I've seen stacks of organizational products in people's garages and I'm like, oh my gosh.

With like nothing in them, right? Yeah, nothing in them.

I'm like, oh my gosh, don't do that.

Hidden clutter behind closed doors. I. E. Closets.

There's still a low grade stress that happens when you know there's trouble behind your closet doors.

The last thing you want to do when you're exhausted is make yet another decision. Think.

Women just have so much coming at them from a million different parts of their lives. And so I think overwhelm is what paralyzes them.

Welcome back to the iconic midlife, Megan.

Thank you. It's good to be here.

I'm so excited. Are you ready for a fun game?

Yes, I am.

Okay. This one is right up your alley. It's called organized or overthinking it. So basically I will give you a prompt and you tell me if it's a sign of organization. Organized. If you're overthinking it, like, don't think about it so much or if it's just straight up problematic.

So excited. This is right up my alley.

Okay. Color coded closets.

Wait, what was overthinking? Organized. Wait, what was my Organized.

Overthinking it.

Organized.

Okay. Organized.

We do.

We like that, right?

Oh, we love that.

Okay, so when we're doing color coding, are we doing it by section? Like you would do like dresses color coded, or are we doing like closet just color coded? Like, doesn't matter if it's like a dress or a top or how. What does that look like?

By category and then color code within that category. So like shirts, sweaters, pants, jeans, like all jackets, blazers, all by. But that section gets its own color code.

Okay. Okay.

Do you like all your jackets from like. Like, you wouldn't mix your jackets. Like, do all your denim together, do all your blazers together, do all your like raincoats together? But then within that mini section by.

Color, are we doing changeovers for seasons? Like, are we doing like a changeover for fall? Like, are we? Because I know some people actually, like, pack up their close and like move out. Like, and that does seem. I'm not going to lie, it seems a little overwhelming. But, you know, like, maybe that's a thing to do too. I don't know. What are your thoughts?

If you live somewhere where it's cold and then gets warm in la, there's no reason to do it because we had like 80 degree weather last week, so. And it's January, so I Feel like if you're living in la, don't do that. If you're living somewhere else where you have seasons and you're not going to wear a sundress in Michigan in January and you don't have a ton of space in your closet, definitely under the bed boxes. I did it in London when we lived there. I had under the bed boxes because our closets were so small. And I just packed up my summer dresses and put them under the bed.

Ah, so you are a fan of like, like, let's say at the Container Store or something. You can buy those storage sort of boxes and just pop them under, like a piece of furniture or something.

Yes, if you're changing. But if you're. If you're going to know that in the springtime, you're going to do the swap out, like, don't put it under there and forget it. But if you're going to do a swap, make sure, put it on your calendar or something that you're going to do the swap so you don't forget that you have, you know, 30 sundresses under your bed.

Okay, that's a good point. Okay. Keep keeping items because they were expensive.

Problematic. No, sell them.

So don't do it. So what if it's like, we bought this, like, gorgeous handbag? Like, let's say it's a Chanel bag. I'm just making something up. But it's been sitting in our closet. We. We haven't used it, but it was expensive, you know, so what do we do? What do we do?

Chanel you never get rid of. So keep the Chanel no matter what. So some. If they're really trendy, nice purses and you don't think they're going to come back in, then I would get rid of it. I did at one point have. I did an archive drawer in my closet, which was like a Gucci bag that was no longer in. Some things that I was like, oh, these jeans aren't that in, but they're like kind of classic. But right now people are into barrel jeans and not into this jean. I did have that in my old closet where I kept. That was a Kathy Douglas stylist who's amazing. That was her tip and it was great. And I put things so that I didn't get rid of them because I didn't want to just sell a Gucci purse to the real real for 20 cents. I wanted to keep it for my daughter down the road. So I would say with some of those, if you've Got an archive bin that you can do things that mean something to you that you don't want to actually get rid of or you want to give your d. Daughter down the road. But if it's just some trendy, ugly thing that you ended up spending a lot of money on and you don't like it, get rid of it, get rid of it.

Now what would you say for those? Maybe like they're the designer pieces, right, that we want to either resell, you know, like, would you say to go like the real, real route or like poshmark or like try to do it on our own? Like, what is the best solution that you've seen for that the most?

I think you'll get more money if you do like an ebay or a Poshmark and you're doing it yourself. But that's the hardest way to go. I, I use the real real. You really get nothing from them. Some of the bigger, nicer items. But again, if you've got a Chanel purse and you don't need to sell it, don't sell it. That's always going to gain value. Like there are items that I would say you've got an Hermes, whatever, don't sell it. But if you've got something that you're like, eh, I never really liked this and I'll get some money for it. What I do, I like stuff on the RealReal. If you just say, don't give me the money, give me a credit, they give you even more money back. Like they give you 10% or something. So I just have an account with them that accrues and then if I find something that I like down the road, I use that credit to buy myself something of someone else. So you can, you can build up credit with them, which I like. And then I end up getting a bag or something. So I think they're the easiest because you can just either they'll pick it up, you can drop it off, or they send you a mailing label. It just makes it really. I send them stuff all the time because it just makes it really easy.

Yeah, makes it so easy. You're right. Buying storage bins before you do the edit.

Don't do it unless you have a clear. Unless you're me and you've come in and, and measured and figured out the plan, don't do it because just figure the space out first. Do the edit first and then you will start to see. Because you also might start to see like I'm, I actually, we should actually have this in this closet and this should go here. So don't, don't pre buy because then you're going to have to return. And so many people don't return. They just let it stack up. I've seen stacks of organizational products in people's garages and I'm like, oh, gosh, you got that.

And with like nothing in them, right? Yeah, nothing in them.

Like, oh my gosh, don't do that. Go later, Go later.

Okay, Go later. Go after the edit, after you have come over and done.

Come over. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Okay.

Exactly.

Saving things for your kids who don't want them.

Oh, I don't know what the point would be though, if they don't want it. Although when their kids are not going to say they want it, I would still keep it because they might change as they get older because I've said, oh, I'm gonna save this for your babies. And like, my son roll his eyes. But, like, I'm sure, you know, down the road he will want that. So it depends on the kid's age. If you've got an adult, adult child who's like, I absolutely don't want that ugly desk or whatever you're saving that's been in our family for however long, don't save it. Like if they're just going to throw it away if you give it to them. So find someone that loves it instead. But I would wait until someone's. If you really want to hold onto it, I would wait until you've got a child that's not a child. Someone that's like in their 30s living a life as an adult and can make a better informed decision.

That totally makes sense. I think I might know the answer to this, but let's see what you say. Organizing once a year instead of maintaining systems.

Let me think. Maintaining systems. Don't let it build up. Totally.

You're like, do it every day.

Do it every day. It's like exercise. It's really like exercise. And it becomes a habit. It becomes a habit.

Maybe. You know what I was just thinking too? Maybe within that schedule which we were talking about on the last episode with you that we dropped on Tuesday with that schedule, maybe you build in like a 5 to 10 minute block where you're like, organize like. And that could look like anywhere in the house really. Maybe that's a daily or a weekly or something. You just kind of build in. Right?

Literally 15 minutes.

Yeah.

And then when the timer goes off, do not let yourself go over.

Oh, really? So cut it.

Don't stop you're done. Because then that'll keep you. Yeah. You don't want to burn yourself out. So you want to do those small and make sure you stop. Don't. But don't start a project that you can't finish in 15 minutes. So start with like a pen drawer and do that. And like weed out all your dead pens and then go to your next drawer. Do a junk drawer. Do just your blouses. Like small things, but start in one area and just methodically go. Don't like ping pong all over the house.

Okay. Like, stick to one, like location.

Yeah. Just like move slowly.

And there's nothing wrong with moving slowly. Right. There's nothing wrong with taking it.

Yeah. You'll actually get a better result if you take it slowly because you'll be more thoughtful.

Good point. No hidden clutter behind closed doors, I. E. Closets Problematic.

Yes. Not because it's, you know, I think people push it out of sight so they don't have to look at it. But I do think that there's still a low grade stress that happens when you know there's trouble behind your closet doors. Like, I think you dread getting dressed, you dread going in there, then you dread going in your bedroom. Like, that just compounds. And so I think people are always like, oh my gosh, I feel so much better having taken care of it. And I think people just let it build up and it becomes this like, skin scary things. So no, like every once in a while you need to shove things in your closet. You have people coming over last minute, whatever. You need to like, shove things away.

Great.

But on a regular basis, like, it just. It's not good for your mental health.

That's true. Like, everything should have a home or like a place. Right.

Otherwise you're just. It's too. The visual clutter adds to your mental load. And that's what you're trying to lighten.

Yes. So much of it. You know, we talk so much about the gut, brain health. But there's something I think that's so important with like, brain and like, like what we're talking about today, like this organizational sort of thing. Because it has so much of a bearing on like, how you feel about not only yourself, but about the world in general. You know, how you move about.

Yes. If I feel hurried and scrambled, I. The whole day is like. But if I start the day calm, I move through the world differently.

The heaviness is not there. Right.

Yeah. And then the, the scramble, the anxiety. You want to keep that down. We've Got enough. Just turn on the news. We have too much anxiety. Like, just take. Take that down for everyone.

Yes. Your home should not be, like, adding to that. You're right. Feeling guilty, throwing things away.

No, don't overthink that.

Just don't overthink that. Right. Yeah.

There should be no guilt.

There should be no guilt, right?

Zero guilt.

Because it's just an item. It's an inanimate object. It's not.

And 99 of the time, you will not miss it, nor will the person miss it. That if it's like, again, like, the artwork that has one line on it from a child, like, they're not going to miss it. You're not going to miss it. Don't even think twice about it. Just throw it away and move on.

Just throw it away. Okay. Trying to organize when you're already exhausted.

Don't do it.

Don't do it.

Start fresh the next day. Like, do. Yeah, don't. Because you're just going to make do, like, dumb things that don't require a lot of brain work. Like, you know, tidy up a little bit and then go to bed and start fresh. There's nothing worse than trying to do organizing when you're tired. It's just, you're going to make bad decisions and, like, life's too short. Like, it's not worth it. Do it a different day if you're not feeling up to it.

What do you think is the biggest struggle with women in midlife as it relates to, like, organization, and what is the best way to overcome it?

I think overwhelm is the biggest. I think women just have so much coming at them from a million different parts of their lives. And so I think overwhelm is what paralyzes them because it's just too much, and then the system sort of shuts down, and then it just clutter starts accumulating. And so I think if you can break things down into smaller bites, do those bigger lists, like I said. So it's a running master list so you don't have to remember everything in your head. Like, break things down into different pieces so that you don't get flooded with overwhelm, because I think that's the biggest problem. Plus, you know, perimenopause, menopause, like, we're tired. Hormonal shifts, memory loss. We're not sleeping. By the way, your podcast on sleeping was so helpful. Oh, thank you.

Glad you liked it.

The breathing thing. I'm now. Oh, my God, The. The four, seven, eight. Breathing. I like a new I'm a changed person. So. Yeah, but we're not sleeping. You know, it's like, we're like. Everyone I talk to is like, oh, I woke up at 3. I woke up at this. Like, we're not sleeping. So that's also contributing to it. And everyone needs something from us at all times. Right. Even the dog needs something, your partner needs something, your kid needs something. Like, it's just too much. And so I think that that becomes, like, almost a rebellion of, like, I'm not even gonna touch that. And then it just becomes this major mess. Yes.

And as you were saying in the. In the last episode when we were talking, this decision overload is like. Is real, you know, like, the last thing you want to do when you're exhausted is make.

Yes.

Yet another decision. You know, and our. Our nervous systems are already fried with all of these biological changes and, like, you know, emotional changes and mental. So, like, that.

You're right.

That's like, the last thing you want to add onto your plate, you know? Yep.

We got to be taking things off our plate.

Yes. Well, no doubt. If somebody hires you and has them come into your house, you'll be taking lots of things off their plate.

I'm like, let me take it off your plate. Take it off.

Totally. Totally.

Yeah.

And for those who are interested in booking with you, please tell everybody where they can find you. You guys have to check out her Instagram page, by the way, because it will bring you joy. It is just, like, so organized, so clean. It gives you, like, a sense of peace.

Yes. My whole feed is just organization. It just makes. You can find me@megankasman.com. just my name, and then Megan. Megan Kessman is my email. And then you can find me at Megan Kessman home on Instagram. So those are the three places to find me.

Yes. You guys definitely check Megan out. And by the way you spell your name. A different. Like, it's different Megan.

So it's M, E, a G, H, A, N. Yes.

Yes. Be sure you spell it correctly, everybody, because you will definitely want to go check her out. It's amaz. So much fun chatting with you. Also, please check her other episode that we dropped on Tuesday, because we talk about all the things, the mental load, the or. She gives the best organizational tips for us, especially in this, like, sandwich generation and in midlife. We're taking care of elderly parents. We have kids, we have home offices. We've got all these think partners. Oh, my gosh. Just a swirl of things going on. So you gave really great, actionable things that we could do to help organize our lives, which I totally appreciate and I love. And if this episode resonated, please, like, follow rate and comment wherever you're listening to this podcast. Or do the same on YouTube and be sure to subscribe there so you don't miss a great next episode. Thank you so much for listening watching, and I thank you so much, Megan, because I'm just so glad you were here and you gave us all these great tips, and I can't wait to see what's next with you.

Thank you. It was so fun to be on this. I'm so honored to have been asked. So thank you for having me. Roxy, I love your podcast. I love to see everything you've done over the years. You do it all, so it's so fun to watch you. So thank you.