256 – I’m Not The Finished Package

Damon: [00:00:00] You have any questions before we get started? Any, anything we should go through?

Ryan: No, no questions. So I'm, uh, I'm an open book team and

Damon: ask. Oh, I love to hear that. That's great. Really good.

Ryan: Okay. Maybe it's a stronger response. I just, uh, speak. I just overexplain.

Damon: Yeah. Well there's nothing wrong with that, right?

This is kind of what we do. Try to the areas where we're most comfortable and express ourselves as best as possible. Lemme ask you real quick. I'm getting a little bit of feedback. I can hear my own voice.

Ryan: Okay.

Damon: Do you have your thing turned like all the way up perhaps? Yeah, I can turn it down. Down, yeah.

Let me see if I hear. I still hear my voice a little bit. It also could be your internet connection. I'm not sure.

It's fine. Let me see if I'm hearing it now. A little, yeah, I'm hearing it a little bit less now. [00:01:00] Do you have headphones like um, AirPods or something?

Ryan: Yeah. What? No, they just broke unfortunately. Sorry. Oh

Damon: really? No other ones, wired ones or anything like that? No, I don't. Sorry. Okay. Don't sweat it. It's fine.

It's fine. Don't sweat it. Um, so no questions. You're good to go? Um, yeah. Ask away. Excellent. Very good. Well, this

Ryan: is my 14th.

Damon: Is that right? Really cool. Good for you, man, for being out there. Are these podcasts all over Europe or are they in the US too? What's the deal?

Ryan: Um, about 80% in, uh, us.

Damon: Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Not many in the uk.

Damon: Okay. Very good. Well,

Ryan: I, yeah, I'm just, I can't remember quite a unique story, but you know, you said speaking about what you're comfortable in, I'm quite uncomfortable doing. Podcast, but I just chuck myself in the deep end.

Damon: Really? Why is it that you're uncomfortable doing it? Just because,

Ryan: [00:02:00] uh, searching for perfection.

I wanna say every sentence spot on. I want a hit a nerve. I want everyone glued to the speed. Yeah. I want my mind to be operating a hundred percent to, uh, to answer every question that you fired at me. When. Perfection.

Damon: I understand 100%. There's nothing wrong with that. But you don't worry about that at all, man.

Everybody's here to accept you exactly as you come. So don't stress it at all. All right.

Ryan: Um, yeah, I kinda just got a bit hard on myself, self-critical, but, um, I have had good, uh, feedback from people, which is nice.

Damon: That's great. Good to hear. Well then, without further ado, do me a favor and just tell me about what your life was like.

Grow. Tell me about where you grew up, first of all, where, what was your, where did you grow up and what was your life like in your family?

Ryan: I grew up in the city of Edinburgh, Scotland, [00:03:00] where we just chatted. Where you visited, um, Edinburgh. That's home to me. Um, I grew up in, um, with my parents, uh, Moroccan man and, uh, English woman.

Um. Rock and tan man, English white woman. Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Um, yeah, I just grew up in, uh, Edinburgh.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Uh, just kinda quiet child, well behaved. Yeah. Sometimes. Uh,

Damon: what kinds of stuff were you into? Are you a, are you a footballer? You a rugby guy, you cricket? What's your thing?

Ryan: Soccer over here? Yeah. So football, loves football.

We love just walking about sheets. I was good as, uh. Good at school and yeah, just active. Mm-hmm. And just quiet in my younger years and that's what changed.

Damon: Interesting. Very interesting. Tell me a little bit about your, [00:04:00] your town and your community. Was it a small town, kind of quiet place? Is this a big city?

Where, where where'd you grow up? In the, in the Edinburgh area. Um, an area called the Edge. Um, the edge.

Ryan: The Edge, yeah. Really. Just a close community. Um, just like anything, there was trouble there. Um, but I, I look back and with fond memories growing up, um, yeah. But you had to kinda, yeah. You were, it wasn't like the worst place, but it wasn't the best place either.

Damon: Mm-hmm. Understood. And what was your relationship like with your mom and then with your dad?

Ryan: Uh, definitely a mommy's boy. I was, and definitely not a dad's boy. So really close with my mom and, uh, quite embarrassed and ashamed of my dad, [00:05:00] um, and loving my mom to bit.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Growing up, I think I mentioned I was always grew up with embarrassment.

Embarrassment about. Being rocking, embarrassment about color of the skin, a balance management about religion, embarrassment about how much money we had, embarrassment, even something about more mum's, uh, English accent.

Um,

Ryan: just anything that attracted bullying.

Damon: Yeah, anything that attracted bullying, it sounds like.

Anything that made you feel like you were standing out right color of your skin, your religion, your socioeconomic status, the way your mom talked. I mean, it sounds like any single thing, if you could be made fun of about it, was something that you were really sensitive about. Is that roughly correct? Spa?

Yeah. [00:06:00] Um,

Ryan: we call it slagging. It's like taking the mic so that we didn't want to get. It was already an embarrassment. Mm-hmm. Was, it was tough growing up, being, getting slacked, so. Mm-hmm. I, I just didn't want any more of that.

Damon: Yeah. I can understand.

Ryan: Especially as a child. Yeah. It really affects you.

Damon: It really does.

It's true. You said you were a mama's boy, but not necessarily fond of your dad. I think you said you were embarrassed of him. Tell me why.

Ryan: Just the. Just the reason, as I mentioned his religion, um, is we addressed his job, um, just his characteristics.

Mm-hmm. Um,

Ryan: and obviously I didn't felt much affection from him younger, so, um, I kinda pushed that, pushed that away.

Mm-hmm.[00:07:00]

You said your proper father son connection. Also about the religion as well. I didn't want to be Muslim, uh, growing up.

Damon: I see. So as a Moroccan, you were Muslim in Edinburgh where the predominant religion is, what?

Ryan: I think it's Christian. Yeah.

Damon: Is it Catholic? Is that accurate? I think so. Accurate, yeah. Yeah.

Okay. So yeah, you stood out in a great many ways. I could see that. And it doesn't sound like you were. Moroccan in a Moroccan community either, is that correct, you? No, I had, I

Ryan: had my, my name was my, uh, my name was Rashid Abo Marini, so I was embarrassed. I was born in Morocco. I was embarrassed in my Arabic name.

I was embarrassed that, um, Muslim color of the skin, um, yeah, just didn't add. Yeah. Obviously the color of the skin, I want it to be white as well.

Yeah.

Ryan: Or [00:08:00] growing up that was, these are all stuff looking back on. I don't feel the same either.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: I wish, I wish a barr of the Arabic la a barr of Arabic language.

Now I wish I knew it all. Yeah. Not too late to learn.

Damon: No, it's not. But you know, this is the challenge that we have is hindsight is 2020, right? When you grow and mature and you realize. What body of knowledge you've missed out on, what experiences you've missed out on the uniqueness that makes you special.

It's really tough to stand in the hot wind of someone making fun of you about yourself and feel pride about it. Even if your parents say that should, that should be a source of pride of you. It's just a thing that people. Really struggle with, it's hard to do. So I, part of my,

Ryan: part of my mom, I was embarrassed of my mom, uh, as much of her caring side come.

If I'm a minute late, she'd come out looking for me worried. And all my friends would laugh. Now, looking back, that's a caring mom. [00:09:00] Yeah.

Damon: And

Ryan: yeah, so I do, I do. I remember that the types, and looking back, I was very grateful for what my mom done for me.

Damon: Did you feel with your dad? You said even how he dressed.

Did he dress? Sort of traditional? Muslim, Moroccan. And that was a standout for him?

Ryan: A a little bit. I also dressed like, uh, he had no money, which I think he did. I was very annoying. That's a typical Moroccan. Um. Or quite Moroccans, I believe are known as Hagglers. Uh, just been to Morocco there, and they're literally, they'll tell you a price.

So you divide it by four and you're, you said, I'm a five minute, uh, yeah, back and forth. Um, I knew, I always thought there was something up with me and I remember all the tantrums I used to have. Um, but. [00:10:00] Growing up, I never, I never really knew what it was, but I knew there was something different for me.

Damon: That's interesting. You, you said you never knew what it was, but you knew there was something different. What did you think that was going on? What, like what did you feel it could even be?

Ryan: Um, that I didn't know. My brain, my brain didn't have the, the knowledge or intelligence to try and work it out. Um,

Damon: yeah.

When you don't have the language for something, it's impossible to figure out what is this thing that I'm feeling? Right. It's crazy.

Ryan: Yeah. Well, yeah. Maybe our child's brain hadn't developed that much to work it out. What was, what was up with me? Um, so I have a, my parents had, uh, [00:11:00] a son and a daughter and they were white skinned, and I always thought I was dark skinned because I was born in Morocco.

So I used to lie and say that I was born in Scotland.

Damon: Oh, really?

Ryan: Yeah. And uh, that was, that was just one of the, the shame factor growing up, just of anything.

Damon: Yeah. Interesting. So your parents had two biological children from their union. Yes. But you looked different from those kids? Yes. Mm-hmm. And so tell me about this time you said that you were, well, let me ask you this.

How did you get along with your siblings? Fine.

Ryan: Yeah, I was, I was kinda like a spoiled kid, so. Um, and yeah, nothing was, everything was fine. They were, uh, supportive. Nice. [00:12:00] They put up with me 'cause I was, I was hard work. Um, and yeah, they were, they were, they loved me and I love them back.

Damon: That's amazing. So

Ryan: those are part, the five of us have never been in a room together, which shows you, um.

That the family's very, what's the word for it? Just all over the place. Not close.

Damon: You said the five of you have never been in a room together? Yes. Really? Yes. Even to this day. To this day,

yeah. That definitely speaks to some. Separation. But you said you got along with your siblings just fine. Your mom was, boy, yes. You weren't close to your dad. It's just, it seems odd to me that there would never be a time when y'all would ever be in the same room. What's the age difference in y'all? In [00:13:00] your, in each of you?

Like my brother and sister

Ryan: in their fifties just turned or brother 49. 30. 50? Yeah.

Damon: I'm 34. Gotcha. So there's a 16 year. Age difference between you? Yes. Ah, gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. That makes sense. So they are significantly older than you're got it living in different cities, Uhhuh, right? Yeah. That now it makes sense.

Okay, interesting. So if I recall correctly from your story, there was a time when you were a teenager that you discovered you were adopted. Is that right?

Ryan: That's right. It was, uh, 4th of January, 2008. Um, I'd been in Edinburgh. I, uh, my parents are divorced, so I was living in England, but I, I missed Edinburgh so much.

So I was in [00:14:00] Edinburgh, partying for New Year's. We call, had good fun, came back down to England and my brother attempted that. You need to speak to mom. She's got something to tell you. And my mom wrote me a letter. Uh, a three page letter and just telling me that was adopted and yeah, I just felt my whole body shaking.

I ran out the house crying. Um, I just went into a room, didn't speak to, and unpacked the bag. Left next weekend, day, and um, yeah, uh, I was told. Of love. You're too scared to tell me. Um, although some people are told out spite, I would just be like, yeah, it can be nasty or, yeah. And I, I've thrown it back in her face so many times, but I've, I've, I have now I've been able to [00:15:00] understand it, understand.

And uh, there was a, there was only a period, like a week or two where we were, we were distant and, um, but yeah. Since that day that created trust issues.

Damon: Um, so just to recap, you were out of the house, you were old enough to be living in the, in England, but you missed Edinburgh, so you came back to party.

Yeah, I was, didn't hang out for two years.

Ryan: Yeah. I got family in England, so we moved to England, but I was always thinking in my head, I'm moving back to Scotland. Mm-hmm. So I was move, I was in Scotland at the time, came back down and got told that news and that really upset me. So I just packed the bag and left.

And that's when I started, uh, just left. Uh, to tackle life on one, two feet. I stayed with a friend, then I got a flat, then I got [00:16:00] my first ever job, and then that was it. I was just going to me against the world

Damon: really. And how, what age were you at this time? 18. Wow.

Ryan: And so, but then that's, so then all that embarrassment.

As a kid, this was the biggest weapon someone could use against me.

Damon: Oh, so, so if they had known you were also adopted, that would've been yet another thing to have B bullied you on.

Ryan: So that's why I kept it a secret. I was so ashamed.

Damon: Mm-hmm.

Ryan: And then the adopt the adoption stuff of anytime when anyone was ever nasty to me.

'cause I was adopted. So obviously they thought that the whole adopt family knew I was adopted except my cousins. Um, and you just, you just look around and, uh, things are like black and white. Um, and

Damon: you, and you're [00:17:00] thinking to yourself. Everybody knew but me.

Ryan: Yeah, you feel silly. So, uh, that's called an LDA late discovery adoptee.

That's right. So with it being a, being an adoptee, I've got, um, different types of layers for transracial because my mom's a different race, transnational. Different country, Morocco to Scotland, LDA late discovery adopter, you find out late. These are all different layers to just be even being adopted. Yeah.

Which is, can have its challenges.

Damon: Yeah. You're absolutely right. I'm glad you highlighted the multiple layers of complexity that you live with. 'cause this is one of the things I talk about when I'm, I'm writing and I've. Begun to highlight this very thing that an adoptee can fall into multiple buckets at the same time, right?

You could be, you know, transracial and L-G-B-T-Q and international and LDA and [00:18:00] all these things at the same time and it's just adds a tremendous layers of complexity to, there's a few more

Ryan: layers, but that goes back to the start of my story. But for me, the main layer was keeping that a secret for 13 years.

Damon: So since you were 18, you didn't tell anybody?

Ryan: No. Um, I think I told someone in 2017, uh, when I was drunk and you think I'd feel better and I felt worse. Why

Damon: do you think you felt worse?

Ryan: Because that's how I felt. I've just felt like that secret was out and I just wanted, I didn't wanna be here. What I am so disappointed in myself for slipping up.

But I slipped up for a reason because it was, it was killing me inside.

Damon: Yep. That's exactly what I was thinking.

Ryan: Age 22, 23. Uh, I started writing a will. I was always thinking about death. I was always, [00:19:00] um, I started on antidepressants. Um, yeah, so that's where, um. My battle with mental health started, but I was younger years, I was able to cope.

Mm-hmm. So I

Ryan: don't, I dunno if I did really cope, but I was, it was much more manageable I think. Then I was

Damon: Did you cope through

Ryan: young? There was more distractions.

Damon: Yeah. You're out surviving, right? You're trying to maintain your job, maintain your flat, have a social life. All of these things that are, that keep a young person really busy.

Ryan: The social life was the main part. Partying, alcohol and drugs.

Damon: So you were running from it and masking it with substance abuse.

Ryan: Yeah, but I was actually having fun. I was having really a lot of fun. Right. Um, it wasn't like I was upset taking it. I [00:20:00] was just, yeah. I was having fun going to the clubs.

Experience, uh, nightlife. Yeah. Or on holidays. Um, yeah, I was, I was, uh, I was trying to live my life where with no care of myself, not caring about myself.

Damon: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Really fascinating. But it sounds though like you can sort of admit you were running a little bit. Is that roughly correct?

Ryan: Yeah, of course. Of course.

Yeah. Every holiday, every event, every festival. I needed something to do to look forward to.

Because then,

Ryan: and I would just distance myself from my adopted family and then my friends turned my family.

Damon: So let me ask you about that relationship with your family then. You've been, you were 18, you get this unexpected letter that reveals you're an adoptee.

Yeah, it shakes your world. You said your body was shaking when you read this letter [00:21:00] and you vanished. You went off and you found your own flat, got your own job, and you started your own life. But you know, there are times that come around your birthday, the holidays, you know, all of these different momentous occasions throughout the year where family typically gets together.

What did you do? Did you ever reach back to your, your mom? They, they

Ryan: always, they reached out, they were always supportive and I can like, pushed them away, but they would, didn't go, so they were always reached out, which was nice. Um, part of, go back to the start of my, I'm also a foundling, so I was meaning found in the street.

Damon: You were a foundling found in the street.

Ryan: That's another layer.

Damon: Oh my

Ryan: gosh. And with no, and with no information. Really, I, I did have, dove had have an adoption file and I didn't look at that till age 31. Um, but I'll go into that. Yeah. So, yeah, I, family [00:22:00] occasions, Christmases and birthdays, they would a trigger.

Um, I would to get invited to people's houses for Christmas and birthdays. And if I ever got went to see my adopt family, I would just feel awkward. But, um, yeah, there was, there was times when I needed them 'cause I got myself in a bad, a few bad situations, but, um, they were always there and they always cared, which was nice.

Damon: That is great.

Ryan: Uh, the problem was a mad brain, not theirs. Um, and yeah, I was just very stubborn. And just couldn't, couldn't get around for it. Didn't, and, and I didn't get any help either. I didn't ask for any help. Meaning from any professionals.

Damon: Well, yeah. I mean, you ran away, right? You, you got the dues, you [00:23:00] decided you were outta there, and you've said that you never really confronted it.

You only revealed it to somebody when you got drunk. And, and so you kept it a secret for a long time, so Yeah. It doesn't sound like there was any professional support at all.

Ryan: Yeah. Um, well do, do you know the professional support that's out there? Usually it's offered to kids or teenagers. Mm-hmm. Young adults.

Yeah. But not to older adults. Yeah. So when I reached out for help at, at lockdown age 31, 3, 2. There was nothing much there for you because they're only the only one that cater to the youngers.

Damon: You said you reached out during lockdown, is that what you said? Yes. Really. What was it about lockdown that made that the right time for you?

You're talking about the Covid pandemic and everybody being by themselves or sort of sequestered in their houses.

Ryan: Yeah, so my life, everyone thought I had a good life. I would, uh, I got, uh. [00:24:00] I got, I enjoyed going to, uh, island called Ibiza, and I spent five summers there. And in the winter I'd go traveling and, but every holiday was just me chasing dopamine to forget about my adoption.

And I did forget about it because I was doing amazing stuff, but then I turned a throw seeker. And so then what happened when. Covid Stu happened. We couldn't fly anymore, so that means I couldn't escape. Oh. And then that gave me the reason to stop alcohol and drugs for one year.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: And then that gave me the, the strength to go and tell my, tell my friends that was adopted, tell my family.

Then I 50 minute life story video and done some work on myself. Uh, spoke to a therapist for the first time. Joined groups. Done. Any [00:25:00] self-development stuff you can think of? Re Reiki Yoga Meditation Senior. Wow, I was just winging it.

Damon: Yeah. So tell me, let's, let's go back for a moment. I wanna hear a little bit about your first entry into, we'll just call it therapy, for all of the things that you did to start to heal.

How was it for you to start to confront what your reality was with Open? I just remember,

Ryan: yeah, I tried to get therapy in 2019 and I just sat to the woman and I couldn't speak. This was, uh, and I walked out after the first session, and that is obviously just a message to people that you have to be ready in your own time.

I wasn't ready there, so two, two years later. I got, uh, therapy and you couldn't go face to face because of Covid. So it was over the phone and that one hour [00:26:00] was fantastic. Really. I felt a big weight off my shoulder soldier, big weight off my shoulders there. So I was really happy with that. And, um. Since then, I've had like only about seven or eight therapists.

But yeah, the first, the first, the first time was a huge deal, just like speaking to the first ever adoptee. Just like going to the first ever adoptee group, just then speaking in the, the adoptee groups, uh, getting lots of support and just see it, realizing there's a whole adoptee community out there. Yeah.

And I can put myself in as an advocate at what I do my best.

Damon: Yeah. That's amazing. I'm really glad to hear that. As you're speaking though, I realize I didn't, I neglected to ask about your father. So your mother has written you the letter to reveal you are adopted. You said you pushed your whole family away, but did your father reach out to you at all?

Yeah, he was there.

Ryan: Um,

Damon: we'd, [00:27:00]

Ryan: um, we were civil. The uh, yeah. He was there. If he was there, if needed me. We didn't like each other, but we loved each other. But he wasn't, he was just like, he, he was not very emotional and he just said he, he used the, like the be grateful card and stuff like that. And, um, it just, he was, yeah, not very, we kept a distance.

But we just keep in touch if we needed.

Damon: Yeah. But basically it sounds like what he was telling you is you should just be thankful for the life you did get.

Ryan: Yeah. Uh, the, the meaning that I would be running in the street if I would be a kid running the streets in Morocco. Uh, lots of Moroccan even say that to this day.

You are lucky to be in the uk. And then my reply is, [00:28:00] I might have been happy in Morocco. I might have been successful, I might have had a, a different family. Everything's all speculation, so don't say tell me to be lucky because the UK's got its problems. Just as Morocco's got its problems, obviously there's better opportunities.

Yeah.

Ryan: Um, but everything's speculation. So you don't know if I would've been better, had a better life in Morocco. The best life.

Damon: Yeah. This is the overestimation that a lot of people see from their point of view. Right. They will tell you that, but they probably don't have the privilege of hearing some of the things that you've just shared with me that you were ashamed of your dad, you were ashamed of your religion.

You were an outcast because you were a different race than everybody around you. Like there were so many different pieces of your upbringing. That brought you shame and embarrassment and bullying that [00:29:00] they haven't even considered how challenging it was for you to grow up there versus at home where you look like everybody, your name is similar to other people's.

You hold the same religion like you were. A homogenous part of the entire community and we're not a standout. And so while the opportunities may not have been as great as they could be in the uk, the opposite is that you would've been absolutely at home with people that look like you, et cetera. Exactly.

Ryan: I would've had my own family. My culture in my community. So obviously I took the culture away from me, even though I tried to encourage me to, to be in the, uh, Arabic culture, Muslim culture as Islam culture. I just, I, I went in the opposite direction.

Yeah,

Ryan: yeah. But yeah, I, I had a party life and um, I was sick of everyone thinking I had a good life and I noticed.[00:30:00]

If you get, um, jealousy and stuff, and anytime someone upset me, the, the back of my head would be that I'm adopted and that problem would magnify every now and again. And, um, I'd always wanted to stop alcohol and drugs, uh, even just for a, a break. Um, and. I'm very glad that I've done that during lockdown.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Um, to give myself a clear head to create a, a video to try and to help me and others, which, uh, is probably one of my biggest achievements to the day.

Damon: Mm, that's really interesting. Tell me about this desire to reach sobriety and how it connected with. Your therapy and just how this made you feel to [00:31:00] finally have broken the, what sounds like shackles of running from everything, partying and, you know, abusing substances and then wanting to take a break, but not really ever doing so, and then you finally decide, I'm gonna, I'm gonna break this whole thing.

Ryan: It was just that pyramid effect, the opposite way where my hangovers were lasting one day to sometimes five days. Um, this is sitting in bed thinking, getting suicidal thoughts. Mm-hmm. Um, the party in life, if you get the balance wrong, uh, can have a negative effect on you. Yeah. Which it was for me. Yeah.

And it can be very difficult to pull yourself out that situation. I would always have breaks every now and again and do a month off it, but, um, I just kinda just felt myself going in a circle and, [00:32:00] um, I, I was, and really ashamed of the guy, person I would become a drunk. Um. Sometimes it'd be the life and soul.

Sometimes it'd be annoying.

Damon: Yeah, I can imagine.

Ryan: Heads in or, uh, say something inappropriate or having to apologize in the morning. Luckily I got away with it because people knew I was a nice guy.

Damon: Yeah, right. You, you get forgiveness. My choice

Ryan: man.

Get intoxicated or take drugs. And, um, and also, uh, the harm it had on people, so looking around me, friends, going to jail, friends dying

mm-hmm.

Ryan: Addictions. Um, it's, it was, uh, and then obviously people changing.

How do you mean? And

Ryan: not, and also [00:33:00] the. Uh, bullying and nasty stuff happening to me. Mm-hmm. So I knew what good a good person was like from being around my mom.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Uh, I, that's the type of people that existed that I knew that were good kind people, and then I've seen evil people. Mm-hmm. And most of us want to be around the good people in our life.

Absolutely. Yeah.

Ryan: And it was, it was, yeah, that was, it was just a cocktail. All, all of, all that. And I just felt that any wrong that I've done in life, 'cause none of us are perfect.

Right. I

Ryan: wanted to start to do as much right as possible.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: Much good. So that's what, that's so then obviously me having a few being unconscious from drugs once that's

really,

Ryan: some of them are. Alarming [00:34:00] moments. So I wanted to try and just like let life just short attitude be as good as possible and

Damon: yeah.

You wanna break free from that? Yeah. Wow. So let me ask then, you've become estranged from your family. You've gone through some healing in terms of all of the multiple lever levels of being an adoptee. Do you, how do you think about your birth family? What kinds of thoughts do you have and do you try to go back to Morocco to search at all?

What? What do you do? As the conversation, I'm just back yesterday,

Ryan: why that was my third time searching. Just like to highlight how difficult it is for an adoptee who's adoptee from a different country, the money I need to spend, the, the effort, the amount of times I've had my door closed in my [00:35:00] face, um, asking strangers for help have been fantastic.

Um, not many people are willing to put theirself out there like I have. Um, I have no information. Uh, the nurse people are trying to remember stuff from 38, 34 years ago. The nurse that, um, said that I was found on the street, she's now dead five, six years ago, um, in Morocco, like they. She would've maybe known something, she would've maybe seen the mum.

Yep. Who knows in Morocco is a culture thing. Um, if had sex before marriage or if you cheated or if you are young or if you're in poverty, you just have the baby and leave,

um,

Ryan: get about and start a new family. Um, or could be many situations. Um, but. Um, there's also the depart of getting exploited as [00:36:00] well.

Um, but yeah, if you think, I don't know it, there's also, I've done the DNA test as well and there's no high matches, but how many people in Morocco can afford the DNA tests?

Damon: I was just getting ready to ask if Morocco had its own DNA database. You have to do a database in some other country, right? Yes. Did you do ancestry?

I've done them all. I've

Ryan: done about six or seven.

Damon: Yeah. Have you really? Wow.

Ryan: Yeah.

Damon: Hmm.

Ryan: So I've, I've knocked on every door people as much as helpful as they are. They say, how about this? How about that? Done that, done that. Spoke to the embassy, spoke to the hospital, spoke to the courts, spoke to the registry office, walked the streets.

Um. Spoke, I, I grilled my parents like a newspaper reporter, asking them question after question, uh, repeating the question, uh, sometimes raising my voice, uh, that them in tears saying, I promise, I'm telling the truth. [00:37:00] Um, yes, searching for answers. I, I just, I, some people go looking for parents. I go looking for a cousin.

Damon: Mm, I want

Ryan: anything.

Damon: Mm-hmm. Any distant relative will do. Right. As a

Ryan: positive, I have met fourth, third, and fourth cousins. Okay. And they treated like me, like family. Oh really? Plus most of the other Moroccans are treated, uh, when I go to Morocco treating me like family, which is nice.

Damon: That is amazing.

Ryan: Um, but still in search of, um.

So, so in search of tried, uh, search for my family and the biggest people who have helped me are people on my social media. They've been fantastic lately. One person creating a poster for me, one person translating it for me, people coming up with different ideas, people sharing my poster, um, [00:38:00] sharing my, uh.

I've been to the TV studios. Yeah. So my, the only way I, the, my ideas of trying to find family is turn up to the TV studios and ask them to take my story, speak about it. So my, the way I look at it, I do podcasts and try and do as much as they can for mental health. And my superpower can be vulnerability.

So that's me. Make myself useful to, to my, to my debt, to the world.

Damon: Yeah. That's really great that you have opened up to this level of vulnerability for other people because there's a lot of challenge in your story and journey, and I can't help wondering about this lack of true identity for you.

Basically I couldn't help [00:39:00] thinking that whatever birthday you have always celebrated probably isn't your real birthday. Possibly.

Ryan: I asked that question. I'm waiting a reply. Um, 'cause I just wondered why. So I was born with no name, so my adopted parents gave me my name. Um, and I wondered why the 19th is on Monday 19th.

February's on my birthday. I don't know. Um, but obviously my story's very sad, but I'm actually a hap a funny, well, not funny. Well, I think I'm a bit funny. I'm a happy go lucky guy.

Yeah. My

Ryan: good days whenever anyone sees me. I'm smiling. I'm always joking. I'm immature. Um, I. It's not, it's not been all bad.

Had a good, my mom's been fantastic and yeah, the rest of my family. So it, some, some, uh, one of my friends mentioned she went, you used to be the man. And now it's just a sad story. And [00:40:00] I also, I do wanna flip a bit, flip it and say that life's good. I'm still out living my life and Yeah. Or making the best at a bad situation.

And, uh, if, even if I don't find my family. I'm not, I'm either not gonna give up or, uh, I wanna try and be an inspiration.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: But it, it is important to highlight the difficulties as adoptees face because society always thinks, oh, adoption's good. Um, and you've been saved and you should be grateful, which I am at parks, but I look at it on both sides.

Uh, 'cause there's some, I've heard some stories of horrible adoptions.

Damon: Absolutely.

Ryan: And, um,

Damon: absolutely

Ryan: my heart goes out to them and there is a fact that adoptees are four times more likely to commit suicide. So, um, that's quite an alarming fact. It [00:41:00]

Damon: really is. And it, yeah,

Ryan: were brought into the world from tragedy, so.

It's, if I ever hear of anyone who's adopted, I instantly feel like I've got their back.

Damon: Yeah, absolutely. There's a, there's definitely a kinship among adoptees, right? We feel this relationship to each other almost, you know, like sort of brotherly sisterly from a distance, right? You are somebody that can understand.

How my life began. There's the stories, the origin, origin story may be different, but ultimately we all can understand this adoption piece and it's something that nobody else in society, very few other people in society can, can relate to. And, and I loved what you said too about just being a positive person in general.

I was talking about this with someone else, that we can have traumas in our lives. [00:42:00] And they can make us or break us. And it's all kind of dependent upon the person that the individual who is able to overcome adversity will do so. And then some other people struggle mightily with that. And you just, you've said yourself, you've got a positive attitude about life and you're just a happy go lucky person with this bad story.

Ryan: I stop you there. I not all the time. There's days when I give up. Really days when I'm so stubborn, I don't reach out. There's days when I'm thinking suicidal thoughts really? So I'm not the finished package. I'm nowhere near it. Mm-hmm.

I've had

Ryan: therapy and some therapist says, Ryan, you're too much. I can't handle you.

Um, a few therapists have said that, and um, sometimes we are being adopted with a badge of honor. Sometimes I wear it like an embarrassment and I'm useless. I always feel the need to be doing great [00:43:00] things and like looking for perfection or, um, chase an a dopamine chaser, whether it's a podcast to a cliff, jump to going to find my family.

Um. And it's pushed you, you to the edge in a lot of ways. Huh? Trying to be incredible. Yeah. When sometimes it's, it's okay to not be, to just be still and relaxed. That's a great point. And I'm not, I'm not that. 'cause some people say it's traveling's the best, but sometimes I work, family life's the best.

And yeah,

Ryan: being content with watching around everyone's different.

But, um. Yeah, I wanna, at the moment I'm a dopamine chaser, um

mm-hmm.

Ryan: And I don't know if that's healthy.

Yeah. Yeah.

Ryan: Um, I [00:44:00] do, do get my, my kicks from it. Um, I don't know if I'll ever change. I'm still young in the head. Um, you're still young in many

Damon: ways.

Ryan: In your thirties, you're still young. Part of me, what's playing on my mind is I've never had a partner and, um, never letting people get close to me and, and getting to that age when I'm gonna start a family, but I've made a pack that I've, uh, would never want.

I don't want have kids and let until I get my head sorted and will I ever get my head sorted. Um, and is Kevin Kids the answer? All these questions, and I'm having this debate in my thirties where time's running out, um, sometimes I can ignore it and then times that can play on your mind.

Yeah.

Ryan: Because having a child [00:45:00] doesn't mean that you, if you have, if you don't have a child or not, doesn't mean if your life's worth living or No.

Does it?

Damon: It really doesn't. And that was actually part of what I was gonna say is. Your relationship status, your parenting status doesn't define the score on your life, right? You don't get 10 extra points 'cause you have a kid and then another 20. 'cause you're in a relationship, you get credit for being a good person regardless of all of these other pieces of your life, right?

So as long as you're sort of your life in the clean ways. That you are a person that people wanna be around, right? You're, you are nice and kind and generous and thoughtful, and all of the things that make someone special to other people. It really doesn't matter if you are in or out of a relationship, if you are a father or not.

Like those aren't, those are wonderful things to have. I'm not discrediting them. I'm simply saying, you [00:46:00] don't get extra points at the end of life to say, man, you checked off a lot of boxes there. It's, it's the quality of your heart. I get quite, and the fact that you're out trying to share your story to help other people, those are things that you should actually take a lot of credit for, in my opinion.

Yeah. I get quite

Ryan: upset or quite annoyed and quite sad that, as I say, light out, no, I'm like, uh, nobody's perfect. So when I make mistakes and when I'm not positive, or if I've upset someone or if someone doesn't wanna be friends with me, that. Being adopted is the abandonment again. Yeah. Um, I've got thousands of friends, uh, loads and loads of friends, lots, uh, and well, in fact I'm calling people friends.

I've got, I know a lot of people, uh, I've got a lot. I do start, I was thinking that a lot of people as friends, but then who are your true friends and mm-hmm. I have been, [00:47:00] stuff's happened to me, um, where. A friend's done back stabbed you or done something, you've not, I don't think, what's the word for it?

That's no. Something a friend wouldn't do, and I'm actually numb to it. The amount of disappointment I've had from people

really, but,

Ryan: but it's also, I've done it to others as well, just raising your voice or upsetting them or an argument and. I feel like I should know better with mm-hmm. Being educated, being on this journey, educated and, and also, you know, when I, I have a low point, I feel like I should know better to beat this low point, but I can't.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: I, I, I have, I have more tools. There's some days where I just give up and then

mm-hmm.

Ryan: So by being the more knowledgeable about mental health. It's made me even [00:48:00] worse sometimes on my day down, days worse, knowing that. Yeah. When I, when I come outta depression, I look back and go, I've just wasted eight hours there.

Yeah.

Ryan: Uh, I'm just, and it takes me a few days. I'm even like that, like if I spend a tenor or I've lost 10 pounds and like if I've lost money, I kick myself and went, ah,

yeah, I going

Ryan: for an hour. It's the same feeling about depression, obviously much worse. But yeah, and also you, I walk around and I think nobody knows how I was feeling an hour ago.

And us as adoptees, some of us we people watch. I do that a lot. I watch, look at people and I wonder what their stories are. And now I now more and more try and engage with people, try and make sure my words are uplifting, but they're not all the time because sometimes, [00:49:00] uh, I have my flaws and I do silly stuff.

But

Damon: we all do. We all do. But I think. Like I said, one of the great things, Ryan, is that you are out telling your story to try to help others, and I would encourage you to accept the help from other people to lift you up the same way you're trying to lift up others to say, listen, this is my story, but this is not the end.

I would just encourage you to absorb the stories of others and make sure that you are accepting yourself for what has happened, but don't let it define you as who you are as best as possible. It's tough. I'm not saying it's easy. I'm just trying to encourage you that, you know, there's a lot of richness to life that you can build on, and it doesn't have to all be related to adoption, but it is a significant part of your story, especially because you're an LDA from 18 years old that.

Ryan: Yeah, I feel like [00:50:00] I need to tell my story as much as possible because the 13 years I was quiet and playing catch up.

Damon: There you go.

Ryan: I can literally tell a person in the street my story.

Damon: Mm-hmm.

Ryan: And it's nice. Sometimes I've inspired others.

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: And I want to keep on inspired and, um, just even regarding mental health.

Damon: Mm-hmm.

Ryan: A big part with men, isn't it?

Damon: Yeah, absolutely. For men especially, right. I've often said that, and I'm not being, so I think we all can agree. Women tend to be more emotional than men. Men tend to be very logical and therefore we're not as communicative and we hold our emotion, emotions, backs, and, but we still experience the same kinds of things.

That will elicit different emotions. We just process them and express them differently and, and not always in healthy ways. And so I, you're absolutely right to [00:51:00] talk more about this mental health piece. From the male perspective, it's incredibly important because not a lot of us invest the time in ourselves to try to make sure that our mental health is strong.

Yeah.

Ryan: I remember me doing a video, me being sober. Me doing a hell walk to doing a cliff jump. I watched someone else do it, so that's why I wanted to do it. So the point is, if someone, if you do it, someone else might want to do it.

Yeah,

Ryan: and this is the point where I went a year off alcohol and drugs and then I went back on them for 18 months and I used the word balance and I was like, I've done my year, now I can get back on it.

And I had fun, but then when I got myself in a bad state, people who looked up to me see me in a not so great way. [00:52:00]

Mm-hmm.

Ryan: And I felt like I was, I felt like a fraud. So that ING's why I've recently done another year off it. Mm-hmm. And I had a thought to myself to say, I might never go back to it. Yeah. And, and in honor of anyone who's had issues, still got issues and thinking about making that pact to myself because there's a lot of people who have lost someone due to alcohol or drugs.

Yeah. So,

Ryan: um, I always use the word balance. Um, everyone's balance is different. And I've had very dark days being off it. Yeah. So I'm very frustrated to say, why am I still having dark days and I've cut out this toxic stuff? So it's quite frustrating. But, [00:53:00] um, I believe I probably would've been much worse if I was still doing that

Damon: stuff.

I think you're right. I think you're right. I mean, you know, we've, you know, as well as anybody, these things were depressants. I. You know, they'll tear apart your body. They do far more harm than good a, and so it's probably better for you to spend, invest the time in strengthening yourself than investing lost energy in consumption, right?

It's not gaining you anything. If you took the time that you spend seeking out the substances, consuming them, being. This altered state and then hung over. If you think about that entire duration of time, and instead you said, I have gone to therapy, talked to friends about this, been on podcasts, sat and written my story, processed it in all of these things, and like invested in this mental strength that you've talked about [00:54:00] wanting, you could see that the same amount of time could be spent very, very differently.

One, building yourself up the other, tearing yourself down. I did have a great

Ryan: time and I had great memories, and not many people would say this. My life's not really changed. I've, I still go to the clubs. I go to the clubs and I drink coffee and people laugh at me. Uh, and I've done, I went to the island. I beat her twice.

Now, sober, I do say I've had half as much of a good time, but I'm only having, I'm 10 times better in the morning. So that's, there you go. That's my, that's my balance.

Damon: That's great.

Ryan: But I, I don't want to beat myself up and say I'll never do them. 'cause I might, because I have had some great experiences, but, um, I don't, I don't want to feel like that horrible feeling that I've let myself down if I did do it.

But I'm just not putting any pressure. I understand.[00:55:00]

You're right. There is more bad than good.

Damon: Yeah.

Ryan: But

Damon: yeah, use the time to build yourself up.

Ryan: Yeah. Wow. I do my best to do my best.

Damon: That's good to hear, Ryan. Well, thank you so much for being here with me, man. I really appreciate it. I wish you truly the best of luck. This search in Morocco down really touched.

Ryan: I was in, I was in Morocco, and um, I done that poster and that then went viral and a lot of people have messages and said, they're my mom. So I'm filtering through these messages and, uh, see what happens. Uh, obviously DNA takes, I've done a DNA test with a woman, so that take four weeks.

Damon: Yeah. That's what I was gonna say is I would highly encourage anyone who thinks they're your mom to do any DNA test because even if they're not your mom, their child might be looking for them.

Exactly. So that's my, that was

Ryan: my thought process. I went, if she's not my mom, I. [00:56:00] As an adoptee, I'm gonna, I'm gonna help her find her son or help her son find their mom. That's great. Uh, that felt good. Uh, but as, as you can see, it can be quite overwhelming going to the TV studios. What, 500 comments to go through on Facebook?

I've got constant WhatsApps and different languages. Wow. And beware for people to not be, you know, get overwhelmed. Um, I, I need a pa.

Damon: Yeah. But I'm sure

Ryan: I can, I'm sure if I asked, I can get one.

Damon: Yeah, you probably could. You probably could. Well, Ryan, I'm really

Ryan: happy I went to Morocco and uh, I'll continue to keep visiting.

Um, but you do, you do feel like you got a mixed identity, like in Scotland, I feel Moroccan, Moroccan, and then Morocco, I feel Scottish.

Damon: Yeah.

Ryan: Um, but I, I embrace it.

Damon: Yeah, that's really great.

Ryan: But times it can be challenging. But um, at the moment I'm smiling, so I always say [00:57:00] enjoy your good days and ride out your bad days.

I love that. And there's also another

Ryan: quote is like, you wanna live life for those around you. Live life for those no longer here and live life for yourself.

Damon: Mm-hmm. That's really great. That's

Ryan: what I try to tell myself.

Damon: That's great, Ryan. I love it man. Thanks so much for being here with me. I appreciate

the Ryan. You later man. Bye.