Hello everyone.

Welcome back.

My name is Sarah Karakaian.

I am Annette Grant, and together we are--

Thanks for Visiting.

All right, let's kick off the show like we do every week,

and that's sharing one of you our amazing listeners who are using our

hashtag #STRShareSunday on Instagram.

Annette, who are we sharing this week?

This week we are sharing @perchtreehouse.

That's @perchtreehouse, P-E-R-C-H, Treehouse.

And it is in Lake Mitchell in Alabama.

And this Treehouse is gorgeous.

And it's not really a treehouse.

I mean, it's on stilts, but it's not attached to a tree.

I think a lot of the new tree houses aren't really in a tree, but this one is--

They're among the trees.

They're among the trees.

Wow.

It is stunning.

There's this--

The front door.

Yeah, the front door.

Actually, I'm going to encourage, let's stop right there with the front door.

Listeners, there's this amazing front door.

They have this amazing light.

They actually have a-- there's really custom welcome sign.

This is what your visitors foresee.

This is their entrance.

So it's springtime, get out there, clean it up, freshen it up, have

it looking good for your visitors.

They have amazing views.

They've done some fun hanging chairs to overlook the views that

they have here at the lake house.

But I mean, the decks are, like it says, they're perched in the trees, so

they have the water view, and they have just really-- the design is special.

You can tell they took a ton of time and really thought through all of the details.

Yeah, you have to look at both of the entry doors.

The color that they've used in the kitchen is stunning.

They've done a lot of just detail work throughout, and there's a

special spot on the exterior where they've got a deck and a porch

underneath with a television, which is really cool, some outdoor showers.

I mean, they have got it going on, and it really is perched amongst

the trees when you check it out.

And I want to say, we are highlighting the Perch Treehouse today because

it's a segue into our episode.

The Perch Treehouse is hosted by Lucy and Daphne, who were competitors

of Sarah and her husband, Nick, on the HGTV show, Beach Flip.

And I cannot wait to turn the table and interview Sarah.

And the thing I think that's most shocking, that I cannot wait

to share with everybody is the compensation that they received

for this competition show on HGTV.

Let's get into this.

This is so exciting.

I mean, I don't even need to look further than right across the

table from a former HGTV star.

Yes, I'm going to say star.

It doesn't matter if it was one season.

Sarah, I want to go behind the scenes.

I want to do a tell-all.

Let's get into it, everybody.

I mean, so many people want to be on HGTV.

They want to be on a reality show, but you have been there, done that.

So I'm going to ask some questions that I can't believe I've never asked you before.

What have I been doing?

And I hope this is going to just entertain our listeners, but also

shed some light on what it means to actually be on a HGTV show.

So tell us about it.

It was 2015, Beach Flip, Alabama, Gulf Shores.

And it was a competition show.

There were four couples?

Yes.

Okay.

And you were all vying for a prize.

Yes, it was a cash prize, which I feel like none of us really cared about.

We wanted the accolade of winning.

Okay.

So that was my first question is like, what was the motivation

to be on the HGTV show?

Because I know there's going to be a lot of steps to even get you to Alabama.

So was it something that you had desired?

Was it like, hey, this is going to put us on the map.

What was the why in the beginning?

So Nick and I, prior to this, I was all in on Broadway musical theater.

I had blinders on.

I was focused on the great white way, and I had been doing it.

Nick had come to New York City to be with me and--

He had blinders on in a different way.

No, he really did.

He had blinders on.

I told him, its either come to New York or you don't.

And so he came, but he had blinders on to pursue his career

in architecture and space planning.

I had a-- hopefully, listeners, you can relate.

I had this coming to myself moment of, I don't know that I want to

do musical theater anymore, which I never thought would happen.

But this was also after 15 years, listeners.

Sarah was very successful and had been a professional actor for quite some time.

So it wasn't one summer in New York then she hang up her--

No.

But I never thought that would happen.

I knew where I wanted to be buried in New York City after all of my Tony Awards.

I was very focused on it.

But when I was being honest with myself, like, why wasn't

I going to auditions anymore?

Why was I not caring about practicing anymore?

And I really-- so anyway, fast forward to Nick and I, I've always loved houses.

Nick and I bought the house that we were living in.

It was a house in New York City, and we were short-term renting

it, obviously, the basement.

And I was going to YouTube university.

My dad was an electrician and a big DIYer growing up, so I

helped him tile, hang wallpaper.

I painted my own living room and bedroom.

Listeners, you're probably all like, yeah, me too.

So I knew I loved houses.

Nick had drywalled his way through college.

And in my brain at that point, early 2010s was like, oh, so then

he knows how to do everything else.

He can literally do anything.

He's he drywalled for five years.

No, that was-- honestly.

So anyway, when I was leaving Broadway and I was thinking of what I else I

wanted to do, I was pursuing a career in professional organizing and starting

my own business, but also helping Nick.

He was also doing handyman jobs in New York City, which people will pay

you a lot of money because they don't have ladders in their apartments.

So he was hanging TVs, changing light bulbs.

He was making barn doors.

I remember barn doors were a big deal.

And then of course we renovated our home in New York City in Queens, and

we were getting ourselves into it.

We replaced the entire support beam in our Queens home.

There was a large eye beam in our front yard, no permit.

And we were just learning how to-- so anyway, we were doing this in

Instagram, which just came on the scene.

That's what I was going to say.

Is social media even a thing at this point in time?

So I can't remember if we were just late to the party, if it

was still becoming a thing, but we started documenting all of this on

Instagram under our handle nesters.

And then a producer DMed us and said, hey, there's this

show that you should apply for.

Ooh, okay.

I had assumed this whole time that you were a true Sarah Karakaian, you were

scouring the internet and putting out applications and sending in videos.

So they scouted you.

Yes, they did.

Or maybe they-- and not to not say that you're not

amazing, but maybe they were sending out hundreds of DMs a day.

No, they were.

Okay.

Yeah.

But you took action.

So you got the DM, and it said you should try out for-- did it say the exact show

or was it just like, hey, send in a--

No, it was a concept at that point.

I think it was like, we're looking for-- it's a competition show on the beach.

You should apply.

And what was the application process?

It was online at first, if I remember correctly, and we had to,

I think, just surpass that phase.

Maybe send in some photos of some work that you had.

Yes.

And then I'm sure it was followed by a lot of interviews on Zoom.

And honestly, another reason why this episode is cool, because I know a lot

of our own members in HBMM are having their spotlight on HGTV episodes, one

of our coaches was on A&E, I believe.

Mm-hmm.

With his tiny homes.

So I'm hoping I can shed some light on my experience.

Obviously, this is a long time ago now, so things have changed, but yeah.

So it was an online application, and then once we passed that,

we moved on to video interviews.

After that, it was live, in-person auditions.

This is where I want to dig in.

I know it was a while ago, but when you got the first email,

when you got the first Zoom interview, how excited were you?

Did you think, holy smokes, this is it?

We're going to be on HGTV.

We're the next chip and-- what was going through your mind?

Were you super excited or were you just like, I'm going to play it cool.

And if it happens, it happens.

Nick was very, very excited.

You have to understand I was a professional auditioner.

So I've had--

Ooh, you got no a lot.

I got nos three times a day every day.

And I even had a signed contract, flew to a location to do a regional

show, this was in 2008, only to be told go back home and kick out your

sublet because the show's not opening.

So I really never got like excited excited or planned my future until

I was like on stage opening night.

Okay.

That's fair.

During the interview process, was there anything else really extra you had to do?

Was it any time out of your day, any financial commitment or were

you just like showing up, tell them who you were and how you would be

able to participate in the show?

They want to see your projects that you're doing.

They want to see you and your partner working together.

They want to make sure you're going to look good on camera.

So I don't remember the video process, but I am pretty sure we submitted just

self-taped videos of us changing lights, and painting walls, and pouring cement

into our basement, things like that.

Live action type working together.

Yes.

From the time you got the DM until the time that you

actually said, hey, you have been chosen, what was that timeline?

I feel like it was forever, four to six months.

Okay.

That actually doesn't seem like that long.

No.

And at the time-- and actually, well, a little spoiler alert, we've had other

opportunities to do HGTV shows, and they, I mean, I think two years before.

But they weren't competition shows.

It may have been longer.

It was a long time ago now.

Right.

But I just want to offer that to everybody, that it isn't something like--

It's not immediate.

Yeah.

It's not a normal-- sometimes when you're getting courted for a

job, they need to fill the thing.

This is a show.

There's so much production into it.

All right.

How do they tell you that you've been chosen?

Is it an email or they play coy?

Do they say, let's get on a Zoom.

And I know I've got to jog your memory here.

I feel like it was a call or an email from the producer.

I'm assuming, which is a buzzkill, if you get chosen, I don't

feel like you can go out and party with your friends and family because it seems

like there's a lot of NDAs and quiet.

So is it like this celebration between you and Nick?

I mean, is that pretty much the first thing is the contract?

I feel like those contracts would be air tight.

Yes.

And we didn't know to ask.

We didn't have any other friends who were on a network reality show.

We didn't have a lawyer we could call.

I'm sure we could have found one, but we didn't think that.

Not like the amazing Scott Brown.

Scott Brown.

Call Scott Brown.

No.

Yeah.

No, we did not.

Oh, okay.

So could you tell anyone?

No.

So I had to get permission.

So at the time, I was working at the hotel.

Okay.

And I knew that-- we did know enough that when-- so I think we

found out fall of 2014, and we had to leave for Gulf Shores, Alabama, I

remember it being February of 2015.

And we were there for two months, so February and all of March.

Okay.

And I had to leave my job.

And this not just like a-- this is a high end hotel, and

I had a management position.

So it was a big deal for me to leave.

And so I had to tell them.

Okay.

I mean, what is that conversation, like you and Nick?

Because I'm sure, I mean, maybe your position, but was

it a paid leave of absence?

Is it like, hey, we're just going to take this chance?

No money coming in during--

That's right.

Okay.

And could you tell your parents?

Can you tell your family, or can you tell them conceptually, hey, I'm doing this?

We have an opportunity.

Yeah.

And I'm sure I told my parents, and we had a dog.

So we had to tell-- I don't remember where we sent Hero, but we sent our dogs

somewhere, or it was someone's house.

Oh no.

Maybe my friend lived in the house--

Fortwo months.

Whoever that friend is, they're going to kill me for not remembering.

Vinny did.

Vinny lived in my house.

Okay.

You had to leave the dog behind.

So that's also something in the contract of two full months.

You got to leave your job.

And did you and Nick decide that earlier on like, hey, if we get this,

we're just going to figure out how to bounce for two months and make it work?

Yeah.

Because once we got it, I won't lie, at that point, while I wasn't like,

okay, they could still boot us or find another couple, and that's probably

very true, but at the same time, you can't help but let your mind wonder.

Is this the thing that's going to change our lives?

Yeah, I feel like once you get the yes, the swirling

of thoughts has to be like--

Can I share one other little anecdote?

Because I want to show this to any listener out there who might also be

being shopped right now by a network.

It's funny because when we went to our audition in person, this

was like the final callback--

Oh shoot.

Okay.

And this was actually a big production callback.

They put you in a room, they gave you pictures of rooms, and they

gave you five minutes, and you had to design the whole thing.

And you have to remember, everyone, at the time, I was going to school

for interior design because I was transitioning out of musical theater

into-- but I didn't have years of clients.

I had done one house, my own.

You know what I mean?

I didn't have all this experience yet, and so I was so nervous.

And once they give you that five minutes, you then go with all the fancy producers

who are amazing human beings, and they put a picture up of the room, and you

have to tell them what you would do.

Oof, pressure.

Okay.

And I am trained musical theater.

Give me script.

I will perform for you.

They don't want you performing.

They want the real you.

Thank the Lord for my husband, Nicholas Karakaian, who is--

I can see it.

A character of all characters, and he-- you guys, it was a beach prop.

It looked like a Golden Girls home that we had to bring to 2015.

And I don't remember, but Nick brought in Star Trek to the conversation,

had the producers howling, and I'll never forget leaving.

It was somewhere on 14th Street, and I was so upset at Nick.

I was like, how were we talking about Star Trek?

I was typical Sarah, just stressed.

Just so everyone knows, Star Trek comes up in every conversation with

Nick, so you can only imagine when your partner brings up that thing that you

hear about all the time that no one else wants to hear about, and he did it again.

He did it in front of producers, but I guarantee you--

It's the reason.

He's the reason we got picked.

It was not for my savvy tile selections.

It was Nick being the character.

So anyone out there, I just implore you to be yourself because they've

been looking at you for reasons that you didn't even know they were looking

at you for, just being yourself.

So anyway, I wanted to leave people with that.

That's a good point.

All right, so you leave that final, you're going to Alabama, Gulf Shores.

Do they let you have any prep work like, this is the house that you're

going to get, this is your budget?

Nothing.

Ooh.

Okay.

So you can't even start ahead of time

No.

But I could have.

Had I had done a million houses, I could have put a concept together.

And I am a Enneagram 3.

I let the unknowns roadblock my brain.

I could have put a concept, a general concept together, and colors, and a vibe.

And I knew I wanted a beach.

I knew I wanted the Hamptons.

I knew that, and that did help me.

That did serve me when we get there.

Right.

You started your--

But no, they don't tell you square feet.

They don't tell you how many rooms.

They don't tell you anything.

Oh.

Fun but nerve-wracking.

It was an adventure, for

Adventure.

There you go.

When you get to Gulf Shores, where do they put you up?

Are you in another house?

Are you at a hotel?

Obviously, you didn't stay in the property that you flipped, right?

No.

They put us up in the most gorgeous, most giant vacation rental, first

row on the beach of Gulf Shores.

You didn't have to stay with the other contestants, did you?

Oh, we all lived in this house.

That was part of the content.

Oh, it was.

And how about this?

They told us in the van.

They picked us all in the airport.

I don't remember what happened after that, but we'd driven this van to the house and

they said, okay, when you get in there, you have to run and find your room.

Oh, it was like the old school, um, MTV where they were like--

Choose a room.

And they of course, documented this.

And you guys, it was, I don't remember how many bedrooms, but it was, I

mean, 7, 8, 9, 10, 14 bedrooms.

Again, Sarah, so stressed about at getting a room I'm not even

thinking, Sarah, you're on the beach.

Pick a room where you can see the water.

I just picked a room.

You didn't get one with, uh--

No.

Oh.

Bad move.

And I think I may have been the only--

Big, huge mistake.

Only team who didn't pick--

Oh my gosh.

Yeah.

Again, just take a breath, everyone.

Don't be like me.

At what point in time do you get to meet the fellow contestants?

At the airport?

I think it was at the airport.

Ooh, wow.

Okay.

And at this point in time, is this when you are like, it is quiet time.

You cannot talk to friends.

You cannot talk to family.

They take

your

Ther

phone.

What do you mean they take your phone?

You could not have your phone until-- we had

days off, maybe once a week.

At that point, you had like phone time, and you could call home.

I wonder if it's still like that.

I don't know.

Literal, they took your phone.

Because you cannot Instagram your experience.

You know what I mean?

Right.

If something gets leaked, the whole show's done.

Yeah.

it's not fun that way.

They had to do it very seriously.

They didn't want you getting inspiration from anywhere.

Oh, that's true too.

Ifon our days off we wanted to go see a movie, we all had to go see a movie.

We all had to experience the same things while we were there.

To try to keep it controlled.

Yes.

So that no one got a leg up.

Interesting.

Yeah.

Okay.

Since you're talking about the home, and the boundaries here, and

the contestants, they put you up in this amazing house, how are they

taking care-- are you truly talent?

You're talent.

Everything's taken care of.

Okay.

Yes, we had free housing and free food.

Okay.

Is there compensation coming in while you are there filming?

Do you get paid at the end of the show?

Do you get paid in the beginning 50%, 50% when it closes?

Do you remember the compensation, and how that happened?

If you win, you got the prize money.

Do you remember what that was, prize money?

The prize money was 50,000, I think.

Ooh, okay.

But nothing else?

Nothing else.

What do you mean?

Nothing else.

Wait.

Not like, hey, here's $5,000 for being talent?

No.

Eight weeks, no compensation, unless you are the grand prize winner?

That's right.

I'm very, very surprised by that.

I thought there'd be a little something, something.

No.

Really?

Uh-uh.

They do future cast with you.

What's that mean?

Let's say this show took off and they want us all back to do

season two or something like that--

Then you might get a--

In your contract, they tell you what it would look like if you were to

succeed with the show moving forward.

But I mean, it's a competition show.

Do you want to see the same competitors each season?

I mean, I guess something could take off.

They want to be prepared for that.

Or do something different.

So it's the-- yeah.

They're future casting selling you the promise.

Mm-hmm.

Let's just spoiler alert.

We ain't got the 50k, right?

We didn't get the 50k.

So it's okay.

Oh man.

I'm really, really surprised that there wasn't any.

Sorry, I'm stuck on that.

Do you know-- could there have potentially been other contestants that

got compensation, they worked it in their contract and you just don't know?

That's true.

I'm pretty sure we had conversations with our castmates, who were

amazing human beings, all of them.

But again, they could be just being nice and not telling us.

AD MARKER

When the competition starts, sorry, I went all the way to the

end first, is it day one, this is your budget, this is your team, or

is it also very like, hey, we're going to start in the kitchen?

You get four days to do the kitchen.

Then you do the bathrooms.

How scripted, I guess, or how controlled is it?

Did you really do the whole house, or did they-- do you see three rooms that

they show on TV, like the kitchen, the dining room, and a bathroom?

Was it like, here's your house, here's the budget, have at

it for the next eight weeks?

So it was, here's the house, here's the budget.

But it was, okay, this week we're going to be filming the living room.

This week we're going to be filming the two bathrooms.

We were all doing the same room at the same time.

And there was one bathroom.

They were essentially beachfront duplexes, two of them.

So each team got their own side.

And they were identical, square footage, layout, everything.

There were just mirror images of each other.

And there was one bathroom that wasn't included in what we did.

But here's the fun part.

The homes were owned by homeowners, and they were actual vacation rentals.

And these homeowners were promised, if you can trust your home to us and these

competitors, who they didn't know who the hell we were, then you could get--

and they got to keep the furniture.

A free upgrade.

A free upgrade.

That sounds like they're the ones that were winning in the whole.

But you don't get to pick what it looks like.

You don't get to pick anything.

Okay, so there's--

From what I've seen, every week--

No, they--

We'll put the link below, uh, in the show notes.

You can look at all of the before and after.

Trust me, these homeowners won on this, uh, competition show.

Did you each get the same amount of time to work each day, or if you wanted

to work 18 hours, could of you, or was it like, we drop you off at 7:00, the

van's going to pick you up at 8:00?

Oh, so that's how they did it?

Yeah.

If you were like, no, I want to sleep here and work all night.

We could vote.

I feel like I remember us voting like, hey, do you want another hour or two?

To everyone.

But everyone has to do it.

Okay.

Was the square footage-- you said they were duplexes.

Mm-hmm.

So everyone had the same exact square footage, same exact setup?

Yes.

And I can foresee this in these beach places being

very cookie cutter or identical.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

And let's talk about the other contestants.

What were their backgrounds?

Was it all husband and wife duos?

What were they?

So there was Martha and Alex.

They won the show.

They, at the time, were not married.

They are now married, happily, with beautiful children.

There's Lucy and Daphne.

They're the only all-female couple, and they were best friends.

Daphne is an amazing real estate agent, and now has this

stunning tree house on a lake.

And Nick and I are going to go there this August actually.

We're all still friends.

Lucy sells and makes architectural hardware, jewelry.

So if you've ever seen pictures of me with hardware, jewelry from

house-- and her home is gorgeous.

She is a talented interior designer.

And there is, Mahdi and Mel, and they were-- were they married at the time?

No.

Because we went to their wedding a couple years later.

They were also boyfriend, girlfriend, and they were another team.

Were you nervous about the competition?

Could you research them ahead of time?

No.

Did you do any research?

Because, I mean, if--

They don't tell you.

Okay.

Could you have your laptop?

Could you have a computer?

I'm like, could you go--

They gave us each a laptop to use when we got there.

Joss & Main was a sponsor of the show, and so they had a curated list of things

we could pick each week for whatever space we're doing that we could pick

from, or we could call local stores.

But it was not easy.

It was not-- you had a very limited amount of time to design it.

If things were out of stock, you had to start over.

Okay.

And what did your-- I mean, was it just Nick and you?

Did each of you get a painter, a carpenter, a tiler?

What did your team, if you had a team, what did that look like?

Yes.

These are the unsung heroes.

Okay.

So let me tell you this, the work was very real.

And I don't remember the exact times.

We got dropped off 6:00, 7:00 in the morning, and we came home at midnight.

And we were working.

So they were hosts of the show.

It was Nicole Curtis, David Bromstad, and Josh Temple, all amazing humans.

And they were the talent.

We were also talent, but we were also--

So you're not just designing.

You're in there like, oh--

Hanging tiles, painting, caulking, everything.

But each team had a dedicated carpenter.

Shout out to Mark Peria, who behind the scenes-- he's funny because

he would always send screenshots with him working in the background.

The talent in this man and all of the carpenters we were assigned,

they called him carpenters, but they could do anything, was endless.

And Mark's dedication to Nick and my vision for this home was admirable.

I'm sure he could have made much more money with a traditional

client, and he had a blast, I think.

We still talk today.

We're very close.

And then there was a small team of contractors who would help if anything

happened with plumbing or electrical.

They could go aroundin each of the places.

And we had a GC.

Oh.

So we also had a GC who was licensed in the area, and knowledgeable,

and worked in Gulf Shores, and he made sure that we were following.

Um, it'd be interesting to maybe have Mark on the show,

and just from the tradesperson's perspective, and how do they get chosen?

And then they're just working with these random people.

That sparked a whole new thing in my mind.

I've never thought about the people actually performing the work.

I want to dig into a couple of--

maybe it's

vanity.

I don't know.

Okay.

Every day when you're going to the show, do you care what you're wearing?

Are you putting makeup on?

Do you feel like you're being recorded?

What goes through your mind about how you're going to

be showing up to the world.

Because it's like you're-- I mean, you're competing, you're

doing a lot of laborious tasks.

How does that play into your mind, and decisions, and how you're

showing up to actual work perse?

At first, it starts out with makeup and hair in the morning.

Wake up super early and caring into not caring.

Not caring because I'm just throwing this opportunity away into, I am stressed

about getting it done and having an idea, because every room you did had

to have something that you DIYed.

Let me go--

Oh man.

You've got to be super creative in such limitedamount--

But also-- yeah, creative with limited amount of time.

So Nick and I would dream up building a built-in, but I learned very quickly--

The time.

After one or two failed attempts that like, I don't have time to do that.

So how do you do impressive things that don't take long?

And again, I was very new to the-- so I started a blog and all that

stuff, and we were DIYing our home, and I was still really new to it,

so I didn't have that skillset yet.

Right.

Of like, what can be super impactful, but done--

Both Annette & Sarah:

In short amount of time.

All right.

And then let's just get it out there.

You're with your husband, there's $50,000 on the line.

What is this tension?

Is there fighting?

Is there like, can you go behind a door and yell at each other?

Was it there?

Or did you work well to-- I don't know.

I imagine cameras bring a different amount of pressure just being there.

This is where my trained self flourished.

In front of a camera?

Let's go.

And I can--

Fourth wall it.

I can fourth wall.

Nick, on the other hand, again, is like a reality show star because he

cannot, which is good for reality TV.

Right.

He lets it fly.

He lets it fly.

And so we had to come up with a code word for when we were both

getting ticked off at each other.

Ooh, smart.

We did.

And the word was lunchbox, which is funny.

So you can't hear that word and not laugh.

Where did come from?

I don't know.

This is genius.

We made it up, and it did help.

Because when we're just at each other's throats because you are

tired, you are hungry, you--

Away from home.

Away from home, you are tapped out on ideas, you are worried about what

your teammates doing because you can't see what they're doing during the week.

You know what I mean?

So we had to say lunchbox a couple times.

You have a dedicated camera person.

Ours was Corey.

He was amazing.

And they cannot talk to you.

You cannot build a relationship with your camera person.

What?

Because they--

Oh, I want to be friends with them.

No, you can't.

And we did too.

Because they need to be unbiased, and they just need to get the content.

Right.

So you couldn't have a conversation with him.

And you cannot hide behind doors.

They will find you.

You have mics on.

Did you fight?

If we went back and watched Beach Flip, would there be any moments of--

There's me crying because the countertops weren't right.

I'll never forget the first night, you guys.

The first challenge was the kitchen, and we sat down with the cabinet guy,

and they gave us each, I think, five or 10 minutes to lay out this kitchen.

And again, we had two kitchens under our belt at this point.

So now I can be like, oh yeah, I want a 30-inch there, and an 18.

I knew what I could tell you now, and so getting home that night and just being

mad at myself because when we finally got the kitchen, we did not order the

cabinets that we should have ordered.

And, um, so I did a lot of like self-fighting.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

Let's talk about the tears.

Sarah's told me a lot of stories about Twitter and her tears.

They did capture you crying quite a bit, right?

I cried a lot.

And so people would say something on Twitterabout it.

Oh, Sarah's crying again.

I think I even had a hashtag.

I really don't know.

I'm sure one of you will find it.

Yeah, I cried over these countertops.

That was the biggest one because I really wanted these marble looking countertops

and they gave me ones that would've been great, but again, under pressure,

you're just like, I wanted these ones.

Oh my gosh.

And they loved getting me ugly crying.

Oh my gosh.

We're going to have to find clip.

And I don't cry.

Can we please find the clip and put it on Instagram?

I'll try to find it.

Okay.

That sounded not--

No.

Listen, it's out there, so I will try to find it.

Oh, so good.

All right.

So lunch boxes are being said, tears are flying.

How are you feeling during this whole thing?

Is there a moment-- did you ever want to quit?

No.

Oh, heck no.

All right.

And is there ever--

Iloved it.

Oh, all right.

Great.

That was going to segue into that, but when it's week 5, week

6, week 7, is it like you're grind-- is seven days a week also?

Did you get two days off?

I think we got one day off.

One day?

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

When you're through this, when you go back to the house, do you talk

to your competitors about what you're doing or is it tightlipped

around there about the duplexes?

Our camera people, and we always had a producer at the house.

Always?

Yeah.

Oh my gosh.

So our listeners, when you watch these reality shows, I mean, I

think they probably still are pretty close to this, it is pretty real.

Ours was pretty real.

So we would talk about it, but also we were all really good competitors.

We wanted to win.

We all had a really good relationship.

We're still friends.

We're all going to go to Daphne's Treehouse in August, but--

But you were keeping things tightlipped.

All right.

And then what did it look like?

And I haven't watched your show, but I know on a lot of reality shows, they'll do

these like snippets where you're dressed up, and you're talking with the host.

How did they plan for that?

Did they let you know, hey, the host is going to be coming by today and

interrupt you for X amount of time?

How did they tee that up to you?

I don't remember exactly, but we all got pulled away from the

projects the exact same amount of time.

To make it fair.

Okay.

Mm-hmm.

And there were days that-- we knew schedules.

Like, okay, you'll be working from this time and this time.

We'll have, I think they were called on the flies.

That's when you go off the side and you talk with your producer

and give an update of what's going on, or, hey, this happened.

And that setup takes forever.

And it was also February and March in Gulf Shores.

It's not warm.

Spoiler alert.

It was so cold.

So that whole thing, all that's pretty planned out.

Yeah.

Okay.

And then the competition show, who was voting on your spaces?

Was it the public?

Was it the producers?

Was it the homeowners?

This is why it's fun, because of what we do now now

that Thanks for Visiting is what I do in short-term rentals.

So these were all active vacation homes, and the whole premise

was doing smart renovations to increase the value of the home.

For just the overall value or for the nightly rates?

Market value.

But that's the thing.

These homes, they're duplexes.

They're never going to be someone's primary residence.

They could be, but they're just not.

There's still going to be a beach home on the primary.

Yeah.

So you had to make decisions that would impact them being great vacation rentals.

So of course, ADR and occupancy.

And so at the end of the show, we had appraisers come on.

At the beginning they told you what the value was, and at the end

they tell you what the value is.

And whoever increased their value the most won.

Really?

Yeah.

Fascinating.

And it was a group of appraisers?

They were real Gulf Shore, Alabama appraisers.

Interesting.

Experts.

Okay.

What have you.

And so I will offer you this too.

I went in there, again, we had our short-term rental in the basement of

our Queen's home, but I was not yet this-- I didn't learn all the things

that I know now about value of property.

And so one of the first competitions was the primary bedroom, and there's these

two closets in the primary bedroom.

And not only did yours truly paint them, which that's where I should have stopped.

Opening the door and seeing a bright pop of color, super fun.

But yours truly, again, I told you I was becoming a professional

organizer, and I was in it.

I loved it.

I could tell you how much room you leave for long hanging,

short hanging purses, shoes.

So I spent $1,000, maybe more on outfitting each of these closets in this

primary bedroom with closet organizers.

Dumb.

Do you think-- would you say that was your biggest mistake in the home?

I'm calling it a mistake just so you know.

No, you should.

Yes.

Okay.

And I'll never forget.

So each week you do these things and then the hosts tell you, why they

think that was a good or bad decision, and I've never-- so Nicole Curtis,

number one, everyone, is so smart.

She knows her stuff.

She does not play around.

She is the real deal.

They all are the real deal.

But I remember her saying, Sarah, these people are coming for a week, and they

don't need to organize their clothes.

They're going to throw their suitcase on a-- I mean, some people might,

but like they're going to throw their thing on a luggage rack.

One person in 1,000.

Yes.

She was like, you just-- and we had a budget.

Oh, blew a ton of your budget.

I blew a ton of my money on something like that, and I could

have done something else with it.

And so I'm grateful I made that mistake the first episode, because

then again, my mind started to shift.

I'm like, oh.

To short-term or not.

Okay.

The value of the home is perception of the buyer, and if investors are going

to buy this home-- so I learned a ton.

Okay.

Any other large mistakes like that that you're like, I would definitely

would not do it again on another?

Because listeners, that's actually high value right there for any

short-term rental, is not putting a ton of money into the closet spaces.

Don't do that.

And there was these beautiful views.

Then Nick and I made smarter decisions moving forward because we

also weren't idiots either at point.

We were smart enough to find a home in one of the most expensive real estate

markets in the world, tap into the Airbnb thing, which wasn't a thing yet.

You know what I mean?

And we've put faith in it.

So we were also weren't dumb.

So we took that, and there was a room where there was these giant closets.

It was half closet, half room.

And we removed one of the closets and put a desk there.

Oh, nice.

Um, now, thinking back, we probably could have fit a bed

there, but the fact that we took out storage and made it functional--

Larger square footage usage.

Correct.

That was a good decision.

And also we all had these sliding doors that looked out in the ocean.

I forget what we did to them, but we made that more-- I don't know if we

made them bigger or what we did, but we did something to really focus on

that Gulf Shore view of the ocean.

So that was also good.

So we made good decisions there.

I probably spent money that I shouldn't have spent in some other places.

How much money did you get?

Do you remember?

I don't remember.

And was it a-- I'm just making up a number, let's say it's 20 grand.

Yeah.

Could you spend it all in one swoop?

And how did the spending go?

I feel like every episode, if you won-- every week was a chance to "win".

And if you won, I think you got more money.

Yeah.

Do you have a spreadsheet?

Who's doing the math for you?

The producers are.

They are.

Okay.

So they're keeping track of like, you bought this much paint, you

bought this much whatever, blah, blah, blah, and they'rekeeping

track of what you have left.

Yeah.

That's nice.

So if you won that week-- I think you got like, okay, if you win this

week, you get an extra a $1,000 to your budget, an extra $2,000 to your budget.

So if you weren't winning, you had to be even more creative on less money.

Okay.

Did you win any of the individual challenges?

We did.

I don't remember which.

Which ones.

Okay.

I feel like I won the guest bedroom and maybe--

Were those the appraisers that--

No, those were the hosts.

They were the ones deciding.

Hey, Nick and Sarah, are you one this week?

Yes.

Correct.

Now, that type of stuff, would everybody come together?

Was that part of the filming and like, Lucy and Daphne, you won

this week, and they'd cheer you--

They'd walk you into each space, and the hosts would tell you why they

liked it, why they didn't, and yeah.

And then obviously the viewers got to see, compare all of our rooms.

It was fun.

On Instagram, they would show all of our rooms, and Instagrammers got to vote.

Oh, okay.

So that would be live even though, or it was once it went live?

Once it went live.

Oh yeah.

It aired the summer of 2015.

That was going to be one of my questions, is when--

June or July.

Some summer kickoff.

Okay.

And so was it the last and final day?

Is that when you found out who the winner was?

Pretty much.

Okay.

And then you and the competitors, did you guys have a celebratory

dinner of like, we finished.

We did.

Did it feel so complete when it was complete, or was it still

wild because no one had seen it yet?

I just remember it feeling awesome to finish.

The house looked great, in true Sarah fashion.

I really was just excited for the people who owned the property.

We did a good job.

And I knew that it would stand out on their online listing.

And we were all best friends, and we are still.

I went to Martha and Alex's wedding, Mahdi and Mel's wedding,

and then Lucy and Daphne's.

We almost moved to Birmingham, Alabama because we wanted to take over the world.

Lucy and Daphne, the connections we made were real.

And even with the host of the show, Josh Temple, still supports us on Instagram.

Nice.

Yeah.

I would never take it back, and we can always say, I see you on HGTV.

And so while we're not HGTV stars, we still got a lot of opportunities

because of that experience.

So we got paid to speak after that at different home and garden shows.

Oh, cool.

Nick and I, when we were bloggers, we worked with some big

brands because of that accolade.

We worked with Lowe's for a while, and yeah.

You can have it on your brag bar forever.

You can, and you do.

And I earned that.

New York Times best seller as seen on HGTV.

Yeah.

So I think with that being said, you would absolutely do it again.

I think it would depend.

Here's why.

Because I'm in a different place.

We now have almost, however many years ago that was now of fixing up

homes, of running vacation rentals, of running short-term rentals under

our belt, that I don't know if a competition shows, just to get something

on my resume, where I did that.

And so now, what you and I are building with Thanks for Visiting, I

have different wants and needs now.

So if we were to get our own show, I would consider that.

Right.

Okay.

And then what do you think though-- all of the lessons learned there, what

is the number one thing just about television period that was like, oh,

that was completely, totally unexpected?

Is there something that you learned that made an impact or like, wow, that

was way different than I anticipated?

I am not going to lie.

I told you when we first met that if I could have done anything differently when

the show was airing, I would've engaged even harder with opportunities on my

own and leveraged me being on that show.

I would've invested in a PR agent.

Oh yeah, you have discussed this.

So you would've handled-- and I didn't touch on that.

Let's touch on that.

So when you left, you still couldn't tell anybody about your experience.

So February, March.

It comes out maybe--

June, Ithink.

Okay.

Did you have a party?

Did you have this huge event where your friends and family could watch?

And then did you watch it every week?

Did you have a watch party when it came out?

We did.

Youdid.

Okay.

Awesome.

And that's fun.

And then how did you stay tightlipped about the winner?

Because were your friends and family like, did you guys win?

Listen, you signed a contract.

And I'm not messing around with HGTV.

They will come and get you.

Yeah.

No.

We didn't tell anybody, and it was fun to watch it because you don't

know how they're going to edit it or cut it and show who you are.

They had this little thing where they called him nosy Nick because Nick

would go and ask the girls, Lucy and Daphne, next to us, if they had an

extra set of, I don't know, screws.

Oh, to see if he could see inside.

Yeah.

And they like-- of course, Nick is going to see and tell me like, oh my God, they

this really cool thing with the ceiling.

But Nick is not this like cheater or copycat.

But it was fun to lean into that.

Have that persona, nosy Nick, a it'd be like, went

over there to check it out.

Do you by chance know what the winners did with their money that they won?

What Martha and Alex did with their money?

I don't know what they did with it.

Interesting.

And then were you and Nick dreaming up what you would

do with the money if you won?

We probably were, buying a rental, finishing our house.

You know what I mean?

Right.

Something like you had some thoughts around it.

But I love, um, I think it's interesting what you said your takeaway was.

I think it's like most things in life is the real work actually

starts after you're complete.

With the show, what I heard was that you should have capitalized when

it was airing, hired someone in PR to get you out there while the show

was hot or while it was airing.

Right.

I thought that maybe HGTV would do that for us.

But you do remember their focus was the show, not Sarah and Nick necessarily.

So Sarah and Nick could have done more to get more opportunity during that time

and capitalize on our 15 minutes of fame.

And you need to remember too, I mean, this is before streaming was

big and people still had cable.

And a lot of people watch HGTV, obviously, but they don't necessarily hone in

on, oh, that couple, Sarah and Nick.

Right.

So if you have this opportunity, anyone out there right

now, just know that you are in charge of leveraging that opportunity

within your contractual agreement.

But we did a lot of fun stuff.

I love that.

No, that's such a great tip.

Actually, let's circle it back to-- we have a lot of our members, they're

going to have opportunities to be highlighted by people with super large

YouTube channels, people with large Instagram followings, TikTok followings.

You cannot just say, hey, I did my part.

You have got to help keep that flame alive.

I mean, obviously, they're going to do the work that they want to do.

They're going to offer you the deliverables promised.

Yes.

But you need to promote.

And I'm not saying it in a selfish way, but their goal is to promote themselves.

Yes, you're helping, but that is where-- and it goes with being on Airbnb or Vrbo.

You have to self-promote.

If you want the direct bookings, you have to promote it yourself if

you are on the show and you want to get some love after doing that PR.

But I think that's a HGTV hot tip there from Sarah.

We've got friends who have shows, and I've got friends who had

one season, and I've got friends who are, I mean, multiple seasons now.

And they had to put the work in too to make it catch fire.

Well, and I think, and hopefully we'll have, um, some of

these said friends on the show.

They've been on before, but specifically talk about this because I think the

show is still "a loss leader" for them.

It is them getting the real estate estate deals.

It's them getting the street cred from other things.

Because at the end of the day, the show itself is not supporting their

family with the earnings from it.

No.

I know you do make money, obviously, and whether or not-- let's say you do

get your own show and it is the Bob and Susie show, you might be getting

paid your first, like season one, and then as you continue on with seasons,

you get paid more and more for sure.

Reality shows, I don't know.

I didn't get paid.

Maybe someone else did.

Congratulations if you did.

I sure didn't.

Correct.

Again, you have to leverage.

And how many opportunities are there to be Chip and Joanna?

And again, I really believe if you read their books and their content,

they put a lot of work into taking that opportunity and helping it blow up.

This is why they have their own network now.

They did a lot of work.

They are smart marketers.

They made smart decision with their 15 minutes.

And also they had to meet up with opportunity.

The world had to love them too.

Absolutely.

All right.

This was fun, but I'm still sad you didn't win the money.

I'm not sad.

It looked good.

Okay.

And then my last question is, do you ever go back and watch any the episodes?

No.

Absolutely not.

No.

And actually, I say it looks good, but if anyone out there

is going to go look at it--

They all will, by the way.

I would make all different decisions.

I learned so much.

Forgive me for what I've--

Forgive me, for what I've done, the colors I chose and the decor I picked.

It's also almost a decade ago.

Almost a decade.

I'm telling you, when you have a camera person on you, and you have

someone breathing down your neck, and a budget, you make decisions that maybe

you're not proud off down the road.

What I mean it looks good, it looks much better than what it was,

and the quality of work was good.

Awesome.

Well, no, thanks for sharing, and anyone out there, if you are on a show,

getting ready to be on a show, or your show is going to air, let us know.

Email us.

We'd love to share your story especially if it's fresher.

Ours is a little dated, but we'd love to hear if we have any

listeners with their own experience.

So it would be wonderful to hear from you.

Thanks for sharing my story, Annette.

It was a definitely a highlight of my life.

It was a lot of fun, and I really appreciate the network for giving

Nick and I the opportunity.

So with that, I am Sarah Karakaian.

I'm Annette Grant, and together we are--

Thanks for visiting.