So many wannabe podcasters say, I'm going to start a podcast, I want to monetize and I'm going to use advertising.

And while that's a thing, I have some new information that may change your mind about that strategy.

Welcome to profit from your podcast Proven strategies to turn listeners into a livelihood.

Here's your host, Dave Jackson.

I was listening to my buddy Rob Walsh from Podcast 411 on episode number 241 where he interviewed Dan Granger, who is the CEO of Oxford Road.

And Oxford Road is basically an ad agency, a huge one, by the way.

And Dan is also the host of the Media Roundtable podcast.

I'll put a link in the show notes so you can listen to.

The whole thing was actually really good, but this is the one that jumped out at me where Rob is asking him, so how many downloads do you need to get a sponsor podcast?

411.com listen different per host Read.

What level of downloads per episode do you see advertisers willing to go down to?

At one point it was anything, and then it went to 5k and 10k and 20k.

When you see advertisers today, what are they looking for for a minimum for a show?

And I, and I know it does vary if it's a female audience versus a mixed audience, but typically, yeah, I

mean, listen, I think when you're under 50,000 impressions an episode, it's hard to get people to pay attention.

That's the reality.

And are there brands that'll really take the time to evaluate the long tail and go down to the 2010 and five?

Yeah, they're out there, but fewer and fewer.

And for better or for worse, you know, I think that a lot of the momentum in this business is shifting toward more of a winner take all model.

I'm not saying that's a good thing, but when you have an industry that has gone, you know, past the billion dollar mark and now we're talking billions of dollars in revenue, you're talking about a lot of institutional capital.

Like it favors the 8020 rule starts to apply.

Now, I think we're trying to champion that long tail as best we can, but there is an equation somewhere where you have to say, well, how much time can you spend in your day procuring managing an authentic relationship with a host who falls below a certain threshold?

I know that that's always been the issue.

I mean, it takes you just as much time to find the time codes and listen and make sure they've done the host read right For a show that's 150 versus a show that's 15,000, you're doing 10 times the work just to get to 150 with, you know, the 50 shows.

And I get that.

Now let's clarify.

We're talking about a big sponsor sponsoring your show.

And I used to tell people, I remember what I used to tell people, 5,000, and then it was 10,000, and now it's 20, and now it's 50,000 per episode.

And so to say that less than 5% of podcasts get that kind of download, that's pretty accurate.

And it's not that advertising isn't going to work.

It's that big sponsor.

And so for that, I want to point you at Ray Arnott over at around the Layout Dot Com.

Now, Ray, he does a very niche show for model railroads and he partners.

That's the key.

He calls his sponsors partners because he works with them, alongside them, and they both together come together on how can we Promote each Other.

It's a true partnership.

Now, that idea comes from the book sponsor Magnet by Justin Moore.

And so here again, I'm not saying that you'll never be big enough to get sponsors.

I am saying I believe in my honest opinion.

I always love when people say that, like, as opposed to in my dishonest opinion, where I'm going to lie through my teeth.

In my honest opinion.

I think that's the way to go.

If you want to do advertising, don't look at as advertising.

Look at it as a partnership.

I truly believe the way things are gonna be going in the future, because advertising, the pricing for the programmatic ads, the Geicos and the progressives and all that, you know, those prices I believe are going down.

Where you see people that are like, you can make money.

From day one.

I did some calculations on a campaign I was running and I was making somewhere around less than $5 per 1,000 downloads.

And that just does not work for most people.

And as Dan said, it might be that, you know, the rich are going to get richer here.

So I'm here not to again squish your dreams, but just saying to when your show is smaller, when you do get 5,000 downloads, then start looking for a sponsorship.

And I'll put a link out in the show notes to Justin's book, because it is all about partnerships.

Where my book Profit from youm Podcast is about, you know, the seven different ways you can make money with your podcast.

Justin's book is amazing.

And after I read it, I was like, I want to rewrite my part of that part of my book about this is he just has a better strategy.

This is all available out at Profit from your podcast dot com.

Thanks for tuning in.