Does research really improve public transportation?

That was the question we put to a panel at the recent Transportation Research

Board conference in Washington DC.

I'm Paul Comfort and we held a Transit Unplugged Live panel there at the APTA

booth, the American Public Transportation Association booth, for a live group

that came to join us and we asked that question to three key leaders.

What role does transportation research play in real outcomes that improve the

lives of our passengers and communities?

Great answers by some great panelists.

Art Guzzetti, my friend, who is Vice President of the American

Public Transportation Association, dove into that and also the role

that TCRP plays in all of this and the studies that are done there.

Kate Ko joined us, she's vice president of WSP in the U.S. She talked

about some of the specific studies.

She's been involved in and how she's seen them implemented in agencies.

And then my former colleague from MTA Baltimore, who now is at the Texas

a A&M Transportation Institute as a research scientist, Michael Walk also

dove into some of his recent studies and how they've actually improved

public transportation services.

I think you'll find this a fascinating panel to listen to today.

Again, thanks to the Transportation Cooperative Research Program,

TCRP, APTA and COMTO DC for their support of this panel.

Now let's dive into this fascinating conversation.

Well welcome everyone.

Thanks for being with us today at Transit Unplugged Live.

I'm Paul Comfort, the host.

We've put together a panel today perfect for a TRB conference.

We're gonna be talking about the value of research and how it

impacts real life transit agencies.

I spent my career in real life transit agencies running small,

medium, and large systems.

Ended up a CEO of the MTA in Baltimore here with Michael at my side, helping to,

uh, organize all of our routes back then.

And, um, the, the role that Transportation Research Board and TCRP

play in this process are phenomenal.

We wanna thank TCRP, Jamaal Schoby here, who's helped organize everything

and Cherice Myers from APTA.

Thank you so much for helping us organize today's panel.

We've got some great practitioners

with us and uh we'll start right now and kick it off.

So we'll go to Michael Walk.

Michael, tell us about yourself and what you do

Howdy I'm I'm Michael Walk with Texas A&M Transportation Institute or TTI

and there I'm a research scientist I'm also the uh program manager of

the Transit Mobility Research Program and an active uh TCRP researcher there

All right Kate Co from WSP.

Hello everybody Kate Co at WSP I'm an economist at WSP.

I also um lead business development for economics, finance, and grants uh within

WSP's uh advisory and planning uh services

And I am Art Guzzdetti I'm vice president at APTA for uh policy mobility technical

services and innovation I know that's a mouthful but we do a lot at APTA uh

I was at New Jersey Transit and I was at the Pittsburgh Regional Transit

working for transit systems and then spent the second half of my career

at the American Public Transportation Association Good to be with you again Paul

Absolutely So Art let's start with you Why don't you give us kind of a

global view Of what TCRP programs do.

Talk about the value and the role that research plays in

informing real life transit impact

Well I can tell you, Paul, that uh working for a transit system is the

the second toughest job in any metro area Uh the the the toughest job is

the school system Uh but I'd say the number two is is transit And in in the

course of that there are all kind of issues There are many issues that arise.

On the operation side on the scheduling side on the workforce side et cetera

going down the line Uh and we need answers to that and I think in many ways

the guiding light comes from research.

I would say any program whether it be highways rail transit the

program needs to be comprehensive.

It needs to have you know provide funding for transit support but it also needs

to have a training element You need a research element I think that was uh

the big success of the uh interstate highway program in the fifties is because

they did it in a comprehensive way You had the universities that were part

of that You had the the engineering community that was part of it So it was a

comprehensive program that that included all of those pieces uh and research

Needs to be part of that We're in a year that we're going to reauthorize the

Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act Research needs to be an element of that

reauthorization and not lost It might not come up in every conversation but

it is an essential part of the program

Art before I let you go um walk us through just for like you know a minute

or two the process of how TCRP works the tops uh commission and all that I know

that you all had meetings Yes This week

Yep Uh in in fact uh That is true Uh and you know okay There are many components

of the federal research program all of which are important the TCRP program has

as its origins What do the transit systems around the country see from the ground

level You know it's it might be uh you know the universities have a role in what

they do Uh the federal government has a role in what it does but the transit

systems have their own practical needs that come up in their day-to-day work

Their own problems So that's the origins of TCRP What do the transit operators

see What do they need answers to So they have a process of soliciting problem

statements Those problems are submitted to TCRP then a commission what we call

the TOPS commission which is the TCRP TCRP

of course, is the Transit Cooperative Research Program.

The TOPS Commission is the TCRP Oversight and Project Selection Commission.

So in collaboration between the transit community and FTA,

federal Transit Administration and TRB uh, together collaborate.

What are our priorities?

What do we need answers to at this point in time, and most impactful for us to.

Uh uh you Put as a research project.

Uh, the tops commission then selects them, and TRB uh, implements them through,

uh, competition, uh, on contracts.

Excellent Thank you for that.

And let's, we're gonna be talking about of the specific

studies that have been done just now, some that were and

talked about at this conference.

But first, kate Co Tell us about the TCRP ambassador program

that you're involved with.

Yes, the um, TCRP Ambassador Program, it's actually a um, joint effort between

APTA, uh, COMTO and TCRP to get a word out about the research being done, uh, at

TCRP and, um, as ambassadors, we are sent to various local and national conferences

to really get folks excited about drafting research needs statement, uh, serving on

panel as members or submitting project proposals and even to implementing

research as well as like finally getting feedback back to TCRP and if folks at the

conferences are interested We also talk about how to really get engaged in other

ways with TCRP, COMTO, uh, as well as TRB

And the best part about being an ambassador was actually

that all expenses are paid for.

So all you really need is your manager or supervisor's approval to participate.

And I really appreciate uh leadership at WSP for uh, always

supporting my, uh, uh, involvement with TRB, COMTO and and um, TCRP

That's great.

Speaking of wSP, we've got another bigwig from wSP here, Davey Kim,

former Secretary of in California.

Davey, thank you for being with today.

Let's give him a round of applause

Davey was a guest lecturer last year for me at my Villanova, uh, course

where we taught graduate students on the future of public transportation.

And Davey's really big in one of the hot topics right now, which is

potentially highway user revenue.

And charging there.

And so thank for the work you're doing in that area.

We need to have a long-term funding solution for this industry and we know

that the gas tax may not be the final end all be all, do all for that anymore since

so many cars going to electric, etcetera.

So thank you for that

Alright, now let's go to Michael and we're gonna wrap this round of questions on

our Transit Unplugged Live podcast here.

Michael, you are PI.

What's a PI?

A private investigator?

Absolutely, absolutely.

Uh, no.

Uh, PI is a principal investigator.

Okay.

Yeah.

Tell us about that process and how transit agencies involved

in the study and research.

Yeah.

Bottom, bottom line is, uh, without transit agencies, the TCRP

research wouldn't actually occur.

Right.

transit agencies, representatives from transits are involved first,

as, as Art mentioned in submitting problem statements in helping to

select problem statements for funding.

Uh, and then ultimately being panel members of panels on

TCRP, uh, research projects.

So every TCRP research project has a panel, an oversight panel comprised

of members of the transit industry and representatives from other

organizations, FTA or other specialties.

That oversight panel is critical in setting the scope of the project in

reviewing data collection material, and ultimately approving the final report.

So without transit agency staff being on those panels, uh, you know, these

projects wouldn't get done and they help ensure that the research along the

way meets the needs of, of transits.

Um, another way that transits are involved in, in TCRP research is

they're often featured as case studies.

They help complete surveys, uh, you know, so that we're learning from the industry

during the conduct of the research.

So it, it's best for the practitioner.

So lemme tell you quick story.

So when I got the MTA in Baltimore, uh, 10 years ago as CEO of that agency,

the 11th largest transit agency in America, we had 120 million trips a year.

We had commuter bus, commuter train service, MARC train into

Union Station we had a bus service with seven 50 buses, paratransit,

light rail, and a subway system.

And just before got there, the governor made a decision to not go forward

with something called the Red Line.

You might remember that that was a line that was proposed to go East

West connection across Baltimore.

And uh, we the system had to be improved, man, our on time performance for our

bus service, which where two people were riding outta those six modes, was awful.

I'm not gonna tell you the number, but it started with a five.

it was uh, very low on time performance and we measure it properly we had

radio systems tracking where the buses were instead of really good GPS.

So I asked the governor the time, Hey gov, I know can't do red

line 'cause you don't wanna that.

You We're still going with the purple line, right?

Yeah.

We're still going with the purple line, Paul.

All right.

But what what else can do?

Could you let me improve the one service?

Where most the people ride the bus service.

He's yeah, you can do that.

I said, great, because a buddy named Michael Walk just told me about a

study they've been for two years called the Bus Network Improvement Program.

They've gathered two years worth data.

It's like a gift sitting there.

No one's done anything with just got finished before I got here.

Go for it, Paul.

And we used that data be the basis of Baltimore Link, the Houston style

remodeling of a transit agency where you basically take routes that were laid out

50 ago and make them relevant to today's workforce, knowing that two thirds of

all the routes at the time were going to the downtown central business district.

But now most jobs in the suburbs.

didn't have any service out there.

So used the research that he oversaw during time there as the basis

for what's happening right now in Baltimore City 10 years later.

It actually started eight years ago.

They kicked it off.

Yeah.

But eight years later, a research project is impacting

millions of people in Baltimore.

That's value of good study, good analysis, and how it impacts the lives

of the people that we serve transit.

What say you to that, Michael?

I'm, I mean, I think you underscore something that's really critical.

You know, like Art mentioned that research is an important

component of of the industry.

And if we're not doing that research, then when, one, we don't know the best

practice, we don't know, uh, the right way to do X, Y, and Z, whatever that is.

And we're also not proactively looking for opportunities to make improvements,

which is one of the foundational, uh, outcomes of good research is

these are the things that we need.

This is now we know what we need to do.

And that can actually be implemented right in based on science.

On an empirical approach, research focus.

So not only in planning, right, planning studies, but in any topic, whether it's

workforce, policy, law, you know, all of these topics, these, the research that

gets done through the TCRP, you know, projects and through agencies is critical

to actually be able to implement and make things better for the riders and

the communities that rely on transit.

And I think a lot of people don't fully understand in the transit agencies.

So APTA just put out their annual study and they said there's about

450,000 people in the United States working in public transportation.

Right, Art?

So it's about a half a million people in America work in this industry.

So many of them I don't have a clue about all the research that

on here and around the country.

That's why we're doing this podcast.

Our podcast is number one in world.

We're heard a hundred countries.

We're number in America for transit.

We're trying to make sure transit understand the value of that.

A lot of the work Kate, is done through standing committees.

You're involved with that, right?

Tell us about that.

Sure.

Um, I'm the, uh, standing committee member of the Economic finance

and Investment Committee, but.

I have a secret to share with you guys.

You don't need to be a committee member to be actively engaged in research, right?

So for example, I've been, uh, a friend of the, uh, the former

Transportation Equity committee.

And, um, through that I had the privilege to, um, help pull together, choose

very successful CATE conferences.

CATE stands for conference on advancing transportation equity.

And I swear I had no part of naming that

That's pretty funny

conference.

And shout out,

come to my conference, the CATE conference.

I know, right?

Um, so I had a great opportunity work with the OGs in transportation equity.

Uh, Gloria, Gloria

the original

Gloria Jeff, um, happy retirement from MinDOT, as well as, uh,

Tracy Strong Gilian, uh, who pulled up conferences together.

And we're actually convening this Thursday at the MLK library just

down the street here, uh, for the crossroads events where continue to

have platform understand, um, shape and advance, uh, transportation equity.

So, all right, are you ready to get into some specifics?

Now let's talk about real life, how these studies are impacting transit.

We're gonna go to Art Guzzetti.

So Art is Vice President of Policy for APTA.

Um, and uh, there's so much going on right now, as he said, but Art, you all

also have like sent ideas for studies.

Right.

Tell us about what, what some of those were and how they worked out.

yeah.

First I just make quick note on the TRB meeting and the theme, because

I'd like to underscore Innovation

Yeah Innovation is a theme everywhere at this, uh, conference.

Uh, there is a lot about, uh vehicles.

There's uh you know certainly automation.

Is something not only the on highways, but on transit community.

We're all over that advancing it.

Uh, very soon a uh, automated system will open in Honolulu,

uh, a totally automated rail.

Is that the first in America?

It's the first totally automated in the way it is.

There are certainly even right here in Washington, had, uh, partial

automation along the way and some of the people mover systems around

the country, like in, uh, in Miami.

And, uh, uh, you know, in, in Vancouver in Canada, there have been those,

that type of automation, but the Honolulu system is a new breakthrough.

We wanna be in the transit community ahead of the curve, ahead

of the curve on things like AI.

There's, there's, uh, sessions here, there's studies on that as well as

innovation, but it's more than that.

It's, it's also the customer experience.

Right.

We need to think of that in an innovative way.

Uh, you know, we talk about universal mobility.

Uh, certainly the administration has put a emphasis on family.

you know, what type of family friendly policies might we come up with?

What are kind of, you know, fare systems might be friendly to, to

families, and we can get all over that.

Uh, you know, uh, there's the old concept of eight to 80.

A transit system has to be usable, understandable, and work for everybody,

not just able-bodied people in middle age.

You know, it, it, it should, the young people should be able to

understand it and use it and, and all.

So those kinds of threads are here all the way across.

And things like way finding, you know, technologies that can enable and

facilitate way finding and new study here is for, uh, hearing impaired.

The TCRP is, is launching, uh, to mention a, a, a few more.

Um, these are just hot off the press kinds of things, but one would be, uh,

safety, but not just looking at safety.

Safety's a broad subject, but how can you collaborate on safety?

How can the, uh, the workforce of the transit agency collaborate

with the broader workforce of a community and and work hand in hand?

So looking at it in a more specific way, a problem statement that's more

specific in getting into the, into the, uh, granular, uh, questions.

Um, we have, uh, like transit-oriented development, not a new idea that's been

around for my long career, uh, but.

how about bus transit oriented development has often been looked

at, looked at through a rail lenss.

Now, with all these bus rapid transit projects that are really the, the,

uh, majority of projects coming through the Capital Investment

grant program, how can they be tied into a capital investment grant?

Uh, a, a, a transit oriented development thing?

You have, um.

accessibility.

Accessibility is a, another huge theme of Marc Molinaro at the

Federal Transit Administration.

So how can we work together with that and, and all the different you.

Accessibility is not a single issue.

You have accessibility for an vision side.

You have accessibility on the cognitive side, you, there's many

different aspects to accessibility.

So, in a way, you have to look at all of those in an individual way.

So those, those are just some of the things I would mention.

But I wanted to mention, um, funding in the sense that there

is, just to identify the sources.

It's not, you know, TCRP is not an advocacy program and I don't wanna

suggest in any way that it is,

but to understand.

how many funding sources are there at the local level we're getting into three

digits people, you know, it's, it's, um, uh, it's a lot of different ways that

local communities do support transit and just an inventory, a list of those.

A current project is doing a sort of a, uh, uh, a menu of the different

ways that locals could consider.

Thank you.

If you just stepped up where you've, uh, stepped into, uh, a live recording of

Transit Unplugged Podcast with a expert panel to talk about the value of research.

and how it is affecting real transit on the street.

And I wanna ask Michael next a question about that Art, you

mentioned automation, Michael, didn't you just do a study on that?

Yes.

Yeah.

We recently released, well it was a couple years ago, um, as a TCRP study

on the effects of vehicle automation, on the public transportation workforce.

And tell us what, what was the outcome?

What was the, uh, summation would you say?

we tried to look at, um, automating different kinds of rubber tired services.

Right.

And how potentially, uh, those different frontline jobs, like bus operators,

mechanics and service people, dispatchers and street supervisors, how might they

be impacted with, let's say, you know, automated BRT service or automated, uh,

mobility on demand, things like that.

Um, or, uh, automation in the yard.

Right?

In a, in a bus yard.

bottom line was, if automation of transit vehicles is, is implemented, yeah.

There's, you know, there's gonna be impacts on the frontline workforce.

It's not all bad news though, right?

there are changes.

upskilling or other, uh, approaches to training current staff right,

can actually benefit, employees that might be impacted by the automation.

and we actually have in the reports, you know, some guidelines and one

of 'em was be employee centric.

If you're gonna implement automation, remember to talk to

your frontline employees, get people involved along the way.

Uh, so that you can maximize the benefits and minimize any sort of negative impact.

That was one of the key takeaways from that work.

That's excellent.

let me ask you like, how long do these things normally take you?

You've worked on a bunch of 'em, right?

So let's say you, you win and you get to do the study.

How long does it take you to do a study?

It really depends on the nature of the study.

It's anywhere from, you know, eight, eight to 10 months on the low end to

18 to 24 months on, on the long end.

'cause there's different kinds of studies in the TCRP program.

There's synthesis studies, which are short and sweet and

what's going on in the industry.

There's sort of short turnaround, mid-tier studies.

We call 'em J elevens.

I don't know why, but I'm sure there's some sort of magical reason,

um, that are usually a little bit longer, but um, or more focused.

And then there's the bigger projects, you know, and those might

take 18 to 24 months depending.

Um, so it's, yeah, they can be, they could be long projects.

Kate, I got a question for you, a real life question you just presented

or you're presenting on causal inference for transit funding.

Tell me about that.

What is that?

Uh, yes.

Um, it was actually yesterday morning at 9:00 AM on a Sunday.

So I appreciated all those folks that came out early on Sunday, Sunday morning.

I'm sure was hundreds there for that.

There was, the room was packed, Paul.

That's good.

The room was packed.

So, um, the workshop part of it, it's about, uh, causal inference and in the

transportation economics context, that's all about evaluating the impact of, uh,

transportation policy or, uh, investment.

Some, some sort of interventions, right.

And evaluating the such impacts, and actually more importantly,

effectively communicating these impacts, um, or for transit investment

is ever more important now, right?

Because of the issues that we raised about having sustainable source of

funding for transit and even, you know, related is also to how do we change,

um, you know, perhaps our, our car centric culture in America, right?

So yesterday we also, um, learned about congestion pricing, uh, new York City

and how, um, that could be a potential source to fund New York City transit.

And what also even more important there from that, uh, uh, session

yesterday, we learned that.

Hey, congestion pricing actually is good for everybody because the studies found

that, um, congestion actually got reduced in areas outside of the pricing zone.

So it's really a win-win for everybody, not just for those who are transit

customers, but also for everybody else, uh, in, in the, um, in the area.

Um, another related example, uh.

You know, for causal inference and, um, funding, it's really my, you know,

passion and, and interest, connecting transit, investment and property values.

And in that field, that vast field of research, um, we've pointed out that

value capture of transit, it's really can be a successful tool to not only fund

transit as far as other needed, community investments such as affordable housing.

I love that.

I wanna unpack that a little bit more, if you don't mind.

For those of you who aren't familiar, this is a really unique

concept, like MTR and Hong Kong.

All these other groups, they fund transit a lot differently

than we do here in America.

Uh, matter of fact, MTR doesn't get any subsidy.

Uh, they get their money from like Brightline is done building up, uh,

transit oriented development around the stations and then, uh, charging

rent for that and capturing that money.

But there's also something called captured value where the value of property goes

up around transit hubs, uh, and stations.

And how do they actually capture that for the transit agency?

What's What tell us how that works.

Sure.

I'm actually born in Hong Kong, so I know all about, you know that what they do, uh,

. That's right, that's right.

Um, so for example, um, one mechanism of, uh, value capture is

actually tax increment financing.

Where just to be clear, they're not increasing tax on properties around

transit stations they're actually capturing the increase in property

values, incremental, above and beyond the normal rate of increase.

and attributing that to the success of, uh, transit oriented development, so

that with that incremental, um, increase in, um, property values, a percentage

of that of the tax, uh, revenue coming from that increase in property values

actually gets, directed to a general fund.

It could be for transit, it could be for affordable housing,

it could be for education, whatever the voters decided to do

Very interesting, isn't it?

Yeah.

And that's the kind of stuff that these studies call out, right?

That's right

that's great.

So if you haven't ever read a TCRP study or a TRB study, there's

all kinds of good stuff there.

Alright.

Art.

Um,

we're at TRB so I'm sure you had your ear to the ground

while you're here.

What are you hearing people say right now about what they want studies on?

What do we need to know?

What's new?

Well, one, one thing I might say, uh, in response to that is the TCRP program

of course there's a process for annual solicitation of ideas, but what about

ideas that come up along the way?

Right.

It's a, it's a dynamic world and, uh, even sometimes as practitioners are

navigating around, they're saying, you know here's something that we

just noticed, and is there a way of flexibly and nimbly and quickly, uh,

addressing this kind of a question.

Uh, so I might highlight, uh, some of those things.

For example,

We, the transit industry is implemented in a very broad way, something

called positive train control.

And what that is, if a, if a potential hazardous situation

is coming up on down the way of

the track, the system will kick in and sort of stop the train.

Okay, well we've put a lot of money into implementing those kind of systems.

Shouldn't that decrease the liability?

Right.

Uh so we're trying to figure that out.

How does one work hand in hand with the other if we're a lot safer

because of positive train control?

Shouldn't that impact the liability insurance?

Which by the way is a problem in itself.

Insurance is very expensive.

Uh, so we're trying to connect the dots on a question like that would

also have a question with them.

Uh, marijuana testing, for example, uh, transit drug operators in any

sensitive safety position needs to be drug and alcohol tested.

It's a federal law.

Well, um, the problem with marijuana testing is there,

um, traces in your system.

it's not really on impairment, you know, so it's on, does

it show up in your system?

And by the way, it's legal in many places of the country.

So how can we come a way of testing for marijuana that, um, that tests

for impairment, not for the presence.

Those kind of, these are some of the practical issues, but 'cause

by the way, we need operators.

You know, we wanna make it, um don't wanna put up artificial

barriers to hiring an operator when, when really you can hire someone.

It's, they're in the law and they're not impaired.

So why, you know, why put up a roadblock to that kind of thing.

I would also say something, another issue around the country is.

call it governance, uh, transit.

Every transit system has a board, of course, uh, to set policy direction.

Uh, but they're all done in many, many different ways.

Uh, again, this is another one we're probably in three digits, Paul.

And how many different models are there for governance?

and we're taking a, a close look at that question.

Some, there are issues around the country, sometime there are city suburb.

uh, but there are all kind of reasons, uh, why governance can be tricky.

So the better we understand that issue, the better we are.

And the, and the final thing I'll mention again, these are all very specific,

very granular kind of questions, is what about schedules for operators?

Again, we wanna make it easy to hire well, if someone has their job and

they have, okay, you have to show up at, uh, five in the morning.

We need rubber on the road.

We need to start service early in the morning.

Uh, and we also need you later in the day for the evening rush.

Uh, and in between you can go home, uh, well, you know, hey, a young person

with a family who, uh, uh, might not like that kind of a schedule routine.

So, uh, we're looking at what is the impact on schedules as far as

making them more, , attractive, , to workers, making them more say friendly.

Friendly.

And, uh, what can we understand better about those problems?

So those several problems I'd flag is.

Current issues that come up.

sometimes, uh, you know, along the way.

And, uh, there's a program that TCRP has the J 11 program that enables

TCRP to take them on quickly.

All right, let's go to Michael.

There's another big issue along those lines of employee retention

and that is you just, are you doing a study now on health and wellness of

operators and how that impacts, you know, the ability to get employees?

Talk to us about that.

Yeah.

Um, I'm involved in two active studies right now and one coming up, uh,

that are all focused on, operator health and wellness or retention.

Um, one, one is a project we're doing with our partners at the International

Transportation Learning Center, or ITLC.

that project is specifically focused on how to change organizational culture or

improve organizational culture inside a transit agency so that the workforce,

feels like it's a safe, psychologically safe place where they can raise concerns,

get their concerns addressed, right?

Because culture is a really big part of the bus operator

retention, you know, solution.

It's not just, Raising the wage, of course that has value.

But, um, so that, that research, it's TCRP project F 32, um, is specifically

focusing on how can culture improve operator recruitment and retention.

another one is a synthesis project that's looking at operator health and wellbeing.

And that that particular project is trying to look at how to transits,

you know, implement, health supporting programs, things that reduce stress,

things that improve operator health, because the reality is, like Art

mentioned, you know, the, an operator job is, is a difficult job period.

Baseline conditions are, are difficult between schedules,

working with the public, maintaining the schedule, et cetera.

And so these studies are looking at ways to support the workforce, right?

Um, in ways we haven't really thought about before, at least as

an industry, haven't really put as much attention on as we should have.

How do we improve health?

How do we improve wellbeing?

How do we improve culture?

Uh, so that the workforce that matters so much to the day-to-day

operations, um wants to stay?

And that's what this research is, is about.

alright, we're almost done.

Uh, we're gonna wrap up here in just a few minutes, but Kate, tell

us about the role that you you play with tCRP, but you're also are, are

very active in the COMTO DC chapter.

Right.

Talk to us about that and how you all work together.

Sure.

so TCRP and COMTO actually has a partnership to expose, develop,

opportunities and pathways For folks in the transit industry,

especially, uh, for minorities.

so for TCRP, um, they, you know, we've already talked about a lot about,

eliciting, uh, research needs statements and developing the actual research

and, um, disseminating the research.

Right But COMTO cOMTO comes in and actually help actualize those initiatives.

And bring them into action by one, elevating disadvantaged

and minority owned businesses.

Two working with entities like the WSP, to, sponsor, scholarships and internships.

And lastly really to, um, COMTO DC uh, and other national chapters

also are actively engaged in, um, spotlighting talents from HBCUs to

ensure there's a knowledge transfer there

That's wonderful.

Thank you.

Art, why don't you, uh, give us your closing thoughts on the value of studying.

Anything else you wanna talk about with APTA?

I just, I'd just like to underscore that the it's a comprehensive program

It's uh it's the data and statistics that help U.S. measure performance.

It's the research that helps us solve problems, you know so all of

these things go into a comprehensive holistic transportation program.

So I think I would say in this year, as we're looking to reauthorize the

programs, let's make sure we all have a mind on research and its important

role in the holistic federal program.

That's great.

Kate, any closing thoughts

just, uh, you know, get on, get in transit, get out of

your cars, and, um, oh yeah.

And Michael,

And, lastly, I just am so excited about this attention to research.

And this opportunity to sit and talk through just how important it really is

that we sit and wrestle with these tough problems, but in a way that practitioners

can have confidence that what they're seeing outta the TCRP program is

implementable, is based on evidence and as something they can run with, you know,

as soon as they can possibly, uh, use it.

So thanks.

Absolutely.

You know, I'm gonna close by talking about why we do what we do.

So I've spent 38 years of my life working in public

transportation and local government.

I started out right outta college, running a small bus system an hour from here on

the eastern shore of Maryland, just over the Bay Bridge in Queen Anne's County.

And I can tell you that every day for those first seven years when I was

working, uh, transporting elderly people with disabilities, and then eventually

we started a public transit system.

Every day I was in direct contact with our passengers.

I rode the bus with them.

I got a commercial driver's license so I could drive.

I was only 22.

All of my drivers could have been my parents or grandparents and

all the employees there, you know?

So I wanted to have their respect and the way to do it was to

be able to do what they do.

But every day I went home with my heart feeling full.

I felt warm inside because I knew the impact I was having on their

lives because I was actually involved with them on a day-to-day basis.

And the further I moved up in the industry, I made sure that I wanted to

stay connected with what we're really doing this for, which is our passengers.

We're really here to serve them.

We're not here about the trains, the type of trucks underneath of it.

The AI, uh, the software, the technology, those are all great tools, but they're

all tools in service of a greater good, which is the mobility of people.

Not only those who need it, but also those who want it, who wanna have a

positive impact on the environment and don't wanna drive their own car,

wanna be able to ride in mass transit.

The, the impact that we have, the 500,000 people in this, in this

country of America, and the hundreds of thousands of more around the world

on the actual structure of how society works, is kind of hard to fathom.

Uh, if you were to pull transit out of a city for one day.

Think about how that city would operate.

It wouldn't.

It is we are the veins that transport the blood, the people that work in that city,

the impact we have on an economic value.

But in my life, even more importantly, um, on the, the people who use it,

I spent a lot of my career working with people with disabilities.

Um.

I feel like they deserve the very best we can give because they

need it more than almost anyone.

And without us they may not have access to almost any of the

opportunities that life offers them.

They may be home bound and not be able to get out.

So when you leave this place and all the research that's done.

Just keep in mind, you know, like, um, Stephen Covey said, with one of

the seven habits of highly effective people, begin with the end in mind,

our end is to improve the lives of people through public mobility.

And the work you do makes that happen every day, and you really do make

a difference in people's lives.

There's not a higher calling we can have than to serve people

through what we're doing.

Let's thank our, our great guest speakers here today and I'm sure

they'll be available to talk to you a few minutes afterwards if you'd like.

And thank you for being part of it.

I encourage you to subscribe to our podcast.

It's wherever podcasts are heard, Transit Unplugged.

Thank you so much and thank you Jamaal and the group for putting it on.

Thank you for listening to this episode of Transit Unplugged, the world's

number one transit executive podcast.

I'm Julie Gates, executive producer of the podcast.

Many thanks to the team that makes this show happen.

Host and producer, Paul Comfort, producer Chris O'Keeffe, editor Patrick Emil,

associate producer Cyndi Raskin Transit.

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