[00:00:00] It's Around the House. I always miss in the construction industry, right? Yeah. What are some of the ones you see out there where people, where you just hold your eyes and go, Oh, it's going to hit. You're right. There, there are a lot of concerns out there that sometimes are completely unbased. And one of them is that a metal roof is going to be noisy.

[00:00:23] I literally in 46 years, excuse me, 44 years in this industry, I have had two complaints about noise. We're on the house shows brought to you by pyramid heating and cooling. Serving in Oregon, the Portland Metro area and Bend, Oregon. They are your one stop shop for heating and cooling and indoor air quality.

[00:00:41] To find out more, head to pyramidheating. com. Oregon CCB 59382. When it comes to remodeling and renovating your home, there is a lot to know. But we've got you covered. It's Around the House. Come to the Around the House show, the next generation of home improvement. Thanks [00:01:00] for joining me today. Doesn't matter if you're on the talk media network out there, catching this on the radio or the podcast or streaming online.

[00:01:07] Thanks for joining us today. And we've got an amazing interview today. This is going to be so much fun. And anytime him and I get together, it's always a good time. So thanks for joining us. I've got Todd Miller, president of Isaiah industries. We're going to talk metal roofing today. But he's also the host of the construction disruption podcast.

[00:01:27] So and a fellow podcaster here as well. Welcome to around the house, brother. Hey, thank you so much. I always enjoy talking with you and love all the work that you do. So thank you, Eric. Looking forward to it. Oh, always fun, man. And you're, you have such a great brand out there with. Isaiah Industries and creating metal roofing and I am such a fan of it and it has come a long way over the years.

[00:01:53] It's not just that metal shed stuff that people think of sometimes. It can look very architectural. [00:02:00] It really can and that really is up to the consumer or the property owner and whatever sort of look that they want. But that is a certainly a nice thing. You can have that traditional long vertical seam metal roof look or you can get metal roofs that Really look like high end slate or wood shakes or shingles or clay tile.

[00:02:19] So lots and lots of alternatives. And I think what's cool is the durability of it. It doesn't matter what look you're going for. If you've got something where you've got extreme weather, whether it's snow, heat, or whatever else, it is a great option. It really is, and that's what a lot of folks will ask me is, where is metal roofing most popular?

[00:02:38] And I'm like, any place that has severe weather that they're trying to fight or they're concerned about, tends to be a good market for metal roofing, whether that's coastal areas worried about hurricanes, or out west worried about wildfires, or even areas worried about seismic activity. Are oftentimes turning to metal because it is so [00:03:00] much lower weight than other roof systems, especially a lot of those seismic prone areas use heavy tile roofing.

[00:03:07] And let's just really just ask it for the house to collapse if much movement goes on. Whereas a metal option provides a much lower weight option for them. You're gonna laugh about this and this is you're bringing up a great example So i'm gonna call a buddy out because he's having a new house built in We'll just call it arizona and we'll leave it at that so we can keep this a little vague but home builder He's buying it in a neighborhood one of the big home builders in the area putting it in And I'm watching them build, which is completely different than they do out here on the West coast and guarantee way different from the East coast.

[00:03:41] I'm watching this house. They've got some plywood. It's framed up. They got plywood or OSB actually around the garage door. I get that for sheer. There's nothing on the outside walls. They've got the roof actually sheathed and they've got the tile preloaded up there. And I'm like, [00:04:00] You were putting how many tens of thousands of pounds on the, on the roof of this, and you haven't got any sheer up on the side of the house.

[00:04:06] I was just like, Oh, I'm like one windstorm away. That thing's got to come over like a deck of cards. Yeah, that does seem awfully dangerous. That's for sure. Interesting. Wow. Different than they do here, but they don't have, they don't have a lot of the other issues, but like, doesn't take much wind to push a building like that over.

[00:04:24] And they had a couple of two by fours up as a is sheer on it. But I'm like, wow, that's. Obviously, they haven't had one happen yet, but at some point, they probably will. They were going to do stucco on the outside, but literally, they just put up some, some, didn't even use OSB on the sides of that thing or plywood.

[00:04:40] They put up some kind of a composite board and stuccoed right over the top of it. So it was a home board on the outside over the stud. So I still looked at that and went, I don't get where they're getting any strength out of that. Very strange when you see that, but you just brought that up with that roofing.

[00:04:56] There's so much weight up there and I'll be honest, I don't want to have [00:05:00] 000 pounds over the top of my head in a seismic zone and wonder, no, is that going to stay up there? Yeah. It's interesting. We actually sell quite a bit of our product into Japan, which is unusual. Not a lot of American building products manufacturers sell into Asia, but.

[00:05:16] What really got that started was I'm old enough to remember this. There was a really severe earthquake a number of years ago in Kobe, Japan. And what they noticed was the houses that had their traditional tile roofs just caved in. And so they really moved toward lower weight roofing materials after that.

[00:05:34] And it's turned out to be a nice market for us for a lot of years. At this point, don't tell my competitors. The physics don't lie on that. It's basic. Okay. We're going to put all this concrete ceramic or. Or clay product over my heads and hopefully it stays up when everything down below it moves, why not lighten that up a bit?

[00:05:49] It's a good call. Absolutely. I'm going to ask you. So what got you started with all of this with Isaiah industries and how did Isaiah industry start out? Cause it's not a new company. [00:06:00] Sure. No, it isn't. The company was actually formed by my father back in 1980. He had been an engineer with. Alcoa building products in the seventies, uh, always had the entrepreneurial bug and left there in 1980 to start this company.

[00:06:13] And I was in high school, so I was working summers and high school and college and came into the business full time in 1986. But our business has changed a lot over those years because back then residential metal roofing was almost unheard of. The metal had. Maybe a one, one and a half percent share of the residential roofing market.

[00:06:34] And we were selling a lot of commercial roofing. So we had national accounts with Pizza Hut and Dairy Queen and IHOP and 7 Eleven and all these chains of the colorful roofs that dotted the highways and byways of our country. And, but in the mid eighties, we saw that commercial business was going to be real prone to fads.

[00:06:55] And so we started spending some time with a few contractors scattered around [00:07:00] who were. We're selling our products residentially, learning what they were doing. And then we just went out and started replicating them, finding more contractors that were, Hey buddy, you want to try this new metal roofing stuff?

[00:07:11] And that was the way it happened. So I did a lot of traveling around the country and set up a network of contractors really across the country who are experienced with our products. But really I think our industry started to grow a lot with the formation of an organization called the Metal Roofing Alliance.

[00:07:29] And the Metal Roofing Alliance is an organization I've been involved with for about 25 years, and I currently am blessed to serve as chair or president of it. But our goal through that organization is consumer awareness and education about metal roofing. And so over the years, we have seen metal now is at about a 15 percent share of the residential re roofing market, probably around 8 or 9 percent of the residential New construction market, but it's very much the number [00:08:00] two player.

[00:08:00] Whereas it used to be metal was sunk down at the bottom with tile and wood shakes and slate. And we all had little single digit market share numbers, but today metal is clearly number two behind the obvious industry leader, which is asphalt shingles. Sure. And. And we notice that asphalt shingles, like everything else, when oil prices change, those things sure change in price as well.

[00:08:22] So that can get to be a little, a little chaotic sometimes when we see as those political seasons change and everything else, all of a sudden when oil goes crazy, so do those building materials. Yeah, they really do. They are heavily, heavily dependent upon the oil market. And so their prices are really dictated largely by that.

[00:08:42] The other thing that we saw, and I don't think that they can do much different, but back in the seventies, when we had the oil embargo and again, stuff I can remember, but what they actually did was they cut the oil content in the shingles. And so a lot of folks out here say I had shingles that used to last [00:09:00] 35, 40 years and they don't anymore.

[00:09:01] And that's usually what it comes down to is. Looking at the oil content, but cutting the oil content makes them affordable and makes them viable because it lessens their, their need for oil content. Yeah, it sure depends on climate too. Cause I've noticed that here as well, that what would be called a 20 or a 25 year roof.

[00:09:19] And our market, because of one, we get a lot of rain and two, we get so much damage from moss and stuff like that. And people trying to clean that off to find out more information about the show, head to around the house, online. com. We'll return with Todd Miller. From Isaiah Industries, we're talking metal roofing.

[00:09:37] Just as soon as Around the House returns, don't change that dial. Welcome back to the Around the House show, the[00:10:00]

[00:10:12] next generation of home improvement. Thanks for joining me today. We've been talking with Todd Miller. About metal roofing from Isaiah industries. And this is something, if you're thinking about a great roofing material for your next project, this is something you should be exploring. Now let's get back to the conversation with Todd.

[00:10:29] We get so much damage from moss and stuff like that. And people trying to clean that off that sometimes those roofs last 15 years. Because of that situation. No, you're absolutely right. It is very much driven by geography. Also. We do a lot of roofing in Texas where asphalt shingles, we, we commonly replace them at seven, eight years.

[00:10:50] But you get here in the Midwest, a fairly moderate climate and sure. 25, 26, 27 years is not unheard of. Yeah, it's amazing. I've been both [00:11:00] to a asphalt shingle factory, watch them get made. And then we have a major steel manufacturing facility here in my area. A steel scape that makes for many companies out there.

[00:11:11] And I got to watch those 50 ton rolls come in off the train and they actually make it into and shrink that metal down into roofing. It was fascinating to watch how much steel those guys crank out. And it really shows, and it's just one of the many manufacturing places around the United States, but it was really amazing to watch how much metal goes out for residential like that.

[00:11:33] It really is. And SteelScape is a great company. In fact, we buy some raw material from them. One of the things that they are really experts at that is also changing our industry, it used to be, if you wanted to buy a metal roof and you had choices of. Brown, green, gray, black, and it was going to be all one color.

[00:11:52] One of the areas SteelScape has really been a leader is putting more than one color of paint on the metal. So [00:12:00] we can get roofs that actually are speckled to look like asphalt, or they're actually. Veined and textured to look like slate. In fact, SteelScape can put as many as I think five or six colors on at one time.

[00:12:14] And they can just do some amazing, amazing, what we call print coats. And those have been very revolutionary in our industry. Yeah. My buddy, John works in that over there and Dan as well. And those guys, huge fans of the show. I chat with them almost weekly on social media, but I tell you what, those guys.

[00:12:32] Over there, I saw one that looked like probably the best way to explain it was it looked like a reclaimed recycled old. Rusted tin roof, but it was completely manufactured. So it had that without rusting everything else around it. People, I'm going to put this very cool, I'm going to make an outside bar area and I'm going to make it look like an old shed.

[00:12:55] And they're going, Hey, wait a minute. I picked up that old stuff off Craig's list or Facebook [00:13:00] marketplace, and it's throwing rust all over the place. And it's like, yeah, that's because it's rust and it's going to damage the concrete. They can put a brand new finish on something and it's absolutely stunning.

[00:13:10] That looks like it's supposed to, but you get that warranty and new product without having to worry about something that's. Already three quarters to its lifespan. Absolutely. Rust is an impossible process to stop once it starts. And yet folks, especially in the mountain States and Southwest like that sort of old rusted look.

[00:13:29] And so lots of good options now with painted finishes. Another thing we're starting to see more call for is. What I call natural metals. So that could be copper, it could be zinc, but another metal we see coming on real strong is anodized aluminum. So you'd normally think of aluminum, you put paint on it, but you can also alter the surface of the aluminum through a process called anodization, which.

[00:13:55] Helps the metal keep that I call it specular. It helps it keep this [00:14:00] sort of metallic look to it. So it no longer looks like paint on there. It looks like what it is colored metal. And so I have big hopes in coming years for anodized aluminum roofing as well. That just adds so much durability to the outside of that, that anodization process used to see if you're into old classic trailers or companies out there that used to make RVs out of anodized, not Airstream so much, but they would sit there and make anodized gold trim on the side.

[00:14:28] Absolutely. 50 years later, it looks amazing still. So that's the cool part with that process. That's that's absolutely right. And, uh, and a good shout out to Airstream, which is just located about 15 miles up the road for me, actually. Uh, they crank those things out by the, by the thousands. Amazing. All right.

[00:14:45] A little secret to anybody going out to that, uh, heritage center there. My little brother has three trailers, uh, that he has restored in their heritage center. And that's cool. Being one that, uh, we rescued. That was, uh, Wally's [00:15:00] original Airstream and Greg's list, and it was sitting out here in a quick little side story, guys.

[00:15:05] We were sitting out here. My brother was restoring Airstreams for people. He's a school teacher and he found one and he's like, wow, it was like 4, 000 bucks and it was pretty hammered. It had been painted on the outside a couple of times. So it looked just absolutely horrible. And when brother got the pictures, he went, wow, that's weird.

[00:15:25] Airstream never put a kitchen in the front. Let me send that over to the heritage center, to his friend at the Airstream there, that was the historian. And he called him up and just kept calling him, calling and calling. He was at, I think he was teaching class or something and kept calling him. And he says, go get that trailer.

[00:15:41] And my brother goes, I didn't even tell you what it costs. He goes, that's the Holy grail. That's Wally's Airstream. We've been looking for 35 or 40 years. You found it. Where is it? So he took the next day off of school and went down and paid the guy. Full price for it for like 4, 200 bucks or whatever and drug it home on new tires and then put the next two years restoring it, [00:16:00] but it is the only painted Airstream they really did because it was painted a yellow to match his fifties Cadillac he was pulling it with.

[00:16:07] So I've seen pictures of it. That's amazing story. Incredible. Yeah. So that was, that's been a. A lot of fun. He's got a few of those down there in that museum. So if you want to check out metal trailers, that's the place to go with that brand new. Yep. And then head 15 miles South and check out metal roofing.

[00:16:23] It's, it's a great combination.

[00:16:28] So I love it, but yeah, it's funny. And I think a lot of people think of, of metal is steel on roofing. And it's just because. Aluminum is a great product for that. Yeah, it really is. It is a little bit more expensive, but especially if someone is in an area where maybe they get a lot of, could be acid rain, something that's really corrosive, or it could be a coastal area.

[00:16:52] Aluminum is a great material for those areas, but it's also what we typically find is, The metal roofing customer [00:17:00] intends to stay in their home for a very long time. They're, they're usually the homeowner that says, Oh, they're going to have to carry me out of this place. And, and so a very durable, long lasting metal roof makes a lot of sense for them.

[00:17:12] Oftentimes aluminum is a good metal for them because it does have a little bit more life to it than some of the other metals, even. Yeah, and I've seen people out there now even take that 30, 40 plus year old roof that they put on that maybe it was a low slope situation or whatever, and have gone back and had professionals paint them and make them look absolutely amazing again, when maybe they wanted a color change or the sun did its damage like any painted roof.

[00:17:38] Absolutely. And the paint finishes we're using today on most residential metal roofs are something called PVDF, polyvinylidene fluoride. I've practiced that for a few years, but the PVDF finishes are really unmatched for their fade and chalk resistance. But you're absolutely right at the end of. [00:18:00] 50 years, 55 years, someone looks up there and says, gee whiz, that's faded enough.

[00:18:05] I'd like to freshen it up. It's just a matter of repainting it. And when you think of commercial buildings and industrial buildings, even agricultural buildings, we're really very good at repainting stuff in our country. So that's not a major challenge at that point when and if. Yeah, I'd say it's a restaurant and a changes from one hand to the other.

[00:18:24] And they had plenty of metal roof on there before. Rarely do they. Tearing that off. They're just bringing in a pro and putting the right finish on it. And it looked brand new again. To find out more information about the show, head to around the house online. com. We'll return with Todd Miller from Isaiah industries.

[00:18:40] We're talking metal roofing just as soon as around the house returns. Don't change that.[00:19:00]

[00:19:08] Welcome back to the around the house show the next generation of home improvement. If you want to find out more about us. Find us on YouTube. Just look around the house show, or you can head over to around the house online and find the YouTube channel there. Now let's get back to our conversation with Todd Miller from Isaiah industries.

[00:19:25] We're talking metal roofing. Absolutely. That is great. So what's the process for people that are really trying to explore metal for their home, whether it's on the, on the side as an accent wall or on the roof. One of the things I always suggest is, and I suppose I'm a little bit biased in this response, Eric, but is to start with finding the product that you like.

[00:19:49] And a lot of times that starts with kind of setting your criteria. What do you want to accomplish with that next roof? Do you care about aesthetics? Do you care about energy efficiency? Do you care [00:20:00] about fire safety, wind resistance, low weight? What is it that you want to accomplish? Because there are certain things that Even a metal roof may do that.

[00:20:08] A homeowner may say, I don't really care about that. And that's fine, but set your criteria and then go out and find the product that meets those criteria. And then go to the manufacturer of that product and say, Hey, who in my area is experienced and trained to install this? One of the things that metal roofing is oftentimes gotten.

[00:20:28] I don't want to say black guy, but thing that people say a lot is I can't find anyone that knows how to do it. And you're absolutely right. If you go to a lot of contractors, they're going to tell you, no, I really never have done one. And so you end up with the product that they want you to have rather than the product that you want to have.

[00:20:47] So my suggestion is figure out what you want to accomplish. Go out and research manufacturers and then connect with manufacturers that produce that product and use them to drive you toward an experienced [00:21:00] contractor. And of course the website I mentioned earlier from the Metal Roofing Alliance, metalroofing.

[00:21:05] com is a great place to do that. And my own company of course has our websites as well that we can connect people with products and contractors as well. Yeah, I know one of the top questions people ask is, okay, I've got a, a quote for a nice high end architectural tar based roofing product. Let's say, I don't want to get after too many brands out there, but I'm looking at metal as well.

[00:21:30] What kind of price differences are we seeing between those? And I know we're trying to take apples and oranges and there's between those, but is there any help to guide people of what the difference is before they start that journey? Absolutely, and we try to be very upfront about that. So metal roofing does come in a fairly wide range of products.

[00:21:48] So you've got what I call entry level, which is basically sheets of corrugated roofing that have screws driven right through them. And you've seen these products used on agricultural buildings [00:22:00] and so forth, but they're also used residentially. And that's entry level. And then from there you move on up into standing seam and metal shingle type products, and then you get into the real high end stuff, which it oftentimes is those natural metals like copper and zinc and anodized and some of the more exotic metals.

[00:22:19] Things, but I generally tell people entry level metal roof probably is going to be about double the cost of, of a good fiberglass or asphalt shingle. You get into standing seam and the metal shingles, they're probably going to be two and a half to three times the cost. And then you get into the natural metal type products.

[00:22:38] Yeah, they're probably going to be three and a half to four times the cost. So that kind of becomes your range. And again, it comes down to figuring out what you want to accomplish with that next drift, how long you intend to stay in the home. A story I love to tell is my own parents, a number of years ago, had Built a new home.

[00:22:56] Of course they put our roof on it, but the home that they were moving out [00:23:00] of had asphalt shingles. And when they went to sell the home, the roof was shot, they needed a new roof. And you know, we were all like, put asphalt on it again. It makes no sense for you to put metal on that house and turn around and sell it.

[00:23:12] You'll never, you'll never get the value out of it. Absolutely. No, it's, it's definitely for somebody. Juan, that's going to be there for a while because you're spending more money, but you're also getting that added durability. And that product looking so much better for years to come. And again, if you're working on a historical project and you had copper in places and things like that, you can really make some, some pretty poor design choices by trying to put a, an asphalt or fiberglass shingle in that place, because it just is going to look like you went the cheap way with.

[00:23:42] Yeah. It was interesting. I had a homeowner contact me earlier today and he's got wood shingles on his house and they, they're shot. They need to be replaced. And he's obviously concerned about cost. He's got a pretty big roof, but he realizes that anything that he goes to that. Doesn't keep him with that sort of [00:24:00] higher end, either wood shingle or slate look is going to be a real downgrade to his home and really probably make it so it doesn't look right in his neighborhood.

[00:24:08] And that impacts salability of a house. It impacts how desirable a home will be to a future owner. And he realizes all those things. He still doesn't necessarily like the idea of what he's going to have to pay for this new roof, but he understands that. Absolutely. He understands those concerns. Yeah. And I think one of the big things too, that, that a lot of people forget about is if I was living on the West coast, which I am, and I was going to be in my house for a while where it wasn't just a, Hey, I'm selling it in five years and going type of situation, I'd sure look at metal just because of our wildfire risks and that stuff that's been creeping up and getting.

[00:24:48] Bigger and bigger and bigger on the West coast, because for a number of reasons, we're getting a lot more fires than we used to out here. And I'm not going to dive into the rabbit hole of forest management, but we've got some [00:25:00] serious issues that we've got to resolve. And these little fires are now big fires and they sure have been creeping into neighborhoods where you'd never think of it.

[00:25:07] And a lot of people have still those old wooden shake roofs and stuff like that, that you would see in those areas. That's been a the wildfire risk has been a real driver of interest in metal roofing for a number of years and really what we're seeing now is it's driving interest in metal wall panels as well because they're saying if I won't put a metal roof on, I probably better do something to the walls of my house.

[00:25:29] And then the thing that I think is really cool, you've probably talked about this before, though, but. Is the vents that are being developed that close down during fire storms. And I think that's just fascinating technology, uh, and some cool stuff because we got to have vents in our, in our attic to keep on most homes.

[00:25:49] You could have a. Totally conditioned home, but usually you got to have vents and those will suck embers in and now you've got a fire starting inside the attic, which is not, isn't [00:26:00] good, obviously. So I love some of the things that O'Hagan vents and some of the others are doing good, good stuff. Yeah, I think, I don't like to sit there and waive the, this should be building code things, I know that gets expensive, but I think in many areas that is stuff that should be adopted fairly quickly just to, it's, it's crazy, the expense of a little more on vents could make a huge difference on a new construction home or a remodel out there, I'd sure like to see that being used a lot more because that could sure prevent a lot of pain and disaster down the road.

[00:26:31] I agree. And I think you and I maybe have talked about this before, but when it comes to building codes, everyone says I'm building to code. We got to understand code is the bare minimum. This is what you got to do. But to really build a superior dwelling or a superior structure, you got to be prepared to go beyond code in some cases as well.

[00:26:51] Todd, I couldn't agree with you more. I've seen dozens in my life, horribly constructed homes that 100%. [00:27:00] Met building code, but we're just poorly constructed. I saw a house one time that it was one of those concrete homes where they put the, uh, the foam Lego blocks together. And of course they, I'm trying not to use brand names to them.

[00:27:13] I know what you mean with this, but you pour the concrete in the middle and this contractor had never done it before. And it was a windy day, so the two story exterior wall had a really nice bow to it, like a sail from the wind, and the trim rooms were bowed on the inside, it was just, but it met building code altogether, it wouldn't have passed any kind of a building inspection if a homeowner had paid for it.

[00:27:39] But as far as matching building code, it was right there in perfectly fast code, but turned out into a triangular bode home. And it was, I was like, there's not much you can do with this guys, except try to build it out and flat it out. But they were trying to get some ideas and it was, it was insane. And that just proves the point of building code is that minimum code.

[00:27:58] I'd sure like to see, and then we're seeing [00:28:00] people now really building to exceed that with building science and stuff these days that we're really starting to see a number of builders across the country, whether you're in the South building some of these new fortified homes where they're building them to take category five hurricanes to other things.

[00:28:16] It's nice to see the industry expanding beyond what normal code would be. Absolutely. I agree a hundred percent. So it's good. But where are you seeing your emerging markets for, for metal roofing? Is it just popping up everywhere? Cause it seems as we talked about earlier, it's just growing more and more.

[00:28:32] To find out more information about the show, head to around the house online. com. We'll return with Todd Miller. From Isaiah Industries, we're talking metal roofing, just as soon as Around the House returns. Don't change that dial. Welcome back to the[00:29:00]

[00:29:03] Around the House Show, the next generation of home improvement. If you want to find out more about us, Find us on YouTube. Just look around the house show, or you can head over to around the house online and find the YouTube channel there. Now let's get back to our conversation with Todd Miller from Isaiah industries.

[00:29:19] We're talking metal roofing, but there's always missing the construction industry, right? Where does some of the ones that you see out there where people, where you just roll your eyes and go, You're right there. There are a lot of concerns out there that sometimes are completely unbased. And 1 of them is that a metal roof is going to be noisy.

[00:29:37] I literally in 46 years, excuse me, 44 years in this industry, I have had 2 complaints about noise and both of those were situations where they had no attic insulation. In fact, no attic space. They laid in bed and looked up at the underside of their roof deck, which is unusual. I call it. California or Hawaiian construction, which [00:30:00] is normally where I'll see it.

[00:30:01] But I had a couple of complaints there about noise, just two over the years. And in those cases, you can actually insulate on top of the decking to control that sound transfer. That's one of them. Uh, I think another one is lightning. Folks are concerned that a metal roof somehow attracts lightning. Well, metal doesn't attract lightning.

[00:30:22] It's. does conduct electricity. So the key on that is lightning will typically strike the highest object around, path of least resistance, rather than go to a metal structure or a metal object. And one of the things that's important is to think about the metal roof. Grounds out through the structure. Now, years ago, again, I'm old enough to remember this pipes coming up through roofs from bathrooms were oftentimes cast iron and yet a cast iron pipe coming out and a metal roof got electrified.

[00:30:55] Uh, you better look out if you're in the bathtub. Okay. It's going to get exciting real quick, but [00:31:00] now all of that stuff has to be PVC coming through the roof so that it will not conduct that charge. Uh, I think another thing, a lot of times that. Sometimes folks wonder about with metal roof, and I touched on earlier, but who can install it?

[00:31:15] And that has been a problem in the past, but we've got some very robust industry training programs. NRCA now even has a pro certification program for metal roofing. So it's pretty easy if you do your research to find a competent and skilled installer today as well. Yeah, that makes sense. Like so many products out there, and I'll say HVAC, I'll say roofing, I'll say there's a lot of different products out there that the quality of the product is 50 percent of the battle.

[00:31:45] The rest of it is making sure you've got somebody that knows what they're doing, that's putting it on, that's been factory trained or been trained by other professionals to follow the best practice of that product. Because How many times do we see something that's just an amazing product, [00:32:00] but got wrecked up during the install process and it's not going to ever perform like it was designed?

[00:32:05] Yeah, you're absolutely right. That's really key. And I was called in on a project recently where the homeowner was concerned. It wasn't our product. It was someone else's product, but they were concerned it hadn't been installed right. And so we went out and did an inspection just as a courtesy and actually found it was installed.

[00:32:22] Really pretty well, but again, people just don't know what they're looking for with a metal roof. And as I always say, you got three things. You got building code requirements, you've got industry best practices, and then you have whatever specifications are required by that manufacturer. And somehow those three all have to get brought together in terms of finding a.

[00:32:45] Product that is installed right in the end and a project that is going to be successful. Great example. If you've got a house that is, so that was framed, met building code, everything else, there's nothing in building code says that thing has to be square on that roof, right? Maybe [00:33:00] somebody didn't take the time to square that off.

[00:33:02] If you're going to put square pieces of metal on it, that's not the optimal one to be up there with your mic, your magnifying glass, looking at every installation, because they're going to have to work with that as best they can. An unsquare house, putting square things on it. You're always going to have to fudge it a little bit here and there to make it look right.

[00:33:19] Yeah. And if you've done your checking in advance and when you're dealing with those circumstances, you can usually come up with some little tricks. I know we know a number of them, uh, to fool the eye and to make it work anyway and, and keep it from looking bad. Yeah, absolutely. And that's, that's some of the challenges that I see.

[00:33:36] And especially when, when DIY project, there's so many tricks to the trade with it. Of the right way to put these pieces on what trim goes on first what trim goes on last There's a lot of little tricks that I wouldn't want a contractor or a homeowner Just trying to dive in for their first one without some prior education.

[00:33:54] Yeah, I agree 100 Cool. We've got about a 12 000 square [00:34:00] foot training facility here at our place in ohio and so we bring typically groups of Contractors in three to five times a month To run them through installation training and we'll train them even on competitors products. We'll train them on anything just to make sure that we're getting an army built of qualified and trained installers out there.

[00:34:23] Man, that is great. And there's so many great products out there that goes. Beyond that from the different products now, as far as roof sheathing, that's got the weather barrier built into it. And it's just really made probably that installation so much easier through the process because technology keeps getting better and better, including your industry.

[00:34:42] Absolutely. Things are improving all the time and. One of the nice things that I think that also means is homeowners have a lot of good products to choose from out there. You can still find some guys out there that are selling secondary products or maybe products [00:35:00] that they somehow got from overseas that are lower quality, but by and large, there are a lot of good products out there today.

[00:35:07] Yeah, that is great. Before we go, I wanted to talk about your construction disruption podcast and what you've got going on there because you've been cranking along with that, my friend, and for people out there that are tackling those projects, whether you're a contractor or even experienced DIY, it's a valuable tool for people to check out.

[00:35:26] We've had so much fun with that. It's been almost three years, folks who want to visit it. It's construction hyphen, just the little mark construction hyphen disruption. com. I'll tell you what I've really enjoyed is how much I have learned. We had, we have had guests on talking about. New types of building materials, new technologies.

[00:35:46] We've had a number of architects and that's always been fun getting their perspective. We've also dug into a few things that are issues in our industry regarding addiction, even suicide awareness, because we find [00:36:00] that the rates of those. Can be high amongst construction workers. And so we've touched on a few of those topics that can be pretty life changing, but we try to make the podcast fun.

[00:36:11] We do some little fun things on every show, but we really do try to make it so that doesn't have to just be for someone in the trades, it can be for a property owner, and it's just fun, fun place to learn and a great time. I got to call you out and see here. What are some of your favorite episodes that you look back and go?

[00:36:29] Wow. This was notable, at least in your own mind. My one with you was certainly very notable. Another guest I've really enjoyed. We've had on twice is a gentleman by the name of David Applebaum. I have been, been down to David's house, hung out with him in person. And I had him on here many times, talk about a great soul of a person and a talented architect.

[00:36:53] Yeah, he really is. So he's been fun to have on. We've also had a guy by the name of Wolf Richter [00:37:00] and Wolf has a website called wolf. com and he does economics analysis. He came out of the automotive industry. He looks at housing. He looks at what's happening in the economy and he always has some great insight.

[00:37:15] We've also had Eric Finnegan from John Burns Research and Development. Eric looks a lot at the home improvement industry and market. That's been a lot of fun. Another one we had was a company out in Pennsylvania called Stellar Floors, and they have come up with a wood floor that you can actually pull individual planks out of and replace them.

[00:37:37] And so if you get a bad scratch or something on an individual plank, you can pop it out and pop a new one in. And so they're doing some cool stuff too. Uh, that is cool. I wish we would've had that for the beach house that we were just working on that had so much water damage in it. It was the people on the show.

[00:37:54] I've heard of our audience out here. I've heard this a lot, but it was a rescue house that we did out on the Oregon [00:38:00] coast out here. And when we went to look at it, it had had tarps on the roof for about 20 plus years. And we hauled about 2000 pounds of tarps off of this thing. So for 20 years, they just kept putting new tarps on top, but the hardwood floors, when we were in there looking at it on a, on a November day, it was raining outside and it was like somebody had a garden hose landing on the floors in the living room and there was a lot of weaving in spots.

[00:38:22] We'll put it that way. Sure. This is pretty cool with these guys are doing. So anyway, yeah, it's just been a blast being on it, having the show and learning from folks. That is great. So Todd, let's, let's round this out here and wrap it up with ways people can find you, of course, Isaiah industries and everything else, just to make sure we get everybody locked in and get their arms around all this so they can get more information.

[00:38:45] Sure. They can always visit us on the web at IsaiahIndustries. com. I also have an educational website where I answer people's questions about roofing and ventilation and condensation and such things. And that is [00:39:00] AskToddMiller. com. Sometimes that's easier to spell than Isaiah. So folks can find me there as well.

[00:39:05] And I'm pretty active on LinkedIn. So if you just search Todd Miller roofing, you're going to find me on there as well. But always happy to, to touch base with people and feel very blessed. Anytime we can possibly help lead them in the, in a good direction and answer their questions. And I appreciate what you're out doing out there for the industry as well.

[00:39:25] Todd, it's you guys are really making a difference out there with education and the podcast, which is even more education as well. So thanks for coming on around the house today, my friend. Can't wait till next time. Thank you so much, Eric. It's been a blast. I'm Eric G and you've been listening to Around the House.