Dementia is a cruel

disease, and to try and make

sense of that, you know, this is

my mum. This is somebody that I

cherish. I spend a lot of time

with my mum. That's incredibly

important to me, but I can't fix

it. So in the absence of being

able to fix it, I want to try

and do something that makes a

difference for her, for sure.

But actually, as I've learned

more and more about dementia,

what I love the idea of the most

is being able to make

everybody's day a little bit

better to be honest.

Hello and welcome

to storytelling for business,

the podcast that helps you build

meaningful relationships with

your customers and clients by

telling stories they want to

hear. I'm Katie Flamen. I'm a

voice actor and podcaster

specialising in business

storytelling. I work from my own

recording studio right here, and

I do a bit of everything

corporate, videos, ad campaigns,

training modules and answer

phone messages. My clients

include Pearson, Pfizer and

Volkswagen. They've all trusted

me to help them share brand

stories and business

developments. So storytelling

for business seems these days,

everyone's banging on about

storytelling, but what's that

all about? Really? What's the

power of story? Can telling

stories really boost your

business? I'm investigating. I'm

talking to storytelling experts

and regular business owners to

find out. And actually, today's

guest is a bit of both. Louise

callin is the founder and CEO of

a brand new startup, real life

conversations. She's invented an

app to support people with

dementia and their carers. It

brings family photos to life,

guiding conversations and

unlocking memories. Louise's

business, literally, is

storytelling. I'm so excited to

have her here. She's joining us

from her boat, which is why you

might be able to hear boat

noises in the background.

Louise, Callan, welcome to the

podcast. Thank you so

much, Katie, thank you for

inviting me. This is a very

exciting day for us at Reel Life

Conversations.

Well, it's

brilliant to have you, and it's

such a fascinating and unique

idea. So let's, let's jump right

in. So, Louise, what actually

have you invented?

Invented such a

cool word. I love it as somebody

that's been involved in sex.

What I have invented is the

ability for a dementia patient

and their caregiver, whether

that caregiver be a paid carer,

somebody in a hospital, hospice

or, you know, care home type

environment, friend, family. It

gives two people the ability to

sit down and have a conversation

about the family photographs

that have been collated and are

in front of them. It provides

so that they've

got an an iPad, a tablet,

something like that, in front of

them.

Ideally a tablet, yes,

ideally a tablet, and any

tablet.

And how do the

how do the pic? How do the

pictures get in there? What what

I mean. Really talk us through

it step by step. If I, if I say,

Yes, I want to get this. What do

I what

happens? What happens

is we, we envisage the role of a

family administrator. And a

family administrator is most

likely the person that's going

to download the app, and at that

point they will be able to set

up some very basic things about

their loved one. Their name is

very important, because we

welcome that person by name

every time they look at the app

the family administrator then,

either by themselves, can upload

photos to their own space, which

is secure and has all of the

privacy things that you would

expect by themselves. They can

upload all of those photos into

the app, or we have a concept of

contributors, and those

contributors can be friends,

family members of the loved one

with dementia. And they can also

add their photos. What we'd

really like is a sentence or two

about each of those photos,

whether that be the why that

photo was taken, it might be

something about the where. It

might be about the who,

but we don't

mind. So this is, this is you,

you and Uncle Phil, when you

went for that lovely walk,

exactly in Brighton,

absolutely. And if the

photo is a digital photo, we can

use lots of the information that

the digital photo holds about

itself. If it is a photo of a

photo from your photo album,

your physical photo album, we

don't care about that either, as

long as you can just about see

what that photo is. Just take a

snap of it, upload it into our

album. Some

of them are going

to be old, aren't they really

old? We

black and white,

colour. If it's got curly edges,

we don't care. Pop it in. Add it

to the album. Add it to your

real life conversation album.

And in the background, what we

do is we go and join all of

those photos together. So

imagine the visual of chucking

100 photos, let's just say, up

in the air, and then as they

land down on your desk, they've

got hundreds of little bits of

string that show all of the

things that link those photos

together. And it's a beautiful

map on your desk, your table,

whatever it might be. And the

things that link those pictures

together might be people, it

might be places, it might be

time, a decade, for example, or

a year. It might be a particular

holiday, destination, might be

anything like that. But the

other thing that we look at are

everyday objects in every single

photo. Because if your loved one

doesn't remember the who, they

don't remember the why, they

don't remember the where we

still provide the opportunity to

talk about that photo, there is

no swiping right in our app,

because you don't remember

something we will always pick

out, Oh, what a what a beautiful

necklace you're wearing in that

photo. If you use that in front

of me now, was one of the

pictures in the photo we would

pick out, gosh, they look like

ear muffs, for example. Or it

might be something about your

lovely necklace. It might be the

colour red in the corner of your

cardigan. So we will pick out

items from that picture. So even

if all of the obvious things in

that photo aren't something that

you remember, actually there's

always

something to talk

about. How did this idea come

about? So I have a mum

with dementia, and she's about

five to six years into her

journey at the moment, and she

loves more than anything, to

look at our family photos. It's

something that gives both me and

her joy. They are moments of

calm, and when you're talking

about dementia, I always feel

like that expression of if you

know, you know, because if

you've ever looked after someone

with dementia, you know that a

quiet and peaceful five minutes

or 10 minutes is just worth its

weight in gold. It's just

incredible. It's such a lovely

time. Because it's not always

like that, dementia is a very

difficult disease to observe to

have, and those moments make a

huge difference. So I've had a

30 year almost career in

corporate technology, and at the

back end of last year, decided

that I wanted to do something

different. I let my brain Potter

around for a few weeks, thinking

about what I might do, and this

concept of my two, you know,

huge parts of my world, my

career and being a carer for my

mum, started to come together,

and Reel Life Conversations has emerged.

Wow, okay, okay,

that's so fascinating. All

right, so, so tell us about,

tell us about your mum. What's

she like? What? What's she like

now, and what was she like? My

mom's amazing. She's

She has got a wicked sense of

humour, and she still has, she

still has today, sometimes we

get that little twinkle, usually

a naughty twinkle, I'm not gonna

lie, a little twinkle in her eye

that can emerge from all sorts

of funny scenarios. I'm

embarrassed to say that

sometimes that can be at other

people's expense, but that is

also part of her job. She's,

she's been an incredible, you

know, traditional mum. She was a

great support to my dad during

his during his business life and

and she was a great mum to my

brother and I, and she moved

down to be near me about 12

years ago, and lockdown was

tough for my mum. No question.

Yeah, she lived on her own, and

all of the things that gave my

mum structure, all of the things

that gave my mum purpose, and

all of the things that honestly

gave her a lot of joy, which was

spending time with other people,

suddenly got stripped away, like

it did for us all. So she wasn't

unique in that sense, but the

loneliness, hour after hour, day

after day, I don't think any of

us appreciated just how

impactful that was and the

ongoing and long term effects

that that would have on so many.

Hmm, so, yeah. Fast forward, she

began to change. She began to

lose confidence in things like

directions, and she suddenly

didn't remember how to organise

things my mum. We always used to

laugh about my mum and say that

she had the ability to organise

the logistics of a small

nation's army. She was an

incredible planner. And in a

different life, my mum would

have been a project manager for

some some company doing

something, because that's how

life she was just an amazing

list maker. Nothing fell through

the cracks. She was just that

woman, and all of a sudden, you

know, that really was obvious

that that skill wasn't really

happening, and she didn't want

to organise in that way, and she

couldn't organise in that way

anymore. So even though they

might not seem like big things,

they were hugely different for

the way that from the way that

my mum operated and the way that

she she liked to organise

herself, and she didn't have

confidence. She didn't have

confidence anymore. She stopped

friendships, she stopped wanting

to talk to people, and I think

honestly, she was scared of

being found out that there was

something really wrong, and that

her life had shifted and

changed. So yeah, we started on

the journey of trying to get her

diagnosed, which was an epic

journey because of flat refusal

and denial, desire not to tell

people how she really felt, and

it was very difficult. It's a

very difficult thing to go

through diagnosis for dementia,

and you feel like

the bad guy, I guess, oh, in

that because, you know, there's

something wrong, yes, and you

want to help,

yeah, but, and the only

person that can really talk

about the differences, if

someone doesn't want to talk

about it is those that are

closest to so you go from being

like numero uno, the person that

is like your, your you know,

your best person, in some ways,

to being the worst person in the

world. And that's the real shift

of role. It's a real shift of,

yeah, it's a very difficult time

different, a very

different dynamic. I can imagine

that. And it was interesting

when, when you talked about

COVID robbing people of that

connection and feeling

disconnected from other people,

because you're right, we did all

feel that and and whether we

worked remotely or whether we

live, depending on who you are,

you've had a very different

experience of COVID, right?

People trying to homeschool, or

people who live by themselves,

being desperately lonely or

whatever. But that feeling of

being robbed of connection is is

universal, and that's really

what dementia does, too, isn't

it? It's kind of what, what your

mum ended up kind of, kind of

developing in her maybe COVID

kick started, it, whatever

happened. It's a, it's a more

permanent version of of

lockdown.

I guess. Never thought

of it that way. But, yeah, I

think, I think you bang on. None

of us. I don't think really know

how it feels to be that person

and be in that space. But the

observation, you know, seeing it

being so incredibly difficult to

link one thing to the next, the

science says that's exactly

what's going on. The brain is no

longer functioning in the way

that it used to because of a

disease that is impacting its

ability to send messages,

whether that, you know, for all

sorts of different reasons. But

exactly joining the dots is no

longer a natural thing, and it's

hampered. I love what you said.

Then actually, it's, it's, it's

a very different form of

lockdown.

So you became,

well, maybe overnight, but also

over a longer period of time, a

dementia expert. I'm, I'm,

you've got this tech background.

You've got a very smart mind,

and this was happening to to

this beautiful role model,

wonderful woman in your life.

And I mean, I don't know about

you, but I want to always want

to help. I want to fix things. I

want to make it all better, take

it away, whether it's my child

or somebody I really care about.

I want. If I could take the pain

onto myself, I really would. And

it seems to me that's what that

I mean, starting a business is a

big deal, so you must have

really wanted to make a

difference with this. I

absolutely did. You know, I'm

gonna say it again, because I we

must keep hammering. This home.

Dementia is a cruel disease, and

to try and make sense of that,

you know, this is my mum. This

is somebody that I cherish, and

knowing that I can do nothing to

fix it is very difficult. It's

very difficult for a person like

many of us are I don't mean I'm

unique, but for a person like

me, it's very difficult to not

just try and want to fix the

problem. I can't fix the

problem. I spend a lot of time

with my mum. That's incredibly

important to me, but I can't fix

it. So in the absence of being

able to fix it, I want to try

and do something that makes a

difference for her, for sure.

But actually, as I've learned

more and more about dementia and

people with dementia, actually,

I what I love the idea of the

most is, is being able to make

everybody's day a little bit

better, to be honest, real life

conversations isn't about fixing

everybody's day for 20 hours a

day. It's absolutely not that.

It's about capturing a moment,

and it's about having a moment

where you just get something

back, you get a little glimpse,

you get a little glimpse of of

the person that you used to

know, and allow them to feel

that a little bit more like the

person that they recognise as

well.

Yeah, yeah. So

bringing that connection back

for both sides, for them and for

you, and recognising who they

were, it's, yeah, I get it. I

completely get it. So how many

people have dementia in the UK,

and how many people are looking

after those people?

So there are about a

million people in in the UK that

have dementia today. It's a

significant number of people.

It's the UK second largest

killer, or is it now even the

UK's largest killer? It is

researched very, very well.

There's lots of research going

on at the moment, incredible

amounts of research, but there

are lots of families that do

everything they can to try and

support their loved one. The

statistics say there are 600,000

people in the UK today that are

unpaid carers to their loved one

with dementia.

That is

staggering, isn't it, a million

people and 600,000 other people.

So it's affecting, it's

affecting a lot of people and

and I was thinking when you were

when you were saying about the

health implications if somebody

has a diagnosis of cancer, of

course, that's devastating, but

there's usually a plan or a

roadmap or something they can

do, or they tell you that

there's nothing they can do, but

at least you kind of know, and

with if somebody breaks a limb

or needs an operation, there's

usually a there's usually a way

to go about it, but there's not

a lot that they can do with

dementia. Is there, or is there?

Is there kind of groundbreaking

treatments? You said, there's

loads of research. So what do

you know? And I also know that

you've got scientific advisors

on board with Reel Life

Conversations. So I mean, kind

of how deep a dive have you done

into all of into all of

the science? So I'm

going to talk about being a

daughter of a dementia patient,

and then I can talk about being

a business owner of a dementia

service or tool or product. So

as a daughter, it's a lonely,

lonely world. It is a very

difficult time to navigate. One

of the things that I've said

before, and it's it was actually

in my first blog, and it was a

really poignant thing. In the

beginning, I found it so

difficult to read all of the

information that there is out

there about my mum's path and

where she was heading. It. It's

a bleak, bleak path, frankly,

and I couldn't digest it. I used

to find it so difficult knowing

that that's the direction that

my mum was heading in and one of

my greatest friends, what a

blessing she was. She used to

read all of that for me. She

used to read books, cover to

cover, the guides information on

the internet. And then she would

gently summarise for me. She

would pick out the bits that

would be the most helpful at

this stage, and then some of the

other stuff she would just leave

for the moment. We have this

great concept of like now, next

and later. What do I need to

know now? What I need to know

next? And what can I worry about

friends? So. What a treasure she

was, and now we feel a lot more

confident with the information.

I've got a lot more experience.

My own journey as a carer has

evolved, of course, because you

learn more and more as you're

looking after somebody. And to

be honest, I look back at some

of the things I used to do and

say and wince a little bit, I

think for a long time, I

protected my mum and did it with

the absolute best of intentions,

but I used to almost pretend

that a lot of the things weren't

happening in order to save her

embarrassment, I used to help

her with things that probably

would have if we'd have sorted

some of those things out before,

we might have had more help

earlier, or at least a diagnosis

earlier. But instead of that,

through protection and love and

respect, all of those things

that you have as a daughter, I

didn't, and it actually sort of

went the other way, I think in

some ways, now fast forward to

being a business owner trying to

look at the science and all of

the information that's out

there. Meeting Dr Phil Jodrell

was just an absolute blessing.

Frankly, here's a man that has

spent the last well over 10

years studying the effect of

accessible technology for people

with dementia, and looking and

studying all sorts of different

scenarios. And here was me sort

of bumbling along with this

great idea, what I thought was a

great idea, and then having

somebody that's looked at this,

you know, nod and actually

gently say, Yeah, you're onto

something here. This is good. I

like it, and he's been a huge

asset to our team, and very

lucky. Feel very lucky to have

him on board, and he's helped us

no end silly things that might

mean nothing to some people, but

to a dementia patient, makes all

the difference. So having your

mouse, not just as a mouse, but

actually giving you just a

little bit more instruction, bit

more obvious, hovering as to

where you are, and a little bit

of feedback. So whether that's

in in the form of like a haptic

or something, so you get the

little the little judder, if

you've done something that

you're expecting to do with your

tablet, fonts, you know, there's

a lot of research around

accessible fonts, and then

there's an extra little bit that

actually helps a dementia

patient as well. So clarity is

just so important. Colours,

yeah, colours are very

important, and how we figure out

the right colour to use to be

able to distinguish between

information and non information.

How we simplify all of the data

on the screen? Strip away as

much as possible so that there

is as little complexity as

possible. But I guess a lot of

that is obvious, but one of the

things that is so important for

the self esteem of a dementia

patient is to not have a fear of

failure. There is no right or

wrong in real life

conversations, it doesn't exist.

There is no right or wrong. You

can't get it wrong. And so for

somebody that worries about

getting it wrong doesn't want to

be exposed for getting it wrong,

all of a sudden, there's an

activity that you can do that

doesn't care whether you're

right or wrong. And that

principle of it doesn't have to

be perfect was actually

something that I've used right

from the beginning. It doesn't

have to be perfect. And for a

dementia patient, being able to

feel like they can contribute to

a conversation, and if they get

something wrong, it doesn't

matter. It doesn't change the

direction. It doesn't give you a

no ever. You just keep flowing

through. And this is where it's

important for a carer as well.

So a caregiver that might or

might not be a friend family

member, they actually might be

somebody that is just getting to

know the person with dementia

now didn't know anything about

their past, those prompts that

help to be able to support that

kind of conversation is, I'm

told, a very valuable asset,

because always trying to think

of something to say in what can

be quite banal conversation, to

be honest, because it's not, It

doesn't flow naturally. So

actually having prompts that

guide you, I think, is going to

be something that is a real game

changer for many. And that's my

dream. That's my hope. I guess

there's,

there's probably

a lot of anxiety or fear, maybe

if, if you show a picture to

someone and they don't know who

it is, they don't remember

where. It is they don't

recognise anything that could

potentially be quite a stressful

experience for them. So I love

that you've got something,

there's always something that

you can pick up on. And like you

said, they can't get it wrong.

Yeah, and that's

honestly, that's lived

experience, that is lived

experience that has gone into

the design, because there's been

way too many times where I've

looked at a picture and I

haven't got a clue, you know, if

that's uncle Fred's great friend

or whatever else, haven't got a

clue who it is. Haven't had the

opportunity to ring around my

cousins and ask them. Haven't

got anyone there in the moment

that can help me. Don't know

anything about it. So what do I

do? Oh, I poker. Oh, look at

what a gorgeous dress. Gosh,

weren't the 40s beautiful? You

know, whatever it might be, you

know, what was your favourite

thing? And all of a sudden,

you've generated a conversation

naturally, because you can see

it in that picture. So there's

no surprise why you're suddenly

talking about something, but

you've unlocked the ability to

have a much more natural

conversation, because there's

something to tie it to. The

picture is your anchor, and it

can unlock if your patient, your

I never want to say patient,

very sorry. Shouldn't say

patient. If your loved one with

dementia, or the person that you

are looking after that has

dementia, recognises someone in

the photo, amazing. We can go

off. We can look at other photos

of that person. We can see where

that takes us on our little

journey of photos. But if you

don't, there's a backup, and

there's a plan, and there's

always the ability to honour

that photo and not just move on

just because your loved one

doesn't remember who's in it.

I think, I mean,

I'm just gonna pick up on you

saying I didn't mean to say

patient. I shouldn't say

patient. I think I get it. I

should think this is the most

extraordinarily frustrating

experience, perhaps you've ever

had in your life. And it must be

exceptionally difficult to not

just just, you know, chuck

everything up in the air and

walk out sometimes because

you're trying and you're trying

and you're trying, and it must

feel like you're banging your

head against a brick wall some

days. Oh, totally. I am i right

there? Absolutely. I

mean one of the things again,

I'll say it again if you know,

you know, but no yesterday, and

this is the honest truth,

because I've got no reason to

lie to you. I really needed a

hug from my mum. It didn't

really matter if she knew or she

didn't know, but yesterday, I

really wanted a hug from my mum

yesterday, not a chance. Didn't

stand a chance of getting that

hug. But I think there was some

deep down awareness of mum that

she hadn't got it quite right. I

cannot even begin to imagine how

hard that is for her, and it

breaks me every time that

happens, as I say, there are

really good reasons for taking

huge risks in life, but if it

is, nothing feels more important

than this right now. Nothing

feels more important

well, you're

doing a double risk. You're

doing this, you're, you're,

you're, I guess it's it's a risk

because you don't know if it

will help all the people. You

think it's going to help. I

think it probably will massively

help lots of people. But it's a

risk because you're starting a

business, and whether people

have experience of dementia or

being a carer or not, whether

they're a parent or not, it's

starting a business is a big

deal. It is scary. It is it is a

lot. So I think, is there a

story that you were telling

yourself all those years in

tech, and then did that story

change when you ended up

deciding to do this kind of, I

mean, I'm not going to say mad

idea, because it's a brilliant

idea, but it's, it's a bit of a

pivot right from from doing

although all those years in

corporate, to now being an

entrepreneur and and all the

other stuff that goes with that.

I just like to say

triple risk. I've never done a

podcast before, but that's

besides I yeah, of course, you

know, back doing the kind of job

that I did, I had the absolute

privilege of leading lots of

people my you know, my teams

meant everything to me. And I

always tell a funny story about

wanting to be a physio. That was

all I ever wanted to be growing

up. I wanted to be a

physiotherapist. I didn't get my

grades a level. I messed it up

and I went to do a computing

degree. As I have progressed

through my career, actually

caring about people, solving

problems, teamwork. I. Yeah, and

actually trying to make a

difference. It landed every day

for me in my corporate world,

what has become and what's

emerged through my mum's

experience and my own experience

of being a carer, I've just

changed those dynamics a bit.

Actually, what really matters to

me is how my 30 years of

experience doing what I do can

actually make a difference to

people I am so passionate about,

carers and people that do this

as a job, they are the most

under celebrated group of people

as far as I'm concerned. So if

you are listening to this and

you're a carer, thank you so

much for what you do. You do an

incredible job that is at times

very stressful, very hard work.

And I can promise you that six

years ago, I had no idea just

how important your role was, and

now I do so thank you,

perspective, huh?

Yeah, we talk a lot about

perspectives on this podcast and

and seeing things from other

people's perspectives. But I

love that you've, you've kind of

taken what you already had, that

care, that that desire to help

people to see do the very best

for your teams, and, of course,

your your kind of tech brain,

and you've, you've put it all

together into something which is

both exceptionally personal,

exceptionally personal, like

super selfish, if you Like, but

also massively altruistic.

Because, as we said before,

million people with dementia,

600,000 carers, if it takes off

in the way that you hope, it

really will enable people to

feel less fear, feel less guilt

and shame and and tell each

other stories that Well, I say

my introduction every week,

every every podcast episode,

telling your audience stories

that they want to hear. That's

kind of what you're enabling, I

think, with your with your Reel

Life Conversations app,

I hope so. I really

hope so. That is, for me what

it's all about, those stories,

those moments, being able to

unlock memories from storage,

that's one of the things that I

talk about. Sometimes we aren't

able to tap into the things that

someone with dementia does know,

because we can't go back there

with them. And so there we are

having wonderful conversations

about, you know, what's happened

today, or what's in your life,

but where you said selfish

earlier, it's like, great, but

how am I going to actually turn

the table and actually talk

about something the mum wants to

talk about, or your loved one

with dementia, If you don't go

back there with them. How can

you? How do you do it? It's

very, very difficult, and if you

don't know that person's

background, even more so,

oh yeah, if

you're not a close family

member, if you're if you are a

care a nurse or or a grandchild

who does, or great grandchild,

or somebody who doesn't see them

very often, that can be quite

difficult. Can't it to make that

connection

very, very difficult.

You pick on a brilliant point

there. I think it's hard to have

a conversation with someone with

dementia. You have to have the

ability to pivot quickly,

because you just don't know

where it's going to go, because

if they forget what they were

saying, they'll then look at the

table and go, Oh, cup of tea,

you know, because they need a

prompt, and the prompt will be

whatever they can see in front

of them, because they don't want

to stop, because they realise

they were in flow. Well, not

flow, but it's, it's a very,

it's a very difficult thing to

have a conversation. So the idea

of a safe activity, an activity

that helps someone with dementia

go back in time to a place where

perhaps they've got a lot more

to say than if you just keep

going back to yesterday, a story

might emerge for you both that

you had no idea would still be

remembered, and you can honour

that story. You can do something

with it. You can take it with

you, and you could tell someone

else that story as well. So the

idea of unlocking that is hugely

important to me,

and it's it's

legacy as well, isn't it? It's

passing on that knowledge and

that information from the

photos, through the through

their memory and and I love that

you that, that you use the word

unlocking, because it is, it's

really, I think it's really

interesting how memory. My

memories work, and I've got

notoriously bad memory, and I

never remember anything, really,

where I've been, films I've

seen, and then I'm watching it,

and I think, oh, yeah, have seen

that. But it's, it's quite it's

quite personal, but it's also

really universal. And that's, I

think, what, what, what I'm

fascinated about in terms of

these shared stories that you're

able to to bring about, whether,

whether the person has the

knowledge in advance or not, as

you say, you can, you can absorb

a new story and learn something

new that maybe you didn't know

at the beginning of the of the

experience,

absolutely. And I think

one of the things I haven't

talked about at all is like, how

the app will adjust to the stage

of dementia that your loved one

is at. Tell us about that, well,

the things that you need at

early to mid stage are very

different to what you need at,

you know, mid to late, for

example. So what we actually

have the ability to do will do

is, because we are still in

development, is actually adjust

the information that gets

displayed. So in the beginning,

you might want less about

objects and things like that,

because there's a lot more

ability to be able to see and

remember things that are on the

screen in front of you, and

therefore prompting about

objects might be less useful. So

there's effectively, like a

sliding scale where you can talk

about where your loved one is

at, and it will just adjust the

type of information that we

display, going all the way

through to the late stage of

dementia, and I'm not there yet,

so I don't have lived experience

on this, but this is where my

advisors come in, and this is

where the people that are, you

know, incredibly skilled at this

stage have been able to help me.

But the idea of bringing music

in at this point is very

important, because the

conversation ask you about

sounds much less and so then

music becomes way more

important, and then it's much

more of a one sided conversation

where a carer or a loved one

might just be able to sit and

describe a few words about That

picture. But how much more

connected is if actually there

is music that matches the decade

that That photo was taken, or

it's a favourite song. So those

are the things that we're

actually putting in, that kind

of thing, where we can actually

adjust and adapt depending on

where you're at on your journey.

And our hope is that, because

photos are something that

everyone loves to look at, in

the main this is something that

you can use for quite some time,

all the way through, in all

honesty, to end of life, and

being able to then have the

ability, If you so desire, to

connect with a third party that

will allow you to take all of

those photos and pop those into

a memory book, something that

actually you can hold on to.

That's we haven't even thought

about how we're going to do that

yet. I'll be totally honest with

you, but that's on the wish

list. It's on the it's on the

backlog, but that is a very

stressful time for everybody.

I've been to too many funerals

where you see all the photos of

loved ones. That's actually

quite difficult to be doing that

at that stage of grief,

collecting all of those things

together. But actually, if you

had sent in a selection of

favourite photos. How wonderful

to be able to use those to be

able to help you at that awful

stage. So that's a potential.

We're looking into what that

might look like. But yeah, Reel

Life Conversations, we hope, is

going to be a tool that can help

people from as early as they

become aware, all the way

through. And yeah, we're just

looking to give those moments of

joy. One thing I'd love to say

as well,

yeah, go, go, of

course, where

families aren't always

physically together, the guilt

associated with not being able

to continue and contribute

towards everyday care for

someone with dementia, which is

very long and drawn out, is

heavy. It's a very heavy

emotion. What Reel Life

Conversations could allow you to

do say you had a sibling, and

the sibling was the one there

day to day to day, and you

weren't able to be there every

single day. You could take on

the role remotely as the family

administrator. Do all of the

Organising, get all of those

photos gathered together, and

then there is some sense of

contribution to care if

actually. You're the one that is

helping. You can refresh those

pictures if you want to, but you

can do something. And actually,

if I had a penny for every

single time one of my extended

family said to me, is there

anything I can do? And I have to

very politely decline and say

it's very difficult for you to

help remotely. I love the fact

that people message me, of

course, but that's support for

me. That's not actually support

for my Yes,

yeah. It's a

Yeah. And that's different,

isn't it? Yeah, it is lovely.

Okay. How can people sign up?

How can people become a

subscriber or by the app the

Reel Life Conversations.

So the thing that will

help Reel Life Conversations the

most is joining our wait list.

It's not yet available. We are

tracking towards an August

delivery, and so if August 2020

August 2025 doesn't feel that

long way now, ah, but it's stay

calm. It's all fine. It's all

fine. Running a small bit, it's

all good. Every day is a school

day. That expression has never

been more true. But please,

please do go to our website.

Please join our wait list. I

There's a million buttons

everywhere, all over that wait

list, all over the website,

hoping that people might join

our wait list that shows that

this product is needed. And

that's very helpful for a

business, a startup like mine,

to be able to show the need I

know this is needed. I believe

in every ounce of my being that

this will help people. I need

some numbers that show that too.

So if any of your listeners are

impacted by dementia, any of

your listeners are going through

this kind of journey, a, I'm

right by your side, and I know

how tough it is, but B, pop your

name in my wait list, and I

can't wait to be able to unlock

your ability to have some real

life conversations. What's the

website? It is,

www.reellifeconversations.com.

And it's a play on real it's R,

double E, L, because this is

about photos. Love it.

Okay, well, we're

nearly out of time, which it's

been such a fascinating

conversation, quite a heavy

conversation, but also, there's

a lot of hope in there. And I'm

really, really excited for you.

So I'm going to ask you my last

question, which I always ask

people, which is, what does your

story look like for the next

five years?

I I want to land this

product in the hands of as many

people as I can. This is that we

talk about the million people in

the UK. There's 60 million

people worldwide, 60 million

people, if we could make 1% of a

difference to someone's day at

that kind of scale, that feels

amazing to me. I want people to

love my product, and I want to

be able to make a difference.

It's that simple. So my next

five years, I will be walking

the streets. I will be telling

as many people as I can about

the product, and hope that, hope

that people enjoy it.

Lovely, lovely.

Well, it's been a real privilege

to talk to you about it, and I'm

I can't wait to find out how

your launch goes and and what

happens next, but I wish you and

your mum the the very best for

the future. Thank you so Louise

Callan, thank you so much for

being on

the podcast. Thank you

very much for having

me. What a

fascinating conversation. That

was okay. Here are today's key

takeaways. One, What's your why?

Louise was super clear on why

she started her business. She

said, Nothing feels more

important than this right now.

She took a massive risk leaving

her solid 30 year corporate

career to create a business from

scratch, but she is very clear

on why she's doing it, and that

passion really shone through.

Does your business light you up?

Two share stories about your why

wasn't it lovely when Louise

described her mum's wicked sense

of humour and the naughty

twinkle in her eye, and then she

told us about watching her mum

lose confidence and start to

isolate herself, Louise was

really vulnerable in our

conversation, and that's

powerful. It's up to you, of

course, whether you choose to

show up in such a. Real and raw

way. But for Louise, I'm certain

her story will help her

marketing and will make her and

her product stand out and enable

her to help people living with

dementia. Three sharing stories

and CO creating them are a

fundamental human need. Louise

told us her Reel Life

Conversations app is about

capturing a moment and getting

something back. You get a little

glimpse, she said, of the person

you used to know. For people

living with dementia,

communication and connection are

vital to identity, relationships

and emotional well being. But

I'd argue that sharing stories

isn't just a lifeline for

dementia sufferers, it's a

powerful need for all of us. We

really do cover a lot of ground

in this podcast, don't we? A

massive thanks to Louise cannon.

Do check out her website for

more information about her new

app, and you can also watch a

video on there, which shows how

it works. All the details are in

the show notes coming up next time

there was just this

feeling that I work in video, I

need to get in front of video. I

need to I need to push myself.

I've always felt like self

challenges the way that you move

yourself forward. You know you

get to the next stage, and maybe

that's an incremental step, but

all those incremental steps they

they work towards the bigger

picture. So I started doing

sporadic videos, trying to help

people with the same fear as I

have.

Creative Director

Andy Greenhouse on why video

storytelling is so powerful, how

icky he feels about getting in

front of the camera himself, and

why he's doing it anyway. And

that's just a tiny bit of what

our conversation covers. It's

really good, so please make sure

you subscribe so you don't miss

it, and if you're enjoying the

series, please consider leaving

a review so more people can join

our storytelling voyage of

discovery. Okay, time's up. I'm

Katie Flamen, and this is

storytelling for business until

next time. Goodbye. You.