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Good evening and welcome to Crowd Church. It's great to be here tonight. I am

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joined by Dave Connolly.

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Hi, Johan, how are you doing?

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Good. Have you had a good week?

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I have a lovely week, really enjoying the weather and, um, yeah, just plenty of

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time to do whatever it is I needed to do.

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Yeah, it's been nice to have a week of sunshine, although it seems like it's

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about to end. Oh no, I know, I know, the weather's looking a bit— and we always

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talk about the weather here, it's not a weather forecast. Um, but yeah, it is

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about to take a turn for the worst, I believe. But you know, for anyone who's

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outside of the northwest of England, um, you know, it's quite rare to get a

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really hot week, isn't it? So we get excited about these things. Enjoy it. Yeah,

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exactly. Well, we could chit-chat about the weather in our weeks, and you know,

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we were just talking about North Wales. Actually, interesting fact for everyone,

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that brings me into introducing our Speaker tonight, Aidan, a second, is that

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I've been in North Wales for the weekend, um, I've been on holiday for a few

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days with my family, and, um, we actually met in real life earlier today, Aidan

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and I and his wife Sonia and my family. And yeah, it was the first time we'd met

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in person rather than just over Crowd Church. So it's like, wow, Crowd Church

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friends becoming in real life friends.

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So yeah, really seeing each other.

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Yeah, so that this is, this is like, yeah It's exciting. So I'm going to pass

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over to Ade now, and yeah, my officially in real life friend now, but he's doing

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the talk for us tonight. And so yeah, Ade, I'll pass over to you. I think we

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don't have sound. We'll just give that a second. Ah, we have him. Okay, passing

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over to you again, Ade.

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Got stuck in the green room again. That's local insiders, the techies in the

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background. So yes, it was wonderful to meet you in person. And yeah, we're

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slowly building up a list of people we're meeting who come from Liverpool and

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spend some time in North Wales, where let's face it, it is just beautiful here.

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Yeah.

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We're so lucky to be here. But tonight we're not going to talk about North

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Wales. Well, let's leave that for conversation straight. Tonight we are going to

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talk about success. Now, when I started preparing this, the working title I had

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was The Price of Success, but by the time I got to the end of it, it was really

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The Purpose of Success. And so let me just take a moment to think about the

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typical definition, the dictionary definition of success. We get phrases like

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accomplishment of goals, attainment of wealth, prosperity, favorable outcome of

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ventures. Now, from a societal point of view and culturally, we tend to

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associate success either directly or indirectly with wealth. Yeah, typically the

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rich and the famous. And when it comes to wealth, the UK bank, the HSBC, did a

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survey in 2024 to just get a feel for what do people think wealthy was? And the

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number they came up with was £213,000 a year for an income. Now, this is 5.5

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times our national average. If you look at stats, you find 4% of this country

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earn over £100,000, 1% over £207,000. So we're getting into the fraction of a

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percentage is what we design. We, um, have categorized wealthy as what we would

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see success in wealth as. Now, success comes at a price. If you think about it

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from a career point of view or a sporting point of view or pretty much any

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venture, there's higher stress. The higher you climb, the higher the stress, the

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greater the expectations, the more time you're taken away from family and

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friends. And this in itself almost leads to increased isolation and in some

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cases burnout. And we think, okay, well, people who are really, really wealthy

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and successful, they don't worry about this, you know, these financial stresses

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that the rest of us do. Well, actually, studies have shown that the really

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wealthy actually really worry about losing their wealth. They worry about losing

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their standing, their perception. They also worry about their friends really

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just after them for their money and not for who they are. So, excuse me, we are

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going to have a look at a particularly successful individual in the Book of

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Luke, a guy called Zacchaeus, who was a tax collector. Now, it's quite a short

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passage. It's Luke 19:1-10. So if I can stop coughing, I am going to read this.

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Well, actually, apologies, I'm going to read this anyway. So starting at verse

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1: Jesus entered Jericho and made his way through the town. There was a man

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there named Zacchaeus. He was the chief tax collector in the region, and he had

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become very rich. He tried to get a look at Jesus, but he was too short to see

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over the crowd, so he ran ahead and climbed a sycamore fig tree beside the the

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road, for Jesus was going to pass that way. When Jesus came by, he looked up at

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Zacchaeus and called him by name. "Zacchaeus," he said, "come down. I must be a

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guest in your home today." Zacchaeus quickly climbed down and took Jesus to his

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house in great excitement and joy. But the people were displeased. "He has gone

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to be the guest of a notorious sinner," they grumbled. Meanwhile, Zacchaeus

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stood before the Lord and said to him, "I will give half my wealth to the poor,

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Lord, and if I've cheated people on their taxes, I will give them back 4 times

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as much." Jesus responded, "Salvation has come to this home today, for this man

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has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham. For the Son of Man came to seek

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and save those who are lost." So just to set the scene here, Jericho was a very

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desirable place to live. It was a prime toll center for the region. It was known

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as the city of palm trees. It was incredibly rich. It's also a very powerful and

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strategic city. It was a major exporter of balsa wood. There were abundant

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springs. There were fertile lands. This was an agricultural hub and trade

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center. This was not a backwater town. This was the place to be.

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Be.

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And being at the top of his game as a tax collector here rather than some

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backwater town, that made him a big fish in a big sea. Now, Zacchaeus, we don't

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know too much from that passage, but we do know that first of all, his name

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means pure. He is a man of small stature, and he is a chief tax collector. Now,

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this would have presented him a number of problems with his fellow Jews. For a

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start, he was a Jew working for Romans, so he was working for the oppressor. He

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would have been considered an outcast. In fact, he would have been considered

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ritually unclean. His tithes would not have been accepted in the temple. In

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fact, he wasn't allowed to partake in any of their rituals. And on top of that,

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he would have also been disdained for overtaxing people, because the Roman

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system of taxes were the Roman wanted— Romans wanted a certain amount of tax,

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and this would have been based on initially the land you own, the business you

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conducted, the number of people in your family. And they had a number, no one

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else knew what it was, but the tax collectors were allowed to add whatever they

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wanted on top of that, so, you know, to keep them going. And they notoriously

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added a lot of money onto that. They extorted the people. Now, they had, you

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know, Roman soldiers there to enforce these taxes, so the people really had no

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choice but to pay and be extorted. So he'd been hated for that as well. So he's

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most— on one hand, he's one of the most prominent men in Jericho. Now, we assume

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that he's really good at his job because he's a chief tax collector, not just a

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tax collector. We can also assume the guy is middle-aged or older because it

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would have taken him time to get here. But this is a guy who who is— we'll say

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he's on par with today's millionaire. He's someone who's made it. He's rich in

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wealth, however he is poor in status, and, uh, he did not belong. He was— he

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would have been incredibly lonely. So he has this amazing encounter with Jesus.

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So for a start, despite his wealth, something drives him to go out there and see

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Jesus as he's passing through. So, assuming he's got it all, he doesn't really,

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and he also wasn't going to be held back by the crowd or being small in stature.

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So he climbs a tree, and we, we assume that was probably the most efficient

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course of action. He could have tried to push through the crowd, but let's face

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it, he was a really unpopular guy and he's physically very small. By the time he

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got to the front, Jesus would probably have passed by. He's rich, he could have

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tried to bribe, but again, that probably would have taken too long. So this guy,

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who's likely middle-aged or older, and he's wearing a robe, he does a desk job

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for a living, he climbs a tree. So, you know, that's something we can assume he

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does not do very often, but, you know, he was that driven to go and get a

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glimpse of Jesus, he climbed a tree. Now we don't know if he was really thinking

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through and aware of the type of tree he was climbing, but in Jewish culture,

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sycamore fig tree is known as the sin-spreading tree due to its dense canopy.

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The idea is any sin committed underneath it actually can pass to all people on

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the tree. Now, if you have a whole row of these things and they're all

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overlapping, it can pass to anyone who's under any of these trees. In fact, they

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were always about keeping these things within your boundary. Either way, he saw

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he had a problem, he saw a solution, and he acted straight away. Again, these

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are one of the reasons probably why he was good at his job. You know, being a

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motivated problem solver is an important ingredient in a successful career. And

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then comes the encounter. Jesus walks by and he instantly calls, and right away,

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Zakias answers. He doesn't hang around. He doesn't get swayed by the comments of

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the crowd. And ultimately, he, you know, he is open to hearing the harsh truth

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and reality that he is a sinner. But he doesn't waste time here. He jumps again,

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not wasting time, being time efficient, another important trait of being a

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successful person. And then after having spent this one short time period with

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Jesus, he gives away half his possessions. Now, Jesus did not ask him to do

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that. He just, off his own bat, recognized he was a sinner, recognized he needed

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to make changes, and said, look, I'm giving away half my possessions, and anyone

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I've cheated, I will repay them back fourfold. Now, interestingly, he also, as

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far as we know from this, he also remained in his successful job. He wasn't

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asked to leave it, and he didn't feel convicted to leave it. So he's still a Jew

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working for the Romans. As I said, Jesus did not tell him to leave it, but you

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know, we obviously would assume going forward that he would have taxed people

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fairly, and given his position in that system, you know, maybe he had the

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opportunity to change the system for more people. But the crucial point here is

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his success now benefits people other than himself. They benefit the community,

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for the people who he'd given half his possessions to, for the people who he had

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repaid, for the people who going forward he would have taxed at a more

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reasonable rate, and possibly for any positive changes he brought to that system

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in Jericho. So honest success, is not unbiblical. I mean by that, by honest,

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fair work for a fair reward. And Jesus talks about this in Matthew 25, the

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parable of the talents, where a master gives 5 talents to one worker, 2 talents

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to another, and 1 to a third worker. The master then goes away for a period of

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time and comes back, and the gentleman who had 5 has invested, worked hard, and

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made another 5. And the same with the one who had 2, he then made another 2. And

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they were rewarded, you know, well done, good and faithful servant. Now the guy

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who's given one chose to do nothing with it. He didn't even put it in the bank

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for interest, and he's cast into darkness, and his talent is given to the one

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who did well with five. So we can see from this that hard work resulting in

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success is rewarded, not punished. We can also see from this that some of us

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will be given more opportunities than others for success. And it doesn't stop

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here. Paul, in his letter to the Ephesians, says in 4:28, "Let the thief no

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longer steal, but rather let him labor doing honest work with his own hands so

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that he may have something to share with anyone in need." So the results of the

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work aren't just for the worker, they are to be shared where it is needed. And

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this practice goes all the way back to Leviticus in chapter 9, verses 9 to 10:

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When you reap the harvest of your land, you shall not reap your field right up

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to its edge, neither shall you gather the gleanings after your harvest. And you

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shall not strip your vineyard bare, neither shall you gather fallen grapes of

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your vineyard. You shall leave them for the poor and for the sojourner. I am the

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Lord your God. So what we can see here is the honest success is a biblical

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principle, hard work being rewarded. It is not just for us, we are the steward

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of its benefits and we are to use it to help others who need help. And some of

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us will have more opportunities for success than others. It really means they

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will have more opportunities to bless and support others. So taking these ideas

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and looking inward, are we searching with vigor like Zacchaeus was? And Jesus

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isn't walking down the main street of our respective towns and villages here is:

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are we reading Scripture daily? Are we praying daily? Are we meeting with other

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believers? Are we overcoming obstacles to these things, or are we just making

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excuses? And then, are we answering immediately? And that can be, you know,

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prompting from the Holy Spirit, you know, are we listening for that? But also

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Biblical instruction— there are plenty of very simple guidelines that we are

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told to do. Are we answering those? 1 John 3:17: If anyone has material

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possessions and sees a brother or sister in need but has no pity on them, how

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can the love of God be in that person? And finally, are we acting with love? Are

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we sharing that success where we have it, the benefits of that success? And that

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doesn't actually have to be only financial, it can be some of the skills that we

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have built up as well. Are we using those to serve those in our church, in our

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community around us? Our community here is really central. We are not meant to

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be alone. We are not meant to be successful alone. Hebrews 10:25, not neglecting

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to meet together, as is the habit of some. But encouraging one another. And

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that's our role in this. We are here to encourage one another as we, as we wait

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on God, as we study his word. And that is where I would like to bring this to a

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close tonight. Thank you.

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Great, thanks so much, Ade. That is, um, Just so much in there. Really great.

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Um, what did you think, Dave? Any immediate things that jump out?

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Yeah, I, I just love the story. I love the delivery, uh, you know, the things

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you brought out there. And, um, I think the thing that always stands out just

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about— here's a guy who's got everything but no one to share it with, and he—

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but he knows he's lacking something. And yet, um, you know, he climbs the tree

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almost still hidden, but Jesus is coming along. He's going somewhere, and Jesus

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stops and calls him by name. And I just think there's something wonderful

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whenever Jesus stops and there's a beginning of a conversation. He calls him by

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name. Just amazing.

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Because there's something about Jesus's presence, isn't there? And when he, when

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he encounters Zacchaeus, that it actually changed— like, his response is so

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counterculture. Like, he completely does a 360— well, a 180, not 360, that would

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be the same direction. Um, a 180. Maths was never my strong point. Um, he does

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complete 180 though, doesn't he? Like, in terms of where he was on money and

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wealth and success. And actually, when he comes into the presence of Jesus, he's

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like— it's not that Jesus tells him, but he's instantly— I find it really

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interesting that he's instantly convicted.

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Yeah.

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And he feels it necessary to give half his money away and to repay all those

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that he'd swindled, and to change his ways and to be more generous and honest

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with money. To use his wealth to sort of benefit many, not just himself. And I,

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I think, isn't that interesting, that, that it's just that sheer encounter of

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being in Jesus's presence? Jesus hadn't told him to do that. No one's said, oh,

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you're really bad, you're, you're living like this. It's just the very coming

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face to face with who Jesus is changes him. I find that incredible.

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We see it repeatedly, don't we, in all these stories that we get in the gospels,

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you know. Um, but it's the counterculture Jesus, isn't it? Oh, Jesus the

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revolutionary, eh? And, um, you know, um, he— everybody hates Zacchaeus. They

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despise him, you know, even though he's got everything. They just despise him.

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And yet Jesus, he's the one that Jesus wants to talk to. And he says to him,

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Again, I find it's really moving. Jesus says to him, come down because I'm

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coming to your house. That's the last place anybody wants to go to. Yeah, to

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that level of association, you know. And, and then, you know, we see what

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happens. I, I'm so thankful that we don't know what the conversation was between

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Jesus and Zacchaeus. Otherwise, men being men, or mankind being mankind, humans

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being humans, we would have made a programme out of it, but we don't hear, but

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we see the fruits of repentance, which Aidé brought out wonderfully.

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Mm. Yeah, absolutely. And I loved— the other bit that I really loved about what

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Aidé shared was just this whole idea that when we work and what we earn and what

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we create with our hands and, you know, everything that we have, all this

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success, all the money that we earn, is for sharing, and it's not just for our

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own benefit, but it's for the benefit of wider community. And I love that. And

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you see it so often with, like, you know, business people who are Christian,

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where they, you know, not, not just Christians, but often Christians are

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particularly good at it, give a lot of their money away. And actually, um, yeah,

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just that real challenge that's there in the Bible quite a lot about, um,

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sharing with those in need. And it's so counterculture to what we often see in

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the world, right? We see these I don't want to pick on anyone, but these Elon

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Musks or Kardashian-type characters that are on TV screens, you know, the big

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tech bros in America. And you just think they are not benefiting everyone with

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their wealth. They're benefiting, well, mainly themselves and a few people who

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work for them right at the top. And we do live in a world, don't we, today where

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the richer are getting richer, like, and that gap between the richest and

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poorest is actually getting bigger in a lot of our societies.

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Yeah.

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Smaller. And, um, yeah, and I just think it's so— it is so counterculture. Jesus

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is a revolutionary. What he teaches here and what he demonstrates is so

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counterculture to what we see about very successful rich people today. And, you

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know, it's easy to sit and criticize people, isn't it? Because I don't have that

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kind of money to give away if I wanted to, you know. It's— but nonetheless, I

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think it's just not what we see a lot of people build more wealth for

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themselves, for their own gain, don't they?

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I think giving is— it, for me, it has to come with a cost, you know. So, um, I

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think, you know, the culture at the time— I think Middle Eastern culture is very

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different than, than our own, and not just historically. I think even today it

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was very reciprocal. So like, I have some Farsi friends And, um, you know, if

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you ever invite them out around from a— come around for a meal, well, you can't

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even get it in your diary until you've told them when you're going to their

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house. So, you know, because it's reciprocal, it's not one-offmanship, it's we

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want to participate in this, and they'll bring stuff. And I think we— I see

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something lovely about a society, a culture of reciprocation and value. And, and

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as you're saying, that we share what we have. and it should cost. You know, I

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think, you know, if you've got— I don't know, these figures are beyond me, like,

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you know, £10 million in the bank, to give somebody £10,000, it is still

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significant, but it probably isn't to you. You know, um, so I think, you know,

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giving is about reciprocation. But what I see in Zacchaeus is fruits of

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repentance. The very thing that was an idol to him, that like was like a god,

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finance stuff, you know, that he got from doing, um, from his job. That's what

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he surrendered, you know. And I think we need to know what it is to surrender

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those things that are idols in our lives, you know, that we count so important.

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Let's share them. I bet those people were terrified when he started doing that,

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you know. What's the catch? Zak, yes, you're going to tax me more next time.

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Yeah, you know, it's interesting, isn't it? We've got a few comments here on the

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feed that I'll just pull up as well. So we've got quite a bit of people on the

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feed here. So we've got Alicia, Ellis, Rach, Sharon, Ros, Sonia, MJS Player,

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it's the ID, Catherine. So we've got a number of people listening in live on the

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feed. And one comment I've got is here from Alicia says, there was so much

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fascinating context here in Ade's talk. I knew Zakias was was hated but didn't

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realize the connection between his work and the oppression of Rome. Um, hi Ade,

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Anna, Dave. What does sharing your skills and money, etc., look like in your own

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lives? That's from Sharon. Oh, there's a big buzz on that.

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It's gone.

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Fine, it's gone. So did everyone catch that? So what does sharing your skills

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and money look like in your own lives? That's a question from Sharon. Any

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thoughts, guys?

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What about, what about you, Ade?

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The fact I'm here right now, you know, so I am an engineer and a physicist. I

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often talk to people who don't know a thing about technical anything and

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convince them this is a really good thing to do for the business. So actually

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speaking in front of people, that's something I do quite comfortably. And so

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having been a Christian for a number of years, studied the Bible for a number of

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years, and more recently in Bible college, it's coming here and taking what I do

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for a day job but with, you know, a theological and scriptural context rather

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than a scientific context. Yeah, that's an example of skills.

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Yeah, that's, that's a really good, good part of it. I, I think, yeah, I, I feel

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the same. I, I feel like a large part of being generous is like, for me, it's

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being generous, yeah, with our money, but also with our time and our resources.

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So, you know, like me and my husband Andy, we like to like open our house, you

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know, open our, yeah, just our space or our diary, our lives to people. And I

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think, yeah, that can be money because sometimes people have financial needs,

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but also it's giving people things to borrow when they need them, or being like,

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come stay in our house the weekend we're away, or, or come and have a meal with

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us, you're on your own. Or yeah, it can be really just a little practical

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things. But I think you're right, Dave, it's about a generosity of heart. And

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yeah, for me, that's a really important part of it. It's about being generous

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with whatever we— whatever we're blessed with, in whatever way. Like, use my

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car, use my time, you know. But also, you're right, Ada, it is about time as

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well, like, and your skills. So, you know, doing things like this or whatever

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we're good at, giving it, giving it, um, to the purposes of God and to bless

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other people as well.

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I think time is really important because, you know, once—

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having a few sound issues tonight. Bear with us, folks, we'll keep going.

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So one of the things I quite like about this passage is, and this is where we

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see Jesus really being a revolutionary.

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I think, you know, with time, it's the most precious thing that we have. Which

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affects all the other things. But, you know, once that time is spent, it's gone.

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Yeah, you, you know, you just don't get that back. And, um, and I, I think it's

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wonderful to spend time with people. Some people are easier to spend time with

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than others. Well, you know, I would just encourage people that when we're with

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people, to give them our best, give them our concentration, put our phones away,

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you know, you know, type of thing. It's horrible when you're talking with

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somebody, um, and, and, and they change— they're looking at the phone. And I

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know they might be waiting for a kidney transplant or something, but most of us

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aren't, you know. Let's give people our undivided attention.

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Yeah, that's a really good point. I've got another comment here on the feed,

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which is, uh, from Alicia. She says, um, this was a refreshingly nuanced take on

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what success is especially for people of faith. So it's not just about what,

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what can be done with money, but how you employ your other gifts. Yeah, I think

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we just covered that, but really good point. I thought as well, an interesting

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point, um, that Ade made was about how, um, like, we're called to steward what

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we're given, but not everybody's given the same amount. So like, some people are

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given more to steward than others. And that's interesting, isn't it? Because

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sometimes you can look at it from a human perspective and be like, well, why

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have they been given so much money or resource or opportunity? Because they're

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not actually using it as well as I might think I would do in their shoes. I'm

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not saying I would, but you know, when you're like, sometimes there's that

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thing, isn't it? Like, why doesn't God give just good people? Like, all of that

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stuff. But Espe Zacchaeus is like a great example of, yeah, actually anyone has

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that potential when they encounter Jesus. Um, but I just wondered if you had any

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thoughts about that, Aidan, while you were prepping the talk, like that whole

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idea of we're not all given the same, you know, in terms of stewardship.

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Uh, yeah, absolutely. Um, I, uh, personally, I'm blessed enough to have been

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born into a Christian family. My parents loved each other, they loved the Lord,

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they stayed together. I came from a stable family. I was able to go to a

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polytech and study engineering and science, live at home, commute to that, so

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not have racked massive debts, and then go on to a career in science and

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engineering, which is a, you know, it's a generally jobs are reliable. I could

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have chosen a completely different career path and not had anything like the

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number of opportunities I had today, whilst having worked equally hard at that

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career path. So some of it is the blessings I was born into, some of it is the

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work I've done with the opportunities I've been given, and some of it is just

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the choices I've made. There's so many things there. And also, we pray that God

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will open the right doors, close the wrong doors and everything. But Sonia and

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I, there must be, there must be that as well.

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Yeah, I think that's really helpful, and it's a really helpful perspective.

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Like, yeah, it's interesting. Go on, Dave.

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We're only to steward that which God has given us. I'm looking from, you know,

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the God side of things. We're just accountable for that, and, you know, when

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people say to me, you know, like, maybe, let's say faith, Dave, you know, will

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you pray that God gives me more faith? And my normal response is a little bit

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tongue-in-cheek, but it usually goes something like, 'What are you doing with

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what he's given you? If you want more faith, use what you have.' And when we

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talk about stewarding, whether it be gifts or resources, we just need to know

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that we do it for the glory of God and at the same time generally being a

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blessing to other people. But we will be— stewardship is all about being

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accountable, whether it be even our families, like our kids, We, we, you know,

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we steward that, you know, um, and I think we just forget sometimes that there

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is a, a day of reckoning where we have, you know, stewarding. God says, what

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have you done with it?

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Yeah, I think that's it. That's a challenge for us all, isn't it? And I, I feel

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like some— so much of this for me is about heart posture and holding things

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lightly. So Yeah, whether it's your children or your time or your resources or

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your, like, money in your bank account.

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It's—

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for me, it's like knowing that the earth is the Lord's and everything in it. And

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actually, everything I own, everything I own, everything I have is, you know,

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as, as Ade touched on, is from God, it's for God, it's back to God in the end.

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You know, we're all given different starts and chances in life and different

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opportunities, but actually God just expects us to have a good posture of

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generosity and stewarding as best we're able to what he gives to us. And I

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think, yeah, you know, just holding things quite lightly and not clinging to

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things too tight is really helpful for me.

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I'm not sure whether it's just our— the day in which we live, but it's a little

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bit like, I want that. And we spend so much time looking at what we don't have

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or what somebody else has that we miss what we've been entrusted with, and

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because our attention is somewhere else, so we don't really do that stewarding

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that well. And but I love that phrase about posturing. It is all about our heart

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because, you know, God knows it. And whilst we may be able to fool ourselves at

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times, we never fool God. God knows what our heart is and our heart responses to

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things.

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I've got a few more comments coming through on the feed. So Ellis says, one

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thing I struggle with when it comes to sharing and giving is doing it because I

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feel like I should rather than because I want to. I struggle to find the balance

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with that. Um, yeah, I think that's— it's a really good point. I think it is

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difficult, isn't it, to feel like I ought to give rather than I want— I

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genuinely want to.

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Yeah.

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Do you have any thoughts on that, Dave?

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Well, I remember just a few months ago we were sat here and we were— we were at

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this very, um, this very conversation. Um, Yeah, I think for me it's always been

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hold things lightly, you know. And when I'm sowing into things, I'm giving, you

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know, I might give to this person, but in fact, you know, I'm actually—

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it's God.

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I'm doing on behalf of God. So at our local Tesco, there's, there's a, there's a

408
00:33:46,825 --> 00:33:51,281
lovely guy, and I know his name, and he's really amused I know his name. And I'm

409
00:33:51,281 --> 00:33:55,737
like, well, why wouldn't I? You know, I ask you it all the time. And I know what

410
00:33:55,737 --> 00:34:00,193
he likes. He likes coffee and he likes a certain sandwich, etc., etc. And I will

411
00:34:00,193 --> 00:34:04,649
just get him them, not because I'm anything, you know, it's not gonna bust my

412
00:34:04,649 --> 00:34:09,105
bank to do that because I don't want him to even have to ask me, you know. I

413
00:34:09,105 --> 00:34:13,561
want to see any and I want to be able to respond. And, um, yeah, you know, and I

414
00:34:13,561 --> 00:34:18,017
just— it comes back to what you said, it's this thing of our heart. Just, you

415
00:34:18,017 --> 00:34:22,472
know, our heart on giving, giving freely. You know, people, you know, ask you

416
00:34:22,472 --> 00:34:26,928
for money, you know, and you might give them something, and, um, and somebody

417
00:34:26,928 --> 00:34:31,384
else say, you know, you shouldn't have done that, they could go and buy drugs

418
00:34:31,384 --> 00:34:35,840
with that, they could go and do such and such. And you know what, they could,

419
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:40,296
but I'm giving them, I'm just wanting to bless them, I'm giving them what

420
00:34:40,296 --> 00:34:44,752
they've asked for. And, you know, we can find that in scripture as well, you

421
00:34:44,752 --> 00:34:49,208
know. Um, but I just think, you know, let's give generously and freely. When we

422
00:34:49,208 --> 00:34:53,664
give it, let go of it, you know. Don't— you mustn't spend it on this, but give

423
00:34:53,664 --> 00:34:58,119
it and be a blessing.

424
00:34:59,199 --> 00:35:03,471
Definitely. A couple more comments that have come through. So Alicia said also,

425
00:35:03,471 --> 00:35:07,742
I think one point about how some are wealthy and can be afraid of reversal of,

426
00:35:07,742 --> 00:35:12,013
you know, not having their money anymore, like losing their wealth, or, or

427
00:35:12,013 --> 00:35:16,284
possibly, um people only caring about them for their wealth or their success or

428
00:35:16,284 --> 00:35:20,556
power or whatever. I think she said that's really good, and that's very, you

429
00:35:20,556 --> 00:35:24,827
know, it's a good point, and that's a very fearful way to live. And, and I think

430
00:35:24,827 --> 00:35:29,098
that's true, and I think we can be fearful, can't we, whether we've got much or

431
00:35:29,098 --> 00:35:33,369
little when it comes to money.

432
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:34,000
Yeah.

433
00:35:34,159 --> 00:35:39,062
And actually, some of it is just about perspective, like whether you've got much

434
00:35:39,062 --> 00:35:43,965
or little, trusting that God provides, and actually Everything is his. And yeah,

435
00:35:43,965 --> 00:35:48,867
again, that encounter with Jesus changes your perspective because money is not

436
00:35:48,867 --> 00:35:53,769
your God. God is your God.

437
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:58,659
Yeah, I mean, we're all blessed, aren't we, that, you know, we have— most of us,

438
00:35:58,659 --> 00:36:03,360
and, you know, in this room, you know, we, we have generally, I think, you know,

439
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:08,059
what we need. You know, it's, it's not that there aren't things that we want.

440
00:36:08,059 --> 00:36:12,760
Yeah, that we haven't got, you know, um But we generally, you know, have what we

441
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:17,460
need. And I think, but if I was to go and give somebody, you know, 20 quid, you

442
00:36:17,460 --> 00:36:22,160
know, I mean, I, I would probably want to give them more than that because I

443
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:26,860
want to feel the bite. I want to feel the cost of doing that, not so I can feel

444
00:36:26,860 --> 00:36:31,559
good, but so I can feel that cost. And I want them to be blessed significantly.

445
00:36:31,559 --> 00:36:36,260
And what they do with it is beyond you know, beyond me. But I also want to be

446
00:36:36,260 --> 00:36:40,960
dependent on God, um, you know, um, for my finances, you know. And we talk about

447
00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:45,660
in the church or being full-time or, you know, living by faith. Well, you know,

448
00:36:45,660 --> 00:36:50,360
I think if you work in the Ford Motor Company, you're living by faith. Whatever

449
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:55,060
we do, we need to live by faith, and it's God's blessing that we've even got

450
00:36:55,060 --> 00:36:59,760
that job.

451
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:05,010
Yeah, yeah. Any more thoughts from you, Aidan? I'm aware that you're over in

452
00:37:05,010 --> 00:37:09,219
North Wales, but we still want to hear from you.

453
00:37:09,769 --> 00:37:10,300
Yeah, shout.

454
00:37:10,730 --> 00:37:14,929
She's just not in this physical studio with us. Yeah, shout from North Wales.

455
00:37:15,309 --> 00:37:16,719
Yeah, we'll talk all night, just me.

456
00:37:16,820 --> 00:37:19,869
Yeah, it's just hard to get a word in between me and Dave, that's all.

457
00:37:21,159 --> 00:37:26,378
I have noticed that. I think, I think one of the things to remind you about, you

458
00:37:26,378 --> 00:37:31,596
know, but the difference between feeling I should do something, whereas I want

459
00:37:31,596 --> 00:37:36,814
to. You got to start somewhere and you have clear guidance in the Bible to meet

460
00:37:36,814 --> 00:37:42,032
together, to study the Bible, to pray, to support the helpless. And sometimes

461
00:37:42,032 --> 00:37:47,250
you just have to, it's almost fake it till you make it, right? There's an

462
00:37:47,250 --> 00:37:52,469
instruction here I should do. I don't feel like doing it. But do it anyway. And

463
00:37:52,469 --> 00:37:57,687
I think I've gone through— it's only in the last 6 months, I think, I've come

464
00:37:57,687 --> 00:38:02,905
out of a rut where I actually want to read the Bible. I've been reading it daily

465
00:38:02,905 --> 00:38:08,123
anyway, but because all the stuff that we've been going through in our personal

466
00:38:08,123 --> 00:38:13,341
lives, it's like, right, this time I do this. I don't feel like it, but I'm

467
00:38:13,341 --> 00:38:18,559
going to do it. And it got to a point where I thought, you know what, I'm going

468
00:38:18,559 --> 00:38:23,778
to do it. I think I'm going to do this even better, and I'm going to sign up to

469
00:38:23,778 --> 00:38:28,996
an online Bible college. But up until that, and now, you know, it's— I've kind

470
00:38:28,996 --> 00:38:34,214
of gone through that phase now where I want to, I can't wait till the next time,

471
00:38:34,214 --> 00:38:39,432
I'm just kind of learning so much. But I had to go through a good 18 months.

472
00:38:39,432 --> 00:38:44,650
Yeah, let's say a good 18 months of just doing it because I knew I should be

473
00:38:44,650 --> 00:38:49,869
doing it, being very open in my conversation with God that I'm doing this

474
00:38:49,869 --> 00:38:55,087
because I should. I'd like to want to do this, but right now I just, you know, I

475
00:38:55,087 --> 00:39:00,305
just don't feel that. I just don't feel much of anything. If we do that with the

476
00:39:00,305 --> 00:39:05,523
right heart and we ask God to help us through it, we will come to a place where

477
00:39:05,523 --> 00:39:10,741
we do want to do these things. But very often we have to put in the work to get

478
00:39:10,741 --> 00:39:15,960
ourselves there.

479
00:39:16,820 --> 00:39:21,610
Yeah, it's one of the— this, it's discipline, isn't it? Which isn't really much

480
00:39:21,610 --> 00:39:26,400
of a 21st century word because we all like to do what we want to do.

481
00:39:28,210 --> 00:39:32,725
Yeah, it's funny, isn't it? Because it's— yeah, it's like, like you say, that

482
00:39:32,725 --> 00:39:37,240
fake it till you make it thing. And I love your honesty about your situation,

483
00:39:37,240 --> 00:39:41,756
Aidan, the fact that sometimes it is a choice and Yeah, and the feelings sort of

484
00:39:41,756 --> 00:39:46,271
come later, and sometimes they're quicker, aren't they? And I think we've all

485
00:39:46,271 --> 00:39:50,787
got different examples of, yeah, how sometimes you kind of just have to make the

486
00:39:50,787 --> 00:39:55,302
first step and Jesus moves towards you. But then sometimes there's situations

487
00:39:55,302 --> 00:39:59,818
like Zacchaeus where Jesus literally steps towards him and he, you know, he

488
00:39:59,818 --> 00:40:04,333
calls him down out of his tree. It wasn't that Zacchaeus stepped towards Jesus,

489
00:40:04,333 --> 00:40:08,849
but Jesus went— he called him out, didn't he, and said 'Hey, I want to speak to

490
00:40:08,849 --> 00:40:13,364
you.' Yeah. So yeah, I think it can be both ways, and, um, and it's okay. And I

491
00:40:13,364 --> 00:40:17,880
think it's really honest to be like, 'I don't really feel like doing this, but

492
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:22,396
as I do it, because I know it's the right thing to do, God, would you change my

493
00:40:22,396 --> 00:40:26,911
heart?' And, you know, and Aidan's example is that over time that has been his

494
00:40:26,911 --> 00:40:31,427
experience. And I think I've got examples of that as well, and mine wasn't

495
00:40:31,427 --> 00:40:35,942
necessarily about reading the Bible, but I, you know, I went— I've been through

496
00:40:35,942 --> 00:40:40,458
seasons where I didn't really want to pray. I didn't really want to talk to God

497
00:40:40,458 --> 00:40:44,973
sometimes, um, because of, you know, different difficult situations. But I think

498
00:40:44,973 --> 00:40:49,489
when you kind of take a step towards God, I think he steps towards you. It's

499
00:40:49,489 --> 00:40:54,004
like there's a Bible verse that's like, you know, draw near to God and he'll

500
00:40:54,004 --> 00:40:58,519
draw near to you. And I, I think it is sometimes there is that two-way process.

501
00:40:58,969 --> 00:41:03,261
I mean, when you read these stories, like, that they are so personal, whether it

502
00:41:03,261 --> 00:41:07,552
be Zacchaeus or, um, the woman caught in adultery or the one with the issue of

503
00:41:07,552 --> 00:41:11,844
blood. You know, the gospels are just full of these things where, whether Jesus

504
00:41:11,844 --> 00:41:16,135
calls them by name, somewhere in that interaction they become deeply personal

505
00:41:16,135 --> 00:41:20,427
and life-changing. They're heart-changing, aren't they? Um, and I think only

506
00:41:20,427 --> 00:41:24,718
when our hearts are changed do our feelings get changed. That's pretty good, I

507
00:41:24,718 --> 00:41:29,010
must write that down.

508
00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:30,989
Uh, only when I say it again, Dave.

509
00:41:31,559 --> 00:41:36,437
Only when our hearts get changed do our feelings begin to change. Yeah, you

510
00:41:36,437 --> 00:41:41,314
know, and, um, and I think that would be really true, you know, for me. Um, I'm

511
00:41:41,314 --> 00:41:46,191
quite a persistent person, so again, you know, just doing something until I get

512
00:41:46,191 --> 00:41:51,068
that longing, because I know it's good. It's like, you know, lots of things in

513
00:41:51,068 --> 00:41:55,945
life are good, aren't they? Like go in the gym, eat well, you know, you know, in

514
00:41:55,945 --> 00:42:00,822
a big list, and we all know what's good. But we need the discipline to do them,

515
00:42:00,822 --> 00:42:05,699
um, and to do them continually and consistently.

516
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:10,943
Yeah. And it's— I love the, um, just, just reflecting on this story. The thing

517
00:42:10,943 --> 00:42:15,967
that really sticks out to me is that it's Jesus' presence that changes our

518
00:42:15,967 --> 00:42:20,991
perspective. And so I think however, however you get to be in Jesus's presence,

519
00:42:20,991 --> 00:42:26,015
whether that's he pursues you, you have to persistently pursue him, even when

520
00:42:26,015 --> 00:42:31,038
you don't feel like it, like Aidan's example, like, that encounter with Jesus is

521
00:42:31,038 --> 00:42:36,062
what changes your perspective and changes your life, really. So, I think it's

522
00:42:36,062 --> 00:42:41,086
worth, you know, that persistence, that discipline, that wrestle, if it needs to

523
00:42:41,086 --> 00:42:46,110
be, to get to that place.

524
00:42:46,829 --> 00:42:51,774
I think sometimes we get a bit afraid of silence, you know, and with our walk

525
00:42:51,774 --> 00:42:56,719
with God. We think, you know, as he got off, where he's just trying to create a

526
00:42:56,719 --> 00:43:01,663
space for us to maybe just think, what is it that God is saying? What is it I am

527
00:43:01,663 --> 00:43:06,608
wanting? What is it I'm wanting to communicate to him? And, um, it's just, it's

528
00:43:06,608 --> 00:43:11,552
just always there, and he's always intimate with us. And when he speaks, when he

529
00:43:11,552 --> 00:43:16,497
acts, you know, when he reaches out, um, You know, that was so profound what

530
00:43:16,497 --> 00:43:21,441
happens to Zak. I just love it, you know. And that the very thing that was his

531
00:43:21,441 --> 00:43:26,386
idol, it was broken. Because you can't break the idol in somebody's life and

532
00:43:26,386 --> 00:43:31,330
then hold on to the money. I'll tell you what, you can borrow me donkey. That's

533
00:43:31,330 --> 00:43:36,275
not— that doesn't cut it. He breaks the idol, which is the final, and he starts

534
00:43:36,275 --> 00:43:41,219
to restore what he's taken from people.

535
00:43:41,469 --> 00:43:45,853
Yeah, I think, I think it's, um, it goes back to that, um, Firstly, like, um,

536
00:43:45,853 --> 00:43:50,235
it— like, um, Aid mentioned it actually during his talk. It was— I noted it

537
00:43:50,235 --> 00:43:54,618
down. It was 1 John 3, where it sort of says, how can the love of God be in that

538
00:43:54,618 --> 00:43:59,001
person, that person who doesn't share what they have with others and meet

539
00:43:59,001 --> 00:44:03,385
people's needs? And that's really challenging, isn't it? Like, if you're not

540
00:44:03,385 --> 00:44:07,768
generous, if you're not sharing what you have with others, how can the love of

541
00:44:07,768 --> 00:44:12,150
God really be in you? It's like, oh wow, that's, that's tough. And yeah, I

542
00:44:12,150 --> 00:44:16,534
think, wow. But it's that encounter with the love of God that enables you to do

543
00:44:16,534 --> 00:44:20,917
that. That— it was, it was Jesus' love that called Zacchaeus down from the tree.

544
00:44:20,917 --> 00:44:25,300
Like, he saw him, he loved him, he called him out.

545
00:44:25,780 --> 00:44:25,900
Yeah.

546
00:44:26,039 --> 00:44:30,072
And that, that encounter with Jesus' love enabled him to, you know, it was

547
00:44:30,072 --> 00:44:34,103
having Jesus' love inside of him, wasn't it, that created that transformation?

548
00:44:34,103 --> 00:44:38,135
And then out of that came transformation to other people's lives and the

549
00:44:38,135 --> 00:44:42,167
community around him, people they worked with and you know, collected taxes

550
00:44:42,167 --> 00:44:46,199
from. But yeah, I—

551
00:44:46,199 --> 00:44:50,490
and it was natural. Yeah, wasn't it? It was like the overflow. That's the word.

552
00:44:50,490 --> 00:44:54,781
Yeah, I thought I, I couldn't get it right, but it is out of the overflow. It

553
00:44:54,781 --> 00:44:59,072
was the natural response of encountering the presence and the power of Jesus.

554
00:44:59,072 --> 00:45:03,363
And you're like, I didn't have to think it all through. He didn't have to go

555
00:45:03,363 --> 00:45:07,654
away and lay a fleece. He, you know, we don't know exactly what the time frame,

556
00:45:07,654 --> 00:45:11,945
but It's not long, he's in a tree, he's out of a tree, he's walking to his

557
00:45:11,945 --> 00:45:16,236
house, he's having dinner with Jesus. Yeah. You know, and I bet you those people

558
00:45:16,236 --> 00:45:20,527
like were, you know, who were outside, people being people, I wonder what's

559
00:45:20,527 --> 00:45:24,818
going on in there, you know. And they were waiting, you know, maybe, maybe

560
00:45:24,818 --> 00:45:29,109
waiting for the pound of flesh or for Jesus to come out and say, I've sorted

561
00:45:29,109 --> 00:45:33,400
them out. But it's what Zahia says that is so impacting. Um, which is amazing.

562
00:45:34,139 --> 00:45:38,289
Yeah, definitely, definitely. Yeah. Any more thoughts from you, Aidan?

563
00:45:40,389 --> 00:45:44,360
Yeah, I think a key thing to pick up on here is it doesn't matter who you are.

564
00:45:44,590 --> 00:45:44,760
Yes.

565
00:45:44,820 --> 00:45:49,613
What you've done, what you think you've done. Zacchaeus, as I mentioned, he was,

566
00:45:49,613 --> 00:45:54,407
you know, he was the lowest of the low in one sense culturally. So if you look

567
00:45:54,407 --> 00:45:59,200
in the New Testament, there are numerous lists of sinners and tax collectors,

568
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:03,994
tax collectors and prostitutes. They're down there with you know, the lowest

569
00:46:03,994 --> 00:46:08,788
dregs of society at that time. That's how low they think of them. And then, and

570
00:46:08,788 --> 00:46:13,581
so this lowly, lowly guy then decided to go and climb the sin-spreading tree

571
00:46:13,581 --> 00:46:18,375
where some of that probably rubbed off on him on the way up. And, you know, the

572
00:46:18,375 --> 00:46:23,169
revolutionary thing happening here is he is the last person that Jesus should

573
00:46:23,169 --> 00:46:27,962
have picked out. It should have been someone else, maybe a Pharisee or religious

574
00:46:27,962 --> 00:46:32,756
leader or a really nice guy. Didn't. Took someone that society hated, and he

575
00:46:32,756 --> 00:46:37,550
was, he was on the manky sin tree.

576
00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:38,360
That's right.

577
00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:43,300
That's the one. He said, I'm coming home with you. That's great.

578
00:46:43,550 --> 00:46:48,675
And that is so challenging, isn't it? Like, because we, we so often want to, I

579
00:46:48,675 --> 00:46:53,800
don't know, discard people, or we assume people are, or they're beyond saving,

580
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:58,925
or they're, you know, they don't deserve it. And our judgment is so often not

581
00:46:58,925 --> 00:47:04,050
God's judgment, you know, like, yeah, sorry, Ade, go and carry on.

582
00:47:05,389 --> 00:47:09,519
I say it's a bit like in your typical Hollywood film where a good guy goes to

583
00:47:09,519 --> 00:47:13,648
prison, everyone hates him, he walks up to the biggest, baddest dude in the

584
00:47:13,648 --> 00:47:17,777
whole place and picks a fight to change the entire atmosphere to suit him.

585
00:47:17,777 --> 00:47:21,906
You've got to wonder, having people that— the crowd, they were watching, they

586
00:47:21,906 --> 00:47:26,036
were seeing this, they see the lowest of the low on the monkey tree going for

587
00:47:26,036 --> 00:47:30,165
Jesus, and then 'Cause, you know, 'cause word of mouth spreads, they're gonna

588
00:47:30,165 --> 00:47:34,294
hear he's given stuff away. Some of them will have seen it. And, you know, what

589
00:47:34,294 --> 00:47:38,423
we don't see here is the actual impact that must have had in Jericho. That would

590
00:47:38,423 --> 00:47:42,553
have been, that would have been right around the city. This is unheard of. I

591
00:47:42,553 --> 00:47:46,682
mean, anyone who worked for him must have been quaking in their boots thinking,

592
00:47:46,682 --> 00:47:50,811
right, we're gonna have to skim less off the top from now on. But it's, yeah,

593
00:47:50,811 --> 00:47:54,940
you know, this is massive. It's unfortunate that, you know, we just don't see

594
00:47:54,940 --> 00:47:59,070
beyond that in this text.

595
00:47:59,670 --> 00:48:04,113
Yeah. A few final comments coming through on the feed that I'll just read out

596
00:48:04,113 --> 00:48:08,556
because there's some good stuff here. So Sharon said, someone once told me that

597
00:48:08,556 --> 00:48:12,999
desire can follow attention. I found that really helpful. I can choose what I

598
00:48:12,999 --> 00:48:17,442
give my attention to, even if I don't feel like it, just as Aidan said in his

599
00:48:17,442 --> 00:48:21,885
example. Alicia said perspective is so critical because just as we could assume

600
00:48:21,885 --> 00:48:26,327
that our giving will be abused, we can also choose to assume that it's going to

601
00:48:26,327 --> 00:48:30,771
be used for good. And I believe our efforts count to God. Um, Sharon also said,

602
00:48:30,771 --> 00:48:35,213
I think it can be a fun activity partnering with God to be generous. I think

603
00:48:35,213 --> 00:48:39,657
that's a really, really good point, actually. Um, yeah, you can have some real

604
00:48:39,657 --> 00:48:44,100
adventures with giving, can't you? Probably not got enough time to unpick them

605
00:48:44,100 --> 00:48:48,543
all, but Sure, we've got some— all got some examples of that. Um, Ellis says, I

606
00:48:48,543 --> 00:48:52,986
really relate to Aid there. I make sure to read the Bible every day even though

607
00:48:52,986 --> 00:48:57,429
sometimes I don't feel like it. However, other days I feel really motivated and

608
00:48:57,429 --> 00:49:01,872
enjoy doing it. Both are edifying. That's a really good point. Um, I'm aware

609
00:49:01,872 --> 00:49:06,315
that time is ticking along, so, um, any final thought from either of you guys

610
00:49:06,315 --> 00:49:10,758
just in sort of rounding up? We'll, um obviously go across to the live lounge in

611
00:49:10,758 --> 00:49:15,201
a minute, and the link for that will be coming up shortly on your screen or in

612
00:49:15,201 --> 00:49:19,644
the comments box. Oh, it's already in there, I'm told. Yeah, I'm a step behind.

613
00:49:19,644 --> 00:49:24,086
I know, it's almost like we've got tech guys behind us, you know what they're

614
00:49:24,086 --> 00:49:28,530
doing.

615
00:49:29,300 --> 00:49:30,119
Yeah, yeah.

616
00:49:30,420 --> 00:49:35,725
Um, but yeah, so there we are. Just, just to shame me as I'm speaking. Um, so

617
00:49:35,725 --> 00:49:41,030
yeah, our sound wasn't great tonight, but they're on top of everything else.

618
00:49:41,110 --> 00:49:44,579
They can't hear you, Matt.

619
00:49:45,199 --> 00:49:48,650
You're not on mic for once. Matt's just shouting from the— for anyone who's

620
00:49:48,650 --> 00:49:52,099
listening, Matt's just shouting from the back of studio. No one can hear you. No

621
00:49:52,099 --> 00:49:55,550
one cares.

622
00:49:55,780 --> 00:49:56,789
No, exactly.

623
00:49:57,599 --> 00:50:00,305
Um, anyway, before this descends into total chaos, um, any final thoughts from

624
00:50:00,305 --> 00:50:03,010
you, Dave?

625
00:50:03,050 --> 00:50:09,470
I just say that, you know, encountering Jesus loosened Zacchaeus's grip on money

626
00:50:09,470 --> 00:50:15,889
and the selfishness that more often than not accompanies it.

627
00:50:17,110 --> 00:50:19,945
Amazing. Yep. And how about you, Aidan? Have you any final thoughts to leave us

628
00:50:19,945 --> 00:50:22,780
with?

629
00:50:24,449 --> 00:50:28,630
Yeah, so Zacchaeus had it all. He had all the kind of wealth he wanted. He did

630
00:50:28,630 --> 00:50:32,809
not have community, and community really cannot be underestimated. And if you're

631
00:50:32,809 --> 00:50:36,989
watching this and you don't have community, please reach out to us. Heck, even

632
00:50:36,989 --> 00:50:41,170
come along to the live lounge after this. We are an online community of

633
00:50:41,170 --> 00:50:45,350
believers. Doesn't matter where you are, it doesn't matter if you haven't got a

634
00:50:45,350 --> 00:50:49,530
local church. We can be your local church, literally on your screen.

635
00:50:50,050 --> 00:50:51,650
Yeah, amen to that.

636
00:50:51,730 --> 00:50:51,940
Amen.

637
00:50:52,150 --> 00:50:57,000
It's very true. Um, just to let you guys know, next week we're back, same time

638
00:50:57,000 --> 00:51:01,849
at 7 PM on proud. And, um, next week we've got Mike Harris talking, so he's

639
00:51:01,849 --> 00:51:06,700
going to be here talking about when positivity doesn't help. And it's just a

640
00:51:06,700 --> 00:51:11,550
continuation of this, uh, series that we're doing on Jesus the Revolutionary. So

641
00:51:11,550 --> 00:51:16,400
Dave's laughing because he can't say the word revolutionary. I think it's—

642
00:51:16,400 --> 00:51:17,940
I've said it once. I think it's a—

643
00:51:17,940 --> 00:51:21,159
Go on, Dave, before we sign off, just try it.

644
00:51:21,309 --> 00:51:22,250
Jesus. Jesus.

645
00:51:22,409 --> 00:51:22,760
Jesus.

646
00:51:22,809 --> 00:51:23,710
Revolutionary.

647
00:51:23,849 --> 00:51:24,179
Nearly.

648
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:29,630
He's been practicing, everyone. He's been practicing. Jesus the revolutionary. I

649
00:51:29,630 --> 00:51:34,460
don't think it's that hard. Anyway, never mind. Tell us in the chat bar if you

650
00:51:34,460 --> 00:51:39,289
think revolutionary is hard to say. Um, but yeah, on that, on that, exactly,

651
00:51:39,289 --> 00:51:44,120
join the revolution. So on that, um, note, we probably— it's time to wrap up.

652
00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:48,950
But, um, yeah, hopefully join us in the live lounge if you want to continue this

653
00:51:48,950 --> 00:51:53,780
chat. We'd love to see you. And if not, we'll see you next week. Take care.

654
00:51:54,099 --> 00:51:54,320
Bye.