Lisa Marie Rankin [00:00:00]:

In this episode, I have the pleasure of speaking with Ayana Madrone. She is an author and content creator whose work flows from the wellspring of earth based spirituality, ancestral reconnection and intuitive magic. Today we talk about the wheel of the year and the upcoming seasonal Sabbat Imbolek. Ayanna helped me with my pronunciation, how to really bash the patriarchy and the problem with the self help in wellness industry and so much more. There is so much feminine wisdom and magic this episode. I know you're going to love it. Let's dive in. Hello beautiful listeners and welcome back to the Goddess School podcast.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:00:42]:

I am your host, Lisa Marie Rankin, and today I am joined by Ayanna Madrone and she is an author and creator whose work flows from the wellspring of earth based spirituality, ancestral reconnection and intuitive magic. And I am so excited to have her on the podcast and just in time for. So welcome, Ayanna.

Ayana Madrone [00:01:06]:

Thank you so much. I'm really grateful to be here. Excited.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:01:10]:

Yeah. So, Ayanna, I found you on substack and you have a fantastic substack. I'm going to put a link to to it in the show notes for folks to go on and read your work. And I know a lot of what you do is with the celebration of the seasons and really getting back to more like ancestral intuitive magic. I believe this podcast I'm hoping is going to be released like just a couple days before Imbol. Please share with everyone, like, why. Why is this important to you to reconnect with the cycles of the seasons? Like, what is that even all about?

Ayana Madrone [00:01:45]:

So I think that it really stems from a place of wanting to be connected to my ancestors. But also we are all such cyclical beings, especially as women. Like our bodies are constantly cycling and wanting to cycle with n. And so the more disconnected we become from those cycles, the more dis ease we have in our bodies, the more stuck energy and blockages we experience in our lymphatic systems, which, you know, ultimately create all of these different conditions that we're dealing with as women. We have stuck energy. We're not expressing ourselves, we're not releasing, we're not grounding. So for me, it was really a desire to feel imbalance. As we were talking about before we started recording, so many of us want to feel connected to something authentic.

Ayana Madrone [00:02:36]:

And what's more authentic than nature? Nothing. I mean, it's. It's truly the place that we all need to go back to right now and treasure and, and find ways to just be okay. With the boredom of existing in nature, disconnecting from our technology, and the constant desire for that dopamine hit. So for me, yeah, it was really just a desire to have that, that deeper connection. And so I started writing my books, which are eight books about the different pagan holidays within the Wheel of the Year, which is actually a Wiccan created wheel, but the holidays themselves are from different cultures. I have mixed feelings about how it was put together, but I do think my desire to write the books was really to help people feel connected to the seasons, but give them a deeper understanding beyond the aesthetic of it. Because I feel like so often people are just like, oh, this is cute, and I'm going to do it for that reason.

Ayana Madrone [00:03:34]:

But there's, there's so much deep richness, history that exists there. And I think it's always important to honor that when we are going to celebrate something that is, you know, culturally significant. So imolaq or imbuluk, which is how you say, because a lot of people say imbolc. And I very rarely heard anyone know how to pronounce it. And I'm working on it myself because I'm working on learning Irish or Guelga. But that is the first fire festival for the year. And it's the welcoming in of the spring, the first signs of spring. And it's honoring the goddess Bridget.

Ayana Madrone [00:04:14]:

And she's kind of the fire water goddess and the one who's kind of like telling the Kali people say it differently, she's the goddess of winter. Telling her that, like, no, your time's done. It's my time to rise and bring back life. And so it's really that beautiful time that we just look and observe like the first signs of spring, you know, the first leaf that's green or, you know, the days are slightly warmer, slightly longer. And I, I think our bodies crave it and need to honor that connection more and more. Because as we do, we will feel more grounded, we will feel more at peace with what's going on around us that we can't control. So it's a great way to feel like we have something that we can connect to. And like I said, control.

Ayana Madrone [00:05:05]:

Not that we can control nature, but we can control our actions within our little. Our little space. Yeah.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:05:12]:

Yeah. Thank you so much for that. And a few things. So many of the women in my community are familiar with the Wheel of the Year, but. But not everyone. Could you just give maybe a little bit more of a framework of what the Wheel of the Year consists of? And also do you have to be a pagan or Wicca to. To follow the wheel of the year?

Ayana Madrone [00:05:32]:

You know, I. So Wiccans I see as kind of a people wanted to leave Christianity or really structured religion. And so then they found a Wiccan, like a Wiccan way of believing, but it's really more religious, like more structured in that way. Like, you must do these things. These are the rules, these are the regulations. Right. And so I don't feel connected to the way that people practice within that spirituality, but I do appreciate some of the constructs that they have put together. Like the mother maiden in Crone is another thing that you probably are quite familiar with.

Ayana Madrone [00:06:12]:

But the wheel of the year itself is composed of Germanic and Nordic holidays or festivals and Celtic festivals. So you have the four fire festivals, which are the solar. They mark the spots in between the solar festivals. So you have Imuluk, and then it goes into Ostar, which is a solar festival, spring solstice, and then you go to the next fire festival, Bieltana or Beltane, and then it goes from there all the way around. So basically every other holiday is a solar festival, and then you have your next fire festival. But it's a lovely way to just kind of trace the year and always have something to look forward to and celebrate and connect with. And so that's something that I found within my community that's been really valuable. And no, you do not need to be somebody who embraces the title of pagan or witch in order to honor and celebrate these holidays.

Ayana Madrone [00:07:13]:

But I would say that if you're going to connect with them and celebrate them, you should also be looking at your ancestors and looking to how they celebrated these different times of year. Yes, honor it, celebrate it, but also, like, use it as an opportunity to dig deeper into your. Your connection because, like, it runs through your blood and your ancestors want to speak to you. So if you open up and you allow that to come forth, you will find so much richness there.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:07:42]:

Yeah. Oh, that is so beautiful. And I think that's just important to remember. And I, especially in the age where we can access all of these different traditions to really kind of look within as well too and feel, what did my ancestors do? One of my teachers, Katie Silcox, she had said something that I thought was really profound at one point was like, yeah, look at who your ancestors worship, because that could be easier for you to connect to. And it's not to say, like, right or wrong, but it is also. It's in our DNA as well, too.

Ayana Madrone [00:08:14]:

Exactly.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:08:14]:

Of course we can kind of expand and think, but I think it's really a beautiful way to ground back into that ancestral wisdom. Yeah. And I love how you said, you know, we can. We can celebrate these seasons, the beginning of the seasons and the midpoint, and it gives us something to look forward to. Now. I feel like I am notorious for mispronouncing everything, and actually my whole family makes fun of me because I read a lot, so I know a lot of words, but I just don't know what the hell they say.

Ayana Madrone [00:08:41]:

I mean, it's a completely different language. And like I said, I. I think I've heard one other person say it, like, as correct as I am able to say it as somebody who is not a speaker of Irish or Guelga. So I'm doing my best, but basically it's either you can say it like imoloc or im. Bullock. So like a bull in the middle of the M in. Look.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:09:06]:

Okay, thank you for that.

Ayana Madrone [00:09:08]:

And I'm actually going to make a video. I'm planning on making a video on TikTok about how to pronounce it, because I. I just haven't seen other people, like, sharing that information. I think it's really, really important to be able to speak. Speak the words in the ways that they're supposed to be pronounced because tones matter, and, like, speaking the word connects you to that energy. And so. And it also honors. Like, that's a language that was almost eradicated completely.

Ayana Madrone [00:09:40]:

And so being willing to take the time to learn is so significant, especially now, because there's kind of this reawakening and desire for it to come back. So I'm excited to be a part of that journey, even though I'm very early on it. I'm excited to be able to share just a little bit and do my. My part and do my best. But, yes, don't feel bad. I also am terrible at pronouncing words. I've read quite a bit as well.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:10:08]:

Yeah. Someone told me that it's like, it's just a sign that you read a lot, and if you haven't heard people pronounce them, then, you know, you just do the best you can. Right.

Ayana Madrone [00:10:16]:

It's true.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:10:18]:

Yeah. So imbolok. Did I say that correctly or no?

Ayana Madrone [00:10:23]:

Yeah. Imbolok or immol. So it's. It's either like a mole or a bull in the center.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:10:29]:

Oh, okay.

Ayana Madrone [00:10:30]:

Bullock. Immolok.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:10:32]:

Okay. I'm gonna go with imbolloc, since I said that first. So that is coming up on February 1st. And this is the midpoint between winter and spring. And you said, you know, it's really about the goddess Bridget. Like, do you have some favorite ways that you like to celebrate or rituals that you practice?

Ayana Madrone [00:10:50]:

I do, and I have quite a bit in my book as well. But I really enjoy making a Bridget's cross, which usually is made from reeds, but you can use kind of anything that is flexible to do it. And the tutorial that I've made for people, like over on TikTok, and I think I shared it on substack too, is you use paper, and you just fold, and it's this really beautiful, protective symbol of the four directions, the four seasons, that cycle of nature and connecting to Bridget and honoring her. So it's. It's a really simple craft, but I think those crafts that make us just, like, do something repetitive and keep our minds focused on that rather than everything else is really beneficial right now. And something I really enjoy doing with anything that's repetitive, like braiding hair is. I'll put an intention on each strand or each piece, and so each time you weave it, you're amplifying that intention in what you're. You're putting together.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:11:53]:

Oh, I love that. You know, one of the sacred threads that I'm following and, you know, really working with my community this year is creativity. And so I love, you know, having these crafts for the different seasonal practices as well, too, because we live in a culture where it just seems like we consume so much. And I'm always like, make sure that you are creating more than you're consuming and, like, doing things with your hands and bringing something to life. So I love how that's often, like, such a part of these seasonal celebrations is like making bread, creating fires, creating. And it's just because that. That. That connects us again to our ancestors, our own inner wisdom, the cycle of the seasons.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:12:32]:

Now, one thing I. I've noticed, and you've probably noticed this too, is more. We're spending more and more time online. I mean, I'm actually in my study right now, and I have, like, a little heater going on. I live in Massachusetts. Cold out.

Ayana Madrone [00:12:46]:

You know, I'm in Tennessee, so.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:12:48]:

Oh, you.

Ayana Madrone [00:12:48]:

I mean, it is warmer in general here, but the last couple nights, it's been around 17 degrees, so it's. It's chilly. I get it.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:12:59]:

Yes.

Ayana Madrone [00:12:59]:

And.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:13:00]:

And yet sometimes we can even get disconnected from the seasons because we have heat, we have electricity, so we can stay up late even if we don't want to. I'M imagining. I actually don't think my listeners would say that, but I guess just to finish this train of thought, some would say, like, well, does the even, does the seasons even matter? Because like, I can just turn on the heat. I can just, you know, turn on the light switch or in the summer, I can just put the air condition on. I can create my own little habitat. So, like, does it even matter?

Ayana Madrone [00:13:30]:

It does, it does significantly, actually, for your health. There's a lot of studies that show, you know, when you are acclimated and you're in, in nature and getting used to the temperatures rather than in this artificial environment of heat and, and ac, you have better health. And I'm forgetting which country it is, but it's one of the Nordic countries where like, they don't even want you to have heating, central heating in your home because they see it as such a negative thing for your health. And I just find that so interesting. But it makes a lot of sense. I mean, I'm sure you've heard about cold plunging and, and doing ice baths and stuff like that, but it's, it's teaching the body to be able to deal with stress responses and stimulating that vagus nerve. And if you don't have good vagal tone, then so many things go awry because that vagus nerve connects to so many different parts of your body. So a simple practice that I actually learned about pretty recently was if you can swallow three times in a row without drinking anything, then you have good vagal tone and you're not in fight or flight.

Ayana Madrone [00:14:34]:

But if you can't, that's a good sign that you need to work on the health of your vagus nerve.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:14:38]:

Oh, interesting. I have never heard, haven't heard of that practice before. Oh, I will have to try that. I'll try it after the podcast.

Ayana Madrone [00:14:47]:

You're just gonna sit here and try and I mean, we could do that.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:14:51]:

Too, but we'll wait for a different podcast.

Ayana Madrone [00:14:55]:

Yeah. Okay.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:14:55]:

Yeah. So I also wanted to talk to you about. You have some great essays on your substack. And one of them was, if I wanted to control you, I'd sell you a perfect version of yourself. And I really, really, really loved this. And in my community, my, you know, my listeners have been listening me to kind of talk about the shadow side of self help culture and even the shadow side of therapy culture where it's kind of like this hamster wheel of healing. Can you tell me a little bit about like, what your thoughts are on, on what you wrote in the article and just kind of your thoughts on the self help culture and all of these people telling you what's wrong with you.

Ayana Madrone [00:15:32]:

I think especially as women, we have basically no way to exist. That's right. You know, whether it's, you know, we're growing too old too quickly, we're not getting old enough quickly enough, we're having children at the wrong time, or we're, you know, too early, too late, you're, you're getting gray hair, your, your face looks older, you know, like you're getting normal signs of aging. All of these different things are constantly thrown at us. And so there's literally no way to be accepted. And so we need to stop caring about that so much and just sit and rest in the existence of who we are now and find ways to be stable in that and really embody what I call the crone energy, which is I can, I swear, sure, of course. Okay. I don't give a fuck about what's going on around me or what other people think.

Ayana Madrone [00:16:22]:

I'm fully embodying who I am right now and honoring that. And once we get to that point, then everything else starts to crumble because the patriarchy can't survive off of women who are stable and strong in themselves, who honor their wisdom, who share their wisdom. Can you imagine having girls grow up and feel so confident in themselves? Like they don't question themselves and who they are or how they appear. That's just not even a factor anymore. It would be incredible. But it's kind of all tied into the self help culture of something's wrong with you, you need to fix yourself and there isn't a destination. That's the thing. Like you're working towards something, but like, we need to stop working towards something and, and realize the, the richness, the value of being in the journey of life and that there isn't a right way to do that.

Ayana Madrone [00:17:18]:

There's a lot of talk around, like shadow work, for example. You got to do your shadow work. Here's a book. Start doing your shadow work.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:17:27]:

Right.

Ayana Madrone [00:17:27]:

Journaling, whatever it may be. But in my opinion, shadow work is something that you only do when it comes up naturally. It's not something that you force. You can't. And if you do, it can actually cause more trauma in your body. And so I really like to remind people of that, you know, specifically with shadow work, that it's, it's really important that you don't force it. And I would say the same thing goes for anything else. But along the healing journey, forcing things Rushing things is a violent action.

Ayana Madrone [00:17:58]:

We need to be okay with the process and for things to take time. And there's beauty in that journey. And so, yeah, I guess for me, the article was really from that place of like, there's a lot of toxicity within the healing communities of like, this is how you do this thing, or you need this in order to be okay or to get well. And the reality is, no, you don't. What you need to do is you need to connect to your intuition. And once you start doing that and you heal that connection with yourself, everything else starts to fall into place because like, that connection to your intuition connects you to, you know, far and beyond. You know, I, I've studied metaphysics, but, you know, source all of the other energetic fields connects you to earth. And then nothing's limited.

Ayana Madrone [00:18:49]:

We can heal anything. We can be anything that we desire. So that's, that's kind of where it came from. Was this just like sickening feeling of please stop seeing yourself as not enough or believing these lies, you know, that you need to go and spend all your money on this thing or that thing to find happiness, to find stability in and of yourself?

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:19:11]:

Yeah, thank you so much for that. And there were so many things that you, you said that I would love to drill into. And one is just, I feel the same about shadow, you know, and it's so funny that that's so popular like in our culture right now and there's all of these journals. But I agree, the shadow work is like when we're triggered, when we realize something in the moment. For one just very practical reasons. The shadow is your unconscious. If you can sit down and just start journaling about something, it probably isn't your shadow. It's in your conscious mind if you sit there and start writing about it.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:19:42]:

And yes, and it's like we need to kind of just see as it is, you know, as it's coming up, and work with it that way. And it's interesting too. I also find that this self help and the wellness culture, it really keeps people stuck one because it's like they're waiting for this time to feel better, to get into a relationship, to start the business, to really embark on getting fit. It's like, oh, I got to work on these things first, which I don't believe. I believe that, you know, we learn, we heal through action, through relation with others, kind of like, kind of just getting in, in the game. And it's also very much outsourcing, like you said, our wisdom for somebody else. Some expert or some guru. If you do these five things, you're gonna have a great business, you're gonna have a great relationship, you're gonna have great health.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:20:30]:

And it's just simply not true. Where really we should be kind of turning inward and connecting like what's true for me. And I say that's why we practice, that's why we meditate, that's why we walk in nature, that's why we pray. It's like these practices is what is going to help us access the information that we're actually looking for.

Ayana Madrone [00:20:51]:

Exactly.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:20:51]:

And then the other thing too that you said that I like too, because I will say it always rubs me the wrong way, like in a lot of like my communities. I'm sorry folks, you have said this before, is like, we need to bash the patriarchy. Because I feel like, well, what do you mean we need to bash it? Like, it's not like just like my ceramic mug I can throw on, on the floor. But I'm always like, well, what we can do is choose not to participate in it. Right. And not try to adhere to like an unrealistic society beauty or continuing to fix ourselves. And yet that's a lot harder than just throwing around the slogan we, you know.

Ayana Madrone [00:21:28]:

Yeah.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:21:28]:

To bash the patriarchy. But I think that's like, so what would be some of your maybe steps of like dismantling the patriarch?

Ayana Madrone [00:21:38]:

Absolutely. So I, first of all, I love that you said that because I feel like there's so much in the way of fear mongering or just like stirring up agitation without actual steps to create these solutions. And like, you might as well not do anything. Actually, I prefer that you didn't do anything if that's all you're gonna do. Because freezing people into fear is, is doing the opposite of dismantling the patriarchy. But I actually shared a spell yesterday, I think it was, and it was about revoking from the patriarchy. I no longer consent to these things that I've allowed myself to be a part of. And also remembering that as women we uphold the patriarchy in so many ways.

Ayana Madrone [00:22:21]:

We've embodied it and, and kind of enabled these actions of harm to one another by, you know, comparing ourselves or trying to put other people down or step on top of them in order to get ahead and not seeing ourselves as these beautiful circles. As I view the matriarchy, which is not about women being in charge, but it's about having these circles within circles, the most vulnerable at the center and then progressively moving out from there and people who are really like in a protective role to be on the outside. But it's not about anybody being on top of each other or above each other. It's about having harmony and balance and welcoming people back who are ready to heal. But specifically dismantling the patriarchy. I think like I was talking about with connecting into your intuition and letting go of these constructs that we've been taught is essential, I would say that's the first step and the most important step. And then once you've done that, being able to connect to other people who've also done that work and creating this rippling out effect, it's just seeing through the lies. It's such an important thing to start to do and so few people are able to do it right now because the level of brainwashing has been so intense.

Ayana Madrone [00:23:43]:

But I believe in us. I believe that we are able to get to that point where we are awake enough and we no longer want to participate. So it's not a, it's not a violent action of like, we got to like break something. It's, it's more of a, like we don't need to put our energy into these things because our energy is the most valuable thing we can have, what we possess and what we can give in exchange. And so if we're giving our energy away to anything, whether it be somebody who's negative in our lives and we're, you know, talking poorly about them or engaging in something that they've done to us, like we're giving away our energy for what reason? For what reason? And where can we invest our energy that's actually going to create a co creative endeavor rather than something that's just draining life force from you. So those are a few things that come to the top of my mind. I don't know if you have anything else you'd like to touch on from what I've said, but yeah, that's a, that's what I have.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:24:48]:

Thank you so much. And I love that. And I think that gives people a better like framework and a more empowering way to move through it. Because, you know, I mean our culture loves slogans, bash the patriarchy. But it sounds like yes, something forceful we need to do, but it's really to think about our own belief systems and where we may be brainwashed. And this is easier said than done. And this will go into one of the next articles that you wrote that I also want to talk about. The crone is coming for the patriarchy and I say it's easier Said than done.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:25:21]:

I turn, turned 50 this summer. I have a 19 year old daughter that just started college. And you know, and I love what you wrote and you're talking about like the hag with the gray hair. And when we don't adhere to society's standards of beauty, we take back our power. Now intellectually, spiritually, I believe that is that easy for me to embody. It's like, I'm looking, I'm seeing like wrinkles and things are sagging and you know, I'm, I can feel a little panic and it's. So I'm saying it's easier to do. It's like great with it 100%, but can I actually do it? But it's like, okay, let, like, let's start to peel that back.

Ayana Madrone [00:25:59]:

Yeah, absolutely. And I think just the fact that you're willing to explore that shows the strength of who you are. Because so many people wouldn't at all, they would just say, no, absolutely not. Like, I'm not gonna be, I'm not gonna consider being that vulnerable. But I also, I also see it as like, it is not, it is not a requirement of anyone to choose to fully portray who they are. Right. But also like, if you do, it is such a powerful thing for younger generations to say it's okay to age. It is okay to have gray hair and to have wrinkles and to look your age because like, that's an honor.

Ayana Madrone [00:26:41]:

It's something we should honor because aging is something that we should cherish. A lot of, a lot of people aren't able to make it to 50 or older. And so like, the ability to get there should be something that we see as valuable rather than something that we were like, oh man, well, here we are. And I can only speak to it so much from my point of view because I'm 35 and I haven't arrived at that point yet. But I hope that I will be in that headspace when I do arrive at 50. But I also don't know. And so it's, I really just writing from a place of like, this is what's in my heart and on my mind. And it's what's coming to me, like, what my ancestors are telling me.

Ayana Madrone [00:27:27]:

Like, this is important, you need to share this. And I just, I feel so blessed that so many people say it really resonates with them. I don't see like embodying the crone energy as something that you have to be a certain age in order to do. I think that it's, it's more of a mindset than anything, and so no longer having expectations. So if. If your desire for yourself is to be and portray a certain way, then that's beautiful and that's what it should be. But if it's because society wants you to be that way, that therein lies the problem that we are all struggling with. So, yeah, that's.

Ayana Madrone [00:28:03]:

That's kind of my viewpoint on it. But I. I love writing about the Quran. I've had so many people share how important it is that I continue to talk about it. And so I will probably be writing more articles about the Qur' an in the future.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:28:21]:

Excellent. Yeah, no, thank you for that. And thank you for sharing, Sharing that wisdom. One thing that I was thinking of as I was kind of reflecting on, like, my experience and of just aging, and I do feel that society, yes. Does not want me to age. It does not want me to wrinkle, it does not want me to look 50. I mean, this is just my belief system. It doesn't necessarily mean that it's true.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:28:44]:

And yes, often when we think of the patriarchy, we're thinking of it's men. And in my experience, it's actually like, my friends, like, are they gonna still wanna go out with me if I'm, like, all wrinkled? Like, I have an amazing partner? I always like to think he's like, the embodiment of the divine masculine. He's a very masculine man, and he doesn't want me doing anything to my face. It's almost. I feel I need to for other women. And so the patriarchy isn't necessarily about men. It's kind of these societal constructs. Do you have any thoughts on that?

Ayana Madrone [00:29:18]:

Yeah, no, it absolutely is. It's that inverse masculine energy. Right. It's not the divine masculine energy that we all desire. It's the opposite of that. And we all have masculine and feminine energies in. In ourselves. And so, like, we can all portray, you know, the.

Ayana Madrone [00:29:39]:

The less exalted or the less healthy version of either one. Yeah, and, yeah, absolutely. I think women, I mean, we uphold the patriarchy. If we chose to just not engage with it anymore, it wouldn't exist. I mean, we are the. We are the leaders of communities. We are the healers. Like, we're the ones who bring things back into balance.

Ayana Madrone [00:30:00]:

And so it is essential that we wake up and start making a change, because once we do, everything else will. It just has to. That's the way it goes. But we've enabled it for a long time.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:30:13]:

Yeah.

Ayana Madrone [00:30:13]:

And I'm not going to say that it's all our faults, because it's not. But if it continues to be this way, we are contributing to it. We are not outside of it.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:30:24]:

It reminds me of this passage. So in my community, a lot of us have read Women who Run with the Wolves by Clarissa Pinkela Estes. And I think it's in chapter seven, when she is talking about the body, the chapter's joyous body. She's like, we can't just make culture change by yelling change, but we actually have to change our. Ourselves, our belief system, the way that we view our own bodies. It's not like culture. You need to, like, love all. It's like all bodies.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:30:50]:

It's like I need to love my body. And that's exactly how we ultimately change the culture. But it really starts with us. And I feel like that's harder to do than just say everybody else is wrong and should be doing something different.

Ayana Madrone [00:31:04]:

It is. It is. We. We want to fix everyone else, not look at ourselves. But, yeah, I mean, it's essential that we start figuring out how to be brave and cut through the bullshit and start actually doing the work on ourselves. And not because we want other people to accept us, and not because we want to be a part of this community or that community, but truly, just because we want to really connect to most authentic version of who we are. And then that just radiates out to everybody else. I mean, it's the most incredible form of frequency that you can exude to everybody else is authenticity.

Ayana Madrone [00:31:43]:

It's the most powerful frequency. So we might as well. Might as well start trying a little bit. But, yeah, it's not easy. I have plenty of my own struggles, but having a little. A little daughter of my own and realizing how impactful the different things I say, even the way I look at myself in the mirror, how much she's watching, has really shifted my perspective. And I do so much right now specifically because I don't want to, you know, put any thought into her mind about her body or herself. So while I am thinking of, you know, being internalized with my own thoughts and feelings, I am also doing so much work because I don't want to pass on that generational curse to her.

Ayana Madrone [00:32:33]:

But also realizing how much I was trained by my mother with the ways that I think and how I still see so much of it in her has been really enlightening and helpful in a lot of ways. But also, like, whoa, that's. That was a real thing growing up. And I didn't, you know, ever make that connection until I was an adult. But how cool to be able to see it and to know and to not repeat it.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:33:00]:

Yeah. And I think that is key, too. And I think definitely, like, having daughters and even for, like, women who don't. Don't have daughters, that we're just examples for.

Ayana Madrone [00:33:09]:

For.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:33:10]:

For other women. Like, I think you said early on for younger women. And, like, what would we like to be passing on? Like, whether it's lineal line or just, like, our. Our womanly wisdom as well.

Ayana Madrone [00:33:22]:

Exactly.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:33:23]:

To think about that. You said one other thing, too, about, like, we've all been so brainwashed. And I've been thinking about that a lot lately as well. We are all on social media. I'm actually trying to be off of it a lot more lately. But, like, so many people. And I just see people walking in beautiful parks and they're staring at their phone or everybody in the doctor's office, you know, or just staring at their phone. If we are bombarded in an echo chamber as well with what we need to look at, what we should desire, what we should be outraged over, I mean, to me, it is just a little brainwashing machine.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:33:58]:

Like, how do we start to break free from that?

Ayana Madrone [00:34:02]:

Well, first of all, realizing it's happening is the first step. And then after that, it's, you know, setting new patterns for ourselves. So, specifically with the addiction to technology and phones, you know, if you're able to start naming, like, okay, this is. This is why I'm picking up my phone before you pick up your phone, and then, like, give yourself a little distance from your phone. And then, like, if you can wait a few seconds or a minute before you pick it up, you might choose not to because, you know, it was just an addictive reaching out for more dopamine rather than an actual, like, I need to do this thing. And I think just having that little mindful practice of being a little bit more disconnected and then searching for ways to, like, have that dopamine replacement. Because it is an addiction. It is literally an addiction.

Ayana Madrone [00:34:57]:

It's not. It's not, like, a simple fix that, you know, we're gonna just be like, oh, we're not gonna look at our phones, because we're looking for a way to. To feel better about the condition of the world. And we haven't found an easy fix as simple as the scroll or the, you know, click or whatever. And so, yeah, I would say don't, like, don't be hard on yourself, but try to do little intentional acts of just like, okay, this is why I'm doing this thing. Do I need to do that? I don't. Okay, can I pause for like a minute and wait to do it? Okay, I can do that. All right, that's good.

Ayana Madrone [00:35:36]:

Progressively just work up the time, you know, have it, have it no longer on your body all the time, have it in a different room, go places without it. Like, just get used to it not being an extra limb on your body and then find other things that you really enjoy that bring more satiation, I guess you could say, for your energetic system that you enjoy that you can do that are simple. That would be kind of my recommendation. And this is something that I struggle with too, because everything I do right now involves the Internet and social media. So. I understand. And it's a challenge. It's really difficult to balance.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:36:12]:

Yeah, no, it is a challenge. And one of the things, I'm a student and teacher of Ayurveda, which is an ancient Indian health system.

Ayana Madrone [00:36:19]:

Oh, I love Ayurveda.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:36:21]:

Yeah, yeah.

Ayana Madrone [00:36:21]:

We can talk about Ayurveda if you want.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:36:24]:

Well, I, I was gonna, you know, make the point that in Ayurveda digestion is very important. Like the foods that we eat, can we digest, can we assimilate? But it also takes it a step further where it's like we're actually digesting anything that comes into our consciousness. So I often tell women, like, well, are you feeling better or worse after you pick up your phone? Because a lot of times it's worse because either we're getting very stressed out about what might be going on in the world or we're seeing people that look like they must have a better life or where we got some mean that tells us why we need to do shadow work or fix ourselves and feel like we're behind. So it's like we really have to be just like we all. I think many of us, and I think many of the women in my community look at their food labels and try to eat non processed foods. And you know, it's like, I think we have to start using that level of discernment with the type of content that we're consuming as well. Because just like crappy junk food labels all over it isn't good for us. Neither is probably much of the content.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:37:22]:

I mean, you and I are both content creators. I will say not all content, but all content.

Ayana Madrone [00:37:27]:

But there is a lot. Yeah, there's definitely a lot of what we call junk food content for sure. And it is important. And I would say it's it's kind of like, because I'm a soil scientist and, and I say organics and stuff in undergrad and in my graduate degree. But it's just like planting a garden. Like what do you want to, what do you want to grow? What do you want to flourish? And it's, it's not something that you do. One day you plant seeds and then you're done. Like you have to go back out there and weed it and you gotta water it.

Ayana Madrone [00:37:57]:

Like what are you investing your time in? And that's what will grow. And it's about having that consistency, which is something that we tend to all struggle with. Having consistency and little bites, little steps. There's a really great book called Switch that I actually read during my graduate program. And it's great because it talks about little changes being the most significant, the most impactful instead of large changes. And so that was something that really hit me pretty hard. And I've held, held close to my heart for a long time is just like, how can I be consistent? Slightly different today, right? Consistently doing this thing slightly different. And over time it will create a lasting long term result.

Ayana Madrone [00:38:42]:

So go for a five minute walk or you know, start your day with drinking some warm water. Just very simple things. But it makes a huge difference in your life and how you feel. But yeah, Ayurveda is definitely another passion of mine. I have not studied it formally, but I definitely have done a lot of my own research and have a lot of experiences with it in my own life too.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:39:05]:

Yeah.

Ayana Madrone [00:39:06]:

Oh, I just saw a crow fly by.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:39:09]:

Oh, nice.

Ayana Madrone [00:39:10]:

Yeah.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:39:10]:

I wonder what that symbolizes.

Ayana Madrone [00:39:12]:

I see it as just intuitive guidance, like my guides are watching over me and like confirming what I'm saying is important. That's how I see it.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:39:22]:

But yeah, I see it similar. My dog and I go for a pretty long hike every morning in the woods. And like one of the things it's like, I always like to be on the lookout for wild animals and owls sometimes and deer and sometimes fox and in the summer snakes and yeah, it always is kind of like I feel like it's a little bit of. Oh yeah, there's some insight here, there's some wisdom here. I loved your metaphor about the soil and tending to our garden as kind of a way of tending to our psyche. That is really important, what we are feeding it in the nutrients in terms of like content, how we're spending our time, what we're engaging in.

Ayana Madrone [00:40:01]:

I think that's the words we say repetitively to ourselves. Like I think Even about food. Because, like, regardless of how you choose to eat, right, if you're telling yourself something is really bad for you, your body's gonna accept that message. And so, like, how can we be mindful with the words that we're speaking over our food and our bodies? Like, can we talk to our food before we start eating and express gratitude or ask it if it's willing to incorporate into ourselves and create healing and balance? Just like, little acts like that are so important. But remembering that words are spells and like, repeating something has an impact. It amplifies it. And singing it is even more impactful. Be careful what you sing.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:40:48]:

Oh, I love that. And yeah, that's definitely something that I've told the woman in my community, is that our words are mini spells and we are powerful. And you know, like, yeah, really look at, like, what you're saying. Because I also hear a lot of people, like, argue for their limitations. Like, I can't do this. I'm too old for this. I'm too young.

Ayana Madrone [00:41:04]:

You're manifesting so well.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:41:05]:

Okay.

Ayana Madrone [00:41:06]:

You've been manifesting that reality for yourself so well. Like, look at yourself. You are powerful, manifester, because repeating that to yourself, you're exactly where you've put yourself. And it's unfortunate, but it's true. And so if we shift it away from all the things we don't want into the things we do want, it's amazing what can happen. But like, taking out the negative words from our sentences, I don't want, blah, blah, blah, like, great, but you're telling yourself that you do.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:41:37]:

Yeah, it is.

Ayana Madrone [00:41:39]:

Say what you want. Say what you want.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:41:42]:

Yeah. And that to me, that's that big shift from, like, what's wrong Consciousness to what's possible consciousness. Like, so.

Ayana Madrone [00:41:47]:

Exactly.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:41:48]:

Well, thank you so much for this conversation today. I found it really inspiring and I know the women in my community will find it inspiring as well too. Is there any, any things that you would like to leave us with or where can people find you, reach out to you, support you?

Ayana Madrone [00:42:05]:

I'm on Substack and TikTok. I have a Patreon as well, and Those are the three platforms that I'm focused on. TikTok's kind of doing weird things right now, especially as it's transitioning being a US based only company. So I've noticed a lot of differences with how things are going in the algorithm. So I'm kind of like focusing more of my attention on Substack and Patreon. So most of my energy is being poured into those two platforms. So I recommend checking me out over there. But yeah, I offer books.

Ayana Madrone [00:42:37]:

I have eight books so far that I've written and I have many in the works because that's just how I am. I'm always creating. And I do also offer natal chart readings and tarot readings and synastry readings. So those are relationship basically taking two people's natal charts, whether it's a romantic relationship or other, and showing different ways that they work well together, different challenges and just creating this beautiful woven tapestry of what that really relationship currently is and how to move forward in the like most healthy of ways together. But yeah, so those are, those are some of my offerings. I am so grateful I was able to be on this podcast today. It's really fun getting to know you a little bit, Lisa, and this is a beautiful community you've created and I'm excited to to hopefully get to interact with more of them in the future because I don't think our communities have really intermingled that much yet. But I think that they would really enjoy being in community together.

Ayana Madrone [00:43:38]:

There's a lot of like minded people. So thank you so much. It's been my honor.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:43:44]:

Thank you so much as well too. And yeah, I will see you back over on Substack.

Ayana Madrone [00:43:49]:

Perfect.

Lisa Marie Rankin [00:43:53]:

Thank you for joining me for this episode of the Gotta School podcast. I hope it sparked your imagination and expanded your vision for what's possible. If you're ready to explore these concepts more deeply, reclaim your personal myth and live with greater creativity and enchantment, I invite you to join me inside Enlivened my Divine Feminine Mystery School and Sacred community where we bring these teachings to life through ritual, story coaching and of course, real world action. You can find the link to learn more in the show notes. And remember, the Goddess isn't a deity outside of yourself. She's an aspect of your highest self. You are the Goddess. Until next time.