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[00:00:17] The Missional Life - Dan: All right. Welcome back to Mission Life podcast. Today we have Janet Boy on the show. Janet is the founder and CEO of Janet Boy's Ministries, an organization dedicated to guiding individuals toward freedom from homosexuality and other sexual sins through the transformative power of Jesus Christ. She's also an ordained minister with the Assemblies of God and the author of several impactful books, including called Out a Former Lesbian's Discovery of Freedom, as well as God and the LGB.

[00:00:43] The Missional Life - Dan: Tea Community, a compassionate guide for parents, families, and

[00:00:47] The Missional Life - Dan: churches. Janet, welcome to the show.

[00:00:50] Janet Boynes: Welcome. Thank you both for having me. What a blessing.

[00:00:54] The Missional Life - Dan: Amen. Great to have you. It's

[00:00:55] Janet Boynes: good to be here.

[00:00:57] The Missional Life - Dan: Janet, let's start off, can you share with our listeners some of your personal journey and what led you to establish Janet Boyne Ministries?

[00:01:05] Janet Boynes: Yeah, it. You know, my story is not unique, but it is unique to some but not others. When people go through a lot of trauma, it can guide you to drugs or alcohol or homosexuality. Like I wind up going into being raised in a family of seven kids, four different fathers, and one of those fore fathers that raised me was an alcoholic.

[00:01:28] Janet Boynes: Violence would always break out at our home. And me not being a bad kid, even though everybody said I was a bad kid, I would go to school and start doing the things that I saw my parents doing at home. Meaning I went to school and started fighting. You know, I started beating up all the kids because I assumed that.

[00:01:48] Janet Boynes: Beating up kids was how you handle your problems. 'cause that's how my parents handle their problems. Profanity came outta my mouth. Why? Because I heard it from my families. A lot of parents think, you know, they wonder why their children are acting out. They're acting out because of some of the things, not only that they're hearing at school, but a lot of times what they're hearing at home.

[00:02:07] Janet Boynes: And during that time of the watching my father abuse my mother, then my mother started abusing us as children and. She held nothing back. We got beatings with extension cords and broom handles, and not with our clothes on. You know, back in my era, you know, I'm 66 years old, so back in the, you know, sixties and seventies, man, they beat us with our clothes off and hoping that, you know, we would learn a lesson from that, but not really for me because my mom beating me gave me some type of.

[00:02:42] Janet Boynes: Love. I thought that's the way she loved me is by disciplining me. And so I would act out quite often. However, at the age of 13, because I was raised in a family of seven kids, four different fathers, I used to follow my sister down to her dad's house, not knowing what could happen to me later. So me and my youngest sister, you know, we're like little ducks following the big duck, you know, down to her dad's house and one day.

[00:03:08] Janet Boynes: He sent my sister both to the store and then he raped me. And so later in life I found out that he did the same thing to my youngest sister, but I didn't tell my mom. And so many people in our churches, Dan and Amanda, are suffering in silence. Why are they suffering in silence is because we won't talk about it.

[00:03:28] Janet Boynes: So when we don't talk about it, people assume that. Somehow we agree with the issue or we just don't want to tackle that. However, I did not go into, for me, I didn't go into homosexuality right away. I was a great basketball player. I would get kicked outta school often. Everybody thought I was a bad kid because I got in trouble all the time, but they didn't realize what was happening to me in the home.

[00:03:51] Janet Boynes: The abuse that I was dealing with, the rape that I went through that I didn't tell anybody until I was 21 years old. And when I decided to, to tell my mother what happened and my stepfather who raised me, nobody believed me. Naden didn't believe me until 15 years later, until my youngest sister, who was married to her husband, decided to tell my mom because she was going through just a lot of trauma and pain and getting counseling and she finally had to, you know, get it off her heart.

[00:04:19] Janet Boynes: And they had her call me and hear. We didn't know about each other, and then they decided that they were gonna believe me, but all that pain in between that time was really rough for me. And so I got really close to my eighth grade English teacher who was amazing. She came to my basketball games, took me under her wing, the worst kid in the school.

[00:04:39] Janet Boynes: Think about that. You know, the one who got suspended almost every week. My eighth grade English teacher took me under her wing and started working with me on my English, and her husband was a social studies teacher, so I spent a lot of time with them. They took me bowling, picked me up, and I. Known to man.

[00:04:56] Janet Boynes: I never knew that, you know, the relationship between the two of us would grow with her husband. They moved to Minnesota in 1976. The year that I graduated from high school. I went off to college, play basketball and, and you know. 1979, I decided I couldn't live without them. So I moved to Minneapolis, Minnesota and I wind up going to a school.

[00:05:19] Janet Boynes: She got me into Concordia College, was like a, a Christian school. And as I'm walking through campus one day there was, this woman came from nowhere and I look around today and I tried to find her years ago and I can't find her. It could be, could have been an angel. And she invited me to church. Outta the blue, I said yes.

[00:05:39] Janet Boynes: And that night in the eighties or 19 80, 81, I decided to go to a church called Jesus People Church. And I gave my heart to the Lord and I wound up getting saved, went home, told my family about my newfound faith. And during that time that I was home, my brother, the next to the oldest one, he was already living a life of homosexuality.

[00:06:01] Janet Boynes: He was, you know, cross-dressing and that's what they called it back then. They didn't. Call it transgender. They just have a new name for it. They, he was cross-dressing. We never saw him dress like a woman, but he shared with me when I was home that he had the virus, which would, could lead eventually into aids, and so I didn't think anymore about it.

[00:06:21] Janet Boynes: He seemed like he was fine. He seemed like he was healthy. I went back to, you know, Minneapolis, Minnesota, and met this young man who courted me for a few years and wind up asking me to marry him. And in 1985, I'm telling my age I was supposed to get married and three months before the wedding I called it off because I wind up having a sexual relationship with this woman and the pastor that was supposed to, I.

[00:06:49] Janet Boynes: Through our ceremony. I went to him and told him what I did and he told me three things and he knows now that they were the most important three things he could have told me. Call off your wedding, get some help, and tell your fiance for me. I did two of the three. I told my fiance and I called off my wedding and I went into the world of homosexuality for 14 years.

[00:07:09] Mm-hmm.

[00:07:12] The Missional Life - Dan: What , a childhood, because there's so many people that go through so many things at such a young age, and it's like the Bible says when, things aren't exposed to the light, darkness can, just multiply. And so what a hard childhood that you walked through. We've seen that more and more in this generation of parents being absent from their children. And I think that's one of the key points that this is becoming such a major issue is the absence of family time, the absence of parents , speaking into their children and helping them along the way. And so what a, what a hard thing. And we also see this biblically too, that the sins can transfer from generation to generation and, and it's not necessarily the fault of the person, but , when somebody struggles it just gets passed on and passed on.

[00:07:59] The Missional Life - Dan: So how did this relationship begin to progress, and how did you begin to find yourself? In that, but then what was the light that came and began to bring you freedom from that relationship?

[00:08:11] Janet Boynes: Hey, that, that's a great question because I'm sure you know, your listeners are probably thinking, okay, keep going, keep going.

[00:08:18] Janet Boynes: How'd you get out of that life? 'cause so many people, you know, struggle with walking away from that life. As time went on, I was enjoying the life. My sin was fun for a season. And after five years. I really started losing interest in being in life of homosexuality. I wanted my relationship back that I had with God, his present.

[00:08:39] Janet Boynes: I could no longer feel in my life. I was empty. So I started doing drugs and started drinking and started going from relationship to relationship. Looking to feel that emptiness. And that's what a lot of people that. Have walked away from their faith. They start doing, they start getting high, and they start overeating, and they start doing all these things that they think can fill that emptiness and that void.

[00:09:02] Janet Boynes: And the only one who can fill that is Jesus. Because he said, if you drink from my cup, you'll never thirst. You know, and I'm always still trying to fill that cup with all the things of the world. And that wasn't working for me. And so as I lived, in this place called Maple Grove Assemblies of God, there was a church down the street from me and on the right hand side, I never saw it for the few years that I lived there.

[00:09:25] Janet Boynes: And one day I was driving and out the right side of my eye I could see this church and something in my spirit said, you're gonna go to that church one day. And I looked at my girlfriend at that time, I said, I'm gonna go to that church one day. And matter of fact. I'm gonna write a book. And she looked at me like, what are you talking about?

[00:09:44] Janet Boynes: And I said, I don't know. I don't know how to write books. And so we left it alone and during that time I had a cleaning business. And five years later I. Five years later to the Lord telling me I'm gonna go to this church, I had my own cleaning business and Lifetime Fitness at that time was one of my clients.

[00:10:02] Janet Boynes: And at three o'clock in the morning, I had about four or five people working for me and I said, I'm gonna go to the store. Well, once I put myself in treatment in 1989 because I was on drugs. I really never went out at night or even went to a store unless I was going to work because you know, I did residential homes during the day and did commercial at night.

[00:10:20] Janet Boynes: So I said, I'm gonna go to the store now. For what reason? I don't know. But I had this urge to, to the store. So as I am going into this grocery store called CV Foods, I parked my car and this woman was coming out. I was going in and we met. Face to face and I said to her, ma'am, it's three o'clock in the morning.

[00:10:42] Janet Boynes: You know you can be robbed. I'm real sensitive about just us women being out late at night and carrying our purses and being robbed or raped or stuff like that. You know, I'm real sensitive to that and 'cause she had this. This cart full of groceries. I mean, you know, you go put 'em in your car, your purse can be snatching.

[00:11:01] Janet Boynes: And I said, you know, you shouldn't be out here at three o'clock in the morning. She said, well, I just dropped my son off at school. She didn't run, she didn't, you know, she weren't, she wasn't scared. She just held a conversation with me and I said, ma'am, you don't need to be afraid. You know, there's no.

[00:11:15] Janet Boynes: Schools open at three o'clock in the morning and she chuckled and said, oh, my son, I took him to his dorm downtown Minneapolis because my husband and I are going on vacation and we have four boys and we need to get groceries. I said, but there's no school open at this time of morning. And she said, yeah, there was a school called North Central Bible College.

[00:11:38] Janet Boynes: He's on campus there. And I dropped him off and then the wheels started turning because before I walked away from my faith. I took Homiletics and Hermeneutics there, and so I was very familiar with the school, and so I knew in my heart this woman was a Christian. And that's when I said to her, I used to go to school there, but I walked away from my faith and I'm a lesbian now.

[00:11:57] Janet Boynes: And so we began to talk. She said, look. Why don't you come to church with me? You know, my husband and I will be back in a few weeks and I would love for you to go to church. And she pulled out a brochure, wrote her name down, which is Tammy Brown. And when I saw the brochure, it was the church that was down the street from my home, maple Grove Assemblies of God.

[00:12:17] Janet Boynes: Two weeks later I went to church and I rededicated my heart to the Lord in 1998. And during that time as I went to church, nobody looked at me because I wasn't very feminine at all. You know, I was very masculine. I had own boxers, you know, I strapped down my breasts. I was just like a man because I played the more dominant part in the relationship, and women just loved on me.

[00:12:41] Janet Boynes: They hugged me. There was no expectations. I went to church and one day Tammy calls me and said, Janet, there's a Bible study at the. In the pastor's office, and it's not that large or big, so it's only 10 women. There's one slot open, would you like to go? Well, me and my dumb self, I said, sure, I'll go not knowing what to expect.

[00:13:04] Janet Boynes: And when I got there, that Tuesday, right at the door, I saw all these women and Amanda, I tried to backpedal. I was like, I'm not going in there. They were dressed with their, you know, hair done and they had their nails done. They had these. Cute purses, some Louis Vuittons, which I didn't know what it was back then, but I know doubt.

[00:13:24] Janet Boynes: I mean, they were really dressed nice and here you had this woman back then that they called a dyke, you know, had this durag on her head, and I'm just gonna be transparent and real. Had this do rag on her head and. Looking like a man and knowing that when I left there I was going to go to work, so I didn't know what to expect.

[00:13:42] Janet Boynes: I didn't know what to wear. They said, come as you are. Come as I, as I was. But when I couldn't leave, my feet would not go backwards, but they would go forward. I'm not kidding. It felt like. Somebody put glue and I just stood at it and couldn't move. So I sat down and they noticed me and we did this AA meeting going around in circles.

[00:14:03] Janet Boynes: They all introduced themselves and I was last, and I said, my name is Janet and I'm living a homosexual life, but if you help me, I will serve the Lord the rest of my life. And during that time, mm-hmm. The women just gathered around me. They took me out on dates with them. It was like, I can't believe they even wanted me with them at that time, but they didn't care.

[00:14:23] Janet Boynes: They invited me over their house. When girls, the, you know, leaders did stuff, they took me with them. And then one of the leaders, about six months later, her and her husband came to me and said, Janet, you know, we've been praying for you. You've just been on our hearts and we would like you to come live with us.

[00:14:40] Janet Boynes: And so at the age of 40, I sold my home and I moved in with this Christian family, and that's where the real work. Began and that's where God started really showing me his love. And I had the family that I never had before because me and my siblings were never close. And you know, I didn't even know what it was like to really have a mother and father, even though I was older than them.

[00:15:02] Janet Boynes: They were just like a mother and father because that's something that I needed. And siblings, and having dinner together and hearing them at night, pray outside of my door. And I'll never forget the day that. I got a call from my parent, my mom, at three o'clock in the morning. Sadly, that my brother, who you know, was living a gay lifestyle died of AIDS in 1999.

[00:15:26] Janet Boynes: I lost my brother to aids, and what I like to tell people is that sin will take you further than you want to go, and it will keep you longer than you wanna stay. You see, I never planned on living a lesbian life for 14 years. I never planned to be on drugs as long as. As I was, but because of the pain and the trauma that I dealt with, I used those things to medicate my pain, which put me on a bad trajectory.

[00:15:50] Janet Boynes: But now by the grace of God, you know I'm serving him and now I get to tell people what I've been through, but also help them in a way that others have helped me.

[00:16:02] The Missional Life - Dan: Wow. I love how the church welcomed you. And it's just so amazing how God had been working in your life beforehand. You said you were walking through that campus and somebody invited you to.

[00:16:19] The Missional Life - Dan: that bible meeting. And it's amazing how even before all this, and this is the amazing thing about God, is that he, , at the cross, he took care of all of our sins, you know, past, present, and future. And so , he saw you and he loved you and he received you. And he knew you were gonna go through the 14 years, but he also knew what was gonna come after that and mm-hmm.

[00:16:37] The Missional Life - Dan: And during those 14 years, it's amazing to hear just how. You longed for that. And I think there's a lot of people like that. Mm-hmm. That have walked away from parents or lifestyles in the church where they've been involved and maybe they've been involved in ministry and they just go through something that's really challenging and they step away from the Lord.

[00:16:55] The Missional Life - Dan: But yet God's still working in their hearts and I think as Christians have. Kind of grown up in the church and remained in the church. Sometimes we have that older brother syndrome, like, ah, they walked away and, and we can kinda be judgmental, but mm-hmm. But how God works in people's lives and they know it.

[00:17:10] The Missional Life - Dan: You knew it. You knew the emptiness. And you felt the emptiness, but you continued in that. And yet when the chance to step out of that came you, you took it and God almost didn't allow you not to take it in, in a sense that he kind of glued your feet. Yeah. And the other key word that I, I heard was the word notice.

[00:17:29] The Missional Life - Dan: Notice so many people in the world just want to be noticed, don't they? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And there's such a value in being noticed . I think that's what drew people to Jesus, is that he walked through these crowds and he noticed things. He noticed people, and that draws people.

[00:17:44] The Missional Life - Dan: And I think it's amazing how they noticed you and they began to love on you, and they stood with you and they weren't afraid of you. , and they didn't, you know. Keep you apart, but they invited you in. And I think that's where a lot of that, that healing can begin is when we get invited in and we can be in community with other beliefs and we can , be real with people, as you were saying earlier, and allow them to meet us where we're at and minister to us and minister those things 'cause they can see it.

[00:18:10] The Missional Life - Dan: But when we don't allow them in, we miss that. Opportunity that they can share. You said a word that I don't

[00:18:15] Janet Boynes: want you to skip by you said community. Mm-hmm. And when you walk away from homosexuality or drugs or alcohol, you're stepping away from one community, but now you need to find another community.

[00:18:29] Janet Boynes: Could you imagine if they did not love on me the way I needed it to be loved and just spend time with me and I didn't build that new community? I don't know if my life would be the same right now. Mm-hmm. I believe I might have just walked back out into the world and say, I will never go back to church again.

[00:18:48] Janet Boynes: And that's what's happened. We say that those that are coming outta homosexuality need to be in church, but if they don't look like you, walk like you or talk like you, you push them away. As soon as they come into the church, you're like. I'm not going near them. You know, men don't wanna go near the ma.

[00:19:04] Janet Boynes: You know, another man that don't look like him, walk like him and talk like him. But all they're looking for is somebody to accept them, not their behavior, not the homosexuality, but to love them where they are. Because we don't come into the church cleaned. Jesus said, you catch 'em, I'll clean them. But most people want us to come into church, you know, like, you know, spotless.

[00:19:29] Janet Boynes: Well stop playing God Junior folks, you're not the one who changes lives. So if we come in as we are and you want people to be in church, just give God ample opportunity to change them. Not from the outside in, but the inside out. So if there's a man, I, I just listened to a pastor who I'm gonna reach out to.

[00:19:49] Janet Boynes: There's a video if I can tell this quick story. And only thing we heard was you don't come in my church dressed like a woman. I. You need to get outta my church. And when you can dress like a man, you can come back. That's all we heard. Well, somebody sent me the original video and so because he got so much backlash, the gentleman who was dressing like a woman has been in his church for a period of time and he was coming outta homosexuality.

[00:20:18] Janet Boynes: He was gay. He gave his heart to the Lord. So he's coming to church on a regular basis. Yes, you can go to church. But that's not gonna solve the problem because folks, homosexuality is the manifestation of what's really going on inside of you. Wow. Just because he came in looking like a man and all of a sudden for the third time, he dressed as a woman.

[00:20:40] Janet Boynes: Nobody said, what are you dealing with today that caused you to want to come to church looking like a woman? What? Where's the pain from? The pastor never said, can we get you some counseling? Nobody invested. In his life as far as getting to the root cause of why he decided to live a homosexual life. Only thing he know is he need to come to church, but you better not come as a woman.

[00:21:05] Janet Boynes: What a missed opportunity for the pastor to take him in the back and say, look, you've come in three times. Just like a woman. Do you need some counseling? Can we pay for you to go to counseling? There's something that you are putting on. Like these women clothing that you're covering up something that is impacting you to do what you're doing.

[00:21:28] Janet Boynes: And that's what people don't know. So when you know better, you do better. That's why we created a curriculum, a psychotherapist, myself and Jonathan Alexander, who's an attorney for Liberty Council here, it just came out less than a month ago, where people can go on and purchase it. The reason why we created this, and I raised all the money to do this video of six and a half hours, is so we can help the church do better on working with those that are struggling with homosexuality because we are not educated on how to work with the homosexual, the transgender, or whatever they choose to be when they walk into the church.

[00:22:10] The Missional Life - Amanda: That's so interesting because you know, on one side you have. What was probably the horrible approach for a long time of the judgmentalism, the rejection, you know, you have to come to church, clean approach for decades. Mm-hmm. Right?

[00:22:28] Mm-hmm.

[00:22:28] The Missional Life - Amanda: But then now there's a swinging towards some churches that have become, they call themselves inclusive and you know, giving up doctrine.

[00:22:37] The Missional Life - Amanda: But, . It would seem as if the desire started out to be loving, but then maybe, you know, morphed into not holding onto the truth. And your personal story is absolutely beautiful.

[00:22:51] The Missional Life - Amanda: it took such courage to go into the, the women's group. , as a believer my whole life. There have been times where I have been nervous to go into women's groups at church because we are wonderful. But there are times where there can be the cattiness and things that happened, and so the love that they showed you is such a beautiful picture.

[00:23:13] The Missional Life - Amanda: So what would you say to that, with your curriculum, how is it taking the truth in love and applying that to individuals as they come into churches? How do you hold onto that truth and show compassion in a practical way?

[00:23:30] Janet Boynes: Yeah. You know, a lot of the gay community feel as though us loving them means that we are supposed to compromise our morals and our values.

[00:23:41] Janet Boynes: That's the last thing you should do is compromise your morals and your values. The Bible talks about if you, you know, they love you, the Lord your God, with all your heart strength and might, and that's our first love. And if you're going against the Word of God, you're not only not loving God, but you're not loving that person.

[00:23:59] Janet Boynes: And I think our delivery to people that are living a homosexual life plays a big part on the possibility of them having a walk with God. But we have to understand that they do have a spirit, soul, and body. And if God wanted us to be robots, he would've made us that way. I had a choice to either extend that hand to that family that asked me to come live with them.

[00:24:24] Janet Boynes: That was my choice. And when you come into the church, they have a choice. To either abide by the rules of the church or not. Let me give you an example. Just say, I have my own church. I'm a credential pastor. I don't have a church. I have a ministry, but I went back to school and got my credentials, and there's a couple that is coming to church.

[00:24:46] Janet Boynes: They're gay or lesbian. We're very much aware that they're there, they're coming to church, nobody's bothering them, everybody's kind to them, et cetera. And just one day they decide to kiss. You know, or, you know, put their arms around each other and everybody is seeing this. 'cause you know, they're always gonna be the focus, you know, and then somebody goes up and say.

[00:25:10] Janet Boynes: You can't do that. That's not the way to handle that. You wait till after church and you ask if you can meet with them, and you take somebody with you and you sit them down and let them

[00:25:38] Janet Boynes: know how much you appreciate them coming to church and you want them to come. But in this church, we believe that marriage and relationships are between a man and a woman.

[00:25:49] Janet Boynes: And while you're here and we want you here, we ask that you're not affectionate. They're either gonna receive that, respect, the boundaries that they have at the church or they're gonna leave. Sometimes they respect those boundaries and sometime they leave. It all depends on how you handle the situation that comes up.

[00:26:11] Janet Boynes: A lot of times the gay community feel like, and parents feel like going to a gay wedding is loving them. That's not loving them. You have now stepped into. Compromising your morals and your values. Now you're saying, because I, you guys been married. What do they say? You know, if there's anybody who don't support this marriage, they've never been married, I don't know the right words.

[00:26:33] Janet Boynes: You know, speak now forever. Hold your peace. Well, when they go to the gay wedding, when that comes up, nobody speaks now forever hold your peace. So that means you support their ideology, you support their, their. Marriage, and that's where Christians I think are being thrown for a loop is that when you start spending a lot of times with people that don't, they're not like-minded, then we start getting ourself into trouble and we start believing the lie.

[00:27:04] Janet Boynes: Because now you're spending all this time with the gay community. 'cause people ask me, well, do I hang out with the gay community? A lot of 'em are my friends. Well, if you're spending more time with the gay community than you are with Christians, there's a problem because it's only gonna pull your thinking in yourself into more sin of being more like them.

[00:27:24] Janet Boynes: I, I hope I answered your question, but Loving people is being honest. There's a way of delivering things to people without being nasty. To them and rude to them and demeaning them. Speaking to truth is, like the Bible said, we wanna speak to truth and love because the love of God will draw one to repentance.

[00:27:45] The Missional Life - Amanda: Mm-hmm. That's so good. Yeah, I think that was, , I. Just a great summary. Like the key to that is the delivery. Mm-hmm. How it's delivered, how is the truth delivered? It has to be out of love and not condemnation, not judgementalism. That's just so important for us to, , just stay close to the Lord.

[00:28:07] The Missional Life - Amanda: Mm-hmm. So his compassion can flow through us and mm-hmm. You know, as people are led to him,

[00:28:13] Janet Boynes: yeah, we have a choice to do a lot of things. I mean, think about, I came out at life in 1998, I'm still single. Right Before I went to Europe, I got really frustrated with God here. All my friends are married, that I hang out with most of my friends, all of my friends are married.

[00:28:29] Janet Boynes: I hang out with married people 'cause I wanna be like that, you know? Mm-hmm. And I was sick. I have a temperature of 101 and I drove myself to the emergency room. I was frustrated 'cause I was so sick at that time. I wish I had somebody with me, you know, my husband to be able to take me. Imagine being alone for over 20 years, waking up in the morning alone.

[00:28:54] Janet Boynes: Going to bed alone, doing things alone. Your, some of your friends that are married have grandkids and you know, mother's Day, father's Day and Valentine's Day, which is coming up, you feel alone, and that drives one back into that lifestyle. But for me. People are like, how do you do it? You know, you haven't slept with anybody, you haven't went outside of God.

[00:29:17] Janet Boynes: How did you do it all those years? Because I wanted God more than I wanted that sin, because I knew if I step into that sin just one time. Just once. It wasn't going to fill that emptiness in that void. I remember that emptiness in that void that I had years ago. I will never forget it, and I don't wanna lose what I lost 20 some years ago.

[00:29:41] Janet Boynes: My walk with Jesus, or not even feeling his presence. I don't want that again. So my choice is always to serve him. And to resist the devil. And that's not a even a thing that I want to go back to that lifestyle. My desire is to get married and I've come to a place even now, that this is the way my life is gonna be.

[00:30:04] Janet Boynes: I'm not going on any more dating sites 'cause everybody wants to have sex outside of marriage. Most men is that we're finding, I mean, these Christian men. But I'm staying close to God. I play a lot of pickleball. I find things to do outside the house so I'm not in the house and you hear all my friends go, you're always playing pickleball.

[00:30:24] Janet Boynes: You have something else for me to do. You know, I'm not just gonna sit home. So we have to find things that we enjoy doing outside of the house, because if you stay in the house, you get involved in pornography, you start drinking, you start doing drugs. You start going back into that old lifestyle, you start doing things that are not cool in the eyes of God.

[00:30:46] The Missional Life - Dan: Like a holy distraction. Right. A holy distraction. I like that. I'm gonna steal that from you, but, but let me say this, and I know you probably have tons of questions. I want you to think about this, and I know you guys are not here in the United States. Yeah. President Trump had to sign an executive order.

[00:31:06] Janet Boynes: To let people know or recognize two sexes. If you Google gender, you'll find about 80 genders. God didn't come up with it. I don't even want people to call it gender anymore. There's two sexes, not two genders, God said is male and female. We had to have an executive order for men to no longer go in women's bathroom for men to no longer play in women's sports.

[00:31:34] Janet Boynes: For men to no longer can go into women's prisons. They all have to be sent back for transgenders to no longer be in the military. If you're gonna be dressed like a man, I mean, really this is where we are folks here in the United States. And here in the United States, we have 26. States who can no longer give counsel to those that are struggling with homosexuality because they are saying that, that they are abusive in their practices, which is a lie, and they use that to try to get rid of our ministries and then think about this.

[00:32:18] Janet Boynes: I praise God for what Donald Trump did. We shouldn't never had to, to to have that executive order to just recognize two saying, thank God for the victories, but there's so much work to do out there. I want you to think about the one I just mentioned is about the 26 states, but think about this. We also need to address the growing practices of doctors profiting from transitioning our children.

[00:32:43] Janet Boynes: Absolutely. Do you know they're getting hundreds of thousands of dollars to transition, but they're not telling them what's going to happen if things fail. Yeah. Do you know they take a chunk out of their leg or their arm to, to transition them to have gender reassignment surgery, and a lot of them are det transitioning.

[00:33:09] Janet Boynes: And the other thing that I think is important for your listeners to know. Is that God's not finished because we need to restore biblical marriage. Marriage is between a man and a woman, and I can't imagine what's going through God's mind that we have taken his word and turned it upside down and not believing what he designed, like I like to say his design is under attack.

[00:33:40] Janet Boynes: If you hurt one of these little ones, it's better that you have a millstone hung around your neck and thrown into the depth of the sea. That millstone is so big, it will take you to the depths of the sea, so you might as well just go on and kill yourself. I don't care if you're a parent. I don't care if you're a pastor molesting kids.

[00:33:59] Janet Boynes: I sex trafficking, you destroy. We are God's children even at our age. That goes for anybody who hurts us as well. I. We are losing so many of our millennials and Gen Zs to the life of homosexuality. You have to ask yourself why. It's because everybody's silent. We are so far behind. Not that God can't redeem the time because he can, but I can't do any more than what people allow me to do.

[00:34:33] Janet Boynes: What the church allows me to do, come and speak. At their church and share our stories. Why do you think the gay community is doing so well? They have millionaires supporting them, and so they have all this money where they can just take us to court and try to take away our ministries. Sooner than later, we will be thrown in jail for our faith.

[00:34:54] Janet Boynes: We have not been tested folks, but we will be, and so the time is now to get out there and try to help. Our families who don't have an understanding of why their child is walking away from their faith and going into the life of homosexuality. I get so many emails from parents that are listening out there, your child is living a homosexual life and and you want help.

[00:35:19] Janet Boynes: And I hear parents say, Janet, my children went to church every Sunday, Wednesday, whenever the doors are open. But you know what? I don't hear parents say, Dan and Amanda, I watch my kids pray. I watched them read their Bible. Going into a building is not gonna save your children. Mm-hmm. Do they have a personal relationship with Jesus?

[00:35:38] Janet Boynes: Are they doing the things that they need to do to hold onto their faith and their walk with God, like reading their Bible, praying fellowshipping with the saints and parents today are afraid of their children, and I think that's why we're having some of the problems that we're having today.

[00:35:56] The Missional Life - Amanda: You know, it's interesting you bring that up.

[00:35:58] The Missional Life - Amanda: 'cause as you were sharing your story, I was thinking about the timeline of when you experienced it was the late eighties into the 1990s and how much our society has changed from then. Mm-hmm. You know, and like you said, there's so many kids now that you know, young adults that are going down that trajectory and we've seen social media.

[00:36:20] The Missional Life - Amanda: Also contributing to this, whether it's TikTok videos or Instagram. And so how is your ministry approaching social media reach for the next generation?

[00:36:32] Janet Boynes: You know, I'm on TikTok. I don't have as many followers as others, and for whatever reason, I don't know why. Maybe the Lord is showing me you don't need followers for me to get your message out because the Lord told me.

[00:36:44] Janet Boynes: Mm-hmm. Many years ago that my story will be told all over the world and I say, God, I am not going all over the world. What is wrong with you? He said, I told you your story's gonna go all over the world. Mm-hmm. And regardless if people like my stuff or I have, you know, a hundred thousand followers. It doesn't matter.

[00:37:03] Janet Boynes: God can get my message out there to men and women. So I'm on TikTok, I'm on Instagram, I'm on, you know, Facebook, I'm on YouTube. All my podcasts go to YouTube. People go to my ministry. There's more people know me than I could imagine. I'll go speak somewhere and they'll say, Hey, I know who you are. I've seen you on this.

[00:37:22] Janet Boynes: I've seen you on that. Or it was like, are you kidding me? There's a lot of people who know who I am. I don't need to buy a hundred thousand. Likes. 'cause you know what? People have come to me and said, why don't I just, why don't you just buy all these likes? I'm not gonna do that. Nope. If people don't like me.

[00:37:42] Janet Boynes: Organically, then forget about it. But that's how a lot of people reach me, and I'm not afraid to talk about homosexuality. I'm not attacked as much as I probably should be, but for some reason, God has let me fly under the radar. You know, I still put out information on homosexuality. I am not ashamed of the gospel.

[00:38:03] Janet Boynes: It is the power of salvation to all those who believe my heart and my boldness is to serve God. And I pray that when that day comes, when somebody threatens my life, I stand up for him. 'cause he stood up for me. I am where I'm at today because God gave me a second chance. And so I'm gonna continue to spread the gospel, spread the news so we can get back our children.

[00:38:31] Janet Boynes: Our parents that have walked away from their faith to go into the life of homosexuality. We see more people leaving the faith going into that life than they are coming out, and that's a shame.

[00:38:44] The Missional Life - Amanda: Yeah, and it's so true. What you shared a bit ago about, are they just going into the church building? Or are the kids also praying at home?

[00:38:54] The Missional Life - Amanda: Are they reading their word? Are they digging into scripture? Is it being discussed at home? Are they in Bible studies? It's such a difference living a Christian life versus just entering a church building and leaving a church building, and I think that's so important to remember that we. Us believers make up the church body and we gather at different church buildings, but it's really who we are in Christ.

[00:39:19] The Missional Life - Amanda: And knowing him and spending that time in word and prayer that is so important. I also wanted to address what you brought up earlier about , the finances with all the surgeries and such. , I know of someone who. Called out Planned Parenthood on social media and said, , hey, you're, you're promoting this, you know, there must be so much money in it.

[00:39:43] The Missional Life - Amanda: And within, in less than 20, 30 minutes, they were completely blocked from their page. So it must have triggered something at that point. Mm-hmm. You know, but there's just so much prayer needed in that area as well that whatever spiritual battle is happening. That those resources either get taken away, that the blindness, the deception is broken.

[00:40:08] The Missional Life - Amanda: And as believers, we truly need to remember, it's a spiritual battle. It's not just a physical battle. It's not about the money. Ultimately, it's the enemy behind it that is wanting to deceive people and say, Hey, this is where you can make so much money, you can have power. All these things that they're trying to fill themselves with.

[00:40:28] The Missional Life - Amanda: That ultimately are completely empty. And so just praying that, , the Holy Spirit moves in these people.

[00:40:37] Janet Boynes: I'm glad you said it's a spiritual battle because it is, and we need to supernatural, give birth to the natural. You talked about Christianity and you know, Amanda, I don't even. Say I'm a Christian anymore because everybody's a Christian.

[00:40:52] Janet Boynes: I don't even like saying it. I always say, I'm a follower of Christ. You are either a follower of Christ or you're not. You know? But, you know, pretty soon people are gonna be like, yeah, I'm a follower of Christ, you know, living a homosexual life or having sex outside of marriage. I mean, Christianity to me, just that word just went down the tube.

[00:41:08] Janet Boynes: Mm-hmm. You know, you got, you gotta be a follower of Christ. But go ahead, Dan.

[00:41:14] The Missional Life - Dan: You said something very, very important and I wanna make sure that we center on this. You brought up how President Trump changed some things, right? He made some executive orders and changed, he cleared the space.

[00:41:26] The Missional Life - Dan: So I'd like us to imagine the space is cleared. Now there's followers of Christ. We'll define them that way, that want to help, that wanna step in thousands of them that want to come and serve and be effective in reaching these, these people that are, are in this scenario with Jesus, you are now. Commander in chief, you have thousands of followers of Christ who are looking to do something to be effective.

[00:42:01] The Missional Life - Dan: Speak to the follower of Christ, speak to the church, and speak to maybe the business or the NGO that also want to have an impact as well. Can you, can you share with our listeners what would be your marching orders to those groups of individuals?

[00:42:20] Janet Boynes: That, that, that is so important. You know, I'm not the one to play God Jr.

[00:42:26] Janet Boynes: But I think people first and foremost need to know Jesus as their Lord, God savior, you know, because the Bible talks about thy word as a lamp into my feet and the light into my path. And when you know him, he'll speak to you a lot of times through your word. Through his word, and a rainbow word will pop.

[00:42:44] Janet Boynes: You know, come out. And most importantly, all of us need to be evangelists. Mm-hmm. We all need to share the gospel. And do you know, a lot of people don't even share the gospel anymore. They don't go in stores and and see somebody that might not know Jesus and ask the question, do you know Jesus? Back in the day, man, we were so fi on fire for the God.

[00:43:04] Janet Boynes: We'd be asking everybody, are you saved? Are you going to hell? We tell 'em they're going to hell. You know, not knowing, you know, but I think that's important. And we gotta love people where they are. I'm not saying compromise your morals and your values, but we have to do better to meet the need of the people.

[00:43:21] Janet Boynes: Stop looking at the outer appearance. If there's somebody in my church that needs somewhere to sleep. I'm just not gonna give 'em food. Or if there's somebody that needs food, I'm, I'm not just gonna give 'em a coat or some shoes to put on. You meet the need of the people that's showing love and when you love them in that way, you're serving God because we are all God's people.

[00:43:46] Janet Boynes: God never responded like that towards people. He met the needs of the people if they needed food, he gave him food is they needed clothes, he gave them clothes. And so I think that's, that's first and foremost is knowing Jesus. I believe he'll guide each and every one of us. I can't speak to the people out that out there who, how God is going to guide them.

[00:44:07] Janet Boynes: I know how he guides me and how he speaks to me. But at this day, in this time, the most important thing is for parents. If you're a mom and you're a dad, love your child.

[00:44:20] Mm-hmm.

[00:44:21] Janet Boynes: Look in their phones, look behind the apps and, and see what's behind some of those phony apps that they have, where they're able to do things and see things that you're not aware of.

[00:44:31] Janet Boynes: Don't be afraid to go through their drawer. You are their parent and you're gonna be held responsible for them when they start, you know, paying for their cell phone and, and giving you money for rent. You know, that's a whole different ball game, but you're supplying all their needs that, that they need met.

[00:44:50] Janet Boynes: So you be the parent and not their best friend. Just be their parent and love on them and spend time with them. You know, when I'm traveling, Dan, I, I always talk to the dads and I say, look, we need you to be the leaders that God called you to be. We need you to be the fathers, the spouse. You know that God has called you to be.

[00:45:09] Janet Boynes: Because if you're not, then you're pushing us to step up to do your job. To be the head of the home. And then we wonder why women are so more outgoing or doing the things that their husbands aren't doing. That's why we're doing it because we're trying to be mom and dad and trying, but we can't. We can only be the people that God has called us to be.

[00:45:33] Janet Boynes: So I'm believing God, and I'm praying that the men will be the head of the home. They'll be the leaders and we can follow behind them.

[00:45:41] The Missional Life - Dan: Wow. Amazing. So we wanna be honoring of your time. Where is God leading you in your ministry? Now? What's, what is God speaking to you and what are you, what's the territory he's calling you into now?

[00:45:54] Janet Boynes: Yeah, I, you know, I've been asking that in my heart for the last few months. God, where are you leading me? What? What are you doing? I decided not to do a conference this year. I normally do a conference every year, but right now we are working on. Talking about my new curriculum, get 'em into schools and Christian colleges and have parents maybe put their money together and purchase it so they can have a better understanding on how to work with those that are struggling with homosexuality.

[00:46:25] Janet Boynes: It's on our televisions in our schools. It's all over the world. It's not going anywhere. I mean, they kiss right in front of us and we need to have an understanding on how to handle it. If one of our kids have a gay friend, or should we be. Bringing them to the home. Do we go to the marriage? Their marriage is, I mean, there's so much to talk about because when you know better, you do better.

[00:46:46] Janet Boynes: And so that's my focus right now is to get the curriculum out there and, and hopefully churches will purchase it. Of course, I'm still doing my podcast. I'm working on a new book and I said to somebody, I'm done with writing books. You know, I have a few books got in the LGBT community. Was my last book, which is really good book.

[00:47:06] Janet Boynes: We wrote this book for pastors and ministry leaders to have a better understanding on how do we work with those that are struggling. What if they want. Us to come to their wedding. How do we deal with that? All this is in that, that book and then called out was my very first book Who? Which is going in Dutch.

[00:47:25] Janet Boynes: That's why I was in the Netherlands. Wow. It will be out in Dutch really soon. So I'm excited about that. We're gonna be doing a conference and amsterdam. I'm excited about that. Wow. So the Lord is in large of my territory. I'm not getting any younger, but I tell you what, he's really expediting the time that I have here on Earth and really moving me around right now.

[00:47:45] Janet Boynes: So I'm excited about that.

[00:47:47] The Missional Life - Amanda: I know for listeners who aren't as aware, and you can speak to this, Janet Amsterdam has historically, for a while writing been a hotspot for , homosexuality. So the fact that you are able to go there, that is a huge blessing from God. So we just speak favor all over that in name.

[00:48:06] The Missional Life - Amanda: Thank you.

[00:48:07] Janet Boynes: Thank you. I think they are the, the first country to do a gay wedding. And they're a very liberal country, very, so we look to get some pushback, but if God calls you, he equips you, he'll open the doors and he'll cover us. So I'm ready. Let's go.

[00:48:23] The Missional Life - Dan: Yeah. Amen. Where can our listeners purchase your books and where can they get ahold of the new curriculum that you've been writing?

[00:48:30] Janet Boynes: If they can go on my website and look up curriculum, I'm right there on the front and they can click on that or go to one of the dropdown boxes and you can get my books on Amazon or on the website. I tell people, you know, if you don't wanna buy 'em from my website, go to Amazon. They're always a lot cheaper, so, and if they need help or assistant reach out, we always respond within 24 hours.

[00:48:52] Janet Boynes: My ministry is not a ministry where we won't respond. So if you email us, you'll hear back from us. So we wanna do what we can to help.

[00:49:00] The Missional Life - Dan: Listeners, we'll have those in the show notes. Janet, what an honor and a blessing, thank you and encouragement to have you on the show today. And we are so encouraged by how God is opening doors for you in dark places, and we're so excited to see the light shining forth, and so we just speak blessing over you and your ministry and excited to see how God continues to use you,

[00:49:19] Janet Boynes: Dan and Amanda, thank you for having me.

[00:49:21] Janet Boynes: What a blessing. Amen. Thank you.