I think just starting by naming some of the

patterns that come along with good girl conditioning, so that

women can really see if they are currently playing that role in

their life, either to a large degree or to a smaller degree.

And what I'll share is that we are all exposed to the same

conditioning from media, from our culture, from our society,

and we internalize that conditioning in our current

modern day. I mean, I even see this for like my maternal

lineage, like this is how women have been programmed up until

now. And I see us right here, right now, as change makers, as

women who are breaking the chains of our maternal lineage

to come back into our power. And it's really beautiful that we're

in a time that we're able to do that

I love. I am so excited for you to hear this

episode with a very special person in my life, Amy Natalie,

who is a dear friend, soul sister, who I actually met right

before we launched the new truth in January 2020, and she was

about to launch her podcast, feminine frequency podcast,

which you might already listen to if you don't go check it out.

But Amy and I connected at this business event, and we just like

instantly connected. And it's been so beautiful because I have

had her on the new truth. We have had her on the new truth

several times over the years, and she's had me on her podcast,

the feminine frequency, several times over the years. She just

had me on on Valentine's Day. And it's so beautiful because

both of us have evolved and grown so much through our work

and as we're both really just walking the talk, walking the

embodiment of what we teach. So she is a magical soul. She's an

author, a podcast host, a feminine leadership coach with

over a decade of coaching experience. She specializes in

helping women emerge as their most authentic, confident, fully

expressed selves. Her mission is to ignite women into their

feminine power so they can live a life of freedom, pleasure and

fulfillment. And she is the author of the feminine way, a

book that I think she wrote last year, and is the host of the

feminine frequency podcast, which has over 400 episodes. So

she, at one point, was doing two episodes a week. So she has more

episodes than the new truth. She is amazing, such a magical soul.

And there's just so many nuggets of gold in this episode of

learning how to break free from being a good girl and how to

really liberate yourself to live from the essence of your soul.

And Amy is really the embodiment of that. So enjoy her magic and

her medicine. And as always, spread the spread the episode to

all the women you know who need to hear this message? Lots of

love.

Hello, my loves. I am so excited for this conversation. Welcome

back. Amy Natalie,

thank you. I'm excited to be here with you as

this version of myself in this

timeline, yeah, and in the the solo or the new truth

would just being mine. This is actually the one year

anniversary yesterday of the new truth just being mine. So you've

never been on this version of the new truth, but I think this

is your third or fourth time. Do you know how many times you've

been on

I don't but I love the new truth. I love it as a

guest and as a teacher, and I also love it as a listener. So

I'm really excited about what's unfolding for you, and also for

all of these incredible women to get to receive your wisdom and

your magic and your love. And, yeah, to get to be a part of

this incredible community

and your wisdom and your magic and your love. Yeah,

it's, it's kind of cool that you've I think I feel like this

is at least the third time, but maybe the fourth. And I know

I've been on feminine frequency, if you don't know the feminine

frequency podcast, go follow it now. But I've been on that

several times, once with Catherine, but many times on my

own. And I think it's so cool because you and I met. The

divine timing of our meeting was literally the month that, or

like, I think days before both of us were launching our

podcasts in January 2020,

yeah, I feel like we've had such parallel

timelines in so many different facets of our lives. And I just

love that our souls get to keep weaving. And I feel like you and

I have such similar missions with just different flavors and

different teachings that really support women to ultimately live

in their power, in love, in purpose, in friendship, in their

life choices, and yeah, I'm just such a fan of your work and our

shared mission in

the world. Okay, I just got goosebumps because I

was just thinking how this is the new paradigm of female

relationships. There's no shortage of. Women on planet

earth who need help. And, you know, some women will be

actually, I've had clients who've worked with you and me,

and I've worked ahead clients. I worked with Catherine and me,

and you know, it and or, you know, just benefit from both

podcasts. And it's so beautiful that there is no shortage, you

know, we've been trained in, especially as women to compete,

to be separate, to be comparing and jealous and threatened, and

yet it's so beautiful how our work is so similar and how we

deliver it, and like our magic and medicine, is different. So

even one woman can work with both of us and get so much value

and from both perspectives and and both practices and both, you

know, experiences, even though, yeah, like similarities, but

different, because we're all unique, and when we're living

from our souls, there's no competition. Like we all have a

different magic that we bring, even if it's almost the same

thing.

Yeah, I feel like this is the new paradigm, which

is really about collaboration over competition and celebration

of other women, because in our culture, women are actually

taught how to connect over gossip, over judgment and about

other women. And the new paradigm is, how big can I

actually celebrate another woman's light? How big can I

support her and celebrate like her fullness? And I think that

we each individually, benefit so much from that and are able to

rise and shine brighter together. And I write about this

in my book, The feminine way, because sisterhood has been such

a mirror for me of my own growth and evolution, because

sisterhood was not something that came easily to me when I

was younger. I had a lot of insecurities. I had a lot of

self judgment around my body, around being too much, too

sensitive, all these things, and it was reflected in my

friendships. I would get triggered very easily. I would

shut down. I would create distance. I would want more from

friends that they couldn't give to me. And I often felt left

out, like very left out. And I didn't have that experience of

being part of like a group or part of a sorority, and I just

didn't feel like I belonged with a lot of women. And once I went

through my own the initial spiritual awakening that I went

through in my late 20s and started on my personal

development path, and really started to do this work around

self love and self worth and authenticity and not having to

be someone in order to fit in. That's when I got to experience

the magic of sisterhood and of women who really see me, who I

feel like I have genuine connections with, who I'm not

afraid are going to like, go talk behind my back or think I'm

too much, but really, those that can actually hold all of me,

right? And I'm, I'm a Scorpio. I go really deep. I love the deep

stuff, and I also have a lot of joy and play and sensuality and

pleasure inside of me, and that can be intimidating for women

too. And yeah, I'll just share one, one example from recently,

like, last week, one of my girlfriends, she was in late

luteal, and she was having, like, a really hard day, and she

was asking me about my life, and I was sharing about some new

experiences that I'm having and love that I'm experiencing. And

she was able to, even in, like, the challenging place that she's

in like, be really celebratory of me, and be like, Wow. Like,

thanks for sharing this energy with me. Thanks for for bringing

this yummy energy to my life right now, because I'm having a

little bit of a hard time, you know,

takes her out, instead of it being this thing

that makes her feel bad about herself. Because it's just like

relating from our patterns, and building relationship from our

patterns, where you're the perfect little match to whatever

their patterns are. And then it's always a painful,

unsupportive relationship, even if it might look supportive on

the surface, versus the like you have transformed your

relationship with yourself, right, and celebrating yourself,

loving yourself, honoring yourself. And so then you become

a magnet to that like that is exactly. It's just a mirror of

where you're at, what you said at the beginning, where you're

at in yourself, how fucking beautiful. And I imagine so many

women listening are in the other type of relationships, still and

longing for a deep, meaningful sisterhood. And I just think,

like, I mean, even in Africa, it's like everything is

community oriented here. Every my friend said the other day,

it's like everyone parents, everyone's kids. It's not like

my kid and your kid and your daughter did something my

daughter. It's not this separation consciousness. It's

like everyone's doing it together. All the kids are in

like everyone's in community together. And how, you know,

going back ancestrally women, we. We were only in community.

You know, men weren't even there. Like we've made men the

center of our worlds now. And yet, it used to be women with

women and men off on their individual hunting, you know,

journeys.

Yeah, last night, I got together with what I call

my soul family here in Asheville. And most of my

friends are, you know, have kids that are under one years old or

between one and two years old, and I created this monthly

gathering called the soul fam supper club to get everyone

together at least once a month. We see each other more often

than that, but to have this regular touch point where we get

to watch these kids grow and we get to celebrate our expansion

together and be there for each other. And yeah, just being

there last night, it felt like that. You know, people were

holding each other's kids, and the kids were playing together,

and we all got to connect in different ways. And yeah, I

definitely feel like that community element is something

that is missing and that is possible for for everyone when

you're on this path of soul evolution and surrounding

yourself with people who who really get it.

Yes, I love it. So beautiful. What a great place to

start. Because when we're trapped in the good girl

program, we that was me, like the goody goody best friend to

everyone, like, big because I'm a people person. So when I was

little, I was, like, literally best friends with fucking

everyone. But like, it felt horrible to be in most of those

relationships, because it was at the expense of everything that

everything that I was feeling. It was just like I would contort

myself in every possible way to belong in any group, but that I

never belonged to myself, and I never felt good inside. And I

remember even like after I would leave gatherings with even my

very best friends, I would my saboteur mind would be like, you

did something wrong. They're judging you. They probably hate

you. They'll never gonna call you again like I was tortured in

my friendships, even though I was friends with everyone so and

I was definitely the good girl to the nth degree. So I'm really

excited to have this conversation with you and unpack

breaking free from good girl programming and everything that

comes with that. So where do you want to start?

Yeah, I think just starting by naming some of the

patterns that come along with with good girl conditioning, so

that women can really see if they are currently playing that

role in their life, either to a large degree or to a smaller

degree. And what I'll share is that we are all exposed to the

same conditioning from media, from our culture, from our

society, and we internalize that conditioning and in in our

current, modern day. I mean, I even see this for like my

maternal lineage, like this is how women have been programmed

up until now, and I see us right here, right now, as change

makers, as women who are breaking the chains of our

maternal lineage to come back into our power. And it's really

beautiful that we're in a time that we're able to do that so

similar to you, I was very much in what you would call good girl

conditioning. And good girl conditioning is a a way of

being. It's a conditioning that is rooted in wanting to be liked

and wanting to be accepted. So I think it's important for us to

recognize where it comes from. It's from our attachment system

of I want people to like me and love me so that I feel like I

belong and I feel like I'm safe, right?

Where do you think we learned it like, where do you

think it comes from?

Oh, we watch. We watch our mothers do this. We

watch men and like society place us in these gender roles of how

women should behave and how men should behave, and so I think

it's deeply ingrained, even in movies. I think it's ingrained

in how we see our mothers and grandmothers performing or

behaving, right? I see it coming from religion, from patriarchal

conditioning. It's everywhere. That's just how we've been

molded. Of means, this is what it means to be good, and if I'm

good, then I'm liked and I'm accepted. If I'm quote, unquote

bad, because I'm not following the rules and I'm not playing

small or demure or polite or kind all the time, or if I'm not

saying yes to everything and everyone, then I am good. And if

I'm saying doing the opposite of that, I'm being myself, I'm

using my voice, I'm being true and honest, and I'm being

expressed then I'm quote, unquote bad, or in a.

Appropriate, right? So which, of course, we all were

those things when we were little, and then we got put in

the go sit in the corner. You're grounded, go to your room at

school, shamed for it publicly, like the having a voice gets

shut down so early for girls. And then, of course, like as

adults in the corporate world, and it's still, it's so isn't it

crazy to think it still happens? How much women, Yeah, shut down

for using, oh, you're emotional. Oh, you're that. And like a man

can say the exact same thing and gets a completely different

response.

Yeah, it's wild. I mean, some of my clients have

shared with me, when we start to unpack some of the deeper layers

of this conditioning, is they will share things that they

heard when they're younger, that women are meant to be seen, not

heard. Don't be so dramatic. You're being too much. You know,

you go to your bedroom until you can can pull it together, right?

These are things that were taught directly and indirectly.

So this leads to some of the patterns, primarily like people

pleasing, which is something that I used to do all the time,

and was a huge, huge reason why I ended up being depressed, why

I ended up having being feeling disconnected for myself and

where I was like performing but I didn't feel like the real me.

Another pattern that we see is conflict avoidance, where we

don't want to ruffle any feathers. We don't want other

people to be upset with us, so we just swallow what's bothering

us, or we swallow when something doesn't feel right. Another part

of good girl conditioning is deriving your worth, like

feeling like you need to prove yourself in order to receive

love and acceptance and emotional suppression, which is

something that we just talked about, is like, oh, I need to be

put together perfect, like, have this fake smile on my face and

pretend everything's fine and Everything's good, and then

behind the scenes, you feel like the people that you're

surrounding yourself by don't value you, or you feel upset

about something, and you never say something, and it just

creates a lot of in inauthenticity in your

relationships. And shape shifting is another one. Is like

being who other people, who you think you need to be in

different situations, like adapting to the world around

you. So those are just a few of them. There's a lot of different

components to good girl conditioning, but essentially, I

really love this, this philosophy that Dr Gabor Mate

teaches, which is about the difference between authenticity

and attachment, and essentially, what he says is that we all have

both of those needs. We have the need for attachment when we're

younger. We need our parents in order to survive, so we're going

to modify and do whatever we can in order to receive that love,

nourishment and safety. We also have a need for authenticity, of

expressing who we really are in the world, of following our own

path, of being who we came here to be. And oftentimes there's an

inner conflict of those two pieces. If I am who I really am

meant to be, if I follow my soul, if I listen to my heart,

then am I going to be rejected? Am I going to be cast out from

the tribe? Are other people going to be upset with me? Am I

going to disappoint people and everyone who's on a path of

growth and evolution at some point is going to experience

this, this inner war, this inner battle between these two needs,

and ultimately, a lot of people will choose attachment, which is

why they will stay in relationships that aren't

working. They will stay in jobs that are sucking their soul dry.

They will not wear the clothes that they want to wear, because

they're afraid of what other people will think. And so they

end up living this life that is very vanilla, that is very

small, that is not fulfilling or enlivening. And it is those who

have the courage to live from authenticity and be true to

themselves that end up experiencing that radiance, that

aliveness, the deep connection, the deep intimacy, the deep love

and the freedom to be themselves. And that's I think

what you and I teach very much for women, is to operate from

that place of of truth, which doesn't mean that you need to be

a bitch or you need to be like, never like. It doesn't mean that

you can't be in loving connection with your family or

the people in your life. It's just that some people are not

going to be able to handle that, and so there will be some people

who fall away, but the people who really love you and care

about you are going to actually feel inspired by you, living in

your light, and you living on your own path.

Yes, totally, yeah. I mean, look at my parents. They

just came to Africa. They never were going to come to Africa. It

was like, not on their list. They were not planning on it. My

dad just turned 79k he looks like he's like, 30, he acts like

he's 30, but he crazily, just turned 79 and like, they travel

to Greece every year because they lived in Greece. You know,

do these have this like crazy relationship with Greeks and

Greece and the culture and the people, because of all the four

years that they've come to visit me, and now they came to Kenya,

and they fell in love with Kenyan people, and they're

probably coming back next year, like It's so wild to think how

much their world has opened up because I followed my truth.

Yeah, I've loved watching you follow your truth

and inspire other people to do that. And so beautiful to hear

how your parents have opened up and expanded because of your

path. And I feel very similarly, you know, I grew up in a pretty

traditional religious upbringing and very conservative. And what

was your religion?

I didn't know that. What was your religion? Yeah,

so my family's Jewish, and I went to a private

Jewish school from kindergarten to 12th grade. There were 45

people in my graduating class, and that is a very, very core

value of my family, and that's ultimately what led me to

marrying the man that I did in my early 20s, because it was

very, very, very important for my family for me to date and

marry someone Jewish, and that's ultimately how I felt like I

would be fully accepted by my family. Because when I did date

non Jewish men, that was a huge point of conflict in my

relationship with my parents, and then when I did marry

someone that fit the mold of who they wanted me to marry, who, by

the way, was a really nice person. Was a lovely man. He

treated me well, like there wasn't anything blatantly,

quote, unquote wrong, but internally, it didn't feel true

for me, and because it was the

script, it was like, who you were. Like, here

we've handed you, we've decided what your religion is, we've

decided what your path is. We've decided who you're meant to be

with. Of course, that's going to be conflicting, yeah.

And ultimately that led to chronic depression,

a lot of anxiety, constantly questioning myself, getting my

experience and for I was in that relationship for five years, and

three out of those five years, even before I got married, I was

questioning if this was the right path for me, and I kept

like at that point, I didn't know how to trust my intuition.

I didn't know how to listen to my inner voice. I just knew that

something felt really off, and I thought there was something

wrong with me. Like, why can't I just be happy with this? I have

everything that I should have, like, I've checked all the

boxes. Like, why am I so unhappy? What's wrong

with me? Oh, my God, can we pause here? Because

I feel like so many women are gonna relate, like, chronic

depression, chronic anxiety. I think you had like, autoimmune

diseases

on autoimmune diseases. I had digestive

issues. I had eczema and skin issues.

Yes, our body is my

body was holding on. No way. My body couldn't

lose weight, even though I was eating really healthy and

working out.

Yeah, this is so important, because I know that

so many women listening struggle with all of these things and

like, you go to the doctor and they're like, here's some

medication just numb your pain and your pleasure, rather than

like, Wait, what are you doing? What are you saying? Yes to

that's actually so out of alignment. We're not taught.

We're just taught to suck it up, push it down and and move

forward anyways. And all of these symptoms were a result of

you going against your own truth without knowing it.

That's so important. And I didn't have

language for it. I didn't have words for it. And ultimately,

the only places that I was really telling the truth was in

my therapy sessions and in my journal and whenever I would go

on a yoga retreat, I got certified as a yoga instructor

back in 2014 which was around the time that I was in this

inner turmoil. And anytime that I would get on my mat or get

away from like my day to day life, I would just cry and I

would just feel all the pain that I was feeling inside,

because I didn't feel like I could be honest. Being honest

meant I would be hurting the people that I loved and that I

cared about, and that was my biggest fear, and that was my

priority at the time, was making sure that I didn't hurt or

disappoint the people that I cared about, and that was a

higher priority for me, until the pain became so loud and my

body and my soul were speaking to me and screaming at me to the

point where I was like, I cannot keep going this direction. If I

keep going this direction, I'm not going to be happy, and it's

going to keep getting worse, and I'm going to end up being

married with kids and feel trapped in this life. That's not

true for me, and eventually I. To get to that point, and this

was through a lot of introspection, a lot of

meditation, journaling, therapy, coaching, doing all the things

where eventually I sat with myself and was like, okay, am I

willing to choose myself? Am I willing to listen to the part of

me that's trying to get my attention, that knows that this

isn't right for me, and am I willing to do that at any cost,

like, even if it feels like I'm dying because I'm afraid that

I'm going to be cast out from the tribe, like, can I be okay

with that? And it took me building a lot of resilience, a

lot of sovereignty, a lot of self trust, a lot of self love,

to be like no matter what, I'm going to be okay and I'm going

to be better off. My life is going to be more magical. My

life is going to be more expansive. I'm going to get to

receive the type of love and connection that my soul is

craving. And the only way to do that is by listening to this

inner voice.

Yeah, that's so true. And as you're sharing your

story and talking, I'm just seeing like the good girl's

entire existence is for everybody else and not so she's

living everyone else's life, meanwhile they got their own

life. Like, isn't it crazy how deep that programming runs, and

how many women make massive life choices to not let down other

people. Meanwhile, other people do not care like they care for a

minute. They care for a day, a week, a month, your family, I'm

sure, and I'd love to hear more about their their journey of

shifting as you shifted. But it's like other people are.

They're slaying their own dragons and dealing with their

own sacrificing in their own projections and their own pain.

They got their own life, like, if we each get one, and it's so

wild that, you know, we're so deeply programmed to to put

everyone else first, and to make our choices based on not wanting

to let anyone else down, which is impossible anyways.

And a conclusion that I got to was like, even if

I try and make everyone else happy like I can't, and it's

actually not my responsibility to hold that for everyone else.

No, because then who's living your life like it's

just like abandoned ship. We just abandon our own ship to

not, like, have anyone else be sail it alone. Meanwhile, our

ship is just like floating out in the sea by itself.

Like, yeah, yeah. And another thing that was

really potent at that time that I remember, like talking to my

therapist about, was this, this truth that me not being honest

is actually harming people more than it's helping them. And me

being in a marriage where I was halfway out the door and not

fully able to show up and adore this person and love this person

in the way that he deserved to be loved, like that was actually

more hurtful, like it was selfish, like I'm gonna abandon

myself and I'm going to pretend that I'm this person, because I

want to receive your love. I don't want upset with me. I

don't want you to be mad at me. I don't want to lose you, so I'm

gonna do this. But that's not that's not love, that's not

true.

Meanwhile, the guy gets the woman who doesn't want

to have sex with him, or isn't attracted or isn't, you know,

like it when he could actually be with someone who's aligned

and, oh, my God, it's it's so crazy to think one of my

favorite memes I've ever seen was people pleasers are the

biggest liars of all. Like, yeah, we straight up lie

constantly. Lie.

We withhold our truth, we pretend everything's

fine, and it's like people can actually feel that that's not

the case. Yeah, you don't even have to say it, like people can

feel it totally Yeah. And so yeah, to come back to, like, my

how my parents responded to it. I mean, ultimately, they went

through their own grieving process. And, like, it was

really hard for them. They were really good friends with my ex

husband's parents. They would go to movies together without us.

We would all have dinner together, almost, you know,

definitely on the holidays, but sometimes, more often than not,

and they were very invested in this picture perfect marriage

that their daughter had created. And it meant something to them,

in society, in their community, to be proud of their daughter in

this way. And so it was definitely a really challenging

process, but I will give so much credit to my parents that no

matter how hard it was, like they really did show up for me

with unconditional support, and they loved me through that

process, and ultimately, like they don't want me to be in

pain, and they want me to be happy. And so that, to me, was

like the deeper underlying truth that it came out of. It was

like, yeah, they could have disowned me, and they could have

been so embarrassed that they didn't want to, like be

associated with me, but they're my parents, and they love me,

and I think the maybe even the next challenging conversation

that I had to have with them, and this is like a framework

that I teach is for. First, it's about like being honest with

self and revealing your own truth, and actually have like, a

free ritual that I can share with your your listeners on

like, how do you actually excavate and connect with your

own inner truth? And then the next thing is speaking your

truth and sharing your truth with others, which means that

you have to have courageous conversations. And then the

third is expressing your truth in the world. And so the story

that I'm going to tell you is about speaking your truth. And

so it was about a year after I got divorced, and I had kind of

started dating again, and it was actually my 30th birthday, and I

went out to dinner with my parents, and I knew I wanted to

have this conversation with them that was probably going to be

the hardest conversation that I would ever have with them. And

the conversation was and I literally waited the entire

evening. I felt super nervous. I waited until the server brought

the check to the table to be able to say, hey, there's

something I want to talk to you about. And I sat across from my

parents, these people who have supported me my entire life, who

have dedicated their lives to like me, living on the path that

they thought was best for me. And I sat across from them and I

said, you know, I'm going to start dating again. And the

truth is that I don't know if I'm going to marry someone who's

Jewish, and my values are around personal growth. My values are

around spirituality, my values are around kindness, around

health and wellness, like these are things that are deeply

important to me that I've discovered. And you know, it's

likely, or it's possible, that I won't marry or date someone

Jewish, and I know that this feels really hard for you to

hear, because that's really important to you, but I'm asking

for your support like I get that this is not what you want for

me, and I'm asking for your support because I don't want

this to stand in the way of our family, and I don't want this

stand in the way of me having a relationship with you, and it

was really hard. I mean, my dad was pretty much like, silent for

the rest of the time, and I could see he was, like, in pain

and processing. And my mom was like, Well, can you Why can't

you be with someone who's Jewish and also values those things and

like, why don't you want to be with someone who's Jewish? And,

you know, just asking questions out of maybe some anxiety or

curiosity, and yeah, eventually I was just like, yeah, it's

possible that I could date someone Jewish that also is into

personal growth, and I can't guarantee that beautiful. And my

relationship with my parents is has been, yeah, so much deeper

and and so much more connected because it's real on my own

path, yeah,

because mostly it's okay. I'll just be the little

puppet you want me to be like, of course, on a that's their

conditioned self that you're bumping up against in that

conversation. And of course, on a soul level, what resonates is,

is realness, like, even if it's confronting to a part of them,

they're gonna, they're gonna feel closer to you and more

intimacy when you're bringing who you really are forward. And

I love how you articulated it in such an eloquent way of

acknowledging their experience and also and how important the

relationship is and what you desire moving forward, but also

like this is who I am standing with and for yourself.

Yeah, my dad's actually, like, they're proud of

me, like they my dad has even said, like, every time you

follow your intuition and like you've taken these leaps, like

you always end up stronger and like better on the other side,

like he sees, he really sees me and trusts me.

Yeah, that's incredible. Oh my gosh, wow. How

special. So it's possible to break free from the good girl,

and I just think of all the women that are inspired and

maybe short circuiting from that story of how, I mean, I've

worked with so many women over the years where their families

don't even know them because they they they're so afraid to

be abandoned and cast aside. But I think that, of course, there's

the odd, especially, like really crazy religions that are like,

so like Jehovah's Witness. That's an example of one where

we're actually like, you're cast out of the community yourself if

your kids leave or set like so like, there's ones that are so

deep that, you know, some people actually do lose their families.

But of course, we can also build new families and create like

Soul families. And, you know, family is such a it's such a big

word, and I think it expands way beyond because I believe, on a

soul level, we the our soul family, are our family. It's

just like those family that resonates with the soul. But you

know, I've worked with so many women over the years who are so

afraid to even share their working with me, I think of one

client who was afraid. This is years ago. She was afraid that

her parents would not accept it, not be okay with it, and I ended

up one day going to her like family thanksgiving, I happened

to be in the same city in the States, and like her parents

cried when they met me, and they were like, You changed your

whole family. Like, so grateful. And it's it like when we stand

with and for ourselves. In my experience is shocking. How many

people in our lives that we wouldn't imagine would change

with us do?

Yeah, and I want to, I want to name the reality

that it's not always the case and and the analogy that I want

to share is this analogy of a magnet. So when you are being

your authentic self. There's going to be polarity. It's going

to be polarizing. Some people are going to be that negative

charge where they're like, I can't handle this. This makes me

uncomfortable. This doesn't work for me. And they are going to

walk away. I had many people from my life when I was married

who don't talk to me anymore and who have judgment around me

getting divorced. And then there's going to be a even

larger pull to the positive side, to the plus side, where

you are attracting and drawing in and magnetizing the people

who actually see you and genuinely support you, not

because it's conditional with you behaving the way that they

want you to behave, but actually people who lift you up, who

support you, who expand you, who believe in you. And there is

sometimes is a little bit of a lag, like, I've had some clients

who have experienced this, where they are letting go of old

habits, habits and old parts of their identity. Even sometimes

it's like, I don't want to drink anymore, because that doesn't

work for me. Or I don't want to talk about these surface level

conversations, and I don't want to just be complaining all the

time with my friends, so I don't want to just answer the call and

be on the phone and feel this like person's draining my

energy, right? So they'll start to make these shifts, and what

it will do is there it creates a gap in their old identity and

who they're becoming. And so there is sometimes what I like

to call like the cocoon phase, where you are going really

inwards, where sometimes it can feel lonely, which is why I

create, you know, this mentorship, both you know the

group mentorships and communities for women who are on

a similar path, who they're shaping and shifting who they

are, and it is like a grieving of the old identity and grieving

of these relationships that you thought you might be friends

with for the rest of time, and grieving these things that you

used to do, but in that cocoon, you're really in this deeper

discovery of who am I Really and who do I want to be moving

forward, and what is the real me that wants to emerge? And as you

start doing things that align with that, maybe you start going

to yoga classes, or you join a group program, or you go to

personal development seminars, or you go on a retreat, or you,

you know, start taking you start following your hobbies and your

passions. You do pottery or singing or acting, and you

actually start listening to that. You start to meet more

like minded people, and just start expressing yourself in the

world as this new version of yourself and some of the people

in your life from before are going to be really inspired by

that and be like, Whoa, I didn't even know that was inside of

you, which is what some of my clients have said, like, whoa. I

didn't even they didn't know that you were an amazing writer,

or that you were, you know, into certain things, and they feel

drawn to that. And other people are be like, yeah, that's not my

cup of tea. I'm not interested in it. And you have to be so

willing to not be liked. You have to be so willing to be okay

with disappointing people, and that's the hardest thing for

people pleasers to do, and when you are willing to do that, you

will actually receive the true love and acceptance and

connection and belonging that you've been craving.

And you can never get it from the part of you

that's playing the good girl, and that's in the pattern. So

like, you'll always try and get it, but that it's insatiable and

the quest is never ending. Versus, like when you're willing

to go through that perturbation, that discomfort, that

uncomfortable place in the middle it. I mean, the good news

is, too you start to feel way better, like when you just start

making decisions that are for you, that feel aligned with your

soul, even if everyone else is like you're crazy. This makes no

sense. You're a weirdo. We can't be friends with you anymore, and

everyone falls away, and it feels like kind of lonely for a

minute. It's like in that place. What happens is your inner world

feels so good because you're doing things that feel good for

you. So eventually your focus is it just feeling good internally

with, you know, of course, the grief of the change and all of

that too, and then exactly that you become a magnet. I'm curious

in your journey, did you have anyone who was like, Oh, can't

believe you left. Who. Who canceled you like you were

talking about the all the people that canceled you or that you

ended relationships with. Did any of them come back later and

like, get sparked by you, or go on their own journey and then

become aligned later? Yeah. I mean,

let's even talk about my ex husband like we

didn't talk for four years, and he had this perception and

projection of me being the villain and being like this

horrible person, and like, you know, he went through his own

journey and experience, and five years later, we reconnected. It

was a time where my grandfather had actually passed, and my ex

husband reached out and was like, Hey, I heard your

grandfather passed, like, he was an incredible man, and I just

wanted to, like, send my condolences. And I was like,

wow. Like, that's so amazing. And he was like, you know, I was

like, how are you? And he's like, that's a big question to

answer via text. Like, you know, maybe sometime we can connect so

we end up talking. And on the call, he literally was asking

for relationship advice in the in the relationship that he was

in, because he was actually in the shoes that I was in, which

was like, I'm going along for the ride. But this actually

doesn't feel true for me. And he was like, how do you actually

end something like that? And then he, you know, he thanked

me. He was like, this was one of the most painful things that's

ever happened in my life, but because of our divorce, it sent

me in the direction of doing personal development work. Now,

when my friends are going through a hard time, they come

to me for support. I have way deeper connections with my

friends. And he was like, thank you. Like, thank you. And at the

end of the conversation, it was crazy. It was like an hour long.

And caught up, and then he was like, Do you ever coach men? I

was like, no, why do you ask? And he was like, you'd be really

good at it. And even just as I'm saying, it like I have tears in

my eyes, like I had held the vision that one day we would be

able to sit across from each other and have a conversation.

And we actually ended up meeting up for coffee after when I was

in San Diego again, like, we met up for coffee, and I got to sit

across from him and, like, see this man that I care deeply

about. And like, you know, that's, that's one big example,

and a smaller example is some of my mother in law's friends who

are women in their they were in their 50s, and they literally

wouldn't make eye contact with me. They would ignore me when

they would see me, and it was like the most childish, like it

was wild. And yeah, I wasn't able to see my nieces. I wasn't

able to see there was a lot that happened after I got divorced,

that I had to process and grieve, but yeah, there were

people who literally Outcast me, pretended I didn't exist.

Wow, isn't that wild and that like, we have to

be willing, at all cost, to not abandon ourselves for somebody

else's saboteur. It's not even who they really are, like, it's

their conditioned self, it's their trauma, and it's like

we're abandoning ourselves for that, versus actually the

willingness to to walk through the fire and let people, even if

they can't see it at the time, like we are planting seeds

subconsciously for people that might come to bloom one day.

That is the coolest story though, about your ex husband

and and how much impact like that just goes to show you, like

we think we I just think when we're people pleasing and being

the good girl, we really hold people to their small self and

hold them incapable versus like because you had the courage to

walk through the fire, follow your truth and let him have that

rupture. That rupture led to his awakening, which is so often the

case.

It's almost all too often. I've been seeing this

time and time again with, yeah, and I won't say it's for all

men, and it's not only men, because I think women go through

this too. But you know, sometimes we don't make changes

until it gets painful enough, and the pain becomes the

motivator to be like, I have to do something about this. A lot

of people are not heavily vision or desire, like motivated. Some

people are, but it often is a, oh, my God, this big thing

happened in my life, and I can't not look at this anymore. It

like is like this, this awakening that happens, and it

does happen for for a lot of men after they get broken up with is

they start to see the things that they couldn't see in the

relationship. And, you know, I think it's part of human nature,

and I know there's a lot of amazing men who are doing good

work, and even the men who do get broken up with that doesn't

mean they're not good men, and maybe they needed that in order

to become an even better partner to their next in their next

relationship. And I've heard some of my clients being

frustrated about this and being like, Oh, I. Want to just be

this teacher for all these men, and I don't want to be like the,

you know, the catalyst for their growth, and then I just feel

like there's no one who can really meet me. And I was like,

Well, if you see it that way, then that's what's going to keep

happening. But what if you got exactly what you needed from

that connection, and you learned about yourself, what you like,

what you don't like, what you need, what you don't need. You

practice speaking your truth. You practiced, you know, being

honest with yourself and with others. You opened your heart to

someone and got to receive some things you wouldn't have been in

that relationship if you weren't receiving something from it. And

what if that is the exact puzzle piece that you needed in order

to refine your your desires, and to call in the the aligned match

that you're meant to be with next. And like, I think it's a

little bit victimy to say, like, Oh well, I you know other

people, men, just like, I just catalyze their growth. And

there's nothing in it for story that's

just like the man that says, like, every woman

gets married after she after she ends a relationship with me, or

women say that too. It's like, it's just a story, and like, our

sabotory ego minds always looking for stories to latch on

to that limit us. And I was just thinking as you're sharing that

version, it's like, how many women are being the catalyst for

you to tee up with that, like, because this woman had an affair

even with that man, and then left her husband, and then her

husband has his catalyst and grows, and whatever, and then he

becomes aligned. For you, like, it's always happening for all of

us all the time. And you know, every relationship serves a

purpose for every person, and so we're all doing that all the

time. So somebody, if you're teeing men up for for other

women, also, other women are taking men up for you.

Yes, I love that perspective. Yes, yes, yeah,

we're all rising together. Yeah, exactly, yeah. So, so I think if

you're cool with it, I'd love to kind of move in the direction

of, like, some of the parts that women like that come online for

women, when they stop playing the good girl, does that feel

good as a

place to go? Yes? Amazing.

Yeah. Okay, yeah, yeah. So I think ultimately, the

shift we are going from is going from living in our patterns like

you're talking about, which is ultimately our ego, which has

done a great job at trying to keep us safe, to living in our

true soul essence. And each and every one of us has our own

unique soul essence of how it wants to be expressed in the

world. So my soul essence is different to Kate's soul

essence, right? But there still is a resonance of truth that

people feel when they're in our presence, that we are living

authentically in alignment with ourselves. There's a resonance

with that people feel that, right? So for me, some of the

things that I used to feel like I had to hide with when I was

living in good girl programming are, where's my sensitivity, my

emotions? I have very big emotions, and

me too. Girl,

yeah, and my sensuality, and the sensuality

piece really was rooted in religion of that it was

inappropriate to be sensually expressed in any way, right,

like what you wear, how you act, all the things, how you dance,

how you move. So once I started to deepen into honoring who I

really am, I started to really take up space and be honest with

my emotions. I started to let myself actually feel my

feelings, and I remember for the first time crying without

judging myself, and being like, Oh, this actually feels really

good to let myself cry, or being on the dance floor and dancing

freely and feeling so alive, and being like, Oh, I have

permission to to do this. I can, I can be my fullest self. And

for other women, it might be around their creative expression

where it's like, oh, I have like, I sing by myself in the

shower, but I never sing out loud in front of other people,

or I write in my journal. And I've always been a writer, and

I've always wanted to write a book, but now I'm starting to,

you know, actually share my writing and share online or

share with people that I love or for. In my case, it was using my

voice and sharing my beliefs and not hiding them because they

were different from other people, which meant getting in

front of the microphone and speaking on stages and, you

know, hosting my own workshops and teaching women. So it's like

whatever your soul has been suppressing, whatever you have

been suppressing, like this journey of of moving into your

authentic self, which, in my language and my world, is called

Becoming a multi dimensional woman. It's becoming the full

range. A full expression of who you are and being connected not

just to your 3d self in the 3d reality, but your 5d self, of

being connected to your higher self and allowing that to be

what guides you in the world. And another piece of the multi

dimensionality is around like really embracing both your

masculine and feminine energy, and being able to have both of

those in alignment and in harmony with each other. So,

yeah, this, this multi dimensional woman process, is

really an excavation of letting go of the programming and

conditioning and through the body, really getting to feel and

sense, what is a yes? What is a no? Right through the body being

like, Oh, this feels really good when I do it. Or this doesn't

feel really good. Or I get contracted when I'm around some

people, and then I feel expanded when I'm around other people.

And like, really letting the body guide you, which I know is

something that you talk about a lot, too.

Yeah, beautiful. I love the word multi dimensional.

I can just like I feel like I can feel it just, it's almost

like the infinite nature to our essence, and the more like,

because, in my experience, it's like a treasure hunt. It's never

ending discovering more facets of ourselves.

Yeah, yeah. And my belief is that life just keeps

getting better and better, like, as we get older and as we be

more fully expressed in our lives, that life actually

continues to improve and expand. And it's not the opposite way,

where women are like, Oh, I'm aging and everything you know is

harder and all like the decline. I'm like, no, like, I feel way

more radiant and alive and turned on by life. And also, I'm

able to navigate these big, like, waves of grief and

challenges, and I'm able to move through those with so much more

grace and ease than I ever was before, yeah? And, like, my

capacity continues to grow.

I was just thinking that word, that was the word.

It's like, we expand our capacity. The container

internally expands. Okay. Yeah, beautiful, amazing. And so how,

how does one unlock her multi dimensional woman?

Yeah, I think that where a lot of women are who are

probably listening to this podcast right now is that you

have some awareness of your patterns. So if you're listening

to this podcast, you're probably into personal growth. You've

either gone to therapy or you've done yoga or journaling, or, you

know, all the things and you have awareness around your

patterns. Maybe you know that you're people pleasing, maybe

you know that you're self sabotaging, maybe you know that

you are feeling imposter syndrome, or whatever your

patterns and the stories are right. But even though you have

awareness around it, you still find yourself repeating the same

patterns, or you're not actually living as the version of you

that you know you could be. And I remember that phase of my

growth being so fucking painful, to be honest, where it was like

I my inner world didn't match my outer world. I knew I had so

much more potential. I knew I was playing small, and I wasn't

blind to it anymore. I had started to see it, but I was

still not making the decisions, having the hard conversations,

following what lit me up, like it was just this, like beginning

stage where it was like, Oh, damn. Now I'm watching myself do

these things. I'm frustrated with myself, right? And so we

need to go through that phase. That awareness phase is crucial

for our growth, and we will go through many other phases in our

life where things are uncovered, blind spots, things that we

didn't see, that are uncovered for us to to be able to be more

free, essentially, is what that's for. So we go through the

stage of awareness, then the next stage is acceptance, and

this is the hardest part for a lot of people. Is like, can I

actually love these parts of myself? Can I can I accept these

parts of myself, the parts that feel like I'm too much, the

parts that feel needy, the parts that want to hide right? Really

going into this deep acceptance of self, and through that love

and acceptance like that is the alchemizer. It's like, can you

be in the depths of your grief or sadness or anxiety and

actually be kind to that part of yourself? And when we do that,

that creates a lot of healing, and we dissolve the shame, and

when you dissolve the shame that unlocks the key to

transformation and change. So the acceptance piece is the next

part, and then the third part is aligned action. It's now, can I

start taking actions that feel aligned with my more true, my

truest self, so that that's kind of the journey, but underneath

that, there's also what I like to call the embodiment journey.

And this is what lights me up the most in my work. And I would

say that's quite different to other coaches and mentors that

my clients have worked with, is I work with movement and dance

and. Somatics to help women to break free from the shame and

the conditioning through movement. So a lot of women do

this through heady processing, analyzing, overthinking, like

breaking down all these reasons why they are the way that they

are. But then they're like, why is nothing, no change happening?

Or they see these positive affirmations in the mirror, and

they're like, why isn't anything changing? And it's because the

programming actually lives in your body. It lives in your

nervous system. It lives in the soma, in the body, in the

tissues. So when we start to do these practices that help women

to start to connect with their sensual nature. Start to connect

with their emotions. More start to connect with that more like

fierce energy that allows them to set boundaries and to stand

in their truth. We do this through music, through dance,

through an excavation of peeling off the layers that are not

serving them. And every time at the end of these practices, my

clients will say, Ah, I feel like I just like came home to

myself, like the noise in their mind is not there. It's like,

oh, I can feel the confident version of myself. I can feel

the creative version of myself. I can feel the turned on version

of myself in my body. And we start to create those new

imprints in the body of like, oh, what does it feel like to

show up as my higher self, as a woman who's empowered, as a

woman who speaks her truth, as a woman who is not afraid to

express herself? And we create that imprint in the body of the

version of yourself that that you've been all along, but now

you get to, like, live as that version of yourself. So

embodiment, to me, is living as your authentic self. It's like

walking in the talk, taking the actions, being that version of

yourself.

Yeah, it's I just think of how many women are not

even connected to their bodies at all, and their bodies are

just numb or anxious or depressed or, you know,

disconnected, disassociated, because they're all up here and

and, yeah, it's, it's, it's, it allows us to unlock all the

grief and all the pain that needs to be felt and welcomed

and moved and merged with, and then also, it allows us to

alchemize it and then to start feeling like you said you you

your sensuality came back online, your ability to express

yourself, to speak your truth, the pleasure, the power, the you

know, all these different facets that have just been locked away

because we're not moving the body, and we're not In the body,

connecting with the body,

yeah, yeah. And it's incredible to see just like

how much more present women are able to feel in their lives, and

how much more connected to themselves and to others when

they're not operating from the stories and the conditioning,

yeah, and how much more free they're able to feel in their

expression and honestly, the the piece that lights me up, I don't

know if it's at the most but, but it really is. What happens

with so many of my clients is that once they're living in this

multi dimensional identity that you know is their fullness, then

they have the energy and the capacity to show up for others,

then they can share their guests, then they can step into

their purpose. Because when you have all of this like

conditioning, so much energy goes towards managing yourself,

so much energy goes towards managing your emotions and your

appearance and what are other people going to think and when

we release that, there's so much more life force energy, and

there's so much more confidence and courage to go after your

dreams, to share your gifts, to to Follow your purpose, whatever

that is for you, and that is how I believe that we're going to

change the world as women. Is that the more that full, full

fully we live in our own joy and our own pleasure and our own

aliveness, then we have more to offer and more to give to the

world.

Rather than doing what everyone does on Facebook

and talking about all the problems of the world, and just

like, look over there, look over there, look over there. It's non

stop. The distraction also

not actually making a difference.

No, exactly. It's non stop. And it's like feeding

the fear based story only makes the fear based story bigger.

It's not to negate what's happening, but fucked up shit

has been happening on this planet with human beings for a

very long time and and that is so true, the more we deepen into

our own experience and expand into all of who we are, like it

is women that are going to change the world. Men will heal

through women operating from a different aspect of ourselves,

and that will heal. The whole world. So how does one learn

these practices? And, you know, go deeper with you and expand

into their multi dimensional,

multi dimensionality. That word always

gets me try and spell it too, or like, you know, I love the word,

and it's not the easiest to say. Yeah, so I have a few different

tracks and ways that women can work with me. One is my

signature group coaching program, which is a six month

embodiment journey that really allows us to peel back those

layers, allows us to go deep into connecting with your

authentic self, having those courageous conversations,

showing up in the world as you know, in your full expression.

And I guide you through that, the exact formula, the exact

process that I went to to liberate myself from good girl

conditioning. So that's one path, the six month mentorship,

and I have a mentorship starting on March 12. So if you're

listening to this before then and you're curious about it, you

can come on over to Instagram and find me at Amy Natalie CO or

you can check out my website. I'm sure we'll put that in the

show notes for today. And then another way that I work with

women is in person retreats. And I have one retreat in Costa Rica

each year, and one retreat in Asheville, North Carolina, which

is where I live. And we get to do in person environment work

together. And the third track is through one on one mentorship.

So if you're like, I just want to do one on one. I want to go

deep with you. And like, I want to go on a yeah, just more of a

somatic path, that coaching path, going deeper into the

body. Then that's also an option too. That's mostly for leaders

and executives and women who are holding a lot for other people

and visionaries and really helping them to show up as

embodied leaders in the world.

Beautiful. That's so amazing. Do you have, like,

what if a woman wants either all three, I mean, they all serve

such a deep purpose. Do you have? Do you do packages? Or is

it like, yeah, I have some.

I usually what I do is I have an initial

conversation. So someone will fill out an application. We'll

talk about their goals, and then I'll, you know, guide them to

which path might be the best place to start for them, because

it is different. And then sometimes my clients will do the

group, and then they'll work with me one on one, or do the

group and then go on retreat, or vice versa. So yeah, they're all

just different layers of the work, and it's possible to to

move through them. Yeah, I would say within a year you could do

all three. Yeah, yes.

You just like, start with the thing that you

need the most, and you help them identify that. And then that

opens them to going deeper in whatever way is deeper for them,

amazing. So March 12 is the kickoff date, and they have to

book a call with you before then, obviously, if someone's

listening to this after March 12, can they still reach out?

Yeah, they can reach out. I usually will open

up a wait list for the next round. I'm actually not sure

when I'll be running the next round, so just reach out to me

and I can share what's what's available and see if it's a good

fit for us to hop on a call. Amazing.

So any final word words for the good girls out

there who are ready to unlock their multi dimensional woman,

ready to reclaim their own life? What? What are your What are

your final words for them?

Yeah, I just want to breathe life into the belief

that there is so much magic waiting on the other side, no

matter how scared you are, that what actually is going to happen

on the other side is like way beyond your wildest dreams, like

you couldn't even imagine what your life's going to look like.

And if you can keep anchoring into the vision and the dream of

what you want your life to feel like, what you want your life to

look like, and then also to look for expanders of women who have

taken the leap and who are doing what you want to do and being in

their frequency. And I really do believe that it does take

community. I believe that it does take mentorship, like you

got to do it with, other people. It's not a lot of blind spots.

Yes, many mirrors around you, yeah, and you'll, you'll get

there way faster when you do it with other people, when you have

mentorship. And I 100% believe full, with full confidence, with

every cell in my body, that there is incredible magic for

you on the other side of this transformation?

Yeah, ditto. I so believe that, and I know that

your work is an absolute, beautiful, magical journey where

women, you know, I think of all the women who are starving for

deeper connection and more intimacy in their lives, even if

you're starving for it in a romantic way. It's like you.

Will satiate that part of you through the sisterhood, through

learning how to have deep, meaningful, healthy

relationships. And I know that your community offers that

because it's all women who are devoted to themselves and to

living life in a much more empowered, expanded way. So I

think of my own journey, and the sisters Who've you know,

supported me on my journey. It's like there is no way in hell I

would be doing what I'm doing, living where I'm living, like

experiencing the the intimacy and love and joy and magic in my

life, if it weren't for the sisterhood and, of course, all

the mentors along the way that guided me so absolutely. But at

least book a call with Amy so you can feel and experience a

little bit of her magic and see what is the path for you,

because we are so multi dimensional and we have so much

magic inside. And yeah, I mean, it would be a fucking honor for

any woman to work with you. So thank you for sharing your magic

and your heart and your medicine with us today, my love.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for having

me.

Love you so much. Love you until next week. Share

this episode with every woman who every good girl you know who

needs to hear this message, even your grandma and as always, we

will we'll see you next week. Love You. You.