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On this episode of the dudes and dads podcast, we talk with our friend, Chris Russell about human trafficking.

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You're listening to the dudes and dads podcast, a show dedicated to helping men be better dudes and dads by building community through meaningful conversation and storytelling.

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And now here are your hosts, Joel DeMott and Andy Lehman.

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Andy.

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Hey, Joel.

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How are you?

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I'm good. I think I think I pushed all the right buttons tonight and got this thing going.

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Nice. You know, every once in a while, Andy, something happens.

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The podcast varies come in and they change things around.

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And boy, do I love to watch you just put it all back together.

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You know, though, Joel, it's way better than having to set it up every time we go ahead and do one of these things.

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That's so true.

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Because that never works.

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That never works.

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Love it.

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Hey, everybody, welcome to the dudes and dads podcast. Glad to have each and every one of you with us.

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Maybe you're watching the stream right now.

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Maybe not.

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But if you're not and you want to, you should.

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You should.

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You can watch now streaming and out live.

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That's where you can find us at now streaming that life.

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Is this a new edition?

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No, it's we've had it for a while.

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See, this goes to show you what I know.

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I don't know where the things are, but.

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Yeah, glad to have each and every one of you here tonight.

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Excited about our our conversation.

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So much to learn.

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Joel, what is new tonight?

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You know what?

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Thanks for asking.

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I left Josiah attending a large bonfire is what I did.

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Is your wife home?

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She is.

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OK, good.

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Had a clear line of sight.

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He's a boy scout.

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He's 13. I'm sure it's fine.

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I mean, I trust him.

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I'm sure it's fine.

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I was clear about the parameters of being number one, that all fuel sources need to

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be in far distance from that.

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But we had a lot of brush and things that had to get burned.

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And you know, you know, the weather the way it's been right.

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While it's dry and there's no wind, it's like, let's get on it.

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I had a fire last night because of that same reason.

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That was like, you know, I've got to get it out there and get the brush done when I can't

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get it done.

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And because of the summer and spring sports stuff that all goes on, that also limits my

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weekend burning opportunities.

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It does.

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So when you get it, you jump on it, you go.

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Yeah.

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And then I had to get here to the studio.

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And so I was like, Josiah, I think I think you're this is good for you.

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You can handle it.

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You can handle this.

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Please don't burn the garage, the garage or the barn down, please.

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So, yeah.

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Yeah.

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So as far as I know, everything's going great.

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And I guess we'll find out when we get back.

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How are things going for you?

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Good.

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So tonight we are actually doing a zoom back channel for our Patreon supporters.

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For those of you that are concerned, zoom back channel is entirely legal.

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I'm told it's entirely on the up.

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It's essentially just a zoom meeting that you can be in and chat and with other listeners

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and talk.

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And then if you actually want to talk and we want to bring you on, we will bring you

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on the show.

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Andy, I thought that when we sent a man to the moon, I said, that is the pinnacle of

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technological innovation and achievement.

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And yet here you are tonight talking about the zoom back channel.

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And I say, Hey, really?

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The sky's the limit.

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What else is possible before you'll be telling me that we that we the time travel is next.

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I think that's probably the next step.

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And Doc Brown is next door.

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I think anyways, Joel tonight, we wanted to bring a Chris Russell on.

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Chris is somebody that I've known for a little while.

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He's come and visited our church and talked a little bit about destiny rescue.

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And I remember thinking back then when he came on or came up, came on, came up to Clinton

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frame.

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You know, this would be a great, a great thing.

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And then the, we were at the father's more, I can't get the words out tonight.

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Fathers matter forum.

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That's hard to say it is the other week.

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And Chris had a booth not too far from us.

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And he said, you know, I think that would be a great topic.

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This I, this topic of human trafficking.

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And I said, yes, actually it would.

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It's always great to be in close booth proximity to people that are on mission.

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We're on the same thing.

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So it's great.

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So welcome to the show.

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Chris.

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Hi, welcome.

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Hey, thanks guys.

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A little worried, Joel, looking out the window.

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I see some smoke in the distance.

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I'm not sure what direction your house is from location.

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Well, that's we'll just ignore that.

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I'm assuming looks to the best.

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It's literally, it's going to be in the back of my mind the entire time recording.

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There's a reason your back is taken.

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We're just going to act like it's not happening.

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Chris.

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We always like to like to start off every show, getting a little more info about you.

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And we like to call these the, the dad stats as it were.

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So this is an opportunity for us to ask you to share anything you want to about yourself,

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your family, anything you want to put out on the interwebs.

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This is your time, but yeah, tell us about yourself.

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Maybe a little background where you come from, how you ended up doing what you're doing and

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yeah, your family, all that, all that good stuff.

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We'd love to hear about it.

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Yeah.

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Well, thanks for having me on guys.

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Appreciate it.

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So I've actually been living in the Goshen area since 2010.

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I came up here to be the lead pastor at community church of Waterford.

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So did that from 2010 to 19.

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And then that's when I came over full time with destiny rescue.

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So asked her for 23 years and now I've been full time with destiny rescue for five, but

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our church partnered with destiny rescue for four years before that.

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So I've been connected to the ministry for nine years, but full time for a little five.

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Gotcha.

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And I'm assuming you're married.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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My wife and I are married and four kids.

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Caleb is in Cincinnati.

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He'll be 25 next month.

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Nice.

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I don't know how that works.

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Does the kids get older and we don't.

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Like I'm not sure how the math works on that, but, and then three girls, my wife and I adopted

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three girls seven years ago.

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And the, and by the way, all, all at one time, right?

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Yes.

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Okay.

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So the oldest one's actually going to be 21 on Saturday.

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Another crazy one.

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And the two at home are 16 and 10.

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So yeah, I didn't think this through really well guys.

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So I grew up one of three boys.

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So getting three girls, there was a lot more drama with girls.

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And yeah, I tell people I volunteered to go on the road a lot to speed.

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Just kidding.

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He loves it.

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Quite different.

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And I think about the fact with the age difference that they had, that I was going to have at

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least one teenage girl for the next 16 years of my life.

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Yeah.

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So yeah, let us know how that goes.

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Yeah.

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Man.

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Wow.

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We'll keep that in mind.

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I've got two, two girls that are coming up and while they're not actually, well, one's

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teen, teenager.

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Yeah.

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But the other one, I think thinks she is sometimes she's working on it.

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She is.

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Yeah.

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She is.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I yeah, Chris, if you, I did the three boys and then the youngest is the, is the girl

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and Molly is a survivor.

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People, people just all the time with her, like, Oh, you have three older brothers.

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They just assume like, man, she's just having to overcome so much.

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Right.

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And it's like, she's got it made.

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This is the baby of the family.

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She she had this gig.

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She's restarted this up now where we're brothers will give her piggyback rides.

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I think if she's like, Hey, let's, let's go.

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She's tops on when she gets older.

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Any boy that's interested in her really doesn't stand a chance.

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That's how I feel about it too.

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So you're not even gonna have to step in dad.

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I feel fine.

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Chris.

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I do wonder because I just, I don't know.

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I have a particular fascination and curiosity with this for some strange reason.

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I'm wondering stepping out of pastoral ministry and doing what you're doing now.

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Have you felt like there was a very easy transition crossover?

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Have you had strange out of body experiences since, since then?

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I just, I wonder what that's been like every night after Mexican.

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I wonder, I wonder we're talking about.

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Yeah.

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I wonder how that's gone for you.

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Actually, it was a pretty smooth transition.

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And you know, Andy and I were actually talking a little earlier about that transition.

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So I was at community church of Waterford from 2010 to beginning of 2019, but my wife

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and I, we finalized the adoption with our three girls on August 3rd of 2018.

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And it was just a couple of weeks after that, that I actually sat down with our head elder.

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Cause that was the time of the year where we typically kind of do a, it's not really

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a review.

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It's just like, Hey, let's have a conversation.

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Let's discern like, is this still, or am I still the right person to lead the church

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family?

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Is it the right fit for me?

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And I just told him, I said, Hey, I really feel like the answers are different this year

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and I need help discerning this.

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So we took about a month to really pray and talk that through and realized, yeah, God,

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God had something up his sleeve and something was coming.

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So we actually announced in October of 2018 that we were going to wrap up at the end of

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the year and we had no idea what was coming next.

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It was a great faith teaching moment for our church family that, you know, we had, anytime

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you have transitioned in church, there's always people that are wondering, okay, what's the

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real story?

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Cause everything was good.

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Everything was healthy, but you know, you're always just, you know, the enemy likes to

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creep in there and make people doubt about stuff.

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So we actually kind of sent the letter out.

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So everybody got it on Friday.

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So that kind of the bomb effect and then just, I invited everybody to come on Sunday and

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we were just going to have a family meeting during service time.

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And I, three barstools up on stage, it was me, our head elder, our head board member,

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and we just shared the story and spent some time celebrating how God had called me there

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in 2010, some of the great God moments in the time I was there.

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And then how God had just been kind of changing how he had me wired, that something else was

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coming up and that I was going to be stepping out of that.

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And we just talked about kind of Abraham about the whole, I will show you as you go.

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And that's kind of how we felt was like, we don't know what's next from a, from a human

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standpoint, this makes no sense to make this decision to step, to be announcing that we

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are leaving when we have nothing lined up, but from a faith perspective of going, there's

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a time, cause we had just finished the series called sink and it was all about being in

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sync with, you know, how God wires you and what he calls you to.

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And that's what I use as that illustration is that, you know, just kind of being in sync

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with God, but over time things had shifted and God was calling me to something else.

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And there's a time that you take to pray and discern, but then there's a time where, you

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know, the answer, and now you're stepping into disobedience.

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If you continue down that road and just share that with the church, I said, I don't want

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that for me.

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I don't want that for my family.

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I don't want that for our church family.

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So we are going to trust God in this, that he's going to show us as we go.

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And we're going to go ahead and in faith, we're going to announce that we are wrapping

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up.

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Yeah.

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So, so you had mentioned that you didn't know where you were going, but shortly after that,

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you joined destiny rescue.

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Yeah.

248
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Shortly after when that became public that we had announced that we were leaving, Kirk,

249
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the CEO at the time of destiny rescue had reached out and he just wanted to get together

250
00:11:19,780 --> 00:11:22,940
to kind of hear, cause we connected, I had been going in and doing devotions with their

251
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staff and I'd spoken at several other events.

252
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I was on their board.

253
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He just kind of wanted to know like, Hey, what, what's been going on?

254
00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:34,840
And about halfway through that conversation, he said, Hey, it really value having a conversation

255
00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:36,920
with you about joining our team.

256
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And that totally blindsided me.

257
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And I was like, well, you know, this goes guys with the wives.

258
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I called the wife.

259
00:11:42,040 --> 00:11:43,400
She's like, yeah, I kind of expected that to happen.

260
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I'm like, well, thanks for the heads up there there.

261
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I had no idea that was coming.

262
00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:51,960
And so it was just this awesome thing of, you know, I got to talk with him and then

263
00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:58,080
a couple of days later I met with Jason Tash and our current CEO and we just had a chance

264
00:11:58,080 --> 00:11:59,920
to talk cause he was a former pastor as well.

265
00:11:59,920 --> 00:12:04,280
So it allowed me to say, okay, what's this look like to go into this nonprofit world

266
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with a background as a pastor.

267
00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:10,800
And it's, you know, we talked for a couple hours and then it kind of became a, okay,

268
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what's this job look like?

269
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And they're like, well, give us a week to come up with a job description.

270
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And they came back a week later and kind of rolled it out and it was just everything in

271
00:12:19,560 --> 00:12:22,440
my wheelhouse and in my, in what I was passionate about.

272
00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:23,920
So, so tell us about your decision.

273
00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:24,920
Yeah.

274
00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:28,780
So tell us about your role, what that is, are, and maybe, I don't know, maybe it has

275
00:12:28,780 --> 00:12:33,160
shifted or evolved some over time or if it's kind of maybe stayed in the same line, but

276
00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:36,960
so I began pretty much in the role that I'm in now.

277
00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:41,920
We did some adjustments where I, I moved into a different role and it was a lot more administrative,

278
00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:44,920
a lot more meetings and it just wasn't life giving to me.

279
00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:50,720
And really, and to their, to their credit, when I had those conversations with team members

280
00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:53,080
of going like, Hey, this is my wheelhouse.

281
00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:54,720
This is what I would really love to do.

282
00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:58,640
And I'm willing to do whatever for the organization, but if at some point I can get back to what

283
00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:03,840
I love, that's, and in short order, God provided someone to take some of that other leadership

284
00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:07,440
on and I was able to slide into the, into my sweet spot.

285
00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:09,840
And so, so I serve as the director of engagement.

286
00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,440
I'm one of, we have about 30 of us on the US team.

287
00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:14,660
Seven of us are pastors.

288
00:13:14,660 --> 00:13:19,440
So I'm the, I serve as the director of engagement and I'm one of those seven pastors on staff.

289
00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:23,960
So, so I get the opportunity to really connect with people.

290
00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:28,960
I probably spend about half of my Sundays traveling the country and we do what we call

291
00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:30,600
rescue Sundays.

292
00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:33,320
So it's getting to speak at churches like you're talking about and you've been, you

293
00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:36,860
know, been here getting ready to come back to Clinton frame in just three weeks for the

294
00:13:36,860 --> 00:13:38,080
third rescue Sunday.

295
00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:41,300
And it's really, let's, let's raise awareness on the issue.

296
00:13:41,300 --> 00:13:45,000
Let's connect people to God's heart on the issue and then let's figure out what God's

297
00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:47,680
call to action for our church family is.

298
00:13:47,680 --> 00:13:50,560
So it still allows me to stay very connected to the church.

299
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:56,960
And now I really get to love on and coach up pastors and then helping them figure out

300
00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:59,240
how do you get your church engaged?

301
00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:04,160
How do you get them fired up and how do you release them for ministry to set kids free?

302
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:05,800
So that's really rewarding.

303
00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:10,320
Can you tell me a little bit about what destiny rescue is for those who don't know what rescue

304
00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:11,320
is?

305
00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,840
So destiny rescue, we're an international Christian organization.

306
00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:18,520
Our primary focus is rescuing underage girls out of sex trafficking situations.

307
00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:21,280
Now in the process of that, we certainly get boys last year.

308
00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:23,920
We actually 10% and that's our highest percentage ever.

309
00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,200
And typically been hovering around like three to 4% before that.

310
00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:28,800
But last year was 10%.

311
00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:33,260
So but our primary focus starts by looking for underage girls, but in the process of

312
00:14:33,260 --> 00:14:39,040
doing our raids undercover operations, of course we go in looking for the underage girls.

313
00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:41,660
When we do the raid, we're taking everybody that we can.

314
00:14:41,660 --> 00:14:47,040
So we end up with, you know, over half of our rescues end up being miners.

315
00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,920
But we do get a lot in that like 18 to 25 range.

316
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:55,040
And then we, like I said, we get had about 10% males last year, but last year alone,

317
00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:58,520
we were able to rescue 3,352 individuals.

318
00:14:58,520 --> 00:14:59,520
Wow.

319
00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:00,520
Trafficking situation.

320
00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:01,520
Wow.

321
00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:02,520
Goodness.

322
00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:03,520
Our average rescue is 15 years old.

323
00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:06,920
Our youngest two rescues to date are two eight month olds.

324
00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:09,960
One of those was a kidnapping situation that we got asked to help out in.

325
00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:15,280
And another one was a kind of a generational situation where the girl belonged to a brothel

326
00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:16,280
and had a baby.

327
00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:18,520
And now that baby belongs to the brothel.

328
00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,600
It's just a matter of time before something happens to that little one.

329
00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:26,940
We did rescue both before any abuse started, but it just shows you how deep and dark this

330
00:15:26,940 --> 00:15:28,800
issue goes.

331
00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:33,240
But we are an international organization and we, so when you, when you look at trafficking

332
00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:37,960
in general, human trafficking is the fastest growing criminal activity in the world by

333
00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:40,560
far.

334
00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:44,840
It makes over $150 billion a year.

335
00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:48,960
It's estimated about 99 billion of that is specifically sex trafficking.

336
00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:53,480
And we know that right now there are well over a million kids on the planet being sex

337
00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:54,560
trafficked.

338
00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:55,560
It happens everywhere.

339
00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:56,560
It happens in every country.

340
00:15:56,560 --> 00:15:58,820
It happens in every state in our country.

341
00:15:58,820 --> 00:16:00,400
It doesn't happen equally.

342
00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:05,580
If you're looking at a world map, Southeast Asia is about 60% of those million kids that

343
00:16:05,580 --> 00:16:07,680
are being sex trafficked is there.

344
00:16:07,680 --> 00:16:10,420
There's kind of like, it's almost like old Testament view of women.

345
00:16:10,420 --> 00:16:14,360
Like women are seen as second or third class citizens property.

346
00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:19,040
The younger ladies have less opportunities for the kinds of jobs they can have in society

347
00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:22,360
and the oldest girls responsible for the parents as they get older as well.

348
00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:27,480
So you just put all those factors together and it just creates trafficking at massive

349
00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:29,560
levels.

350
00:16:29,560 --> 00:16:37,520
When you are are you frequently, cause you mentioned, is your organization contacted

351
00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:44,280
to go into places or are you are you operating independently and then bringing other resources

352
00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:45,280
to the country?

353
00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:48,400
Cause I would imagine in terms of like law enforcement or these sort of things, when

354
00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:52,280
you use the term raids, that's what comes to my mind.

355
00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:58,280
So I'm wondering, you know, maybe how to whatever specifics you can give, what is the kind of

356
00:16:58,280 --> 00:16:59,680
the formation of your effort?

357
00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:05,160
How where does it start when you become aware of something to the, to the process of, of

358
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:07,040
going in and making that contact?

359
00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:08,040
Yeah.

360
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:09,040
Okay.

361
00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:10,040
Great question.

362
00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:13,220
So when you are doing undercover operations in a country, you have to have what's called

363
00:17:13,220 --> 00:17:14,220
an MOU.

364
00:17:14,220 --> 00:17:18,360
It's a memorandum of understanding, legal document spells out what you can and can't

365
00:17:18,360 --> 00:17:19,480
do.

366
00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:23,880
But that allows our undercover agents to wear the hidden body cameras on them and then go

367
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:24,880
in there.

368
00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:27,400
It also spells out once we've rescued girls, do they come into our care?

369
00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:29,680
Do they go into government care?

370
00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:31,840
Are they able to be reunited with family?

371
00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:37,600
I mean, the sad reality is it's estimated that about 40% of trafficking starts with

372
00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:39,060
a family member.

373
00:17:39,060 --> 00:17:43,000
So when we rescue girls, we definitely have to vet families before that's even considered

374
00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:44,000
as a viable option.

375
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:49,080
Obviously it's the ideal option to get them back with their family if it's safe and healthy,

376
00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:50,660
but otherwise it spells out.

377
00:17:50,660 --> 00:17:54,580
So places like the Philippines, we actually do more raids in the Philippines than any

378
00:17:54,580 --> 00:17:56,820
country that we work in.

379
00:17:56,820 --> 00:18:01,760
We've done hundreds of raids, arrested hundreds of traffickers there, but they have a great

380
00:18:01,760 --> 00:18:04,000
aftercare program for the kids.

381
00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:08,540
So we help with the rescue efforts, but then they go into government care afterwards.

382
00:18:08,540 --> 00:18:13,120
Other countries like Thailand and Cambodia where they don't have as many resources for

383
00:18:13,120 --> 00:18:16,800
that, we do have programs in place that some of those kids come into our care.

384
00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:24,180
So like last year, the 3,352 rescues that we had, about almost 600 came into our direct

385
00:18:24,180 --> 00:18:25,180
care.

386
00:18:25,180 --> 00:18:28,560
Others either were able to be reunited with family or they went into government care for

387
00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:31,360
that aftercare component.

388
00:18:31,360 --> 00:18:40,000
So when a raid happens, who all is involved in that raid specifically?

389
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:43,880
So when we do, once you have that MOU, then we're working hand in hand with local law

390
00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:45,160
enforcement.

391
00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:51,580
So what's beautiful is like in places like the Philippines, you cannot be American and

392
00:18:51,580 --> 00:18:53,900
be a police officer.

393
00:18:53,900 --> 00:19:00,920
So just by being present there, traffickers aren't worried about you being with the law

394
00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:05,840
because they assume you're the tourist, which is the target audience for these traffickers.

395
00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:10,000
So it allows us to, it's a great partnership with us to be able to work with local law

396
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,000
enforcement.

397
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:14,940
And so we have, we're one of the few organizations that actually has our own undercover agents.

398
00:19:14,940 --> 00:19:18,920
We have typically 35 to 40 full-time undercover agents around the world.

399
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:24,960
A lot of anti-trafficking groups are, they gather intel, they hand it off to local authorities,

400
00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:28,880
hoping something will happen, but local authorities are getting paid off to look the other way.

401
00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:32,360
So we raise up our own rescue agents.

402
00:19:32,360 --> 00:19:38,000
So some of these agents live in these different communities under assumed names and they're

403
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,600
building relationships with traffickers.

404
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:45,400
They're building a network of informants basically.

405
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:49,440
So when they gather enough intel, then what you could have, like, you know, it could be

406
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:54,560
a common thing would be, let's say you and I, you know, are working together with Destiny

407
00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:57,240
Rescue and we're the undercover agents.

408
00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:58,940
We're building these trusted relationships.

409
00:19:58,940 --> 00:20:03,980
So we go to these guys and we say, hey guys, we've got a business deal going down and we

410
00:20:03,980 --> 00:20:06,900
want to celebrate it Friday night, but we want a bunch of young girls.

411
00:20:06,900 --> 00:20:09,420
So they're like, okay, yeah, we got, we got young girls.

412
00:20:09,420 --> 00:20:10,840
We can bring young girls.

413
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:15,820
So let's just say you and I, Andy, we, we end up going in and we're the undercover agents.

414
00:20:15,820 --> 00:20:21,260
We, we go in pretending to be customers and we go in, the traffickers show up and then

415
00:20:21,260 --> 00:20:25,580
when the girls show up, when everything's in play, then we're able to send, you know,

416
00:20:25,580 --> 00:20:29,580
some kind of signal with the phone or whatever to the rest of our team and the local team.

417
00:20:29,580 --> 00:20:34,440
Then they come in to do that rate on that and we get arrested in the process as well.

418
00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:37,040
So it helps keep our cover intact as well.

419
00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:39,700
But in the Philippines, they, they're really coming down on that.

420
00:20:39,700 --> 00:20:44,760
If you're caught trafficking two minors, it's a 30 year sentence, 30 years for each additional

421
00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:46,420
child after that.

422
00:20:46,420 --> 00:20:50,600
So a few years back, we were part of arresting a couple that had 10 kids and they each got

423
00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:52,600
270 year sentences.

424
00:20:52,600 --> 00:21:01,560
So I mean, I would assume, and is there a degree to which destiny rescue is doing policy

425
00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,640
advocacy in those, in those regions as well?

426
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:10,880
Or are those regions kind of realizing the issue that they have and are they, are they

427
00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:15,220
in terms of legislation, law enforcement, all of that sort of taking that, that banner

428
00:21:15,220 --> 00:21:16,760
up themselves.

429
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:20,120
So we're definitely, cause you think about this guys, if you're going to partner with

430
00:21:20,120 --> 00:21:24,920
the country on this kind of work, you're, you're putting as an undercover agent, you

431
00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,480
are putting your life in other guys.

432
00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:32,000
Cause think about this, you know, if you, there's a reason this is the fastest growing

433
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:36,320
criminal activity in the world and the money it's, it's going to surpass illegal drugs

434
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:38,720
and firearms and the not too distant future.

435
00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:42,120
And it makes sense when you think about that, if you sell me a gun, you make a profit one

436
00:21:42,120 --> 00:21:47,360
time if you own a girl thousands of times.

437
00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:50,320
So it, yeah, you're, you're putting your life on their line.

438
00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:55,080
So, so when you're, when you're doing that, you got to make sure that, you know, you really

439
00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:59,320
believe that government is really serious about, about what they're doing.

440
00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:02,960
So we don't work as much on the policy side of that.

441
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:07,960
I think that's the beauty of how God has called many different agencies to work together on

442
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:13,660
stuff like IJM, international justice mission, that that's their sweet spot is, is working

443
00:22:13,660 --> 00:22:18,580
on that legislative side and really doing policy and all that kind of stuff.

444
00:22:18,580 --> 00:22:21,880
And we, we get to work in partnership with them on, on some things.

445
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,980
It's just not a primary for us, but absolutely.

446
00:22:24,980 --> 00:22:28,400
I believe the countries that we work with, if we didn't believe they were serious and

447
00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,980
on their end, willing to work on some of this policy and stuff to stem the tide.

448
00:22:32,980 --> 00:22:37,580
I don't, I don't think we would ever sign into that partnership.

449
00:22:37,580 --> 00:22:40,240
Has the growth in the trend trafficking.

450
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:45,500
I mean, I would imagine that developments in technology have really aided trafficking

451
00:22:45,500 --> 00:22:46,500
considerably.

452
00:22:46,500 --> 00:22:47,500
Sure.

453
00:22:47,500 --> 00:22:52,020
Would you say that that's, that's the primary cause or is there, or is there something else

454
00:22:52,020 --> 00:22:57,840
going on that is it number one, are we just, do we just care about it more?

455
00:22:57,840 --> 00:22:59,940
So we're more aware of that it's going on.

456
00:22:59,940 --> 00:23:02,780
Are there other factors that are, that are building this industry?

457
00:23:02,780 --> 00:23:10,080
I mean, as you said, it's going to surpass illegal firearms trading and narcotics.

458
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,700
Would you identify as the contributing factors societally?

459
00:23:12,700 --> 00:23:17,020
Because, because it's, like you said, this is an international issue.

460
00:23:17,020 --> 00:23:22,020
So I'm just, I'm just curious if you would have a, in one word, sin.

461
00:23:22,020 --> 00:23:23,020
Yeah.

462
00:23:23,020 --> 00:23:24,020
Great.

463
00:23:24,020 --> 00:23:25,020
Yes.

464
00:23:25,020 --> 00:23:26,020
Yeah.

465
00:23:26,020 --> 00:23:27,020
That's really what it comes down to.

466
00:23:27,020 --> 00:23:31,740
I mean, we are one messed up broken world and that shows itself in ugly, ugly ways and

467
00:23:31,740 --> 00:23:35,580
nothing uglier than I think this issue.

468
00:23:35,580 --> 00:23:39,780
But I think you're, you know, speaking to your point earlier, there's, I mean, technology,

469
00:23:39,780 --> 00:23:43,560
the trafficking looks really different in different places in the world.

470
00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:47,600
So even like here in the U S like if we're the partying type, we're not going to go out

471
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,680
to a bar and find a 15 year old girl working in the bar.

472
00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:51,680
It's not going to happen.

473
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:54,280
We've got the laws against it and we have the bite to those laws.

474
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:55,280
Right.

475
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:59,400
But I, you know, we could literally go over to Cambodia and Thailand right now and I could

476
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,000
take you one down one city block of the red light district and we're going to probably

477
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:05,560
find 10 underage kids working.

478
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:06,800
They just lie about their age.

479
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:07,860
They've got laws against it.

480
00:24:07,860 --> 00:24:10,920
They just have no resources to force it.

481
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,360
And so they're really hiding in plain sight.

482
00:24:13,360 --> 00:24:18,140
So it's just a very different scenario than what you would find here in the U S where

483
00:24:18,140 --> 00:24:21,680
it's going to be much more high tech, much more underground.

484
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:27,920
So there are the technology stuff really is something that has aided the traffickers.

485
00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:36,780
So I think a lot of times people see and hear about trafficking in other countries, but

486
00:24:36,780 --> 00:24:40,320
you had mentioned it, it obviously happens here in the U S too.

487
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:46,160
And I think, you know, we had talked a little bit about when we met last that pornography

488
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:47,680
is a slope to that.

489
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:50,840
So can you, can you talk a little bit about, about that in general?

490
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:57,800
Cause I think a lot of times when, when men particularly get involved with watching pornography,

491
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:02,480
they don't necessarily think, Oh, I'm an I'm helping out trafficking.

492
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:03,480
Yeah.

493
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:04,480
Yeah.

494
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:09,160
Pornography is part of the monster human trafficking engine.

495
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:10,160
There's no separating that.

496
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:15,900
I mean, if you, if you do background on these guys that are deeply steeped and addicted

497
00:25:15,900 --> 00:25:24,020
into abusing and using these young girls, pornography is predominant.

498
00:25:24,020 --> 00:25:28,860
Like it's pretty much, I, I would guess it's gotta be a pretty darn close to 100% factor

499
00:25:28,860 --> 00:25:31,820
across the border of history with that.

500
00:25:31,820 --> 00:25:38,280
And I think this is where the enemy gets victory in guys lives is if a guy's, you know, sitting

501
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:43,000
behind a closed door and looking at something on their computer and doesn't feel like it's

502
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,040
really that big of a deal.

503
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:46,560
Like I'm not hurting anybody.

504
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:54,000
I'm not, you know, but, but the enemy loves that cause the enemy isn't always in a hurry.

505
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:58,240
The enemy, you remember the old casting crown song, it's a slow fade when you get like that.

506
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:03,680
That's really, I think how the enemy plays this battle of pornography with many men.

507
00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:07,760
He's not in any hurry and he will just take you down slowly over time.

508
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:13,040
So guys start looking at, you know, your basic pornography.

509
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:19,840
And the problem is it's almost like a, how your body builds up tolerance for medication.

510
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,640
Like eventually that same dose doesn't do it anymore.

511
00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:26,320
And then you've got, it's kind of like these like guard rails.

512
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:30,040
You know, if you picture those like on a road or something, you like you put those in place

513
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,140
and then all of a sudden you move them a little bit and you're willing to look at this and

514
00:26:33,140 --> 00:26:34,140
that doesn't do it.

515
00:26:34,140 --> 00:26:36,000
So you got to look at something a little more extreme.

516
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:40,840
So you just move those guard rails again and more and more and you just keep moving the

517
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:42,120
boundaries slowly.

518
00:26:42,120 --> 00:26:44,440
The slow fade happens.

519
00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:49,040
And eventually what you end up with is men who have a serious addiction to pornography.

520
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:53,460
And the reality is eventually the idea of having sex with a 15 year old girl doesn't

521
00:26:53,460 --> 00:26:59,560
really seem that far out there because it's the slow fade that is just slowly rewired,

522
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:05,400
literally rewired their brains to think completely different about this whole issue.

523
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:12,360
With, I'm trying to think of the, the really the best way to ask this question, but for

524
00:27:12,360 --> 00:27:20,540
a man here in the U S who, who eventually crosses over that line and who that now is,

525
00:27:20,540 --> 00:27:26,440
that's like something that they're, that individual is going to seek after what, what is the court?

526
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:31,760
Cause I mean, I just sit here and I go like on my worst day, like on my worst day, I don't

527
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:37,440
even know where to like, how do you even think about where to access that or to, or to gain

528
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,920
or to gain that, gain that access.

529
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:42,320
And yet clearly it happens.

530
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:45,120
It's very, it's very real.

531
00:27:45,120 --> 00:27:48,880
What are the places in the access points of that?

532
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:49,920
That's that's occurring.

533
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:55,820
What circles are people getting into where they now have access to that kind of, that

534
00:27:55,820 --> 00:27:56,820
kind of opportunity?

535
00:27:56,820 --> 00:28:00,140
Does that question make sense without, without like trying to instruct people?

536
00:28:00,140 --> 00:28:06,680
And I'm not going to name any particular, www.no, we're not going to do that and plant

537
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,180
some seeds that don't need to be planted.

538
00:28:09,180 --> 00:28:15,980
But I think, yeah, that there is such a dark underbelly to all of this even in the U S

539
00:28:15,980 --> 00:28:21,540
you know, I know in general, which I think are okay to talk about the topic of that,

540
00:28:21,540 --> 00:28:26,100
but like even just you know, like with the massage parlors and stuff like that, that's

541
00:28:26,100 --> 00:28:29,280
very, I mean, obviously, you know, you hear about that in like Southeast Asia and that,

542
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:33,660
but that's, that's very much a thing here too, that, you know, you get these underage

543
00:28:33,660 --> 00:28:39,700
girls that are working in some of these places and some of the websites, like I, I do some

544
00:28:39,700 --> 00:28:43,060
deep dives, just, you know, kind of out of research and share that, you know, we have

545
00:28:43,060 --> 00:28:44,340
teammates that share that information.

546
00:28:44,340 --> 00:28:49,540
So there's some accountability with that, but really there's so much of this that comes

547
00:28:49,540 --> 00:28:55,820
down to vulnerabilities and not just talking children here, but just women in general.

548
00:28:55,820 --> 00:29:02,660
You know, there's websites that that men can pray on young women because they're, you know,

549
00:29:02,660 --> 00:29:08,080
they might be single moms or they're, they're young, young girls trying to put themselves

550
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,500
through college and have nobody to support that.

551
00:29:10,500 --> 00:29:15,580
And there's, there's websites you get on that like, you know, you set up, Hey, you can just

552
00:29:15,580 --> 00:29:18,500
set up these kinds of arrangements where I'll help pay for this.

553
00:29:18,500 --> 00:29:23,900
And in return, you know, like it's just, it's totally feeding on the vulnerabilities of

554
00:29:23,900 --> 00:29:24,900
our women.

555
00:29:24,900 --> 00:29:28,740
It's guys that are looking for easy prey.

556
00:29:28,740 --> 00:29:34,580
And, you know, we have a whole program called a rescue op one 20 for our teenagers and we

557
00:29:34,580 --> 00:29:39,020
go into schools and we talk to the kids about how traffickers think, how they use social

558
00:29:39,020 --> 00:29:40,020
media.

559
00:29:40,020 --> 00:29:44,340
I put my dad hat on, I talk about girls, what kinds of pictures you post, what message that

560
00:29:44,340 --> 00:29:45,340
sends.

561
00:29:45,340 --> 00:29:49,140
I talked to the boys about pornography and every time I go in, I have at least one girl

562
00:29:49,140 --> 00:29:53,220
that shows me a conversation on her phone that I can guarantee is a draft.

563
00:29:53,220 --> 00:29:57,940
And I, you know, it's embarrassing sometimes that I have this conversation with my own

564
00:29:57,940 --> 00:30:01,700
kids from the standpoint of they hear me talk about this all the time.

565
00:30:01,700 --> 00:30:06,180
And every now and then something comes up where it's like, are you, are you listening?

566
00:30:06,180 --> 00:30:11,980
You're just, you're in that naive teen years where you're thinking now that can happen

567
00:30:11,980 --> 00:30:13,220
to me.

568
00:30:13,220 --> 00:30:19,700
And so, so as a, as a parent, so if you're addressing me and Joel as, as dads, what are

569
00:30:19,700 --> 00:30:29,480
some things that we can do as parents to a help protect our kids and, and be help in

570
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:33,340
general, the whole idea of, of, of human trafficking.

571
00:30:33,340 --> 00:30:38,780
Like what can we do sitting here in our comfy chairs and in the studio, like what can we

572
00:30:38,780 --> 00:30:39,220
do?

573
00:30:39,220 --> 00:30:41,740
Well, let's talk a little bit on the U S based side of stuff.

574
00:30:41,740 --> 00:30:45,300
So when we're talking about the most vulnerable populations, when we're talking kids, we're

575
00:30:45,300 --> 00:30:52,300
talking migrant workers, foster care, those are the two biggest vulnerability populations.

576
00:30:52,300 --> 00:30:57,420
So I encourage people in churches, groups, whatever that is, how do you, how do you support

577
00:30:57,420 --> 00:30:58,260
those groups?

578
00:30:58,260 --> 00:31:03,780
You know, like there's boys and girls clubs, you know, there's the post here in town.

579
00:31:03,780 --> 00:31:06,140
How do you come alongside foster families?

580
00:31:06,140 --> 00:31:12,860
Maybe your church gets some, you know, people to get a license as foster families or how

581
00:31:12,860 --> 00:31:18,580
do you support those networks of people, whether it's you doing it yourself as a foster parent

582
00:31:18,580 --> 00:31:23,460
or coming alongside a foster family and really doing that whole, it takes a village to raise

583
00:31:23,460 --> 00:31:24,860
kids kind of a thing.

584
00:31:24,860 --> 00:31:28,980
So I think there's a lot of that that can happen and people can get more involved with

585
00:31:28,980 --> 00:31:29,860
that.

586
00:31:29,860 --> 00:31:35,260
As far as for your own like personal kids, I think open conversation, like you having

587
00:31:35,260 --> 00:31:37,020
open lines is really important.

588
00:31:37,020 --> 00:31:44,180
And I think as parents, the challenge here is that we've got to be careful about how

589
00:31:44,180 --> 00:31:45,740
we set the table for that.

590
00:31:45,740 --> 00:31:46,580
Sure.

591
00:31:46,580 --> 00:31:52,460
Cause as a dad, you know, I think as dads, we get pretty fired up and passionate.

592
00:31:52,460 --> 00:31:56,140
Especially in particular with our girls as far as protecting them.

593
00:31:56,140 --> 00:31:59,220
And it'd be really easy to be like, you don't do this, you don't do that.

594
00:31:59,220 --> 00:32:01,500
You know, like it would be really easy to do that.

595
00:32:01,500 --> 00:32:07,140
And, but I think we have to be, I think our, our daughters need to hear our tender heart

596
00:32:07,140 --> 00:32:13,260
side of things to recognize how much we value and cherish them and love them and want the

597
00:32:13,260 --> 00:32:14,580
best for them.

598
00:32:14,580 --> 00:32:20,580
And to realize that these predators are out there and that, you know, with our girls,

599
00:32:20,580 --> 00:32:25,740
we talk about that, like if you get on something, if somebody contacts you and it's something

600
00:32:25,740 --> 00:32:30,900
inappropriate, you bring that to us, you are not going to get in trouble for what somebody

601
00:32:30,900 --> 00:32:31,900
else does.

602
00:32:31,900 --> 00:32:32,900
Sure.

603
00:32:32,900 --> 00:32:36,500
Now you're going to be accountable for what you decide to do in return or how you foster

604
00:32:36,500 --> 00:32:42,780
or, you know, re you know, reply to that or build that, that situation up, but you're

605
00:32:42,780 --> 00:32:47,020
not going to get in trouble if somebody, you know, sends you some picture or sends you

606
00:32:47,020 --> 00:32:52,900
some really crude message or whatever, like just come and talk to us so we can help you

607
00:32:52,900 --> 00:32:55,980
figure out the best way to handle that.

608
00:32:55,980 --> 00:33:00,320
Because you know, the reality is nowadays, like even the little kids, the, the video

609
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:05,700
games they play, those all have chat features on them and there's traffickers all over those.

610
00:33:05,700 --> 00:33:09,460
So you just got people pretending to be somebody they're not.

611
00:33:09,460 --> 00:33:14,220
And you know, my kids know like the, the ceiling is you don't connect with anybody on social

612
00:33:14,220 --> 00:33:15,700
media that you don't know in real life.

613
00:33:15,700 --> 00:33:21,820
The reality is nowadays, even that's not necessarily guideline, but that's like the ceiling part

614
00:33:21,820 --> 00:33:24,460
of that is like, you don't go past.

615
00:33:24,460 --> 00:33:28,420
If you don't know someone in real life, you are not connected to them in any way on social

616
00:33:28,420 --> 00:33:29,460
media.

617
00:33:29,460 --> 00:33:32,180
It's just too dangerous of a world that we live in now.

618
00:33:32,180 --> 00:33:33,940
We just, you just can't trust it.

619
00:33:33,940 --> 00:33:36,940
So those open communication lines are really important.

620
00:33:36,940 --> 00:33:41,740
So we need to be aware of what our kids are doing and what our kids are on with social

621
00:33:41,740 --> 00:33:42,740
media.

622
00:33:42,740 --> 00:33:43,740
We need to be monitoring that.

623
00:33:43,740 --> 00:33:47,900
More parents need to have monitoring software with their kids' phones.

624
00:33:47,900 --> 00:33:55,380
I mean, you're giving, you're giving immature kids, even if they're mature kids, they're

625
00:33:55,380 --> 00:33:57,380
still kids.

626
00:33:57,380 --> 00:34:03,980
You're giving them a phone with the power to access pretty much everything on the planet.

627
00:34:03,980 --> 00:34:08,000
And especially when you're giving that to hormone driven boys and you're just giving

628
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:11,580
them a phone, like, what do you think is going to happen?

629
00:34:11,580 --> 00:34:15,460
Like naturally they're going to find their way onto those things.

630
00:34:15,460 --> 00:34:19,540
So that's what we've got to be able to have the heart to heart conversation.

631
00:34:19,540 --> 00:34:21,220
You know, it's like scripture.

632
00:34:21,220 --> 00:34:25,660
It's never just a God saying, don't do this, don't do like, there's always, what's his

633
00:34:25,660 --> 00:34:27,540
heart behind that.

634
00:34:27,540 --> 00:34:32,820
Because if we, his heart is always for us and if we understand his heart, then it doesn't

635
00:34:32,820 --> 00:34:35,260
feel like a, Oh, I'm just going to do this.

636
00:34:35,260 --> 00:34:36,900
Cause he says, don't do it.

637
00:34:36,900 --> 00:34:41,120
You know, like if they understand that for all of us who are dads, if our kids understand

638
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:46,420
our hearts behind it, they're going to be much more receptive and open to the following

639
00:34:46,420 --> 00:34:48,420
that wisdom.

640
00:34:48,420 --> 00:34:58,060
So for, I think, you know, as our kids, we, and Andy and I have these conversations all

641
00:34:58,060 --> 00:34:59,060
the time.

642
00:34:59,060 --> 00:35:04,800
That's been the ongoing thing of I don't know what did I, I was, I was talking with some

643
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:11,100
educators the other day and I, I, I just said, and I, cause I've seen it.

644
00:35:11,100 --> 00:35:14,400
I've seen a ton of, I'm always looking at with an adolescent studies.

645
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:20,000
I mean, I w I work for a, you know, a youth serving organization now and I'm always, I'm

646
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:25,320
always trying to stay very, very, you know, reasonably up to date in terms of technology

647
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:34,900
access with kids and what it's doing and across the spectrum, be, be secular or faith-based.

648
00:35:34,900 --> 00:35:38,760
Everyone is saying the same, like it's one of the few times I think where we across the

649
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:42,960
country here where everyone is speaking pretty like the people who know and are doing the

650
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:49,560
research and are in, I think pretty much everyone knows like the results are all are in.

651
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,160
And I just, I said to somebody the other day, I was like, I was like, you're giving, you're

652
00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:53,700
just, you're putting a gun in your kid's hands.

653
00:35:53,700 --> 00:35:59,080
Just the bullets are super slow, you know, but it's, but it's loaded and it, it will

654
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:01,040
make, it'll make an impact.

655
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:05,160
And I think it makes an impact in this particular area.

656
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,240
We don't, we don't think about that, that piece.

657
00:36:08,240 --> 00:36:14,420
That's an interesting point though, Joel, you know, both your kids and my kids are trained

658
00:36:14,420 --> 00:36:16,540
in 4-H shooting sports.

659
00:36:16,540 --> 00:36:18,640
We wouldn't have just gone out and said, Hey, here's a guy.

660
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:23,280
I mean, like really we wouldn't have, but we, we do that as parents to our kids with

661
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:24,280
the phone.

662
00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:29,900
Like a lot of times we just say, here's a phone and we don't, we don't, we may put restrictions

663
00:36:29,900 --> 00:36:34,200
on it, but we don't even talk about the fact that why we're doing that or what the restrictions

664
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:39,000
mean and, and how, how to actually be safe with it as opposed to just saying, okay, here's,

665
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:40,000
here's your phone.

666
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:46,320
Cause it is, I mean, you know, really to Chris, to your point, like it is a, it's a direct

667
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:53,880
line of access to your child and, and people who have nefarious intentions who, you know,

668
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:57,120
like it is, you know, and it's super easy.

669
00:36:57,120 --> 00:36:58,120
Yeah.

670
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:03,400
I mean, it's just super easy to, to gain access to them, which is, you know, our, our policy

671
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:08,280
has been, and I don't think it's just, you know, my kids don't have social media at all

672
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:12,520
at this, at this age, like just zero access to that.

673
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:18,360
And and if I find out they are trying to get access to social media, I mean, I treat it

674
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:21,120
like I've treated, like they have stolen a vehicle.

675
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:22,800
Like I like it's, it's serious.

676
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:24,520
You know, it's serious.

677
00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:26,520
My 16 year old has a track phone.

678
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:27,520
Yeah.

679
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:28,520
Okay.

680
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:30,000
That's all she's going to have for awhile.

681
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:31,000
Yeah.

682
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:32,000
Yeah.

683
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:33,000
Yeah.

684
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:38,560
Like you said, the studies are so conclusive, like depression level of is like young girls

685
00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:42,720
that just get down there and comparing themselves to all these other, what they're seeing in

686
00:37:42,720 --> 00:37:46,300
magazines and articles about what women should look like.

687
00:37:46,300 --> 00:37:50,300
And it's just absolutely devastating on their, their self esteem and image

688
00:37:50,300 --> 00:37:52,080
Without going down the rabbit hole too far.

689
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:59,960
I mean, this is the most, and this is this past fall is one of the seminars I was at

690
00:37:59,960 --> 00:38:05,040
a researcher who is, who's done extensive research in this area.

691
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:10,920
They just, they do these national I'm going to get the name of the studies, but it's national

692
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,120
mental health wellbeing amongst adolescents specifically.

693
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:20,400
And so 2012 was the year that all this, it just started tanking, like tanking heavy.

694
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:28,120
And we're talking to the point where they, they had a hard time figuring out what in

695
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:33,520
the world would have caused such a dramatic decline in mental health amongst adolescents

696
00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:37,080
because in 2012, like there were no wars really going on.

697
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:41,080
There was not like any major like economic crisis or like anything else, you know, going

698
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:47,920
on at the, at the time it's when the iPhone hit market saturation and when, when the technology

699
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,520
hit saturation, that's when youth gain access to it typically.

700
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:51,520
Right.

701
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:54,220
Cause the prices have gone down and mom and dad are like, okay, well, junior can have

702
00:38:54,220 --> 00:38:55,940
one or whatever.

703
00:38:55,940 --> 00:39:00,100
And then from then on out, just the steady decline of what we, and I just think about

704
00:39:00,100 --> 00:39:02,060
the population you're talking about.

705
00:39:02,060 --> 00:39:05,660
I mean, that are at risk.

706
00:39:05,660 --> 00:39:11,620
If they are, if their mental health is already compromised, if they are, if they are a vulnerable

707
00:39:11,620 --> 00:39:16,380
population in that alone and the right predator comes along.

708
00:39:16,380 --> 00:39:17,380
Right.

709
00:39:17,380 --> 00:39:19,820
I just, it's like fish in a barrel, man.

710
00:39:19,820 --> 00:39:26,520
It just seems like it's just how, how, how easy, how easy that would, that would be.

711
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:31,600
And again, this is not, I mean, we're not, these are, you've seen it.

712
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:32,600
I'm sure plenty.

713
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:33,600
That's not a scare tactic.

714
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:35,840
This is a real, like this, these are real life scenarios.

715
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:37,800
This is exactly how this happens.

716
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:41,640
And we weren't part of this particular case, but in Fort Wayne, right before COVID, there

717
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:44,560
was a 14 year old girl and a very similar thing.

718
00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:47,540
She met somebody on social media, you know, the, you think about it.

719
00:39:47,540 --> 00:39:55,080
If you, if we were predators and we were getting online and creating fake accounts, what are

720
00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:59,920
we looking for when we're looking at all these other teenagers accounts, we're looking for

721
00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:08,740
depression, just loneliness, suicidal tendencies, ones that don't get along with their parents.

722
00:40:08,740 --> 00:40:09,740
Well, right.

723
00:40:09,740 --> 00:40:10,740
Even better.

724
00:40:10,740 --> 00:40:16,680
How easy is that for us to pretend to be that sympathetic ear and be like, no, you're amazing.

725
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:19,200
That's the way your parents shouldn't be able to tell you what to do.

726
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:20,200
Why do you listen to them?

727
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:21,200
You should just leave.

728
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:23,240
You're old enough to get out on your own.

729
00:40:23,240 --> 00:40:28,320
And that's what happened with her was the guy convinced her to run away.

730
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:31,940
She runs away, meets up with him before she even knows what happens.

731
00:40:31,940 --> 00:40:35,840
He takes the phone, disables all her social media, destroys her phone, and he starts to

732
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:40,120
abuse her and then start selling her to friends to abuse her.

733
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:45,240
And the only reason she got rescued was because a police officer went to a car that was parked

734
00:40:45,240 --> 00:40:48,960
in an illegal zone and it was a woman who was transporting this girl.

735
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:52,760
And when he went to talk to her, he looked in the back seat and saw this girl who was

736
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:59,160
obviously very young with all this makeup and dressed up way older than she was and

737
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,320
realized that it was a trafficking situation.

738
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,440
That's the only reason that she got arrested.

739
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:06,200
I was right in Fort Wayne.

740
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:14,880
So I think for those who are listening, we, when we talk about these things, I mean, the

741
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:18,960
purpose is always to be real.

742
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:19,960
It is absolute to be real.

743
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:25,640
It is never to give you, to give anyone a sense of like, we should be fearful about

744
00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:29,600
every single thing around every corner at the same time.

745
00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:34,440
To be discerning is a necessary thing.

746
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:36,480
And social media really is the biggest thing.

747
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:41,600
You know, you see movies like, you know, everybody can quote Liam Neeson, right?

748
00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:45,960
They've taken movies and even the sound of freedom came out, you know, the storyline

749
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:47,040
of kidnapping.

750
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:52,600
It's, it's a Hollywoodized, you know, that that's the storyline we want kind of thing.

751
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,760
But the reality is, is that is not extremely common.

752
00:41:55,760 --> 00:42:03,520
It's much more traffickers that are exploiting vulnerabilities over time and grooming kids

753
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:04,580
for this.

754
00:42:04,580 --> 00:42:08,080
So we, we gotta be careful not to think like, okay, where's my kid?

755
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:09,080
Where's my, you know, kidnapping.

756
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:12,720
Yes, be diligent about knowing where your kid is, make sure they're smart and they know

757
00:42:12,720 --> 00:42:16,320
what they're looking for and being aware and being with others, not by themselves.

758
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,120
Like, yeah, absolutely do that.

759
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:22,920
But recognize that if you're doing that and you're not paying attention to the social

760
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:26,840
media side of things, that's the bigger threat.

761
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:27,840
Interesting.

762
00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:28,840
Yeah.

763
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:37,760
I, I'm Chris, I wonder for you personally, I mean, when you say 3,352, I mean, that's

764
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:39,760
got to feel pretty good.

765
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:44,720
And yet for every single one of them, you know, there's plenty, plenty more.

766
00:42:44,720 --> 00:42:45,720
Yep.

767
00:42:45,720 --> 00:42:51,360
For you psychologically, mentally, spiritually, when you look at that, when you look at that

768
00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:55,300
reality, what, what keeps you going?

769
00:42:55,300 --> 00:42:56,800
What keeps you?

770
00:42:56,800 --> 00:43:01,160
Cause I, I get a sense that you're as, as focused on the, on the mission as ever, which

771
00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:04,080
we're so grateful for.

772
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,920
And maybe you could speak to for you and for others on the organization, because I mean,

773
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:10,440
you guys are looking, it's just constant darkness.

774
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:16,240
Like you are, you are perpetually aware of the, just the darkest underbelly of, of any

775
00:43:16,240 --> 00:43:18,560
given society.

776
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:19,600
How do you do it?

777
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:24,400
How do you, how do you stay, stay well in the midst of all that?

778
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:32,800
Cause I just have to imagine, like it's, there's a lot of rough stories again and again.

779
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:37,600
You know, guys, I'm reminded of, you know, I think about in the book of Numbers when,

780
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:43,680
when Moses sends out the 12 spies to check out the land and all of the spies see the

781
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:47,720
same thing, but 10 of them come back and what do they say?

782
00:43:47,720 --> 00:43:48,720
Yeah, this is terrible.

783
00:43:48,720 --> 00:43:49,720
We can't do this.

784
00:43:49,720 --> 00:43:52,160
We can't possibly do this giant, right?

785
00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:58,320
And the other two who see the exact same thing, they come back and they're basically like,

786
00:43:58,320 --> 00:43:59,320
let's go.

787
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:00,320
Yeah.

788
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:01,320
God's got this.

789
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:07,880
And I think for me that plays a lot into this role because I think that situation applies

790
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:11,480
for all of us that have giants that feel overwhelming in our lives.

791
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:14,060
When that happens, you have two choices.

792
00:44:14,060 --> 00:44:18,840
You look at the size of the problem or you look at the size of your God and we serve

793
00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:23,040
a big, big God and he is knocking down doors and he's setting kids free.

794
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:28,320
And I think another part of that is like, I get that idea that, okay, 3,352 is amazing.

795
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:34,760
That's a ton of kids, but we've also said there's over a million kids being sex trafficked.

796
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:41,280
But I've also, I've also got to sit down with these rescue kids.

797
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:47,200
I've gotten to hug these rescue kids and love on these rescue kids and hear the stories

798
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:49,400
of these rescued kids.

799
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,000
And every single one of those kids matters.

800
00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:54,880
Like, like think about it.

801
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:59,400
This was a situation with one of your kids, one of your daughters.

802
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:03,360
Would you want my team to not do whatever they could to get her out?

803
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:08,440
Even if it meant that there was a million other, you know, for everyone we get out,

804
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:09,440
it matters.

805
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:14,080
And I think the other thing you got to think about is the ripple effect.

806
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:22,300
So like if you go to our website, destinyrescue.org under get involved, there's a tab for advocacy

807
00:45:22,300 --> 00:45:24,440
and there's a, we have documentaries.

808
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:25,920
There's like five documentaries.

809
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:30,840
We did one of those a few years ago at Clinton frame and the one we did actually, it's called

810
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:32,560
you are beautiful.

811
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:37,780
And it's one girl's story of how she got sold into trafficking by her mom.

812
00:45:37,780 --> 00:45:44,320
And it tells her story of what happened or like growing up, the poor village she was

813
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:49,040
at, how she ended up going into town and thought she was going to work at a restaurant and

814
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:53,080
then ends up working at this bar where she's got to sit with men and ends up getting abused

815
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:54,080
by them.

816
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:57,840
And she's trying to, you know, talk to her mom about not wanting to do this and her mom

817
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:01,080
saying, Hey, you, you got to do what you got to do.

818
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:03,020
And it's just totally condoning this.

819
00:46:03,020 --> 00:46:07,840
And then you actually hear audio files of the night that our agents are with her and

820
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:12,600
talking back and forth about her in particular to get her out of that situation, which is

821
00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:13,600
really cool.

822
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:14,600
And then she gets rescued.

823
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:16,400
She comes into our aftercare.

824
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:19,500
And one of the things that the title of it is you are beautiful.

825
00:46:19,500 --> 00:46:23,800
And that comes from the fact that day after day, she would show up at our residential

826
00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:27,300
program and the ladies there would constantly say, you are beautiful.

827
00:46:27,300 --> 00:46:28,300
You are beautiful.

828
00:46:28,300 --> 00:46:33,480
But for the longest time she could not receive it because in her mind, the world had changed

829
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:35,920
the way she thought about herself and her mind.

830
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:38,200
She was not valuable anymore.

831
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:40,640
She thought she was going to have to do that work the rest of her life because it was all

832
00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:43,040
she was good for in her mind.

833
00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:46,560
That's what the enemy and the world had taught her was her value.

834
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:52,720
And so for her to, to start having people speak truth into her life, that she was a

835
00:46:52,720 --> 00:46:55,520
daughter of the King of Kings and had infinite worth.

836
00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:59,800
And, you know, she went on to get introduced and accept Jesus Christ as her savior.

837
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,720
She felt a calling to start working with children.

838
00:47:02,720 --> 00:47:08,160
And as you see her story continue through the documentary, you just see this ripple

839
00:47:08,160 --> 00:47:12,900
effect of hundreds of kids that she's interacting with and pouring into.

840
00:47:12,900 --> 00:47:18,840
So every life that's rescued has a ripple effect of hundreds, if not thousands of other

841
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:19,840
lives.

842
00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:25,080
You know, part of our empower program or aftercare program, that's a Christian based counseling

843
00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:26,080
program.

844
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:27,080
And part of that's about forgiveness.

845
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:31,360
Now, you know, all of us have walked with Jesus long enough to know that sometimes it's

846
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:32,360
not easy to forgive.

847
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:36,880
You know, we can, that can be a hard process, but can you imagine talking to kids about

848
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:42,560
forgiveness who have been raped over and over and over and over again and talking to them

849
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:44,860
about forgiveness?

850
00:47:44,860 --> 00:47:47,020
She learned about forgiveness.

851
00:47:47,020 --> 00:47:50,300
This person, she went to forgive, she went back home to her home village to forgive her

852
00:47:50,300 --> 00:47:51,300
mom.

853
00:47:51,300 --> 00:47:52,300
Wow.

854
00:47:52,300 --> 00:47:56,840
And it's not, she ended up leading her mom to Christ and it's not in the documentary,

855
00:47:56,840 --> 00:47:59,880
but she ended up ultimately leading her entire family to Christ.

856
00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:00,880
Wow.

857
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:05,340
So this ripple effect of, you know, it's not just 3,352.

858
00:48:05,340 --> 00:48:06,840
That's how many got rescued.

859
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:11,580
That's hundreds of thousands of ripple effect lives from that.

860
00:48:11,580 --> 00:48:13,720
And every single one of those matters.

861
00:48:13,720 --> 00:48:18,280
So Chris, you've touched on it some here, but in terms of the aftercare process, because

862
00:48:18,280 --> 00:48:21,820
it's not just about getting them out, it's about what happens to them after they get

863
00:48:21,820 --> 00:48:23,460
out.

864
00:48:23,460 --> 00:48:25,180
What does that look like for you guys?

865
00:48:25,180 --> 00:48:26,900
How do you, how do you put that together for them?

866
00:48:26,900 --> 00:48:27,900
Yeah, you're right.

867
00:48:27,900 --> 00:48:30,100
It doesn't do us any good to get them out if we can't get them free.

868
00:48:30,100 --> 00:48:31,100
Right.

869
00:48:31,100 --> 00:48:32,200
So it has to be a holistic ministry.

870
00:48:32,200 --> 00:48:37,340
So that empower program is, is a kind of trauma resiliency program.

871
00:48:37,340 --> 00:48:39,220
It's a 10 week program that they go through.

872
00:48:39,220 --> 00:48:42,740
Obviously it's not like they're just suddenly healed at the end of that, you know, it's

873
00:48:42,740 --> 00:48:45,880
just getting them started on that, on that healing process.

874
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:50,220
But so every girl that comes into our care, and I remember earlier we talked about, sometimes

875
00:48:50,220 --> 00:48:52,380
they're reunified with family.

876
00:48:52,380 --> 00:48:53,960
Sometimes they go into government care.

877
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:57,060
If they come into our care, then they have what we call a freedom plan.

878
00:48:57,060 --> 00:49:01,160
So the freedom plan basically is everybody who works with each girl is going to come

879
00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:04,680
up with a plan that's going to help them succeed for the long haul.

880
00:49:04,680 --> 00:49:07,680
So they're going to look at, you know, what do they need?

881
00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:09,180
Is it a younger kid that was rescued?

882
00:49:09,180 --> 00:49:10,180
Okay.

883
00:49:10,180 --> 00:49:11,180
So education is the need.

884
00:49:11,180 --> 00:49:12,180
Is it older?

885
00:49:12,180 --> 00:49:13,180
Is it a younger child?

886
00:49:13,180 --> 00:49:14,180
Is it a younger generation is going to be the need?

887
00:49:14,180 --> 00:49:15,180
What do they need psychologically?

888
00:49:15,180 --> 00:49:16,180
What do they need medically?

889
00:49:16,180 --> 00:49:19,580
What do they need emotionally, relationally, spiritually, all of those things are going

890
00:49:19,580 --> 00:49:24,360
to be looked at to create a unique freedom plan for that, for that child.

891
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:29,820
And what's really neat is we, we partner with a lot of local ministries because we can just,

892
00:49:29,820 --> 00:49:31,500
we can grow so much faster that way.

893
00:49:31,500 --> 00:49:35,060
You know, if we go to a new country, if we got to start from ground zero, it takes years

894
00:49:35,060 --> 00:49:36,980
to just build up that stuff.

895
00:49:36,980 --> 00:49:39,900
But if we like, when we were in Zimbabwe, we went there.

896
00:49:39,900 --> 00:49:44,140
There's a, essentially a ministry that's an orphanage there that's been there 25 years,

897
00:49:44,140 --> 00:49:48,220
already well established, already trusted, already has relationships with those local

898
00:49:48,220 --> 00:49:49,620
government leaders.

899
00:49:49,620 --> 00:49:51,820
We come in and start partnering with them.

900
00:49:51,820 --> 00:49:56,140
They have a facility that can hold up to 70 kids.

901
00:49:56,140 --> 00:50:00,180
So kids who are hungry, kids who are homeless, they're able to do that.

902
00:50:00,180 --> 00:50:04,420
They've got some agricultural training on campus that they, you know, done and they've

903
00:50:04,420 --> 00:50:08,420
done this for 25 years, max out at 70 kids.

904
00:50:08,420 --> 00:50:10,540
So we come in and we kind of add three components.

905
00:50:10,540 --> 00:50:13,860
So we add field agents who are trained.

906
00:50:13,860 --> 00:50:18,960
So we offer, we add the staff and the funding and the training so that these field agents

907
00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:23,180
who know how to go out and identify kids who are being sex trafficked can go out and have

908
00:50:23,180 --> 00:50:26,340
those conversations, bring kids into the program quickly.

909
00:50:26,340 --> 00:50:31,120
That whole counseling side, the empower side, we add the staff and the training and the

910
00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:32,820
funding for that.

911
00:50:32,820 --> 00:50:36,340
And then the other part is the TOJ training on the job.

912
00:50:36,340 --> 00:50:40,300
So they go out, they find local business leaders who are interested in things that the girls

913
00:50:40,300 --> 00:50:41,300
want.

914
00:50:41,300 --> 00:50:44,660
So like in Africa, sewing, catering, hair salon are the three big ones that the girls

915
00:50:44,660 --> 00:50:45,660
want.

916
00:50:45,660 --> 00:50:48,780
So we go find business leaders and most of them, because it's connections through the

917
00:50:48,780 --> 00:50:51,180
church are Christian business leaders as well.

918
00:50:51,180 --> 00:50:55,220
So they're not only just, they're not just building skill levels in the kids, they're

919
00:50:55,220 --> 00:50:58,620
mentoring them spiritually, which is awesome.

920
00:50:58,620 --> 00:51:05,520
So let's say, Andy, that you've got, you own a catering business and you agree to take

921
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:07,180
five of my girls.

922
00:51:07,180 --> 00:51:10,760
So we're gonna, we're gonna come to an agreement on a six month agreement.

923
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:14,760
And what I'm going to do is I'm going to pay their full salary for two months, two thirds

924
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:18,060
for two months and a third for two months and return.

925
00:51:18,060 --> 00:51:21,700
You're going to teach them everything they need to know about working and possibly even

926
00:51:21,700 --> 00:51:23,840
running a catering business.

927
00:51:23,840 --> 00:51:27,000
So at the end of six months, you've just got this win-win situation.

928
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:29,460
If you have openings, you know what you got, you trained them, right.

929
00:51:29,460 --> 00:51:33,320
And if not, they're ready to go out and look for a job somewhere else.

930
00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:38,780
So it's a great win-win situation and you're able to take kids who have only known getting

931
00:51:38,780 --> 00:51:42,300
used and abused on a daily basis.

932
00:51:42,300 --> 00:51:46,340
And within a matter of months, their lives have completely changed and the trajectory

933
00:51:46,340 --> 00:51:48,880
of their lives is completely different.

934
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:49,880
That's awesome.

935
00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:50,880
Yeah.

936
00:51:50,880 --> 00:52:02,500
I, I think there's just something, you know, to be said for really a multi, a multifaceted

937
00:52:02,500 --> 00:52:08,620
approach, a whole, you said this, a holistic approach to toward healing because you know,

938
00:52:08,620 --> 00:52:15,700
while, while there are spiritual needs, obviously in all, in, in all of that, I mean, following

939
00:52:15,700 --> 00:52:20,440
abuse, they need, they need a way, they need a way to support themselves.

940
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:22,300
They need, they need a way.

941
00:52:22,300 --> 00:52:25,920
And without that support, by the way, without those skills, whatever they find themselves

942
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:31,220
very much, very easily back in the similar situation that they were, they were in.

943
00:52:31,220 --> 00:52:37,460
And so, you know, I think for anyone listening, when, when you're thinking about partnering

944
00:52:37,460 --> 00:52:41,600
with an organization, and we certainly hope that you partner with destiny rescue, if that's,

945
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:46,260
if that's a, something that, you know, an area that you want to pursue and want to support,

946
00:52:46,260 --> 00:52:53,880
I, the thing that I love is that, you know, I think a ministry such as, such as yours

947
00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:57,620
really has to look at the whole, has to look at the whole situation, has to look at the

948
00:52:57,620 --> 00:53:03,140
whole person and empower the whole person toward greater independence, toward greater

949
00:53:03,140 --> 00:53:04,140
healing.

950
00:53:04,140 --> 00:53:08,660
Because, yeah, just to get them out of the situation is one thing.

951
00:53:08,660 --> 00:53:13,600
But yeah, just to give them an opportunity for, for a better future and to see themselves

952
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:17,340
being able to contribute to their own, like to really stand on their own two feet and

953
00:53:17,340 --> 00:53:22,820
say, I mean, I'm, I'm making a decision to walk forward from this.

954
00:53:22,820 --> 00:53:26,060
That's that's, that's really, really powerful, really powerful.

955
00:53:26,060 --> 00:53:29,780
It's a fun time for us too, from the standpoint of, you know, we've been doing this since

956
00:53:29,780 --> 00:53:30,780
2001.

957
00:53:30,780 --> 00:53:37,580
So we're at the point now where we've got girls who were rescued 10 years ago that are

958
00:53:37,580 --> 00:53:42,820
now project leaders and pouring into the next generation and talking about being able to

959
00:53:42,820 --> 00:53:46,540
completely understand what these girls have gone through.

960
00:53:46,540 --> 00:53:48,340
That's a pretty powerful thing to see.

961
00:53:48,340 --> 00:53:49,400
All right.

962
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:53,940
So we appreciate you being on the show tonight, but first, before we let you go, we can't

963
00:53:53,940 --> 00:53:55,260
let you go without doing.

964
00:53:55,260 --> 00:53:58,220
And now it's time for the dudes and dads pop quiz.

965
00:53:58,220 --> 00:53:59,220
All right guys.

966
00:53:59,220 --> 00:54:03,760
So pop quiz, if you've never joined us is basically a time that we ask Chris random

967
00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:07,180
questions that he can't prepare for that have nothing to do with the topic of rescue.

968
00:54:07,180 --> 00:54:11,020
So do you get to go first?

969
00:54:11,020 --> 00:54:12,020
You can go first.

970
00:54:12,020 --> 00:54:13,020
Oh, fantastic.

971
00:54:13,020 --> 00:54:14,020
You have one ready?

972
00:54:14,020 --> 00:54:21,520
Um, tonight I'm feeling a little bit off the cuff, so we're gonna, we're gonna try, Chris,

973
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:33,420
if if you were made to, um, like right now, if I said, okay, you need to grab three things,

974
00:54:33,420 --> 00:54:37,280
I'm sending you on, I'm sending you to a deserted Island.

975
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:40,060
You gotta grab three things before you leave.

976
00:54:40,060 --> 00:54:43,220
You've only got a matter of minutes to grab them.

977
00:54:43,220 --> 00:54:44,220
What are you taking?

978
00:54:44,220 --> 00:54:45,220
What are you taking with you?

979
00:54:45,220 --> 00:54:46,220
And you're gonna be on this deserted Island.

980
00:54:46,220 --> 00:54:49,180
We're gonna, we're gonna put you on there for, uh, we'll do a couple of weeks.

981
00:54:49,180 --> 00:54:50,180
Okay.

982
00:54:50,180 --> 00:54:51,500
So a couple of weeks on deserted Island.

983
00:54:51,500 --> 00:54:52,500
You got three of them.

984
00:54:52,500 --> 00:54:53,500
So you can take with you.

985
00:54:53,500 --> 00:54:54,500
What are they?

986
00:54:54,500 --> 00:54:55,500
Man?

987
00:54:55,500 --> 00:54:56,500
I'm a guy.

988
00:54:56,500 --> 00:54:57,500
So I'm thinking all food items.

989
00:54:57,500 --> 00:55:01,020
Nothing else seems to really matter at that point.

990
00:55:01,020 --> 00:55:04,260
So and I eat like a five year old.

991
00:55:04,260 --> 00:55:05,260
Oh, nice.

992
00:55:05,260 --> 00:55:09,700
So, um, you know, my, my first thought as you're asking the question was where do I

993
00:55:09,700 --> 00:55:12,180
get a truckload of cherry Pepsi?

994
00:55:12,180 --> 00:55:13,180
Cherry Pepsi.

995
00:55:13,180 --> 00:55:14,380
Cause that's definitely one.

996
00:55:14,380 --> 00:55:15,620
That's that's one of them.

997
00:55:15,620 --> 00:55:19,660
Um, I love pizza, but I'm a little worried about how, you know, yeah.

998
00:55:19,660 --> 00:55:26,820
I'm going to spoil three weeks with some practical concerns here, but you know, because I eat

999
00:55:26,820 --> 00:55:31,780
like a five year old Lunchables, I think have a shelf life of seven and a half years.

1000
00:55:31,780 --> 00:55:32,780
So I think you're right.

1001
00:55:32,780 --> 00:55:39,380
I can get the bologna and cheese Lunchables and really cherry Pepsi Lunchables on those.

1002
00:55:39,380 --> 00:55:40,380
Okay.

1003
00:55:40,380 --> 00:55:45,900
Um, I mean, great answer, but I, I would, I would just, uh, I would encourage you to

1004
00:55:45,900 --> 00:55:53,500
maybe think, think about, about that more in case, just in case you find yourself, it's

1005
00:55:53,500 --> 00:55:56,420
not a, you know, Tom Hanks.

1006
00:55:56,420 --> 00:56:00,220
So maybe I should take a volleyball as my third one.

1007
00:56:00,220 --> 00:56:01,220
Just right.

1008
00:56:01,220 --> 00:56:02,220
Yeah.

1009
00:56:02,220 --> 00:56:03,220
All right.

1010
00:56:03,220 --> 00:56:04,220
All right.

1011
00:56:04,220 --> 00:56:07,100
Which bander artist dead or alive would play at your funeral?

1012
00:56:07,100 --> 00:56:08,540
Ooh, there we go.

1013
00:56:08,540 --> 00:56:10,340
Which band artist.

1014
00:56:10,340 --> 00:56:18,740
Man.

1015
00:56:18,740 --> 00:56:24,540
So I, I am a huge kid of the eighties.

1016
00:56:24,540 --> 00:56:33,140
So you could put together, you know, a whole crew of eighties band.

1017
00:56:33,140 --> 00:56:35,140
So I don't know, Def Leppard.

1018
00:56:35,140 --> 00:56:37,340
Oh, there we go.

1019
00:56:37,340 --> 00:56:41,380
There's a few of those that I would definitely be all about.

1020
00:56:41,380 --> 00:56:46,540
I, uh, I once saw Journey and Def Leppard play at the same show together.

1021
00:56:46,540 --> 00:56:48,540
They were co-build.

1022
00:56:48,540 --> 00:56:51,340
It was an experience.

1023
00:56:51,340 --> 00:56:52,340
Yeah.

1024
00:56:52,340 --> 00:56:56,380
Last year I went to Penn, Penn state, Journey and Toto.

1025
00:56:56,380 --> 00:56:57,380
Nice.

1026
00:56:57,380 --> 00:57:00,300
Toto's made a hard comeback.

1027
00:57:00,300 --> 00:57:14,340
Chris, in a zombie apocalypse, which one, still have a cherry Pepsi in the zombie apocalypse

1028
00:57:14,340 --> 00:57:15,340
of your family members.

1029
00:57:15,340 --> 00:57:17,020
Who's the last one standing.

1030
00:57:17,020 --> 00:57:18,780
That'd be me.

1031
00:57:18,780 --> 00:57:19,780
Okay.

1032
00:57:19,780 --> 00:57:23,100
Yeah, definitely with the cherry Pepsi and pizza.

1033
00:57:23,100 --> 00:57:28,260
What is it about your skillset that enables you to survive in a zombie apocalypse?

1034
00:57:28,260 --> 00:57:29,860
The longest of my family.

1035
00:57:29,860 --> 00:57:31,140
Cause I can run the fastest.

1036
00:57:31,140 --> 00:57:32,140
Okay.

1037
00:57:32,140 --> 00:57:33,140
All right.

1038
00:57:33,140 --> 00:57:34,140
Okay.

1039
00:57:34,140 --> 00:57:35,940
You just have to be able to outrun one at a time.

1040
00:57:35,940 --> 00:57:37,380
That's really what it comes down to.

1041
00:57:37,380 --> 00:57:38,380
That's fair.

1042
00:57:38,380 --> 00:57:41,220
Don't have to be the fastest always just faster than at least one.

1043
00:57:41,220 --> 00:57:44,620
Joel, yours are like the things questions that never would happen.

1044
00:57:44,620 --> 00:57:47,540
Mine are like the things that could possibly happen.

1045
00:57:47,540 --> 00:57:49,660
The practical and the deeply metaphysical.

1046
00:57:49,660 --> 00:57:50,660
Yeah.

1047
00:57:50,660 --> 00:57:51,660
All right.

1048
00:57:51,660 --> 00:57:53,540
So what's the worst job we've talked about.

1049
00:57:53,540 --> 00:57:54,540
We've talked about your best job.

1050
00:57:54,540 --> 00:57:57,780
I remember your best job, but a job that matters most to you, but what's your worst job that

1051
00:57:57,780 --> 00:57:58,780
you've ever had.

1052
00:57:58,780 --> 00:58:01,660
Oh man, I've had a lot of those.

1053
00:58:01,660 --> 00:58:10,140
So when I was in college, when I was in college, I did those, you know, the temp agencies where

1054
00:58:10,140 --> 00:58:11,860
you just like work for a week or two.

1055
00:58:11,860 --> 00:58:14,020
Oh, those are horrid.

1056
00:58:14,020 --> 00:58:15,020
Those things.

1057
00:58:15,020 --> 00:58:18,180
There was one of those ones where, you know, the, um, like the block glass you get for

1058
00:58:18,180 --> 00:58:23,060
like basement windows and the guy that goes in that does the mortar work and everything,

1059
00:58:23,060 --> 00:58:27,500
he goes in like an hour earlier and then we go in and we've got the little, like the silver

1060
00:58:27,500 --> 00:58:30,780
hand tool that you go and scrape all the excess mortar out of.

1061
00:58:30,780 --> 00:58:33,540
And you got to go around twice and do that.

1062
00:58:33,540 --> 00:58:36,940
And then you got to go around with like one of those green scrubby pads.

1063
00:58:36,940 --> 00:58:40,540
And then you got to go around with like a wool pad and like do that.

1064
00:58:40,540 --> 00:58:45,140
And like you're doing that for hours and you can't get it enough with your, your, with

1065
00:58:45,140 --> 00:58:46,140
the gloves on.

1066
00:58:46,140 --> 00:58:47,140
So you got to do it bare handed.

1067
00:58:47,140 --> 00:58:51,180
And then you get all those like little silver splinters in your fingers.

1068
00:58:51,180 --> 00:58:54,640
And then you ever have, if you get that and you get near anything hot, you touch anything

1069
00:58:54,640 --> 00:58:56,620
hot, it like, it's terrible.

1070
00:58:56,620 --> 00:58:59,660
Like I did that for a week.

1071
00:58:59,660 --> 00:59:01,140
That was bored.

1072
00:59:01,140 --> 00:59:05,680
And then Woolie's fish market being in the refrigerator for eight hours a day with like

1073
00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:10,900
nice little stylish hair net and saran wrap and fish for eight hours.

1074
00:59:10,900 --> 00:59:11,900
That's right up there too.

1075
00:59:11,900 --> 00:59:12,900
Okay.

1076
00:59:12,900 --> 00:59:14,900
Um, the two for one there.

1077
00:59:14,900 --> 00:59:16,900
I appreciate it.

1078
00:59:16,900 --> 00:59:17,900
Bonus.

1079
00:59:17,900 --> 00:59:20,740
Uh, Chris, what book should we be reading right now?

1080
00:59:20,740 --> 00:59:25,740
Aside from the Bible, I'll just, I'll put the copy out in there.

1081
00:59:25,740 --> 00:59:28,780
What book should you be reading right now?

1082
00:59:28,780 --> 00:59:32,300
Gosh, what was the last one I did?

1083
00:59:32,300 --> 00:59:34,980
Yeah, this is not deeply spiritual at all.

1084
00:59:34,980 --> 00:59:40,860
I just did the latest hunger games one, the prequel one, the ballad and songbirds and

1085
00:59:40,860 --> 00:59:41,860
snakes or whatever.

1086
00:59:41,860 --> 00:59:42,860
Total surprise to me.

1087
00:59:42,860 --> 00:59:43,860
Did not, I did not have him.

1088
00:59:43,860 --> 00:59:44,860
I didn't have him.

1089
00:59:44,860 --> 00:59:45,860
See, I didn't have him.

1090
00:59:45,860 --> 00:59:46,860
I didn't read the books.

1091
00:59:46,860 --> 00:59:52,420
But I feel like, you know, with your, you know, zombie apocalypse and island desertion,

1092
00:59:52,420 --> 00:59:54,980
the whole hunger games feels like it kind of fits in.

1093
00:59:54,980 --> 00:59:55,980
It's on brand.

1094
00:59:55,980 --> 00:59:56,980
Yeah.

1095
00:59:56,980 --> 00:59:57,980
On brand.

1096
00:59:57,980 --> 00:59:58,980
A hundred percent.

1097
00:59:58,980 --> 00:59:59,980
Nice.

1098
00:59:59,980 --> 01:00:00,980
Yeah.

1099
01:00:00,980 --> 01:00:01,980
Yeah.

1100
01:00:01,980 --> 01:00:04,420
Uh, my favorite, my last question is what's the favorite thing that you've bought this

1101
01:00:04,420 --> 01:00:07,620
year?

1102
01:00:07,620 --> 01:00:09,740
Besides cherry Pepsi.

1103
01:00:09,740 --> 01:00:11,340
Um, let's see.

1104
01:00:11,340 --> 01:00:12,340
It could be pizza.

1105
01:00:12,340 --> 01:00:17,220
I mean, that's maybe, it might be the chief ice cream I had.

1106
01:00:17,220 --> 01:00:23,660
Oh, I'm trying to think of any, if I've done any like, you know, it's the thing that stinks

1107
01:00:23,660 --> 01:00:28,540
as you like get older, you get more excited about projects that just wouldn't excite you.

1108
01:00:28,540 --> 01:00:29,540
Yeah.

1109
01:00:29,540 --> 01:00:33,380
Like I'm excited about the fact that in a couple of months I got a, an inch of gravel

1110
01:00:33,380 --> 01:00:37,460
coming to cover the whole driveway, you know, like that was never something that would have

1111
01:00:37,460 --> 01:00:38,700
excited me 10 years ago.

1112
01:00:38,700 --> 01:00:39,700
I'd be excited about that.

1113
01:00:39,700 --> 01:00:40,700
Yeah, me too.

1114
01:00:40,700 --> 01:00:45,660
So I'm with the truck in, uh, we got the truck in cause we're putting in pastures for the

1115
01:00:45,660 --> 01:00:49,460
horses last summer and the reverse decided to stop working.

1116
01:00:49,460 --> 01:00:50,460
Oh, no.

1117
01:00:50,460 --> 01:00:51,460
Got the transmission fixed.

1118
01:00:51,460 --> 01:00:55,140
So my truck actually, every time you pull in the parking lot, you gotta be like, all

1119
01:00:55,140 --> 01:00:56,140
right, where do I park?

1120
01:00:56,140 --> 01:00:59,140
How am I going to get out of here?

1121
01:00:59,140 --> 01:01:00,180
And now I have reverse.

1122
01:01:00,180 --> 01:01:03,380
So that's probably the best, uh, best money I've spent this year.

1123
01:01:03,380 --> 01:01:04,380
The reverse.

1124
01:01:04,380 --> 01:01:05,380
Fantastic.

1125
01:01:05,380 --> 01:01:06,900
Well, congratulations cause you know, there's zombies.

1126
01:01:06,900 --> 01:01:08,900
You gotta have reverse.

1127
01:01:08,900 --> 01:01:11,060
You hit them, but you got to back up and check.

1128
01:01:11,060 --> 01:01:12,980
Well, congratulations, Chris.

1129
01:01:12,980 --> 01:01:16,380
You have successfully passed the dudes and heads pop quiz.

1130
01:01:16,380 --> 01:01:17,380
Well done.

1131
01:01:17,380 --> 01:01:20,140
Uh, we do thank you so much for joining us tonight.

1132
01:01:20,140 --> 01:01:21,700
This is super helpful.

1133
01:01:21,700 --> 01:01:27,580
Um, a really great, uh, a great topic, a great thing to be reflecting on Chris.

1134
01:01:27,580 --> 01:01:34,340
Where, where can people find out all about whether it's you or destiny rescue, where

1135
01:01:34,340 --> 01:01:36,020
do we want to send them?

1136
01:01:36,020 --> 01:01:38,100
So destiny rescue.org is our website.

1137
01:01:38,100 --> 01:01:40,020
And so there's a ton of great information on that.

1138
01:01:40,020 --> 01:01:42,660
We're on Facebook, Instagram, and Tik TOK as well.

1139
01:01:42,660 --> 01:01:46,700
Um, if you're listening to this really soon, then just come on over to Clinton frame on

1140
01:01:46,700 --> 01:01:48,220
the 26th in the morning.

1141
01:01:48,220 --> 01:01:49,860
What time service said I'm going to be here.

1142
01:01:49,860 --> 01:01:54,180
We're taking 10 30 at the 10 30 service on the 26th here at Clinton frame.

1143
01:01:54,180 --> 01:01:57,260
So I'll tell you two big fundraisers that are coming up this fall.

1144
01:01:57,260 --> 01:02:02,520
Just so you know, is August 15th through the 18th at community church Waterford over on

1145
01:02:02,520 --> 01:02:03,520
County road.

1146
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:06,500
21 past cultures is the sale that saves.

1147
01:02:06,500 --> 01:02:10,780
That's a garage sale that started with the idea to rescue one kid, $1,500 to rescue a

1148
01:02:10,780 --> 01:02:11,780
kid.

1149
01:02:11,780 --> 01:02:16,740
And as of right now, they have raised enough over eight years with this year being the

1150
01:02:16,740 --> 01:02:18,780
eighth one, but we've added corporate sponsors this year.

1151
01:02:18,780 --> 01:02:23,220
So we've got businesses getting behind it and they have raised enough to rescue 125

1152
01:02:23,220 --> 01:02:24,220
kids.

1153
01:02:24,220 --> 01:02:25,220
Wow.

1154
01:02:25,220 --> 01:02:27,180
Four day garage sale.

1155
01:02:27,180 --> 01:02:29,480
And it's all about setting kids free.

1156
01:02:29,480 --> 01:02:34,060
So then August 15th to the 18th and then September 7th, keep it on your calendar.

1157
01:02:34,060 --> 01:02:37,580
We don't know the exact location, but the Goshen rotary does a freedom walk every year.

1158
01:02:37,580 --> 01:02:40,100
It's been at the Goshen high school the last three years.

1159
01:02:40,100 --> 01:02:42,820
They're talking about making it like a five K 10 K this year.

1160
01:02:42,820 --> 01:02:43,820
So it could be at Fiddler.

1161
01:02:43,820 --> 01:02:48,020
I'm not really sure exactly, but if you follow Goshen rotary, they have a Facebook page and

1162
01:02:48,020 --> 01:02:52,720
you can keep an eye on that, but set aside that date September 7th, but two of our actually

1163
01:02:52,720 --> 01:02:56,460
biggest fundraisers in the country right here in the Goshen area.

1164
01:02:56,460 --> 01:02:57,460
That's awesome.

1165
01:02:57,460 --> 01:02:59,740
Well get on board folks.

1166
01:02:59,740 --> 01:03:00,900
Get on board, get over there.

1167
01:03:00,900 --> 01:03:01,900
Support destiny rescue.

1168
01:03:01,900 --> 01:03:04,020
And Andy's waiting to touch the button.

1169
01:03:04,020 --> 01:03:05,780
Are you touching the button?

1170
01:03:05,780 --> 01:03:06,780
He did.

1171
01:03:06,780 --> 01:03:07,780
All right.

1172
01:03:07,780 --> 01:03:10,780
Everybody, as always, get over to dudes and dads, dudesanddads.com.

1173
01:03:10,780 --> 01:03:11,780
Yeah.

1174
01:03:11,780 --> 01:03:12,780
I wasn't sure where you were going with the button.

1175
01:03:12,780 --> 01:03:13,780
I didn't know if you were going to stay on the button.

1176
01:03:13,780 --> 01:03:14,780
I didn't know if you were going to stay on the button.

1177
01:03:14,780 --> 01:03:15,780
I didn't know if you were going to stay on the button.

1178
01:03:15,780 --> 01:03:16,780
I didn't know if you were going to stay on the button.

1179
01:03:16,780 --> 01:03:17,780
I didn't know if you were going to stay on the button.

1180
01:03:17,780 --> 01:03:18,780
We're going to start.

1181
01:03:18,780 --> 01:03:19,780
Okay.

1182
01:03:19,780 --> 01:03:20,780
Well, we're good.

1183
01:03:20,780 --> 01:03:21,780
Well, we'll machine over here.

1184
01:03:21,780 --> 01:03:23,780
Dues of that podcast at gmail.com.

1185
01:03:23,780 --> 01:03:29,460
If you've got any show ideas, responses, harsh rebukes, whatever you want to send over there,

1186
01:03:29,460 --> 01:03:32,080
feel free to email us.

1187
01:03:32,080 --> 01:03:37,080
And you can always, always, always call our voicemail, five seven four two one three 87

1188
01:03:37,080 --> 01:03:39,520
zero two, and you won't wait Joel or I up.

1189
01:03:39,520 --> 01:03:43,580
You will not, but we will listen to it and possibly put it on air.

1190
01:03:43,580 --> 01:03:47,380
Guys, we're so grateful for each and every one of you for tuning on.

1191
01:03:47,380 --> 01:03:49,980
Remember, share us, like us, do all that.

1192
01:03:49,980 --> 01:03:50,980
We appreciate it.

1193
01:03:50,980 --> 01:03:51,980
Subscribe to us.

1194
01:03:51,980 --> 01:03:52,980
All those good things.

1195
01:03:52,980 --> 01:03:55,460
And until next time, we wish you grace and peace.

1196
01:03:55,460 --> 01:04:03,460
Bye.

1197
01:04:03,640 --> 01:04:04,100
*OBE wellbeing community*

1198
01:04:04,100 --> 01:04:04,600
you