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On this episode of the Dudes and Dads podcast, we talk with our friend,

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Sean McRindle about kids facing significant challenge.

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You're listening to the Dudes and Dads podcast, a show dedicated to helping men be better dudes

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and dads by building community through meaningful conversation and storytelling.

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And now here are your hosts Joel, DeMott and Andy Lehman. Andy Joel.

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Dude, I had a fantastic Sunday. I'm glad. I'm glad.

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I'm glad to hear. Fantastic Sunday.

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For those of you that don't know, we record on Sundays.

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You'll hear this on a Tuesday, but it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter because

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it's a Sunday now. It's a Sunday now and I need to share a few

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year a few joy points with you. Sure. Let's start off with first.

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Had a great day. Great day at church today with my friends over at restore church community.

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Church was great. It was fantastic. All right. Number two, I went sledding.

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That's always a fun, a fun time. Yeah. I love sledding.

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Did you stay warm when you were? I did. You guys, we'll put it. We'll have to put a picture.

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We'll put a picture up on the socials later of what,

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what I did to, to protect myself from the elements. We got a balmy high of 14 degrees

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out here today. So you did want to, you did want to bundle up.

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Right. I did the full rabbit hair mad bomber hat. Okay.

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Which makes me look a little cousin Eddie like out there.

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And then all, then my, my hunting bibs and coat.

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I was, so I was in full camo out there sledding as also provides a little bit of extra padding

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when you wipe out, but the problem was it snow camo or was it tree camo?

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No, no, it was tree camo. So my, my camo did the opposite effect.

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It made you very visible. I am the most visible out on the snow.

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All right. Yeah. I look like a, yeah.

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I just, so that was, that was fun. Did some sledding.

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And then to really cap off just before heading over to the studio here

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to cap off my day, the, the Lions won yet another playoff game.

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And we're excited about that. All my Lions fans.

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Congratulations. Hey, those down in the 313. Congratulations.

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Bob Seeger was at this game.

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Really? Yeah.

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That's interesting.

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Yeah. Who knew?

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Who knew?

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I didn't know he was a Lions fan.

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All the, he's a Detroit guy. It's all the, all the Detroit greats were there.

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Jeff Daniels too. Oh, yeah.

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Great.

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All the, the classics. So anyway, I'm in a, especially good mood today was just filled full

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of all kinds of goodness and got a, got a Costco run into today as well, which,

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well bless you.

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And everyone knows that eight launch at Costco, Costco pizza guys, come on, to feed a family.

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I got a Costco pizza for $110.

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You, come on.

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You can't beat that.

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You cannot beat that.

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So really in totality, I mean, we're adding all those things up.

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That's the, that's a recipe for a fantastic day.

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So how are things with you, my friend?

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Pretty good. Pretty good.

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I was, before we came over, I was watching the chiefs since my eagles are out.

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I mean, fly eagles.

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Yeah. Fly, yeah.

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Yeah. Not fly today.

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Not flying. More dying than flying. Sorry.

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But that being said, I was watching the chiefs game since my family's chiefs.

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Yeah. You're one of those guys like, like me, like I'm a Detroit Tigers fan when baseball

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season comes around the rest of my family are a bunch of traders and follow the guardians.

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Do you feel similar? Do you feel like the odd man out amongst your family?

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I mean, I, yes, because they all hate, they don't, they're like, they're terrible team

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or they're terrible people.

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Yeah. Yeah. They call the, they're leaving like throw out like the, the morality of the team as well.

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Yes. That's what they have done.

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That's deep. That's deep.

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Yeah. It hurts. It hurts right here. No.

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Well guys, we have a, we have an awesome show today with our friend, Sean here. But, but first,

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I want to remind you that this show is supported by listeners like you. We could not do this show

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without the financial gifts that you guys give to us. It keeps us going, keeps the lights on, keeps

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the heat on in this cold day. Yeah. But, but also for all of the technology that we have to feed

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all the stuff, all the things that we do to make this show happen

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are supported by listeners like you. And if you want to join, you can go to dudesanddadspodcast.com/support.

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We will find all the support options available.

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Yeah. That's great.

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Dudes and dads. Thank you.

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Yes. Supporters.

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What should we do? We actually have an official name. We never do some podcast.

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Dudes. No, that sounds terrible. Let's not do that. No. We're not calling you dudes.

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I've got a, I've got a, a comedian I follow, Dustin Nickerson. Oh, yeah.

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He does the podcast, Don't Mean We Come Back There, which the logo is he and his kids. And then

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it's like, he and his wife in the front seat and his kids riding in the back. And it's like,

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Don't Mean We Come Back There. And then they call their fans, their supporters. I think

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back seaters. I think that's what they call them. Yeah. So like back seat drivers or whatever.

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Right. Right. I got you. Okay. So we'll have to work on that. If anybody out there has a

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recommendation for what we should call the community that supports us and it has to be nice.

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It has to be clean. Family clean. And better than duties. Because that's not, that's not,

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that's not a good one. Love, we love, we love to hear your recommendations. Well, hey,

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uh, yes. Thanks everyone. Um, we're super excited this evening to have our friend,

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Sean McCrindle on the show. Sean serves as the president and CEO. Yes. President and CEO.

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I didn't get double titles with my job. I feel like I, I feel like I, uh, I missed something

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there. But yeah, Sean serves as the president and CEO of bachelor children's home located here

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in beautiful Goshen, Indiana. Um, and, uh, he's a friend of mine. He's a colleague. Sean and I

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were fortunate enough. We get to spend a fair amount of time together. Actually, we,

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we sit on a round table every month together. We talk about CEOE things,

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right? Which, which, and I should say we have, we have a lot of, it's not just like business.

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It's a lot of personal, we share life together and, and I've gotten to know Sean in that way

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and it's been really, really good. So I've, I've just been over this last year. I felt really

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fortunate to spend that time. So Sean, thanks for joining us this evening. Good to be here. Yeah.

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So Sean, we, uh, you know, when thinking about, um, we, we talk a lot about, obviously this is the

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dude, you know, Andy and I being dudes and dads and having kids and you yourself, uh, as a dude and

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a dad, uh, we always like to start, start to show off by, uh, asking about the dad stats. So tell us

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about your family, your kids, where you grew up, where you went to school, all the stuff that you

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want to share with the internet about, uh, you and your family. Yeah. We'd love to hear it. Well,

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it's, you know, my family is amazing. Um, you know, I'm obviously I'm biased probably.

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You guys are too, but, uh, you know, it starts off with my wife, Shelly. Um, she and I had met up

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in college. We actually both went to Goshen High School, but didn't really know each other and

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met through mutual friends and, uh, you know, I kept, uh, trying to set her up with my friends

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because I thought she was an amazing person. Sure. And then one day I realized why am I

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just warming up with anybody but me. That's right. You know, so, um, you know, a mere seven and a

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half years later I wore her down and we got engaged and got married and we've, this year will be 25

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years. Nice. Awesome. Nice. And we have, uh, two kids both in college at Purdue right now. Uh,

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Liam, who's a senior at college and Kara, who is a sophomore and, uh, both of them are. What are

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your kids studying down there at Purdue? He's, uh, he's graduating with mechanical engineering.

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Yes. He's studying biomedical engineering. Yeah. So I'm glad to know they'll be able to support

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you guys in your old age. That's all I know is thank goodness for my wife's genetics.

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Cause I know that didn't come from this guy. They were just like, dad, we've seen, we've seen

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that what social work has done to you and we're just, we're heading in a different, a different

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direction. You know, it's interesting because, uh, fair amounts of times throughout our lives,

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silly. And I've looked at each other and said, I don't know what couple got our kids,

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but they've got to be going, what went wrong? We're such great smart people. You know, so

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yeah, no, they're great family or kids are just amazing. You know, um, I think, well,

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everybody's always biased about their kids and it, but, uh, you know, really I can, I can say

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there's lots of points in my life where both of my kids have taught me huge life lessons at critical

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times. And yeah, till to this day, I mean, we just, you know, when they were home for this,

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the Christmas break, we got to do a week's vacation together, climbing around rocks and kayaking and

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stuff. And just a great time. And when you have kids that you can actually go like, I like being

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around them. Exactly. That's cool. Exactly. Right. Andy and I talk a lot about, you know,

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and, and kind of any of our parenting journey, that really what we are is we're raising adults

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that we want to hang out with, right? When they get, when they get older. And I think that's

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when I see families that are older that have kids about your age and it's like,

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they just can't wait to spend time together and they look forward to that and it's life giving.

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Like that is the, I think it's just the sweetest thing. I think it's, I think it's a, a win and

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chalk it up to a victory in the old parenting category. We're like, I raised, I raised adults

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that I want to spend time with. They don't, they don't, uh, you know, drive me up the wall. So

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that's, that's good on you. Um, so Sean, you have now, uh, you've obviously been in the,

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been the area that we live in here in Goshen, Elkhart County for, for a time. You've worked for

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basher children's home for a total of 28 years. Yep. Um, been the CEO for how many years now?

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Are you two and a half? Yeah. Two and a half. And, and so prior to that, what sort of roles did you,

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I'm guessing Sean's a real, you know, he likes to climb the ladder. Um, probably a clear,

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uh, yeah, it was, it was a set out plan from the beginning. I'm sure, I'm sure. But what's,

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I mean, what is kind of what, what roles and sort of things have you done while serving at

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basher children's home? Yeah. So it's interesting because, um, when I had graduated from my

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undergraduate, I was initially planning on going right onto graduate school, but through an internship

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realized I was going down the road to being a psychologist, realized that wasn't really the

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thing for me. So I thought I needed to pause a little bit. I came back home to this area and,

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you know, applied at basher. I told the guy that was interviewing me

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that I'd be there about exactly one year. I was going to be moving away. Um,

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and he laughed at me there and at all three of his retirement parties, which he finally

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fully retired after 50 years. Um, and so I started as a second shift, direct care staff

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in one of the residential programs with younger guys and, um, it just got under my into my into

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me, you know, like I realized that there's a lot going on with these young guys and most of the kids

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that I've worked with, but at heart we're just really not all that different. You know, um,

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the thing that happens with kids who've had a lot of crazy things happen in life is at some point,

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it becomes really risky for them to believe in their future and have hope for their future.

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Yeah. And so acting like a fool is easier than acting like somebody who might believe in yourself

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or believe that you can have a chance in life. Yeah. And so they choose that path until they

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have an opportunity to see another one. Yeah. Yeah. So when you're going into the residential

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situation, you know, um, I think, you know, obviously there's some of the challenges there

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that you, that you mentioned. What sort of, if you think about like skill sets that you,

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that you needed to succeed, because obviously you stuck with, you stuck, you didn't leave

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Bachel, you stayed there, you stuck with it. Yeah. What thinking about skill sets and abilities to

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to succeed in that environment, what, what would you, what would you name, what would you say was,

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was essential for that? Yeah. So I think, uh, really when it comes down to it, when you're

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starting any of this stuff, you know, if you're going to be working with kids, you got to know

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where your values lie and, and you got to be strong in those. Um, but you also have to

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get to be able to, to be a person who can ask more questions than, than make statements. Um,

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I think if you're going to get somewhere with kids, even your own kids, you get a lot farther,

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if you're willing to ask them questions about things, rather than tell them about things a lot.

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Absolutely. And so I think that that, that's one of the things I think kids have,

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have taught me over the years, but I think knowing where my beliefs lie, where my values lie,

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was important for two reasons. One was because a lot of times even kids with a lot of trouble,

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their values and beliefs matched up with mine a lot more than I would have thought.

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Interesting. And then the second thing is, is sometimes my values and beliefs,

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if I were, if I wasn't aware of how those came into play with kids,

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it caused problems and friction between us. Because say one of my, obviously one of my

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values is you treat women right. Well, sometimes our kids don't do that very well.

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And, and I would jump in too harshly early on. And I had a great, uh, female co-worker who said,

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"Hey, maybe let me fight my own battles." Oh yeah. You know, and it was a great lesson for me because,

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one, she needed to, to gain that credibility. But the other thing was, is I wasn't going to

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change that kid's feeling by jumping in there. And so I, I think that, and then I actually think

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a fair level of ignorance is the beginning of it. Not knowing that you're, you know,

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you're going to go through a lot of roller coasters, both emotionally and, and, and in other ways.

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And just not knowing how tough it's going to be to get close to kids that you see

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horrible things sometimes happen to, you know, um, that ignorance can be really a blessing at times.

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When you think about, um,

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the, the kids that you guys serve at Bashar, and I guess let me first ask this,

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kind of paint a picture for us for, uh, the, the types of services that Bashar offer,

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because they are, they are varied at various levels.

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And you had mentioned your children's home, but what, what else do you guys do? Because, yeah,

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you guys, it's a, it's a varied thing. Yeah. And so, you know, I want to encapsulate it,

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because if I went into that stuff, we could be here for hours and hours. I mean, so,

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quite frankly, Bashar serves over a thousand kids a year and our residential side is the most

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intensive, but it's actually the fewest number of kids. And so, you know, I think if you think of

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like a hospital, Bashar, that the residential kind side would be that intensive emergency

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room and critical care unit, a lot of intensive work, that sort of thing. But then we have

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services where we help kids who are in our, in our community schools and struggling there,

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not, not making it there, who, who the schools can refer to our alternative school. They come in

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for the day, they're actually going back home at night. And the goal is to keep them connected

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to their school and get them back into their school. We also have a very small foster care

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program, basically just for our kids who come out of residential. And we have our community-based

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services, which has a huge array. I mean, this is everything from one-time classes to outpatient

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therapy. We have programs to keep kids from getting into the system, like stop skipping,

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which is for kids who are having trouble missing school, stop lifting for kids who shop lift too

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much, or our shoplifting. And then we have a Teg Court program, which is all run by teens,

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everything from the prosecuting attorney all the way through. Huge success right there.

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And then one of the other things that we have that I think is really good in our community-based

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services is for every family who is going through divorce in Elkhart County and has kids under the

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age of 18, they go through our Transparenting and Seasons class. And the whole goal of that thing

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is whatever is going on, you both care about your kids. Let's help you focus on them.

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I wish more people knew about that service right there. I think that, right, because that hits so

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many families in a very significant way. Can I tell you a quick story about it?

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So years ago, when we were first starting this, I got to run some of those classes. And one of the

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things I would do is while the parents are in the Transparenting class, their kids are in Seasons.

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So, you know, we'd have some of the kids who are younger. And a lot of times what we'd do is,

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that was big for them because they got to realize I'm not the only kid going through this. That's

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pretty big. But I would always have the people who are working with the young kids take them out

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while I'm doing some classes with the parents. Heather kids do sidewalk chalk art. And they

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would tell them, don't put any names down, just draw how it is for you right now with your family.

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And then they would come in and I would tell the parents, hey, we're going to go on break.

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We're going to go out and walk down the sidewalk. Every parent knows their kid's drawing.

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Wow. Wow. And so there were parents in there who were terrified that they were doing horrible by

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their kids who would see pictures that their kids drew that actually were pretty normal.

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Families holding hands, things like that. And they would break down and cry. Because for them,

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it let them know for the first time, I'm not doing as bad as I thought. And there are other parents

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who were so much in their own hurt that they didn't realize what they were doing to their kids.

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And they'd walk out and they see their kids with a heart that's being pulled apart and they would

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break down. And those families would come in and be like, we need more help. And so to me,

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I look at that and I say, that's a very critical time for families and for kids. And if we can do

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things the right way, the direction those kids go from there can be hugely impacted,

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but also just their connection to their family again can really be drawn together.

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So you've talked about the residential and that's kind of a smaller group. And they're

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on the Basher campus. You have houses that are individual houses that are dedicated to that

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service. Yeah. So we have an emergency shelter care, which is really designed for kids who are in

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transition. But also if there are kids who've been kicked out of their house or they've run away from

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home, they can check in and there's no cost for that. We just have to work with their parents to

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make sure that they're okay with them staying for a while and working with us. And that's been a

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really good thing. And then we have a bunch of other residential programs, everything from substance

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abuse treatment to significant traumatic kids who are dealing with traumatic issues, things that

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have happened and behaviors that result. And then our newest residential program is for girls who

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have survived human trafficking. And in that one, I think the, so maybe you can help, you can help

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me understand this. And I think I sort of understand, but when I drove by your guys'

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facility shortly after that, that place was built out. There's a stark appearance to it

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in comparison to the rest of the facilities that you have. Kind of describe it to us and then

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why, the kind of the why behind it. So excuse me, I think the thing that's always the hardest to

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understand because our brains can't really comprehend it and mine couldn't even after doing

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in doing this work at the beginning. But the girls who have been subjected to that, you would

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think that once somebody saves them, that they would be like, thank you so much. I'm so excited

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about this help. And actually, they have gone under such systematic brainwashing. I mean,

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we don't even have a good concept of the level of brainwashing that happens with these girls,

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that their first thing is, I don't trust anybody. I definitely don't trust you. I have to get away

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from this place and many times get back to my abuser or my pimp or whatever, which makes no sense.

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But if you understand the levels of psychological abuse and trauma that these girls go through,

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it does. So our facility is set up to be as, to be a secure facility. So that means the girls

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aren't locked in their rooms or anything like that. It means that they can't freely run outside into

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the community because if they did, their skill set would make them gone. And then once they're

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gone, they're at real risk for never coming back or somebody finding them and them no longer being

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alive. And so we built this really, it's a beautiful facility really. And the girls helped

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design a lot of things. And in fact, one of the girls who's one of our, we call her our most

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notorious, but she also is one of our most beloved girls who's been gone for several years.

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We actually contracted her to help us look at some of this stuff because she was so effective at

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hurting herself and doing things. And she was extremely helpful in that. But then we also have

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outside courtyards and all that with really high fences that are anti-climb fences. And they look,

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they actually look really nice to look through. But then on the side, it's amazing how things are

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so well designed on the side to our parking lot. The wall that is there, you could literally drive

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a semi into and you would not break through. And it's because those girls got to know that nobody

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can bust in and steal them. That's interesting. I think that's one of those things that you think of

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happens elsewhere. Happens in third world countries. It happens in Miami,

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but not in Goshen, Indiana or this area. And yeah, that's sad. And thank you for doing the work

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that you're doing. Yeah. Yeah. I'll say this. Just to be honest, we didn't think it was that bad.

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And it wasn't until we were getting more and more kids in our shelter who were couch surfing

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and kids run out of places to couch surf. Then they run into places where people expect things

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of them and then they run into danger. And as these kids told these stories, we realized,

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okay, there's more than we even realize is going on both within our community and then traveling

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through our community and within the state. And so we really tried to work with other facilities

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to help get these girls the help they needed, but both our kids and those places said,

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you guys know as much as we do, you need to jump in the game and do this. Wow. Yeah. And so that's

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what we do. Yeah. Yeah. So and again, and then so we've, you know, the trafficking side, the residential

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side, the education, the education side. So you're running an alternative school within,

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within on your campus as well. Yeah. Grades ranging from kindergarten all the way through.

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Okay. Yeah. And it was interesting because we used to go fourth grade through and then as the

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schools kept asking us, how about third? How about second? When they got to kindergarten, we were

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like, seriously, you need us for kindergarten? They were like, they were in a position of deciding

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whether they were going to expel kindergarteners or not. Wow. And we were like, really? And then

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those kids promptly showed up at our place, bid our teachers just like, you know, they were going,

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okay, we understand now. Yeah. And you know, there's a lot of difficulty schools deal with,

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but it's nice that we, it's good to be able to be there in our, our community schools try really

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hard with these kids. And that partnership has been good because they, they really see the

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importance of us doing things, but also the importance of them being able to get those kids

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back into their schools. So I wonder if obviously this, the stories are

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unique to each kid and kind of where they come from. If you were able to kind of paint

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with broader brushstrokes, like the circumstances that are, that you, that you guys identify that

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are contributing to the students that are finding their way. It goes from even start with just the

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alternative school, like the students that are finding their way into your, into your services.

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What, what challenges are they facing or what, in what atmospheres are they in that maybe

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that, that might probably overlap with kids that are, that are kids that are also staying in the

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schools. It's clearly they have responded to something different differently though, that

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something different has happened in their life. What are the sort of the things that contribute

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to that? Yeah. Yeah. You know, and I can say this, there, there's kids from varying backgrounds.

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Like we always tend to think it's kids from certain backgrounds that, that run into these

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challenges. But sometimes you have kids who are, who have very loving families who, who care about

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them a lot, but there's been some trauma that's happened or some things that have been really

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difficult. And so as the kids' behaviors become more and more problematic, there are times where

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the family just realizes, okay, if I don't do something different with my kid, my kid's going

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to end up getting expelled from school. And so we have kids that come in where their parents are

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working with the school on that, and we have kids who come in whose families are kind of chronically

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homeless. And so they aren't in a particular school system for very long periods of time,

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and they bounce and bounce. And once you get really behind as a kid, if you have two choices in class

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to look stupid or be a problem, it's easier to be a problem in front of everybody than look stupid.

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And so our kids will act that out. And some of our kids, you know, really come from a lot of,

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a lot of substance abuse within their family. And, you know, that, that's hard, especially with,

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you know, a lot of the stuff that's out there now, it puts kids in bad positions. It puts them

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in positions of basically being in control of their own lives at really early ages. And we all

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know that that doesn't work out real well, but also puts them in situations where they're around

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some particularly dangerous people sometimes. And so those kids both like going to school

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because it's one safe, stable place. But then they have real trouble at school because they're

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used to doing whatever they want everywhere else. And so that's a lot, I think a lot of what we see

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are, you know, families who have had some difficulties have kind of that chronic homelessness

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side of things, a lot of substance abuse issues. And then we do see a lot of families, a lot of

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boys struggle with a complete father absence or positive role, male role model has huge impacts

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on those kids. They don't realize that, but you can see it. Yeah, I think this has been a

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conversation, I think this is a conversation that comes up a lot on our show. And it's definitely

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close to the work that you guys do really addressing fatherlessness, really talking about

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the impact that it can make. I say this with all respect to the families that

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you know, that are running and trying to operate without a dad. But, you know, there's just no,

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I felt like culture for a long time, you know, was trying to say like, well, you know,

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like the single mom, like she can, she can, she can get by, right? She can, she had enough resources,

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enough support, whatever. And for all the amazing women, and there's story after story after story,

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who, man, just went and got the second, the third job, worked all kinds of hours and shifts,

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it made a way for their family to survive. And that's really what it was. Just had a,

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had a mindset of like, we will, we will make this, set themselves to that. Like, my goodness,

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how amazing. We can say that. And at the same time, say that nothing replaces having a father

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in the home. And that's, that's for our young men. And that's for our, for our young women.

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Well, and not only that, but I think that when you have a son, especially that doesn't have a dad,

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not only is he not getting that example, but then he also has to be that man of the house.

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Yeah. Right. And that's not something that any kid should have to take on.

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Right. Yeah. Yeah. Such a lot of, I mean, I can only imagine just the amount,

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in so many cases, with some of the kids that are, that are coming to you guys,

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just the level of stress, just chronic stress that they are carrying with them.

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Feelings of, like having to take on responsibility before they should really have to take on that

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responsibility. Right.

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Wondering how are my parents doing? How are my, I mean, they might be,

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they might be the ones that are the adult in the room, right? No, kind of, kind of thing.

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How, so, I mean, you guys are provided, and obviously, and I, you guys are providing

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in the services that you do, there's a lot of psychological care, I would imagine in all of this.

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What, what is a young person who's coming to you? What do they, what is your goal?

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Like, what do you feel like they need to know and experience and understand to, to move forward

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in life? Yeah. Well, you know, one of the, one of the great things is, is a part of our agency,

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we've always had, you know, a strong Christian spiritual background. Yeah.

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And the great thing is, is, you know, our people, though,

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try to shove anything down any of our kids' throats, a bad idea, right? Yeah.

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And so, you know, we're always trying to offer as many things as we can

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and not have it be like, we're trying to make you do this stuff. And I'll tell you this, people

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think, would think, and in, it does happen at the beginning, but our kids are not as

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resistant to that stuff as people would think. In fact, most of our kids are interested. We have

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kids who go to area churches, who are involved in area youth groups. We have a chaplain on campus,

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and actually one of my favorite statistics, the only 100% statistic that Basher has,

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I love this one. Every kid who has tried to punch our chaplain has gotten baptized.

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Now, we've had other kids who've gotten baptized too, but every one. So, so my, my question for

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our, you know, chaplain who most recently came in was, I said, told him that I said, you, you

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will want to take one for the team. He's like, I'll take two of it gets a kid baptized. That's a

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good stat. I mean, you should be maybe gotta be more concerned about a kid if they haven't taken

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a swing. Right. Yeah. It's like, are you okay? Is this? Well, they don't, you know, the good thing

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is I always say that's not a kid who's, who's apathetic. He's at least mad. And I do think so,

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for me, you know, kids choose to put in repair requests. And it's amazing to me. We have

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something like 1400 people who are on our prayer request chain who like, yeah, our kids and staff

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put out prayers. They pray for them. But, you know, like in my role now, I watch those very

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closely and I can tell you when something changes for a kid because it'll look a lot like this. And

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I remember this one girl had this very specific one several years ago, 16 straight weeks of Get Me

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Outta Bashar. That was the prayer. Week 17 was please pray. Or my prayer is that the man who

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killed my mom knows he's forgiven and that I can realize that I'm forgiven too. Wow. Wow. So that

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was week 17. So I got to tell her staff. I said, Hey, you know, she's going to be doing butter here

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soon. And they're like, yeah, right. Cause this is a kid who flipped every furniture. She was like

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super human. A couple weeks later, a couple of staff show up at my door and they were like,

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how'd you know? And I was like, well, I'm just that good. And then I told them, I'm like, well,

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no, actually, I was reading her prayer request. But you can see it. Yeah. Like so, so how do I

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know? Yeah, I like, I like the kids start to feel hope for their future and belief in things.

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But I know that that's also tied to grace, knowing that they're them having grace for people,

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having grace for themselves. And then also being able to kind of see that side of things where

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you're grateful. Yeah. You know, I had one of the kids tell me one time when I said to him,

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said, why are you still making it years after he said, you just statistically shouldn't be making

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it. And he said, I got so much more to lose now. Wow. He's like, I just don't want to pay the cost

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anymore. And I was like, that's a grateful person. The 100% living with gratitude is powerful. That's

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a powerful thing. And you know, you say 16 weeks of prayer. That's, that is, that's a few months.

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Yeah. Right. That's four. That's a long time. Yeah.

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How many of us as adults, when we look at a problem at a troubled kid or a kid who's going

387
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:33,200
through something are willing to say, are willing to say, Hey, I'll go through, I'll go through hell

388
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:41,920
with this kid for four months. If it means, if it means, you know, I just think like, that's why

389
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:47,440
I appreciate what you guys do is that it is, it's not a sprint. It is a marathon with, with so many

390
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:53,120
of the kids, but you're, you guys are in a position and you have an intentionality to take that journey

391
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:59,680
with them. And, and I know like not every story, not every story ends, ends as happily as you guys

392
00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,920
would want to. And I'm sure there's lots of stories that actually in the long term, maybe did, and you

393
00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:09,040
just don't, you don't know, but you're committed to planting the seeds of hope for, for a better

394
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:17,120
future. And it's a win every time. I mean, it's a win every time we do it. Right. So as you've done

395
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:21,920
this, if you've, as you've, as you've just climbed the ladder at Basher and if, you know, you did

396
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:28,080
direct casework and then you, like how many, how many different roles have you, have you held?

397
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:33,280
I think, you know, I never really counted them, but it's got to be over 10. Yeah. And here's what

398
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:39,680
I found out was just like, I, you know, looking backwards, I didn't realize it wasn't that I was

399
00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:45,680
so good at anything. It was just, I was really interested in everything. Yeah. So it was like,

400
00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:50,880
hey, we're going to start this really hard new program that it's like, it's, I don't know if

401
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:56,560
it'll work out. And I'm like, yeah, can I do that? You know? And what I realized in that was

402
00:34:56,560 --> 00:35:03,920
that, you know, the good thing is, is, you know, God already had the plan. He just needed, again,

403
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:09,280
back to ignorance. Somebody ignorant enough to realize they didn't have the skills, but we're

404
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:14,320
fortunate enough to be backed by somebody who did, you know? That's good. And so like, yeah,

405
00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:19,200
I've gotten to be involved. Now, the one thing I've never gotten to do as a job and I'm not even

406
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:24,560
allowed to play with is anything in our maintenance or engineering. So I get to look at this stuff.

407
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:29,680
I just don't get to touch anything. I don't know if I've ever seen Sean Molaouan out there.

408
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:36,160
No, no, no, let me wash the mower. So yeah, that's nice. It's nice. Sean, as you've,

409
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:40,560
as you've done this work, as you've had, you know, you've, you've seen

410
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:46,000
the importance of the work, you've seen the dynamics of the work of working with kids that

411
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:51,520
are coming from challenging situations. I'd be interested to know how it impacted your own

412
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:59,360
fathering journey. What it meant, yeah, how it impacted the way you talked to your kids about

413
00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:04,320
things, the way you parented. You're kind of, you know, we always talk about parenting philosophy.

414
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:08,320
I'm not sure I have a fully baked one yet, you know, like, but we're trying to get in that

415
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,680
direction, right? Like a framework that we're operating from. I'd be interested in what that

416
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:17,200
was for you. Right. Well, at some point, my parenting philosophy at its base level was this,

417
00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:23,920
try not to set the kids on fire. Yeah. As much fun as you can without setting your kids on fire by

418
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:30,400
accident, you know. Well, I'll say, yeah, I was, I was really taught so much by the kids, you know,

419
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,960
so I was 21. Yeah. When I started, Shelley and I got married two years later, it was two years after

420
00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:41,280
that. We had our first son, our first child, Liam. And so there was a couple of things. In fact,

421
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:47,280
Shelley told me this at one point early on, because, you know, she's just an awesome everything,

422
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:54,000
but she's an awesome mom and she's adventurous and all that. But, you know, the, is a first mom,

423
00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:59,600
it's a first parent anyway, but especially the first mom, I think you worry, we're doing everything

424
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:05,440
wrong. I'm doing everything wrong. And one day, you know, I guess I didn't really even think about

425
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:13,280
it, but I said to her, I said, look, you know what I do? As long as our kids know without a doubt

426
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:20,320
that we love them and that we believe in them, we're going to have to try really, really hard to

427
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:27,600
screw them up. And I believe that. Like you think about it, like you can be too hard on your kid or

428
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:36,720
too soft on your kid, but if you are, if your kid knows, not fake, but knows that you believe in them

429
00:37:36,720 --> 00:37:43,120
and that you love them, even if you're too harsh on things sometimes, they're going to understand

430
00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:49,520
that. And in fact, that was probably one of the other things I learned in working with our kids

431
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:55,440
at Bash or was, you know, I had to truly believe in them. I had to really be interested in relationship

432
00:37:55,440 --> 00:38:01,120
with them. Truly had to love those kids. But if I had to fall on one side or the other,

433
00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:09,040
my side was always more stern or strong, not stern in a mean way, but like strong. And it would

434
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:14,400
immediately be followed up with something that would make that kid know that I was being that way,

435
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:18,560
because I believe that they had something in them that was really good. And I wasn't going to accept

436
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:26,080
something less than that. And so that really fed into my kids. I mean, yeah, I think my kids made

437
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:31,200
my life too easy. Shelley and my life too easy. In fact, there are times where like, shouldn't we be

438
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:37,840
having a little more problems, you know? And there's, I think there's lots of things that go into that.

439
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:45,280
Large family is wonderful and supportive. And so it's far beyond us. But definitely the other

440
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:51,920
thing the kids taught me early on, quick story to show just how stupid I was at the very beginning,

441
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:57,440
but that how God gave me a great lesson. And that is we had this policy that came out like three,

442
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:02,240
four weeks after I was hired that said, if a kid throws a chemical, you have to physically

443
00:39:02,240 --> 00:39:07,680
intervene with them right away. Makes sense, right? Because now we don't give kids chemicals

444
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:15,040
anymore to do. That was back then. So just me and one kid are in the cottage and the kid

445
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:20,080
trucks this bottle of chemicals and I'm in my head going, this seems weird, but I got a,

446
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:25,280
but I take the kid down in a physical intervention and we get to the ground and the kid goes,

447
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:32,400
why did you do that? And I said, I don't know. And so I said, you okay? And he's like, yeah,

448
00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:37,040
like, can we sit up? And he's like, yeah, so he's set up. And so I kind of explained to him. I said,

449
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:40,720
but now I'm realizing I'm pretty sure that only men, if there's other kids in the area,

450
00:39:40,720 --> 00:39:50,400
he started laughing and I said, I'm really sorry. And he started tearing up. And I was like,

451
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:56,560
I'm like, oh no, maybe I did hurt him. I'm like, you okay? And he's like, yeah. I'm like, what

452
00:39:56,560 --> 00:40:02,720
happened? He goes, nobody's ever said that to me. And so that was like God thing. And it was like,

453
00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:06,880
my own human stupidity does this thing. But then God's like, I'm going to make something out of it.

454
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:07,600
Right.

455
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:10,960
Realizing that kid had never, that kid should have been told he was sorry.

456
00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:11,280
Yeah.

457
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:15,200
Like so many people. And the craziest thing is a couple of months later,

458
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:20,080
to one of the female staff who is really hard on female staff. I heard him say, I'm sorry.

459
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:26,320
And it changed her world too. Because she never thought that would happen. And so I think in that

460
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:34,240
is saying you're sorry to your kids isn't weakness. No. It is the only real strength.

461
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:42,240
And kids are incredibly forgiving. This kid who had this horrible life immediately forgave me

462
00:40:42,240 --> 00:40:45,280
for physically intervening for absolutely no reason.

463
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:47,680
Yeah. Yeah. I love it.

464
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:51,760
He had no reason to end it. Who am I to him? And he forgave me immediately.

465
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:57,120
My own kids who love me to death, me being able to say I'm sorry and truly be sorry for something

466
00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,400
is not going to do anything but make their lives better in mine too.

467
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:08,880
So you mentioned kind of at the top of the show that you, you know, initially when you got out

468
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:11,520
of college, you're like, Hey, I'm going to go get my masters right away. And then you're like,

469
00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:19,440
No, maybe, maybe not. And so went to Basterd did that, did that work? How, so how long between

470
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:23,040
undergraduate and graduate work for you? Let's see, probably would have been

471
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:30,320
eight years. Okay. Yeah. So do you feel like that was the right, that was the right move?

472
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:31,680
Like that was the best. For me it was. Yeah.

473
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:36,720
Yeah. Yeah. We, we talk a lot on this show frequently about, we've had like gap year

474
00:41:36,720 --> 00:41:42,800
discussions. We've had kind of, I think helpful because we've got lots of families,

475
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,360
they're listening and they're asking the question about how, you know,

476
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:49,840
how they should be encouraging their kids one way or the other in education and things like this.

477
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:59,440
I know, I know in my under my, I know in my, well, from between undergrad and graduate work for me was,

478
00:42:00,240 --> 00:42:07,440
was not, I just was a year in between, but, but I was an older, I was a super senior by the time

479
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:12,320
I graduated was a little bit, I was married and you know, and all sorts of things. But I just,

480
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:19,520
I think now so often times like the value and I'd be interested in even when you're looking at,

481
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:25,760
when you're hiring people and talking about staff, the value of getting some real world on the ground

482
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:34,160
experience. There is such a, there can be such a rush through the educational process. And I know

483
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:39,680
in my, in my time in graduate school, the students that annoyed me the absolute most that really

484
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:45,200
got under my skin and I was just like, you're just not, they were not able to connect with the

485
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:51,040
educate, the graduate educational part the same way because they had not gone and been a practitioner,

486
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:54,720
like they had not actually been a practitioner for a time. They had not,

487
00:42:54,720 --> 00:42:59,600
they'd not gotten hit in the face by a kid, you know, or, or, you know, an elder,

488
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:08,320
or whoever, you know, they had not had to have that kind of, you know, rubber meets the road

489
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:13,200
experience a little bit to help gauge their, you know, yeah, to give some parameters and some

490
00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:19,840
direction for their future. I mean, are you there? Do you think like, hey,

491
00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:25,680
space it out, get some real world experience. It's, it's valuable.

492
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:32,720
Well, you know, here, here's what I would say. I, and I guess this comes from my own experience

493
00:43:32,720 --> 00:43:38,400
with my own kids. So, you know, both my kids being it Purdue for engineering, you know,

494
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:42,880
okay, yeah, that's a bragging thing or whatever. It's hard to get into that. Right?

495
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:48,400
I told both of them, if you get into this and it's not for you, change your major.

496
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:53,520
Because the worst thing you could do is be in something that's super successful

497
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:58,960
and you're really good at it and you do all this and it pays you too well that you can't really

498
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:06,720
move into something else and you hate it. Yeah. And so, and I truly meant that and that came from

499
00:44:06,720 --> 00:44:10,800
my thing. I was going to come, I was going to become a psychologist because that was kind of

500
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:17,360
the highest paying and this helping profession. I realized I wasn't like there and like wonderful

501
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:22,160
psychologists are very, very important. I'm just not that guy. You know, I got to,

502
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:27,040
I got to have more different interaction, less testing interaction. And so what I'd say is

503
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:35,440
when you're looking at your kids, step back and assess honestly. If your kids are in high school

504
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:41,920
and they're being really successful, they don't need you to drive them anymore. Like they just

505
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:48,560
don't. You've already done your work, you know. And in fact, probably at that time, the best thing

506
00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:54,160
you can do is switch gears and be like, you don't have to take yourself so seriously. You're already

507
00:44:54,160 --> 00:45:01,920
going to be successful. Because one of the, I mean, we all remember back to high school age and if

508
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:07,920
you went to college, early college, that whole being terrified of, am I going to be good enough?

509
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,520
Let's face it, you're not going to go anywhere where you're the smartest person ever.

510
00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:15,040
I mean, somebody will, but it ain't going to be me either.

511
00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:21,520
So I can let go of that. I'm also not a failure, you know. And you probably don't have kids who

512
00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:26,320
are a failure. And that's where I think switching, especially, you know, from junior high to high

513
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:31,840
school age, switching from a parent who makes a lot of statements to being a parent who asks a

514
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:38,640
lot of questions becomes really critical. Because your questions will bore out your kids'

515
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:43,440
beliefs and their deep values. And you've already cemented those in your kids.

516
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:49,040
And over the long haul, most kids, even if they're kind of going out of bounds a little bit,

517
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:56,720
if they've had the right kind of moral upbringing and all that stuff, good family, outside of drugs,

518
00:45:56,720 --> 00:46:01,920
drugs are the wild card, man. But outside of that, most of them, even if they bounce around,

519
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:07,440
by mid to late twenties, they'll be coming right back into line with things. And so I think we put

520
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:12,400
that pressure on ourselves. And I would challenge us not to look at how other people's kids are

521
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:18,400
doing. There you go. That's going to kill everything. I care comparison goes you every time.

522
00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:25,200
Yeah. Yeah. And I hope for us, for listeners out there, I mean, I really hope you hear this from

523
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:32,800
Sean as someone who's interacting with a lot of kids and has seen, in 28 years, I just can't

524
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:37,520
imagine all that. I mean, you've probably forgotten more things than you, than anything. But like,

525
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:45,600
I think to sort of boil it down to say, you know, the takeaways from your work and what you've seen,

526
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:54,560
I really hope everyone hears like it really isn't rocket science in as much as like we just often

527
00:46:54,560 --> 00:47:00,960
think and I'm there too. I have, man, I've got it like it's a, it's a voice that's in the back of

528
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:06,240
my head of like, Hey, I need to keep the accelerator down with my kid. I need to keep, you know,

529
00:47:06,240 --> 00:47:13,600
to keep on making sure that they, that they're doing their best all the time. And, and I hear,

530
00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:17,120
but I mean, and this is what we also know. It's what we know about adolescent psychology. It's

531
00:47:17,120 --> 00:47:22,000
what we know about, you know, brain development, moral formation, all that sort of stuff.

532
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:28,080
The key building blocks more than likely through adolescence are there, are there,

533
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:33,520
are there as long as they don't get mixed up in, in substance abuse, which like you said,

534
00:47:33,520 --> 00:47:40,160
that's a major wildcard. As long as they don't, and they have a parent that really what you've

535
00:47:40,160 --> 00:47:45,120
really really said becomes more of a mentor and coach to them and less of a less of a

536
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:48,320
guiding each one of their steps and kind of giving all of this.

537
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:53,600
You're setting up them by and large, setting them up first and first success. And then

538
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:58,080
that way we can just as parents take a little bit of a breather. So absolutely. Well, man,

539
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:04,880
Sean, wow, really helpful, interesting perspectives on things. I think a lot of good experience.

540
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:13,440
But we can never end a show without putting you through the final ringer. And so now it is time

541
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:18,400
for now it's time for dudes and dads pop quiz. Thank you, Aaron. James appreciate it. This is

542
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:22,640
where we ask you random questions. You can't prepare for them right anyway, shape or form. And

543
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:29,760
we can't prepare for the answer. Oh, man. That's good. That's what makes this podcast magic.

544
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:34,800
Yes. Andy, you got you tell me when you're ready with your questions and I'm going to fire mine off.

545
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:42,800
All right. What's your greatest regret? I want the regret one. Nice one. My greatest regret

546
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:51,120
would be and I don't have very many of those. That's okay. So yeah, my greatest regret would

547
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:56,320
be that I couldn't trick Shelly into marrying me at five years instead of seven.

548
00:48:56,320 --> 00:49:02,320
Wow. I feel like the way he answered that is like it's a win. Right. Yeah. One more matter

549
00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:09,600
of what. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. Sean, if you were, if you had a time machine

550
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:19,120
and you wanted to relive three significant events within your lifetime,

551
00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:26,400
what would those three things be? I would, and I'm going to pair these together. I would relive

552
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:34,480
both of my kids being born because I've never had a body mental spiritual reaction like that in my

553
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:45,680
life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then so the second one would be reliving a week before my dad died.

554
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:54,880
He was on a fishing trip with us and my son Liam was on the boat and my dad could barely do anything

555
00:49:54,880 --> 00:50:01,520
by that point. And my dad catches about a three and a half pound small mouth bass and reels it in

556
00:50:01,520 --> 00:50:07,840
himself, which was like, he could hardly hold a spoon and we get it in and we're all just excited.

557
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:13,440
And Liam turns to me just tears flush in his face and he said, I just prayed God let him have one

558
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:19,760
more. Oh, come on. Come on. Yeah. I could live that all day every day. Yeah. That's great.

559
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:28,400
And then, then the, I think probably one of my greatest gift joys in my life is a mug my daughter

560
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:37,760
Cara gave me that basically the mug said, thanks for raising me to be a great man even though I'm

561
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:44,560
your daughter. And I was so excited about that because I've always said we don't have different

562
00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:51,120
rules for boys and girls in our house. She's a very strong woman, but not a not mouthy strong.

563
00:50:51,120 --> 00:50:55,840
She's just strong. Yeah. And so when she gave that to me, it was one of the best gifts of my life.

564
00:50:55,840 --> 00:51:02,480
That's great. All right. What is your favorite gadget? My favorite gadget would be,

565
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:11,360
I'm going to have to say my, this is my favorite. I'm thinking of all the things I play with. Okay,

566
00:51:11,360 --> 00:51:17,200
probably my favorite gadget is I have like a World War two trench lighter. There's somebody

567
00:51:17,200 --> 00:51:22,320
had built out of a cartridge in World War two and it's taken me a lot to kind of get it running

568
00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:25,760
and going again. So I'd say it's probably my favorite gadget. That's nice. That's good.

569
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:30,080
Favorite book that you've read in the last five years?

570
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:36,320
My favorite, the favorite one I'd say would probably be endurance. It's the story of Ernest

571
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:43,200
Shackleton's ship. I don't know if you've heard the story, but they got 1800s, got stuck in

572
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:49,680
pack ice, survived for 400 and some days in Antarctica. Amazing story. Great leadership story.

573
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:53,760
My last question, which living person do you admire the most?

574
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:04,560
It's a tie and it's all within my family. Oh, wow. Oh man. Yeah, I admire both. I admire all three,

575
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:11,520
my daughter and my son and my wife. Nice. For different reasons. My son is probably the

576
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:19,760
best representation of Jesus that I see. He's just crazy weird how good he is. You know what I mean?

577
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:27,200
Like almost irritating. My daughter is always a surprise in the depth of her spirituality

578
00:52:27,760 --> 00:52:34,960
and my wife is always an amazing representation of grace where it's not.

579
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:40,800
I just go to dinner with my family basically. That's great. Awesome. That's great.

580
00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:45,680
Sean, what's the best thing you've eaten in the last year?

581
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:54,800
Well, that's easy for me to answer. So when the salmon are running into Bering Springs,

582
00:52:54,800 --> 00:53:01,760
my son and I always go out and fish. And so there's been times where we catch a salmon,

583
00:53:01,760 --> 00:53:07,520
flay it up, butter it and salt it over a fire and there's nothing better than that.

584
00:53:07,520 --> 00:53:12,160
Well, that's beautiful. That's beautiful. Sean, congratulations. You have passed.

585
00:53:12,160 --> 00:53:18,720
You have successfully passed. Flying colors. Oh, gosh. Sean, I just want to say,

586
00:53:18,720 --> 00:53:22,480
from the bottom of my heart, I'm so grateful for you. Thank you for being out there.

587
00:53:22,480 --> 00:53:27,120
Yeah. Thanks for coming out. We're just so fortunate to have people

588
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:32,720
like you and the many great people that are at Basher doing amazing things in our community.

589
00:53:32,720 --> 00:53:37,040
And so as always, we will give you all the ways.

590
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:43,600
Basher is always looking for volunteers, people to invest in their ministry there and all that.

591
00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:49,200
So we'll make sure over the show notes at Dudes and Dads, Dudes and Dands podcast.

592
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:55,040
You'll get it right. We'll get it on these days. We'll make sure to send links over there so you

593
00:53:55,040 --> 00:54:00,880
can get to know more about them. Guys, we appreciate you. We're grateful for you. You can

594
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:07,280
hover to dudes and dads podcast.com for all the show notes, past episodes, future episodes,

595
00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:12,720
present episodes, Dudes and Dands podcast at gmail.com. You can listen now to our future

596
00:54:12,720 --> 00:54:17,760
episodes. You can. You can. You've got a time machine. It's amazing. Dudes and Dads podcast

597
00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:22,000
at gmail.com. If you want to send us an email ideas for future show ideas, all that good stuff,

598
00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:29,120
all that great stuff, all that great stuff. Anything else Andy with grace and peace. See ya.

599
00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:30,640
Hey, baby.

600
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:32,800
Yeah.

601
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:33,620
You

602
00:54:33,940 --> 00:54:34,500
you

603
00:54:38,020 --> 00:54:48,020
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