1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:03,920 Does this describe you? You opened your 2 00:00:03,920 --> 00:00:07,600 podcast dashboard this week, maybe as recently 3 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:11,360 as this morning or yesterday. You saw a number 4 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:16,320 and you either felt vaguely okay or 5 00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:20,720 pretty terrible, and then you closed the tab and got on 6 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:24,360 with your day. See, that's not a podcast 7 00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:27,690 strategy. That's reading your horoscopes. 8 00:00:28,090 --> 00:00:31,770 And in this episode, I'm going to give you the playbook for putting 9 00:00:31,770 --> 00:00:35,370 that data to good use and actually grow 10 00:00:35,370 --> 00:00:37,130 your show and grow your brand. 11 00:00:41,210 --> 00:00:44,810 Welcome to B2B Podcasting Insights with me, Neil Verlio, 12 00:00:44,810 --> 00:00:48,450 the founder of Podnos, a podcast agency 13 00:00:48,450 --> 00:00:52,010 helping clients get better results from podcasting. 14 00:00:52,500 --> 00:00:55,380 Here's something I want to make clear. Today we are going to be talking about 15 00:00:55,380 --> 00:00:59,060 podcast listener analytics, and 16 00:00:59,460 --> 00:01:02,900 I'm not going to be spending the next 10 to 15 minutes just 17 00:01:02,900 --> 00:01:06,100 pontificating to you about how unimportant download numbers are, 18 00:01:06,500 --> 00:01:10,060 how they're the worst metric to focus on, and all that 19 00:01:10,060 --> 00:01:13,900 stuff. You've probably heard it a million times. Instead, what I'm going to 20 00:01:13,900 --> 00:01:17,540 do is I'm going to give you a way of actually putting 21 00:01:17,540 --> 00:01:21,250 those analytics to good use. Those download numbers 22 00:01:21,250 --> 00:01:24,610 that are staring you in the face and are kind of the poison 23 00:01:24,690 --> 00:01:28,530 chalice, if they're on the high side, it's great. It fuels 24 00:01:28,530 --> 00:01:31,890 your ego. It makes you feel good. It also gives you something to report back 25 00:01:31,890 --> 00:01:35,650 to the board or the CMO or whatever decision maker is in 26 00:01:35,650 --> 00:01:39,010 your business. If that number is low, well, 27 00:01:39,410 --> 00:01:42,770 it's the opposite end of the deal, isn't it? You get scrutinized, 28 00:01:43,010 --> 00:01:46,810 questions are asked. Is this worth doing? What I 29 00:01:46,810 --> 00:01:50,530 want to give you is a playbook where you can start a Monday 30 00:01:50,530 --> 00:01:54,250 morning protocol in terms of what to look at in your 31 00:01:54,250 --> 00:01:57,890 analytics, in what order, and the 32 00:01:57,890 --> 00:02:01,610 most crucial part here, what decision each 33 00:02:01,610 --> 00:02:05,330 number in that dashboard should be prompting you to 34 00:02:05,330 --> 00:02:08,570 make. Here's the problem that most 35 00:02:08,570 --> 00:02:12,210 B2B founders and their marketing teams have 36 00:02:12,370 --> 00:02:16,210 around podcast analytics. They've got the dashboard 37 00:02:16,210 --> 00:02:20,050 open, they've got the data, and they're doing absolutely 38 00:02:20,050 --> 00:02:22,250 nothing with it. Certainly nothing useful. 39 00:02:25,850 --> 00:02:29,610 We have all the data, but no idea what to do. 40 00:02:29,690 --> 00:02:33,370 And it's not because they're lazy. It's because nobody ever 41 00:02:33,370 --> 00:02:36,810 told them what the data is actually meant to be used for. 42 00:02:37,210 --> 00:02:40,980 So let's fix that right now, starting with metric 43 00:02:40,980 --> 00:02:44,620 one downloads. Okay, I know I just said that 44 00:02:44,620 --> 00:02:47,780 I'm not going to stand on a soapbox about downloads here, and I'm not, 45 00:02:48,260 --> 00:02:52,100 because downloads are useful for something. They do tell 46 00:02:52,100 --> 00:02:55,580 you stuff. They're just not telling you what most people think 47 00:02:55,580 --> 00:02:58,580 they're telling you, downloads don't measure 48 00:02:58,580 --> 00:03:02,380 popularity, they measure reach. And reach 49 00:03:02,380 --> 00:03:05,700 on its own means absolutely nothing unless you know 50 00:03:06,180 --> 00:03:09,780 who's being reached. And here's the thing. If your episode 51 00:03:09,780 --> 00:03:13,580 about fixing your sales deck got twice the plays 52 00:03:13,580 --> 00:03:17,060 of your episode about company culture, then your 53 00:03:17,060 --> 00:03:20,420 audience has a sales problem right now. So stop 54 00:03:20,420 --> 00:03:23,860 diversifying. Go deeper into what's already 55 00:03:23,940 --> 00:03:26,900 landing. Here's your Monday morning protocol move. 56 00:03:27,700 --> 00:03:31,140 Stop comparing this week's episode to last week's episode. 57 00:03:31,790 --> 00:03:35,390 That's just noise. Compare episode 58 00:03:35,390 --> 00:03:39,230 topic to episode topic. Which of the topics are 59 00:03:39,230 --> 00:03:42,910 pulling in more plays? That's your content brief. That's telling you 60 00:03:42,910 --> 00:03:46,190 what you should be talking about more. That's your audience 61 00:03:46,190 --> 00:03:49,630 literally telling you, hey, I like this stuff. 62 00:03:49,870 --> 00:03:53,390 Do more of it. And in the only language available 63 00:03:53,470 --> 00:03:57,150 to them, they're telling you what problems they're currently 64 00:03:57,230 --> 00:04:01,040 faced with. Metric 2 episode completion 65 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:04,880 rate otherwise known as retention data. This is the one. 66 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,560 If you only track one metric on your show 67 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:12,080 going forward, make it this one. The 68 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:15,640 completion rate, which you can see in Apple podcasts, in the 69 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:19,400 Podcast Connect Dashboard, and in the Spotify for Creators 70 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,120 dashboard. That data tells you whether the right 71 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:26,870 people are sticking around. And what are you benchmarking for here? 72 00:04:26,870 --> 00:04:30,230 Well, let me tell you, a completion rate consistently 73 00:04:30,950 --> 00:04:34,790 below 40% means one of two things. Number one, 74 00:04:34,790 --> 00:04:38,630 your content isn't relevant to them. Those people that are pressing play 75 00:04:39,030 --> 00:04:42,470 are just, nah, it's not for me and they're stopping it. 76 00:04:42,710 --> 00:04:46,470 Or two, your opening isn't making a strong enough 77 00:04:46,470 --> 00:04:50,310 case for why they should be sticking around to hear more. Both of 78 00:04:50,310 --> 00:04:53,770 those are fixable. It just means you've got to get a bit more intentional about 79 00:04:53,770 --> 00:04:57,570 how you hook people in to your episodes and tell them up front 80 00:04:57,570 --> 00:05:01,050 what they're going to get. Back to that intro episode that I published a couple 81 00:05:01,050 --> 00:05:03,850 of weeks ago where I was saying to you, people don't want to hear 90 82 00:05:03,850 --> 00:05:07,370 seconds of plinky plonky piano music. They want to know 83 00:05:07,370 --> 00:05:11,210 exactly what problem you're going to fix for them, or even before 84 00:05:11,210 --> 00:05:14,610 that, making them aware that the problem exists in the first place. 85 00:05:15,010 --> 00:05:18,690 And they want to know exactly what the outcome from listening will be. 86 00:05:19,330 --> 00:05:22,250 Will you help them fix it, or will you steer them towards a way of 87 00:05:22,250 --> 00:05:26,050 doing so and make sure there's absolutely a clear 88 00:05:26,450 --> 00:05:29,810 next step waiting for them at the end of the episode? 89 00:05:30,210 --> 00:05:33,250 Because if there isn't, you're leaving money on the table. 90 00:05:33,650 --> 00:05:36,850 Here's your Monday morning protocol move on this one. 91 00:05:37,170 --> 00:05:40,970 Pull your last five episodes completion rate together and if 92 00:05:40,970 --> 00:05:43,890 one is dramatically different from the rest 93 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:48,200 figure out what it was that was different about that 94 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:52,000 episode. And the answer is almost always to be found 95 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:55,600 in the first two minutes. Metric number three the 96 00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:59,080 drop off points. Now this is one of the most underused 97 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:02,920 insights in podcasting data and it's sitting right there 98 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:05,920 in your dashboard again. Apple Podcasts, 99 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:09,240 podcastconnect.apple.com, 100 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:13,140 spotify for creators. Look at it. It's 101 00:06:13,140 --> 00:06:16,900 completely ignored. They're also in YouTube. That is 102 00:06:16,900 --> 00:06:20,740 the one thing YouTube is really good at. Drop off timestamps are not 103 00:06:20,740 --> 00:06:24,340 a measure of failure. They're your script doctor. They're telling 104 00:06:24,340 --> 00:06:28,140 you with precision to the second the 105 00:06:28,140 --> 00:06:31,900 exact moment that your content stopped being relevant to the person 106 00:06:32,300 --> 00:06:35,820 who should be most likely to buy from you. Maybe went off 107 00:06:35,820 --> 00:06:39,270 topic. Maybe you started explaining something your audience 108 00:06:39,350 --> 00:06:43,070 already knows and they felt a bit patronized. They went to 109 00:06:43,070 --> 00:06:46,750 another episode somewhere else that was telling them a little bit more about what they 110 00:06:46,750 --> 00:06:50,270 wanted to know at that point. Maybe it's where you put your CTA in and 111 00:06:50,270 --> 00:06:53,590 it felt like a bit of a hard sell too early. The data 112 00:06:53,990 --> 00:06:57,510 is pointing at something, but your job is to figure out 113 00:06:57,830 --> 00:07:01,390 what. Here's your Monday morning protocol move on this 114 00:07:01,390 --> 00:07:05,110 one. Screenshot your top three drop off points across 115 00:07:05,190 --> 00:07:08,650 your most recent batch of episodes and and have a look. If there's a 116 00:07:08,650 --> 00:07:12,370 pattern, is it the same segment of the show every single time? 117 00:07:12,530 --> 00:07:16,250 Is it the same kind of content? If so, you found your 118 00:07:16,250 --> 00:07:19,890 recurring problem. Get rid of it or fix it. And that 119 00:07:19,890 --> 00:07:22,530 will fix the whole show's issue 120 00:07:23,650 --> 00:07:27,370 metric four. Repeat Listeners and 121 00:07:27,370 --> 00:07:31,210 this is your buying window signal. We talked about buying triggers on a couple of 122 00:07:31,210 --> 00:07:35,050 episodes recently and that's kind of what this is about. And 123 00:07:35,050 --> 00:07:38,410 most founders completely miss it. A first time 124 00:07:38,410 --> 00:07:41,930 listener is curious. A repeat listener 125 00:07:42,170 --> 00:07:45,930 is considering what you can do for them. They keep 126 00:07:45,930 --> 00:07:49,610 coming back because something in your show is answering a question that 127 00:07:49,610 --> 00:07:53,370 they're still lingering around. They haven't resolved it yet. 128 00:07:53,690 --> 00:07:57,450 That's an open loop in their buying journey. And your podcast 129 00:07:57,450 --> 00:08:01,140 is what they're using to try and close it. These are your 130 00:08:01,140 --> 00:08:04,700 highest value listeners, full stop. Make 131 00:08:04,700 --> 00:08:08,500 absolutely sure that your call to action is framed for 132 00:08:08,500 --> 00:08:12,340 someone who already knows you, not for a complete stranger 133 00:08:12,420 --> 00:08:15,060 because they're not a stranger anymore. 134 00:08:16,180 --> 00:08:19,700 And here's your Monday morning protocol move on this point. 135 00:08:20,420 --> 00:08:24,140 Look at your listener retention curve week on week. Is it 136 00:08:24,140 --> 00:08:27,990 growing even slightly? That stickiness is worth more 137 00:08:27,990 --> 00:08:31,550 than a spike in new downloads from, say, being featured in a 138 00:08:31,550 --> 00:08:35,190 carousel on one of the podcast apps or somebody sharing 139 00:08:35,190 --> 00:08:38,830 your episode's Link on a LinkedIn post. Most of 140 00:08:38,830 --> 00:08:42,550 that doesn't convert for longer term. So there we have it. That's the 141 00:08:42,550 --> 00:08:45,910 four metrics, the four decisions that you can be taking 142 00:08:46,070 --> 00:08:49,910 around your podcast. None of them require a spreadsheet, none of 143 00:08:49,910 --> 00:08:53,680 them require a data analyst, and all of them can be acted 144 00:08:53,680 --> 00:08:56,880 upon. Before your next episode even goes live 145 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:01,200 Monday morning, stick an hour in your diary to go through all this stuff. 146 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:05,120 Downloads compare topic to topic, not week to week. 147 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:09,240 Completion rate, your audience fit, test drop off 148 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:13,080 points, your script rewrite, repeat 149 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:16,920 listeners, your buying window and triggers speak 150 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,390 to them like they're almost ready to buy. Because they probably 151 00:09:20,390 --> 00:09:23,990 are. Each 152 00:09:23,990 --> 00:09:27,750 episode I share questions from founders running their own B2B podcast. 153 00:09:27,830 --> 00:09:31,536 You can send yours to Neal. That's N E a l@podnos.co.uk 154 00:09:31,684 --> 00:09:34,110 p o-k n o 155 00:09:34,110 --> 00:09:37,670 w s.co.uk. 156 00:09:37,990 --> 00:09:41,430 this week's comes from Rachel, who's head of growth at a 157 00:09:41,430 --> 00:09:45,030 professional services firm. Rachel has recorded six 158 00:09:45,030 --> 00:09:48,680 episodes and hasn't published a single one. I see where this is 159 00:09:48,680 --> 00:09:52,400 going, she asks Neil. I keep going back and finding things to 160 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:56,120 improve on my yet to be published episodes. How do I 161 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,840 know when an episode is actually ready to publish? I'm going to be 162 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:03,519 honest with you, Rachel. You're not tweaking here, you're hiding. And I say 163 00:10:03,519 --> 00:10:07,320 that with complete understanding, because almost every founder I've worked with has had 164 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:10,960 a version of this conversation with me at some point. Here's the 165 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:14,880 truth for you. The six episodes sitting on your hard drive 166 00:10:15,390 --> 00:10:19,190 are converting. Absolutely nobody, not one warm prospect, has heard 167 00:10:19,190 --> 00:10:22,830 them or been nudged closer to making a decision to work with you 168 00:10:23,150 --> 00:10:26,550 or booked a call. Meanwhile, the episode that has 169 00:10:26,550 --> 00:10:30,030 published imperfectly next week and then 170 00:10:30,030 --> 00:10:33,750 lands in the ears of one person who maybe needed to 171 00:10:33,750 --> 00:10:37,390 hear it that's already doing more for your business than anything 172 00:10:37,390 --> 00:10:40,830 you've recorded so far. So you need to meet 173 00:10:41,490 --> 00:10:45,010 the imaginary version with the real version, because there is no 174 00:10:45,010 --> 00:10:48,850 ready, there's only published and unpublished. 175 00:10:49,250 --> 00:10:52,690 And unpublished is just really an expensive hobby that 176 00:10:52,690 --> 00:10:55,970 you're kind of justifying with the brand 177 00:10:56,130 --> 00:10:59,850 attachment. So what I would say is pick the 178 00:10:59,850 --> 00:11:03,490 strongest episode, accept that it won't be perfect, and just publish 179 00:11:03,490 --> 00:11:07,250 it no matter what happens. The second episode would be better, because by 180 00:11:07,250 --> 00:11:10,730 the time you hear the first episode with the ears of a listener rather than 181 00:11:10,730 --> 00:11:14,530 creator, you're going to pick up on things you can improve, and the sixth one 182 00:11:14,530 --> 00:11:18,010 will be even better still. But none of that improvement 183 00:11:18,010 --> 00:11:21,250 happens while they're sitting on your hard drive being quietly 184 00:11:21,410 --> 00:11:24,690 tweaked into the point of irrelevance. Another 185 00:11:25,090 --> 00:11:28,530 tip for you it might be time to hire an external editor 186 00:11:29,010 --> 00:11:32,730 to be the critic on this and actually tweak it 187 00:11:32,730 --> 00:11:36,530 in the way that helps your business doesn't stay anchored in your 188 00:11:36,530 --> 00:11:38,570 ego. Hope that helps. Rachel 189 00:11:41,130 --> 00:11:44,930 Time for this week's quick tip for B2B founders stop writing your 190 00:11:44,930 --> 00:11:48,370 show notes as a summary of the episode. Nobody who 191 00:11:48,370 --> 00:11:51,690 hasn't listened yet cares what you covered. 192 00:11:51,930 --> 00:11:55,650 Your show notes are a landing page for the person who found you through 193 00:11:55,650 --> 00:11:59,250 search, and they haven't pressed play yet, but they're trying to figure out whether they 194 00:11:59,250 --> 00:12:03,060 want to write the notes for that person. Write for 195 00:12:03,060 --> 00:12:06,780 search intent, not for listener resources. By 196 00:12:06,780 --> 00:12:10,460 all means, stick the listener resources in there, because it then gives them an idea 197 00:12:10,460 --> 00:12:14,180 that it's worth them listening to. Then have the outcome at 198 00:12:14,180 --> 00:12:17,660 the end, but don't write it like they've already 199 00:12:17,660 --> 00:12:21,420 listened. And here's something that's worth knowing if your website SEO is 200 00:12:21,420 --> 00:12:24,940 weak, your Apple Podcasts episode page can actually 201 00:12:24,940 --> 00:12:28,570 outrank your own site for the same keywords. Which 202 00:12:28,570 --> 00:12:32,410 means your show notes might be the very first thing a warm 203 00:12:32,410 --> 00:12:36,250 prospect ever reads from you. So treat them accordingly. 204 00:12:36,490 --> 00:12:39,690 If this episode's been useful, I've put together the Founder 205 00:12:39,690 --> 00:12:43,290 Podcast Playbook as a downloadable resource. 206 00:12:43,530 --> 00:12:47,130 You can go and get that. It talks you through everything we've mentioned, 207 00:12:47,210 --> 00:12:50,850 covering all four metrics that we talked about today and with the 208 00:12:50,850 --> 00:12:54,690 Monday morning move for each one laid out so so you can act on 209 00:12:54,690 --> 00:12:57,490 it straight away next week. To grab it, go to 210 00:12:57,490 --> 00:13:01,050 podnos.co.uk Founder 211 00:13:01,690 --> 00:13:05,530 Podcast Playbook. That's podnos.co.uk 212 00:13:06,730 --> 00:13:10,490 founder podcast playbook 213 00:13:10,810 --> 00:13:14,650 and the link's also in the episode description, as you would expect. And 214 00:13:14,650 --> 00:13:17,530 if you want to go a little bit further and figure out 215 00:13:18,250 --> 00:13:21,950 whether your show is actually doing a useful job 216 00:13:22,190 --> 00:13:25,630 for your business right now, that's what the Podnos 217 00:13:25,790 --> 00:13:28,910 Podcast Growth Diagnostic is for. 218 00:13:29,470 --> 00:13:32,790 It's a single session designed to answer 219 00:13:32,790 --> 00:13:36,349 exactly those questions. Also in the episode description. 220 00:13:37,070 --> 00:13:40,630 Until next time, best of luck continuing to publish 221 00:13:40,630 --> 00:13:42,430 your B2B podcast.