Jay Schwedelson: We are back for Do This, Not That, and we might have one of, possibly the biggest guest we've ever had. I really believe that. So who is here today? We have Laura Morton. Now, Laura Morton, you may know her because she is a 20-time New York Times bestselling author. Okay? She's written over 60 books with some of the biggest celebrities on the planet, like Justin Bieber, the Jonas Brothers, Jennifer Hudson, Al Roker, Melissa Etheridge, Joan Lunden, Susan Lucci, you name it.

Jay Schwedelson: Okay? But she's not just an author. She's also has her own imprint, her own book imprint called Lasega Books. And when I went out to the market and said, "Okay, I'm gonna write this book." I just wrote a book called Stupider People Have Done It. It's coming out in June. And I scoured the world and I asked everybody, "Who should I work with?

Jay Schwedelson: Who should I work with?" And everybody came back to the same name. They said, "Laura Morton." Everybody said Laura. I go, "Who is Laura Morton? Who is this person?" She is the person, and I am lucky enough to have my book coming out on Lasega Books and, you know, the book world is so much more than I ever thought it was.

Jay Schwedelson: And I said, "We gotta get Laura on the show. We gotta dig into the world of books. Let everyone have a peek behind the curtain with the person that knows more about this than anybody else." So Laura, welcome to the show.

Laura Morton: Jay, thank you for that introduction. Although I am going to tell you I have 23 New York Times bestsellers, but who's counting, right?

Jay Schwedelson: Who's counting? Well, that's perfect because you are the GOAT of publishing. That's the GOAT number, 23. So that doesn't surprise me at all. So let's jump into it for a second here. Give us, from where you sit... 'Cause everybody, I, I love books. To me, I'm nervous. Is the book market okay? The planet's changing so much.

Jay Schwedelson: Is it the end of books? How are books doing?

Laura Morton: Oh, I mean, Jay, it's, it's absolutely the opposite. First of all, I want to congratulate you on doing something so phenomenal. You know, most people talk about wanting to write a book, right? And they sit around and, you know, their friends tell them, "You should write a book, man. You're so cool. You're so smart.

Laura Morton: I love what you say. You should write a book." And they never get it off the kitchen table, right? It just, you know, it just sits and it's a thought and it's a regret for so many people down the road. So congratulations to you on your book, "Stupider People Have Done It," which I love the title, and I'm so proud to be your publisher.

Laura Morton: Um, you know, you're coming into publishing at a really unique time because do you know, in 2025, there were-- Do you wanna-- Do you know how many books were published in 2025? You

Jay Schwedelson: No idea.

Laura Morton: wanna take a guess?

Jay Schwedelson: Uh, I'm gonna be stupid. I have no i- 30,000. I don't even know.

Laura Morton: Four million books.

Jay Schwedelson: Oh, my God. That's

Laura Morton: books. Yeah. Interestingly, three and a half million of those Are books that are either self-published, hybrid publishers, you know, direct, you know, uh, direct to consumer, right? Um, and the rest is in the traditional market. And what we're seeing now is there's been an increase in book sales.

Laura Morton: We've seen year over year over year that books are selling, and that's good news for publishing. What is even better news for publishing is we're seeing all these different paths to market now. So, you know, and, and, and the question is why, and, and what path is right for you? And, you know, I think that that is, um, what a lot of people are seeing is that they don't need a big publisher to get their book out into the world.

Laura Morton: And we're seeing, in fact, a lot of independent books that are selling big, big numbers, 100,000, 500,000, over a million copies, when in fact-- I'm gonna, I'm gonna give you another stat that's kind of interesting, okay? How many books do you think the average book sells?

Jay Schwedelson: Oh my God. I, uh, uh, a, a, 1,000?

Laura Morton: 300.

Jay Schwedelson: No way.

Laura Morton: 300 copies is what the average book sells in the United States today. 1,000 copies, you know, under 1,000 copies is a, is a pretty safe number, but the average number is 300, which is basically your friends and family buying

Jay Schwedelson: about to say, right. I mean, that's like you buying your own book.

Laura Morton: Yeah. So, you know the question, what is the differentiator, right?

Laura Morton: What makes a bestseller? What makes a book take off? And you know, what, what makes somebody want to read what it is you have to say?

Jay Schwedelson: Well, I wanna ask you a question about that because... And, and this is me, I'm not, I'm not being bragging or whatever, but when I was talking to Laura about the book, I had a lot of doubt. Can I even write a book? And, and I'm proud to say we hit number one on Amazon's, uh, new releases for marketing just this past week, and I was like, "I can't believe this.

Jay Schwedelson: So now I have to listen to everything Laura says." She's like the Yoda of all things books. But here, what you've said from the beginning is, you said to me, you know, "You have a book in you. I really think you have a book in you." And I appreciate that, your confidence, 'cause I didn't have that. What is it that you have to see in somebody?

Jay Schwedelson: I mean, yeah, great, you're Justin Bieber. That's not hard. Good call. Okay, they have a book in them. But what is it for somebody that's not Justin Bieber that you look for and say, "Yes, you could have a successful book that you're not just selling to 300 friends and family"?

Laura Morton: Yeah. Well, I mean, the first thing that anybody will tell you is your platform, right? Do you have an audience? And the difference between someone like yourself who has an audience, right? You have a very large audience. You do a lot of speaking. Um, you have this incredible podcast that you do. Uh, but the difference between someone like yourself and, you know, somebody who, who might be a doctor somewhere that just really wants to write about, let's say, mental health And, you know, they're writing a, uh, an important book, but they just don't have the audience.

Laura Morton: How are they meeting their audience where they're at? Certainly there's a need for a book on mental health, but you still have to be able to market to, to those people, and really ultimately that's what this boils down to is marketing conversation. Um, but the first thing that I look for, Jay, there's actually three things that I look for, and you checked every single box.

Laura Morton: One, do I like the person? Do I genuinely like them? Two, do I believe their message? Right? Because if the, the message isn't believable, if I don't believe it, your reader's not gonna buy it either, right? And three, the book has to put good in the world. Those are my three boxes. I can't say that's true for every publisher.

Laura Morton: But as a publisher, those are the three things that I really look for. And in fact, even as a co-author, those are the things that I look for.

Laura Morton: Um, but to me, writing the book is 10% of the work. It is. And you know, how much work was it for you to write your book?

Jay Schwedelson: Uh, I was, uh, I have to tell you something. Um, 'cause I was talking to our mutual friend Scott Miller the other day, and he goes, "Your second book, you're gonna do blah, blah, blah." I go, "Whoa." I was like, "Let's relax on that second book idea," 'cause this thing was way rougher than I thought it was gonna be. There is nothing more intimidating than staring at a blank screen and be like, "Now I'm gonna start writing a book."

Jay Schwedelson: I felt like the biggest fraud in the world. Is that normal?

Laura Morton: It's totally normal, and in fact, it's normal for-- I mean, I, as you know, I've worked with, you know, uh, billionaire founders, Bob Parsons, the founder of GoDaddy, Glenn Stearns, the founder of Stearns Lending, now Kind Lending, uh, Patty Arvielo, um, Dave Liniger, the founder of RE/MAX, and every single one of them have this sense of there's two things, and it's remarkable.

Laura Morton: Here you've had so much success in your world, right? And there, there is this notion of imposter syndrome. Like- Mm-hmm ... was I-- am I good or did I get lucky? And then the other piece of that is why would anybody care? Why would anybody want to read what I have to say? And funny enough, I actually deal with that quite a bit with my celebrity clients too.

Laura Morton: And you know, I just think that there's this idea, uh, writing a book is different than, you know, what you do every day in the role that you are as a marketing guru. Um, and you know what you know, and when it comes to stepping into a world that you don't know, you better surround yourself with all the right people because then you're just gonna get bad-- You know, in publishing, and, and I don't want to veer too far off from your question, but publishing right now, there's a lot of scams going on in the publishing world.

Laura Morton: And you know, a lot of Um, companies out there that, that are promising that they'll make you a bestseller, promising that they'll get this done for you, and, and they just don't deliver. And people are spending money, you know, hiring PR teams and, and marketing teams and, you know, trying to kite the, the list and the system, when in fact there really is no way to do that anymore.

Laura Morton: So it's really important that you surround yourself with the very, very best in the business who have a track record, who know what they're doing. Um, and that's how you start when you're writing a book, know that you've got a message that you can stand in, right? That's the most important thing. There's one you.

Laura Morton: What differentiates you from every other marketing book, Jay, is you.

Jay Schwedelson: Well, and I also think that's for people in general with their content, uh, whether they're writing a book or maybe they don't have a big enough platform to write a book. I think the you factor, the human factor, y- you know, is so important in, in what's going on now with AI and everything. And so let me ask you a question about AI, because I'll be honest with you, when AI really started coming, coming out, I said, "Books are screwed."

Jay Schwedelson: All you gotta do is, you know, upload John Grisham's latest book and say, "Now write me another one that's about a different thing," using his tone or whatever, and write me five John Grisham books. But it does... Is, is AI screwing the book market? Does AI have an impact on the book market? Does AI not matter?

Laura Morton: That's such a good question. I, I think that there are-- I think it's and both, right? Uh, you know, I think that, um, as a writer who writes nonfiction, and, you know, let's take your book, "Stupider People Have Done It," let's take that for example. You tell a wonderful story where the title came from. It was your grandfather.

Laura Morton: AI would never be able to tap into a story like that. There is a humanness in writing books that AI just does not have today. Do I think it's coming? Hard to say, because you can train a ChatGPT, you know, to, to learn your voice, but it still won't have that human connection. What we don't see right now is empathy.

Laura Morton: We don't see a lot of emotion. I can spot an AI-written piece a mile away. Just look for the em dashes, right? Look for the lists. There's always gonna be five bullet points

Jay Schwedelson: let me ask you a question about that. I don't mean to interrupt, but so, uh, so you have a... somebody that's writing, uh, you know, you, you, "Okay, great, you can be in my imprint. Uh, I can't wait to do... have your book, and we're gonna publish it," whatever. And then they hand you the first few chapters. Like, I had to send you, like, the first few that I wrote, and you had to tell me, well, this is going the right direction or the wrong direction.

Jay Schwedelson: And by the way, Laura's incredible 'cause she's in it, like, the whole way through, and you're like, "Okay, this is good, but lean in this direction, that direction." You gave me a lot of guidance. Do you ever get something from, like, an author that you're working with and you're like, "They didn't write this. This is AI.

Jay Schwedelson: This is garbage"?

Laura Morton: Well, I'm gonna tell you a great story. So there was a book that I, that I was brought on to do, and ultimately my schedule just didn't allow me to do it. So, um, somebody that I worked very closely with said, "Oh, you should, you know, go to this writer. He's written, you know, as many books as you have, if not more.

Laura Morton: And, uh, and I think that he, he's a good person to go to." He happened to be available. He said, "Yeah, I can do it." Um, and this is a great example of this. They turned, they turned in the first, uh, several, uh, chapters of the book, and now I knew this author. I had worked with this author. I knew her stories. And when I saw the chapters, there were, there were things in there that were not even her story.

Laura Morton: It was so bad and, and clearly so AI written. You know, there's a, there's a dryness and a flatness when, you know, everybody listening has used AI for something, right? And what we do if most people will use it, take it, go, "Oh, that's great. Now I can just put my voice on top of it," right? Well, when somebody hands you something that is so clearly not in the voice of the author that they're working with, you can spot it in a minute.

Laura Morton: This wasn't not only in the voice, this wasn't even her story. AI had the wrong story, wrong person, and it was, um, it was really disappointing, I will say. And, uh, and then to boot, this writer, and this goes back to what I was saying, this writer actually hired somebody else to do the work. So this person had never even met the author.

Laura Morton: And so he-- what he did is he farmed it out to a writer who just ChatGPT'd it. And so it happens all the time, but as a publisher and somebody who's been in the business, you know, uh, uh, for many, many years can spot that. Not only that, Grammarly can spot it. So your manuscript got ran through Grammarly, like we know if you use AI, and there's, there's the difference between Grammarly restructuring a sentence and Grammarly creating stories in your voice that aren't really your stories.

Laura Morton: And I think what's so important to understand is that there's a, there's a relationship capital that you build when you write a book and somebody takes the time to buy your book and read it, okay? They're putting trust in you that what you have to say is meaningful and purposeful and will have an impact.

Laura Morton: And in order for that to have the highest level of impact, it needs to be authentic. Anything less than that is, is, I think, damaging to your brand, and I think it's super damaging to the relationship that you're trying to create with your reader

Jay Schwedelson: and I think in general, what-- regardless of whether you're making a book or anything else out there, if you are just taking the output of AI and then you're submitting that as your piece of content, your website, your whatever, you know, to Laura's point, it's just flat. Everyone knows that you're just mailing it in, and it's not all that.

Jay Schwedelson: And I will tell you, you know, the book's coming out, my book's coming out And, but I've given, you know, uh, a couple copies to, you know, some people already, and it is, it is so... I, I can't even tell you the words. When you, when you hear that they're reading it, and they'll be like, "I'm on the subway, I've been reading it," or, "I've been...

Jay Schwedelson: You know, I, I, I skip my lunch hour and I read it," or, "I read it before I went to bed last night." It is the weirdest feeling in the world to think that somebody is there with this thing that you wrote and they're spending time with it. I- it is the strangest experience I've had, like, in my career. It's just not...

Jay Schwedelson: I don't know. You've done it so much, it's probably not that strange for you.

Laura Morton: Well, I have to tell you, two things I want to say about that, Jay, is there's-- I'm gonna use the w- use the word intimacy, right? There's an intimacy involved when somebody reads your story. So one, you're vulnerable in sharing that, right? So that's why you feel that way. But secondly, if you break the word intimacy down, it really breaks down to into me you see,

Jay Schwedelson: I like that.

Laura Morton: right?

Laura Morton: And so that's what, that's what, you know, for you and somebody who, who-- we were talking about this just before we, we started recording. You know, you have this sort of self-deprecating humor, but at the end of the day, that's what I'm talking about. AI will never, never, as far as I can tell, not today, certainly not hopefully while I'm writing books, be able to capture that.

Laura Morton: And I think that that's what, that's what a reader is looking for. Let me come into your world and see, right? And I think that's so important, and I th- and that to me is the difference between a book that connects and a book that doesn't connect. And we've all read things-- I was on a, I was on a webinar this morning about AI and writing, and the, and the, uh, moderator, the person who was speaking, in the first four minutes, he lost me.

Laura Morton: It just didn't-- It was, it was a word salad, right? And here he was talking about AI, and I thought, "This is a human talking to me, and he's lost me 'cause he's a word salad." And so, you know, I think that, that just finding those connectors and those hooks, and you do that so well in your book, that's something you should be really proud of.

Laura Morton: And, and I know it's strange, but the second part of your question, I want to say it never gets old. When I realize that something that I wrote, even if it's not my story, right, is having a positive impact on somebody else's life, that fills my bucket. It's why-- It's my why,

Jay Schwedelson: Yeah. Well, I will tell you, yeah, I mean, one of the things I, and you know this, I was adamant with the book, was that all the net author proceeds are going to the V Foundation for Cancer Research, 'cause I felt, uh, maybe it's imposter syndrome or whatever, I'm like, "This is gonna be a waste of people's money.

Jay Schwedelson: I don't feel right about that. I need to make sure it's doing real good, and that's why it's gonna go, you know, kick cancer's butt." And so part of that, though, you told me, you said, "Listen, if you really want this thing to circulate, you wanna make this big donation, you need to get a lot of pre-orders," 'cause pre-orders really- Help to launch the whole thing, which I-- now I'm jumping up and down.

Jay Schwedelson: Everyone pre-order it so we could, you know, kick cancer's butt. But why do pre-orders with books matter?

Laura Morton: Oh, in today's market, 4 million books coming to market, all right? As a retailer, you don't have room for 4 million books, right? So you have to look at, like, what is there already a demand for? A lot of people chase pre-orders because they're chasing, you know, bestseller status, right? That's not you. You, you really are trying to raise money for cancer, and be-- bestseller status, build it and they will come, right?

Laura Morton: So, but in, in today's world, you have retailers that have to make a lot of very hard decisions. So if they see that there's an interest in a book, especially from a first-time author, somebody that may not be a household name, that gets their attention. And that algorithm, you know, we live in an Amazon world, that algorithm that pushes you up so that if somebody's searching for a book on marketing or life advice or whatever category your book is in, we want your book rising up.

Laura Morton: Sales will push you up in that regard. In, in the case of like Barnes & Noble, if you don't have any pre-orders at Barnes & Noble now, especially as a first-time author, and even as authors who have had books previously, no pre-orders, no shelf space. They just don't have the room. So if somebody is, is going to pre-order your book, it's important that they go to Barnes & Noble and Books-A-Million and, you know, yes, they can go to Amazon.

Laura Morton: Eighty-plus percent of books are bought on Amazon today. When's the last time you were in a Barnes & Noble, right? But it's really important that we keep-- The independent bookseller is so important in the world of publishing today, those mom-and-pop stores, and, and The New York Times evaluates that, right?

Laura Morton: That's also a big piece of the equation. And I, as somebody who's been in publishing for as long as I've been in publishing, I really support the independent bookseller. I really support the small businesses, and I think it's, it's important that we don't let them fall to the wayside. And, and because I think a lot of people right now, um Are getting very frustrated with companies like Amazon, and they're turning away and they're, and they're going to other retailers, and they are supporting their local bookseller, and I think that's really important.

Laura Morton: All of it matters, but pre-orders in particular are what set you apart so that when Barnes & Noble is making an order, when Books-A-Million is making an order, even when Amazon is making an order, they're looking at what kind of interest is in the book. So anybody listening to this podcast today could do Jay the biggest favor, and me as his publisher, and go and pre-order Jay's book.

Laura Morton: It, it is the kindest thing you can do. It's a, you know, it, it's all-- It makes a great gift for graduation. It makes a wonderful gift for anybody that, you know, is thinking about becoming an entrepreneur, that is in business already. Uh, it, it's a small gesture that has the biggest payoff.

Jay Schwedelson: Well, I appreciate that. And everybody should go and... We're gonna put Laura's information, all her contact stuff in the show notes. You could find Laura Morton obviously on LinkedIn, uh, all over the place. And her imprint, Lasega Books, L-A-S-E-G-A Books, they've just been an incredible publisher to work with.

Jay Schwedelson: I, I mean, guided me through the whole thing. I am borderline illiterate, so that's what they were starting out with here, and it's just been, it's been a fun ride. It really has. And Laura, anything else you wanna share with the world about finding you, connecting with you? I just can't say enough good things about you.

Laura Morton: Well, I really appreciate that. Um, yeah, I mean, you know, I'm always looking-- Look, the reason why I started my imprint is because I, I know the business from the ground up. I was a writer who, who always got the short shrift when it came to publishing, right? And, you know, writers are remarkably undervalued in the world of publishing.

Laura Morton: And so I know the business from, from the very beginning of the process, which is inception, which we helped you with, right? Through the writing process, through the editorial process, getting the book ready to get shipped out into the bookstores, and then what? Then what are we doing? And I know the business all the way through marketing, and we have a wonderful partner in our friend, our mutual friend, Scott Miller, who, who, who brought us together.

Laura Morton: Um, and I think it's so important that you have somebody-- If you are thinking about writing a book, ask the person you're talking to how many books they've written,

Jay Schwedelson: And

Laura Morton: most of them have written no books,

Jay Schwedelson: how many of them are New York Times bestsellers? I

Laura Morton: Right, and how many are New York Times bestsellers? So I understand the business all the way through.

Laura Morton: So I really, I started my imprint, Jay As a, really as a give back, because there's so much good content out there. To get a deal at the big h- at the Big Five today is really hard, right? They really look at your platform. What are your numbers? They, they just wanna know what your social media following is.

Laura Morton: They'll read your marketing plan before they'll read your book. It doesn't matter. If you have-- If they know that you're gonna help sell books in a big way, it almost doesn't matter what's in between the cover. I, I think that that's not the right approach, and I think there's a lot of great content, there's a lot of good ideas, and so I look for writers that have a little bit of both that we can cultivate.

Laura Morton: And Scott, you know, I know is talking about a second book, but that's the idea, right? Let's build something together. You have this foundational piece, and if you decide you wanna do a second book, I hope you'll decide you'll do it with me. But if not, that-- If you don't wanna do another book, I get that, too.

Laura Morton: But I think it's just really important. But early on in this conversation, I had mentioned that writing the book is 10% of the work. What you do with it is the other 90%. And for most people, and I wanna make this point before we sign off, w- writing a book likely is not going to be where your revenue comes from, okay?

Laura Morton: Selling the book, that's a piece of it. But what is the book promoting? What is the book doing for you? How are you using the book as a marketing tool? How many speeches do you do right now where you haven't had a book, right? If you wanna get into speaking, a book is the most important piece of the equation.

Laura Morton: So you really have to think about how a book can help market whatever it is your business is. How can a book serve that? And that's the first question I ask any author: How is this book serving your reader, and how is it serving you? And if we can figure that out, we dream backwards to figure out how to make that happen.

Jay Schwedelson: I love it. So true, and that is what you asked me, and you've been guiding me the whole way. So everybody connect with Laura, and if you get a chance, buy Stupider People Have Done It: We're Gonna Kick Cancer's Butt, coming out June 9th, but you can order it now on Barnes & Noble, Amazon, anywhere. Laura, thank you for everything, and thank you for being on the show.

Laura Morton: Thanks, Jay, and thank you so much for being a part of the Lasega Books family

Jay Schwedelson: Absolutely.