Julius Thomas

[00:00:00]

Introduction to Sports and Its Benefits

John Salak: Sports can be a great thing for high school students, college athletes, and even weekend [00:00:36] warriors. It promotes physical activity, coupled with learning teamwork, discipline, unique skill sets, and the ability to overcome challenges and meet goals. For a lucky few with exceptional skills and drive, it can even lead to a free college education.

And there's always a but, isn't there?

Drawbacks and Risks in Sports

John Salak: There can be drawbacks for high school and college athletes. Distorted self image, academic pressures, and of course, the risk of injuries, and these can come in anything from sprains to bruises to joint problems and even the rare fractures. [00:01:12] There are two other concerns or risks as well, and that's concussions and mental health problems.

Understanding Concussions in Sports

John Salak: Now concussions come mostly from contact sports like football, hockey, lacrosse, and soccer. And these head knocks are no small matter. They're drawing increased interest from parents, coaches, athletes, and even mental health professionals. The interest and concerns are justified. Concussions can present real dangers, although whether these concerns raise to the high level identified by some is uncertain.

What's not debatable is that there are an estimated 1. [00:01:48] 6 to 3. 8 million sports and recreation related concussions each year in the U. S. And this is according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. This covers about 10 percent of all contact sport athletes. It's estimated that these concussions lead to about 300, 000 sports related traumatic brain injuries annually.

These numbers, of course, don't take into account the millions of concussions and related brain injuries that occur for reasons that have nothing to do with sports. But let's stay [00:02:24] focused on sports for a minute.

The Impact of Concussions in Sports

John Salak: With Thanksgiving at hand and TVs across America tuned to college and pro football games, it's a perfect time to examine the scope, impact, and potential dangers tied to these injuries.

Thankfully, we've lined up a special guest to help us unravel all of this. He's going to provide a first hand perspective as well as a clinical analysis of what we're facing. We'll also touch on the lesser known mental health challenges for high school and college athletes. So keep listening.

Introducing Special Guest: Julius Thomas

John Salak: We have particularly special guests this week to discuss some of the issues that young [00:03:00] athletes face and what they may carry with them going forward. And that's Julius Thomas. And if you're a pro football fan or maybe a Portland State alum, you'd know Julius well.

Julius Thomas's Career and Current Roles

John Salak: He's had a tremendous career. Julius describes himself as an elite athlete, a speaker, a performance coach, an academic researcher, and a professor of neuroscience. He is also a CEO and consulting of his consulting and coaching company, Mastery Development and Co-Founder of Nestri Health and Performance. In addition, he's also vice president of the Society for Sports Neuroscience on the NFL [00:03:36] Players Association Behavioral Health Committee. And he's also the founder of Parents Playbook, which helps parents deal with some of the pressures they're facing.

In addition to this Julius was a Division one athlete at Portland State, both in basketball and football, and then went on to a Pretty damn impressive NFL career drafted by the Broncos and also played for the Jaguars and the Dolphins.

He was twice selected to the Pro Bowl. And he had quite an impressive career scoring touchdowns as a tight end. I'd like to welcome now, Julius gets a chance to talk. Is that a fair assessment or at least [00:04:12] description of your background?

Julius Thomas: Yeah, man, you nailed most of the things that I'm doing now, the things that I've been, I think that the thing that I would also add is that I'm a fifth year doctoral student in clinical health psychology, so, that's probably everything else that you did great. I appreciate it.

John Salak: And so when you group all of that stuff together the division one athlete at Portland State the impressive pro football career, all of these things you've done after retiring and the fact that you're working on your doctorate, that makes you about 117 years old.

And you would have played with Bronco [00:04:48] Nagurski at some point. Is that fair?

Julius Thomas: Yeah, that's a lot to squeeze in right now, but I'm trying.

John Salak: Yeah. Yeah. All right. Okay. You've squeezed a lot in 35 years. So that's great.

Julius Thomas's Journey to Pursue a Doctorate

John Salak: We're going to get into this in a second, but just curious what inspired you to get a doctorate?

I mean, is it obviously it folds into your work?

Julius Thomas: Well, actually my work was part of my pursuit of getting a doctorate. When I was In my seventh year in the NFL, I just felt that there was a passion shifting inside of me and I was wondering where it went, what was going on and why I wasn't loving the game the way I used to.

And I just [00:05:24] really had this desire to help people. I'm seeing a lot from the area I grew up in, the things that teammates have gone through, man. I mean, I've had so many teammates, unfortunately, die before the age of 35. right? So you're constantly seeing things going on. I just wanted to be on team help.

I wanted to join the helping professions and the way I wanted to do it was by better understanding the mind, the brain, and people's health and wellbeing. So I decided seventh year in the league, starting tight end, you know what, I'm going to go follow this new passion. And I made this crazy ambition that, Hey, I'm going to go get a doctor.[00:06:00]

And psychology, I said, I didn't really know what I was getting myself into, but I stepped into it and I really started to learn a lot about the mind. Then I had a great mentor was a neuroscientist and she started teaching me and talking to me about the brain. So I bring them both together and kind of just try to help share information.

It can be helpful for people to better understand what's going on upstairs.

The Impact of Sports on Mental Health

John Salak: Did other professional football players that you saw in your career, did they realize the impact the game was having on them? And there's a lot of positive, I understand.

Fame, wealth community support, and I know a lot of NFL players do it. Are players aware of what the game may do to them [00:06:36] physically or mentally at an NFL level, at a professional, an elite level?

Julius Thomas: I think it's very important to talk about the game of football objectively,

and let's just report on what the facts are. And so I think that from a lot of the work I've done with the football players health study at Harvard and different groups in the PA, one of the things we're starting to become more aware of is that the players aren't exactly aware and haven't had maybe the amount of education that I think players should have.

A lot better understanding their health risks. and the health consequences of playing in the game of football. I think that's probably one of my biggest ambitions. [00:07:12] Is it continue to talk about American style football, the good, the bad so people have a good understanding. They're able to make informed decisions because I think that's really what's important as a person that's studying to be a clinician or a healthcare provider.

You want people to be able to make informed decisions and that takes a lot of education. So for us there's been a lot of research done on American style football, probably the most researched sport. There is for different reasons. And we have started to uncover a lot of information that I think is very helpful for anybody that's associated with the game of football to better understand.

John Salak: [00:07:48] Now, of course, when we're just answering that question in general, or at least I asked you initially about the highest level athletes in the NFL. But in looking at the impact, and I think it's from two angles, which is great because you understand both, there's the sort of the obvious physical impact that football can have on someone beyond tearing up a knee or breaking an ankle or something, and those are all terrible, but obviously the element of concussions in football, and that's something that's gotten a lot of coverage, both on a high school and a college or even pre high school level, the potential dangers or the number of concussions and what [00:08:24] that may mean. One of the stats I pulled out was that each year there are about 4 million sports related concussions in the U. S. Now, not all of these involve football, but I suspect probably the vast majority do.

Not that you can't get a concussion playing soccer or get an elbow to the head in basketball, or hockey or lacrosse or any of those things, but so much coverage has been put on football concussions especially for young players. Is that an overblown concern? Not just the numbers, but the potential impact of what these concussions may lead to for young athletes.

Julius Thomas: I think one of the trends that I'm [00:09:00] really starting to see in the literature that is so important to talk about and that I want to make sure that, I'm starting to educate the people that listen to me and give me an opportunity to speak that we're starting to kind of look at this thing in two different ways.

And this is very interesting because Grant Iverson, who is probably the most researched individual on concussion ever . Over 600 publications on concussion. His research group at the University of Harvard just wrote a systematic review that came out the spring of this year. And one of the big things they said when they looked at several different research articles and kind of said, what's the gist of all of these?

The Reality of Concussions in Youth Sports

Julius Thomas: is that [00:09:36] maybe it's time that we start talking about the effects of sports related concussions and repetitive head trauma in two separate categories, youth athletes and pro athletes, because sometimes what happens is people look at some of the consequences, the stories and the things that happen in pro athletes, and they just extrapolate that and say that this is the risk for youth athletes.

But the research is not supporting that. The research is supporting that amateur athletes tend to do similar to the general population when it comes down to the long term consequences for their brain health. Which I think is really encouraging. We're talking about 1 [00:10:12] percent of the people are going to play past amateur status, but we have so many people that are very concerned, rightly so about, what's the future health and well being, especially from the mind and brain of their kids or youth athletes going to be like, and so I think it's good that we start to talk about how this narrative is changing from, Hey, here's what's happening to pros and we do have some things that we need to discuss and talk about particularly along the risks for pros.

Thank you. But for youth athletes a lot more research is showing that, hey, maybe we should slow down a little bit. Maybe it's been a little bit more sensationalized and the research is actually able to support.

John Salak: Why [00:10:48] from what you've read in the studies that you've examined. is It that they're getting fewer concussions or that the concussions for some reason aren't as bad?

Julius Thomas: It's really hard to talk about the why. I think, especially when we talk about the brain, getting down to the causation of what and what hasn't happened is really something that. We haven't been able to really elucidate from a research perspective. So I just want to make sure I say that clearly, but I have some suspicions or some hypotheses that I believe are contributing to that.

And one of them I think is when we just think about biology, we sometimes understand that children are [00:11:24] more at risk, but they're also more resilient. When's the time you want to have any kind of injury? You probably want it earlier in life. It's just something that happens when you choose regenerate.

There's some biological things that I would like to investigate and think about in that area. But then I also know the difference between a 14 and 15 year old linebacker tied in safety and a 30 year old. The forces are much greater at the professional level. The frequency in which you're playing.

You're getting a lot more exposure at higher levels, a lot greater forces. And I think that's probably going to be some of the things that we [00:12:00] see start to lend towards, kind of what happens over time. If you think about the course of an athlete's life. Like the person that ends at 18, like most people do, they got maybe a third or half of the exposures of a person that plays into their 30s.

And so I think that there's some contributing factors that we have to look at. But. From what the research has shown and some really great quality research studies is that we haven't been able to see a significant difference between the brain health of individuals that just play um, what about, just amateur and people in general population.

The Impact of Concussions in Professional Sports

John Salak: And when we talk about just amateur we're talking about, people play high school [00:12:36] football or lacrosse, but football is the one that obviously gets the most attention. Everybody knows the Funnel narrows as you go up.

So you might have been on your junior high team. You might have made it your high school team. Chances of you getting to a Division 1 program, let alone a Division 2 or 3 program it gets narrower and narrower.

What about those athletes that make it up to the, out of high school and are still playing competitive football? Have you seen research as to how concussions may be affecting them or because they're older and. They've sustained more hits.

Julius Thomas: Yeah, it's probably safe for us to say, as your length of [00:13:12] participation in any context or increases, so do your risks. But we would understand and be able to imagine that with anything in life.

The more often you do something that has the risk to it, the greater your risk is going to be over time. And, we talk a lot about American style football and when we talk about sport related concussions, repetitive head trauma there's other sports that are involved in that, right? You've got soccer, you have hockey, lacrosse, like other boxing,

other contact sports, but you're very interesting about the literature. And this is something that has not been discussed enough and that I always want to make sure I bring to people's [00:13:48] attention because we really have to start looking into it is that female athletes. appear to get concussions on a two to one basis as a male athlete.

And so that's something that really jumps out at you. It's like, really, in the general population, males get about 75 percent of all concussions. But in sports, women are getting a two to one on a concussion ratio in comparison to men. And that's very interesting. And I think that's something that we have to start looking into because we very rarely assess the risk to female athletes when we talk about concussion.

John Salak: That's fascinating. Yes, I should have thought of that. [00:14:24] Any idea why that's happening? Is it the type of sports or a lack of awareness?

Julius Thomas: So I think the research has started to look into what some of these can be there's different theories to why females may have higher reported concussions in men.

Some people say that maybe that the female athletes are reporting that they're having concussions more often I don't know how many people really get behind that But I think the most compelling one for me is one that I think needs further investigation Is to look at the difference in the musculature of the neck and traps So [00:15:00] i'm starting to wonder if maybe the the difference in how much muscle It's in the neck and traps.

It controls the head and its movement can sort of be protective for males. It's not there in females. And I think that would probably be the most promising direction to look at. And I think it just makes mechanical sense when we think about a concussion, just being a Joel bump blow to the head. It starts to create cognitive symptoms because of the forces that were just at play.

John Salak: And I would suspect within that is that female athletes may be less likely to do weightlifting or build up those muscles. [00:15:36] Would that have an likely have an impact or possibly have an impact?

Julius Thomas: I mean, I think that there's definitely some opportunity for that to be one of the cases.

I think that if we're looking at college, like maybe, I actually probably couldn't comment really well on the weight training for high school female athletes, but I know at the college level. The female athletes and the male athletes, they train about the same, but I think there's just huge differences in the amount of lean body mass, especially in the neck and trapezius area.

John Salak: Right. Okay. That makes sense. I remember going to one of my daughter's soccer games in high school. And I was sitting on the sideline, [00:16:12] and she got a crack in the head, and it reverberated through me. I think it would have, not only because I was her father, but it was amazing.

And she kept playing, though they then held her out of the next game or two afterwards. Do you think... Especially at the high school level, are coaches and athletic directors in schools aware of watching that?

Like, Oh, somebody may in the NFL now or in baseball, their concussion protocols. Do you think schools are aware what precautions to take?

Julius Thomas: Yeah, absolutely.

And I think the first thing I want to clarify is on an acute level people, whether you're in high school, college or [00:16:48] pro have very similar risks. But when you look at the longterm, consequences on brain health? It's less for amateur athletes than pro athletes, but I do want to be clear that amateur athletes are absolutely at risk of negative effects.

That come with concussion . And one of the biggest ones that I make sure that I always mention when I talk about concussion, because this is what people need to be most aware of, in my opinion, is second impact syndrome . And second impact syndrome is basically when you've got the first concussion.

You've got some damage, some swelling to the brain, and you're starting to experience some concussive side effects. But [00:17:24] if you sustain another concussion. Before the first concussion has had a chance to heal, there can be deadly consequences with that. So oftentimes when you hear about a player that died due to concussion, it's generally because of a second impact syndrome.

So that's something that everybody should be aware of, right?

The Importance of Concussion Evaluation

Julius Thomas: If I was talking to high school, I would say, look, let's take concussion evaluation serious. If you think you had a concussion or if you think that an athlete had a concussion, we have to hold them out of play and we have to tell them that even when you go home, don't do anything that might put you at risk for getting another blow to the head.

You got to give yourself that two to four weeks to [00:18:00] recover. I think that also at the amateur level, it's hard because the resources are not there. In the NFL, we've got affiliated neurocognitive specialists, that are watching the game, seeing hits that happen at the high school level we don't have that.

So, I think it's really important that we all understand that concussions are real things, there's serious health risks that can come if we're not evaluating them or if we're not taking them serious. And so I think that what I would encourage people to do is.

If your child feels like they may have had a concussion, it's best to just go get them checked, and then the sports medicine physician will be able to let you know, Hey, I think that they should be out for a certain amount of [00:18:36] time, or they're fine. And we have some growing ability to test people and their cognitive status to give us a better idea if somebody has received a concussion or not.

John Salak: Over the time you were in the NFL, did you see an increased awareness and concern protection or better protocols for dealing with concussions?

Julius Thomas: One thing I do have to give credit to the NFL and both the NFLPA is, every five years or so, we make big leaps and bounds with our ability to understand the risks of concussions, evaluate concussions We're working on rehabilitating concussions [00:19:12] and getting better at that.

But I think there is absolutely a big difference. When I first started playing football, there was a bravado, a kind of macho mentality of, if I got my bell rung, I'm going to get up there and I'm going to keep playing because as a contact sports athlete. Nothing takes you out of the competition.

But I think we're starting to move past that kind of ideology. And we're starting to understand this. Yeah. If you've got a concussion or if a teammate may have a concussion, get them looked at and that's just going to be better for their long term health and their health in the moment. So I think that the perception of how to handle concussion is changing and it's getting to the point where [00:19:48] everyone around the team understands when a person has a concussion, sees it as a real injury, and knows that the person needs the appropriate amount of time until they're ready to come back and

play again.

John Salak: Do you know how many concussions you had when you were playing pro ball?

Julius Thomas:

Julius Thomas's Personal Experience with Concussions

Julius Thomas: I was never diagnosed with a concussion, but if I had to give you some anecdotal evidence, I would say it's probably two times. One time I got hit, for some reason I felt like I was at the grocery store. And I couldn't remember what I was in that aisle for, then it all came back and I was like, Oh, wait, you're in an arena.

You're actually playing football. So that was one that was really kind of disorienting. [00:20:24] And then the other one, I took a hit to the back of the head and then I hit my forehead on the ground and I felt fine mentally. My memory understanding, was I oriented at the time, place, who I am, that was fine.

But I had very blurry vision and that blurry vision lasted for, 10, 15 minutes. So that was when they got me checked out. I think it's also important to say this concussion is not just a part of contact sports concussion. Unfortunately, it's just a part of life.

Look at how many people receive concussions. You've got people from. infants that get concussions, teenagers and older people . We often don't talk [00:21:00] about how older adults have a lot of concussions because it falls. So concussions are real injury. Human beings will do things. Whether they chose to do it or happened on accident.

And so it's good that we start to educate people about concussions and they become more aware of the risks.

John Salak: What are the long term ramifications for somebody who has multiple, because again, that's, I mean, it was comical 10 years ago, the punch drunk fighter, the something like that.

Julius Thomas: It's important that we talk about really just the spectrum. What's the range of what can happen? I think on one end you seem completely normal at the [00:21:36] age of 70.

Let's look at people later in life. We want to see what's the long term effect. You get people that play contact sports and they're completely CTE.

Neurodegenerative diseases start to experience some type of cognitive deficits and those are the things that you know We really have identified and we've made people aware of and we have to find out how we can protect people from getting to that End. We're not sure why one person that played middle linebacker for 12 years that you would expect to be, High risk of developing some type of neurodegenerative [00:22:12] disease.

They don't get it there was actually a really cool article in the Wall Street Journal the other day and They did a neuropsychological test on a guy that has the second most hockey fights in NHL history. He was like the bruiser. He spot, I mean, so many times they looked at his brain, did a neuropsych assessment and he was completely normal in comparison to the average older adult male.

And so you get these stories and I think this is what makes it confusing. Number one, for parents, athletes. But even for researchers and scientists, we're looking into this because we haven't been able to pinpoint why one person. [00:22:48] It's an increased risk or develops neurodegenerative disease and why one person doesn't. And so I understand when people are like, come on, what were the answers?

But unfortunately, we just don't have all of them.

John Salak: So I want to get into another topic the whole mental health but Actually, the work that you see or you watch an NFL game. I mean, four or five times a game, you see a player brought into the tent.

While this may raise concerns, it also raises awareness, which probably is a good thing. I would assume, would you, is it a good thing? Or does it create unwarranted fear?

Julius Thomas: The having an attempt is a [00:23:24] really good thing because it gives the medical professionals the opportunity to evaluate a player on the sideline.

And this is starting to understand the psychology of an athlete. An athlete may be willing to push through some pain because they don't want to go into the locker room. Cause once you go into the locker room, it just feels like, you're more steps removed from the game. It's going to be that much harder for you to remain in the competition.

But when you've got the blue tent right behind the bench, if you feel something or if you need to hit something evaluated, whether it be ankle, knee, hip, head, you're able to do that there. And you're able to have privacy when you do it. We live in the social media world and everyone has a camera [00:24:00] and, those are very private moments.

I think we all would admit, when you see your doctor. You don't want the world to see, so it's good to be able to have those blueprints there, I think for the players and for the game.

John Salak: And also, I was thinking for spectators, saying, oh, this is an issue, but it can be dealt with. I mean, for parents who are watching, or kids who are watching, saying, hey, it's okay to have a concussion. To check it out if you have a problem.

Julius Thomas: Absolutely. And it's important for people to see, some of the best athletes in the world saying, Hey, I want to get this looked at because that means it's going to make a young athlete much more likely to want to do that on their own.

But then I [00:24:36] would also say, back to your earlier point that. Concussion has risk, but it's okay if you've had a concussion. Plenty of people get concussions every day, and generally you feel better in two to four weeks. And I think that's one of the things that was most encouraging for me about learning about concussion is, most people recover and they recover fine.

And getting that into the dialogue when we talk about

John Salak: So, so, that is the hot button when it comes to student athletes and a high level athlete and professional in concussion. There's a whole nother... area that you're exploring and dealing with.

Mental Health Challenges in Sports

John Salak: And that's the mental health aspect [00:25:12] of students, especially younger students. what are the issues and how prominent are they? What are the risks? What are these student athletes going through? And this reflects, by the way, your work on player's handbook, correct?

Julius Thomas: Yeah, for the parents playbook, and this is really well, going to become a psychologist one day, but I think I had to summarize, some of the biggest mental health risks that we think, study, think about and study when we're looking at mental health and sports is number one, anxiety, number two, depression.

Number three, suicidality, and number four, disordered eating. We do see challenges [00:25:48] from a mental health perspective in all those areas. And the best thing about the mental health challenges and issues is that we're great at diagnosing, evaluating, and treating those. And so, the pressures that just come with playing sports, especially in America, which is a very sports driven culture.

The pressures on young athletes have been greater than they've ever been. Young athletes are having exposure for everything from their videos of their games playing and making it on the Internet to getting sponsorships and advertisements. And the pressure that can come with this can really start to create a lot of [00:26:24] anxiety in athletes who also have depression.

Depression can come from being chronically stressed. Depression can come from being injured and depression can also come. When your career comes to an end, that's a particularly vulnerable time for athletes as well, for movement, sort of like depression. Then we have suicidality, which is really unfortunate when we see high school, college, or even professional athletes take their life.

And that is something that we can do a better job of evaluating. Everybody on the team recognizing that somebody is going through something and making the right person aware, be it a sports psychologist or [00:27:00] trainer, so that we can start to give them the help they need. And then you start to see disordered eating in certain sports gymnastics.

Sports that are very weight conscious. Then you start to see people get eating habits that are unhealthy, and this can lead to eating disorders. So there's a lot of mental health things that we really do need to make sure that we're supporting athletes across all levels of competitiveness. But especially our youth athletes, because that high school time.

It's called the formative years for a reason. Sure. People are very vulnerable for mental health issues at that point in time. And we actually [00:27:36] see that the majority of people that have

mental health challenges in adulthood, they began in high school. So getting people through this critical period of being at risk for their mental health is really important.

And I think it's something that we can do a better job of. And if I'm being honest, I think that's an area that we must improve.

John Salak: There's been a fair amount of coverage, of these issues for high level Division I athletes, and probably for lower level Division I athletes, but you just hear more about the high level Division I athletes.

Even though we need to do more of it for high school students, Is there an awareness there that, you had a bad game. No wonder you look [00:28:12] miserable or you heard your parent or somebody else shout something from the stands or whatever it may be. Is there enough of an awareness that this is affecting high school athletes?

Julius Thomas: Honestly, in my opinion, I'm very biased when it comes to this because

I think in general, there's just not enough awareness. We don't get enough time to talk about health. If you think about sports. News and media. If you had to break it down into a pie, how much time on that do we actually spend talking about health, educating parents, coaches, players, fans? We don't get much time.

So unless you [00:28:48] study this day in and day out like somebody like me does, like there's no way that you can have enough awareness. So that's what we have to continue to find ways to do and build. And get an opportunity like to come on this podcast and have a conversation with you because now all the listeners get a chance to get some good information and then start to realize like, Oh, I can follow that Julius Thomas guy.

He can start giving me more information, but we have to find more avenue and get more opportunities where we can talk about health. And I think that's really going to lead to seeing. Impact in changing the outcomes, but it's hard, getting a spot to talk about health isn't always easy.

John Salak: The [00:29:24] responsibility falls with parents to a certain degree to the athlete, but especially if you're 17, You may just be an athlete not even a great one. You may not have the confidence to say Yeah, hey, this is a problem, but it also must fall to a certain degree with coaches I played a little high school lacrosse.

All I remember is the coach poking me in the chest all the damn time and I wasn't very good. But I mean for a high school coach, it must be, for any athlete, it's going to be this major figure in their lives. Men and women may be pushing the wrong buttons, I assume, or could be pushing the wrong buttons.

I don't want to blame them entirely, but they're going to have an impact.

Julius Thomas: oNe of the things that I learned [00:30:00] when I was playing football. And this is something that I've carried with me throughout life. When things are going bad, you point the finger in, when things are going good, you point the finger out.

So the first people I'm going to point at our mental health professionals, right? Ultimately, it's on us. Those coaches and those parents didn't go get five, six year doctorate degrees. They didn't have to study the DSM. They haven't spent thousands of hours working with patients. It's hard for me to say they should know all these things.

I think it first falls on mental health professionals. To start advocating more and start going on the preventative office, [00:30:36] instead of just waiting by our phones for people to call us with major anxiety or depression or suicidality or develop a years, many years in length eating disorder. And then now we have to find a way to fix them.

I think as healthcare professionals, we need to be more vocal. We need to start creating programs, training opportunities. I think it would be beautiful one day. If coaches were in the high school youth sport level, they had to get certified in understanding mental health and being able to recognize that.

I can't expect them to have the same knowledge and acumen as a psychologist. But I do think that they should be [00:31:12] educated. I think that we've got to develop these programs and certifications So there's a parent, hey my child's coach whether Their sport doesn't matter has been trained. It has some basic level of understanding mental health and then even as parents .

You have the ability to learn more about how you can support your child's mental health, what mental health is, how to have conversations with them about that. And that's essentially why I started the parents playbook to give parents that opportunity, but it takes that extra step trying to go get educated and learn more.

And really what it comes down to is being there the best for the adolescent. Which is my [00:31:48] ultimate goal, and I think that's all of our goals, if we're all being honest.

The Role of Parents and Coaches in Supporting Athletes

John Salak: So, The Parents Playbook, how are we activating that? What's the next step? Certainly it's certification, but between now and mandatory certification, there's probably a pretty wide gap. So how do parents, coaches, administrators get involved? What are the next steps they can take?

Julius Thomas: Well, like I said, I pointed the first finger in at myself.

And one of the things that I realized is. It's not going to be a sustainable model for creating mental health prevention if I'm just a guy that sits by his phone and waits for somebody to call me and tell me that their child is not in a good place. So the first thing that I wanted to [00:32:24] start do was to start producing content to start giving people an opportunity to learn more about mental health on the places where people are already looking.

Social media platforms. One of the other ways that it's one of my first efforts to start disseminating quality information about mental health and performance. It's through my newsletter, right? So I have a free newsletter that I release every Friday and it just talks about different things related to really the journey of being a youth athlete.

And really it's designed to help parents and youth athletes have conversations. I throw some tips in there. I talk about a topic, whether it's [00:33:00] performance anxiety or. Even basic health information . I did a newsletter recently on the Olympic youth sports committee, and they did a whole study on youth sports participation.

How it's declining in the U S how that leads to other risk for health and illness due to sedentary behaviors, how kids respond. If the next day at school, if they've had gotten the opportunity to do sports the night before that day, so to really just start educating, take a second, two or three minutes to read more about something that could be really important and impactful for your youth athlete, I think, is going to go a long ways over [00:33:36] time.

John Salak: If you're a star quarterback, or you're even a starting football player, or it could be basketball player, anything else, sure, there's a lot of pressure on you.

But what about the guys who, or the women, who are sitting on the bench, not getting a lot of playing time, but may also be feeling these pressures? I assume they're at risk and maybe less aware they're at risk of some of these anxiety problems just because of the environment.

Julius Thomas: eSpecially when it comes to mental health, your status on the team may actually be more protective in some ways than people who have less status on a team. What you need to think about is overall mood for me. That's where I immediately put my [00:34:12] focus on what's somebody's overall mood. If you're the star athlete on a team, there may be times in a season where your mood dips because you got a lot, you didn't play that well in front of the scout you wanted to impress.

But what if you're the person that's on the bench, right? Like I've spent a lot of my time as an athlete on the bench, unfortunately, but when you're on that bench, it's really hard to keep your mood up. Number one, you're not getting the opportunity to play. Number two, you have whatever your thoughts and feelings are about not being good enough to play or coaches and giving you the opportunity to play.

What's that make your family think. So you've got a lot of those. [00:34:48] Some people, regardless of their athletic ability may have parents. It really want to see them be great athletes and the amount of pressure that their parents may be putting on them You may pay for a particular coach And their coaching style creates strains on your mood and your ability to stay in a state of positivity. So we have to look at everything around the athlete and how it's contributing to affect their overall mood and one thing I can tell you That I always like to say is look, we need to have net positive mood.

If any point in your life, whether you're an athlete or a non athlete, [00:35:24] if you have too many consecutive weeks where the net is negative for your mood, it's not going to be long before you develop a mental health issue. So mood is the first area that we should be looking at when we want to help people prevent mental health challenges and sustain positive performance and mental health.

John Salak: You have a very successful career both as a Division 1 athlete and a professional athlete.

And Ben you had some challenges, coming out of football. Your mood changes and all of these other things. Was this a positive journey for you? And it's, you've had an amazing journey up until 35. Like I said, you look like, it would have taken you a [00:36:00] hundred years to push all this together. Is this been a positive journey?

Julius Thomas's Personal Journey and Reflections

Julius Thomas: I have truly loved what has transpired in my life overall. I've had challenges of injuries. I got an injury that took two years to rehabilitate from. Like I said, I've been on the bench at times and I've had low mood, low self confidence, low self belief. I've got hit with the storms of the big challenges with being an athlete. But I think that what built within me is a resilience and a drive, and it's really defined my character.

thE pressure to perform at the highest level possible [00:36:36] when you get into the NFL and you start to play into really good teams, that starts to shape all your behaviors. The way I approach my doctoral program, the way I approach what I'm doing now professionally, it's all rooted in what I learned when I was an athlete.

So yes, have I had to experience highs and lows that come along with the game of football and basketball and other sports? Absolutely. But would I do it again? Yes. In a heartbeat. Because for me, it's not about going through life saying, and I don't want to ever experience any risks or I don't want to ever experience any emotions or challenges [00:37:12] that are uncomfortable for me.

It's about chasing the things that matter to you. Waking up every day with a drive and excitement for what you're doing. And that's the way I like to live my life and no shame to people that don't write. Some people have different levels of risk aversion. I'm biased. I play football. So obviously my risk aversion is not so high.

But, that, that was the way that I wanted to go about it. I loved it. Some of my best friends to this day came through sports. Some of what sports allowed me to do, like go to college, like now get a graduate degree. I grew up with 13 other guys, my age. I was the only [00:37:48] one who graduated from college.

And I know that was because sports got me to college and then they didn't have that same opportunity. So, sports is something that, that I'm, I still love. I'm still passionate about even now as a older retired guy, I still spend a lot of time watching various sports.

John Salak: sO, and again you're a different level because you're an elite athlete, played in the NFL, Division 1 athlete.

And for younger people, I think it was 2014, President Obama said, hey if I had sons, I don't know that I'd let them play football, was that a reflection of the time? Younger athletes, whether it's football or something else, sports [00:38:24] can and should be a positive experience provided we put some of these things into play, whether it's protective for concussions or mental health issues or anything else.

Julius Thomas: I think that there's first a touch on Obama's comment. I understand it. I tell people all the time, football is not for everybody, right? There's a certain mentality you have to have. There's a certain joy you have to have for colliding into people.

I think there's a level of competitiveness that fits every youth athlete. I want to see all young people getting up and participating in sports because it's [00:39:00] the best way to get physical activity.

Not enough young people right now are getting the recommended amount of physical activity a week, and that is going to end up creating tremendous health problems later in life. We talked a lot about concussion and the risks associated with that, but the risks associated with sedentary lifestyles. And for me, that's as big of a concern as concussion.

And so we really need to get all of our youth up moving around. There's so many sports you can choose from basketball, soccer, pickleball. I mean, hockey, lacrosse. Find the sport that you and your family enjoy. [00:39:36] Take your kids, do it with them. Maybe they get into it and they say, you know what, I'm going to allow this to be something that consumes a lot of my time.

where'd you rather have a kid spending time sitting in front of a TV, getting more screen time that we know leads to mental health challenges and the other chronic and diseases later in life are outside playing, making friends. Supporting their mental health. Like that's what I really want to see.

And that's why I spend a lot of time really being an advocate for youth sports and encouraging parents to get involved with them as well.

John Salak: And certainly the impact that COVID had on [00:40:12] shutting down our systems. And we've written about this a lot at WellWellUSA and spoken about it on this podcast through student.

program student athletes isolation, increased sedentary behavior, created a hole. So it's a normal hurdle. And then it's been this COVID impact dropped on top of it. Julius, how do people get in touch with you, get your newsletter learn about a parent's playbook.

Julius Thomas: One of the best ways that parents could start to follow me and start to learn from some of this, content that I'm sharing around mental health, wellness well being is, to follow me on social media, I have an Instagram Julius [00:40:48] underscore Thomas.

I have a Facebook Julius Thomas. I also have a Tick Tock Julius dot D dot Thomas. Or talk a lot about mental performance and mental health and things that people can do to support that. I've also got a website, parents playbook. com. On that website you can read my blog, you can also sign up for the newsletter, which I really encourage.

Because every Friday, I call it Feel Good Friday . I'm going to send that newsletter right to your inbox, and then you're going to be able to have a three to five minute read is something that you can work on or have conversations with your youth athlete.

Is parents can become the first line of [00:41:24] defense. and preventative health for their children. But mental health professionals haven't done a great job of educating parents on how to do that. So this is really why I did it. I have two sons myself with another child on the way. I'm a sports dad.

I feel the emotions during the games. I know what it's like, and I started to think, how many parents haven't had the opportunity to get a master's in clinical psych and be working on a doctorate. How did they handle the emotions within themselves, within their youth athletes so that they can support them in their journey, whether it's recreational or competitive.

And I [00:42:00] thought, you know what, this is going to be my way of giving back my way of doing that. So, I think it's a tremendous resource. I think it's an amazing place to start. And, just following my content over time, I promise. That whoever's doing that is going to definitely grow in their understanding of mental health and performance.

John Salak: That's great. And lead happier, healthier lives and enjoy sports for all the benefits it can give you.

Julius Thomas: Every family can go play with their kids, right?

Like, sedentary behaviors is hard for adults too. And so when you get the whole family out. And you guys play together. I don't care if it's frisbee, [00:42:36] spike ball, tag. That is good and that's healthy for everyone. So I'm big and encouraging families to get outside, play together. It's going to be good to create bonds and strength of the family unit.

That's also going to help our mental and physical health at the same time.

John Salak: iT sounds like a winning formula. Julius, I want to thank you for taking the time to talk to us. Giving us a unique perspective and also clarifying maybe some of the preconceived notions that people have that may not be exactly right.

But as you say, it's really worth it. It's stuff for parents, coaches, whomever to start exploring. learn a little bit more. They may not agree with everything. That's okay [00:43:12] too. But learn and keep going forward.

Julius Thomas: I love that you guys reached out and really took this opportunity to educate your audience by having me come on and talk about mental health and brain health. So I think that's a fantastic job that you guys are doing. Really excited about your work.

John Salak: We will do that.

Thanks Julius.

Conclusion: The Importance of Awareness and Education

John Salak: Before we move on, we want to again encourage listeners to take advantage of the hundreds of exclusive discounts WellWell offers on a range of health and wellness products and services. These cover everything from fitness and athletic equipment to dietary supplements, personal care products, organic and free.[00:43:48]

Just visit us at WellWellUSA. com, go to Midlands Discounts in the top menu bar, and the sign up form will appear. Signing up will take seconds, but the benefits can last for years. Okay, so whether you support contact sports in school or not, chances are they aren't going anywhere anytime soon. And that's probably a good thing, because they do a lot of good for student athletes.

But it is also important that we know how to better handle the related [00:44:24] challenges to minimize their impacts. This is especially true. for the hidden challenges of sports that can come via concussions or mental health strains. Areas that are a little more difficult to spot than your standard injuries.

The first part to dealing with a problem is identifying a problem. Coaches and administrators may care, but they may not be equipped to recognize a problem, so parents, and if possible, athletes, need to take charge. Signs of mental strain can be tricky, but they certainly include mood swings, changes in diet and [00:45:00] behavior.

Ender reluctance to engage. Signs of concussions are easier to spot. They include blurred or double vision, eye strain, light sensitivity, unusually sized pupils, eye movement, trouble focusing, confusion, loss of consciousness, extended headaches, extreme sleeplessness, or trouble waking up, vomiting, and weakness, numbness, or trouble walking or talking.

If you or someone you know has any of these symptoms, it may be time to get help from a doctor, [00:45:36] psychologist, or other professionals. It is also important to stop all physical activity until an assessment is completed. Knowledge is the ultimate power in protecting yourself or a loved one, so please empower yourself.

Understand what the symptoms are with these challenges, and what your next steps should be. That's it for this episode of What the Health. I'd like to thank Julius Thomas for his time, information, and insights. If you'd like to learn more about his work, please visit Parents [00:46:12] playbook.com. That's parents playbook.com for now.

Thanks again for listening and we hope you'll connect again soon for one of our upcoming episodes Of What? The Health.

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