It's time for Barbecue Nation with jt so fire up your grill, light the charcoal, and get your smoker cooking.

Now from the Turn It, Go Burn

it studios in Portland.

Here's jt.

This is an encore.

Hey, everybody.

Welcome to the nation.

That's Barbecue Nation.

I'm JT along with my co host, co pilot and co conspirator Leanne Whippen, along with Camaro Dave and Commander Chris.

They're lurking about somewhere.

And we're coming to you from the Turn It Don't Burn it studios here in the Portland, Oregon area.

We'd like to thank the folks at Painted Hills Natural Beef Beef the way nature intended.

You can check them out online@painted hillsnaturalbeef.com well, if you're into competitive barbecue or just high quality barbecue and high quality barbecue equipment, you probably recognize this name, Old Hickory Pits.

That's O L E. And we've got the founder here, David Knight, with us today.

And what an honor it is to talk to David.

David, welcome to the show.

Well, thank you so much for the invitation.

That's not.

You know what, you forgot something.

I didn't hear you say restaurants.

My first wood chicks restaurant I had in Old Hickory in there you go.

Yeah, I had the big boy in Florida too.

Yeah, restaurants too.

Not just competitions.

Right, right, right.

That's my error.

My bad there.

So what was.

Let's get this out of the way first and we'll talk about all kinds of things about Old Hickory.

But what was your inspiration to actually start this?

I mean, you, you just walk down the street one day and go, man, I'm going to make some really high end smokers and grills and stuff.

And that was it.

Or what prompted you?

Oh, no, no, that'd be way, way too simple.

This actually started when I was in the first grade.

I grew up in a little town of Poplar Bluff in southeast Missouri and went to Mark Twain School.

And lo and behold, I met a friend in first grade whose family had a barbecue restaurant.

And so it was a regular stopping spot for me after school to go by the barbecue restaurant.

I was always just mesmerized by the whole process and so forth.

So then many, many years later decided going into business.

That's the business I decided to go into.

Wow.

Had you had any experience besides on the consumer side of things with.

No, not really.

Basically just hanging around the restaurant as a child.

But we, the, the boy I got met in the first grade became a lifelong friend.

And in fact, he, he just passed away a few Years ago.

But he was not only a friend, but he was also a mentor on barbecue.

And his whole family, they were all very nice about sharing ideas and so forth.

Wow.

First grade, huh?

Yes, that's.

Back then, we still had the stone tablets, you know,

little chisel action there.

Oh, man.

Homework.

You carry that stuff home and be worn out.

Well, that's.

That's kind of an interesting statement to me.

And because.

And Leanne's been through this, if you do television shows and at the end of the competition or whatever you're doing, and they come up and some producer sticks a mic in your face and says, well, how does it feel or what does it mean to you to win the, you know, the oven mitt competition in Belle Fourche or something?

And they want you to say, oh, it mean the world to me.

But you're the one actual person I've heard that said.

I started in first grade and I believe you.

So that's a.

That's a good thing.

That's good to know.

I got some credibility here.

You got some credibility.

So were you a success straight out of the gate?

Well, I don't mean first grade in the Stone tablets.

I mean.

Well, my.

My first barbecue restaurant was a success.

And.

Yeah.

So right out of the gate, I guess with some good tutelage from my friends and a lot of hard work and so forth, I opened a restaurant here in Cape Girardeau, Missouri.

And it's right on the Mississippi river, which they call Port Cape Girardeau.

And it's in a historic building.

It was built back in the 1800s.

And so to put barbecue into it, I had to come up with a method.

And there was no technology whatsoever in 1974 when I opened.

So the choice was to build a brick bit or use a barrel.

And this was a beautiful building at three stories high and arch windows and made out of brick.

And so it was an easy choice to say, I'll build a brick bit there.

And so it was kind of a, I guess by guessing, by golly, kind of thing, designing.

And it had one really dangerous flaw.

I had to put a damper in the flu.

It was three stories high.

And so when you're cooking a lot of meat and it's going up a 18 inch diameter flu three stories high, it can really get out of handle fast.

And the third time the Cape Girardeau fire department came to put the restaurant out, it dawned on me that there probably should be a better way.

Yeah.

So that's.

That started a long journey to find out Better ways of doing it.

What?

But I think that experience, you know, cooking in a brick pit or whatever experience you had just besides eating barbecue probably helped you build that.

And I don't mean physically, but mentally in your, in your design, in your mind, I would think.

Right.

Yeah.

Well, you're lucky.

I mean to have your first restaurant as a success.

That's a tough gig.

Yeah.

The odds generally about 4 to 1 on being a successful right out of the shoot.

Yeah, it's a risky business really to start.

I've had a little bit of experience.

Leanne's had a lot of experience in it.

And I'll put it this way.

I'm glad I do what I do these days.

And yes, not in the restaurant business anymore.

So what, when did you get into pit manufacturing then?

That was several years later.

It evolved over a period of years and a lot of trial and error.

Try this, try that.

And eventually started making pits that people liked and grew from there.

Now we had Meathead from Amazing Ribs on last week.

He's a frequent contributor to the show and they have a.

An article on the AmazingRibs.com website about not all stainless steel is the same.

How did you go through the trial and error to select what product and what grades and things that you use?

Okay, well, we're not getting too far out into the weeds.

Let me explain it there.

There are different gauges and different types of stainless steel but for food service generally 304 is, is okay.

Now we do use three 16L stainless steel for the ones that we put on the Carnival Cruise line because they have to be marine grade stainless steel.

So it's a really much more pricey product than the 304 stainless that we use on other regular bits for, you know, non marine use.

Yeah, well, with the, I have a little experience on the ocean and it can, it, it's hard on, on any product marine areas, you know.

Right.

If you get in some of those big ships and you look around, it'd probably scare you to see how much rust and pitting there is sometimes.

But that's a good thing.

Did you start out as just building a home product and then, you know, expand into more commercial or competition grade?

It was for the, for the first 30 years it was all commercial stuff.

You know, basically what I was doing was trying to create for my own business and then it just happened that go from there that other people were having the same fire problem I was having and went on from there.

I see a couple of hard hats in the back on your filing cabinet there.

Oh, yeah, yeah, that's.

Well, actually, one of those is for a casino that I built here in Cape Girardeau.

Back then it was the Isle of Capri and it's been sold two, three times since now.

And that's owned by Century Casino.

It's just two blocks from the office here.

But anyway, that's the hard hats.

I get it, I get it.

I only have either cowboy hats or golf hats anymore.

And I've never seen Leanne wear a hat.

So I might be in the snow next week.

One of those toboggan type hats.

I'll get her.

I'll get her one of those from Grumpy Old Men Walter Mathow hats with the little flaps on the ears.

I think she would look good on that.

How have your home units if it.

As it were.

David, we got a couple minutes left before we go to break here.

How have they evolved?

And I know that's probably a long story, but.

Yes.

Get us started with that and then we'll pick it up on the next segment too.

All right.

Yes.

The, the small.

The challenge was to, to get it in the configuration.

It didn't take up so much room.

So actually I wound up spending many years to do it.

I did it actually at the urging of a friend of mine who just passed away this last year, Mike Mills.

He kept saying, you're going to have to make a backyard model.

All these big pits.

There's more backyards than there are restaurants.

And honestly, it took longer to do that than anything.

And we've got two ways that we do them.

We have small ones that are like our big pits, have gas burners that fire the wood up to temperature automatically.

Or we have ones that are strictly charcoal and wood fired and so forth.

Basically same technology, just in different ways of starting the fire.

Okay, we're going to talk about that.

We're going to take a break here on Barbecue Nation.

We're going to be back with David Knight, the founder of Ole.

That's O L E Hickory Pits.

And I'm when you talk about me, I'm old on that.

So Leanne and I and David will be back right after this.

Stay with us.

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This is an encore.

Welcome back to Barbecue Nation on the USA Radio Networks.

I'm JT along with our cover girl, Leanne.

Whip it.

That's good.

Nice job.

Thank you.

Nice job, David.

If you're really nice, maybe I can get her to autograph the COVID of Barbecue News and send you that.

Wonderful.

Yes.

That was really.

She was on the COVID of that magazine this month.

Yeah.

Yes.

If you want to email us, just go to Barbecue Nation, JT.com and you can email us for Facebook, Twitter and all that.

We have the show accounts, and then Leanne and I have separate accounts and so you can find us out there.

So I wanted you to explain the convection technology to us in a.

In an overview.

You don't have to get down to the minutia, but what does that mean?

And how did you come up with it?

Okay, the.

The answer the second question first, that it came up the same way we do everything, trial and error and what worked and so forth and not.

So basically what it's all about is moving the heat and smoke in a way that continually is recycled and that.

Or at least spends as much time in the cooking chamber as possible without being drawn out through the flu.

And so it's a fine tuning of airflow and motion and that to.

And of course, separating the fire from the meat so that it doesn't catch on fire.

Does it go in a.

And this is just really a question for me, I guess, but does the.

From the heat source, does it then go in a clockwise or a counterclockwise and is there a fan to push it out or how does that work?

All of those are yeses.

So it does go in a clockwise and counterclockwise.

And so just to draw you a picture, imagine, if you will, the.

The firebox underneath the.

Where the meat is the cooking chamber.

Sure.

But it's separated with baffles and insulation, so forth, so that it doesn't wind up catching on fire like the.

The old styles used to.

So then the heat comes up the back of it and then comes up to a curved top, and that helps keep the.

The pattern of airflow in A manageable sense.

So then it comes up the back, across the top, and then down inside the cooking chamber in the front by the doors.

And then fans then power surge it or boost it, if you will, to accelerate it and keep it move in this circular direction.

Okay, so when you were creating this, how many.

I don't know what you used as a test product, whether it was racks of ribs or a pork butt or just a, you know, a little piece of meat or whatever.

But how much of.

How many.

Whatever you use for a test product, how many of those did you kind of burn up before you got it?

Well, I'm going to be honest with you and tell you, not very many.

Good.

By that time, I knew that we had to have the temperature, even temperature.

And then, as Leanne can tell you, it's all about low and slow cooking.

Barbecue is a slow process, and it's not like grilling where the meat's directly over the heat source and so forth.

So it was more just fine tuning the airflows and so forth, but not to the point where we were burning up meat.

What's the difference between your technology and convection?

Because it sounds like it's kind of the same.

Yes.

Convection is a generic term meaning that it is moving air.

So the similarity is that mine moves.

It moves the air, the heat and the smoke.

But it does it in in a unique way because it's for barbecue.

And the fact that we're using live fire, but yet controlling it and making sure that the heat and smoke is evenly distributed inside the cooking chamber.

Well, I have a challenge for you because it seems like you're up on technology.

I want to know if you're going to make the first self cleaning barbecue pit.

Oh, yes.

Yeah.

You can be my first customer.

It was always a challenge at the restaurant was taking the racks out, you know, and washing them.

And, you know, the way you design your pit, it makes it very easy to get the grease out of the bottom.

But still, self cleaning would be a nice feature.

Sure enough.

Well, but you're.

You're first on my list to call when we get there.

Okay.

I. I have a. I have a suggestion for you, and I've actually said this many times on the show, but I don't think I've said it since you joined.

Leanne was.

Now, I don't know how it is in Florida.

I'm assuming it's the same way.

I've seen these in Missouri, because I've been to Missouri quite a few times.

I take the racks out and I take them down to the self car wash and hang them on the mat rack and blow them off there.

It works really well.

And so for a buck and a half or two bucks, you don't have to clean up the grease in your own patio or backyard or restaurant.

Just a little pro tip there.

That is a good.

An excellent way to do it, if you have access to that.

Yeah, it worked.

Works out really well.

Leanne, what was your experience like in using Old Hickory's?

Well, it was my first restaurant, and I.

And I remember it vividly.

I got an El Edx, which is equivalent to, like a Southern Pride 500.

So it wasn't the largest one.

It wasn't the smallest, but I needed it to be adequate enough to service the restaurant.

And what I did was I faced it through the wall so it was actually outside.

And I, you know, I was able to retain the square footage inside the building, which worked out great.

But as David was saying about, you know, the smoke and how you vent it out, I happen to be in a small mini mall, and I had to build a stack outside because every city is different on their requirements.

And it had to be built so that it had a fan and it went outside the roof line, so it was very tall.

And I thought it was going to affect the heat in the cooker, but it didn't.

It actually worked out just fine.

You know, from end to end to the center, if you set, you know, thermometers across those racks, you're going to find that the temperature is consistent.

And then it goes in racks that go in a circular motion so it's constantly moving the meat, and it's just.

It's a miracle.

There you go.

Well, speaking of miracles, we're going to take another break, and we'll be right back on Barbecue Nation with Leanne and David Knight from Old Hickory Pits and myself, who I'm just here today.

Anyway, we'll be right back.

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This is an encore.

Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.

I'm JT and We are visiting with David Knight from the founder and mastermind behind Old Hickory Pits.

We'd like to thank the folks at Painted Hills Natural Beef.

Beef you can be proud to serve your family and friends.

And also Gunter Wilhelm knives.

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Very efficient in the kitchen.

That's Gunter Wilhelm Knives.

Find out more@gunterwilhelm.com so, David, how are your barbecue skills?

Well, let's see.

How shall I address this?

I guess so they must be okay.

I'm in the Barbecue hall of Fame.

Ask me a question or something.

Where you want to go with this?

Well, let's put it this way.

When you were a kid and you were hanging around a barbecue store with your buddy from first grade.

Yes, sir.

Did they teach you not just about how good the food was, because I think that's what probably drew you to it, was hanging around there with the food.

But did they.

But did they kind of teach you, give you pointers?

Did they say, like, we make this by doing X, Y and Z to this rack of ribs or whatever it was?

How did that come about?

Yes, because there are some eccentricities to fixing and preparing barbecue.

For example, the ribs, for example, they have, they need to be dressed.

You know, really try to scrape the.

The globs of fat that kind of cracks over there.

And then on.

On the inside of the rib cavity, it's kind of curved like that.

The inside curve there.

There's a membrane that you have to remove and.

Right.

It's called a peritoneum.

And you very carefully get a hold of that and you can pull it out just like you're skinning a rabbit and then throw that away and then trim it up.

And Boston butts, a lot of people like to trim a little fat off of them before they do it.

And same thing with brisket.

And then there's some people like to leave it on there, saying that that's going to give it more flavor.

So there's a lot of regional eccentricities that go into it.

Leanne brought this up in the last segment when she was talking about using old hickory pits.

How easy is it to clean?

I mean, literally, I've been in barbecue stores now, these much smaller individual patio style units.

Yes.

I've noticed this very few times.

Will the, if you will, the husband ask about how tough is it to clean?

His wife will ask, because she knows the first time she looks out there and sees a fire on the deck coming out of the smoker or whatever they bought, and she will turn around and ask the husband, if she's cleaned it.

Now, I've made a joke out of that, but it's actually kind of true.

So how easy is it to clean?

Okay, There's a lot of hints that you can do, and Leanne kind of mentioned some of them, one of which is, as she said, using a power washer.

If you have a commercial pit, a big one, and you're cooking hundreds of pounds of meat a day, you're going to create some.

Some grease and, and crust on the racks.

And so your best friend is a power washer.

And then also some people even like to take them out and let them soak overnight when.

And use some degreaser and let it rest all night long.

And then it really comes off easily.

So there's different methods and so forth, but a lot of it is.

Power washing is a big help.

Is there.

Excuse me for my lack of knowledge, but is there an actual grease catch outside the unit hanging down or something or.

It's basically a drain and typically it'll be on one side or the other of the pit.

And then it has a off and on valve so that when you're cooking, you leave it closed.

And then when you're ready to clean the pit, you open the valve and drain the grease out into a bucket and then you can start your cleaning process and then drain all the water and soap and all that out.

There you go.

It works for me.

Did you do that, Leanne, or did you have somebody do it for you?

Oh, no, I'm very well aware of what goes into it.

One mistake that people make is that they let the grease out, say at nighttime, and they go, they start the cooker the next day or whatever, and they forget to close it.

So reminder, keep the bucket under there always.

Yeah.

Yes, I did.

Yes.

Yeah, guilty.

Not on an old hickory, but on some other ones that I've had or.

Another pro tip, folks.

If you've got a smaller unit at home, you got to empty the bucket once in a while too.

That's true.

Because if you don't, thing you should

do is get a recycle bin to recycle your grease so you can put it in the back of your restaurant or, you know, and you just dump the grease in there and then it gets recycled and you actually get paid a whopping penny or two per cow.

I cheat.

I use it on my burn pile.

We.

We can still burn here.

So I have, with all my shrubs and stuff, I usually have a big pile silver on one side of the property and I go over there and I'll pour it on there.

When things are a little damp in the spring, you know, that helps them get going.

I'll just put it that way.

You can fill in the blanks for yourself.

Were you met with any resistance at all?

I mean, when you came out with these, David.

The commercial ones I could see were, were restaurateurs and stuff are going, wow, that's really cool.

But when you started doing the home version, so to speak, they're spending.

I'm sure I didn't look at the pricing, but they're spending.

But also, you know, people were used to half barrels and, and cutting them and, and putting racks on them and creating their own smokers and all that kind of stuff.

Did.

Yes.

Did you run into immediate acceptance or a little bit of wow, I don't know.

Well, I.

That's interesting that you asked that because I was very fortunate to have a friend that was in the competition world.

His name is Doug File.

He lived down in Tennessee or Mississippi, but at any rate, he traveled the competitions serve circuit and he said, hey, can I.

That looks pretty snazzy.

He was up to the factory here visiting.

He said, can I try that out at the competition?

And I said sure.

And so he took it.

He had a trailer and headed off and he called me up, he said, hey, it works pretty good.

I won and can I keep it a while?

And so he kept it that season and as they say, the rest is history.

Yeah, yeah, I.

Well, you know, there's nothing quite beats success.

Yeah, it is, but.

And it's been these bits.

For example, if you'll take the big contest like Kansas City Royal and Memphis in May, you see them there and, and the people have had wonderful luck with them or success over the years with them.

And there's one model, you know, in country music they got a saying, if you're going to go to Texas, you got to have a fiddle in the band.

Right.

But if you're going to go to Memphis, Tennessee, to the big barbecue contest down there and you're going to be cooking in the whole hog category, you better have an All Hager double wide.

How many different selections do you have?

I looked at your website last night, but I didn't go through product by product by product, do you have everything from.

Well, I know you've got them from the home version to play the game up to big, but do you also.

How many of those do you have and do you ever custom make them for people?

We do.

We have about six big Models, basic models.

Now these have variations and it winds up being like 30 miles or whatever.

But sure, but, but the basic floor plan, about six big models and different in size.

And then the small ones there is about three and a four, four sizes and the small ones and that they're varying in size and so forth.

So the, the one, the, the biggest one we make is called Hogzilla.

It's in fact, I don't know if you've ever seen a Hogzilla Leanne, but it, you can park a Volkswagen inside of it and yeah, it's big.

It'll hold a couple thousand pounds of meat at one load and then the smallest one would be about £40.

So anything from that to that.

Did you find that your sales went up during COVID Yes, ma'.

Am.

That's good.

Good for you.

But I guess you couldn't get them made, right?

You could take the orders, but you couldn't make them because you couldn't get them.

Well, fortunately, fortunately, being the eternal optimist I am and not knowing that the pandemic was coming or whatever, we, we took all that winter before everybody got sick and everything went back and that we were just building bits as fast as we can and said, well, it's not fresh produce, it's not going to spoil.

You know, let's see what.

And so lo and behold, when we were under a mandate, at one point they actually stopped us from manufacturing for a brief while.

But then, but we were able to reopen because we do a lot of work with the emergency people that feed

people in emergencies and operation, Operation Barbecue Relief and all that.

Yeah, that's one of them.

We sponsor that one.

That's when we helped start about, oh, 10 years ago.

That's been quite a phenomenon itself there.

You got these wonderful people that donate their time and energy to come and cook and feed people they don't even know.

It's pretty amazing.

We've fed over 10 million meals.

Wow.

We're going to take a break.

We're going to be back with David Knight from Old hickory pits and Ms. Leanne, our own cover girl, right after this.

On barbecue day.

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This is an encore.

Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.

I'm JT along with Leanne Whippen, and we're talking with David Knight today, who is, as the founder, creator, and head mahu at Old Hickory Pits.

Must be quite a life, David, that you.

You've created this and you've done it, and you've been very successful at it.

Any changes that you, in hindsight that you would make?

Oh, hindsight's always 20 20, so it's kind of hate to second guess myself, but you're right.

The barbecue world is a fascinating world to be in, and Leanne can attest to that as well, because there's so many opportunities to travel, to go to barbecue contests, go to barbecue restaurants, and see what the rest of the world is doing.

So it's really a wonderful group of people all out there trying to.

To barbecue at their best.

And do you ever go to the competitions?

Oh, yeah, Hang out with them.

But I've judged, I've gone to contests and all that.

We.

We don't compete, but we kind of help provide equipment sometimes to people that.

That need help and that.

Yeah, we go.

I always go to the Memphis in May and also the Kansas City Royal.

Those are.

And you gotta.

Gotta be theirs.

Yeah.

I don't know if you remember this, but I was at the royal competing, I don't know, long time ago, and we ordered our meat to be delivered to our sites, and I ended up getting boneless pork butts.

And you came along, and I was having a hissy fit.

I'm like, I have to have bone in pork butts.

You actually.

I don't know if you remember this, but you went out and you got me bone in pork butts and brought them to my site.

And that's a logistical nightmare, you know, at the royal, because, you know, how wide.

I don't know if you remember that, but I vividly remember that.

And you saved the day and you got.

That's so sweet.

Thank you.

That's pretty cool.

That's a pretty cool story.

What do you have on the horizon, David?

What are you looking for now?

Are you designing new things?

Well, the first thing is to get that pit that cleans itself.

Yeah, that's number one.

No, no.

We are in constant pursuit of new avenues of getting a better product to the customers.

Our theme is to let us help you barbecue at your best.

Yeah.

So we got our ears attuned to what people are cooking, how they want to cook it.

Do they want to do it faster, slower?

Do they want more smoke, less smoke?

Just really kind of keep it.

They say if you keep your ear to the ground and your nose to the grindstone and your best foot forward, your odds are you can't even go to work because you can't move.

Yeah.

So that's true.

You got to keep all those things going at once.

I was going to say you get a dirty ear, a bloody nose, and a club foot doing that.

You got it.

But we do.

We do try to try to constantly improve and seek out the opportunities for doing some new stuff.

Right, right.

In overall, this is a question we ask most of our guests.

Is the progression of the barbecue, especially the competitive barbecue world.

Do you.

Are you happy with it, or do you think we should do something different?

Or.

Just give us your overview real quick.

Okay.

You mean as far as the rules?

Yeah, the rules, the competitions.

You know, we have.

We have people on here that I would say, and I think Leanne would agree with me, push the envelope as far as the.

The finished product, they're pushing out.

And then you've got other people that have been around a little longer saying, man, it's, It's.

It's too much.

We.

It's like in golf, they always want to roll back the golf ball because the golf.

Current golf balls fly so far.

And, you know, and it's like that in, in most competitions, there's always a few naysayers, but overall, what's your take on barbecue competition these days?

I think.

I think it's.

It's.

It's pretty good shape, honestly, if you look at it.

The two biggest sanctioning organizations is the mbn, which is Memphis, and then the kcbs, which is Kansas City.

Then we also have many, many state organizations that have their own rules and even cities.

For example, in St. Louis, barbecue organization, from my perspective, I think there's enough diversity of opportunity.

If you don't like this, go to the other one.

And it gives a variety, a variety of items to cook.

You know, you, ribs and beef and pork, and even some of them do anything but beef or pork.

And as a.

As a kind of an odd extra product.

Yeah.

So I think.

I think there's a good balance in that, and I Couldn't come up and think of a critical thing I could say about it.

That's refreshing, actually.

Well, the winners tell jokes and the losers say deal, damn it.

Deal.

Yeah,

that is true.

David, is there anything in barbecue that you have not done that you want to do yet?

Whoa.

Honestly, not off the top of my head.

I mean, I was pretty well, seeing a lot of stuff.

Give me a week or two here.

Okay.

All right.

Do you sell your pits internationally?

Oh, my gosh, yes.

Yeah, we had them all over the world.

And so now that's a fun thing, too, is to.

To see your equipment in a foreign country.

And so I don't get to travel internationally near as much as my son Alex.

He.

He does a lot of our international stuff.

But anyway, we have pits in.

In all the continents and so forth.

And, you know, it's interesting.

In foreign countries, I. I liken it to what in the United states, let's say, 50 years ago, where pizza was back.

You know, pizza at one time was not on every street corner, not in the filling station, this, that, and the other and so forth, but now it's a mainstay and.

And so forth.

Barbecue is following that same kind of evolutionary process to have at one time been that one place in town, kind of off the beaten path to now that's mainstream, gets credit in the magazines, and all of the accolades go to barbecue that it should.

So we're going to get out of here.

David's going to stick around for After Hours, but we've been talking to David Knight from Old Hickory Pits and fascinating story with David.

And like I said, he's going to be on the After Hours segment, so you want to track that down on the web.

But, David, thank you for being here.

Well, thank you so much for the invitation.

Yeah, you're most welcome, Leanne.

You too.

It's been a long time.

Leanne and I will be back next week with another edition of Barbecue Nation.

And remember our motto here, folks.

Turn it, don't burn it.

Take care, everybody.

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