Foreign.

Hello.

Welcome back to the Promoted podcast, the podcast that helps you get promoted and be great when you get there.

Shout out to one of my listeners, actually, who messaged us last week saying that she has had a promotion and a pay rise.

After listening to this podcast, I feel like, Renee, if we could have one person.

That is an incredible, incredible achievement.

So we're happy to keep going.

For all of you out there looking to get a promotion, I'm your host, Felicity Furey, co founder of We Aspire, and I'm joined by the incredible Renee Wootton Tomlin, aerospace engineer, pilot, speaker, all things sustainable aviation fuel, working for Lanzajet.

Renee, great to have you back on the show.

Listen, so good to be here and also, like, so awesome to hear about who is actually benefiting or, like, finding value in what we're talking about.

Sometimes we really do just, like, you know, throw out some of our experience and we hope that they land well for our listeners and we hope that people benefit from some of the things that we're sharing.

So it's really cool to hear when people are benefiting and, like, they're finding whether it's the confidence to ask for promotion or, you know, standing up for themselves or building businesses that, like, really, you know, help them achieve their passion, it's just the best.

So shout out to our listeners to say that, you know, if you do have some feedback for us, good or bad, we'd love to hear it.

Like, how are these helping you?

And also, do you want to, like, you know, have speak about something that's affecting you?

Today we do a segment called the Promotion Pickle.

We'd love to know what your pickle is.

So please write into us.

Felicity.

Yes, please let us know.

Yes, I love, we love, love, love getting feedback DM us on LinkedIn.

That is the best way to get in touch.

And yeah, whether it's a question, a story, or maybe you tried something and it didn't go well and would love some advice.

Would also love to hear that today we have got a juicy topic for you.

We are talking about how to manage millennials.

Millennials are the largest cohort in the workplace.

I can put my.

I am one of them.

I was recently speaking with a client where we're helping them at one of their big conferences to talk about managing millennials.

And they said the young one.

So I said, oh, I'm a millennial.

I like that.

I'm still classified as young.

But we know there are a lot of organizations, people out there who can find this generation tricky to manage where the generation that has was born without a lot of technology and we've had to figure out how to use it day to day.

But I think it's also a really interesting time for this cohort because like we actually briefly mentioned on the last episode, a lot are wanting to buy a house.

They're saving their money.

It's a different financial time compared to previous generations like Gen X or baby Boomers.

We're also in that phase of starting families and going into leadership positions.

So I feel like it's crunch time for Millennials, but I feel like there are some interesting trends that are emerging as well.

I know a lot of my millennial friends have said I don't want to take on a promotion because I don't actually want that extra responsibility.

I've crunched the numbers.

I'm only going to get an extra like 50 buc week.

I don't want to be a team leader and have to deal with all of that chaos.

Renee, what are the trends that you're seeing around Millennials?

I'm imagining that you are managing some in your current role at Lanzajet.

Yeah, Millennials.

I mean, I'm one of them as well.

I self identify as a millennial and actually maybe I'll just speak to part of the experiences I've had being managed as a millennial.

And what I've noticed that comes up for me, I think that generally Millennials are very tech savvy, right?

Like we've grown up with the evolution of Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook.

We have been early adopters of those platforms and so we're generally pretty proficient when it comes to digital uptake.

And so with that, I think the Millennial generation are kind of the first digital influences.

And so what I've seen in my personal career is I'm holding this job.

I've been employ an employer.

Generally, what happens when you are employed by someone, particularly as you become more more senior and hold executive roles, you generally are only allowed to be employed by one employer.

Which means if you're self employed or have a side hustle, suddenly that can come into competition.

And I've certainly seen that running my own personal speaking business and then also representing a major brand at the same time.

And so the challenge that I have seen with that is it can come into conflict around your digital footprint.

The way that you're influencing audiences, the values that you have and what you stand up for, advocate for can at times be either in conflict with your employer or the perception is that you might be Working more on your own self employment rather than for the business because of what they're seeing digitally.

And it's such a tricky thing to navigate.

I have had to navigate that my whole career.

And I've done that through things like a secondary contract where I've had to, you know, sign, whether it's a formal agreement to say these are the terms in which I'm going to be operating my business, or, you know, literally having to negotiate doing public speaking and how I can bring in my employer's brand within that.

So that's been something that I found particularly tricky as a millennial.

So managing a millennial from that standpoint, I think that that could be really challenging is people are making money off of, influencing off of advertising, off of their own personal brands these days.

And that is something that's been really big and emerged in our generation.

What do you think, Felicity?

I definitely had that experience as I love that perspective of being a millennial who's been managed by people of different generations.

Yeah.

Oh, my gosh, that's so happened to me.

And it has been tricky where I have worked with some global organizations, a lot of companies I've worked with organizations, and that brand is really, really important to them.

One thing I have actually loved, which I forgot about in running my own business, is that I get to say whatever I like online or in my speeches.

And there's no boss coming up and tapping me on the shoulder going, you can't say that.

And I know at one time I was doing a lot of media, which is fantastic to get for our charity, and it was really helpful for the organization because their name is getting mentioned, the media, a lot is associated with it.

But it did come to a point where I had to get media approved.

And that became quite tricky because I couldn't just say what I wanted anymore.

And they really wanted to script what I was saying, what I was talking about.

And I had to get things approved.

And that was very.

I understand why they would want to do that and make sense.

They want to protect their brand.

But then it also became quite constraining and scary for me because I didn't want to say the wrong thing.

And it made it really quite difficult to talk to the media and also have that employment.

So that's something that I found, you know, you've got to be really upfront and negotiate.

I've got these things that I'm doing on the side.

And the more I was doing speaking, running the charity, the more I would say to my employer, hey, I'M doing these things on the side, is that going to be a conflict?

And being really upfront about it, how I personally navigated that was that I would do a 0.9 FTE or 0.8 FTE where I'd have a day off.

I'd usually have Fridays off.

And during that time, that's when I would spend on my business or I would do a paid speaking engagement.

So it definitely wasn't that conflict between my employer and my extra employer employment on the side.

But I think it really points to that.

Millennials are really purposeful, and I think that's something to keep in mind when managing Millennials.

But I feel like also, you know, the next generation as well, Gen Z also really big on purpose.

So I think if you are managing millennials, something that I found really helpful is talking about the why of projects, the why of a company strategy.

So I can go, oh, here's how I fit in that why.

Here's how I can take that on board, and here's how that relates to me personally.

And I think a great person who talks about this was actually Dean Boxel.

He came to one of our executive lunches.

He's come to a couple, actually been very fortunate to have him as a speaker for We Aspire.

And he manages very young people.

He's got teams of swimmers who are like teenagers, right?

And he's won.

His team, has won gold medals at the Olympics.

And it was fascinating to him to talk about what are the motivators and what drives his swim team.

And there are a whole range of different motivators.

They actually work as a squad, as a team, and then he coaches.

Coaches them individually, and he has a personal strategy for each person, and it is quite different.

One thing that's out to me that he said was he had a guy in the squad who was just said, I just want to go to Japan.

And that was his reason for training for the Olympics in Tokyo.

And Dean thought, you know what, you could just book a flight and go to Japan.

You don't have to go through grueling two sessions a day training to do that.

He didn't say that to this person.

He went, okay, that's his goal.

Fantastic.

Then I'm going to empower him and support him.

And that's something that I've always done, especially when it comes to something like power of engineering.

People have said to me, hey, I want to get involved, I want to volunteer.

Obviously, I don't have a paycheck to reward them with for their time.

They've got to have a really good reason.

So it's the first question I ask people in my team.

Why are you here?

What's your purpose?

What is your goals?

Sometimes it is, I really want to learn how business works.

I really want to understand being on a board.

I really want to figure out STEM education.

I want to give back.

They have a whole range of different reasons and I feel like it's my job is their quote unquote boss to actually be able to provide that for them.

So I think when you can hook into that purpose and really bring that front of mind, whether it's in your regular catch ups or if it's a personal goal like buying a house that seems like a pretty great one to tie to to work and income and promotions, then that's really purpose related as is that something that's made a difference for you, Renee, in managing Millennials or being managed as a millennial?

Or would you say there are other things that can help with motivation and driver work?

Yeah, absolutely.

So I think a couple of things that you said really resonate with me.

So work preferences.

Flexibility has probably never been a priority like it is for the Millennial generation.

I'm talking about being a parent, drop offs, pickups and for school.

So I've seen a lot of millennials in my generation leave work or come to work earlier or later to suit those work preferences and to have that flexibility in their personal lives.

I love what you said around being a 0.8 or 0.9 FTE full time equivalent.

So that really speaks to the fact that people would rather earn less money to increase their flexibility, to be able to to run their own businesses or spend their time outside of work on other projects that really are important to them.

So I think again, you know, don't be surprised if a millennial comes to you and asks for less time at work or you know, part time circumstances or the flexibility to start work earlier or later to suit their personal circumstances.

And to be honest, I would also say that there is probably this immense confidence and expectation now, particularly post Covid where if an employer does not offer that flexibility, like Millennials would walk.

And I'm probably one of them.

If I had to turn up at an office five days a week and work nine to five, I think that I would literally not accept that job these days because I've got other things that I want to be doing.

I, you know, I'm still committed, I still am very much able to deliver on my job.

But I want the flexibility to be able to do that how I want, in the ways that I want.

And yeah, I've certainly seen that across the board.

You know, you're another great example of that, Felicity.

When you were working for an employer, you know, you were raising a family and making things work flexibly so you could run a business as well.

So definitely a great call out there.

The other part that really resonated was purpose driven work.

So our generation, the millennials, I think, are very big on making sure that the work that they are doing resonates the impact in a lot of instances too.

So whether that's climate change, sustainability, or just looking at, I guess, other social issues and purpose driven work.

So running a charity is a great example of that.

How do we think about, again, offering the flexibility so that people can contribute to bigger causes?

Or you'll find that a millennial will join your company because of the values alignment that you have.

So suddenly, corporate values, right?

We saw them emerge in the last 20, 20 years where corporates will come out and say, our brand represents these values.

They've got them on their public websites.

It's a part of, you know, the, whether it's the brand colors or, you know, the initiatives they support or the community funding that they provide, generally their values are aligned with social impact as well.

And that has also come with the emergence of an ESG strategy where there is an expectation that organizations now operate ethically and have, have social acceptance, so the community backs them, they're happy for them to operate in the way that they do, and that that community is also supported by the presence of that organization.

So what we're seeing is this emergence of value provided both ways to community from organizations and then from community to organizations, whether that's, you know, the employer employing people in the community, and then giving back to that community through grants or charity work or turning up at certain events.

Now, I would say in a lot of instances, and we've talked about this in other episodes as well, Felicity, where ethics and values don't always align in companies.

And so what I've seen is the emergence of employees holding employers accountable to their values and walking away where they do not align.

Great examples that I've seen is first nations men and women and anyone really that walk into an employer, it might be a major mining firm or a large infrastructure provider.

And they say that their values are to protect country, to work with community, and to provide a safe place for people to come in and work.

And then what we're also seeing is the contradiction of those values where Employers aren't protecting country, aren't looking after community values.

An example of that might be they want to build a huge piece of infrastructure within a local marine system, which is going to devastate the biodiversity there.

It's going to pollute the area.

And also, that area is near native first nations lands.

Now all of a sudden, we're seeing millennials walk in and say, well, hang on a second.

You said that your values are X.

You're now running a project that contradicts those values.

I will not work with you anymore.

And I love that.

I love that there is this sense of ethical conviction that millennials are placing on employers.

Because what we've seen for the last hundred years of the way that major corporates or organizations operate is they take advantage of the resources around them for profit and commercial value.

And I think that our generation is doing such a fabulous job in trying to turn that around and say, hey, we have an ethical responsibility to operate in this community.

How can we do better at that?

So, yes, that's my takeaway.

I love millennials.

How good are we?

So true.

I think, yeah, absolutely.

We've gone from like, work and then life is two separate things.

And then my mentor put it so well of it's now work.

It's not like work life balance, it's work life integration.

We're integrating work and life and all of those things together.

And yeah, totally agree.

I've seen people walk away from employers because they're not doing the thing being aligned to their values.

And I think also call out the Work 180 website is a fantastic way to see if there are organizations doing things like the flexibility arrangements you want, the parental leave, you want it.

Actually, it's a job board which shows you what companies are doing in terms of those kinds of things which give those flexibility options.

And so I think making that publicly available, even publishing, you know, with Wijia publishing, the gender equity stats we're seeing, it's becoming really transparent around what companies are doing.

And I agree.

I feel like people aren't tolerating that.

So whether you're.

You are a millennial or you're managing them, we hope this episode has helped you and supported you in manage them.

I'd love to hear from our listeners.

Gen Z. I feel like that's a whole other kettle of fish.

Renee.

I'm probably going to do some research.

I feel like I'm not yet equipped to manage Gen Z.

Maybe just go, you know, humans are humans.

But I'm really fascinated to see what they're going to bring because I feel like they're going to disrupt it even more in terms of that social response, corporate social responsibility, than even the millennials have seen.

Thanks, Renee.

I love your insights.

Any final tips before we wrap up this episode?

No.

That's fantastic.

And just super excited to see the fact that, you know, workplaces, values, and the way that we operate continues to evolve.

And I think that that is a really important call out is I find that there's actually been a significant amount of tension between, like, boomers to millennials, and I'm sure that there's going to be more tension between millennials and Gen Z.

And it's part of the way that we continue to evolve and to improve our systems and work towards a better world.

So do yourself a favor and reflect on, like, what are the tensions coming up for you between different generations and how can we go about improving them?

Because we all have to operate in these businesses and build a better future together.

Thank you.

Absolutely.

Thanks, Renee.

That's a wrap on this episode of Managing Millennials.

We'll see you in the next one, Sam.