>> Charlie: Welcome to the Cook Eat Run podcast with X Miles, hosted by
me, Charlie Watson. I'm a runner, a mum, an NHS
dietitian and author of the recipe book for
runners Cook Eat Run. I'm also a 16
times marathoner and love nothing more than sharing what I've learned along
the way through a lot of trial and error.
Cook Eat Run is the go to podcast for running,
nutrition training tips, marathon debriefs and
more. I'm here to answer all your questions and fuel
you with the knowledge you'll need to run faster, further and,
and actually just to have more fun on the run. So whether you're
training for an ultra, want to improve your marathon pb,
or simply just get more out of your running, you're in the
right place.
So Dan, thank you so much for joining me today.
you are from Pillar Performance. Can you
tell me a little bit more about what
Pillar for Performance does and your job role there?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, well, first thanks for having me Charlie.
Yeah. So, I'm Dan Peluzi, as you say. I'm the head
of research for Pillar Performance. So my main role
is to help with the research
around and around the products and the efficacy and
make sure that it is actually
effective and it does help the
athletes that we give it to mainly. So we've just
helped. We just had some research that's been done
out of Australia, for example, in NRL players, where we looked
at how the pillar performance omega 3s
would increase the omega 3 index in
rugby league players, for example. So that's just one example.
And another thing is we're just currently looking
for a PhD student to do a bit more research
with the effects of magnesium and heart rate variability,
how it might affect sleep, how the collagen might reduce
injury, or, or how the omega 3s might
reduce inflammation and muscle soreness. So I mean I'm
not. My role isn't so much in the product
development but it's more inside the
producing research, white papers and
publications around how the product
works. Basically.
>> Charlie: Amazing. How did you get into that? Is that, did you study sports
science at university and then go down that route?
>> Speaker B: So I'm not really, I'm not a nutritionist. ah,
my background is in exercise physiology.
So I've been working in the exercise physiology Space for
a very long time and also actively
coaching. So I did my PhD in heart rate
variability which looked at the effects
of basically how high variability can
be used to either track positive or negative
adaptation to Athletes and at the time I did that
working with the New, Zealand rowing team. So I was quite fortunate
that I was with the Olympic rowing team and I could do my research
within these very high level, high performance
players. and since then I've kept very active
in the research Space. I work for Auckland
University, Aut University, where I'm a
senior researcher there and I supervise
mostly postgraduate. So only masters and
PhDs. and yeah, and since I finished my
PhD you've got now 70 publications and
4,500 citations in various
things and it's Yeah, and that can be. The
topics have been very varied. It can be to do with like
carbohydrate periodization highway,
variability training in the heat,
durability. Yeah. So it's been,
yeah, really, really exciting. And
basically I got introduced because I also own another
company, that's a coaching company.
And one of my other coaches said, have you checked out this Pillar
Performance? And Damien who, Damien Fitzpatrick,
who's the CEO of Pilar, he was coming over to New
Zealand for the Ironman and
lots of my athletes were talking about Pillar and I was like,
well let's just talk to them and see if I can get a bit of a discount
for some of my athletes because they want it. So I
got in touch with Damian and I met him when he came over to New Zealand.
And you know you just have that automatic connection
with someone and you know, we chewed the fat. We could have talked
for hours around nutrition and micronutrition
and performance. And as a result, Damien asked me, I would like to
join the company as head of research. so that's how it
all came about. Yeah.
>> Charlie: Wow. So that was that when they just had the
magnesium or has that been.
At what kind of stage did you get involved with them?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, I mean the magnesium has always been there, you know, the star
product so to speak. But at that time, time I
think, yeah, Omega 3 was around. it
was mainly, it was mainly the Omega 3.
The the the immune defence and the and the
magnesium were the. With the main products at that time. So
and then we also had something called elite calcium. Then I don't think we do it
anymore, but I love that product. I've still got a bit of a stash and
I'm just seeing it go down all the time. I'm hoping it
will stick around but. Oh, we had the B12 then as
well. So.
>> Charlie: Okay.
>> Speaker B: I had a few a Few products. But I think it was, it must have
been about a year after, after the company started
that I joined. Yeah.
>> Charlie: So what do you think about, you know, what was it about
pillar performance that got your athletes and you
obviously kind of excited about the products? Like what
was the difference point with
their products versus what
else was available on the market?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, well, I mean, I mean I've been, I've been involved
in, you know, training myself. For example,
I've done Ironman triathlon my whole life. you
know, I raised reasonably competitively and I've always been
quite big in the micronutrition Space of taking my own supplements.
But I always felt that it was this gap number
one. It like I felt
micronutrition came across as something for sick
people almost. you know, and you would buy it, you'd
have to go to a pharmacy to buy your micronutrition.
And, and I think as athletes we don't really
like that because we don't see ourselves as sick.
And and, and the difference about Pillow was it was
marketing it with, with other sports fuel. So it was, you know, you
could get it with your carbohydrate gels, you could get it with
your, with your energy drinks, with your protein powders. And it was kind
of for the athlete where it was seen as this
micronutrition as a subset of the macronutrition.
but the most important thing was it was housed,
in doses that are more appropriate to athletes as well.
And it was more targeted for athletes and not targeted
for sick people. And I think there was a real,
gap in the market there. And I think
that's what really, really enticed me. And I could see
that, no one else was doing that. And I think it's really
important that the athletes get high quality
product, get it in the right doses and get
it in the right way, you know, and it's not seen as something
that's, that's, that's for, for sick people is,
it's, it's for performance and it can really elevate your performance.
And that's how it should be looked at. And that's why I, you know, that's why I really,
I really enjoyed Pillow as well.
>> Charlie: Do you mind if we rewind a little bit and just kind of. When you
say micronutrients, what exactly are you talking
about?
>> Speaker B: Yes, so I guess, I guess micronutrients are
the other smaller nutrients that
are within food,
but they're, they're quite hard to get. So if
you talk about a macronutrient, a macronutrient would be
fats, proteins and carbohydrates. Right. Which are quite,
you know, everyone probably knows of those. But the
micronutritions are ah, within foods, but
they're, they're a smaller component. So, so things
like magnesium would be a micronutrient, iron would be
a micronutrient, B12 would be a micronutrient.
so the macro micro. Right. It's not seen as in the global
picture, but they are within of course, within all those macros.
Right. So if you think about a piece of steak, the
macro is the protein, but it's got
creatine, it's got you know, it's got iron,
it's got loads of other stuff in there. And those are the microcomponents and
they're, and they're the things that can often be overlooked because they're
in very, very specific foods and often our
body will not produce them naturally. So
magnesium is something for example that our bodies will not produce unless
it is eaten. And it's used a lot in
athletes. And we generally don't take enough
food with it in because even in something
that's quite high in magnesium, like a dark
leafy vegetables, it's just you would have to eat
so much of it to get the right amount in an athlete. so
it's so that's kind of where we stand with the micronutrients, but
that's kind of those smaller parts.
>> Charlie: And so with the magnesium, what are the benefits for
athletes of ensuring they've got adequate
kind of, kind of supply of, of
magnesium?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, so I mean magnesium is involved
in, I mean many people don't know that a
magnesium is such a critical
micronutrient because it's in, it's actually a CO factor with more
than 300 enzymes involved in like various
physiological processes, processes in the human
body. So things like protein synthesis,
blood glucose, muscle and nerve function.
So with that there's a lot of transcending things that come
out of that. So it can be related to brain health,
your stress and mood regulation, even things like
chronic disease protection such as supporting your DNA
repair and helping with oxidative stress.
there's metabolic health, so it helps with
homeostasis and insulin sensitivity. And there's
also things with athletic performance. So there's also some evidence
around electrolyte balance and being able to increase
oxygen uptake during and total workout output, for
example. So there's so many things that it helps
with. And the big thing when it comes to an athletic
standpoint is that, we tend to lose a lot as athletes.
So the main way we use we lose it is we lose a
lot of it via sweat. So if we're sweating a lot,
we generally secrete magnesium. But
also it's used a lot with high intensity exercise.
So because of those enzymatic reactions that are
associated with high intensity exercise. And of
course the higher the intensity, the more things are, ah, moving
faster, the more things, quicker things are
churning through. You're using up a lot of magnesium.
So, as athletes we need a lot of it. And of course we're
not, unless we're eating it, we're not going to be getting any of it.
So we talk about typical daily
recommendations. Like for men it's between 400 and
420 milligrammes per day.
women 310 to 320. But with
athletes, for example, you could be talking between 500
to 800. So we do need quite, quite a bit
more. yeah, so they're kind of
the big roles of magnesium.
>> Charlie: And so I think a lot of people or lots
of runners use magnesium and have kind of a
magnesium bath or maybe like a spray to put on their
muscles. What would be the difference
in taking it orally and having
it versus kind of transdermally?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So unfortunately,
transdermally, the
research between transdermal absorption of
magnesium isn't that good. So I mean, I
don't want to say it's a total waste of time, but it's getting
towards that point.
>> Charlie: Don't take away my lovely salt baths then.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, well, you know what, like I've got m.
My wife puts magnesium in the kids baths every night and
I do it. I'm just like, yeah, you know.
>> Charlie: It'S a nice little addition maybe
alongside.
>> Speaker B: Overall and as always with these things. Right.
Is, it do no harm. It's definitely not going to be doing you
any harm to put magnesium and who
knows, maybe a little bit of benefit, but it's not really very well
absorbed transdermally. So you
really want to be, you know, do both. You know,
I wouldn't do one, I wouldn't say if you're going to
do just one, I would do it orally. But you're fine
to do both. Totally.
>> Charlie: And so some people,
certainly my experience is some
people get an upset stomach from too much oral.
Magnesium is the pillar performance
magnesium kind of designed to be well tolerated. Is
it a different type of magnesium than some of the other
magnesiums that I mean we see it in the
hospital and lots of patients that I have
then are taking it oral magnesium
and then have some stomach problems basically.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. So, so I mean m. Typically
the, it's the, I think it's
the citrate that can cause a little bit of,
has a laxative effect, a bit of
a sore stomach. So yeah, like you don't want
to be taking a pure citrate for example because
especially in high doses. But a pillar,
our magnesium is called triple magnesium because it has a
chelate, a glycinate and a citrate
in there and they all have slightly different
properties. So like chelate is bound to
it's bound to amino acids. So it's very highly
readily available. glycinate is
probably, if you're going to take one only
magnesium, it would be the one that I would take. It has the ah, highest
bioavailability, and it's also the one
that's the kind of the calming effect. So the
one that's very good before
sleep, it has a good synthesis with
neurotransmitters like gaba. So it's that kind of, that very
calming magnesium that's very good
for taking prior to sleep, for example, which is
why we say take the magnesium one hour
before sleep and then we've got the citrate and the citrate is
one that's also easily absorbed in the GI
tract, and it goes very easily into the bloodstream.
So the reason we have the three is
because the bioavailability
absorption is everything and we're trying to make the
high, we're trying to hit all of the right parts because
they're all doing very slightly different things. But also we
want to make sure that it's very easily absorbed. So that's
why we have the three within one
product.
>> Charlie: And is the recommendation for kind of daily dosing or
is it like if you're marathon training, you want to have it
particularly when you are ah, having you know,
kind of got your peak weeks or race week. Or is it that
actually we benefit from the kind of the
buildup of regular pre
bed?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, that's a great
question. So the you definitely want to be taking
magnesium all year round regardless. but
I would say the more the bigger change is in
the is in the dosage. So.
And the dosage should probably be more dependent
on what you're doing in the day.
So if you're, for example, if you're in the heat, if
you're in a very hot climate, you might want to do, you might want to take
maybe three scoops or two scoops of the
triple magnesium. Whereas if you're like in a cool climate, you're
not exercising that much and you're just doing a general baseline,
you might just take one scoop a day. But say you're changing
what you're doing. A lot of high intensity, you're in the sauna a lot,
you're in a hot environment, you're sweating a lot and you could go to
double the amount or even triple the amount, just depending
on, yeah, just very dependent on that time. But
I think you don't want to never do magnesium
because the research is quite clear that
most athletes are not sufficient in
magnesium. so you want to be doing it all year round. But just how
much you vary that dosage. So in a
big build I would be looking at doing two to three scoops a
day. and I would also be looking to almost break that
up a little bit. So you might do one and a half in the morning, one and a half
in the evening because that helps with some of the absorption as
well. So I mean typically my routine
is I do it once a day and I'll take two
to two scoops mainly and I'll do it at
night. I go to the sauna and then I'll have what just as I come out the
sauna, just about an hour before bed.
>> Charlie: That sounds like a nice bedtime routine. Certainly
with the weather here at the moment.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, it's not bad. I mean you can also, I mean it's great. You can
put it in smoothies, the triple
magnesium, you can put it in in smoothies.
my kids also really enjoy it and I put it in like Greek
yoghurt and mix it around for them and they love it. So
it's yeah, it's, it's very, very
diverse.
>> Charlie: So there's no kind of harm in, you know, different
ages taking it. It's not, ah, something that you
only want to Recommend to over 18s or anything like that?
>> Speaker B: No, no, definitely not. And it's one of those
things, that it's very hard to do. I mean apart from
possibly some GI distress
in a few people with very high dosages, it's quite
hard to overdo it because as you say you're not going to do any long term effects. The
worst that can Happen is you might get a bit of a sore stomach,
but you can't really, there's nothing that's going
to be sinister that happens with taking
magnesium.
>> Charlie: Okay, you've convinced me. I'm going to take some before I
go to bed this evening.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, you should definitely.
>> Charlie: So you mentioned the other, some of the other products that you've got available are,
ah, the Omega threes. Is that
something again that you'd recommend to all athletes
or if people are getting their
amigas getting, you know, having oily fish a couple
of times a week, is that enough?
Who is this, this kind of targeted at?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, so with, I mean
I think when it comes to supplement, and I know
I sit here with a degree of bias of course, but
we'll just discount that. I think
the two micronutrients with the most
evidence around them for benefit
is magnesium and omega 3s. And that's
the reason that
there are gold products, right, because we
know that there's a lot of heavy research behind
them. But when it comes to omega 3s,
again I think
it depends on what your omega 3 index
is. So you can now, we're now at the
ability where you can measure your omega 3 index, for
example. so basically omega 3 index, it looks at the
amount of omega 3s in the red blood cells, and it can be
done from a very simple fingertip blood sample. So you can
actually look at a whole battery of test just from
one one sample. generally though what
we find, and there was just some research, it's the same
research that I talked about before was that
we tested these nrl, these rugby league players
for example. And for an Amiga,
Omega 3s to have a protective and beneficial
effect, you need to be over 8%. And even
in these NRL players who are all reporting to,
taking some supplements, they were talking, they were all reported to have
oily fish, they were way below the
recommended target. So it was more like 3,
3 to 3 to 4% and
really. And you need to be over 8% for it to have an
effect. So
even though many people think they have a lot of
oily fish and supplement, the actual
amount is way beyond
what many people will realise. So yes, I would say
that everyone should be taking omega 3s every
day, for a number of reasons because there's so many
benefits from the EPA being anti
inflammatory from the DHA to having some
effects in the heart, the muscle and the brain,
just a great benefit for
athletic recovery. But again, it's dependent on the
amount. So if you're very high in the omega
3 index, so say you're already somebody who is above
8%, you could probably get away with taking three caps
a day and you'll be totally fine because you can nicely maintain
that. But if you're someone who's on the very low end and
you're like in the or you're someone who has
a very, a diet that is very high in
omega sixes, so eating a lot of processed foods
and you're not getting, you're not getting, you're just not eating
a very whole, whole diet, you probably benefit from taking
almost double the amount. So maybe 5,000 milligrammes
per day. So the minimum anyone would want would be a thousand
milligrammes a day high. The upper end will be around the
5,000.
>> Charlie: And so how do people find that out? They go and schedule a, ah, kind of
a blood test. Or do you think you just kind of can
look at your diet and think actually I probably am on
the more processed seed oils, those kind
of side of things.
>> Speaker B: So yeah, there's definitely a
degree of that where you can, I think and you
intuitively know, I mean at Pillar we're just working
with a company called AmigaQuant to try and build our
own like Pillar testing for testing ability.
So we can actually test people's Amiga 3s. I mean
that would particularly be the case in like
Australia. Australia, whether we get to Europe at some point,
hopefully that would be the case. But like I
say at the moment, I did the test the other week and it's as simple
as they send over the package. You, it's a fingertip
blood sample, you.it on some paper, you put it
in a package that's there, that's a pre posted
package that's sent with you and you post it away and you get
your results. and it's really simple and effective.
So. But again it's one of those things that it's hard to
overdo the Omega 3s. You're not going to, there's really
no downside to that.
>> Charlie: is there any recommendations in terms of again like you mentioned that
it's beneficial for recovery. So is this something that we should
be taking after our workout or does it not really
matter? Can you have it, you know, my
supplements and buy my kettle so that when I make my cup of tea in the
morning I like, you know, I take them
then have my cup of tea so that I don't forget.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, that's a great question. So let's
just before we get into that, I'll just take a little bit of a step
back to talk a little bit more about the
Omega 3. So Omega 3s, they're made up of
two different types of Omega 3. So. Well, two
different types kind of. There's the EPA and
there's the dha. So they are quite
different. So one is that they're made up of a different number of
carbons, they have a different number of bonds associated with
them. But what's more important is that they're
very specific to where they
target. So the EPA for example, it's
more targeted at the vascular system. So it goes into the
blood, it's more around the vascular system.
whereas the DHA is, it's more
for, it's more targeted at the more excitable cells.
So that means that things like the muscle, the
brain, the heart, that's where it
targets. so
when you're looking at athletic recovery,
the two different things so you can think of the
EPA is more
reducing the, reducing the amount of
soreness at the time of
exercise, whereas a DHA
is kind of more of a solvent. So
it's quickening the recovery from
exercise. and there's
also the idea that we have. So
the EPA for example is anti
inflammatory and then. But you also need some pro
inflammatory stuff within your, within your diet. So
Omega 6 is for example is pro inflammatory. Of course we want pro
inflammatory because that's part of the training response.
So the reason I'm saying this is because the
loading period therefore of what you're trying to achieve
is quite different. So you'll get
quite big changes in your EPA and
some of the more vascular responses quite quickly. So you
could do that within 10 days. But the more
DHA stuff, so the more, the more
excitable cells that's associated with the muscle, the
heart, that probably takes a lot longer and you could be talking
up to five weeks. So before
we talk about when you should take them, we need to talk about the length of time you
need to take them for. Right. You do need quite a long
loading period. and of course they're both really important for
athletes. So you want your DHA to be high and you want your EPA to
be high. but when it comes to taking them, you want a long period
of time and when you do take them,
you want to take them with food. That's the most important
thing because that helps the absorption. So it's very
different to a lot of other micronutrients. So things like B12, it
probably doesn't matter that much. But because it's you know, you want
it to be, it's a fat basically. So you don't want to absorb
with. You want to be highly absorbable, which means you
need to take it with food. So you'd want to take it with your lunch, for
example, or with your breakfast. You don't take it first thing in the
morning with coffee on an empty stomach. That would be, that would
really affect the absorption.
>> Charlie: Noted.
>> Speaker B: Well, have I just. Have you been
taking them first thing in the morning or an empty stomach?
>> Charlie: Absolutely.
>> Speaker B: It will make a massive difference as well. It's quite, I
mean in the research that we've done,
you know, we can have two people and we can have
a high, response. So we can measure
their omega 3 index, for example,
and you can have one person who might go from 3
to 10% and you can have one person who Might go
from 3 to 5%. And that
difference usually comes from when they're taking their Omega 3s. The
smaller difference is when they're not taking it with food. So you really need
to,
>> Charlie: Change my routine.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely. Yeah. Otherwise,
otherwise you're wasting, you're almost wasting your money.
>> Charlie: Yeah. Is that so you kind of touched on the
fact that there's a kind of the benefits for the heart and
the brain. I've seen some research that looks at kind
of Alzheimer's and dementia and omega 3
supplementing. Is there
an age where it kind of becomes more
beneficial or more crucial? Or is it a kind of a case
of if we start this early, then we're going to
obviously get the kind of athletic benefits but also
the longer term protection in terms of
heart and brain health?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I think the sooner the better really.
Because by the time you get old and you start
taking it, it's almost a little bit too little too late. Of course you want to be taking
it as you get, as you age as well, but you definitely want to be taking in your
younger years, particularly through kind of that
middle, middle age, you know, like
30, you know, 30 to 40 time when there's lots
of changes going on. You definitely want to be taking it,
throughout that, so, yeah, good to know.
>> Charlie: Okay, I need to change my routine and yeah,
definitely try and encourage my husband to take it more regularly.
so another of the products that you've got on
that's coming new to Xmile. So the
Ultra Amigas is not launched yet, or it
should have launched by the time this podcast goes out. But is the
collagen. can you talk a little bit more about
the product and again, kind of
why athletes might want to be
supplementing with collagen?
>> Speaker B: Yep. Yeah, for sure. So, let's. So,
collagen. So collagen. many people will think,
okay, there's collagen and there's like, so there's collagen
and then there's different types of
collagen. So, there's gelatin
and there's collagen peptides. Both are
collagen. But the main difference is that the
collagen peptides is basically
chopped up into very, very
small pieces, so it's made more
bio readily available. And collagen is
basically the stuff that's around all your connective
tissues, so around the ligaments, around the joints,
and it's, and it's what's basically holding
everything together. And as we age and we
use. We use them a lot through exercise,
we lose a lot of collagen. So, so
there's been some great research and there's been stuff done
by, a researcher called Keith Barr that shows that,
you know, regular collagen,
taking a collagen can really help the upregulation and
the resynthesis of collagen around the joints and the ligaments,
which is protective for injury risk.
But it's also very important for
increases in lean muscle mass, and
it's very important for increases in,
tendon integrity. And the reason tendon integrity
is so important is because
the integrity and the stiffness of your
tendons is highly related
to force production. So if you have a very
stiff and strong tendon, it means that you
can basically produce more force. So you imagine
how that means for jumping, for running, for
any. All of those kind of more plyometric
movements. It means that you're basically, you're getting a
lot more force, a lot more efficiency
in your stride every time you. Your foot hits the
ground. If you think about it, it's like the tendon is
attached to the end of the muscle, right? So if you imagine you have a
really. And the. Basically the muscle shortens really quickly,
and then the tendons pulling on the. On the joint
or the other side of it, which is causing the movement. If you
imagine that that tendon is very strong and stiff, rather than
a floppy, wobbly tendon, you imagine now
when you shorten that Muscle, a floppy one's not going to have the
same jolt on the, on the bone as a
strong one would. And that's one of the things that, the
collagen is doing. And with
pillar R1 is from a company called
Gelita and Gelita, they
devised a very specific collagen
called tender for that is
targeted towards the, ligaments and the
tendons specifically for athletic performance. So you
will see a lot of different collagens out there within the beauty
realm, you know, for your skin, for your hair, for your
nails, of course, very important. But, you know,
it's a very, it's very specific and
it's. And it's designed in such a way to target those areas.
Whereas the, the, the pillar one is very
specifically designed tender for athletes to
very specifically target those areas.
>> Charlie: And so taking it orally, it's still going to be
available within your body for it to be able to
be used for those processes.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, it is, exactly. And, the collagen
is quite different to what we were just talking about with the Omega
3s. It's much quicker. So, you know, you'll be
seeing, you'll be seeing some regulation in the
collagen synthesis is in a few days of taking
collagen. so typically the research shows that
you want about 15 milligrammes per day. but it's
also, and I think this is where a lot of confusion can
often happen is that it's also. It's
very different. Even though it is a
protein, it's, it's not a full
protein. So, yeah, so it's made up
of, so like collagen, for example, it's made
up of glycine, it's made of proline, it's made up of,
hydroxyproline. And it's not a full
protein, whereas a whey protein is a full protein. And
it's very different. It comes from, it comes from cheat. Like comes from the
products from cheese and milk. Right. But it is a complete
protein. So it contains all of those
BCAAs, like Leucine, for example, which is a
very important one for recovery. Whereas the
collagen, it's just from those connective tissues. So you
really do want to take them both. from a
recovery and athletic standpoint, you wouldn't take one or the other. You have to
take them both because they're doing very specific things. The whey
protein is more of kind of a. It stimulates muscle
growth and repair, for example, and it helps recovery in that Side,
whereas the collagen points to your joint health and
your repair of the cartilage.
>> Charlie: And I think I read some research that suggested that you want to
be taking the collagen sort of before maybe like an
hour, 45 minutes before your
workouts. Is that something you would
advocate for or is your research saying,
saying differently?
>> Speaker B: Yes, I mean, most of the research is
taken in after. Okay, after the, after the
research, after the, exercise. But I always say this to
my athletes. I'm like, the most important thing
is that you take it regularly. You need to take it every
day. And that means you need to have it
as part of your routine. So wherever
that sits to make sure that you take it every
day. that's the most important thing. The most ideal time
would be, you know, just, just after you're, just
after your exercise. You know, you can put it with. If you're doing some hard
exercise, you're having a protein shake and you could put your
collagen inside that with your protein shake, that would be great.
But if you forgetful and you're not doing a protein shake every day
and you miss it, that's not as good as taking a sub
optimal time. So, for example, I take my collagen
first thing in the morning when I wake up. I just put it, I just put it in
my coffee, and have it that way. And that's
a guaranteed way to make sure that I'll definitely take
it. so it's not like, it doesn't
matter so much. I know with protein we talk about taking it after
exercise and it's, it's not, not so
much the case with, collagens.
>> Charlie: Okay. And there's no, no kind of downside
in terms of absorption. If you did take
them together in your smoothie, like your whey protein and your
collagen protein, they're not going to.
>> Speaker B: Kind of interact because they're very different. They're
very different. They're different amino acids. You know,
there's like, they're very different things. And in fact, I would
say it might even help some of the absorption.
>> Charlie: Interesting. Okay, so again with the
kind of age thing, we, that
there's, we know that, you know, your skin gets saggy
partly because of collagen as we grow
older. is again, is there a benefit
for kind of increasing dosage
as people get older or is the research
of.
>> Speaker B: Pure Collagen suggested suggests 15 grammes per
day? So, yeah, but the 10 to 4
is, you might. The one that we have at Pillar, we
suggest that you can have a lower amount because it's very
specifically engineered and designed to be, to have a small amount.
But it won't do you any harm to take 15 grammes per
day. I take 15 grammes per day of the collagen repair
for example. but you wouldn't really want to go
any more than that. I think it just even as you
get older and you, it's kind of quite a
set amount. you wouldn't need to go much more
or any more than that. You just keep it quite unlike.
It's a bit different to the omega 3 and the magnesium. You just keep it a
bit more of a steady amount really.
>> Charlie: And so you talked about kind of you've done some research with
some rugby players what kind of putting you
on the spot a little bit here. But what, you know, your research,
is it mostly done on kind of elite
male athletes or is there any differences in terms of
supplementation for female
athletes that you've.
>> Speaker B: Yes. So there were, there were females included in
the cohort with. Actually I know this. So it's a,
it's a group out of a great researcher called
Greg People. So I actually interviewed on our Pillar podcast if anyone wants
to take a listen. He's the real expert in omega
3s and he,
and he's also doing some new research in
the females and there were some females included in that
cohort. But the, but like when it comes to
magnesium and omega 3s,
I really don't think that
they're purely designed for
athletes. You know, I think, I mean
everyone will benefit from supplementing
with magnesium and omega 3s, particularly for
the ageing population. I mean with omega 3s. Now
there's been some great research to show the,
the addition of Omega 3s due to
the anti inflammatory
response can really help with some of
the uptake of protein. So things like
leucine, it helps the uptake of the protein. So if
you consider when you're ageing, basically after 50,
we're losing a lot of muscle, particularly as we get older, there's a lot
of sarcopenia going on and taking omega
3s with protein at the same time, can
be really beneficial to maintain muscle mass. So
I think it's for ageing populations it's
equally as important. And of course when we talk about
collagen, collagen breakdown only
increases as we get older. So again we need
to really keep on top of that as well. keeping on
top of that. 15 grammes per day is really, really
important. as we get older, is there.
>> Charlie: Anyone that should be wary about
supplementing? Should we be
speaking to doctors if we've got any conditions or
pregnant or those kind of things?
>> Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I mean, I'm not, I'm not a medical doctor, so I
don't really want to talk on, talk to that too much,
but I think, I think it's always worth getting a medical
checkup and checking those things. Right. I
mean, they're both quite safe, really.
I'd be surprised, I was surprised if there's any strong
reason not to. I mean, there just might be a little bit
of changes with the doses, depending, depending on
tolerance, really. yeah, I mean, I think I
read somewhere once the, women who are
breastfeeding could probably do with more magnesium,
not less, for example. So there's, so there are nuances
within different situations, of course, and I'm sure there's
differences between menopause and all that kind of thing,
but I'm not really, that down with that
literature.
>> Charlie: Okay, so before you go,
just a couple quick questions. What is
your favourite pillar product?
>> Speaker B: Omega 3. I mean, I have to say, I mean,
I just feel, I feel like. So, One of the reasons I love the
Omega 3s is for years and years
I always knew the benefits of omega 3s, but
I could not take them because I couldn't take
the aftertaste and the kind of, the
repeating, the repeating of the Omega 3s,
but it completely alleviates it and it's just gone
away. Totally. So for the first
time with the pillar, I could actually start taking
omega 3s, and that's, that's just, that was a game changer
for me because before that I just could not take
it. and I actually, with the Amiga Threes, I bite
them and then spit out the capsule because it's
actually quite, You should try it. You'll be surprised.
It doesn't. It's a very. My kids do it
too. They'll bite. Wow.
>> Charlie: Well, maybe it'll be easier to do that when I'm not taking
it as like the very first thing I'm taking in the day.
So maybe that'll make it easier as well.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. So just retry it because
it's, it just. But it goes to show how good
and pure the, Omega 3s are in the product.
So. Yeah. So Omega 3s, without a doubt.
>> Charlie: Are there any products that are coming to
market soon you're allowed to tell us about anything that you're working
on?
>> Speaker B: good question. I know, I know of a
product, but, I'm not sure if I'm allowed
to talk about it or not.
>> Charlie: I won't get you in trouble, but there's something coming and
that in the future that we can look out for then.
>> Speaker B: Yeah, there's something coming in the future. And it's it's a very
popular supplement that many people take.
and we're getting a very, A very. I mean, all of, all
the. All of our content is very high end.
So, it's a very high end part
of a micronutrient that many
people, take. And it gets a lot of press, actually.
>> Charlie: Oh, okay. I won't hazard a guess in case, in case I get it
right or wrong. I don't want to put you on the spot. And
lastly, is there any. Are there any products that you wish you made
or that you hope that you will be kind of coming in the.
In the future? Anything that you maybe supplement
with now that you don't.
You know, there's no pillar alternative,
so you'd like to see it come to fruition.
>> Speaker B: I mean, honestly, they're all the things that I, I tend to
take generally. So, maybe, maybe a
Coenzyme might, might be cosy. Q10 might be
one. could be a good one because that's a,
that's a pretty important one for metabolism as
well. yeah, that'd be the only one that I
could possibly think of.
>> Charlie: Well, it was really nice chatting with you. I'm gonna change
my supplement schedule
and yeah. See how I see how I got on. And for
anyone listening, you can save 10
off all of the range of the pillar for performance
products with the code
COOKEATRUN@XMILES. So I'll leave that all in the
links below.
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