Tommy: My point is always, you know, let's focus on things that we have in
common because in general, this is, this is very unfortunate part of a
discourse these days, that people seems to be focusing on this little thing that
we disagree and let's fight over the.
But there's like all these things that we agree on.
Danny: This week, I'm talking to Tommy, Serafinski, host of Tommy's
Outdoors, a show that talks about biodiversity, conservation, hunting
and fishinh, rewilding, and much more.
And they're all interconnected topics, which we'll definitely
get into on the episodes.
So Tommy, welcome to the show.
How about you tell the listeners about yourself and your podcast.
Tommy: Hey, Danny.
And Hey everybody.
Thanks for opportunity to be on your podcast.
Yeah.
So like you said Tommy cell doors we are focusing on human wildlife interactions,
human wildlife, conflict, conservation, hunting, and fishing rewilding.
You know, our relation with nature, I will human relationship with nature.
That's.
You know, it was like a long-winded maybe not long, but there was a you
know, we, we arrived at this of this format of the show and that the subject
of a show from, you know, the original idea, which was dedicated to everything
outdoors, but it was like, you know, a little bit of experimenting involved
into how the show going to look like and what it's going to evolve into.
You know, like, like, like we spoke a little bit earlier in one of the.
Guests on one of the podcasts.
You said that, you know, this, this podcast is like
my complicated hobby, right?
Because I have a, my day job.
So I didn't come up with a, you know, like a business plan or anything,
and this is going to be a show.
And like this, this, this, it was, it was a kind of organic born out of my,
you know, like a labor of love, really.
I was doing what I, what I liked and I'm sure we can get into more details
of the story, how it came to be.
But yeah, long story short, this is a podcast about the
human wildlife interface.
And I think that the how I see the, the, the, the unique part of the show is that
I talk with sort of two sides of the story always because you know, something
I didn't know, and something I actually learned more about when I was doing a
podcast was that around conservation and, and, you know, environmental.
There is incredible amount of conflict and, you know, opposing views, which
I, as I wasn't aware of that, you know, I came kind of naive to that.
It's like, oh, conservation, we want to protect nature in
animals who wouldn't want that.
Right there just everybody's on the same page.
Right.
And not necessarily it's and the complexity of the subjects and,
and all the, you know, little points and little points of view.
And actually, you know, when you listen to people, everybody's right.
So I think that the big thing for me is that I talked both with
hunters and anglers and I talk with environmentalist and I talk with people
if you are in, you know, in NGOs.
And I talk with you know, for example, lady who works in seal rescue sanctuary.
And then I talk with a trawler man who, you know, so one lady focuses her.
Work and time on helping seals and rehabilitating seals and so on.
And then on the next episode, I have a trawler man who goes like, oh shoot.
Right.
And, and, and yeah, you know, I always say that it's just huge advantage for me,
that people will have different points of view listening to my podcasts, because
I say like, if even, you know, after all these, you know, a hundred, however
many episodes right now, even one person says, wow, I never thought about that.
Right.
That's my job done.
That's that's a success that, that the present different points of view.
So I, I think this is definitely the direction that I, that I'm
taking to the show which is.
Not easy on occasions because you have people, you know, I sometimes
feel like with every episode, there's like a half of my audience gets upset
with me, you know, but this is, my idea is like the weekend only make
progress by talking to each other and presenting each other points of view.
And you know, if you did disagree with something, that's okay.
I often disagree with my guests on stuff, but it's not my job to
challenge them or convince them.
But sort of give a platform to present their point of view.
And then I have somebody else present different point of.
And we can have these conversations.
So that's that's, I think like the big thing for me with my, and
Danny: you'd mentioned that you've got a a hundred plus episodes
actually premiered back in 2016 on my birthday month from October, 2016.
What were your goals for at that time with cause it's very different
from your day job, obviously.
That's what we're speaking about in the green room before the episode, but
what were your goals for, and how's that evolved since that first step?
Tommy: Yeah.
I can maybe back out even, even even further before I had a podcast, right.
It's a podcast they're stories.
So reading my stories, like I started with a blog and, you
know, as an, as an outdoorsman I was originally an angler, right.
Angling was my thing.
Or like you know, recreational fishing rather than like.
And that was, you know, these were times before Facebooks and all those things.
And there was a time where people have these bulit in boards, this messaging
forums, and we have it like an angling forum in Poland back in the days.
And we were posting photos and all that stuff.
And it was like a photo manager called Picasa, which was sadly killed by.
I still think that this, this was the best photo manager ever, ever,
like me even Lightroom not comes close because it was so lightweight.
And because I had this button on the bottom says blog list.
I didn't even know what is like, what, what is this, what it is?
I don't know where the blog is.
Right.
So I clicked it and it's like, oh, it's set up on your site.
I was like, oh, cool.
So that's how I started my blog.
And I started blogging, you know, The always idea was that I wasn't blogging
like on the regular intervals or anything, but it was like, if something interesting
happened, I was writing a blog, post posting photos and you know, it was cool.
So I was doing that for more than over 10 years.
And in the meantime, I, I moved to Ireland.
You know, I, it was like whole new fishing opportunities here,
you know, fishing in the ocean.
And then, you know, I get the little.
Disposable income, I guess.
So I know went to Africa and there was doing some expensive fishing
trips and that was also fun and that was putting up posts and all that.
But because I never want to, you know, I'm like, oh, I went fishing and I caught
three baths and then like, oh, I was fishing and I would call it one bass.
Like I there's always has to be something new, some different angles on it.
So naturally after 10 plus years, it, it kind of died.
It was, you know, so I stopped posting.
It was like nothing, nothing new and interesting on it.
But I enjoyed this, this thing.
I, I enjoy interactions with people.
I enjoy sharing my experiences in the outdoors.
And so, you know, I thought like, well, first of all, it would be cool to
have to do it in the English language.
Just to reach the wider audience and maybe being, you know,
more, more local and also.
Because, you know, English is obviously not my first language
speaking is easier than writing.
So podcasts was a natural choice.
I got let's do it.
So that's how it started.
And the actually little known fact is that they had a podcast in Polish
language, which just started only just to learn stuff, just to figure out
how that this podcasting thing works.
Because I, you know, I knew as much about podcasting, as I knew about
blogging back then clicking that button.
So I, I probably recorded like a 20 episodes of a podcast in Polish language.
Kind of like in parlor later on, maybe when I was on episode 10 or 15,
I started this podcast, Tommy cell doors, where it was initially you know,
again, irregular episodes and probably since episode six or seven, I kind of
committed to schedule every two weeks.
And man, it's like four years now.
I haven't missed the one.
So that's a, that's a little achiever.
So, yeah, that's that's, that was the start of of that whole endeavor.
Danny: And that's something that takes a lot of, well, you know, yourself, it
takes a lot of commitment to keep going.
You know, obviously you moved from the blog cause I was getting less
enjoyable if you like to the podcast.
So, you know, I know how long it, how much effort goes into that.
So kudos, not like five years, four or five years on it.
It's amazing.
And you mentioned obviously one of the things that I enjoyed about your show,
and I'm glad you mentioned it earlier.
Your role isn't to offer a definitive.
Your role as the host and your guests to bring them on is to educate and let people
and let the listeners make their own minds up based on your guests and what the
bra and an absolute, I, I really enjoyed one of the episodes I really enjoyed was
your most recent one fallen off where with mark, I think mark Boyden who was
speaking about, you know conservation and, and going back to your conversation
about, you know, the different viewpoints where everybody's actually right,
when it comes to conversation, and you mentioned that he changed your with.
Which is kinda cool.
And so, so what's, what would you say has been the biggest example of
someone changing your mind or making you think of that a different way from
how you had been prior to an episode
Tommy: being recorded?
Oh, it's a, it's an interesting question.
You know, it's, so I put you this way.
I, I learned something in every episode and especially that.
You know I I'm, I'm not the ecologist, I'm not the, you know, I don't
have a formal education in, in you know, wildlife or conservation or
environment, anything like that.
I'm a computer guy, right?
Like simplistically speaking.
So I learn so much that.
You know, and you notice this, you record the episode and you present
while you're recording an episode, but you're not present because you
also a sound engineer and you're looking at all the different things.
Right.
And then you editing the episode and you, and you're listening to the
second time and you pick up on the new things that you haven't heard before.
And then, you know, you're listening for the third time or fourth time,
once it's published as like, oh, I T.
You know, quite often, it's not even a matter of changing my mind as if we're
like, whoa, I never knew about that.
You know?
And you know, in, in Kings of mark, it was interesting because
he kind of changed the way.
How I plan the, the episode, because, you know, like in this
case, you know, fish farms and Saman farming is like a known bad guy.
So I was expecting him going, digging, you know, like all guns blazing.
And, and he shut it down completely.
It's like, well, we, you know, this is not our business.
We have no official opinion on it.
We'd focusing on something else.
Right.
And it was surprising initially, but then it was like, yeah, that's actually.
You know, refreshing because like, if everybody, you know, has like goals, all
guns blazing, then there is no other way.
And he actually, you know, he said like, yeah, I'm well aware of many
things, but we, we purposefully taking this way and the same wasn't with a
episode with sea rescue on other ones, there's two, one suicide Tewari wants
to see a rescue island where the lady.
Very, this is what we do, and this is what we're going to talk about.
And not there is in many other subjects, but we are focusing on this and I always
appreciate this, you know, clear mission.
This is what we do, and we not getting bogged down by, you know, various other.
I probably didn't answer your question, but anyway,
Danny: no, no, no, I it's.
It's interesting because to your point it's not black and white, you know, I
always, I grew up thinking that, you know any kind of, not any kind of hunter, not
strong, but and it kind of controls you like was, was bad, but then you'd realize,
well, if I sell and a past is lit.
Uncontrolled that can cause other ecological damage.
And so you, you start to learn as you get older and you start to educate
yourself more than listen to people like yourself and your guests you'll
learn more, which I see your point.
I think it's, it's important that we keep our minds open.
Not just what our third belief is.
Cause that's not, not always the right one.
Tommy: Exactly.
Exactly.
This is so new and so complex.
So, you know, anyone who says like, yeah, this is this way.
It's like, whoa.
Danny: Yeah.
And I know that that's something that I want to speak about because obviously
one of the topics you cover is hunting and this can often result in a negative
connotation from animal lovers or animal rights groups, et cetera.
Is that difficult or do you find it a difficult topic?
Cause you mentioned that you're back in Poland, you were fishing and hunting.
Do you find that sometimes a difficult topic to try and educate
on or what what's your feeling?
Tommy: Look, there was quite a few episodes both already published in, in,
in the pipeline taking on that subject.
And it, again, it's, it's very complex.
My, my, my main thing is like, we cannot try to educate people forcefully.
So if someone has already predetermined point of view and is not open.
To revising their view right there.
They're not going to change their view.
Right?
So this is like an old military thing that you'd not attacking
45 45 positions because that's where they are expecting attack.
Right.
So if, if, if you dealing with animal lover or, you know, ethical V.
You know, there is no point going like hunting is actually very good and hunting
is conservation and go educate yourself.
This is absolutely not the way to go.
So my point is always, you know, let's focus on things that we have in common
because in general, this is, this is very unfortunate part of a discourse
these days, that people seems to be focusing on this little thing that we
disagree and let's fight over that.
But there's like all these things that we agree on.
So, you know this is where I'm trying to focus on what are the common
parts where we can agree on some.
We can, we can agree on something.
And if it, if then happens that, you know, I had the many
scientists where a hunters, right.
Or who are anglers.
Okay.
Th th the subject was completely not about that.
And they say, oh, you know, by the way, I'm also an angler.
I was like, oh, I didn't know.
Right.
And I can share a review in with the, with the listeners, a story from my, from
my own podcast where it was one of the first episodes of the podcast, but that
was recording with it with a lovely lady.
And we were talking about she was in her late fifties, early sixties, I think.
And we, we talked about.
You know, connection with nature and how you, you know, growing your own
vegetables and how great it is for your mental health and all that stuff.
Right.
And I didn't know any better.
And I said like, yeah, exactly.
It's the same with the hunters.
They have this connection with their food and they can, and I can see like
she stiffens up and she goes like, Again, hunting and like, and she's
kind of rattles off these, these things that she clearly heard somewhere.
Right.
I go hunting with dogs and like, clearly she doesn't know
anything about hunting with dogs.
Right.
But she knows that she is against that because they write some, okay.
You know, we, we didn't even, we move on to the next subject that.
Talking about the other things.
And we finished the podcast and I did, when we finished, I actually said,
oh yeah, Tommy, great conversation.
You're in my tribe.
We understand each other, but that's it.
We move on right.
Next time.
Next time, the subject of hunting comes up, that lady will
have in the back of her head.
Oh, I actually know one guy who was actually good guy and we have so much
in common and he's a hunter, right.
And this is the way how you change.
People attitude and people, you know, you're not trying to force
something down their throat.
Is it like, okay, like, what is that makes you take right.
Connection with nature growing vegetables.
Great.
It's fantastic.
Right.
So this is, this is my, this is, this is how I approach this, this.
And, but that doesn't mean that I, you know, I have an episode that
are straight up hunting, right?
Sweden is hunting is one of them.
I had a hunter on the podcast and we, you know, dive deep and very geeky
about hunting and you know, what calibers and what, you know, what you
do and how you do all these things.
Sure.
But then because you know, some part of my audience will not listen to
that episode, but maybe somewhere.
And they, you know, and they pick up stuffers.
They're like, oh, okay.
So that actually is a big culture.
And actually everybody in Sweden, you know, 90% is okay with hunting
and actually this is how it goes, and this is how it's managed that way.
So I am not like not finding that difficult per se because
I'm not trying to force anything.
I'm trying to be natural with, with what I do and who I see.
And that
Danny: ties me into a recent episode as well.
I think it was maybe six or eight episodes ago with Ellucian, Alyssa, Mike,
Robert the communication professional, but who's also using storytelling
and communication to educate and help educate and goes back to your point there
about, it's not about force and views.
Dan it's about communicate them use and letting people understand, you know,
from mine, what I liked about the app.
So it's obviously Lucy is awesome at doing that and get them.
What can be difficult topics across wow.
Because of her approach.
But what I also found interesting about that episode, then it goes back to your
point earlier about us being very minute on what we choose to attack and what we
choose to go after is social media and its impact on mental health and, and how
social is really, you know, distracting all the good work that can be done and all
the educational stuff that can be done.
And I wonder because of the topics that your show is on a boat.
Some of your listeners, won't listen to a hunt and stuff, somewhat
lesson about the more ecological stuff or whatever, because of that.
Have you ever been attacked or chilled online or here's your gas shared examples?
Because all they've been trying to do is educate, but then you've
got the very tunnel vision people coming after you or coming after
Tommy: them.
Honestly.
No, and I think that.
A lot of people that, you know, like I think that just listeners or
followers or viewers whoever they are, who have this tunnel vision and not
enjoying these, this type of content, they probably drop off quite quickly.
So, and, and on, on many occasions I had I'm trying to think about negative.
Like I can only really think about one, right?
So, so let, let me, let me qualify.
For sure.
I had a comments like, oh, I disagree with your guests on this and that.
Right.
I listened to the podcast and I think that these guests, you know, I agree
with part of it, but here on here, you know, I did disagree or that,
that, that, that obviously happened.
But one that was probably the most like Ron Thompson, the,
the, the he was he's a rain.
Or he was a ranger in the, in, in African one of the biggest game reserve in Africa.
And, you know, he, he, he, he got himself in a, in the BBC
show with Pierce Pierce broth.
And what's the business more guy.
He's Morgan.
Yeah.
They, they, they kick him out from one show and then they'll
really follow these things.
You can tell.
So, you know, he, he get on the show with him and he gets a lot of heat,
a lot of hate and like, oh, you know, he killed like 5,000 elephants and
you know, like, well, yeah, but that was like a two year long plan, the
government operation of elephant call.
And he was leading that operation.
Right.
So, so people with complete no clothes, like how it happens, that
Rangers didn't, you know, arrest him like, dude, he was the ranger.
He was leaving.
That operation, there was avatar built the process meat of those elephants.
Right.
But people go like, so I had, I had him on the podcast and, and, and,
you know, obviously he, he got a lot of abuse online and otherwise,
so obviously he, he also that, you know, leaves the mark on personality.
Right.
If you constantly attack, then you maybe, you know, have everybody
have their own way of dealing with.
But it was a lovely episode.
He comes across as very knowledgeable nice guy.
And, and that was one episode when I got like comments on Facebook,
death threats, you know, how dare you talking to this guy?
You know, it reflects badly on you and on your show and all these,
but that happened only once.
And I think that because he got such a huge negative publicity, There was
kind of like a fallback of of, of that.
But, you know, I, that's fine.
I'm not particularly bothered, you know, I, you know, I would never not
talk to someone on their part because I would like, I like to talk to, because
you know, someone might not like it or they might, you know, I don't care
if you don't like, then don't listen or unsubscribe, you know, like I said,
it's, it's a very comfortable position.
I admit, because like I said, this is my complicated hobby.
And so I don't care if I have a hundred followers, I do care.
Right.
Don't get me wrong.
Like all my followers are very valued and folks, thank you for listening
to this podcast and my podcast.
But if someone, you know, doesn't enjoy it or doesn't even like, okay, that's fine.
I'm not, I'm not going to lose sleep over that.
So I, I absolutely will talk to anyone.
I feel like it's interesting and can contribute to the conversation
Danny: and to make sense.
It's like I'm, and again, it goes back to why I enjoy the short.
So it's very varied topics and I'm only getting really dug into it.
And I have less than maybe 10 or 12 episodes.
I've got a huge back catalog to go through, but so far
I'm really enjoying it.
And so you mentioned our load as well.
You're originally from Poland, but now you're in Ireland.
What, what have you found has been different from the culture around.
Between the two countries and maybe how the approach, you know, say hunter
and ecological stuff, et cetera.
What's the differences there.
Tommy: First of all, I don't think I can truly answer that question because in
Poland, I was very much city boy, right.
Born and raised in the city.
Finished university in the city first, you know, five, 10 years of my career
was in the , which was at the time, the biggest, second biggest city in
Poland after fall following communism, they, there was, there was, you
know, changes and but then I moved to Warsaw, you know, obviously we're so
big, big city you know, technology.
So I was, I was always, you know, the, the, the biggest contact with nature
in Poland was we had like a summer.
And I call it summer house because it wasn't really suitable to spend
winter like a Polish winter in it.
But we always try to spend, you know, like a three, four months of the, of summer
in that house, it was in the rural areas.
And so obviously as a kid, I had holidays to two months of of, of vacations.
And then I had an option to work remotely, you know, one of the, one of
the benefits of computer industry and.
Oh, it was early two thousands.
I was already working remotely.
So like more time was spending there.
So I enjoyed that and I was doing fishing.
I was going on holidays and there was like in a pond or something.
We were, we went out fishing, but mostly I was a city guy, city boy,
when I moved to Ireland, I, first of all, I moved to the rural area.
You know, the county Kerry where I'm based, it's called like a holiday camp.
You know, tourism and farming and, and, you know, and there was even when
I was looking at, you know, to accept an offer of, of job in Ireland, you
know, I, I, I look up where it is.
I was like, wow, is it ocean and mountains?
You know, and everything in one place, like in Poland, you need to drive
the whole day to, you know, to be in the mountains or, or go to the sea.
So I go like, yeah, I'm there.
I came here and it was like a, truly this open, this there's there's doors.
But to answer your question, I think that Ireland is so fantastically
accessible in terms of outdoor activities.
You know, whether it's cycling, whether it's golfing, even whether
it's hunting or fishing, it's so much more accessible to try have an impact.
So I enjoyed that and I think that gives me opportunity to try many
different things and, you know, pick and choose the ones that I like.
You know, I think, again, especially in the area where I live there
is not that densely populated.
You know, there's no big cities, there's no big crowds, there's relative
easy access to, you know fishing, hunting, golfing, cycling, you name it.
So that's why.
Other thing is that definitely is something that I didn't realize at first.
But then as, as I was doing the podcast and I was talking to members of
environmental NGOs and so on, I realized how depleted the nature isn't that.
It's very, very, there's like almost nothing left compared to Poland where
we're in and in general, you know, there's, there's one other episode
where I also discussed that with, with one of the scientists that you
know, that the further east you move in Europe, the nature is richer.
There's more left if you like, because the industrialization and.
Kind of, you know, lagging a little bit and that left more space for wildlife.
So I think that the part of that is that the Poland is on the, on the
east of Europe, but also is bigger.
It's it's not so farming heavy.
So that's another thing coming from the perspective of.
You know human wildlife interactions.
And, and this is like this interesting thing, because, you know, when I, when
I was starting the podcast, like I said, it was, you know, the tagline was
dedicated to everything outdoors when I was, you know, trying different things.
And I had an episode was about running and cycling and, you
know, sailing all these stuff.
And then over time, it kind of morphed into like, okay, I think that.
Human wildlife interactions is that this is that area.
This is that niche.
If you like this really interesting.
And there is a lot to talk about here and there's a lot to educate people.
There's a lot to do and a lot to learn to that.
And then, you know, from that perspective, I went on and saying,
oh, okay, I see what's going on.
So I think that on the one hand, Ireland has much, is much more accessible.
It's easier to start, you know, either hunting or fishing or
any other outdoor activity.
On the other hand, if you're a wildlife lover or would like to see biodiversity?
Well, this is really far behind.
Danny: We hop over the channel and get a gala photo.
Then we'd mentioned obviously earlier, you'd said that the
show is in its fifth year.
And it's, it's evolved, you know, fourth, I think fourth year.
So it's evolved quite a bit from its original inception.
What, what's the goals?
What's the plans for the future of Tommy's outdoors?
Are you going to continue with a format as it is now, would you,
would you look to get back into and Parson, Ricard and what's your.
Tommy: Yeah, look, this is what we, I think says earlier in the green
room that, you know, I started with a lot of in-person and recording.
I was traveling and it was, you know, the part of the gig that I was packing
all my gear and going to meet the guests and all that, you know obviously because
of COVID and all these things you know, is a hundred percent remote right now.
I think like last year I recorded one episode 99.
Was it in person with a, with an old hunter and white folder who
lives nearby was great, you know, great talk to him and, and you know,
do like a woman person recording.
But to answer your question, I am not under pressure, so I'm not looking on the
revolution it's evolution and they think of the show is evolving all the time.
And a lot of this evolution is driven by.
You know what I observe, what is, what is happening?
And, and, you know, there, there are, there are opportunities that I didn't
envisage when I was starting a show.
Right.
So for example, the research institutions, research projects,
reaching out and saying, Hey, would you like to talk about our project?
Right.
We have a scientist to talk about it.
So that's great.
That, that, that, that, you know, like a scientific community
have an interest in this.
And this is like, I think there's also like a substantial portion of my Audience
are, are, you know, people from academia.
So that's one thing.
The other thing is that also increasingly the publishers are reaching out and,
and, you know, want to talk about you know, either one when the author
of the book interviewed or, or, or, you know, they, which is also very
interesting because then, you know, I kind of, it goes on my radar.
You know, who does what and, and interesting people.
And so-and-so, so I enjoy these things as well, but I think that the overall
the trajectory I'm on going to stay or so, you know, obviously like every
podcast I would like to grow my audience, I would like to have a bigger reach,
bigger, and like all these things.
But there are not, not particularly specific to Tommy Salvador's.
I definitely would like to develop further the.
Platform as a, as a platform for conversation as a platform for
presenting different points of view.
And, you know, having said that I'm not hiding my points of view, right?
Like I'm a hunter and angler, right?
That's, that's, that's one thing.
But I also agree with a lot of things that, you know, that hunters wouldn't
be particularly happy me saying.
And I agree with a lot of things that rewilding, for example, Suggests and,
you know, I, I love the, I love the idea.
I appreciate all the problems.
I appreciate all the difficulties, but in general idea, I liked the idea.
So maybe you know, I could lead by example and sort of say, Hey, people
come and listen to Tommy cell doors.
Even if you look at the title of the episode and you see like, you know, like
an African big game hunting, Listening, you know, you're driving somewhere or
you're doing your yard work, put it on.
Listen, you might find something interesting or at least this is going to
open your, your, your minds a little bit.
So this is definitely my goal to continue on that trajectory and position, the
key positioning Tommy's outdoors as a platform for conversation where, you
know, everybody has an opportunity to present their own point of view.
And I think we need that because.
A lot of conversation on these subjects that are happening on social media, on
the Facebooks and Twitters of this world.
And these are just not the mediums for discussion.
Is it like, right?
But if you can sit with someone and you can have, you know, hour or two hours
to, to really trash it up, And dig and ask followup questions and like,
di did I understood you correctly?
Right?
And then those people are also not limited to the 300 heart characters limit.
They can actually, you know, at the vans, their, their, their
thoughts properly, that changes the way of conversation tremendously.
And, and, and this is what I look forward to, to do in, you know, And I think
Danny: you've definitely sat the shop for that.
Like, like I've mentioned Ellen and I keep mentioning that one of the reasons I
do seriously enjoy your show is the fact that anybody can come on and you allow
them to come on and converse with you.
And you converse with them on very different points of view.
And it allows listeners to really knock away.
Get different viewpoints to really make an educated decision on something
that it's not, it's something that we don't have enough off.
I think so, so kudos to you for that.
Yeah.
So Tommy I've really enjoyed chatting with you and I could have a far longer life.
So remember we have our revisit, like a season five revisit or something for
people that want to connect with you online and, you know, chat with you.
You mentioned they can connect and you can have HR with their viewpoints, et cetera.
Where's the best place for them to find you online.
Tommy: Sure the best place is to go to Tommy cell doors.com.
This is my website.
This is my blog, also any, and all podcasting platforms, people who listen
to podcasts, they know they have their, you know, weapon of choice for podcasting.
So I don't have to tell you that, but Tommy's outdoors.com definitely
going there and explore the page.
There's a search box.
And there are occasional blogs in there.
There are videos on my YouTube channel, which are not necessarily like a podcast
version of video, but like a short videos.
I enjoy, you know, doing like short, short form videos as well.
Explore that page.
There's a, there's a download page.
There is a recommendation for Christmas books at the moment.
So definitely Tommy Salvador's dot com is the best place.
There's also a contact form.
So by all means, if you want to, if you want to get in touch, hit
the about and under about section.
There's a few words about me and the contact form.
So Tommy doors.com.
From there, you will find me in any and all platforms that you may enjoy.
Danny: And I can recommend that.
Cause I got lost in a rabbit hole when I visited your site and it was an awesome
rabbit hole, finding all of these different categories, subcategories
videos, book recommendations.
That was awesome.
I spent quite an enjoyable period of time.
And so I will leave the link to Tommy's website in the show notes.
So you'll listen on your favorite app, make sure to check the show notes
and you can get the link there, but I would recommend normal wasn't today.
Just check out the websites vertical.
So tell me again, thank you for the PLN.
And I'm looking forward to the listeners, you know, learn from your
chat
Tommy: today, Danny.
Thank you very much.
Thanks for the opportunity and all the best.