Most of us don't revere data nearly the way that we should and that is going to have to change as we rely more and more and more on integrated data to make decisions and move faster.

Faster.

Well said.

Move faster.

That velocity keeps coming back.

Rick keeps coming back.

And Nadine, great to see you.

If you missed out, he says he missed today's buzz.

We'll watch recording later.

Well, Nadine, we missed you, but you're going to want to go back and check out the segment we just wrapped with Matt Fain.

So check that out.

Hope this finds you doing well, Nadine.

Okay, Rick, we're gonna make the best use of our time here today.

I want to share one more story quickly on an important space.

I'm gonna pick back up on that data point.

Right.

We're just talking about everybody wants manufacturing, but according to that one survey, not a lot of folks want to work in a manufacturing environment.

Well, big investment and movement in all things automation and robotics in this case.

And this came from our friends over at Manufacturing Dive who reported on a business case for a national robotics strategy.

Now, did you know South Korea leads the world when it comes to robots per factory worker.

According to data from the World Robotics 2024 report.

South Korea comes in first in that ratio.

Singapore, it comes in second.

China, China, Germany and Japan rounds out the top five.

The US ranks 11th in the world in terms of this, what they're calling the robot density.

This, that ratio again of robots per factory worker.

Now, the association for Advancing automation.

That's a mouthful.

A3 aka a3 okay.

Says it's time for the federal government to get more involved to help fuel robotics in the US Perhaps even creating a central government robotics office, along with tax incentives and expanded workforce training program programs.

Some are also calling for government help in creating a bigger and better domestic supply chain and market for parts to build and repair robotics, which you'll find in other countries.

Others point to the CNC if you want precedent.

Others point to the CNC machining industry as a precedent.

Computer numerical control.

Cnc.

Folks, some of you may know that the CNC equipment industry benefited from government investment in 1950s.

Why?

Well, it was spurred by the high precision engineering and production needs of the U.S.

department of Defense's missile and rocket programs of the time.

Now, will the same federal urgency be tangibly applied to robotics?

We shall see.

Rick, your thoughts?

Well, I think it's a really interesting and compelling proposition.

You know, we do need to improve ourselves in terms of our ability to develop and deploy robotics.

Some of that is mindset of leaders and others I have to say, you know, at heart I'm kind of a decentralist and I love the way that competition, innovation fuels our economy.

I'm absolutely not an anti government person, but I think they're good at some things and not great at others.

Others.

And this wouldn't be on my list of things where I would say, you know, they have the first horse in the race.

What I would say is I love this idea about a centralized group, but I'd like it to be run like a business.

A mission, goals and objectives, A P and L talent that's hired based on their ability to deliver the objectives.

And that would be to keep us competitive on the world stage in this area of robotics and automation.

I think there's a lot to be said for for that kind of an organization.

I'm just not a big fan of putting government at the front end of it.

Rick, I like it.

You got the job.

We're going to get a billion dollar in funding.

There we go.

And we're going to put Rick McDonald's the CEO of this thing and we're going to fuel the industry and all the industries that benefit from automation and robotics in particular and have a much brighter future.

But I tell you, Rick, in general, and folks, you can check out all the articles we covered here today and Matt's story.

We drop all the links right there in the chat.

You want to click away.

But Rick, in the broader sense, it is fascinating to see what's going on in factories both here and around the world from automation and robot robotics, as some are saying.

It is fascinating and to see the new applications.

Right.

I'll tell you, we're going to have less and less reason to cling to our spreadsheets and cling to how we've always done things as technology continues just to knock our socks off.

You see the same thing, Rick, I.

Totally agree with that.

Again, the ratio of human assets to digital assets is going to have to shift, I think with good reason, good effect and great value on the back end if it's managed right through the process.

Process of implementation.

Well said.

Okay, so Rick, as we start to wrap here, you know I'm a big old fan of good news in all shapes and forms, whether it's tied to supply chain or if it's about this incredible journey that we're all on, kind of more in general.

So what is one piece of good news out in the industry that you've seen here recently?

Well, I'll tell you, this was surprising to me.

You know, the New York Fed measures supply chain resiliency.

There's a supply chain pressure index and that index was actually improved in April versus the prior month by a significant amount, which says supply chains are more stable.

Stable.

That says to me that there is a lot more resilience in our supply chains than maybe any of us would have suspected.

And if we've been asked the question without that data, we might have said, well, you know, supply chains are turbulent right now.

There's a lot more uncertainty.

And so therefore that's creating disruption.

It actually seems to be the opposite.

And I think maybe all the lessons from COVID and from other times have enhanced our resiliency, but also our agility to respond to things that don't quite go the way we had planned.

Rick, that is interesting.

I love accumulating data points, especially those pulse points that kind of give you different reasons, readings of maybe where industry and consumers and supply chain leaders heads are.

What I'm picking up from you is maybe these aren't as big VUCA times as what some may believe.

And that is Excellent news, Rick.

They're going to be more black swan, gray swan events.

Our resiliency continues to improve as a supply chain community.

I think we got to keep our eye on that ball so that we don't get comfortable that things can't get more disruptive, that they can't get more vuca ish.

If you.

You will.

And good leaders will do that.

Yes, and I certainly will vukish.

I love that.

Is that a adverb or a verb or who knows?

Yeah, that's right.

Folks, if you enjoy hearing from Rick McDonald as much as I have, I got good news for you.

Even better news, you can find him at many events coming up on the keynote in the panel circuit, but you can also find him on a terrific panel at Procurement and Supply Chain live in Chicago in late May 28th and 29th of May up there at the convene.

Willis Tower, of course, former Sears Towers, I think it's the tallest structure in Chicago.

Stands out, it's iconic.

And the convene facility within it is really, really cool.

What a great place to have an event.

So check that out.

And Rick, looking forward to hearing your key takeaways from that session.

Also, folks, be sure to connect with Rick on social.

He's a trusted advisor and board member for some of the most innovative organizations in global business.

All right, Rick, Rick McDonald, great to have you here.

Your first time as a co host here on Supply Chain Now I hope there's many, many more to come.

But great to see you here, Rick.

I enjoyed learning from you, Scott.

I really loved it.

I think we had a great sess, Matt, and always I enjoy interfacing with you and sharing insights and learning from you.

Just fantastic.

I agree.

What a great way to start what's going to be a very successful week, folks.

We always try to make it easy for you.

We dropped several links in the chat, including Connect with Rick, follow Rick right there.

Connect or follow on LinkedIn.

You'll be glad you did.

And you want to learn more about what we do here at Supply Chain now, especially check out our podcast programming.

Take it wherever you may go, including maybe the if you got a cavity getting filled this week, it may be a little less painful by listening to a podc.

I don't know.

I'm glad it's you, not me, my friends.

All right, big thanks.

Matt Fang with pop capacity.

Great to have Matt here, of course.

Great to have Rick McDonald here.

Big thanks to Amanda and Trisha behind the scenes helping to make production happen each and every edition of the buzz.

And most importantly, big thanks to all of our global audience, all of our SCN global fam that dropped in here.

I know we couldn't hit everybody's comments and questions, but really appreciate you being here.

Y' all.

Keep the feedback coming.

Rick, I think I'm gonna go have a.

Have a tomato sandwich.

A homegrown tomato sandwich for lunch.

How's that sound?

That sounds fantastic.

It does.

All right, Rick, we'll see you again soon.

Folks out there, you got homework.

Take one thing.

Rick and Matt brought it here today.

Take one thing they shared.

Share it with your team, put it into practice.

Right?

You know, that's how we change the game.

Deeds, not words.

So with all that said, on behalf of the entire supply Chain now team Scott Luton challenge.

You do good, get forward, be the change that's needed.

And we'll see next time right back here on Supply Chain Now.

Thanks, everybody.

Join the Supply Chain now community.

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