00:00:06 Shreya: There is a stage of life no one really prepare us for. Not the build stage, not the proof stage, but the stage where the question quietly changes from what I'm achieving to how am I actually living day to day? And if longevity is the goal, maybe the deeper question is what kind of life are we trying to extend?

00:00:28 Shreya: Welcome back to the podcast where we slow down, look inward, and notice the patterns that shape how we live. I'm your host, Shreya and today we are talking about longevity wellness. During the fifth stage of life that season where energy, identity and purpose often get renegotiated. Join me is Michael Dorfman, a certified health and nutrition life coach and investigative Author who has spent years helping people build wellness through the whole food plant based living. And this conversation is not about chasing youth. It's about building aliveness with clarity, simplicity, and self respect. Welcome, Michael. I'm honored to have you on my show.

00:01:13 Michael Dorfman: Thank you Shreya. I was looking forward to this conversation.

00:01:18 Shreya: Thank you so much. And also, like when you hear the phrase the fifth stage of life, what do you feel are in points to what changes in people internally beyond what's happening in their bodies?

00:01:33 Michael Dorfman: Well, uh, the fifth stage of life is, uh, I'm eighty four years old. So the fifth stage of life is I gave the name to living life, thriving in life beyond the age of eighty, which would be eighty. And however long you you live. So for me, it's been a a special time because I've rediscovered, uh, a new identity for myself. Uh, it's, uh, I'm enjoying life as much as I've ever enjoyed. Even when I was twenty, thirty, forty, and fifty. So, uh, it's, uh, I'm trying to, uh, pass this on to people and, and coach people and, uh, just share with people what, uh, what I mean by, uh, getting a new identity and what is the reason that, uh, I'm here thriving and not just surviving, uh, beyond the age of eighty.

00:02:41 Shreya: That's such a powerful reframe because I think it immediately takes, uh, this out of biohacking into, uh, something more human, uh, like with attention, meaning, and how we relate to time. And I'm really curious, like, what is the most common misconception you see about longevity wellness in this stage? Like the story people tell themselves, that sounds reasonable but quietly sabotages them.

00:03:09 Michael Dorfman: Yes, exactly. Uh, people have this impression or they, you know, not everyone, but I think most people that, uh, life, uh, when you get into your seventies, uh, even your sixties, that life is sort of on the way out. It's, it's, it's not a time to look forward to something. It's basically to, you know, survive not getting sick, not getting a chronic illness, not, uh, you know, suffering through depression or, or just, you know, many of the things that people suffer when they're in their seventies, like here in the West, for example, I live in Mexico. I've been living here for over fifty years. Uh, the life expectancy is somewhere in the mid seventies or, uh, or upper 70s. And if people live beyond eighty, it's, uh, it's something special. But it doesn't mean that you're really thriving beyond eighty. I think people, uh, would just love to, you know, uh, manage their lives and live out as many years as they can and can and be as healthy as possible. But I'm talking about something different. I'm talking about, uh, truly, uh, you know, having living a fulfilled life, uh, after the age of eighty. I think part of it is because, uh, you know, people have this, uh, uh, conception that, uh, you know, life is, uh, you know, because of the, of the, uh, of the amount of years we're supposed to be living that, uh, there isn't that much to look forward to. And, and I think that people don't understand that there's so much that that they have inside of them and so much, uh, there's so many resources inside of us, you know, whether it's appreciation, whether it's peace, whether it's love, whether it's joy, whether it's being conscious, these are our, our, you know, resources that we all have. And these are resources that never die. It's the same resources we had when we were young. So now for me, you know, it's the time to get things together, put everything together and see what do we really have and not just accept what, you know, maybe doctors tell us or the science tell us that, oh, it's time you're going to go into, you know, an old age home or, you know, you could just sit around and watch TV and just enjoy those years as best you can. So you know, I'm talking about something that's different.

00:05:55 Shreya: Yes. I'm also like, when someone believes it's too late or it's mostly genetics, what tends to happen next in their choice? Do they, uh, get numb, overwhelmed, rebellious, or just quietly stop trying?

00:06:12 Michael Dorfman: Uh, I think each person is different. Uh, I think that a lot of people, uh, they don't see much hope. There's the, the, I guess it's the, the social media or the information that's out there doesn't really deal much with these, this time of life. It's, you know, it's eighty and beyond is, is not really you don't see much information on that in the general in, you know, whether you're watching TV or you're, uh, or you're listening to the podcast or you're listening to what the, the press and the science and the doctors are telling you. There's not that much hope. It's, there's not that much, you know, they don't focus on that time of life. And that's wrong. You know, people retire, uh, in the at the age of sixty, many people look forward to retiring so that they can just, uh, sit around and, and, and just, you know, do whatever they thought they'd like to do. But nobody is really saying what you really should be doing. And I just wanted to focus a little bit on, uh, part of, uh, what I've learned and what part of my, uh, you know, what I do in my daily life is based on, uh, the, uh, the blue zone people, the people that are living around the world, uh, considered the healthiest and longest living people, uh, in the world. So they have lifestyle practices which I've put into practice myself. And this is part of what I do. And, uh, so, you know, there are things we can do when we get older that, uh, help us to really, you know, become more like hopeful and put our life on, you know, a different perspective, a more active life, not just, you know, when you retire, you don't work anymore. It's time to just relax. And that's exactly the opposite of what we should be doing.

00:08:22 Shreya: Yes. I think the real enemy is not age. It's hopelessness dressed up as realism. And, uh, I think like also in your experience, what is underneath the struggle to change at this stage, especially for people who are intelligent, capable, and know what to do but still can't sustain it.

00:08:44 Michael Dorfman: Well, I think we have to start, uh, uh, listening to and researching, uh, some of the, the information that's out there on alternative media, on podcasts, like, you know, your podcast, there's, uh, there's so much information on how to, uh, stay physically, emotionally, uh, and, uh, mentally and as well as spiritually healthy. Um, there's information out there for people who are not aware that, you know, that it is. And that's what I've been, I, right now I, I spend my, so much of my time, uh, investigating, researching and seeing what else can I do? What else can I do? Because it's true that there are certain parts, you know, uh, physically, uh, our body is, uh, declining as we age. We're not. We. I don't have the same energy as I did have when I was in my thirties or forties, you know? You know, I'm in my eighties now, but, uh, you can there are things you can do, you know, that will keep you physically healthy so that you can really, you know, like I, I have, I don't know if you are aware of the game. It's called pickleball. It's a very popular game here in the West and more and more popular around the world. It's a competitive game. And I play, uh, it's, it's, it's, uh, sort of a cross between, uh, tennis and ping pong. And I played this game four times a week, and I play against, uh, people in their thirties and 40s. And I do very well against them. So. And I don't when I play against people that are younger than me, I don't even look at them as their age. I just look at them as, you know, I'm, I'm playing well and I'm doing very well, you know, playing with them. So I think that, you know, wanting to stay healthy physically, emotionally, mentally, and even spiritually is really, uh, what we need to do. And if you want to thrive as we get older.

00:10:54 Shreya: Yeah. And, uh, if you're honest, a lot of wellness is not just about food. It's about what food is doing for us emotionally. And in this stage, what are people most often trying to soothe, prove, or avoid?

00:11:12 Michael Dorfman: Uh, well, I the most important thing for me is I think it's a very, it's fundamental is what we eat. The, our diet, uh, and the importance of, uh, eating nourishing foods, which for me, it's, uh, plant powered foods, plant based foods. It's, I'm not saying that you have to be one hundred percent, uh, plant based. Uh, but, uh, there are certain things that are necessary that the body thrives on. One of it is fiber. Uh, fiber is, uh, what it, uh, it is the healthiest food for our gut microbiome, for the bacteria that inhabit our body. And they love fiber. And when we give them the fiber that they eat, uh, which is, comes from plants, they convert that into, it's called short chain fatty acids, which strengthens our immune system, strengthens our overall health, our brain health, uh, our emotional health. So fiber is very important. Uh, and unfortunately, the great majority of the people in the West here, ninety five percent of the people are, uh, are fiber deficient. We're supposed to be getting. Women are supposed to be getting twenty five grams of fiber and men thirty eight grams of fiber, and they don't even get fifteen grams of fiber. So this is one of the reasons that in the West, so many people suffer from chronic diseases when they're in their seventies, at least seventy percent or more get to have at least one chronic disease. And once you have a chronic disease, whether it's heart disease, whether it's cancer, whether it's type two diabetes, osteoporosis, or high blood pressure, obesity, uh, once you have a disease like that, it makes it more difficult to really enjoy your life, you know, past eighty. So I think, uh, what you eat is very important. Uh, then you have, uh, you know, staying, uh, active and, and doing exercise and not especially going to the gym, but, you know, with these people who live in the blue zones, uh, they are active, they don't retire from work. They're working, you know, through their eighties and 90s. So it's very important that people stay active and don't sit down and get stuck on the screens, whether it's a TV or whether it's on the phone. Uh, so that's very important. And also, uh, having purpose in our lives, uh, when you get older, you know, that's one of the things, you know, with not, uh, you know, having hope when you have purpose, you have hope because then you're focusing on, okay, what can I do? What can I do to help people to enjoy my life? Uh, so when you start thinking of purpose and meaning in your life, it changes everything for you.

00:14:19 Shreya: I think that's the sole mirror moment that, uh, when we realized the problem is not discipline, it's the relationship we have with discomfort, loneliness, uh, fear and change. And also like, what does longevity sabotage look like in everyday life during this stage? Like? Are the subtle patterns that don't look dramatic but compound over time?

00:14:45 Michael Dorfman: Well, I think one of the things that's really, uh, very, uh, you know, dangerous for, you know, for people as they get older. And one of the things that's happening in our cultures is that we became, uh, we're not, we became too, uh, uh, relaxed. We became too, uh, uh, to, uh, what's the word? It's, uh, we, we're living in our comfort zone all the time. We retire or we get older. We're not staying active. We're, we're enjoying living in our in comfort. And we don't take on challenges anymore. Now I'm talking about all kinds of challenges. I'm talking about physical challenges, whether it's doing exercise like I was mentioning, uh, or, you know, emotional challenges of, uh, you know, reducing stress in your life, you know, and that's also there are practices to reduce stress in our lives because stress has become such a major, uh, major detriment to our well-being as we get older and stress is just completely rampant, you know, throughout our lives, whether it's stress from not having, uh, enough money to live on, uh, we're going to stress because we're losing our jobs, stress in our relationships, stress because of what's happening in the world with the craziness that's going on. So we have the stress that's become so important. So it's very important because stress, no matter how healthy you are physically, if you're in stress, you know, living a life of stress, uh, it's going to cause chaos and it's not allowing will not allow us to really enjoy our life. So, you know, reducing and dealing with stress, managing stress is very, very important. So that's another thing. And, and the other thing, which I feel people don't have this connection. They're so involved in this physical world, whether it's, you know, making money, getting the biggest house, getting a new car, uh, you know, is it they're so involved in that that they don't, they lose touch with the connection with inside of them. And that's very important. That can be done through meditation, through tai chi, through, uh, yoga. There are different, uh, things to do. So we really have to see this world of living in your eighties as a new opportunity to start connecting with what's really important.

00:17:20 Shreya: I love that because, uh, it makes longevity less abstract and I think it becomes, uh, listen to the whisper before the body has to shout. And also, you are known for the whole food plant based living. But I want to approach this gently, not as a rigid identity. What does the realistic longevity routine look like in the fifth stage that is sustainable? A culturally flexible and not perfection driven.

00:17:51 Michael Dorfman: Okay, well, I'm definitely not in favor of perfection because I'm not perfect. And I'm always trying to remember that because even though I'm trying to, you know, do the best I can, uh, I'm aware of that. So what I tell people is that, you know, I try to help people and I tried to connect with them where they are. So if, uh, you know, if a person talking about, uh, nutrition, if they're not plant based, I start out very simple because I believe in, in habits that, uh, so much of the time, you know, we're living, we're we have habits. And, uh, these habits can change. So it's very easy. Habits can change in, in, in a very short period of time. And sometimes if, you know, for example, if we're not eating healthy. So I say, well, okay, what are you eating? Are you eating any plant based foods, you know, during the day? And they'll say, of course, they're eating plant based foods, whether it's, they're eating a salad, whether eating, uh, beans and rice and, uh, and, uh, vegetables, uh, you know, nuts and seeds. People eat those things. So what I, I try to, you know, okay, if, uh, if you would like, if you're interested in, in really changing around your life, let's see what we can do. What small change can you do in your life with, with regards to nutrition and, uh, well, maybe it's, uh, what do you eat for breakfast? I know a lot of people like oatmeal. I love oatmeal, I eat oatmeal very often for breakfast, so I try to find out, well, what are you eating in your life? That's actually plant based. And maybe you can add something else. So, you know, I have a diet I follow, uh, which is completely plant based, although I'm not saying that you have to be plant based, but the more, uh, plant based foods you add in your life, uh, the more fiber you're going to have, the more, uh, polyphenols, uh, different, you know, plant chemicals. That really is what our gut microbiome really needs to thrive on. So that's what I do to get them started with that. And as far as, uh, exercise, you know, do you get out at all? You know, if you don't do exercise, well, it's time to get up and go out and do some exercise or even, you know, you know, people work, they sometimes work eight hours a day. Uh, so, but, you know, take the time to get up. You know, I, I sit down and I write, I, I'm, My book is going to be out next month. My longevity wellness revolution. So I'm sitting on. I'm in front of the computer a lot and I'm doing podcasts, I'm doing writing, but I make sure I get up and just take the time to. If you're at a desk and you're working somewhere, you know, find a way to move around in the desk, get up, take a break. So that's very important. And for people who work at home, a lot of people are working at home now on the computer. Uh, yeah, they have the time to, to just, you know, do exercise. So this is the type of thing. And, and as far as, uh, you know, purpose having purpose in our life, which is very, very important, do things, you know, don't just do things that you work, you make money to make money. You know, what do you really like? What, what do you have a joy in your life? Do you like to sing? Do you like to help people? Do you like to play a musical instrument? Uh, do you like to? I love to write. So this is what I discovered late in life. Uh, do you like to make people laugh? Okay. Make people laugh. So finding things that make that fill you. You know, uh, doing volunteer work is wonderful because you're doing things for others and that's helping people. And when you help people, uh, it comes back to you. Uh, you know, in many times over.

00:21:46 Shreya: Yeah. I think that's the kind of approach that feels respectful and less convert your life and more return to what your body recognizes as care. And also, I have a reflection question for the listeners who was quietly scared, who feels their body changing and worries they have already missed the window. What would you want to say to them? Person to person. What like about what is still possible?

00:22:15 Michael Dorfman: Well, you know, I was, uh, I changed my diet. I became a vegetarian in nineteen seventy six, but I was a heavy meat eater and dairy eater, and I was overweight. So, uh, for me, the, the, the most important thing is it's never too late. It's never too early and it's never too late. If you can do it, start early because a lot of people believe that, uh, you know, uh, when they're young that, uh, there's no problem. Oh, I'm young, I'm in my twenties, thirties, forties, even fifties. And you don't have any symptoms. But the problem is, or the truth is that diseases start early in life. You know, cancer doesn't start, you know, when you're a women goes in, you know, in a mammogram and all of a sudden they detect a, uh, uh, something, a spot there and they, oh, it's early detection. No, it's not, it's not early detection. It was just, it had to reach a certain size so the machine would pick it up as cancer. But this started many, sometimes decades ago. My father used to. He worked. He was a painter when he was younger. Uh, and he was working on ships and there was asbestos. He used to work in the, in the, in the hull of the ships. And he was exposed to asbestos, asbestos, which we found out was, you know, causes cancer later on. But this was in the nineteen forties. He didn't have the symptoms of cancer for until forty years later. So people who think that, oh, heart disease starts when you're sixties and seventies, it's not true. It starts early in life. Starts even when you're a child, you're obese as a child. There it is. That's the seed of getting sick. So I tell people that don't believe this, that you know, it's you are okay until you're sixties or seventies. It's not necessarily that. That's why it's important to start early in life. And people who are sick with, you know, chronic diseases. Um, you can reverse these chronic diseases. I, I, I tell, I had this experience which turned my life around, uh, because, uh, I had been, uh, eating plant based foods for a couple of years and a friend of my wife and I, uh, she got the heart that she had a heart attack and she was rushed to the hospital. They did bypass surgery, and they sent her home, and, uh, she had a, uh, she, she was okay for a year. And then she had after a year, she had, uh, pain in her arm, which was possible sign of, uh, heart problems again. So they called her back to the hospital and they wanted to put a stent in because the vein that replaced the original artery was clogged. Because why? Because, uh, the cause of the, of the heart problem was there, and it wasn't, uh, removed. So they, they told her, they tried to put the stent in and it didn't fit. It was too narrow, the vein. And they told her they wasn't, they couldn't do anything. They sent her home and told they didn't tell her, but they told my wife who was with her during the surgery, during the the that time. And her son, uh, her name was Beatrice, her son that she had about six months to live. So I heard about that and I, I had at that time, I was reading books on how, uh, doctors and health professionals were having tremendous success in reversing heart disease. So I gave her this book, which was, uh, how to Prevent and Reverse Heart Disease by Doctor Caldwell Esselstyn, who was one of the chief surgeons at the Cleveland Clinic in the United States. And she went, she said she read the book and she went on a plant based diet, not one hundred percent. It was like eighty five, ninety percent. And she, instead of living six months, she lived almost ten years. So to me, it was like, wow, this changed my what I was going to do in my life because this was a well, seventeen years ago, I became plant based and I wanted to help people. And that's why I want to tell people is that it's not a death sentence. Maybe doctors will tell you, oh, you're going to have to be on drugs the rest of your life, or you can just manage it. We'll just manage your symptoms and that's it. No, not necessarily because, you know, lifestyle and proper nutrition, what I'm explaining is, uh, can reverse different diseases. It can reverse cancer, some cancers, heart disease, type two diabetes, remove your obesity, uh, lower the blood pressure. So there, it's out there. And that's what my book is all about, that it's coming out, but there's more information out there on, uh. If you search for it, uh, that, you know, it's not the end. You know, it's, it could just be just the beginning.

00:27:25 Shreya: Yes. This is so beautiful. And thank you for sharing this with our audience. And if after this, my listeners want to connect with you and want to know more about your work, then what's the best place to find you?

00:27:36 Michael Dorfman: Well, I have my website with which is longevity wellness revolution dot com. I'll send you the, uh, you know, the, the contact, the information. I'm also on Substack, uh, which people can subscribe to. Uh, I, I send out, uh, articles every week on this, these, these topics. And I'm also offering a free, uh, longevity wellness, uh, guidebook, which is sort of the The entrance to my my book, which is coming out next month, but this is free of charge. Uh, and, uh, I will give you that information too. It's, uh, longevity, wellness revolution, uh, slash guidebook. So, uh, you'll have that. So anybody who's, who's interested in finding out what I'm all about when I'm trying to do and, uh, more interested in the topic of what it's like to really survive, uh, past the age of eighty.

00:28:39 Shreya: Yes. And I will definitely make sure to attach all these details and links below so that the listeners can find them easily and get in touch with you. And for my listeners, if today's conversation meet you at the right time, then take one small thing from it one meal, one walk, one choice, one honest look in the mirror and let that be enough for today. This is the podcast. I am Shreya and until next time, be gentle with your body. Be honest with your patterns and keep choosing the kind of life you actually want to stay in. And do not forget to hit the follow button. Subscribe and feel free to share your thoughts because your ears deserve premium content. Thank you.