Daniel Murray: Welcome to a new special series called The Bathroom Break,

Jay Schwedelson: that extra 10 minutes, you either have

Daniel Murray: to listen to marking tips or use the bathroom or both, but I don't recommend. But that's your choice.

Jay Schwedelson: This collab is gonna be super fun. We have Daniel Murray from the Marketing Millennials and me, Jay Schwedelson from the Do This, NOT That! podcast and SubjectLine.com.

Jay Schwedelson: Each episode in this series, we are gonna go over quick tips about different marketing topics. And if you want to be in the bathroom, fine, just don't tell us about it. Thanks for checking it out.

Daniel Murray: We are. Back with another bathroom break. I'm here with the Jay Schwedelson, and I have a, uh, question for you, Jay.

Daniel Murray: Something that I've noticed over the, like last year is you seem to. Get food poisoning more than the average person. So what are some tips of avoiding not getting, uh, food poisoning? Because yesterday Jay got food poisoning,

Jay Schwedelson: right?

Daniel Murray: Two months ago he got food poisoning. Yeah. Before he trip, he got food poisoning.

Daniel Murray: I don't know how he keeps getting food poisoning.

Jay Schwedelson: Well, first of all, I want everyone to know I wash my hands. I'm about to get like slammed to comments, like, I'm disgusting or something like that. Uh, I do wash my hands. I, I think I need to be more focused when I'm ordering food from somewhere or getting food from somewhere because I'll get like weird fish.

Jay Schwedelson: From places are not known for like, you know, fish or something. And so, or on a plane.

Daniel Murray: Oh, I had the funniest story about that.

Jay Schwedelson: Oh, what do you got?

Daniel Murray: Um, when Ari was pregnant, uh, we were saying, oh, hey, let's get you more salmon because it's good. It's Omega-3. So we ordered salmon from. A Thai place and why would you order salmon from a Thai place?

Daniel Murray: It's stupid. And it came and it smelled. She, she was eating it and we're like freaked out 'cause it was like beginning of pregnancy. She starts eating it and she. After like five bites, she's like, this tastes disgusting, it smells off, something's wrong. And I'm like, why didn't you keep eating it? And I freaked out.

Daniel Murray: So we called her dad and said, what should we do? So we threw away the salmon and he's like, no, fish it out of the the trash and put it in the fridge just in case it was contaminated so you could take it out and go get it tested. So we've saved this fish discussing fish in our fringe for a day. To wait and see if Ari got sick.

Daniel Murray: It was terrible. Um, so

Jay Schwedelson: that's

Daniel Murray: amazing. Orang, disgusting. Phish is not a good idea, Jay Schwedelson: right? Well,

Daniel Murray: it's terrible.

Jay Schwedelson: Wow. And saving it is never something I would ever recommend. But maybe saving this episode is worth saving, but a transition. So what we wanna talk about is. Some small nuances that actually are radical game changers right now in marketing performance that I'm sure everybody's sleeping on because I wasn't even aware of some of this stuff until recently.

Jay Schwedelson: So I'll drop one first and then. Forever listicles have been crushing it. Uh, meaning the seven things you need to know about this, the five biggest fashion trends for this, the nine HR rules you need to know. And everyone's also saying Listicles are so great because of ai, because AI loves picking up listicles.

Jay Schwedelson: But there's a nuance now. That, uh, is a little bit different of what AI is looking for to show up in the AI search results. And also it's working to get your emails opened and clicked on and consumed, whether you're a business or consumer marketer. And that is focusing on the absolute best, meaning that instead of saying the seven whatevers or the nine whatevers, it's saying the top three, the number one.

Jay Schwedelson: Or the best, whatever. So the best solution for HR software, the number one option for billing, whatever the top three fashion things you need to know, as long as it's top three, number one or the best, uh, that is actually what's pulling exponentially higher on the AI platforms. And that's actually what's working better in email.

Jay Schwedelson: So it's, it's like listicle within a listicle. And so if you're just playing the old playbook of listicles, you're actually not doing the thing that's actually working better than anything else. All the testing that we're doing.

Daniel Murray: I'm gonna add one about AI too. I had another one, but I'm gonna add this one.

Daniel Murray: One thing that I always was anti is when it comes to writing is using AI to do a lot of the writing. Writing part of the writing, and what the nuance I wanna say is. If you're writing an article or a deep, a deep article about a topic, what you should be actually doing is going on like Perplexity and Claude and ChatGPT, looking at the what is pulled into the resources and use those resources in your article so you become a source.

Daniel Murray: What these AI models want to see is that you, you're helping, uh, curate the internet for them. So if you read a good article and add this source, this source, this source, it actually is, is seen as, okay, this is a, actually a valuable source. This person helped me, uh, curate a bunch of links and they came up with a new perspective and actually a great way to write.

Daniel Murray: So. Don't. When you go into writing, use it as a resource too and find links That Perplexity is pulling up ChatGPT is pulling up, Claude, pulling up and put it in your article.

Jay Schwedelson: Uh, so I love that one. And then, and it's, it literally is the smallest thing's gonna make a difference. And even if it's something that like you thought was a certain way, uh, I'll give you an example.

Jay Schwedelson: And then you had almost retested again. One of those I'm seeing in my, um. My email newsletter, so my email newsletter and newsletters across the board forever. Uh, I used to even tell people. Don't put the addition in your subject line. Don't be like, you know, the name of my newsletter is Scoop. Don't be like Scoop number 22, and then write your subject line, because that was like a waste of real estate.

Jay Schwedelson: It would perform terribly and just focus on whatever the topic of your newsletter is all about. So what we've done though, uh, in the, in the last two months. We've been testing head to head, um, using addition, saying the addition like scoop number 12, and then the subject line versus just saying the subject line.

Jay Schwedelson: And the one where we put it in brackets. So we write scoop number 12, we put it in brackets, and then we put the subject line, the one where we're saying the addition with the brackets. The open rate is about 20% higher than the one that just has the straight up subject line. So that is a tactic I used to tell people to avoid like the plague.

Jay Schwedelson: And now. Now it's working incredibly well.

Daniel Murray: I, I, I think that's a great one. I think I've tested in the past and I've know people go back and forth on what, what if that's actually a good tactic, but I, I like that it's actually working, and I think why it works is people want to go back to certain additions and they can reference certain additions.

Daniel Murray: And then also, and also I think it, it works very well if you. If you have something that's very topical or relevant for that time, because if it's, if it's something brand new every single time and it's re newsworthy every single time, people wanna know. Okay, this is number three. This is the fourth tip, this is five and stuff.

Daniel Murray: So I like that, using it. And I'm gonna test it on another newsletter. 'cause my newsletter is not gonna be, I don't know how many additions I've done.

Jay Schwedelson: You like 4 billion editions. Yeah. Uh, so wait a minute. I'm, I'm just curious about something. So like, do you normally, like, do you eat something at home and you're like, oh, that's gross and you throw it out.

Jay Schwedelson: Do now customarily just because you did it once, do you take stuff outta the garbage on a regular basis now and put it in your.

Daniel Murray: I'll, I'll give you a, the reason is are Ari's dad. He is an environmental lawyer and he is seen some crazy toxic stuff and he is very also risk averse of a lot of things that go to, for example, I think three times a week I get food recall.

Daniel Murray: Text messages or email from Ari's dad for today, I got a cottage cheese recall, and me and Ari did not eat cottage cheese, but I got a email that says cottage cheese been recalled. So wow. Now I, so he is a, a freak when it comes to that. So we, when, when we told him, he said, save it so we could get tested by the lab if you do have this to see what bacteria it is.

Daniel Murray: And

Jay Schwedelson: that's hardcore.

Daniel Murray: It's crazy. No, I've never saved it again because. It was stinking up my fridge for a whole day. It was the worst idea I've ever had. So,

Jay Schwedelson: alright, well that didn't work out well, but either did this episode, now, did things worked out. Uh, but we appreciate you being here. Listen, give Daniel, follow the marketing millennials.

Jay Schwedelson: Follow Do This, NOT That!! podcast. And put, put stinky fish in your fridge. Do it. Why not Daniel? Come on man. I gotta get back to work. Get out of there. All right. While he's still in there. This is Jay. Check out my podcast. Do This, NOT That!! for marketers. Each week we share really quick tips on stuff that can improve your marketing, and I hope you give it a try.

Jay Schwedelson: Oh, here's Daniel. He's finally out.

Daniel Murray: Back from my bathroom break. This is Daniel. Go follow the Marketing Millennials podcast, but also tune into this series. It's once a week, the bathroom break. We talk about marketing tips that we just spew out, and it could be anything from email subject line to any marketing tips in the world.

Daniel Murray: We'll talk about it. Just give us a, a shout on LinkedIn and tell us what you want to hear.

Jay Schwedelson: He's out later.