1 00:00:38,113 --> 00:00:41,113 W. Curtis Preston: hi, and welcome to Backup Central's ReSTOR all podcast. 2 00:00:41,113 --> 00:00:43,633 I'm host w Curtis Preston, aka Mr. 3 00:00:43,633 --> 00:00:49,603 Backup, and I have with me my floor laminate water damage consultant 4 00:00:49,603 --> 00:00:51,733 Prasanna Malaiyandi, how's it going? 5 00:00:52,558 --> 00:00:53,158 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Oh no. 6 00:00:53,163 --> 00:00:54,898 What got water damage? 7 00:00:54,898 --> 00:00:57,448 I didn't know I was a water damage expert now. 8 00:00:57,448 --> 00:00:57,928 Oh, no. 9 00:00:57,958 --> 00:00:59,008 What happened, curtis? 10 00:00:59,053 --> 00:01:00,213 W. Curtis Preston: call out to you. 11 00:01:00,213 --> 00:01:01,543 You, you're all I have. 12 00:01:01,573 --> 00:01:03,763 You're all I have, uh, no. 13 00:01:03,763 --> 00:01:07,393 So, you know, as you may know, you know, obviously I, you know, I've 14 00:01:07,393 --> 00:01:08,503 continued on with the project. 15 00:01:08,503 --> 00:01:15,553 I've finished putting the, the, um, the luxury vinyl planks there in the kitchen. 16 00:01:15,973 --> 00:01:19,783 And apparently there was a little water incident while I was gone. 17 00:01:20,433 --> 00:01:24,933 Uh, my son-in-law, uh, is telling me there's water underneath 18 00:01:25,083 --> 00:01:28,023 the brand new laid down panels. 19 00:01:28,833 --> 00:01:32,133 Um, so I, I don't, I actually don't know what I'm going home to. 20 00:01:32,193 --> 00:01:32,883 I'm a little, 21 00:01:33,643 --> 00:01:33,883 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Do you 22 00:01:33,883 --> 00:01:36,433 think, is it like in the spot of the dishwasher? 23 00:01:36,573 --> 00:01:37,053 W. Curtis Preston: down again. 24 00:01:37,083 --> 00:01:37,503 What's that? 25 00:01:37,843 --> 00:01:39,343 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Is it by the dishwasher? 26 00:01:39,343 --> 00:01:40,363 by the fridge. 27 00:01:40,768 --> 00:01:41,098 W. Curtis Preston: Yeah. 28 00:01:41,308 --> 00:01:42,298 Yeah, it's by the dishwasher. 29 00:01:42,508 --> 00:01:42,808 Yeah. 30 00:01:43,408 --> 00:01:46,918 And we shut off the, we shut off the water and stuff, but he says 31 00:01:46,918 --> 00:01:48,718 that he feels water, like he can 32 00:01:49,403 --> 00:01:50,443 Prasanna Malaiyandi: It's further down. 33 00:01:50,938 --> 00:01:52,108 W. Curtis Preston: I don't know I don't know if he 34 00:01:52,843 --> 00:01:53,193 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Uh, 35 00:01:53,368 --> 00:01:56,938 W. Curtis Preston: what he is talking about, but I hope he doesn't know 36 00:01:56,938 --> 00:02:00,328 what he is talking about, because otherwise I gotta pull up the, all 37 00:02:00,328 --> 00:02:03,538 the flooring and then let everything dry and then put everything back down. 38 00:02:03,748 --> 00:02:08,263 But everything's all cut so it's not, you know, I just gotta, Keep 39 00:02:08,263 --> 00:02:10,363 it all in a row or whatever, but 40 00:02:12,073 --> 00:02:13,123 Prasanna Malaiyandi: not the news you were hoping 41 00:02:13,123 --> 00:02:13,393 for 42 00:02:13,393 --> 00:02:15,403 W. Curtis Preston: want, I wanted the kitchen to be done, right? 43 00:02:15,433 --> 00:02:18,913 I, I finished the kitchen and then I went on this little trip, which by 44 00:02:18,918 --> 00:02:21,613 the way, for those of you watching, well, for those of you listening, I 45 00:02:21,963 --> 00:02:22,903 probably sound a little bit different. 46 00:02:22,903 --> 00:02:26,623 I don't have my usual mic and those of you watching, uh, I look, 47 00:02:26,833 --> 00:02:28,873 this is just a lame camera angle. 48 00:02:28,873 --> 00:02:31,213 This is, you know, standard laptop on a desk. 49 00:02:31,603 --> 00:02:33,133 This is not what anybody wants to. 50 00:02:33,793 --> 00:02:36,883 Looking up my nostrils, but it is what it is. 51 00:02:37,413 --> 00:02:41,973 I need to, uh, mention our standard disclaimer that persona and I 52 00:02:41,973 --> 00:02:43,053 work for different companies. 53 00:02:43,053 --> 00:02:45,843 I work for Druva, he works for Zoom. 54 00:02:46,143 --> 00:02:49,263 And, uh, this is not an official podcast of either company. 55 00:02:49,623 --> 00:02:55,023 The opinions that you hear are all ours and be sure to, uh, to. 56 00:02:56,523 --> 00:02:59,913 To rate us at your favorite podcaster, give us all the 57 00:02:59,913 --> 00:03:01,683 stars, give us the comments. 58 00:03:01,683 --> 00:03:04,863 We love the comments, and we love even more to have a comment 59 00:03:05,073 --> 00:03:07,353 from you, like reach out to us. 60 00:03:07,563 --> 00:03:14,943 You can reach me at w Curtis Preston gmail or at WC Preston on what is still Twitter. 61 00:03:14,943 --> 00:03:18,003 We'll see if Twitter is still around here in a few months. 62 00:03:18,393 --> 00:03:24,408 But, uh, It is what it is, but, um, and, uh, if you'd like to join the 63 00:03:24,408 --> 00:03:27,528 conversation, just, uh, reach out to me and we'll make that happen. 64 00:03:28,878 --> 00:03:34,098 Um, so we're just gonna move forward with our guests today. 65 00:03:34,103 --> 00:03:38,838 Who, you know, I started out, I was on his podcast, I'm happy to bring him on ours. 66 00:03:39,198 --> 00:03:42,408 Uh, he's been in the risk management space for many years, which is 67 00:03:42,408 --> 00:03:45,978 a real, like a, it's like an adjunct space, I think to, to ours. 68 00:03:46,338 --> 00:03:48,768 He's the founder and CEO of Global Risk Community. 69 00:03:49,098 --> 00:03:51,888 He's the host of the Risk Management Podcast. 70 00:03:52,263 --> 00:03:54,543 Welcome to the podcast Boris. 71 00:03:54,543 --> 00:03:55,483 Agranovich. 72 00:03:56,928 --> 00:03:58,038 Boris Agranovich: Thank you, thank you. 73 00:03:59,238 --> 00:04:03,918 And for inviting me to this, uh, amazing podcast. 74 00:04:04,338 --> 00:04:10,068 You were actually few months back on my, uh, podcast the risk management show, 75 00:04:10,458 --> 00:04:13,578 and it was, uh, great, great experience. 76 00:04:13,578 --> 00:04:23,163 Uh, and now, uh, kinda audience, uh, uh, put a lot of, uh, Views 77 00:04:23,253 --> 00:04:26,993 on your podcast, uh, episode, so I 78 00:04:26,993 --> 00:04:27,673 am very happy. 79 00:04:27,813 --> 00:04:32,463 First of all, from my name and my accent, probably you will know that I was, uh, 80 00:04:32,553 --> 00:04:37,053 originally from, uh, this part of the world where now, uh, war is going on. 81 00:04:37,053 --> 00:04:41,043 So I was born in Ukraine now, and I studied in Russia. 82 00:04:41,868 --> 00:04:45,018 Came to Israel and now I live in the Netherlands. 83 00:04:45,018 --> 00:04:47,298 So , it's a little bit a mix. 84 00:04:47,298 --> 00:04:54,288 Uh, and I started in IT space and I, uh, then I moved more to, to banking. 85 00:04:54,618 --> 00:05:00,018 Banking, uh, like, uh, uh, insurance company, finance in banks. 86 00:05:00,348 --> 00:05:07,773 And I worked there on a kind of, Um, angle, like I put, uh, it angle into 87 00:05:07,773 --> 00:05:14,763 risk management business and, uh, because it banks were kinda in nineties 88 00:05:14,763 --> 00:05:20,943 and, uh, in beginning of 2000, have to be, to put some, a lot of it system 89 00:05:20,943 --> 00:05:23,648 to, uh, Upgrade the risk management. 90 00:05:24,038 --> 00:05:28,628 So I was a kind business analyst and then I became a risk manager. 91 00:05:29,108 --> 00:05:37,208 So in 20, I think 20, 20 10, I became, um, independent consultant. 92 00:05:37,568 --> 00:05:42,398 And when I had some pause in my assignments and wanted to, uh, kind 93 00:05:42,398 --> 00:05:46,808 of started to communicate with my peers all over the world, but it. 94 00:05:47,508 --> 00:05:54,378 Difficult with current tools and one best tool I found was LinkedIn, but 95 00:05:54,378 --> 00:05:57,258 it still kind provided a lot of noise. 96 00:05:57,618 --> 00:06:04,583 So I decided create to create a community for, uh, Like-minded people. 97 00:06:04,583 --> 00:06:09,233 So I created this global risk community.com, which I initially wanted 98 00:06:09,233 --> 00:06:15,443 to, uh, uh, to create as a kinda front office of my, uh, consultant business. 99 00:06:15,473 --> 00:06:20,103 But it kind of grew, grew, and now it has more than, Total, I 100 00:06:20,103 --> 00:06:21,573 think a hundred thousand people. 101 00:06:21,933 --> 00:06:28,143 So I, I'm concentrated mostly, uh, mainly on the growing of this site. 102 00:06:28,143 --> 00:06:34,488 Not on my consulting and risk management, but I'm on kind of, On the 103 00:06:34,488 --> 00:06:40,758 front, on the front page, as we say on the front page of both website and 104 00:06:40,758 --> 00:06:42,948 events, what happening in community. 105 00:06:43,688 --> 00:06:49,458 Although I'm not in the trenches as in the past, but I'm more kind in conversation 106 00:06:49,463 --> 00:06:52,518 like with you and other guys in the space. 107 00:06:52,788 --> 00:06:57,848 So I can tell you a little bit more about, uh, what happening in our industry. 108 00:06:58,608 --> 00:06:58,818 W. Curtis Preston: Yeah. 109 00:06:58,878 --> 00:07:03,048 Uh, you know, before we talk about risk management, I, I'm just curious. 110 00:07:03,288 --> 00:07:07,848 You know, I, I've, I've born and raised in, you know, the US right? 111 00:07:08,298 --> 00:07:14,868 And here you pretty much need to speak one language, but you have lived in. 112 00:07:16,688 --> 00:07:19,113 different, very different languages. 113 00:07:19,118 --> 00:07:19,353 Right. 114 00:07:19,353 --> 00:07:25,893 So you have, you have Russian, you have, um, you know, uh, Hebrew, you have, uh, 115 00:07:25,923 --> 00:07:30,723 Dutch, and you mentioned you speak, so you speak a little bit of each of those, 116 00:07:31,653 --> 00:07:36,093 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, actually I speak Russian, even Ukrainian also 117 00:07:36,513 --> 00:07:37,893 because I was born in Ukrainian. 118 00:07:38,163 --> 00:07:38,373 So 119 00:07:38,493 --> 00:07:38,883 W. Curtis Preston: right. 120 00:07:39,423 --> 00:07:43,263 Boris Agranovich: when I was there it kind of, uh, uh, was. 121 00:07:44,463 --> 00:07:45,743 Considerate kind sub language. 122 00:07:45,743 --> 00:07:49,763 But now because of Ukrainians growing, it is now kind independent language. 123 00:07:49,763 --> 00:07:55,823 So you can say, now I'm proud that I can mention Ukrainian as my language 124 00:07:55,828 --> 00:08:00,023 additional, because before that it was kinda a subset of Russian 125 00:08:00,028 --> 00:08:02,693 language, but uh, it's separate word. 126 00:08:02,698 --> 00:08:07,343 I, for 25 years and I moved to Israel, I had to, to study some 127 00:08:07,343 --> 00:08:09,803 another language and I studied. 128 00:08:10,578 --> 00:08:13,038 I lived in Israel and worked in IT company. 129 00:08:13,038 --> 00:08:15,378 Then I moved, uh, to Europe. 130 00:08:15,738 --> 00:08:21,738 To the Netherlands where I have to start, uh, from my Israeli company. 131 00:08:22,158 --> 00:08:26,718 So I started Dutch little bit, but English was on background, so English remained. 132 00:08:26,718 --> 00:08:29,118 Uh, little bit on third language. 133 00:08:29,118 --> 00:08:34,743 Uh, But I still, uh, I like more Latino, so I, uh, I studied little 134 00:08:34,743 --> 00:08:40,083 bit Spanish also, not, not perfectly, but enough to, to go to a vacation 135 00:08:40,088 --> 00:08:45,903 and, uh, not to be afraid of, uh, stage things, uh, happening to me. 136 00:08:46,758 --> 00:08:50,458 W. Curtis Preston: So you, you can, you can converse in all those languages. 137 00:08:51,453 --> 00:08:52,733 Boris Agranovich: Uh, yeah. 138 00:08:53,283 --> 00:08:53,523 Yeah. 139 00:08:53,523 --> 00:08:54,753 On basic levels. 140 00:08:54,753 --> 00:08:55,623 Yeah, on basic levels. 141 00:08:55,848 --> 00:08:57,708 W. Curtis Preston: I find, I find that fascinating. 142 00:08:57,713 --> 00:08:59,518 That's just, that's just absolutely amazing. 143 00:08:59,558 --> 00:09:01,568 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, it's a good for risk management. 144 00:09:01,568 --> 00:09:02,688 It's good for risk management, 145 00:09:02,828 --> 00:09:04,743 Prasanna Malaiyandi: I was gonna say with all the countries, 146 00:09:04,743 --> 00:09:06,563 a dial, X-ray or languages. 147 00:09:06,568 --> 00:09:06,813 Yeah. 148 00:09:07,338 --> 00:09:07,908 W. Curtis Preston: Yeah. 149 00:09:07,998 --> 00:09:08,508 Yeah. 150 00:09:08,508 --> 00:09:13,038 And uh, I think I told you, you know, that, I mean, my, my Russian is very small 151 00:09:13,038 --> 00:09:19,908 things like Bre and, and, and, right. 152 00:09:19,968 --> 00:09:23,718 Um, , I have that, that phrase leftover from the eighties. 153 00:09:24,303 --> 00:09:28,373 Boris Agranovich: uh, 30 years ago in T, but uh, in Russia, it uh, kinda 154 00:09:28,373 --> 00:09:31,623 of degradated, uh, other a direction. 155 00:09:31,623 --> 00:09:31,923 Yeah, 156 00:09:33,303 --> 00:09:37,053 W. Curtis Preston: And I believe in, in, um, Ukrainian, you say, right? 157 00:09:37,143 --> 00:09:37,953 Uh, instead of, 158 00:09:38,283 --> 00:09:38,633 Boris Agranovich: it. 159 00:09:40,413 --> 00:09:40,863 W. Curtis Preston: yeah. 160 00:09:40,923 --> 00:09:41,373 Yeah. 161 00:09:41,493 --> 00:09:44,073 Um, it probably doesn't even register for you. 162 00:09:44,073 --> 00:09:45,153 You just sort of do it. 163 00:09:45,353 --> 00:09:48,423 Boris Agranovich: No, I know know now because of this war, I 164 00:09:48,423 --> 00:09:53,343 listen more Ukrainian news, so my Ukrainian was is is kinda a 165 00:09:54,053 --> 00:09:54,253 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Uh, 166 00:09:54,783 --> 00:09:57,103 Boris Agranovich: restoring in my, my, my mind. 167 00:09:57,103 --> 00:09:57,423 Yeah. 168 00:09:57,903 --> 00:09:58,383 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Awesome. 169 00:09:58,593 --> 00:09:59,043 W. Curtis Preston: right. 170 00:09:59,163 --> 00:10:02,943 Prasanna Malaiyandi: So I, I think one of the questions I had is, I know 171 00:10:02,943 --> 00:10:06,693 when you, when I saw that, oh, you're focused on risk management, I was like, 172 00:10:06,753 --> 00:10:09,653 what is risk management right now? 173 00:10:09,708 --> 00:10:11,028 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, good question. 174 00:10:11,028 --> 00:10:15,198 I'm, I'm not sure that I, I can get, get you, give you all kind 175 00:10:15,198 --> 00:10:18,828 of, uh, uh, uh, academic answer. 176 00:10:18,828 --> 00:10:23,598 But for my, uh, my knowledge, uh, as, uh, layman in layman 177 00:10:23,598 --> 00:10:25,758 terms, if you have your business. 178 00:10:26,158 --> 00:10:30,208 It's kind of you looking forward and to how much you earn. 179 00:10:30,538 --> 00:10:37,048 But you also need to, uh, kind of be a person who knows what can be wrong 180 00:10:37,138 --> 00:10:43,528 in your business so you can, uh, take action when it's, when they are needed 181 00:10:43,533 --> 00:10:50,788 to, uh, protect your, uh, bottom line and also catastrophic events for. 182 00:10:51,648 --> 00:10:56,988 What can happen, you can be financial, you can be exposed to financial risk, you 183 00:10:56,988 --> 00:11:02,658 can be exposed to operational risk, you can be exposed to, uh, governance risk. 184 00:11:02,898 --> 00:11:07,518 If you don't do some procedures and uh, some regulations, you 185 00:11:07,523 --> 00:11:09,438 can be exposed to cyber risk. 186 00:11:10,008 --> 00:11:13,278 And I believe there is now also climate risk. 187 00:11:13,638 --> 00:11:17,868 So this kind of risks, you have to, depending on. 188 00:11:19,053 --> 00:11:23,943 Complexity of your business, you, you have to manage all these risks 189 00:11:24,783 --> 00:11:29,303 and depending of, for example, if you are a bank, you probably will have. 190 00:11:30,168 --> 00:11:33,348 Different, uh, risks inside financial risks. 191 00:11:33,348 --> 00:11:36,978 For example, banks have, uh, creditors, they have, uh, they 192 00:11:36,978 --> 00:11:40,008 have, uh, also market risk. 193 00:11:40,013 --> 00:11:45,108 If they trade different currency, they have, uh, within credit risk, 194 00:11:45,108 --> 00:11:46,818 they also have counterparty risk. 195 00:11:47,148 --> 00:11:53,698 So it's kind of becoming a very, very complicated and all this, um, models now 196 00:11:53,698 --> 00:12:00,913 with all this mathematical models and, uh, Of, uh, AI and ml, this is becoming 197 00:12:01,273 --> 00:12:10,483 very, uh, uh, very, uh, strictly, uh, uh, divided because some, some guys 198 00:12:10,483 --> 00:12:13,273 only, uh, specialized in model risk. 199 00:12:13,363 --> 00:12:18,313 In cont model models, uh, developing models in counterparty risks. 200 00:12:18,313 --> 00:12:21,913 Some guys are, uh, specializing in developing. 201 00:12:23,313 --> 00:12:23,673 Ed risk. 202 00:12:23,733 --> 00:12:28,563 So this all, all, uh, very contr, uh, contemplated. 203 00:12:29,298 --> 00:12:32,658 W. Curtis Preston: that, that phrase that you used, you said counterparty risk. 204 00:12:33,348 --> 00:12:36,318 Boris Agranovich: Counterpart, for example, you now you have this 205 00:12:36,318 --> 00:12:38,838 now crisis with crypto, right? 206 00:12:39,168 --> 00:12:42,618 Uh, crypto exchanges, right? 207 00:12:42,948 --> 00:12:46,248 And because they were a counterparty with other guys. 208 00:12:46,563 --> 00:12:52,183 That probably didn't get, uh, any wrong, but cause they, uh, probably, uh, 209 00:12:52,213 --> 00:12:55,063 failed to deliver, uh, to pay on loans. 210 00:12:55,273 --> 00:12:59,953 A lot of, uh, uh, their counterparties exposed to counterparty risk, 211 00:13:00,013 --> 00:13:02,443 uh, from this FDX exchange. 212 00:13:02,508 --> 00:13:07,008 Prasanna Malaiyandi: they're not directly at risk, but because they were associated 213 00:13:07,008 --> 00:13:08,598 through some lineage, they're at risk now. 214 00:13:09,163 --> 00:13:09,823 Boris Agranovich: Exactly. 215 00:13:09,823 --> 00:13:10,153 Yeah. 216 00:13:10,393 --> 00:13:16,123 Prasanna Malaiyandi: So I'm just thinking though, that like as a company owner, 217 00:13:16,123 --> 00:13:20,233 a business owner, you're so focused on building the business, right? 218 00:13:20,743 --> 00:13:23,443 Who even thinks about all of these risks out there? 219 00:13:23,443 --> 00:13:24,883 Like Curtis, I know you had a business 220 00:13:24,883 --> 00:13:25,483 before, right? 221 00:13:26,203 --> 00:13:31,453 ?Yeah, Yeah, I know Boris does, but Curtis like, Been business owner before. 222 00:13:31,843 --> 00:13:33,623 Have you thought about these things? 223 00:13:35,668 --> 00:13:38,428 W. Curtis Preston: Not, certainly not in the way that, that Boris did. 224 00:13:38,428 --> 00:13:43,858 I mean, we, we mainly thought about, I don't know, I, I think I thought about. 225 00:13:45,823 --> 00:13:49,393 Things that I felt I had some, no, I felt some things that I 226 00:13:49,393 --> 00:13:51,163 felt I had some control over. 227 00:13:51,253 --> 00:13:51,703 Right. 228 00:13:52,273 --> 00:13:59,713 Um, and the risks mainly for me at the time were financial risks. 229 00:13:59,743 --> 00:14:04,993 Um, the, there was the concern because we were such a small company. 230 00:14:05,503 --> 00:14:09,763 There was the concern, there was the competitive risk of, of a, you 231 00:14:09,763 --> 00:14:14,563 know, a, a much larger competitor, basically deciding to get into 232 00:14:14,823 --> 00:14:16,183 the same business that we were in. 233 00:14:16,933 --> 00:14:21,973 Um, but the thing is, I was such, I was such small potatoes that, like, 234 00:14:21,978 --> 00:14:26,248 considering them a risk was almost, it, it was like, I just, you know what I mean? 235 00:14:26,248 --> 00:14:27,778 It's like, um, I don't know. 236 00:14:27,778 --> 00:14:31,828 It's hard to, hard to describe, but I, I don't think I thought 237 00:14:31,828 --> 00:14:35,098 about it certainly in the way that, that Boris thinks about it. 238 00:14:35,098 --> 00:14:38,278 I, you know, and of course I'm a backup guy, so I think about those risks. 239 00:14:38,743 --> 00:14:39,133 Boris Agranovich: Ah. 240 00:14:39,163 --> 00:14:44,623 Yeah, it's part of, I think, cyber risk or it risk, I think, and what you talk about. 241 00:14:44,623 --> 00:14:48,943 Uh uh, uh, sorry, I may be interrupt. 242 00:14:49,618 --> 00:14:52,708 Uh, but what you said about it is business risk. 243 00:14:52,708 --> 00:14:57,748 What you say, what, what, what is related to competitors or your business? 244 00:14:57,748 --> 00:15:00,778 Um, business plans or business? 245 00:15:00,838 --> 00:15:03,988 Uh, kind of, uh, uh, product products. 246 00:15:03,988 --> 00:15:06,388 Uh, we call it, uh, business risk. 247 00:15:06,388 --> 00:15:11,818 We don't put it in the category for kind of finance it cyber, so it's kinda 248 00:15:12,868 --> 00:15:20,308 business rules that actually shouldn't be only, uh, Processed by risk people, 249 00:15:20,308 --> 00:15:25,168 they should be kinda processed by, uh, business people, but they have 250 00:15:25,168 --> 00:15:28,228 to be, uh, supported by risk people. 251 00:15:28,228 --> 00:15:32,068 So they, if you produce a new product, product, for example, 252 00:15:32,308 --> 00:15:33,928 risk people have to look on it. 253 00:15:34,288 --> 00:15:37,758 What is it about maybe some regulatory risk or credit 254 00:15:37,758 --> 00:15:39,318 risk or some, some other risk? 255 00:15:39,853 --> 00:15:40,463 W. Curtis Preston: Mm-hmm. 256 00:15:42,403 --> 00:15:42,683 Interesting. 257 00:15:42,688 --> 00:15:47,413 And so as a, so I'm assuming at a. 258 00:15:48,843 --> 00:15:51,493 A company would have a risk manager, right? 259 00:15:52,698 --> 00:15:56,713 Would, each like, I don't know how large a company would be before 260 00:15:56,713 --> 00:16:01,273 they have a risk manager, like an employee versus a risk management 261 00:16:01,618 --> 00:16:01,768 Prasanna Malaiyandi: It. 262 00:16:01,858 --> 00:16:03,958 It probably also depends on the industry. 263 00:16:03,963 --> 00:16:06,658 Like I could imagine a financial company, even if they're small, 264 00:16:07,588 --> 00:16:12,148 They probably have a risk function in there versus like a tech company 265 00:16:12,148 --> 00:16:13,588 may not do it until it's a certain. 266 00:16:14,428 --> 00:16:15,418 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, absolutely. 267 00:16:15,418 --> 00:16:19,298 Uh, because I was originally from banking in the insurance industry. 268 00:16:19,303 --> 00:16:24,298 So this is where, uh, they have to, uh, have a risk management, even department 269 00:16:24,303 --> 00:16:28,468 of risk management, where they all will do, they develop all these models for 270 00:16:28,468 --> 00:16:31,348 this, uh, different types of, uh, risk. 271 00:16:31,353 --> 00:16:37,198 Uh, and they have to kind of contact, uh, my regular with the regulators about 272 00:16:37,198 --> 00:16:40,408 all these new rules, uh, like socks and. 273 00:16:41,263 --> 00:16:49,693 But now I think many other companies, uh, also develop risk management department. 274 00:16:49,698 --> 00:16:54,463 I think, uh, for example, if you look at health and safety industry, 275 00:16:54,733 --> 00:16:56,953 there are also kind health and. 276 00:16:58,778 --> 00:17:03,788 Separate probably, um, division of risk management. 277 00:17:04,088 --> 00:17:08,138 And they have to, they have all their own, their own kinda regulators. 278 00:17:08,408 --> 00:17:13,658 Also, if you look at, uh, industry and now with climate change is all 279 00:17:13,958 --> 00:17:16,268 related also with this compliance. 280 00:17:16,268 --> 00:17:21,308 So, uh, although risk and compliance or very often different, uh, different, 281 00:17:21,308 --> 00:17:27,458 uh, disciplines, they sometimes kinda, uh, glued together to. 282 00:17:28,033 --> 00:17:35,593 Have a kinda based basic kinda risk management or compliance 283 00:17:35,593 --> 00:17:37,363 department in some, some topics. 284 00:17:37,363 --> 00:17:42,823 So they, for example, if a new, uh, and compliance procedure arises 285 00:17:42,823 --> 00:17:47,513 from, uh, from regulation, they have to up and develop response. 286 00:17:49,693 --> 00:17:49,948 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Yeah. 287 00:17:50,008 --> 00:17:53,968 I, I'm also just thinking like, so I work worse in privacy, right? 288 00:17:53,968 --> 00:17:57,928 And so anytime you have like regulators or when decisions get made right 289 00:17:57,958 --> 00:18:01,328 now, it's like, okay, how does that impact everything else that's being. 290 00:18:02,413 --> 00:18:03,883 Or that has been built already. 291 00:18:03,883 --> 00:18:04,123 Right. 292 00:18:04,123 --> 00:18:07,093 And what is the risk there associated with some of those? 293 00:18:07,693 --> 00:18:12,853 Um, I guess the one question I had for you, Boris, is so I 294 00:18:12,853 --> 00:18:16,183 understand like there's people who go thinking about the risks. 295 00:18:16,513 --> 00:18:21,283 Can you talk a little bit about like, why should people even 296 00:18:21,283 --> 00:18:24,883 care about these risks, right? 297 00:18:24,883 --> 00:18:28,183 Like, what are, what's the outcome if they ignore these risks or if they 298 00:18:28,183 --> 00:18:30,223 didn't have a risk manager or something? 299 00:18:31,003 --> 00:18:33,823 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, it depends, of course, if you are a small business, 300 00:18:33,828 --> 00:18:39,583 uh, you don't have to have a specific risk management role, uh, in your. 301 00:18:40,498 --> 00:18:44,038 Company, but at least you have to manage your risks yourself. 302 00:18:44,488 --> 00:18:49,768 For example, maybe you have a kind small understanding of what your risks are. 303 00:18:50,128 --> 00:18:53,668 Maybe you have an account and accounted and he will talk or 304 00:18:53,668 --> 00:18:56,068 she will talk to you of business. 305 00:18:56,248 --> 00:18:57,058 It'll enough. 306 00:18:57,393 --> 00:19:02,463 For example, you know you have a pay, you have credit cause you, you 307 00:19:02,463 --> 00:19:08,073 have invoices probably you have some days from your invoices and probably 308 00:19:08,193 --> 00:19:09,903 it'll be about maybe one month. 309 00:19:09,908 --> 00:19:13,653 And some big companies they don't even pay after three months. 310 00:19:13,653 --> 00:19:16,563 So it's uh, kinda shame. 311 00:19:16,798 --> 00:19:19,978 And some people have to, to manage their invoices and 312 00:19:19,978 --> 00:19:21,808 probably liquidity so they don't, 313 00:19:25,648 --> 00:19:26,398 invoices don't. 314 00:19:28,678 --> 00:19:29,338 W. Curtis Preston: that that was. 315 00:19:31,093 --> 00:19:35,623 That was one thing I remember as a small company, I, I often did business 316 00:19:35,653 --> 00:19:40,033 with very large companies and we were doing, you know, we would be sending 317 00:19:40,033 --> 00:19:44,443 an invoice and we're doing an, we were putting on events an event. 318 00:19:44,443 --> 00:19:48,163 When you put on events, it's very costly and so we wanted as much as 319 00:19:48,168 --> 00:19:53,013 possible for the customers to pay up front and many of them would, and our 320 00:19:53,213 --> 00:19:56,953 contract would specify that they're supposed to, but those bigger companies, 321 00:19:57,733 --> 00:19:58,963 Yeah, I know we're not gonna do that. 322 00:19:59,173 --> 00:19:59,923 And what are you gonna do? 323 00:20:00,043 --> 00:20:00,883 Do you want our money? 324 00:20:01,423 --> 00:20:04,393 You want our, you want our money in 90 days or do you want no money? 325 00:20:04,693 --> 00:20:05,113 Right. 326 00:20:05,143 --> 00:20:11,708 And you have, you have no power to, uh, You know, I remember, 327 00:20:11,713 --> 00:20:16,048 like, I remember one time when I, I showed them our, our msa, right? 328 00:20:16,048 --> 00:20:20,278 Our master services agreement, this one vendor, and they're like, that's cute. 329 00:20:20,398 --> 00:20:23,488 Here's ours, sign it, or, you know, walk. 330 00:20:23,568 --> 00:20:24,058 Boris Agranovich: Yeah. 331 00:20:24,063 --> 00:20:25,738 W. Curtis Preston: was like, oh, okay. 332 00:20:25,858 --> 00:20:28,508 Well I guess we're signing their msa, right? 333 00:20:28,738 --> 00:20:32,428 And they're like, we do a net 180, right? 334 00:20:32,428 --> 00:20:32,578 You. 335 00:20:32,788 --> 00:20:33,718 Boris Agranovich: Uh, wow. 336 00:20:33,723 --> 00:20:39,058 Yeah, I know these companies, but now I think, uh, regulators in Europe 337 00:20:39,058 --> 00:20:43,918 at least, they kind of demand, uh, demand that, uh, these days, uh, uh, 338 00:20:44,608 --> 00:20:52,678 payment days will be less, I think it's now standard 30 days in, in Europe. 339 00:20:52,678 --> 00:20:57,628 Uh, so, uh, kind of small guys also have more, uh, uh, power. 340 00:20:58,543 --> 00:21:02,563 Because, yeah, it's one of the biggest risks if you do an event like this. 341 00:21:02,563 --> 00:21:05,803 And do you, you have to pay from your pocket. 342 00:21:05,803 --> 00:21:12,373 And do you have a liquidity issue with don't, you're not to pay your for a a, 343 00:21:13,453 --> 00:21:16,003 W. Curtis Preston: remember sitting there often sitting there with over a 344 00:21:16,003 --> 00:21:17,833 hundred thousand dollars in receivables. 345 00:21:18,448 --> 00:21:19,498 Very little in the bank. 346 00:21:19,528 --> 00:21:21,298 Meanwhile, I need to make payroll. 347 00:21:21,778 --> 00:21:22,228 Right. 348 00:21:22,348 --> 00:21:27,358 Um, I'll tell you, I did, we had, we did have a clause in our contract, 349 00:21:28,048 --> 00:21:33,118 um, and it's a, um, it's a company that persona that you and I both know, 350 00:21:33,123 --> 00:21:36,508 obviously I'm not gonna shame 'em on the podcast, but they were, they 351 00:21:36,508 --> 00:21:38,488 were a company that I worked with. 352 00:21:38,968 --> 00:21:42,568 And what it was, was I had a clause and a contract that said after 30 353 00:21:42,568 --> 00:21:47,338 days we start adding, it was like 1%. 354 00:21:48,253 --> 00:21:53,113 To the invoice, um, that it was like, it was like it was either 1% or half 355 00:21:53,113 --> 00:21:57,703 a percent per day to the invoice after, after a certain period of 356 00:21:57,703 --> 00:21:59,113 time, it might have been 60 days. 357 00:21:59,233 --> 00:21:59,623 Right. 358 00:22:00,253 --> 00:22:04,753 And there was this one customer I had that, um, they were blowing 359 00:22:04,753 --> 00:22:11,173 me off and, um, I, uh, I kept, I kept sending them updated invoices. 360 00:22:11,173 --> 00:22:16,423 I'm like, your invoice is now a hundred percent more. 361 00:22:17,208 --> 00:22:23,308 , you know, because of compounded penalties and at some point it got to 362 00:22:23,808 --> 00:22:29,578 actually 150% of the original value, you know, or 250%, if you will, of 363 00:22:29,578 --> 00:22:31,198 the original value of the invoice. 364 00:22:31,798 --> 00:22:35,458 And they were blowing me off and then they got acquired or 365 00:22:35,458 --> 00:22:37,078 they were going to get acquired. 366 00:22:37,963 --> 00:22:38,803 By a company. 367 00:22:39,253 --> 00:22:43,393 And I was like, oh, this is like, if I don't, I gotta do it now, right? 368 00:22:43,393 --> 00:22:44,503 If I don't fix it now. 369 00:22:45,073 --> 00:22:50,533 And I, um, I went and I went to, uh, there used to be this 370 00:22:50,593 --> 00:22:53,473 company called, uh, jigsaw. 371 00:22:53,593 --> 00:22:55,663 The, then it got acquired by Salesforce. 372 00:22:55,668 --> 00:22:59,593 That was like where you could go and you could just easily get the, you 373 00:22:59,593 --> 00:23:01,633 know, some key names from company. 374 00:23:01,843 --> 00:23:04,423 And I went and I got the ceo, the cfo. 375 00:23:04,963 --> 00:23:08,533 The chairman of the board and I got all their contact information and 376 00:23:08,533 --> 00:23:13,243 then I sent them registered letters and emails and, and everything, and 377 00:23:13,243 --> 00:23:17,323 I basically said, I have a contract with your name on it, and you have not 378 00:23:17,323 --> 00:23:19,363 contested a contract you now owe me. 379 00:23:19,603 --> 00:23:23,953 I mean, it went from like $18,000 to $40,000. 380 00:23:24,613 --> 00:23:28,303 And, and, um, and you're about to be acquired. 381 00:23:28,303 --> 00:23:32,473 And I have this, this is a, this is a lie against your company essentially. 382 00:23:33,403 --> 00:23:39,343 Amazingly, I got a FedEx the next day with a check with a check for $40,000. 383 00:23:39,793 --> 00:23:40,003 That 384 00:23:40,013 --> 00:23:41,763 Boris Agranovich: No, you don't pay lawyers 385 00:23:41,928 --> 00:23:42,043 W. Curtis Preston: day. 386 00:23:42,583 --> 00:23:42,883 Yeah. 387 00:23:42,883 --> 00:23:44,413 That was a good, that was a good day. 388 00:23:44,893 --> 00:23:49,873 Um, so there was something else that you and I talked about in the pre-call. 389 00:23:50,263 --> 00:23:55,663 You mentioned this thing you have called the, the, um, darn it. 390 00:23:55,668 --> 00:23:56,383 What did you call it? 391 00:23:56,658 --> 00:24:00,538 Boris Agranovich: We, we, we have a, we as a global risk community, 392 00:24:00,898 --> 00:24:06,268 we often create kind of products kind emanating from our community. 393 00:24:06,508 --> 00:24:12,118 So we created a GRC business, continue to tool it, which you are probably, 394 00:24:12,448 --> 00:24:16,558 you are interested, your users can find on our cited Global Risk Academy. 395 00:24:16,558 --> 00:24:17,098 Don't come. 396 00:24:17,818 --> 00:24:19,298 So yeah, this is the. 397 00:24:19,303 --> 00:24:22,423 W. Curtis Preston: am really curious when we talk about, I always talk about 398 00:24:22,423 --> 00:24:24,703 data protection and backup, and Dr. 399 00:24:24,883 --> 00:24:27,043 And I always mention that that is a component. 400 00:24:28,138 --> 00:24:30,838 Of business continuance overall. 401 00:24:31,318 --> 00:24:36,898 So I am curious from your vantage point, besides the idea of recovering 402 00:24:36,898 --> 00:24:41,728 your computing environment, what else does somebody need to have 403 00:24:41,728 --> 00:24:43,228 in a business continuance plan? 404 00:24:44,188 --> 00:24:45,088 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, absolutely. 405 00:24:45,088 --> 00:24:51,238 So, um, I will tell you that, uh, our two kit contains, uh, 406 00:24:51,688 --> 00:24:54,388 different various, um, kind of. 407 00:24:55,333 --> 00:24:55,963 Document. 408 00:24:55,963 --> 00:24:59,563 For example, we have business impact analysis questionnaire. 409 00:24:59,563 --> 00:25:03,763 So you will have to go through all your inventories and do some work. 410 00:25:04,183 --> 00:25:09,163 Then you have a BCP template, which is a business continuity plan template. 411 00:25:09,163 --> 00:25:12,703 So you will have to, to work through all this, uh, processes 412 00:25:12,703 --> 00:25:16,663 and, uh, figure out what is, uh, important, what is less important. 413 00:25:17,023 --> 00:25:22,633 Then we have business continuity, uh, recovery, uh, questionnaire. 414 00:25:23,158 --> 00:25:29,488 And then we have a business, uh, uh, procedures like, uh, 415 00:25:31,068 --> 00:25:33,388 business risk analysis template. 416 00:25:33,658 --> 00:25:38,728 So it's all very documented based on the best practices in banks and 417 00:25:38,728 --> 00:25:41,638 very, uh, sophisticated institution. 418 00:25:41,998 --> 00:25:47,068 So we have also Chris crisis management plan that actually when we spoke about 419 00:25:47,068 --> 00:25:51,838 with you, with small companies, I think it's this plan should be available for. 420 00:25:52,103 --> 00:25:53,753 Even for small companies. 421 00:25:54,443 --> 00:26:04,433 So also sample, uh, sample vulnerability chart with all this appliances and uh, big 422 00:26:04,613 --> 00:26:07,183 machinery that you have should be there. 423 00:26:07,768 --> 00:26:12,568 So it's kind of a complete scoring methodology that will help, uh, even 424 00:26:12,778 --> 00:26:18,748 uh, people who are not, um, familiar with this, uh, uh, discipline. 425 00:26:19,048 --> 00:26:23,878 They can download it and they can just, uh, start from scratch filling it. 426 00:26:23,878 --> 00:26:29,758 Uh, and also it's has some glossary, so, For terms, people who don't know 427 00:26:30,158 --> 00:26:34,738 anything can, uh, can uh, see, see what, what is the important stuff. 428 00:26:35,218 --> 00:26:37,498 So also technology recovery plan there. 429 00:26:37,558 --> 00:26:38,518 So this is all. 430 00:26:39,913 --> 00:26:43,453 Prasanna Malaiyandi: I, I'm thinking this is super helpful for 431 00:26:43,453 --> 00:26:45,553 people who aren't aware, right? 432 00:26:45,583 --> 00:26:50,473 Of what risk is and what question should they be even trying to find the answers 433 00:26:50,473 --> 00:26:54,813 for, because they may not be, it's like, When you're like, your insurance carrier 434 00:26:54,813 --> 00:26:56,193 says, oh, how much insurance do you want? 435 00:26:56,193 --> 00:26:58,233 You're like, I don't know how much insurance I need. 436 00:26:58,233 --> 00:26:59,793 What are the questions I should be asking? 437 00:27:00,393 --> 00:27:00,663 Right? 438 00:27:00,663 --> 00:27:01,353 To figure that out. 439 00:27:01,353 --> 00:27:04,983 And it looks like this toolkit sort of helps you go through and answer 440 00:27:04,983 --> 00:27:08,613 those questions and figure out, okay, where do I potentially have risks? 441 00:27:08,618 --> 00:27:13,203 And, oh, I may not have thought about crisis management like Curtis, for when 442 00:27:13,203 --> 00:27:19,383 you had your small company, did you have a plan in place in case someone got sick or. 443 00:27:21,178 --> 00:27:23,578 flight got missed, like when you're going to an event, 444 00:27:23,608 --> 00:27:23,938 right? 445 00:27:23,968 --> 00:27:24,508 W. Curtis Preston: yeah. 446 00:27:24,808 --> 00:27:29,368 Flight got, yeah, flight got missed, but, but like I, I was the main 447 00:27:29,373 --> 00:27:31,138 speaker at these events that we put on. 448 00:27:31,558 --> 00:27:34,678 There was no plan for Curtis gets sick, right. 449 00:27:34,888 --> 00:27:35,688 Curtis gets. 450 00:27:36,593 --> 00:27:38,963 Curtis gets covid and there's no speaker. 451 00:27:39,773 --> 00:27:45,713 Um, the, we, we had, we had all kinds of, uh, travel issues 452 00:27:45,718 --> 00:27:47,573 over the, over the years, right? 453 00:27:47,603 --> 00:27:49,673 Because we were often. 454 00:27:50,473 --> 00:27:53,713 It was Monday morning was always a difficult, cuz we do a, we do an event 455 00:27:53,713 --> 00:27:55,903 on Tuesday, we'd do an event on Thursday. 456 00:27:56,443 --> 00:28:00,553 We would fly, you know, so we're flying on the very first flight on a Monday morning. 457 00:28:00,553 --> 00:28:01,813 Again, managing risk. 458 00:28:02,023 --> 00:28:06,463 The risk was that the flight you're on is delayed and or canceled. 459 00:28:06,468 --> 00:28:11,833 And so, You might wanna fly in the afternoon, but if that flight is delayed, 460 00:28:12,103 --> 00:28:13,843 you're not making it to the city. 461 00:28:13,843 --> 00:28:18,043 So we would fly out on the first available flight, even if that was 462 00:28:18,043 --> 00:28:22,813 six in the morning, and we would fly to to, to wherever we were going. 463 00:28:22,843 --> 00:28:27,463 That was the biggest risk, was that the entire, cuz we're all in, we all lived in 464 00:28:27,463 --> 00:28:29,083 San Diego, we were all in the same flight. 465 00:28:29,473 --> 00:28:30,763 If that flight was delayed. 466 00:28:31,143 --> 00:28:32,583 There was no event happening. 467 00:28:32,703 --> 00:28:33,153 Right. 468 00:28:33,513 --> 00:28:35,433 Um, there was no backup team. 469 00:28:35,583 --> 00:28:37,203 There was no, there was no nothing. 470 00:28:37,653 --> 00:28:43,773 And, um, and I, I remember, um, uh, probably the worst thing 471 00:28:43,773 --> 00:28:48,723 that happened to us while we were traveling, we landed in, um, Houston. 472 00:28:49,143 --> 00:28:50,733 Yeah, I'm talking to you Houston. 473 00:28:50,853 --> 00:28:52,293 I will never forget this. 474 00:28:52,533 --> 00:28:56,313 I landed, we landed in Houston and we went to go to dinner 475 00:28:56,373 --> 00:28:59,253 and we weren't, um, we weren't. 476 00:29:00,553 --> 00:29:01,513 Paying attention. 477 00:29:02,113 --> 00:29:07,063 And we had our backpacks in the backseat and we went to dinner and they broke 478 00:29:07,063 --> 00:29:09,113 in and they stole all our backpacks. 479 00:29:09,113 --> 00:29:12,943 So they stole all three laptops, all three iPads. 480 00:29:13,573 --> 00:29:19,483 So we had to do the event like we had, everything was in like Google Docs and 481 00:29:19,483 --> 00:29:26,473 what not, but we had no laptops to get to Google Docs like we were doing, we were 482 00:29:26,473 --> 00:29:28,783 doing stuff on phones and stuff like that. 483 00:29:29,173 --> 00:29:33,193 Um, But the, yeah, that was, I think that's the worst 484 00:29:33,193 --> 00:29:33,913 thing that happened to it. 485 00:29:33,913 --> 00:29:38,593 That one and the time when I went to go, it was the morning before 486 00:29:38,593 --> 00:29:43,663 we're, you know, we're getting ready to travel and we had these two cases 487 00:29:43,663 --> 00:29:50,233 of equipment that we always traveled with and um, uh, I won't say who, but. 488 00:29:51,403 --> 00:29:58,063 She might be the singer on the theme song of this podcast who left the garage 489 00:29:58,063 --> 00:30:02,893 door open with my equipment in the garage and someone stole all my equipment. 490 00:30:03,193 --> 00:30:05,713 And I, I found that out the day before the show. 491 00:30:05,953 --> 00:30:07,933 So, no, we never had a backup plan. 492 00:30:08,413 --> 00:30:12,133 Um, you know, the backup plan was we don't have an. 493 00:30:13,383 --> 00:30:13,993 Boris Agranovich: Mm-hmm. 494 00:30:14,128 --> 00:30:16,018 W. Curtis Preston: Um, that's just, that's just the way. 495 00:30:16,228 --> 00:30:19,648 So cur this, this, uh, this toolkit that you're talking about 496 00:30:19,648 --> 00:30:21,298 is this, do they pay for this? 497 00:30:21,298 --> 00:30:23,098 Resources is a free resource. 498 00:30:23,098 --> 00:30:24,208 How, how does that work? 499 00:30:24,958 --> 00:30:27,268 Boris Agranovich: No, it's, it's actually paid the resource. 500 00:30:27,268 --> 00:30:30,148 Uh, they can find it on Global Risk Academy. 501 00:30:31,123 --> 00:30:31,513 It's, 502 00:30:31,513 --> 00:30:36,433 uh, yeah, it's 1, 1 79, uh, US dollars. 503 00:30:36,913 --> 00:30:42,103 But I think if you, if they wanted to have some initial, uh, uh, free 504 00:30:42,503 --> 00:30:46,723 resources, we have a lot of them on our site at, uh, also at Global Risk 505 00:30:46,728 --> 00:30:52,633 Academy as a core site and on global risk, global risk community.com as 506 00:30:52,633 --> 00:30:55,503 a kinda block event site, uh, whole. 507 00:30:56,518 --> 00:30:58,978 W. Curtis Preston: So it's global risk academy.com, 508 00:30:59,893 --> 00:31:03,433 Boris Agranovich: global risk Academy is a kind of course site, uh, online 509 00:31:03,433 --> 00:31:05,473 courses for our community people. 510 00:31:06,333 --> 00:31:06,673 Normally we, 511 00:31:06,768 --> 00:31:09,568 W. Curtis Preston: sure it's, it's global risk academy.com. 512 00:31:10,303 --> 00:31:11,383 Boris Agranovich: yeah, global risk 513 00:31:11,383 --> 00:31:12,433 academy.com. 514 00:31:12,558 --> 00:31:13,048 W. Curtis Preston: Okay. 515 00:31:13,978 --> 00:31:17,098 Prasanna Malaiyandi: So if people wanted to just learn more about risk 516 00:31:17,098 --> 00:31:22,108 management, they could probably go to the global risk community website, right? 517 00:31:22,108 --> 00:31:24,898 To read the blogs, understand more about it. 518 00:31:26,503 --> 00:31:29,893 Boris Agranovich: They can go, they can read it free, even if 519 00:31:30,103 --> 00:31:31,663 they don't want to be a member. 520 00:31:31,663 --> 00:31:34,483 But if they become, if they become member, it's free. 521 00:31:34,783 --> 00:31:40,513 And then you will, they will get, uh, once per week newsletter, which they 522 00:31:40,513 --> 00:31:44,893 can also unsubscribe if they don't want to have a lot of emails in their box. 523 00:31:45,283 --> 00:31:48,763 But, uh, in, in mainly this is, uh, because. 524 00:31:49,043 --> 00:31:49,643 Important. 525 00:31:49,873 --> 00:31:54,773 They, they can read the blogs, they can participate in a lot of events. 526 00:31:55,103 --> 00:32:01,193 We and our partners produce and also read some partnership, um, posts, for 527 00:32:01,193 --> 00:32:08,453 example, guys, uh, produce some research and some, uh, kind of benchmark reports. 528 00:32:08,453 --> 00:32:10,913 So this all we deliver on our. 529 00:32:12,733 --> 00:32:13,963 Prasanna Malaiyandi: I was just curious. 530 00:32:13,968 --> 00:32:17,293 I know Boris, you talked about sort of climate risk. 531 00:32:17,323 --> 00:32:24,223 Is that something that's new and like an up and coming research area or risk area 532 00:32:24,223 --> 00:32:25,963 that people have to now start considering? 533 00:32:26,723 --> 00:32:28,633 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, I think for big companies. 534 00:32:28,633 --> 00:32:34,993 And now with all this esg, uh, uh, you know, isg, what do you call it? 535 00:32:35,053 --> 00:32:38,853 Environment, um, uh, 536 00:32:38,968 --> 00:32:41,038 Prasanna Malaiyandi: The environment sustainability 537 00:32:41,413 --> 00:32:43,333 Boris Agranovich: oh, sustainability and, uh, 538 00:32:43,468 --> 00:32:43,958 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Yeah. 539 00:32:45,583 --> 00:32:49,453 Boris Agranovich: Governance, I think, or something like this, uh, because it's now 540 00:32:49,663 --> 00:32:52,873 on govern government level over the world. 541 00:32:52,873 --> 00:33:00,163 They decide, uh, kinda, uh, co2, uh, emission plans to, uh, stop 542 00:33:00,343 --> 00:33:03,103 trying to stop climate, uh, change. 543 00:33:03,553 --> 00:33:08,803 And, uh, it's to have a lot of, uh, consequences on the level of companies, 544 00:33:08,803 --> 00:33:15,203 for example, in, uh, Oil and gas and, uh, mining companies because they use 545 00:33:15,203 --> 00:33:17,933 a lot of resources and they have to. 546 00:33:17,993 --> 00:33:25,253 For example, now in Europe, I think we own a a, uh, wrong, uh, of this is ISG 547 00:33:25,673 --> 00:33:36,118 because, uh, a of uh, Very wise, uh, uh, policy, politics, policy people in, 548 00:33:36,178 --> 00:33:42,028 for example, Germany, they decided to get rid of all this oil, gas, and such a 549 00:33:42,033 --> 00:33:45,298 warm company as warm country as Germany. 550 00:33:45,298 --> 00:33:46,318 They decided to. 551 00:33:46,603 --> 00:33:53,473 Rely on sun and, uh, wind, uh, and uh, also on the Russian, on the Russian gas. 552 00:33:53,473 --> 00:33:58,903 And of course in this, uh, climate, they now, they don't have Russian energy. 553 00:33:59,293 --> 00:34:02,623 And the sun Sunday weather is also doesn't help. 554 00:34:02,653 --> 00:34:08,083 Uh, so now we help, we have a lot of, uh, issues with sg. 555 00:34:08,388 --> 00:34:13,728 Because people, uh, stopped, uh, in investing in oil and gas. 556 00:34:14,058 --> 00:34:21,998 But this all kinda, uh, not ag to blame, but uh, kinda, uh, mind of this politics. 557 00:34:21,998 --> 00:34:25,038 This politics intervene in the business. 558 00:34:25,338 --> 00:34:31,608 And, uh, also it kind, um, um, prevents, uh, a good develop. 559 00:34:33,418 --> 00:34:36,628 and of course it's a kind of social movement, you know, all 560 00:34:36,628 --> 00:34:42,208 this greenwash, uh, it's kind of on television people, uh, doing a lot 561 00:34:42,208 --> 00:34:47,878 of demonstration and, uh, politic and starting to kind of take action. 562 00:34:48,268 --> 00:34:53,858 And because of this, uh, we have such a big problems, but ESG itself is a 563 00:34:53,858 --> 00:34:56,518 good idea, but, uh, it, uh, produces. 564 00:34:57,288 --> 00:35:03,198 Many, uh, results that are not, uh, kind of, uh, uh, beneficial 565 00:35:03,198 --> 00:35:04,968 for, for all, uh, people. 566 00:35:05,008 --> 00:35:05,428 Prasanna Malaiyandi: Yeah. 567 00:35:06,438 --> 00:35:09,268 W. Curtis Preston: Yeah, I, I think that's, you know, anytime you have a big. 568 00:35:10,243 --> 00:35:11,923 Social movement like that. 569 00:35:12,163 --> 00:35:15,133 Uh, like in this case, environmental science, we have the same 570 00:35:15,133 --> 00:35:16,723 problem in, in cloud, right? 571 00:35:16,723 --> 00:35:21,433 So people are, people are moving to the cloud and you get a lot of cloud 572 00:35:21,438 --> 00:35:24,223 washing, you'll get a lot of people are like, oh, we're cloud, we're good. 573 00:35:24,223 --> 00:35:27,653 You know, it's like, eh, you're not really cloud, right? 574 00:35:27,903 --> 00:35:32,683 Um, and um, you know, we, we did a couple of episodes. 575 00:35:32,683 --> 00:35:33,433 I don't know if you. 576 00:35:34,693 --> 00:35:35,983 You being where you're at. 577 00:35:35,983 --> 00:35:41,953 Did, did you remember that, that cl the story about the OVH cloud, uh, the 578 00:35:42,013 --> 00:35:44,083 giant fire that was there a couple years 579 00:35:44,083 --> 00:35:44,983 Prasanna Malaiyandi: France, I think 580 00:35:45,403 --> 00:35:46,243 W. Curtis Preston: in France? 581 00:35:47,768 --> 00:35:48,118 Boris Agranovich: Um, 582 00:35:48,133 --> 00:35:50,833 Prasanna Malaiyandi: they're a cloud company that hosted data 583 00:35:50,833 --> 00:35:52,963 centers in containers, cargo 584 00:35:53,143 --> 00:35:58,243 W. Curtis Preston: Yeah, and there was a giant fire that that took out 585 00:35:58,963 --> 00:36:02,683 a couple of data centers and a lot of customers actually lost data even though 586 00:36:02,688 --> 00:36:04,843 they had paid for the backup system. 587 00:36:05,503 --> 00:36:08,023 Um, that I'm surprised that it. 588 00:36:08,668 --> 00:36:11,098 That it hasn't made it over your way, but then again, you 589 00:36:11,098 --> 00:36:13,108 don't focus on DR and stuff. 590 00:36:13,108 --> 00:36:17,638 But that, that popped, that popped on my radar pretty, pretty quick. 591 00:36:18,238 --> 00:36:23,788 Um, any final thoughts that you have, Boris, uh, that you know, things that 592 00:36:23,793 --> 00:36:25,168 you would've wanted to talk about? 593 00:36:26,743 --> 00:36:32,023 Boris Agranovich: Yeah, I think, uh, with you guys, I think we have a lot of, uh, in 594 00:36:32,023 --> 00:36:37,513 common because you're also managing risk and I, it's of course, it's kind of, uh, 595 00:36:37,843 --> 00:36:41,033 one of the, uh, many, uh, facets of risk. 596 00:36:41,808 --> 00:36:42,418 W. Curtis Preston: Mm-hmm. 597 00:36:42,733 --> 00:36:46,093 Boris Agranovich: it's in, uh, it domain. 598 00:36:46,363 --> 00:36:49,423 I'm not sure it's only, but maybe organizational domain. 599 00:36:49,843 --> 00:36:57,013 So I think, uh, if people have some more questions and uh, uh, about, uh, 600 00:36:57,018 --> 00:37:01,243 risk management also in about this business, continue to talk it, they can 601 00:37:01,243 --> 00:37:03,943 go to our site, uh, and check it out. 602 00:37:04,573 --> 00:37:10,723 Um, it's available and, uh, I'm always open for questions in blog 603 00:37:10,723 --> 00:37:13,033 and discussions, uh, and event. 604 00:37:13,033 --> 00:37:17,593 So also some people who want to join our podcast. 605 00:37:17,593 --> 00:37:24,793 As you guys, uh, you joined, welcome to discuss this important topic of business 606 00:37:24,798 --> 00:37:27,493 continuity and, uh, disaster recovery. 607 00:37:27,493 --> 00:37:32,173 We're happy to, to provide, uh, your view to, to our. 608 00:37:34,018 --> 00:37:34,888 W. Curtis Preston: Yeah, absolutely. 609 00:37:34,888 --> 00:37:37,588 And, uh, persona great with your questions as well, 610 00:37:38,368 --> 00:37:39,748 Prasanna Malaiyandi: No thank you Curtis. 611 00:37:39,748 --> 00:37:42,028 Good luck with the floor and Boris it. 612 00:37:42,178 --> 00:37:43,378 Nice chatting with you. 613 00:37:44,578 --> 00:37:47,368 W. Curtis Preston: and, uh, and I'll thank, I'll thank 614 00:37:47,368 --> 00:37:49,288 you to our, uh, listeners. 615 00:37:49,288 --> 00:37:52,528 Make sure to subscribe so that you can restore it all.