Gift biz on wrapped episode 330.
It Has been proven time and time again,
to be one of the most effective ways to get sales
Attention. Gifters bakers,
crafters, and makers pursuing your dream can be fun.
Whether you have an established business or looking to start one.
Now you are in the right place.
This is gift to biz unwrapped,
helping you turn your skill into a flourishing business.
Join us for an episode packed full of invaluable guidance,
resources, and the support you need to grow.
Your gift biz.
Here is your host gift biz gal Sue moon Heights.
Hi. Hi,
It's always so great to have you here.
And if you're new welcome today,
marks the end of my first face-to-face trade show of the
year, or should I say of the last year and a
half? I guess it was amazing to be out seeing customers
and friends and making new ones.
There really is nothing like being in person.
I want to remind you that doing events like craft shows
and farmer's markets offers great photo and posting opportunities for social
media. We talked about this in one of our tips and
talk episodes in the podcast just a couple of weeks ago.
And I bring this up because you've told me you're discouraged.
When you don't see any of the time and effort you
put into social media,
moving the needle on your sales.
So given the time we're in right now,
take this as a changing point to do something different,
putting in more time posting in the same way isn't going
to magically bring you results.
You need to change the way you're posting and what you're
posting. You don't need to put in more work.
You need to put in the right work.
That's when things will change.
If you need some help with this,
I've got you covered with the content for maker's program content
for makers.
We'll enlighten you as to why your social media activities aren't
converting into sales.
It will also show you how to put less time in
and start seeing activity that will increase your sales.
Just imagine a day where you know exactly what to post
and to get it done in five minutes or less,
then you can spend your time interacting with potential customers,
deepening relationships with those you already know too.
And it builds upon itself naturally.
Yes, this is possible.
Content for makers includes a step-by-step strategy to formulating your unique
plan based on your business and your products.
Then you'll have 375 social media prompts over a full year
of ideas.
Along with the 375 prompts come 375 image suggestions.
So you're not left hanging on the creative.
These prompts and image suggestions can be used for all platforms
and all types of posting images,
live streaming reels,
even email direction,
but that's not all posts aren't going to work.
If the right people aren't seeing them.
So you'll also receive a video in a worksheet on how
to choose and use hashtags.
This is a way to attract the right people who will
become your customers.
Most people are doing this wrong.
There's more to content for makers too.
To see all the details.
Just jump over to gift biz,
unwrapped.com forward slash content for makers.
But honestly at only $27,
it's a,
no-brainer why carry on posting as you've been doing all along
expecting different results.
Sign up for content for makers now and see the transformation
of your posting experience change before your very eyes gift biz
on wrap.com
forward slash content for makers ready and waiting for your immediate
access. Right now today's show is a fun one.
My guest is so bubbly.
And can I just say,
I love that she laughed at me laughing at her lots
of personality along with good learning coming your way.
If you've held up starting on an email list,
or aren't sure if you've latched onto a solid strategy,
this episode is for you plus some surprising realizations about open
rates and a fabulous free gift to who doesn't love a
gift, but to get to all of that,
we need to first get to the show.
So let's do that right now today.
I am very excited to introduce you to Kate Doster.
Kate is all about helping ethical entrepreneurs,
open the hearts and wallets of their small,
but mighty audiences.
Thanks to fun email marketing.
She believes you don't need to bleed the alphabet or be
a dirty rotten spam face to write emails that jolt your
community into taking action.
Whether that's building a long lasting relationship buying directly from you
or checking out one of your affiliate partners.
Kate is the host of the inbox,
besties podcast and creator of the love,
your list.
2.0 email marketing mega course,
Katie, welcome to the gift biz unrepped podcast.
I am so excited and see what I can tell this
is going to be a great interview because if the host
giggles over a dirty rotten span of her face,
I know.
Yeah. And I can't wait to hear what else comes out
of all these creative words being put together.
I'm excited for this one.
So I like to start off our conversation in a traditional
way. And that is by having you describe yourself by way
of a motivational candle,
because it's so creative.
And yet you're here with all of us creative makers today.
So if you were to share what a candle would look
like, that resonates with you,
Kate by color and quote,
what would your motivational candle look like?
Motivational candle.
It would be on braid effect and it would definitely be
an umbrella effect that kind of looks like fire.
So it would have like the yellow,
the orange,
the reds.
Cause I always say that I'm just as big ball of
fire and my right hand lady,
her new nickname is the fire Tamer because I am a
creative. I like to create,
I cannot sit still.
So I am just like,
I'm always making something,
whether it is courses,
whether it's emails we bought and sold a house.
And so I renovated simultaneously two kitchens,
two bathrooms by myself.
I just love doing that.
So I'm a ball of fire.
And so the quote would actually be,
do the brave thing because that's what I tell my students
constantly, whether they are trying to grow their email list,
whether they're trying to sell,
whether they're trying to get more visible on say Instagram,
when you default to always doing the thing,
that's a little bit braver.
You are going to get results faster because honestly it's not
too hard to create a bunch of pins for Pinterest and
Canva, but if you're going out there and actually pitching somebody
to be an affiliate for you,
or you're pitching somebody to be on their podcast,
that takes a little bit of gumption,
right? And so those are the things that are going to
get you the results the fastest.
So it would be an on braid one that looks like
flames and it says,
do the bracelet.
I love it.
And I think that you have hit right on what can
be kind of an unseen weakness that we all have.
If you're a creator,
because I am the same way I create podcasts,
I create blog articles,
social media posts.
And is that really,
do I need more of those or should I be doing
some of the,
to your point braver things.
And for a lot of people who are listening,
they're just going to make another loaf of soap or more
candles or additional jewelry because they have a craft show coming
up versus actually going out and selling,
getting a wholesale account,
like all those types of things.
Yeah. I'm wondering what helps prompt you to go into that
brave area instead of staying in the comfort zone of you're
creating. So,
And even goes to,
like you mentioned the craft show.
We know if we start talking to somebody who's potentially walking
by, that can be nerve wracking as humans.
Right. But if you actually talk to that person,
usually there's going to be a sale or they're going to
talk about you.
So I'm the default to do the brave thing because I
figure what's the worst that can happen.
And just like any type of muscle,
like, wouldn't it be lovely if we could've done one set
up in high school and have a six pack forever,
like, that'd be great,
but it does not happen that way.
Sadly. So we'll figure it out eventually.
So bravery as a muscle.
And I think that people forget about that.
So the more that you use it,
the little tiny flexes that you're going along the way,
the more brave that you're going to be,
because for some people when you're like,
oh, what's the worst that can happen.
If they have a lot of social anxiety,
let's be real.
A lot of us creators do tend to have ADHD or
some form of it.
Sometimes you can have that hyper sensitivity to rejection.
So that's why it's like start off a little small,
get a little braver,
get a little braver because the worst thing that can happen
is something amazing can happen.
Or the worst thing that can happen is you're just proud
of yourself for being brave.
Yeah. For just taking the action regardless of what the outcome
is. Exactly.
And that bravery,
that sense of pride.
It's kind of like if you start walking like just 10
minutes in the morning,
you'll usually start eating a little bit better.
You start drinking,
maybe your walks get a little longer.
It's one of those Dominos effects from that pride of just
like you said of actually doing something.
So regardless of what the outcome is.
Yeah. That's why I always just make it,
just do the brave thing.
The worst thing that can happen is you're proud of yourself
or taking a risk.
Oh my goodness.
Like, oh,
Spinning off the conversation about walking.
I'm now a Peloton girl,
but I used to go to a health club and spin.
And the only time I could fit it into my days
was the 5:30 AM class.
Well, that means I had to get up at five.
I live in the Chicago area.
So throughout the year,
sometimes it is freezing cold and snowing,
but you know,
what I would do is I would make my plan the
night before,
this is what I'm going to do.
And I wouldn't allow myself to rethink it.
This is the plan.
This is the timeline.
Nothing is getting in the way at 5:00 AM.
When I have to get up,
there's no client issue.
There are no emails to look at.
There is no excuse,
but if I think about it too much,
or at that time,
like if I would start thinking about it too much,
then I could talk myself out of it.
But if I didn't allow that this is the plan you're
sticking with the plan you're going for it.
That's how I would do it.
I absolutely love that.
I also love biking.
I am not a Peloton person though,
because I don't like people telling me what to do,
but you know what you can do.
I just like to have my music,
my playlist that's okay.
I just bought we're so off topic.
We're going to get right back on in a second,
but this could help some people who are listening,
but I just bought a desk that you can put on
top of the Peloton.
So if you're listening to a webinar or there's something that
doesn't require too much typing,
cause it's kind of hard to spin and type a lot.
But if you're listening to something or watching something or just
a little bit of typing,
you could like be on that thing for a couple hours,
even not fast necessarily,
but still getting some type of a marginal workout.
So anyway,
that's enough of that Eddie.
It's so great.
Because again,
as creative,
like you said,
we're spending the time making the candles,
doing the marketing.
So sometimes it is really hard for us to move our
body. So every little bit counts guys.
Absolutely. Okay.
So share with us a little bit about words and how
you fell in love with words and got into really focusing
on email marketing.
So I am a talker more than a typer.
And so people are like,
what? I'm like,
I was not the person that had like straight A's in
English class.
Literally my least favorite teacher ever was my 10th grade English
teacher. And I feel like most people tend to not like
their 10th grade English teacher either.
And so I think that people get really clammed up,
especially with email marketing because they just flashed back to like
all those reports that they had to do when like sounding
all formal and they have been on the bad end of
emails. And so they don't want to get roped in with
a spammer faces,
but they sound so stiff.
And then they psych themselves out and they don't do it.
I love email marketing,
even I was a copywriter with a w so that means
I got paid to write words that made people do stuff
in my particular place,
hit buttons on the internet.
And I loved copywriting because it is so conversational.
You want to think of the potential customers that you have,
the current customers that you have,
especially as a handmade business,
as your friends who are just as excited about soap,
about candles,
about I have a student that does Harry Potter themed ornaments.
You want people that are just as nerdy and excited.
I'm like your thing is you are.
And when you start talking to them like a friend,
would you start using the vernacular that you normally would?
All of a sudden it starts opening up.
And if you think about email marketing,
because like we talked about,
we don't have a lot of time for staff and like
more power to you for getting up at five to do
the Peloton.
That was amazing.
Those days are over with email marketing.
It has been proven time and time again,
to be one of the most effective ways to get sales.
And the way I like to think about it is look
at your own Instagram.
Chances are,
you're probably following about 500 people or more cause like it's
Instagram, right?
But are you subscribed to 500 people's email list?
Absolutely not.
It is only the company is the bloggers.
Sue. The people that you love to hear from those are
the email lists that you staying on.
And so that's the same thing with your customers,
with your potential customers.
It's these people that are raising their hand.
That's like,
I'm so into what you do.
I'm going to let you in my inbox.
And so you want to make sure that you show up
for them.
So it is one of the most efficient tools out there.
If you do not have time,
if you can spend 20 minutes to read an email,
it can do way more than spending like 15 an hour
or two hours,
three hours say I'm on a blog post.
Not that I'm making blog posts,
but if you don't have any traffic and you don't have
a promotion plan for that blog post,
you could have just saved yourself some time and just send
an email.
All right,
perfect. So we need so that people can follow along with
what we really want to talk about.
I'm just going to be honest and truthful with you Kate
and tell you that there are people who are listening,
who the understanding of how you would even send an email
is overwhelming to them.
So we're just going to cut to the chase here.
If you were to pick one very easy email system,
let's say someone doesn't have any emails,
any addresses,
or an email system.
Yet I talk in other places about how to attract and
get email addresses,
but what would be the one system you would direct them
to look at,
sign up for so that they have a base to start
sending emails from what you suggest?
Just one,
I was going to say,
I'll give them two options.
You're allowed.
I feel that you need to test out back ends to
see which one works with your brain as someone who's neurodivergent
like, you need to find the thing that works for you.
So the two options that I always tell people,
the first one,
if you're looking for something that is free,
as long as you already have that established website,
like you've talked about,
I know you've just had a couple of podcasts episodes ago
about like,
do we need to blog and all of that,
then you can go with a system like mailer light.
They do have a free version up to a thousand people.
They will give you automation.
So say somebody gives you their email address.
They'll give you like the little forums to put on your
website or to put on a page that you can show
people at your craft shows.
And you're like,
I'll just type in your email address.
It does all that form staff.
It will allow you with their free plan under a thousand
recipients to automatically send that person an email,
whether it's a coupon code or a welcome or behind the
scenes, it can do all that for it.
Sometimes it can be a little bit slower.
Like I don't want to use the word clunky,
but something that can be a little bit clunky.
The other one,
and this one was built more so for creatives.
And I'd be interested to hear which one you usually talk
about a lot,
but it's usually convert kit.
So convert kit starts off at $30 a month.
And so for some people they're like,
I don't wanna invest $29 in my business.
Now I know that most of you guys are maker.
So you understand like wholesale cost and cost of materials.
So if you just think of it as a cost of
material and you actually use your email list,
then it's like,
oh, I can definitely make back 30 bucks.
Because say,
if you are selling again,
a candle,
right, you get one customer who buys two,
you sell them at 15 convert kit is paid for.
So now literally the rest of the month,
everything else that you make with email list is technically profit
from your email list.
So I like convert kit because it has those landing pages.
Their customer support staff is really,
really nice.
And they're fast,
which I really enjoy about them.
Same thing with mailer light,
even on the free plan,
the mailer light people will talk to you at the time
of this recording.
It could change,
but in something like a MailChimp,
I know that they don't help anybody on the free plan
and their system is super clunky.
So I don't really advise that if you're going to do
something where say,
you're going to be like selling online and you're going to
take, say a lot of orders and on your own site,
not like Etsy,
then you might want to look into something that your shopping
cart platform recommends.
So like,
if you're on Shopify or big e-commerce or something like that,
you can look to see what systems they recommend that you
use as well.
So that way you can tag and do orders and all
that sort of stuff.
Gotcha. Okay.
So that's a very long answer,
but the biggest thing is to see what works with your
brain and your price level.
And to have that plan,
that if you are going to pay for it every month
that you recoup that money.
Good. And honestly,
I would like to state here that don't go crazy.
Just pick one and get started.
Don't spend a week trying to figure it out.
Look at them,
analyze them as kids just suggesting,
but don't let this be a barrier to getting started with
email because it's better.
If you start at the place you want to stay,
but you can always wait,
no choice that you make is ever irreversible,
I guess would be the one I would say.
I see most people,
honestly on MailChimp or constant contact too.
And constant contact used to be the biggie,
but I don't hear very many people talking about it anymore.
I was going to say,
you didn't Really hear it.
Like I said,
MailChimp, the only reason why I,
well, there's a couple of things.
MailChimp keeps on changing what they do and do not include
in their free plan.
But the biggest thing is there's no customer support unless you
pay them.
Right. Okay.
Well, yeah.
And so for some of my students,
they don't want to pay,
so then they get no help.
So then they get stuck and they get overwhelmed by the
tech, but you need to have one of those they're constant
contacts, the mailer Lite,
the convert kit,
like you said,
just pick one because you just cannot,
legally you cannot like blind CC,
a whole bunch of people from your Gmail account or your
Hotmail account.
No. And people do that.
That is the fastest way to get fine.
Yep. Yep.
So that's Okay.
So we're together with this Kate pick one,
no matter what it is,
mailer Lite,
I don't really know much about that.
So check that one out.
It sounds great because if you can get someone on the
other end of the line in two seconds to answer a
question for you.
That's amazing.
All right.
So regardless of which one it is now,
we're going to move forward.
Okay. It,
and if you need to know,
so you've gotten your email system,
but you don't have any email addresses,
get some friends and family on your email list.
So you can test the system and see how it works.
It's that simple to get started.
We were just talking about how going spinning or going for
a walk.
You just have to take the action and decide to do
it. This is an action point.
If you haven't done this yet,
Most people have at least two email addresses.
So put in your other email address,
because what I found was actually strange from dealing with students
is they will clam up and get more nervous if people
in real life or on their email list,
which is so odd,
right? Because you would think like,
when you want to shout it from the rooftops,
I'm like,
just put yourself on there.
Even if you're literally just emailing yourself for like two weeks
while you're like getting the hang of it before you go
out. And you're like,
yes, now I'm going to go get friends and family,
or I'm going to put this on my website or going
to put on my Instagram or I'm going to put it
in my shop.
That type of scenario,
just get used to sending it to yourself.
It is okay.
Yeah. So just send an email,
see how it works.
See the system,
see how it looks on the other end when you're the
recipient, and then let's get rolling with it.
And like I've said,
we've talked in other episodes about value of email.
I talk about email all the time,
backup for social media.
You can't rely on social media platforms for retaining connections because
it's just too risky.
So we've gone through all of that.
So, all right.
Yay. Kate,
guess what?
I have an email service provider now,
what do I do with it?
Like, what am I going to talk about with people and
how is this going to be useful for my business?
Sure. So the first thing that you're going to want to
do before we talk about,
well, what are you going to talk to these people?
As you need to create some type of incentive for people
to want to get on your email list,
just like Dan formed of when my next show is or
find out when like,
say you do batches of things,
find out when the spring line is coming out.
Like, yeah,
you can have that,
but you're not going to get too many people on there.
You want to give people some reason to actually give you
their email address.
So in the online space,
they'll call it like a freebie,
a lead magnet.
That sort of a thing.
When you are somebody who is a maker and you're selling
physical goods,
nine times out of 10 people are in the buying mood.
So they're going to be looking for some type of discount
code because that's what they've been trained for for those like
big e-commerce sites.
So I always tell people,
if you are a maker,
I wouldn't go with something like eight things that loving Harry
Potter says about you.
If you're selling handmade Harry Potter ornaments,
or how to decorate for the holidays,
sign up for this free guide.
You can,
but people aren't necessarily going for information.
They're going to buy.
They're going to hear more about you.
So that's usually what it defaults to.
I know it stinks because our profit margins aren't that big.
But once you get somebody on your email list,
then the flood gates can open and you can do a
lot of fun things,
but we need to treat people like people.
And that's what they're looking for at that moment.
Well, A question,
is there a way within all of these systems that it's
for a first time purchase,
so people don't leave your list and come back and keep
the adding that discount It would have to.
So I don't do too many e-commerce sites right now.
So I'm just being completely honest with you.
So that might be one.
Remember how we talked about look,
to see what your shopping cart system recommends.
Like if we're using Shopify,
see what stuff they recommend.
I guarantee you that you can probably find something where it'll
generate like a one-time sort of use code and it should
be able to do that.
I know this sounds odd,
but I like to err on the side of people being
good, maybe that's just the Pollyanna in me that like,
I don't think that they would just keep doing it and
keep doing,
keep doing it.
And they unsubscribe.
And then they resubscribe with the same email.
Like they are not going to be able to get a
code because when your email service provider sees like most of
them, when they say like,
oh, Kate at Kate Doster unsubscribed,
and then resubscribed,
they won't send emails back out.
Because according to the system,
even though I tried to resubscribe,
I told them I don't want your emails anymore.
So it usually won't work.
Oh, that's interesting.
We've had people do that by accident unsubscribe,
but then they've resubscribed and been added back on.
Okay. That's good.
So it must've been on some systems.
It depends On the system.
I am chained to infusion soft keep now because I just
have so many funnels going for the other business as well.
Like I could not change even if I wanted to,
but convert kit would be the one I would be eyeing.
So we're in line with all of that.
But the other thing I want to just say,
just as a perspective about offering a discount,
get on a newsletter is think of it kind of like
you're investing in prospects,
just like when you enter in for a craft show,
you are entering in so that you can get visibility to
all the people that are walking the show you've paid for
that to happen.
Some people are going to buy some people aren't.
So it's a similar thing.
Just transferred over online.
A couple of ideas also that come to mind if you
didn't want to give a discount code,
because yes,
that comes 100% off of your profit margin,
but you could do something like a special product of the
month that they get on a discount or an add on
product. That's compatible with some of the other things in your
line. You could also do things like entering into a monthly
sweepstakes, giveaway,
different things like that.
But I like what you were saying,
Kate, about getting the mind of your customer and what is
it that would prompt them to take action because we all
now are so protective over our email because we know exactly
what's going to happen.
You're going to send us information and you are right,
but it's gotta be information that they're going to want to
have. And I also tell me what you think about this.
Then we're going to get off the signup email.
We're going to get off of that in a second.
But I think it's also good to tell them what they'll
do. You know,
besides just the discount code,
then they'll also get promotional codes and insider information that isn't
found elsewhere.
So then it's like that mystery of like,
okay, I'm going to get a discount because I want to
try the product,
but then I'm going to get this other information.
And if I don't sign up,
I won't get it.
Yeah. And I would a hundred percent agree with that.
I think that's a really,
really great point.
And because your handcrafted right.
Treat people like people,
you're going to hear me say this a million times because
that's my philosophy.
And that's why my students do so well.
People when they're buying handmade products,
it makes them feel good about themselves.
And it usually makes them feel,
I don't want to say like,
they're better than other people,
but like they're better than other people.
It's like the boost of the ego.
So if you make supporting your brand,
say something about them as a person.
So it's not just like,
you know,
join the insiders club.
Maybe it is the insider's club,
but you're trying to think to yourself,
okay, I am making these candles and they are infused with
crystals when they go ahead and burn down.
So your person is going to be pretty spiritual,
a lot of Wu,
a lot of that sort of stuff.
So like give them a name.
You're a creative sort of think about that sort of stuff.
What other things would she be interested in?
How does she handle herself?
How does she carry herself in the world?
What kind of things does she find fun?
And then it's like,
so you've got,
you know,
15% off your first candle Polestar will be inducted into the
cause I use Firestarters into the fire starters club where every
month we'll be sending updates behind the scenes,
you get to vote on new products.
And then all of a sudden it's like,
I'm not someone who buys a candle.
I'm a Firestarter.
And then,
cause I know you guys have talked about branding,
right? And then you've got that.
Love that so much.
I don't think that people think that far ahead.
They're like,
oh my goodness.
But like it's true.
It's true.
You've made email list.
A special group.
Yeah. Oh my gosh.
Okay. That just,
and like a Facebook group,
like, I don't want you guys like overthinking this,
like whatever you would have named her Facebook or you could
totally named that to like your email list.
Right. Even if you never referred to them as firecrackers ever
again, when they first sign up.
Yeah. Well I think you should.
I mean,
my Facebook group is called gift biz breeze.
So we call each other Breezers so we're Breezers together because
there are a lot of you who will never,
ever probably have a Facebook group like that.
It's just not part of what you're looking at doing because
you're out at shows all the time,
that type of thing.
Here's a way to have a special group that you could
name that you then throw all your love to.
I guess that I was also thinking of something else.
I don't want to forget this.
Just spitting off other ideas for people is if you do
spices or are a baker recipe of the month.
Oh my goodness.
So be Part of that group,
you know,
you'll get my special recipes every month that I share out,
but you gotta be part of this group sign up.
However, that would be all right.
So this is step one.
We've got to move on.
I don't even know how many steps you're going to give
us Kate,
but okay.
So the very first thing that we're going to do is
we are going to have a sign up box that doesn't
just say sign up for my newsletter for all the reasons
we just talked about.
I absolutely love the idea of naming it.
So we've got that now in place because you told us
to Kate.
So we're ready to go on to step two.
Excellent. So step two,
now that we actually have given them a little extra reason
to want to hang out with us more is you're going
to be sending an email.
So your email service provider will,
in case if you're wondering about the tech,
you'll set it up in the backend,
where, when somebody gives you their email address,
it'll automatically send that first email,
whether it's a coupon code,
whether it's download,
whether it's telling them about the product with mutt,
introducing them into being,
we're going to call them firecrackers,
introducing them into becoming a firecracker.
So that will all take care of itself automatically.
You'll set it up once it we'll do it for every
single person,
you don't have to worry about manually hitting send when every
single person gives you their email address.
So you have to worry about that.
Okay? So it manually that first one.
So make sure if you are going to separate lists,
you know,
you're going to separate them into customers or prospects,
things like that,
that, that email in terms of its verbiage is relatively generic
for anybody who signs up at any point along the customer
journey. So again,
that way you can do that.
So that way you don't have to worry,
like, oh my goodness,
like I just had 15 people at the craft show,
sign up to get that incentive that we're giving them.
And now I've got to,
once I write down this table,
I've got to put everything away.
I've got to go home,
I've got to do all this stuff.
And now I have to go and send 15 emails.
You got to know your system.
We'll help you set that up.
So that first email gets sent automatically.
So you will be good to go there.
So it delivers information off of what you talked about in
the signup box.
When you initially sign up,
it's either delivering that code sharing,
maybe a first recipe,
whatever relates to that.
But it's for everybody who joins your list.
Exactly. And of course you write that email,
so you're going to control what's in it.
But again,
this is why I love email.
You do it once and now it's totally scalable.
So I don't have to write a thousand times that same
exact email.
I wrote it once,
but it can get sent out to a thousand people.
So that's what I really love that.
So we got past that stage.
Okay. Let me just say something else here.
Just because it's coming to mind.
If you have something in place and you're not seeing people
signing up for your emails,
but you know,
people are coming to your website.
So it's not an issue of not having people seen the
ability to opt in,
switch it up,
try something different.
Okay. So this is changeable at any point,
if you want to,
Anytime nothing is written in stone,
are you,
like you said,
if you've got the traffic,
if you're just having it,
you've seen it with a lot of blogs in particular.
They'll have like that one little signup box in the sidebar
will sidebars.
Don't show up on mobile,
except for the very,
very end of everything.
And most people are not going to scroll that long.
Again, treat people like people.
So you need to make sure while I do not like
pop-ups, I'm not a fan of that.
I do like the wheelie guy,
I think privy does him.
I think he's kind of fun because people love contest.
But short of that,
like I'm not one that's like,
oh, have a pop-up.
Cause they're annoying because people are on mobile and then they
can't see your stuff.
They can't look at your catalog,
but maybe just,
I always call it like either whole low bar or a
top banner.
And again,
most of your email service providers will be able to sort
of help you sort of set one of those up where
it's like click here to get 15% off your first order
or click here to get a free custom bookmark with their
order. Right.
Test with your audience.
I mean,
popups can work.
I'm against them too.
But I can't tell you how many signups I get from
my pop-ups,
but I also delay them.
It's not like you first come on.
And all of a sudden in your face is this pop-up.
Yeah. So test it out.
But I agree with you with pop-ups but if they produce,
then sometimes you have to do them too.
Yeah. If you're relying really,
really heavily on Google to send you traffic,
that's the only time that I'd be like,
I wouldn't necessarily do them because Google,
especially now with this last update,
because it's prioritizing mobile viewing and mobile experience.
If you've got a lot of popups,
they crank your ranking,
just do.
Oh really?
Oh, interesting.
Yeah. So it's something if you're like,
oh, but like I'm ranking really high for keyword.
It could definitely be something to look at.
But after you do get the email address,
again, you're asking in a variety of spots now,
like so overwhelming,
but you're giving them more than one shot to be able
to be a firecracker with you.
Then I always tell my students,
I want you to send an email at least twice a
month, guys.
I prefer every week,
but I'm aware that for some people that can get overwhelmed,
even though there's only four weeks in most months,
I feel like you can write four emails,
but I definitely know you can handle two emails a month.
Y'all can do that.
The reason being,
if you're like,
oh, well I'll just send at the beginning of the month,
if are not a brand that is say really,
really visible on Instagram,
if you don't have that local or even online sort of
cult following that sort of a thing where again,
like Peloton Peloton could email you once a month and you
would never forget who they are.
Most of us do not have that name recognition.
The reason why you want to show up at least twice
a month.
So people remember who you are and what you sell.
That's super important.
So it can be something like really casual say that you
are making bracelets or that baker,
right? The making the bracelets,
it can be,
you can literally have pictures in your email and be like,
so I'm thinking of introducing a new bracelet into the shop.
Do you like the one with the pink beads?
Or do you like the ones with the blue beads?
And then you'll have like say the pictures linked.
You'll have a little link that says click here to vote
for pink,
click here to vote for a blue.
Right? And then those links will say,
go to a webpage.
It's just this,
thanks so much for voting.
I'll let you guys know which one won last week.
So now you have that sort of fun sort of like,
this is what we're doing,
right? If you,
again, one of my students,
she does sell those Harry Potter themes.
So a lot in her emails.
So usually always at the bottom have a picture of her
ornaments. But she'll talk about like how she just found this
quiz or what do people think about this again?
It's like,
what would your people want to hear about?
And just,
doesn't always have to be like,
this is my promotion.
This is this.
Now obviously,
if you're going to be doing a local show and you
want people to show up,
yeah, you're going to talk about that.
But it's like,
Hey, so I know that you're really into like this and
supporting small businesses and all this sort of stuff.
So I just want to remind you that if you are
in the Providence area,
I'm actually going to be at this show right here.
And if you're not,
don't worry,
you can always get some stuff from the shop.
And again,
just show up,
just show up.
And I'm Hearing you talking,
like you're talking to a friend,
you know,
it's not this big,
like structured term paper writing that you're doing.
You're talking like a friend and you're just sharing what's going
on in the business.
I want to talk about that again in a second.
And emails can be different lengths too,
right? It doesn't have to be the same structure over time.
One email might just be a couple of sentences.
Yeah. How's everything going with your baking?
What fun way have you used your candle?
Now I'm hearing you asking questions a lot,
trying to motivate a response in email.
And we talk about doing that on social posts all the
time, but is that a good practice for email?
I'm leaving you in suspense in anticipation of that answer and
we'll get to it right after a quick break to hear
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I think that it really is if you can get people
to click,
but definitely reply in that everyone is going to guys.
That's just not.
That is going to show both wherever they're reading it.
Their g-mail their outlook,
all of this,
like, Hey,
when Sue sends an email,
we should definitely show it to her because people like Amanda
really likes Sue's stuff.
They must be friends in real life.
So let's make sure that they get that stuff what's happened
now. And this has always been an issue.
And I don't know why nobody really talks about it.
All email service providers,
all of them,
the way that they track open rates,
because that's a metric that a lot of people like is
that they send this.
Technically it's an invisible picture that has a little pink code.
And so when that file is opened,
the invisible picture,
it sends it back to your convert kit,
your mother lights,
your contact contacts.
Hey, Amanda opens this email.
However, for the longest time,
it was always blocked on Android devices.
And most people where they read their emails on their mobile
phones, but nobody necessarily cared.
And I've been saying this for years.
I'm like just,
you know,
your open rate probably isn't reliable because people on Android,
it can't see it.
Well, the new iOS update came out for iPhones and they're
blocking that pixel now too.
So what ended up happening is you saw a whole bunch
of people,
essentially over two weeks,
just see all their open rates drop.
And they're like,
oh my goodness,
my rate's dropping.
Nobody's reading my stuff out.
Like email stinks.
It no longer works.
That technology is getting blocked.
And so now the only way is that you can reliably
tell is somebody actually opening my stuff.
Is, are they clicking on something?
Cause that still gets tracked or did they reply back?
And so that's why I love to have questions again,
not everyone is going to reply back,
but it's nice to be able to build that personal relationship
with your fans.
Just like you went over like DMS.
I know you've got that really great product of the year's
worth of social media content for makers.
It's that same sort of a thing.
That's what you're looking for is that interaction.
So that way,
when it comes to Christmas or holidays or birthdays,
or somebody needs a cake made,
cause say that you're a baker,
right? They're like,
oh, you need to go to Sandy.
Her stuff's amazing.
And I love her emails,
right? That's what we want.
Yeah. Well,
first off,
nobody freak out.
If you're looking at your open rates and they've gone down
because now you understand why it's not,
the behavior has changed.
The good news is you probably weren't even seeing that your
open rates were initially higher than you even think.
But now that they're going down,
that your numbers are going down,
it doesn't matter.
So that's really my gosh,
like you've just saved a bunch of hearts from dropping people.
I'm thinking,
all right.
So I haven't seen this for a while and I'm gonna
have to go check out if I'm still on his list.
I wonder if something changed,
but there used to be a guy that I would follow.
He sent out Sunday mornings,
which seems like a really wild time.
That's when his emails would come out.
They were always very interesting.
But the very last line was reply back to me and
tell me what you're drinking this morning.
Cause he was like the theme of,
he was at a coffee shop sharing with us what was
going on.
And I wouldn't be surprised if he actually wrote it then
in there while he was having his coffee.
But he'd always say drop me a note.
Let me know what you're drinking this morning or something like
That. Was it this morning?
Dispatch five with Paul Jarvis.
By any chance?
No. Oh,
cause that's what Paula used to do that.
But then he stopped sending emails.
I loved his Sunday emails.
There were the best Ones.
Yeah, no,
this was so great.
And you know what he would respond back to.
Yeah. Whose name is escaping me So interesting.
And that's the other thing again?
And this is why we say weekly,
because like Sue just said guys,
and this is the same thing for your customers.
If they're expecting to see you Sunday,
Friday, Thursday,
there are going to be those diehard people where if you
miss a Wednesday and you send on Wednesdays,
they're going to be like,
are you okay?
Like they're going to be emailing you,
looking for your newsletter.
It's really wild.
This is a perfect example here.
Now granted,
like I just have a brain freeze,
but I can see his face.
I can't think of his name,
but look at what else.
I said,
I haven't been getting his emails.
So if somebody wants your candles and he's like,
oh my gosh,
what's the name of that company?
I can't think of it.
I can't think of it if you've were routinely sending them
emails every other week.
And they were seeing that you are continually pinging their brain
as to the name of your company so that they can
come back when they're ready to buy.
So this is a perfect example,
Kate, when I figure out and remember who it is,
I'll let you know,
you know,
either during this interview or like an hour from now,
I'm going to be like,
ha like how could I not remember his name?
But anyway,
enough of that.
But I do have a question and it might make some
of our listeners angry.
So be careful.
But what do you say to people who are currently emailing,
but what they email regardless of their frequency is a picture
of the product and the price and the description and a
button to go by.
I would say,
well, at least you're emailing.
So now since you've had like that step one,
you've done the crawling aspect.
And now it's time for you to be able to walk.
Now it's that time?
Where again,
because you're a maker because you're not target.
The reason people buy from makers is because they want to
actually know the person and they want to have something unique.
So that's when you start,
including pictures of you pouring the wax pictures of you with
the DOE,
talking about if it is that sort of recipe of the
month, talking about how you were trying out different ingredients into
your workout or like the first one's burnt.
Right? So that way you're actually a real person to them.
So again,
definitely because people are really visual,
have some pictures in there don't necessarily do shoe too many
because that's more likely to put you in the promotions tab.
But obviously it's a visual making thing.
You're going to need to have some pictures in your emails.
Just make sure that they're great ones.
I know that you had just had,
you can't send videos through emails.
I know that on the podcast,
you just talked about videos and that sort of stuff,
you can't send those.
You can send like a,
still shot,
like a screenshot of it.
And then people could say click on it and then go
watch the things that you have.
But again,
just add,
add a little stuff to ask somebody what they're doing,
how they're drinking this cup of coffee,
you know how you were just saying with the Sunday dispatches,
what are your drinking find that brain hook.
So maybe for you,
you are going to talk about your cat,
Mr. Whiskers,
because you know,
secretly that your people are cat people,
even if you are the baker,
right. And then you're going to like,
just like show up and be like,
just have a quick update and be like,
so what are your pet up to just find something so
they can relate to you as a person and not just
a company,
Something easy that they can respond back to.
Nothing hard,
just an easy answer.
And then what do you do?
Respond back to them again,
develop a relationship.
Exactly. Maybe it's a color.
Maybe like you cause something easy as like every time say
you go to a craft,
show you where the color purple.
Right? And again,
this is stuff that's going to span everywhere.
It's not just in your email list.
It's going to be showing up on your social media is
on your Facebook,
on your Instagrams,
your tech talks wherever you're going to be.
So that way,
when people think of purple,
they think this one really doesn't go up because it's makers
and makers.
But I know that there was a certain influencer who Instagram
was his thing and he loved target.
So like now anytime people would go to target,
they would tag.
I know exactly who you're talking about.
Yeah. I bike or walk in.
I would do it in the morning and I do it
at night because I can't sit still.
And so now we have via Instagram stories.
We have an online nightly walking club.
So now when people are walking at night,
I think of myself and my friend,
Jasmine, who does stock photos and they tag us.
And so we have a virtual walking group.
So it's those little sort of things.
Or if you hear spam or face,
you think a Kate,
right? So,
and those things that people want to have that relationship with
you because you are small.
Like, I cannot tell you how many people,
like I love buying special gifts from the Etsy is the
actually finding people.
I personally like to go to Instagram.
So that way I can buy directly from people's websites.
Cause again,
I'm aware that,
you know,
I want to give them as much profit as possible,
but those are the cool things because now all of a
sudden they're the cool person with hookup.
Like, oh my goodness,
if you want like custom wine glasses,
like you need these,
like, they're so cool.
So then maybe your newsletter is talking about what you're drinking
or celebrations.
It can talk about,
they have,
somebody was tagging you on the Instagram and their story or
in their post.
Maybe you could have a section,
your email.
That's like cups in the wild,
if you will.
And then it's just like showing a couple pictures of people
tagging you on Instagram.
So they're like,
Ooh. So that way people are proud to have your product
because they have your product.
It means something.
Yep. You are then part of the vibe of that business
and it's special and it's important and it's being part of
a group.
So Kate,
I have termed this concept that you're talking about,
about people knowing you over and above your product as a
unique, special power.
And one of my unique,
special powers is snow because I absolutely love the snow and
I'll get people literally from all over the world who will
be like,
oh my gosh,
Sue, there's a blizzard coming to Chicago.
You must be so happy.
You know?
Exactly. Yeah.
Or people will see yellow because that's also something that people
who hang around with me know that that's my color.
And they'll take pictures and they'll send me things that are
yellow or things that remind them of me.
And I bring this up because it's a trigger point for
people then to remember your company.
So you're not just doing it because you're talking about yourself,
you're doing it because you're placing certain triggers as someone just
going through life.
Like I have a dear friend who literally,
I'm not even kidding you.
Everything she owns is leopard print everything.
Okay. Until anytime people see leopard,
they think Claudia right away.
That's it?
Because it's so ingrained what we're going for.
Yeah. It's so ingrained.
So unique,
special powers.
Think of one or two things that are yours and start
sharing them with people because it's going to help them.
Remember your business.
It circles around indirectly is the thing It's.
So does.
And again,
because we're really visual and obviously we're makers,
right? We're creative.
So you're going to be visual sometimes.
It's for like the like hate astutely.
Like I'm boring as dirt.
I've got nothing by one item of clothing and just let
that be your face.
So I have heard of her friends with him,
I say 15 years,
he says 13.
I'm like,
we're old,
it's 15.
And he's a personal trainer online.
And he brought this broccoli shirt and I'm like,
I'm going to make that your thing.
He's like,
you're going to make the broccoli's shirt.
My thing.
I'm like,
we're gonna make that a sticking point.
Sure enough.
It's been like two days.
And like the broccoli shirt is now everywhere.
Oh my gosh.
Cause like that is the thing.
Right? So again,
and when you wear it at the craft show,
right? Like say,
and again,
it doesn't have to be broccoli if that doesn't fit.
But like people are going to be looking for that thing
at the craft shows or they're going to buy their own
version, like you've said,
and then they're going to tag you.
They're going to tag Claudia when they're wearing their own leopard
prints. They might wear leopard print when they come see you
in person again,
they want to be part of a secret club.
And they're on the,
in to know that Sue is yellow and like smell And
they feel like they can throw me snowballs too.
Just FYI.
I'm from new England.
I'm just like,
you're on your own.
Oh, I love it.
I hate it.
When it turns out gray and ground,
I can not Get enough,
but okay.
So back to emails and I brought that point about people
showing their product and the description and how to buy.
If you train your audience,
always that every single time I get an email,
it's going to be the product and how to buy.
I already know that.
And I just am not in the market right now for
whatever it is you sell,
then they're not going to open.
But if you know that,
yes, so-and-so sells powdery.
I love their pottery,
but she also shares with me some really cool new restaurants
that are in the area.
And I live right near her.
So I want to know that or a recipe of how
I can use this soup bowls that I bought from her
so that the emails provide information that are valuable to your
follower, your starter,
over and above the product that you sell,
because you want them to not miss opening an email because
there might be something in there that they really want instead
of training them,
product, price,
that's all I'm going to get that valuable when I need
it, but I don't need it.
Adding other good information into emails I have found is the
key 100%.
And so I would say for most makers,
it might almost be again,
it's going to be different than what a lot of online
teachers are going to tell you like,
oh, like one message is one call to action.
All of this sort of stuff I feel for us it's
works really well with like a magazine style newsletter.
So like the top half of your newsletter are going to
be those interesting brain bits.
It's going to be this soup of the week recipe.
It's going to be this and this.
And then obviously at the bottom,
of course you are going to have a picture of some
products and a button to buy.
Right. But that top half is where the relationship is built.
And honestly,
probably some of the stuff that you're learning from Sue's content
calendar on social media can work really well as a top
half of your email,
because you might be like,
oh, well they already read it on Instagram.
So like,
I can't like reuse this content.
Not everyone is going to see all of your Instagram posts,
go look at your analytics.
It's the truth.
Right. And even if somebody does follow your religiously on Instagram
and they set it in the newsletter,
maybe seeing it that second time would actually get them to
reply. And usually they'll say like,
oh, I saw you talked about this on Instagram the other
day. My favorite coffee cup is the golden girls ones that
I have.
So I don't want you feeling like,
oh my goodness.
Like I can't,
I call it upcycling.
I can't upcycle my social media content into my emails.
You can 100% do that.
It is okay.
Absolutely. Yeah.
And different people will get their information in different ways.
Right? Like exactly.
So some people are email.
Some people like Instagram,
and if you copy just a little bit,
it doesn't matter.
I'm so glad you said that.
Yeah. And there are a ton of ideas in there.
You're right.
So that's that?
I do have a question about emails,
shoot. When you're writing,
do we have to follow that 10th grade high school teacher
sentence structure with punctuation?
Or can we get fun and cute and personable in our
writing? Like the actual word?
Well, I know the words because that's what you're all about,
but do we have to follow functionals?
Correct. Grammar scripting,
I guess.
I don't even know how to say that.
Okay. You do not want to have giant blocks of texts
because nobody reads that because people go to email for one
reason. And one reason only it is to procrastinate.
Do not let people tell you anything.
Otherwise they're going there for a quick dopamine hit to be
entertained period.
And nobody wants to be entertained by having to read something.
That's like seven sentences long.
It's all the same color.
It's really small font to read.
They're not into that.
Right? Honestly,
if something is longer than two sentences,
it needs to be its own paragraph.
Because again,
you want things to be skimmable.
You want to make sure say if there are certain keywords
or something that you want to draw attention to,
those are going to be in bold.
So that way they can see it.
Same thing.
Like when you were say formatting,
a blog post,
you want things to be skimmable.
You can use things like y'all or what's happening,
or, you know what I mean?
Like you don't have to follow proper grammar at all.
Obviously you want that.
You want to make sure that somebody is able to understand
it. But if there is a typo,
yeah. You're going to get somebody to reply back and be
like, just say,
you're now you spelled this word wrong.
I like to think of it.
You know,
I give them that annoying voice.
I like to think of it is that their love language
of, because again,
Pollyanna, I like to think that that's just their way of
showing me love,
because they don't want me to get judged by other people
where I see a typo as a sign of an action
taker, because I would've never had the typo if I didn't
send email and I didn't write it.
Right. So for me,
it's a badge of honor,
because again,
it would never happen if we didn't,
like we said at the beginning,
do the brave thing and actually hits.
And so you're worried about those sorts of things.
It happens if a link doesn't work it's okay,
go ahead and email everybody again.
Everybody has made mistakes in life and that's what you say.
It's like,
oops. Well,
I know that this was supposed to go to our Sage
shirts that we have,
and it accidentally went to a pair of shorts.
Thanks everybody for letting me know.
I'm so excited.
You're just as excited about that shirt as I am here
is the proper linkage.
So that way you guys can go ahead and get it.
And when you do,
don't forget to tag me on Instagram so I can show
off how cool you look.
I love that.
Listen, we're talking to other people.
And honestly,
I'm going to say,
if someone is going to be kind of a jerk about
it, you probably don't want them to be a customer anyway.
Nope. You delete them.
Like that's going to be that problem person.
So let it just roll off your shoulders.
If something like that happens or they might just be having
a bad day.
So don't take it on yourself.
Just let it go.
But to your point,
Kate, get these emails out.
Exactly. No,
like being on your list is a privilege.
And I'll say that till I'm blue in the face,
people are lucky that they get to pay you.
They're lucky that they get to get your craftsmanship.
They lucky that they get to get your tips.
I know about Mr.
Whiskers. And they're lucky that they get to have that brightness
that your day is when you show up in their inbox.
And so when you're like,
you know what,
being on my list is a privilege because you can always
go find more people.
I mean,
that's why you're hanging out with Sue,
right? She's got that great freebie of ways to get more
customers. So there is no scarcity mindset here,
guys. We will go and find more because all not a
problem. All right.
So we've got our incentive so that people are going to
be interested in joining our list.
They are delivered a welcome email.
Then we start regularly sending messages that include other things over
and above just our product with responses.
And we send that out twice a month.
Is there anything else we should be doing?
I mean,
again, I would love it to be every week,
but if we were just getting started,
I would also say,
and I know that since we're creative,
sometime we can't plan that far ahead.
But honestly,
if you are only going to send two emails,
just pick a data,
right. Both of them.
Oh yeah.
Because with your email service provider,
you'll be able to have it.
So that way,
even though you wrote it on the first,
you can have it send automatically on the 15th.
You just have to set it up.
That that's the date that you want to send it.
So that's the other thing,
because I do know that again,
we get really busy when it's cracking Susan.
Now that we're allowed to get out of the house here
in the states a little bit,
amen to that.
Things are going to be able to pick up a little
bit more.
Right. So now just be the other thing,
just batch,
get them both done trickle,
but Caitlyn,
I don't know what I'm going to have on my Instagram
in two weeks.
And just don't talk about Instagram in that two weeks,
right? Or,
oh, what if a product is sold out?
If a product is sold out,
I'm sure that you will be able to fix it.
Like, and nothing is end all be all.
And on the 13th,
go and reread that email.
If you know,
it's usually sending on the 15th just to make sure everything's
cool. Like nothing is written in stone.
There's a million ideas that you can have scan your pictures
on your phone.
If you're going to a craft show,
were you there last year?
Do you have a picture from last year anticipating a show
that you're going to be at?
I mean,
there were so many ideas,
so just scan social,
you'll see ideas as well.
Exactly. Again,
how things are made,
what you're doing,
where you're going,
the best place to source it.
I know semi girls,
well show people,
cause I'm sure that they get this question like,
oh, well,
like how do you actually make a candle?
So maybe it's like a little blog post on how to
make your own candles.
Nine times out of 10,
people are not going to take up candle making.
And I know that you had a podcast episode that came
out a little while ago that was talking about using affiliate
marketing to increase your revenue.
Yeah. I mean,
Amazon doesn't pay that much.
Like let's be real here guys,
but be an affiliate for target for Amazon.
I don't know if Michael's or any of the crafting stores
has one because people are always going to want your supplies.
Cause they're like,
oh yeah,
I can make these reefs just like Susan does,
but then they get all this stuff and then they're like,
oh, I'm just going to paces and for whatever.
Oh, exactly.
For sure.
But even your lifestyle things,
you can be an affiliate for like I use hello fresh.
I'm actually creating,
not just business affiliates,
but also just my lifestyle,
things that I use in life that I love.
And so you can talk about those in emails too.
It's very interesting.
I'm talking more and more about this,
that everything is compatible with each other.
Like social media helps reinforce emails,
which reinforces maybe a video that you did.
That's on YouTube.
Like all of these work in harmony together to strengthen your
business. But email is one,
like if you had to pick a few only a couple
things email,
because it's something that you totally control and that your email
list is something that you always have access to,
should be top of the list.
No question about it.
I was going to say,
cause like people can look at my social media following and
they'd be like,
Hey, you've got like a cool,
like 3000 followers on Instagram.
How do you make so much money?
I make so much money because I spent all my time
on my email list and only letting the right people on
my email list.
So my email is like five times what my social media
followings are actually it's a little bit closer to,
I think like eight times because I focused on the thing
that mattered the most getting into people's inboxes.
So I don't need to compete with 500,
600 people for their Instagram feeds.
Yeah. I love Instagram.
It's super fun.
Right. But like,
I mean business,
I'm going to be in their inbox.
I it's me.
And maybe like,
I don't know,
15 other companies max.
I can deal with that eyeball ratio all day.
Every day.
Yeah. Social media following.
Doesn't always equate to the success of a business.
It's hard to remember that sometimes,
but it's everything working in conjunction and you know,
I already said that so I don't have to go Further.
Oh, you're so right.
I mean,
things get hacked.
Social media platforms fall out of service.
When people used to ask me like,
oh, why is email important?
Usually my answer is,
do you remember Friendster?
And if like,
what is Friendster?
I'm like exactly.
Exactly. But did you forget what Gmail was?
No. No.
You did not.
What about list maintenance and cleanup?
Sure. I think that it is important.
I'm going to say it's a little bit trickier now.
I'm not one where it's like,
oh, if somebody hasn't opened my email in six months,
I'm just going to automatically delete them.
Because like we've talked about now all email service providers,
it's not just convert kit.
It's not just keeps lashings views and shops.
Everybody has such a hard time on mobile and like everybody
loves to open on mobile.
Now I will have them send to convert kit.
Does this automatically?
I don't know if infusion soft does this,
but if somebody is considered a cold subscriber,
they haven't opened or clicked on your stuff for any once
in a while,
convert kit will automatically put a tag on there.
And then when that tag is added,
you can have it get set up.
I know this sounds like,
ah, but again,
you set up once and it does it forever.
It'll set up this little series where maybe if someone hasn't
opened up your stuff in six months,
you're going to send them a coupon code.
You're going to ask them like,
Hey, are you still actually getting these emails?
Do you want to hang out?
And again,
it's always the prospect of what's in it for them.
So like usually I'll send a series of about three emails,
but I would say definitely is to where it's just like,
Hey, so I know I can't stand getting emails that I
don't want and having over an inbox.
And I never want that for,
because I just want to help you have a beautiful home
with these candles to be able to set the ambiance.
So if you don't want to hang out anymore,
just go ahead.
You can click here and unsubscribe.
But if I don't hear back from you,
I'm going to remove you,
but you can always come back.
If you want to go ahead and let them do it,
they'll have the tag,
we'll go through it.
I'll usually have the series setup.
So say after that final email where it's just like do
something or leave,
I'll have it wait,
like say seven days and then they'll convert kit.
They get sort of pooled at the bottom and then just
go and delete them a couple of times a year.
Yeah. And I think it also,
I'm thinking about this now,
like when we do webinars,
we'll have thousands of people sign up for a webinar,
but the only way I got their email is because they
wanted to join the webinar and then they may or may
not be interested in talking further.
So we will purge some of them because I figure if
they're really interested,
they're going to come back and sign up for a freebie
and get back on the list.
And I don't need to keep thousands of people on a
list if they're never going to open or really we're only
interested in one thing.
But I'm thinking for makers,
the quality of people that you get on your list is
also based on how you ask for people to join.
Exactly. So like if someone's coming to your website and they
sign up,
that's an initial action or an immediate action that they took
personally. So that's a good person to have on your list,
but what you wouldn't do,
and this is against the canned spam laws,
if that's such a thing anymore,
anyway, is if you're like out at a networking meeting or
you got a list of everyone that came to a craft
show, whether they came by your booth or not,
you can't add those people to your list.
And that would be a bad list first off.
Cause it's spamming.
But second,
you don't even know if they're qualified or interested.
So they're taking up a spot on your list that could
go to somebody who is interested.
Cause at some point,
most lists you'll have to pay based on the size of
your list.
Exactly. That's usually when people tend to,
again, it's different in the online information space.
I tell people if they need to do it habitually,
but again,
because you're meeting people in real life because they could just
be customers who just haven't bought in a while.
It's a little bit different.
Usually it's when people get up to that next tier,
like, oh,
I'm going to have to start paying or,
oh, I'm going to have to start paying 20 bucks more.
That's when they'll go ahead and they'll start cleaning out.
But again,
you want to make sure that rather than just deleting all
of those people altogether that you sent a couple of emails
and then like,
literally put it's like,
Hey, so,
and again,
you don't want to be creepy about this.
Maybe like send the discount code.
They use it,
all of that.
Now they're active that sort of second email to say,
Hey again,
we're talking about spam,
put that in there and be like,
but you might honestly be opening your emails and my assistant
just can't hell.
So just get a quick reply and say like there were
keep or tell something and I've gotten people that have sent
me like huge replies,
like, oh my goodness,
I love all your stuff.
I read it all the time.
I don't know why it's saying that he wants me to
leave. Like all this I'm like,
well now you're fine because that's how action.
So just encourage them,
let them know that like technology isn't perfect.
And I think that that's what you're trying to tell them.
You don't want to be a burden and technology is not
perfect. So you just want to make sure the two of
you are on the same page.
There You go.
Love it.
Love it,
love it.
This has been wonderful.
Kate so much great information,
things that I haven't heard before.
So really fascinating conversation.
Share with us a little bit more about your business,
your podcast,
whatever you want to tell everybody about.
Sure. So I have podcasts.
It's called N box besties.
You listen to it wherever you're listening to this great show,
make sure you leave sewer review first.
Then you can come and listen to inbox best and right.
So leave her that rating review y'all cause it's a great
show. And my website is@katedoster.com.
I do have an incentive as we talked about call the
two years worth of strategic email ideas to come on over
to Kate doster.com
four slash two years.
However, because I love being transparent.
It is geared towards people that are more information-based the bloggers,
the coaches,
the people who sell digital products and coaching.
So some of the ideas might not necessarily work like sharing
your three favorite books.
It could or could not work.
It might work for a segment of say your newsletter stuff.
But I do just want to be clear that that's usually
the people that I help.
I know everyone's like,
oh, why don't you do like an e-commerce thing?
Eventually we'll get there.
But for right now it's primarily info based people.
So I just wanted to make that clear though.
I loved hanging out with you.
You can hang out with me on Instagram.
Kate underscore Doster is totally cool.
I just want to let you know,
you might have to finesse a little bit of the stuff
that I talked about to fit yours.
Yeah. It could inspire you for another idea.
So like your three books,
if that doesn't relate to an audience,
it might be three something else or,
you know,
it might just be the catalyst you needed to come up
with another idea for a topic.
Exactly. Because when you can write about anything,
your brain discussed,
right. But when you have like a cause it's not just
like, I'm not giving you like a hundred,
four ideas in a list.
Cause that's not the way the human brain works.
Treat people like people.
So like I literally have it like may week one,
send this to send this through,
send this some people follow it religiously in order other people
like to switch it up.
It's okay.
And if you're like the key I'm listening to this and
like January through August is already gone.
So it turns out those months come back.
So you were fine.
Just scroll back up.
It's cool.
It's funny.
It's cool.
They're going to come back.
Yeah. And content for email marketing is definitely something that I
know people are interested in.
So make sure to go and take a look at this.
Kate doster.com
forward slash two years.
Right now.
I'll have it linked up in the show notes with the
number two.
Okay. And then how else are you supporting your community?
In case we have someone here who would like to know
a little bit more,
just really quickly The email that's 100%.
Those are my people.
So that's our,
I spent a whole bunch of my time about the podcast.
And like I'd mentioned over on Instagram,
that's where I share a lot of like what Sue said.
A lot of more lifestyle content.
You can chat with me there.
DMS on Instagram is probably the best way to get ahold
of me.
Never sent me a message on Facebook.
I have not checked that in eons.
I'm sure it is awful.
So, Hey,
are we over on Instagram?
It's Kate underscore Doster.
That's real.
I will be.
And if you are listening to this episode with any,
you still are,
make sure you take a screenshot and tag myself and Sue
so that we know that you guys are listening.
Wonderful. I love that.
Kate, thank you so much for joining us today.
Such great information.
I know that we have motivated a couple of people,
probably more to go ahead and get started doing email marketing.
So thank you so much for that.
Want to know my favorite takeaway today?
The idea of naming your email list members for Kate it's
firecrackers. And honestly this whole concept makes me smile.
We all love being part of a group,
particularly when it's something exclusive.
So there you go.
Yet. Another reason to move forward on your email strategy,
perhaps I've gotten your wheels turning here.
This podcast provides you with resources that you can refer back
to at your convenience.
And to do that,
I have a great way for you to find what you're
looking for.
Have you ever listened to a podcast here knew you wanted
to write something down relisten at another time or come back
and grab a resource that was mentioned,
but for the life of you,
you can't remember what episode it was in.
Well, now you can find it instantly.
If you go to gift biz,
unwrapped.com forward slash search,
enter keywords on any topic you want.
And not only will it tell you in what episodes the
topic was discussed,
but it will bring you to that exact spot grab and
go style quick,
easy, and you can be on your way to taking that
newfound information and implementing it into your business.
Whether it's a topic like SEO,
you want to hear from other jewelry makers or you're looking
for a specific guest show all now can be found through
keyword search right inside this podcast.
Yay. I'm so excited about it.
And quite honestly,
I've been using it for myself as well.
That link again is gift biz,
unwrapped.com forward slash search.
Next week,
we're diving back into Instagram.
There have been some big changes there recently,
but we're going back to the basics.
If this platform has been confusing for you in the past,
take a deep breath and join me here next Monday.
That's a wrap for this week.
Please review and share this podcast.
If you haven't already,
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And I'll see you again next week on the gift biz
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I want to make sure you're familiar with my free Facebook
group called gift is breeze.
It's a place where we all gather and are a community
to support each other.
Got a really fun post in there.
That's my favorite of the week.
I have to say where I invite all of you to
share what you're doing to show pictures of your product,
to show what you're working on for the week to get
reaction from other people and just for fun,
because we all get to see the wonderful products that everybody
in the community is making my favorite post every single week,
without doubt.
Wait, what,
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