Kelsey Rae Dimberg

[00:00:00]

Laura: Hi, Kelsey. Welcome to write your next podcast.

Kelsey: Hi, thank you for having me.

Laura: So happy to have you here. Tell us a little bit about yourself.

Kelsey: My name is Kelsey Rae Dimberg, and I am an author living in Chicago, Illinois. My new book, Snake Oil comes out on September 17th, and I'm really excited about it. It's a, I like to think of it as kind of a Hitchcockian suspense novel set in San Francisco in the high pressure world of startups. And it centers on three different women characters.

One is the CEO and founder of a wellness company called Radical and Radical is like an up and comer. It's really successful. The CEO is named Rhoda West and she's Very Instagram happy and just kind of the very polished persona. Another of the narrators is named Danny Lang and she [00:01:00] works at Radical and is a big believer in kind of Rhoda and wellness and she's a big enthusiast.

And then the third narrator is named Cecilia and she is not a Into radical at all, and she just doesn't buy it. She thinks it's total scam that wrote is just a con artist, and she has kind of at the start of the book has kind of dedicated herself to debunking radical and trying to tear wrote it down.

She was like a journalism major in college and she's really bitter that. She's ended up working at customer service at a wellness startup. So she's like kind of applying her writing and journalistic skills to try and take Rhoda down. So that's the story begins with those kinds of three different personalities.

And throughout the story, there's like a cat and mouse chase as Rhoda is trying to close a fundraising round that will [00:02:00] value radical at a billion dollars, so the stakes are high.

Laura: The stakes are high and it's just like it's so house of cards are gonna fall apart with just one little thing, like it's a great.

Kelsey: exactly.

Laura: I found it like really fascinating to read this book and understanding like, because you're trying to figure out how is it all going to converge and how is the house of card going to fall apart, like, because it's just bound.

It's like the train is moving really fast. It's gonna crash. It's like, it's just there. And the rest of it, Cecilia is like, calling it from the inside, but just talking to Twitter and telling them like, Hey, here's all the issues. It opens up this place of like, starting questioning. It felt very reminiscent of Theranos when the Bad Blood book came out and how even though it's like a unicorn and like, how this is a great innovation and it's like actually having someone be like, actually no. [00:03:00] This is not really

Kelsey: And that's obviously Theranos is such a big, bad, awful example because that was so flagrant. But when you read about startups, there's a lot of like the culture of, Overselling is huge. So it's really common for founders to kind of brag about how big they are going to be. And it's so there's an awful lot of like hot air.

So it's actually pretty common for there to be that feeling of like tension, like where what's happening inside the company is kind of different from the outside image. And that kind of tension, Is really a great place as a fiction writer to kind of exploits cause there's already that instability.

Like you called it a house of cards where like you can coast by on your reputation and your momentum and you're like good vibes and your image for a while. But then if something goes wrong, You can kind of really [00:04:00] quickly nosedive. I think WeWork is another really good example of the CEO, Adam Newman was a really big talker.

He got a lot of people excited and then he just couldn't keep up with his kind of big talk.

Laura: Yeah. And then we mentioned to the world wellness, which is a billion dollar industry of not, it's just, everyone feels like they want to feel better. They want to feel healthy. They want to feel good about themselves. They want to have the inner glow and whatever. And so there's a, there's an industry that tries to tell you, like, you have this problem and I have a solution.

And sure. And people who are not science backed. Or have actual training or proper, proper credentials, and I'm not saying credentials, the important thing is, it's like, you have the experience to actually provide a solution, create a place of like, are you selling me snake oil, like, essentially, or are you selling me an actual solution?

Kelsey: it's such an interesting industry. And so part [00:05:00] of it is that a lot of those words aren't regulated at all. So natural, that doesn't mean anything or green holistic, those are words you can just put on anything. And, Just kind of nobody's gonna check out if it's true or not. So that's part of it.

And then I think, so my book is not like a straight like critique of wellness, because I think the truth is that some of the things wellness sells. do have a really long history of being like treatments that might help people or things that are healthier for you than like mainstream medicine or prescription drugs and stuff.

So it's like one of those tricky things where there are valid things being offered, but then there are also Like things that are being way over promised. There are definitely things that are like snake oil that are probably haven't been like undergone any rigorous studies to see if [00:06:00] they actually have any impact.

I was just on Instagram and because I've written a book about wellness, I now get all the wellness like stuff. And so, I always, they always think that I'm going to want a big mask that shines a light on my face. And I don't know what this is for. Like, I actually have no idea. Is it to make me look younger?

I don't know. But that,

Laura: there's a red light therapy so it's supposed to like make your skin glow and like youthful and like it just replenishes there is also like, it goes to the gamma there's some innocuous things that you're just doing you're like, kind of like magical. And then there's like the crazy ones you're like, I need to enjoy the sun fully and sunscreen is cancer.

It's like, it goes this is like, well, everything's going to give me cancer. Why am I going to do this?

Kelsey: yeah. It can be a very Fear mongering place.

Laura: Yeah.

Kelsey: yeah, I think for sure where you [00:07:00] start to feel nervous every time you eat something like regular off the grocery store shelves or that's like totally pure and harvested on a mountain in Greece or something.

Laura: So the, except that like the stuff is like, doesn't make sense. Like, like you're like, it has to be an egg, but like our soil is already messed up. So it doesn't really matter. I think I'm glad that some supermarkets have told them, please do not shoot, like record here, This is just getting to the point where I'm like, Okay, what are you trying to sell?

But again, some stuff does have history, some stuff does prove is proven that it works, and some stuff doesn't. And it's just you have to be discerning of like, how you consume information, who is providing the information, what kind of background they have, what kind of experience just because and one of my issues is just because you cure yourself with that doesn't mean that you can cure the whole world with a

Kelsey: yeah, definitely. And that's another thing, the wellness influencer that you see does [00:08:00] tend to be somebody who looks, they're kind of naturally good looking and they seem naturally athletic. So then it's hard to take them like, Oh, well, this. Is a weight loss thing, or this made me feel so healthy.

It's like, well, you kind of look like maybe your jeans played like a large role in that as well. Like Gwyneth Paltrow is the obvious example who just is a movie star. So she obviously is quite beautiful and you can't necessarily buy your way into looking like Gwyneth Paltrow, but that's a little bit what she's selling you.

Laura: Like the food,

Kelsey: I'm actually a little bit fond of goop just because I was, I've been a subscriber to their email forever.

Laura: too,

Kelsey: So she used to send out like granola recipes and it was really kind of homey. And then all of a sudden now it's this huge, it's a really big company and she is a very, she strikes me as somebody who really believes it.

And he was very like welcoming. I actually watched her Netflix special And it was [00:09:00] like, it was a little unusual. It was about couples, kind of like couples therapy almost, but she was super open and seemed very like, just, she just wanted to like be totally open to any ideas. And so I don't know.

Laura: yeah, I think

Kelsey: is.

Laura: Yeah, I think I was an early subscriber to like in the 2010s, like when she sent this newsletter and she did an edit about meditation, and it opened up this window I actually do practice meditation on a regular basis, found it just really helpful and really healing. And, but it was like that actually that edit, like, I was like, Oh, that's actually was really helpful.

Like I got something out of it. That's, wisdom, like, obviously, we want to quiet our mind and want to do all the certain things. And it's a someone who has anxiety. This is a difficult process. But it is a tool. So sometimes sharing those tools can give you can inspire someone's journey to take

Kelsey: Yeah. That's a great example of something that's like real, [00:10:00] that's wellness, but you know, it's not for sale. It's just a really good practice. Same with me. And I think with the, she did a mindful breathing exercise or a newsletter. I can't remember. And that was like it genuinely was helpful. So there's some good stuff in there as well as some.

red light face masks for a thousand dollars.

Laura: Yes. It's just the world is your oyster, how we can capitalism, how we can solve, all of this and make millions of dollars and live in Bali and,

Kelsey: Yeah. What can we sell?

Laura: have this beautiful lifestyle. So, so, Kelsey, tell us what kind of books do you tend to read?

Kelsey: I read pretty much everything. I'll read any genre. I'll read Contemporary books, classic books. I think in my questionnaire with you, I gave you some different examples, but like recently I've read Skippy Dies, which is this really great Irish novel set in an [00:11:00] Irish boys school. And it kind of opens with one of the students.

Dying in this mysterious way. And then it's a multiple point of view novel with some teachers and some other students. And so it really is it almost seems like a crime novel at the opening, but it ends up being this really like textured and vibrant story about the school and about being a teenager and about what, this kind of fine line between adults and children, it's just.

Some of the adults are more immature than the students. And I really loved it. It was a really good story. And then what else have I been reading? I'm picked up the new Kate Atkinson book. I love the Jackson Brody series. Again, it's like a crime novel, but it's ends up being so much more than about just the whodunit element.

I haven't actually started the new one yet, but her Jackson Brody series has this kind of detective at the center of it. So you think that it's going to [00:12:00] be, male, middle aged, kind of lone wolf detective solves crimes, but then she kind of trades the baton between all the different characters.

So you can get like, sometimes it'll be like a random old woman on a long running soap opera. Who's you're not even sure how she's related to the story until the very end. So the author Kate Atkinson kind of throws in lots of characters and they have really kind of funny distinctive voices and her plots are really big and kind of driven by coincidence and so they end up being kind of Almost like I'm turning like the what the crime novel expectation on its head and just doing like almost the opposite of what you're supposed to do.

But she really pulls it off because I think because her voice is so funny and her writing is so strong. And, [00:13:00] the by the end, the detective is kind of like. barely hanging on to even understand the full nature of what's happening as the crime kind of pieces come together. So I love that series.

I read a lot of like contemporary women's fiction, I guess you would call it if you must. But I also read a lot of I've been on kind of like a mid century kick lately. I've been reading this crime author named Margaret Millar, and she was married to Ross McDonald, who I think if you're into crime, he's like maybe the name that's bigger.

And his novels are more like Raymond Chandler kind of a male private eye. at the center of them. But Margaret Millar's novels were written around the same time, set in California, and they're very modern feeling. They have a little bit of like that a couple of her stories have a little bit of that, [00:14:00] who's crazy, like, am I losing my mind narrative that I consider.

Kind of more recently popular with like Paula Hawkins and some of the more modern thrillers and she also has a lot of modern books about race and about gender and about kind of insanity and grief that all feel really modern. And she has a strong sense of place, which is something that I love in a book.

She has a really strong sense of this kind of California that's starting to be suburbanized but is still a lot more rustic than what we would recognize now. Highly recommend her. And another series that I read this summer because my life has been really hectic with a book coming out. And I told you my house has been under construction.

So we just have been moving from Airbnb to staying with family and just moving around a lot. So I needed some [00:15:00] comfort read books. So I picked up the Kazalit Chronicles. Which is this amazing book series written by Elizabeth Jane Howard a British author, and they're inspired, I think, by her family's story, which is that she had a really big, dynamic family, and they owned, like, a country house, and before World War II, she had a food court.

Thank you, Liz. They all kind of, were the story starts before world war two and they, the family, it's a really huge multi generational family story and kind of the patriarch and matriarch have this country house and then all the different families have like the in laws and the children. And so there's a lot of drama and then things kind of kick it off with world war two.

Kind of being declared and everybody leaving London through the blitz. And [00:16:00] it's just, I would describe it as a little bit of Downton Abbey, but like better written, like there's, what's the Butler's name? Mr. Bates doesn't get charged with murder, like six times. So they're just like really well written, but really juicy and they're thick books, but they go by like really fast.

They're just a treat.

Laura: I love this recommendation. I'm actually like interested in both the mid century. Novel and this one, just thinking about it, Dan's gonna be, but said in this world of like,

Kelsey: Yeah, like later than Downton Abbey timeline wise, but very

Laura: idea, because Downtown Abbey said in, like, before around World War I, like, the same idea of a little more, more modern sensibilities that, you know.

Kelsey: So they still have a couple of servants, so, which is kind of interesting.

Laura: Awesome. Kelsey, tell us what you can find [00:17:00] online.

Kelsey: Yeah, my website is kelseyraedimberg. com and I'm also on Instagram at kraedimberg and that's it. And you can of course find Snake Oil available for pre order until next Tuesday anywhere books are sold and then it'll be out on Tuesday, September 17th.

Laura: thank you, Kelsey, for being on the show.

Kelsey: Thank you so much.