Speaker 1 00:00:05 Hey there, thoughtful listener. Are you looking for introductions to partners, investors, influencers and clients? Well, I've had private conversations with over 2000 leaders asking them where their best business comes from. I've got a free video you can watch with no opt in required, where I'll share the exact steps necessary to be 100% inbound in your industry over the next 6 to 8 months, with no spam, no ads, and no sales. What I teach has worked for me for over 15 years, and has helped me create eight figures in revenue for my own companies. Just head to up my influence. Com and watch my free class on how to create endless high ticket sales appointments. Also, don't forget the thoughtful entrepreneur is always looking for great guests. Go to up my influence. Com and click on podcast. I'd love to have you. With us right now it is Nick Smith. Nick, you are the CEO and founder of sales. Sales is on the web@sales.com. Nick, great to have you.

Speaker 2 00:01:17 Thanks so much Josh.

Speaker 2 00:01:18 Glad to be here.

Speaker 1 00:01:20 Yeah. Well give us an overview of what sales is.

Speaker 2 00:01:23 Sales was the first company to develop autonomous prospecting for account executives. So for enterprises our sale bots are truly autonomous to do every step of prospecting hands free. They find companies, they enrich data and find decision makers. Of course they generate content and send emails outbound, but they go a lot further. They read, react, propose meetings, follow up and even qualify leads all completely hands free and unique to the personality of the AI they represent.

Speaker 1 00:01:57 if you're the recipient of that, how do you feel.

Speaker 2 00:02:01 If I'm the recipient of an email from a sailboat, I have a better experience because, what I say goes, I'm directing it. I'm not just getting repetitive emails. If I say I'm not interested, the sailboat actually consumes data. It reads emails so it knows and removes me. If I say, oh, you need to be in touch with Michael, who handles XYZ, the sailboat is going to thank me and find Michael.

Speaker 2 00:02:25 and if I say please meet with me next Wednesday, the sailboat is going to qualify that and deliver it to a human.

Speaker 1 00:02:32 so, Nick, I, I think I see like when I look at what sales is, I think most of us probably look at this as just kind of an inevitability when it comes to lead generation. Like, obviously this needs to happen because we have the technology. so what? So I'm just curious about like, how this is going to impact The future of prospecting. If sales and an infinite number of knock offs are now going to be engaging in this sort of behaviour.

Speaker 2 00:03:06 Yeah, Josh, it's a very smart question and something we spend a lot of time thinking about. You know, to answer it, I would just say we think about the best of prospecting and the worst of prospecting, the worst of prospecting. First of all, it doesn't work anymore. It's mass outreach from agents that everyone on the team is sharing. It's high volume, repetitive emails. It's dirty data, and it's not genuine.

Speaker 2 00:03:31 That's the worst of prospecting. The best part of prospecting is finding someone that you have a solution for. And you're able to do that because you're a human that's an expert that's spent a lot of time in your field. That's why sailboats are unique to people. They represent you. And so from a practical standpoint, we're going against the grain. Less emails means more success. It means more targeted approaches, and it means you're really being solution driven and mindful. Now, the benefit to our customers is they don't have to use their hands. They're not writing emails, they're not sending them and they're not following up manually. but the benefit to our customers is not mass outreach because it doesn't work anymore. Does that answer the question?

Speaker 1 00:04:14 Yeah. And so and I appreciate the nuance. Can you maybe further define what I mean. Because again, it sounds like higher touch is the goal here. again it's being automated. So and listen I'll just start with my bias here. Right. Because I would feel like, you know, again, I would feel manipulated if it were presented as a human.

Speaker 1 00:04:40 Whereas I feel like if, if, if, if and again, part of my concern here. And so I appreciate our conversation. So I think you can address these other concerns that other people have. I just look at, you know, my own behavior on LinkedIn DMs, for example, I look at my own behavior as an executive, you know, or as a leader with email accounts. And, I just have to be so protective of my time that, you know, it just up goes more and more and more walls and guardrails to protect my attention. So if I'm doing that and I, you know, the feedback I've gotten is that there are a lot more of doing it. So pardon my question. No, no, no.

Speaker 2 00:05:25 It's a hard.

Speaker 1 00:05:27 And maybe unfair question to ask you. So for forgive me. but to me it feels like, you know, it's like we're we're still trying to squeeze, you know, blood from a turnip. No. What's the expression? Something from a rock or something like this.

Speaker 1 00:05:39 Like we're squeezing so hard and there's just not much left. There is kind of my biased, you know, question.

Speaker 2 00:05:47 I don't think you're off base at all. And believe it or not, I'm right there with you. let me say it this way first help is on the way. Because most of these companies I think you're referring to aren't making it in your inbox. And I know we all spend 90s, hopefully not longer deleting irrelevant emails every day. And the thought is, if everyone has one of these agents, you know, Sheryl or Jessica or whoever the agent is, aren't we all going to be bombarded? And that's why I say help is on the way, because those folks aren't even making it into the inbox. We know that the difference is being unique to the human. And so to draw contrast for you here, a sailboat is not a seat on a platform. It's not something you sign up, subscribe to that just automates tasks. Automating tasks is table stakes. And in 2024, the sailboat doesn't exist until the account executive on boards.

Speaker 2 00:06:40 And it's unique to their personality, their approach, their market, their persona, everything that's unique about them, the sailboat does on their behalf in a bespoke, bespoke small batch way. You raise an important point because you said, well, hey, isn't it automation? So isn't it still about volume at some level? And the answer to that is no. It used to be, and it still is for some. But it's about that being everywhere, uniquely, simultaneously and intelligently. So to say it another way, it's not about doing 200 things. It's about being in two places at once, dynamically and uniquely. And so I.

Speaker 1 00:07:18 Mean, yes.

Speaker 2 00:07:19 Maybe just to bring it home real quick. Sorry, Josh, but, you know, real quick, if all of these others are saying volume is the key volume, volume, we all know because we've done this a long time, it's not the answer. They're going to be quarantined in the spam folder. The email service providers have a responsibility to their customers to not let that through.

Speaker 2 00:07:38 It's going to get harder. And what will remain is authentic AI, authentic, real approaches like the one we're using.

Speaker 1 00:07:46 Okay. So, yeah, I mean, I guess, you know, again, the counter to that might be. Well, if that frees me up to do, I mean, obviously that I so it's I guess it's either then a business has fewer E's or, you know, an E is just simply going to be in more places at once. And again, if everyone's able to do that, sorry. And again, we're, we're, we're we're doing futurism right now and I apologize. That's not fair to you. I'm asking you to defend maybe a larger trend. That is not what you're here for. So do I just want to acknowledge Nick? Forgive me. We're going to move on here, but I just want to I want to clear the table, hopefully so that at least we can get people to listen, lean forward and listen.

Speaker 2 00:08:28 Yeah, absolutely. And I would just say to that, Josh, you know, where you start.

Speaker 2 00:08:32 I think you start to go with that. It's absolutely about the I, it's about the person and their approach. So yes, giving them time back is one of the values. But I would just also say most days today are doing a lot of robot tasks and they should be doing human worthy activities.

Speaker 3 00:08:50 Yeah. All right.

Speaker 1 00:08:51 Well we'll see. Okay. So all of that said Nick. tell me a little bit more about, how this platform works or you know, particularly what I'm curious about, right, is how can we leverage platforms like sales, so that we are, using it with best practices, not, you know, again, what I think a lazy sales person or a lazy marketer want to do. we want to help them avoid that because that's not going to be good for anybody. so what are our best practices?

Speaker 2 00:09:29 Well, this brings me to what I think is an emerging trend as well, not too distant from the other point you're making. And that is using demand generation tools as a proxy for product market fit.

Speaker 2 00:09:42 What we've seen is a lot of companies don't have the product market fit they think they have, and they're trying to put a Band-Aid on that. With more leads, more volume, more opportunities, more channels. that is not the best practice for a sailboat. Yes. A sailboat will generate world class, you know, sort of the gold standard and actionable revenue opportunities. But the other thing that it will generate is insights and learnings. And so the best practice is to start where you are today. What do you know about your market? What do you know about the small sample size or potentially large sample size you've already engaged with? And how do you channel that into a sailboat that's doing work on your behalf? That's a point one. But point two is you'll see opportunities from that, but you'll also realize what's working. And so the best, best practice, I think, for use of a sailboat is doubling down on what's working best. And the sailboat will actually do that on its own. So it's about it's not just about this world of prospecting and exploring.

Speaker 2 00:10:41 Hey, who's going to engage with me? It's about exploring what works and then exploiting it and doing less, but more of the right type of activities.

Speaker 1 00:10:51 Yeah. so what would be some examples of of how that tone sounds? What are the I mean, what is the outreach? What what is what are the qualifiers like, how are we and forgive me, I, you know, artificially building a human connection.

Speaker 2 00:11:10 Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:11:10 So and I know artificial is a loaded term. That's AI we're talking about. So it is it's not. And again, it's it's an out. And I get what you're saying. Right. It's it's an extension of how I have preprogrammed it. So I'm very, very bullish on AI for lots of reasons. And yeah sorry for my continued. You know, just bias on the whole thing. But I'm loving this conversation. Thank you. Because you're challenging me.

Speaker 2 00:11:38 Well, Josh, I would just say that again, when you ask about tone, you ask about the approach that there's a very, very little standardization.

Speaker 2 00:11:45 Here is what I would say. And so what we're not doing is taking Josh and trying to whittle him down to some denominator of everyone's using this tool, and this is how you do it. You are you for a reason and your approach no one else can do. And so the sail bot knows that knows you, learns from you, and acts on your behalf. So the tone is unique to you. You know, for example, I think some things that come up here are, what's an example? Maybe something like email links or a word count or something like that. Okay. So if it was, you know, 2019 or something, we might have a best practices for how long your emails should be. We have nothing to say about that. Josh's email, Josh's approach where Josh starts in the org chart, who Josh wants to spend his time talking to is unique to Josh. In my opinion. The AI should be able to account for that and work actually on your behalf. And so these are not loaded terms I say or phrases when I say the sailboat doesn't exist till you onboard.

Speaker 2 00:12:51 It actually doesn't. It truly is unique to you, and you may not want it to do something that your colleague would. If a group of 40 salespeople, all selling the same product, want to join a want to have sailboats. All 40 of those sailboats are unique, even if the product is the same.

Speaker 1 00:13:11 so.

Speaker 2 00:13:11 You have some bias, but that has to run. Yeah, yeah. What you're saying, right.

Speaker 1 00:13:15 Yeah, yeah. So are you. So, you know, in the outreach or the communication are would you acknowledge hey, this isn't Josh, this is Josh's virtual Josh or or do you or do you say, hey, this is Josh.

Speaker 2 00:13:31 Sent from my personal. I sent from my sailboat, that sort of thing. Absolutely. There's sailboats today that do that in their outreach and approach. Ultimately say that's the customer's decision.

Speaker 1 00:13:43 Yeah. Okay. Well, okay.

Speaker 2 00:13:46 Sounds like you would say this is my personal I.

Speaker 1 00:13:49 Yeah. So tell me a bit about, like who you've worked with and kind of what you've seen, in terms of, maybe kind of a before and after.

Speaker 2 00:14:01 Yeah. Great question. So when I look at, you know, this period of 2010 to 2020 was all about how many tools, point solutions, databases, platforms can we add onto our team to make prospecting or sales a little bit easier or softer? and it got so big this construct around sales teams. But we work with large enterprises that have a lot of real, authentic career salespeople, and maybe they never subscribe to the SDR function to begin with. Or maybe they had some of those point solutions, but, never had 12 or 18 or something like that. What we see is pairing sailboats with those ease provides immediate value. There's value and automation, and the time they get back, there's value in task savings and the the sort of cost per task or low cost per task model we pioneered a couple of years ago. but the intelligence is the value they get beyond just closed deals. And so of course, we've seen seven figure returns just from closed deals on a five figure investment. but what we've noticed most often is the learnings they get from the sale bot drive the business further.

Speaker 2 00:15:16 And so a quick story is, you know, if ten sales reps onboard and use the AI, those sailboats are all unique to the ten. And that means they're all going to perform differently. Right? But the learnings from what's working is what's really valuable to the customer and driving that future engagement. So there's been a lot of ROI from return and close deals. There's a lot of ROI from automation, tax savings, data savings, but the ROI that's harder to put a dollar amount on and I think is larger as the intelligence and what it learns.

Speaker 1 00:15:51 Yeah. You so for sales, now sales has been around for over 66.5 years getting on. is this where you started or has sales evolved?

Speaker 2 00:16:03 Well, I started the company after a long career in sales and sales leadership, but enterprise is selling to others. but, yes.

Speaker 1 00:16:10 You have a background in radio. Look at you. CBS, iHeart. Love it.

Speaker 2 00:16:16 Right. So the company was very much something I thought of based on my own career.

Speaker 2 00:16:22 And we certainly launched pre this gen AI boom and all of that. And the first AI model we had was one that we trained ourselves on organic sales data. But this was always where we planted our tree in autopilot or autonomous prospecting for sales. So it's just been an evolution. And certainly as the technology has gotten better, the company has and our technology has as well. But this was the original vision.

Speaker 1 00:16:47 Yeah. I can't imagine, particularly in the last year and a half, I would imagine there's been quite a bit of evolution. Are you, you know, behind. You know, there's always kind of like that AI engine behind the scenes. Did you did you change how what sales is, is built upon?

Speaker 2 00:17:08 We we did. So, we didn't just change. We also evolved. So the patent and sale bot and the sale bot model are still the core. but surrounding it are dozens of proprietary AI models that have been trained based on our own data, not based on synthetic data.

Speaker 2 00:17:25 So what's really interesting is because the sailboats consume so much, the ability to to produce those. So it's advanced.

Speaker 1 00:17:33 Great. so the website is sales.com s a I l e s.com. and so pricing. Do you mind maybe talking about like pricing engagement. Like who. This is an appropriate platform for who. You know, just in terms of like what engagement looks like, what investment generally looks like.

Speaker 2 00:17:53 Yeah. So what I would say is we work with a wide variety of businesses. We're certainly, sector or industry agnostic. and I think everyone probably says that, but but we truly are in terms of pricing, it's really dependent on the number of sailboats. but there's a couple of pricing models and approaches we use. What I would say broadly, Josh, is that we align with the customers goals. Some customers are very intelligence driven, some are very revenue driven, some are. We need to multiply our team driven or task efficiency driven. So we align with their goals and the pricing model follows.

Speaker 2 00:18:29 but you know, without going into specific pricing, that's probably the best way I can answer it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:18:35 But I think it's fair to say this is not, you know, some someone, some baby brand new entrepreneur might be looking for like a $49 a month solution. This ain't that.

Speaker 2 00:18:45 I would say that this is not that. But what this is, is much, much more cost effective than even 4 to 6 platforms surrounding your team.

Speaker 3 00:18:55 Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:18:56 nic next steps for our friend. That's listening. Like what. Where do they go. Like if they want to see demos of this or they, they, they want to experience this a little bit more like what do you typically recommend for their due diligence or kind of research phase, assuming that this might be the first introduction to your platform. Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:19:13 Well, first of all, let me say if someone's listening in their in the sales profession, I'd love to talk. Feel free to always reach out to me on LinkedIn. Nick Smith and then if you want to learn more about sales or sailboats, certainly go to the website sales.com and request a demo.

Speaker 2 00:19:29 our sales team would love to talk about their own experiences using sailboats, and this is what we built the company on. and yeah, we'd love to to have conversations with anyone that's interested and brings their business challenges.

Speaker 3 00:19:43 Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:19:43 Again, sales.com. There is a button right there where you can request a demo. Nick Smith thanks for enduring me.

Speaker 2 00:19:51 My friend Josh, I loved it. I hope we can do.

Speaker 1 00:19:53 It again soon. and you know, again, I think it's just kind of an inevitability at this point. So, this is another one of those situations where, you know, companies need to decide, you know, which of these AI tools they're going to use, how they're going to use them. You know, what aligns with, you know, what they how they show up. but then also recognizing that the rest of the market is, you know, there's going to be a lot of folks that are going to jump on, you know, all of these latest evolutions. So fascinating conversation.

Speaker 1 00:20:26 Nick Smith, founder of Sales, thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 2 00:20:29 Thanks, Josh. Take care.

Speaker 1 00:20:37 Thanks for listening to The Thoughtful Entrepreneur Show. If you are a thoughtful business owner or professional who would like to be on this daily program, please visit up my influence. Com and click on podcast. We believe that every person has a message that can positively impact the world. We love our community who listens and shares our program every day. Together we are empowering one another as thoughtful leaders. And as I mentioned at the beginning of this program, if you're looking for introductions to partners, investors, influencers, and clients, I have had private conversations with over 2000 leaders asking them where their best business comes from. I've got a free video that you can watch right now with no opt in or email required, where I'm going to share the exact steps necessary to be 100% inbound in your industry over the next 6 to 8 months, with no spam, no ads, and no sales. What I teach has worked for me for more than 15 years and has helped me create eight figures in revenue for my own companies.

Speaker 1 00:21:42 Just head to up my influence. Com and watch my free class on how to create endless high ticket sales appointments. Make sure to hit subscribe so that tomorrow morning. That's right, seven days a week you are going to be inspired and motivated to succeed. I promise to bring positivity and inspiration to you for around 15 minutes every single day. Thanks for listening and thank you for being a part of the Thoughtful Entrepreneur movement.