[00:00:00] HAnnah: Hello, and welcome back to the awfully quiet podcast you're in for a real treat today. The conversation you're tuning into is so much about why I started this journey one, obviously, because I want to change the narrative of what it means to be awfully quiet and show you how you can honor your personality, your innate strength.

And quiet demeanor and still be hugely successful in your career. The second reason why I started this journey is rather intrinsic, a little self serving really. And it is for me to naturally connect with brilliant leaders, entrepreneurs, people I look up to. People I connect with, you can imagine it's a type of networking almost that is a lot less awkward than just reaching out to someone asking to have a coffee.

And this particular connection today actually happened in the most beautiful introvert friendly way in someone reaching out to me after we met at a virtual event that was hosted by Nadia Gabrielle, who I had on the podcast a few episodes back. Talking all things, human design projectors in corporate it's episode 21.

If you want to go back and listen, it's one of my most listened to podcast episodes to date. Now, the conversation I'm bringing to you today is with someone who I dare say I have a lot in common with. We're both introverts. Human design projectors, second line hermits, and Enneagram 3 achievers. You know the feeling when you meet someone for the very first time and it feels like you've known each other for years?

That's exactly the feeling I had chatting with Emily Williams. Emily is a true entrepreneur, an international bestselling author, and true expert in all things digital marketing and small business growth. Her entrepreneurial journey spans founding a multi million dollar marketing and education company, launching her own publishing house.

And managing a product based business showcasing her innovative approach and entrepreneurial spirit. In this episode, we delve into Emily's career journey, starting with a really tough decision she made walking away from a seven figure business she co founded. We touch on how she aligns her client schedule and time to suit her projector energy and deliver great work in a way that honors the time she needs for herself.

And her family, we talk about foundational career questions, such as what success looks like about financial security boundaries and building a career that truly works for you, which sometimes means. That you need to make decisions that not everyone understands or likes. There is so much you can learn from Emily.

You'll find this feels a lot more like a genuine open conversation than an interview. And I have a feeling that this will not have been the last time you hear from Emily on the Awfully Quiet Podcast. If you resonate with this episode, Please reach out and leave a message. I'd love to hear your takeaways.

Now, without further ado, let's dive into the conversation with Emily. All right, Emily, thank you for joining me today and welcome to the awfully quiet podcast.

[00:03:47] Emylee: Hi, thank you for having me.

[00:03:49] HAnnah: I'm so excited for this conversation. Emily, we met at, one of Nadia Gabrielle's community events, all for projectors and It seems to be a theme recently. I keep connecting with projectors and projectors keep coming into my life based on this event and based on my interview with Nadja Gabriel and I couldn't be happier about it.

[00:04:12] Emylee: Look at us putting ourselves out there when that is not something that we do.

[00:04:16] HAnnah: It isn't normal, you know, but, where I'd love to start is, you know, tell us a little bit about yourself. What's your life and career look like at the moment? I know you have quite a The impressive journey behind you, lots of, lots of events, lots of detours, lots of, you know, very unconventional stuff, which I love.

So let's get in.

[00:04:38] Emylee: Yes, well, I'm an entrepreneur at heart. I've never held a traditional job ever. I graduated college and started my own business and that has ebbed and shifted and changed in the last while it's been 13 years now that I've been in the small business ownership space. Everything from being a photographer and copywriter to business strategist to educator and podcaster to offering, like, 1 on 1 services, group coaching programs actually dipped my toe into e commerce for like, almost 2 years during the pandemic.

Sold handmade earrings had a Shopify account. and now today I'm on my own. I offer consulting for other small businesses, typically in like, operational marketing. Support, I'm also a published author. I published my 1st romance novel in September of. 2023, and about to publish my 4th 1 in June of this year, which is very exciting.

So a lot of writing a lot of systems building and organizing behind the scenes and truly like. Loving it, loving it so much. I left a. I left a career that I had for about 9 years, about a year ago, literally, I think in 4 weeks, it'll be 1 year from when that conversation kind of started the domino effect of me leaving.

I had co founded a marketing agency and educational company and ran that co funded it and ran it for 9 years and. Decided that it wasn't for me anymore. A lot of alignment conversations. We can definitely dig into whatever we want to about that, but it was a. Quite a whirlwind in the past 12 months of a lot of life and career changes because of that.

[00:06:33] HAnnah: I love that. Let's start there because I'm so intrigued to understand what drew you in to the, you know, the decision to co found a marketing agency after, you know, doing a lot of things that were like small. You know, small businesses, as you say, what drew you in and what didn't work out in the end?

[00:06:55] Emylee: I You know, I was coming up in the online space. This was probably 2013 ish, and that was when, like, a lot of, you know, selling courses and creating small offers was really popular. webinars started to kind of take off. Podcasting was still not in its infancy, but booming. and I. I had a dream of being like a professor when I was in college, and if I was good at school, I probably would have stayed and kept doing that.

But I love strategizing and educating. And so the 2nd, I kind of got the opportunity to teach. I wanted to do that. So I started a photography business in 2011, 2012, and kind of. Just messed around with it for about a year and a half. I didn't have to make money at that point in my life. And so I just didn't really try.

but I had a conversation with my partner about a year and a half into having that business. And he was basically like, you could actually make this legit business if you actually tried, but like, I'm going to need you to try. so I started caring about and learning about selling strategies and marketing and client experience and nurturing and I started to just get obsessed with.

Like, experimenting and testing, and so I would change something about my. Customer experience, the client process and the very next lead I would get, I would run them through this process and I would see if I could make more money and if they would have a better time. And I basically just kept increasing my rate and changing the experience until people said, no, and I started to make.

Some pretty good money and really started diving into doing everything I could to learn about marketing and selling, but in the sense of making it a better experience for that client going through that process.

[00:08:51] HAnnah: important

[00:08:53] Emylee: once I kind of created my own process of what I felt like worked for me, I started teaching other photographers in my hometown how to do that exact same thing.

So a lot of it was with in person selling, creating like collateral for client experiences, using different language in your conversations for clients to get them bought into the idea, all of those sort of things. So I would host workshops or I sold a, I created a mini course that was, it's called, pricing for profit.

It was for photographers to make more money. So because of that course, I found myself in a lot of like Facebook communities of other small business owners. And I remember back in the day, I don't know if you were on Instagram at this time, but 2013 time was. Really big for, like, Instagram pods, so you would be in a pod of people of, like, 6 or 7 other business owners and they would follow you.

They would like every post. They would share your post. They would yeah, they would comment and so it helped the algorithm back when the algorithm was different and it would boost you and you would gain followers. So, I was in a Facebook group where they were organizing these Instagram pods. And you were supposed to comment, like, with your who's your ideal client and what is your basically core belief in your business.

And so I was helping photographers at the time, but my core message or strategy was all about how to be profitable. And someone had commented, and she said that that was similar to her core messaging, but she was helping a different clientele. So we could team up because we had the same kind of values and beliefs around.

Helping small business owners be profitable. So, she ended up being someone who grew up, like, 20 minutes from my hometown, and we had just never met. We had never known each other. And at that time, we were living 4 hours apart, but we just decided to collaborate and see what would happen. So, what eventually started as.

[00:10:44] HAnnah: Silence.

[00:10:54] Emylee: We were selling courses and hosting webinars and challenges together. And then about 2 years into all of that, we decided to actually form a 50 50 partnership.

And so that was probably around.

[00:11:07] HAnnah: Okay.

[00:11:10] Emylee: our partnership and so from 2016 to 2023, I guess,we. Ran this agency that did everything from low price, digital offers to a template shop membership to high price coaching programs, like 15, 20, 000 dollar programs to 1 on 1 client work website, building marketing, building.

And everything in between, we had a blog, we had a podcast that had like, over 800 episodes. I think by the time that I left and spoke at conferences, we held. Virtual events, retreats, summits, all of that, and grew a team eventually. So, at the very beginning, it was just the 2 of us and then we started working with contractors.

I think at 1 point, we had a team of like, 27 contractors who were doing various things

[00:12:03] HAnnah: Wow, yeah.

[00:12:04] Emylee: and then in 2021. I think we switched to full time employees and let go of, like, all of our contractors and had a team of, I think our highest was 11 full time employees, including the two of us. Benefits, 401k, stipends, like, all of the things.

Like, it was a company.

[00:12:28] HAnnah: Legit. Yeah, yeah. Wow.

[00:12:31] Emylee: I hated it. I hated it. I did not like it.

[00:12:36] HAnnah: Why not? Because it sounds like what everyone is selling as the dream on Instagram in terms of the freedom it must have offered you, the financial means, the success. What didn't feel successful to you in that?

[00:12:53] Emylee: So, I mean, I think a huge caveat to know you go looking into this conversation as the lens of. Remember that there were two co-founders, and so at the end of the day there are two CEO EO salaries that are needing to be paid. So you could take everything that I'm saying and say, okay, well there's only one founder in my business or the scenario that I'm wanting to run, and it could look vastly different for you.

I think the con the, the lesson I, or the realization I wish I had had before going into that. Relationship or building something that big was truly how expensive it is to run a business that size. When you have an email list of 80, 000 people, you have to pay for that when you sell courses and you have transaction fees, you pay

[00:13:43] HAnnah: Yeah

[00:13:45] Emylee: When you need to bill your clients or recur invoices or send contracts, you have a system that you have to pay for when you have a team that has project management needs and communication needs. You have to pay for those systems. When you offer insurance, when you offer these other benefits, you to pay for all that stuff cost money and the, what I started to see was.

The amount of sales that we had to make and I, I put that in air quotes because you have to make it to pay the bills to keep the lights on, but you don't have to make it. Because, like, your life doesn't depend on it. You know what I mean? Like, so have to, but it came to we had to make. This amount of money every single month that used to not even make an entire year and it for for what, like, for these really small profit margins at the end of the day for labor and work and mental energy that cost me as a projector.

A lot like it cost me a lot and I had started saying the phrase I kept using probably about a year and a half to 2 years before I left is we would have meetings about how do we feel like the business is running? What do we like? What do we not? Like, we would have those check ins with each other. And every single 1 of those meetings, I would say something along the lines of this just doesn't feel fun for me anymore.

It doesn't feel fun, and I don't know if fun is still the right word. But I think, like, what I was trying to communicate was. the juice isn't worth the squeeze. Like the time isn't worth what I'm getting. I can keep putting in all of this stuff and I know exactly what I'm going to get out of it. And from the outside, that looks pretty great.

Six figure salary, hours that you get to decide, like all of these things. But that I knew innately, especially as I started learning more about human design and learning more about being a projector. Being a 2 4 profile, what does that really mean for me? As soon as I started to learn more about that, I started to really, really believe that I could get the exact same amount of money if that's what it like, because we all need money.

Like, that's what, we can't argue that, but I could get the exact same amount of money for way less cost on my energy, on my time, on my creative energy, all of it, if I did something different. And I thought going into, I had those conversations with my business partner about what I thought that that could look like.

Keeping our partnership and ultimately, like, we, we weren't on the same terms with what we could change in order to get that. And so that's why we ultimately split. But. Yeah, it was for a good 2 years before I even left that. I just kept saying, this doesn't feel fun for me anymore. And how can we make it fun again?

And

[00:16:54] HAnnah: I mean, if you think about it, when, where you started is with the photography business, right? And that's a craft in itself. And it's like, it's a whole different muscle. It's a whole different business. It's, it's almost like more of like an art, isn't it? Then business strategy and marketing strategy and selling.

how did you go about acquiring all these skills anyway? I mean, from taking it from a photography business to, you know, I personally find, selling, you know, marketing, marketing yourself online. One of the toughest things to do in business. How do you go about that?

[00:17:31] Emylee: don't know who, I wish I had a clear answer for you. I, I, I, I love learning. I do love marketing and strategy. I love, I look at business. I look at honestly, a lot of things in life as like a science experiment. I, I'm going to think about something and I have this hypothesis for how I think I'm going to get there.

What do I think I need to do to get there? I'm an enneagram 3 as well. So I'm very like, the overachiever workaholic goal setter person.

[00:18:00] HAnnah: Hmm.

[00:18:00] Emylee: that probably has a huge factor here. I love making money. I love selling. I love. Building relationships in alignment. I, I knew that, like, leaving the business that I would want to have my own business after that it wasn't business or being a business owner that I was escaping.

It was how it was set up to run and how it was set up to support me. and that support changed over the years and my. My energy, my drive, how I wanted to show up changed. And so I knew that even if I can't get it here, I could create something from scratch with now all this new experience that could serve that, as far as learning.

I've taken a lot of courses I've tested, I've worked for free. I've worked with clients who. They said yes to me when I probably was like, over the stating what I could do for them, but I figured it out. I'm definitely someone who is like, Externally motivated, and so if I have a client who wants to work with me and has a need, I'm going to figure out how to tackle that problem.

I, I really love, like, investigating new strategies on how to solve something. I love new tech. I love new software. I think all of that kind of goes hand in hand with being a business owner. and so a lot of the perils that a lot of business owners have, where they talk about how they don't, they don't like checking their email or they don't like learning a new tech system, or they're not tech savvy, I think sometimes you have to navigate for sure.

Like I have a client right now who is not tech savvy at all. And I'm like, I can do a lot for you. And I do need you to show up in these spaces still, even though you hate it, or even though you don't like it, we have to find the way that is going to be an alignment for you. It's not that. don't like selling.

It's not that people don't like marketing or talking about themselves is that they haven't found out the way that actually feels good for them

[00:20:10] HAnnah: I love that, yeah. And I very much resonate with the stage of the learning process where you just find out what you don't know. You just find out everything that you don't know yet. And that is super stressful for me too. But it feels like it's exciting for you. It feels like you are fueled by the stage of the process where you don't know yet, but you know, you just somehow trust yourself and you know that you're going to figure it out.

And that might just be part of the picture is like, You also love the new and like creating and building the new. And it's probably why you've done so many different things.

[00:20:52] Emylee: Would 100 percent describe myself as, like, a visionary starter. I have more problems on the follow through and I think that that's why a business partnership served me so well for so long because my I was again. Externally motivated if there's deadlines that someone else knows about, or there's projects that someone else knows about, I'm going to fulfill on that.

I'm, Only daughter, eldest child over here, so who's doing the things to be the people pleaser and the teacher's pet and turning in the deadlines. Like, it's 100 percent me. So, I feel like that that external motivation was really helpful, but having a partner who could help with the accountability piece could help.

You know, brainstorm to find your strengths. I think that that was something I learned from being in a partnership of probably the 1st year or 2. My partner and I would work on the same things either at the same time, or we would both we basically be doing the exact same jobs just times 2. And it definitely helped us at the beginning, because it helped us get further faster.

We were doing twice the amount of work, but then as our business started to grow, we started to have conversations about, okay, well, it doesn't make sense for us to be doing the same work. Always, what are your zones of genius? What are mine? And I feel like having those conversations 5, 6 years ago. And readdressing them every single year.

Do you still like what you're doing? Do you feel like you do this better than me now? And you should take it over. Do you have questions about this? We need someone in our company to take this role. Do you want to learn something? Do you want to take a course to learn about this? And now you do it or are we going to outsource it?

I think having conversations like that, even if it's just you can really help you figure out where you want to expand. Great. And where you want to outsource if that's an option for you.

[00:22:54] HAnnah: it feels like you were very self aware and as a team, you were also very attuned to each other's needs and perspectives and strength, which, which does sound like it works really well. how did you like leading a team? Yep.

[00:23:30] Emylee: through a leadership training together as soon as we went from contractors to employees, we knew that there was a way that we wanted to show up for that team and really understand how.

What expectations we were going to put in place. And as someone who hadn't had a traditional job ever, my, my business partner had worked in corporate for years before we worked together. And looking back now, I can definitely see that in that moment of us deciding the structure of the team, I came into that strategy meeting, so to speak, where I felt like. I didn't have the skills or the experience because I quite literally didn't. I didn't have the experience of working in corporate or managing a team or being on a team or reporting to anyone. I literally did not have that. And since my business partner did, I definitely let her shape what that looked like.

And ultimately, That was a big reason why I left as well, because I, I would wake up every day quite literally feeling like I was going into like a corporate job that I dreaded and kind of have these meetings and we have these 1 on 1 and now we have this and it got to the point where I'm looking at stuff like.

We decided to do this. We picked this structure. Why are we taking stuff from corporate that actually sucks and bringing it into our business that we made up the rules for? And We couldn't really quite ever come to terms on, you know, 1 side of the conversation was the structures needed in order for people to know how to do their jobs and be held accountable.

And my leadership style was definitely more laws. I fair where I. I'm going to give you the autonomy and I'm going to trust that you're going to do your thing and I hired you for a reason. Good job, like, great. So, yeah, come at me when you have questions.

[00:25:27] HAnnah: I love it then.

[00:25:29] Emylee: Yeah, and only then. and that's

[00:25:31] HAnnah: Oh, my God. I love that.

[00:25:32] Emylee: that's if that's if we have such drastic leadership styles, then that's where you're going to butt heads.

And we did.

[00:25:39] HAnnah: I find it so, so interesting because that's often what I perceive online with like online businesses and you know, what people are striving for. And I still, Have a corporate job, which I'm happy with. And I'm obviously building business on the side and running this podcast, but I will often look at businesses that are much further ahead on their journey.

And I'm going to think to myself, like, is this what I'm going for? Because, you know, there, there are these structures with lots of, so like with lots of employees with like one to ones with like a lot of, Like active collaboration throughout the day. And I'm just thinking to myself, no, I, at the end of the day, I want to be in my own room doing my stuff.

Maybe I'll have an interview or two, but that's it. I don't want all these meetings. I don't want all these live interactions. I want to be creative. I want to work for myself. These are the sort of things that I'm, that I keep thinking to myself and it feels like you might be in a similar space, but like you just mentioned, like.

You know, you can create your business for yourself and you don't have to follow those same structures. What would it look like for you today if you were to build? I think you are building a similar size business. what does that look like? Like, how would you do things differently?

[00:26:59] Emylee: yeah, it's a great question. And I mean, again, because I'm such a, I look at things like experiments. It has been really fun the past year of going off on my own and building a consulting business and getting to decide. Okay, I have at that time I had 12 years of experience 9 of that being in a partnership where we had the gamut of structure.

What what do I want this to look like? What do I think is needed? What what was helpful in that role? That would be helpful here. So, some of the things I took where the same project management system. So, we used a sauna at my old company and I loved a sauna. I use this on a now and I have my clients set up and use this on a.

there were a couple of the. Like, KPI metric kind of marketing data strategy conversations that we would have that I found really helpful. So I, I would build something like that for myself here. Kind of similar mechanisms that don't really change the idea of like prospecting and then a discovery call on a proposal call that doesn't really change.

You can do it in a way that makes sense for you. So now I have it where we have our discovery call and then I record The pitch basically, so I record the proposal and I, I let you watch that and then we have a call where we go over it together. And so I like, I like the flow of that better, but that structure is still the same.

I use the same client management system that we used at my old company to bill and invoice and send proposals. Some of the things that I'm like, I already know how this system works. I'm not going to let myself get distracted by. All of the systems and softwares that are available to me, I'm going to try to keep because I, I very easily can. I kept some of the systems similar, but a right now, I don't have a team. I would eventually like. Probably a part time VA, I don't know what for yet. And so I'm not making that decision. And I, I talk about this, we talked about this a lot at my old company where we, we helped people kind of do the math about if you're working with clients, when are you tapped out?

as the business owner, you like to think that you have 100 percent of your time in the week, right? If you have 30 hours a week to work on your business. Okay. I can do 30 hours of client work. No, you can't because you need to prospect and you need to hop on calls and you probably have to have meetings and you also need to do that client work.

So when is that going to happen? So, if you fact, and you need to do your bookkeeping and you need to, you know, like, all of the things that make a business run. Okay. So do you really have 20 hours or do you really have 15 hours? Okay. So, based on that. How long are your projects taking you? And so are you capped out at 1 client or 3 or 5 or 6?

What is that number actually? So I think it's being really, really aware of what that looks like. And I, I'm at capacity. I'm only 1 person. I'm doing 1 on 1 work for clients. So I can't outsource it. I can't offload it. I'm in their business doing the things. Okay. Now that I'm at capacity. What are my levers to pull to either make more money or get more of my time back?

And so that's where I'm kind of sitting right now of. Is there any work that I'm doing right now that I could have an assistant do. Maybe, but then I'm turning myself into an agency. Where are you I sell you on the thing and someone else on my team fulfills.

[00:30:23] HAnnah: And you're going to have to communicate with an assistant.

[00:30:26] Emylee: exactly.

[00:30:27] HAnnah: I mean, it's not it doesn't. It's not like we can't communicate, but it's like an additional.

[00:30:32] Emylee: a hundred percent, because then the thing that people don't realize are a fully conceptualized, as soon as you hire, even if it's just a VA, your role shifts then to managing that person, whether you like it or not, you have, someone has to, and if you outsource managing, you're still managing the manager, so you're always going to manage at least one person.

And so do you have that capacity? Do you have those skillsets? What do you want that to look like? So I would rather be in a position. Where I'm hiring what's called a subject matter expert and I'm hiring them for that thing. I don't have to train them on the thing. There's no communication you come in, you do your role really well.

And then that's it and there's no communication that has to happen and I'm not in a position yet where it's very clearly. It's very clear of what that that role could be. And so. I'm not hiring and that's fine because when I do hire, I want it to be someone who I can. I can have a call with maybe once a month and that's it and we check in and you do your things and I'm going to trust that you're doing your things and we don't have to do this. Collaboration are back and forth. I have no interest in that.

[00:31:47] HAnnah: Well, I, I completely understand that. And at the same time as a two line and as a hermit, do you ever, where do you feel that capacity of like interacting with even clients? Do you, do you do anything specific about your client work? Do you take on, You know, a specific type of clients. Do you make sure that you cap it at a certain number?

As you say, how do you make sure that you keep your space for yourself?

[00:32:14] Emylee: I keep raising my rate until someone says no. So I'm doing the same strategy. I did when I was a photographer and I was testing and experimenting and some of those tests, right? Like, to give an example is I, I knew my skill set going into starting my own consulting business, but it wasn't clear exactly if here's the way The exact offer and how much it's going to be and who's it's perfect for.

That's just not, that's a dream world. That's a pipe dream that doesn't actually exist. And you don't need that to start or run a business. But I knew my skill set and I knew people who I could reach out to. So I started the conversations. I started at an hourly rate and then I got started. Those hourly people to decide to do a recurring retainer.

And then ever since ever since I switched from hourly to retainer, I haven't gone back to hourly. So, like, when I move into space, I don't go back. And so the very next client that comes through gets. the more refined package or the more clear deliverables because it's getting perfected with every client that I talk to or even prospect that I talk to and their rate gets bumped up 500 bucks every single new prospect that comes in and that helps weigh the low the lower price clients who came in at the very beginning.

I'm at a point right now probably this fall where I'm going to need to assess Do I need to let some of those 1st clients go because they're not at my higher rate and it doesn't make sense for them to bump up to that higher rate or am I good with having the mixed bag of price some sometimes those like you make those decisions in different seasons of your life right now.

I'm have a discovery call today. I, I, like, thought I took down all my booking links because I'm at capacity and I'm going into summer. My child's going to be home for the summer. So I didn't want to onboard anyone new until she goes back to school in August. And then someone booked, and I was like, but I know, energetically, I can't go into that prospecting call already. Shut down and not wanting to work with her because that's exactly where that's going to lead. And even if we can't work together this month, we might be able to work together later this summer or in the fall. And so I have to kind of reshift my brain and to still being open for the conversation, even though right now, I 100 percent feel at capacity.

[00:34:39] HAnnah: Did you ever have the problem the other way around is where you couldn't get enough clients to sustain your business?

[00:34:47] Emylee: I, I mean, yes, for sure. That happened when I was still really, really new to the space. space and more. I had less connections. I had less experience. when I was a photographer, it was 100 percent like, where's the next client coming from? How's how's this? How's the pipe gonna be? Has the funnel be filled, right?

Now, because I have over a decade of experience, and I have a lot of accolades under my belt, I do get to be pickier about who I work with. Every client I've landed thus far, even every prospect thus far has all been referral. And so I haven't had to utilize. Networking necessarily, or like list building or brand awareness or anything like that to have a conversation.

I, I. I've worked with clients who I've either worked within the past in different capacities. I've hired them as contractors and I reached back out to them when I left and was just like, hey, here's some of the work that I do. If you have anything, let me know. And some of those have definitely turned into recurring clients.

Then those clients refer me to some of the here conversation of 1 of their students or something who needs someone like me. And they hire me, and then that person refers me to someone else and it just is like this referral chain. So, because I can rely on referrals and I do have a really strong. Network of clients who has an excellent network.

I have a client literally who has told me multiple times. I have so many people to send to you. Let me know when you're ready and I have told her I'm not ready. Like, we need to wait until the fall. I'm like, I am not ready. But I know that as soon as I wanted to increase that I could. so I think it's about, it's about not just building your network.

'cause I would, I, I, a hundred percent, I would tell you I'm not someone who cares about building my network. I don't like building my network. I don't look at it as building my network. I don't put myself out there. I don't go to events. I don't go to speaking things. I don't do any of that. none of that is fun for me.

It makes me very. Like literally ill, sick to my stomach. I love doing these things. Interviews in my house, where we get to talk and you ask me whatever you want. And we'll obviously both share about this and talk about this and it lends to that credibility of what I'm doing, but I don't know if it's because I'm a 2 for if it's because of the projector or all of the above.

Right? But a big thing that I've. Found that works for me and I have tested this and every single no matter what I'm selling if I share the journey, like, I have instagram. I love instagram. I have my own personal account that I've had for years and years and years and I do stories almost every single day because it's fun for me to do that.

They aren't. I'm not selling anything. I'm just I'm talking about what I'm doing. So, like, right before I hopped on here, I recorded, like, I have pillows around my desk because this is the 1st interview I've done in a year. And so I didn't have, like, my podcast stuff set up. And so I just, like, did a story of, like, oh, I'm doing my 1st podcast interview in a year.

Like, here's all my pillows. And I already have people messaging me like, oh, my gosh, I'd love to have you on the show. Oh, what are you talking about? Or I love hearing like, you know, your side of whatever people love for me. People love the behind the scenes. It peaks, they love the journey, they love being nosy and hearing about the things and I love doing that.

And so, because that's something that lights me up and gets me excited, I do it and I do it often. So, therefore it works for me. You know what I mean?

[00:38:29] HAnnah: I, I do know what you mean. I think my audience just releases a huge sigh of relief in terms of like the, the networking, you know, because it always sounds like, and conventional advice will always tell you to go out there and build connection and, you know, connect with people and, and, and put yourself out there, make yourself louder.

And it sounds just like

[00:38:52] Emylee: It literally makes me wanna gag

[00:38:54] HAnnah: you don't have to make yourself louder. You can stay in your own peace and quiet at home, share your story, what you're comfortable sharing with, and it just feels like people magically come to you.

[00:39:06] Emylee: And, and I'll tell you the exact outline. 'cause I feel like for me, actual examples really helped me see how it could work in my life. So I left my company in like June of 2023. And then I was like, depressed all summer because of that and was really

[00:39:24] HAnnah: Yeah.

[00:39:24] Emylee: and had, I went to therapy and I launched my 1st book.

So I was just like, I threw myself into putting my book out there. So I did not start working with clients again until November. Okay. So I took. A break, but when I finally felt like I was healed enough to work with a client, I need to bring in some income being an author. Spoiler alert is not that lucrative until you, like, go viral, like.

It's not, so I needed some income. Right. So I love easy wins that can snowball into two more wins. And so I reached out to a contractor who we had hired and worked with for many years, she's, she's in SEO, she's an SEO expert and my old job, we'd hired her to do our SEO and because I was on the marketing team, her and I worked closely together.

For years, and we connected, we had each other's phone numbers. We just, we vibed really well. She lives in DC, nowhere near me. but I messaged her on Instagram and was just like, Hey, can I. And I voice message, I'm an audio processor, a verbal processor. And so I voice messaged her and I was just like, Hey, I just would love to kind of loop you in on what I'm doing these days.

And if you have this need, or if you know of anyone who has this need, I would love for you to connect me. And so I just kind of was like, I could do this. I could do that. I could do this. It was still very much in the, I don't have anything to offer specifically, but I have a lot that I could offer. Does anything sound right?

Like pick, pick what you want out of this hat. And immediately she was like, Oh my gosh, this is crazy. She was also in a partnership. And they were separate dating. And so all of the things that her ex partner was what had been doing, she needed a system to be built around that because he was doing it all manually.

And she was like, I don't want to do it manually. I feel like this could be easier, but I don't have time to figure it out. Can I pay you to figure it out for me? 100 percent you can. I would love that. And so she paid me to figure it out for her and then we got it set up and then she needed someone to maintain the system on a monthly basis and write some content.

Hi, I would love to do that. So she turned into a recurring client. So because I landed her, I again started sharing on Instagram. Oh my gosh, I'm working with a client. I'm building out this system. It's so fun. Someone messaged me. I didn't know you were working with clients. What else are you doing? Can I like, I know someone who might be hiring.

Can I like, can I connect you? So she ended up connecting me with someone who I knew, but I hadn't talked to. And I mean, quite literally probably three or four years. So it was not like a warm connection at all. And, but she knew me. So she knew what I was capable of doing. We hopped on a call. She hired me on the spot, did a recurring, and she's the one who's referred me then to.

A student who referred me to a client, who referred me to the discovery call I have later today. And so it's just you on, you. Like literally only have to show up and stand out to one person and then that one person

[00:42:37] HAnnah: And it doesn't even have to be a stranger.

[00:42:39] Emylee: it doesn't. No, no, no. I don't want it to, don't act. Don't actually, I don't recommend that.

Don't make it a stranger. Make it someone, you know.

[00:42:47] HAnnah: But it's so reassuring, isn't it? It's like the, the opportunity, your next opportunity might just be within the people that you already know.

[00:42:55] Emylee: 100

[00:42:56] HAnnah: And it's just about reaching out once and see what

[00:42:59] Emylee: out 1. yes, because within from November to February. I went from 0 clients to 6 and then February to. We're now at the end of April, I have 8 clients and I'm, I'm at capacity. Because they're high, they're high paying 1 on 1, like, I'm in their business clients. so. But, yeah, within, I mean, from November to January, February, I was on track in projected contracts to make more than my salary the year prior at my 7 figure company.

So that feels pretty good.

[00:43:41] HAnnah: it must be on that. If you, if we talk about, you know, what success feels like to you and I know that success is important for projectors. We want to

[00:43:50] Emylee: Yes, yes.

[00:43:52] HAnnah: and you have a lot to be proud of and your career journey today, you know, the marketing agency that you build. A podcast that ran for seven plus years, still runs.

the, you know, the, the businesses you've built, the book you've written, your best selling author. Like what, what else do you want? Just

[00:44:13] Emylee: some

[00:44:14] HAnnah: get out of here.what does success really feel like? Because I, I appreciate that a lot of these things might sound a little They might look and sound really good from the outside, but they don't always feel as good from the inside.

[00:44:25] Emylee: Now what feels good for you? What does success mean to you? these things.

And so, unless that is being met. And I'm equally contributing to that. I won't I will see no success. And that's me. That's how I like, that's how I look at things. Do I want to make a lot of money? Yes. I like making money. I like expensive things. I like going on trips. I like doing things. I have financial goals for myself. I, there's like, a baseline of revenue or money that I could be making that when I hit that I'm like, okay, like, now we're good. Now we can fine tune. Now we can refine. Now we can make this even better now that we're here. So, whatever your baseline is for you, I think truly a lot of people, like, feel like.

Like, nothing is working simply because they haven't met their baseline financial need yet. And so do what you can to get there and then we can reevaluate and make things, like, shift things around and tweak things. But so for assuming that that financial need is being met, which. It is now, which is very great.

then I start to look at, am I truly do I have the schedule and the type of clients where I can legitimately every single day of the week decide what I want to work on when I am very much someone who. If the energy isn't there for that type of task, it's not going to get done. It's not going to get done.

Well, if I have to do it. whenever I feel in the space of being creative and writing. I'm going to be able to do that. I want to be able to do that when I feel like my logic brain kick on my systems brain kick on and oh, I want to design these air tables and these automations and these rules. Then I want to be able to do that.

And so the big part of success for me is truly like waking up that day and being like, what part of my brain is fired up today and of the projects that I have, either for myself or for my clients fit that energy. Now, let me go do that. And so it means not having meetings consistently, no recurring meetings at all whatsoever.

[00:46:38] HAnnah: You have no recurring meetings whatsoever.

[00:46:40] Emylee: none.

[00:46:41] HAnnah: It sounds like a dream.

[00:46:43] Emylee: Yeah, none.

[00:46:44] HAnnah: No, we get 1 to 1 with someone.

[00:46:48] Emylee: I do Voxer. So I have Voxer office hours. so my clients know that they can like, brain dump or ask or whatever. I run like an async business basically. So they can come into my office hours whenever they want. I, they will get a response from me no later than 48 hours.

So I will respond, but it might take a day or 2 or if they need to kind of brain dump and show me a process and they send me just the list of things that need done. They record a loom video, send that to me. I watch it whenever I'm in the headspace to watch it typically within 2 days, then I manage my own.

Project my own timeline. I put all of that into my own Asana and map out their project based on what I know needs to happen in order to get that thing done. If I'm confused and stuck, I'll record a loom, send it to them. They'll watch it on their own time. They get back to me. So it does mean there's, there's a little bit of time in projects.

I work with a couple of clients who have launches. And so obviously in a launch, you have to kind of be a little bit more on top of it. So I know in those weeks. That client is going to get more of my attention. So I communicate with my other clients that I'm going to be slower to respond. But someone, something always has to give if something else is going to get more attention.

We can't maintain our level of attention for everything else. And so whether that means I know for sure I'm not going to write any that week for my books, and I know that, and I have to fact that into my deadlines, or I need to communicate with my clients that my schedule is going to be a lot slower because of whatever else is coming up, but I've even had, like, I have a book that's my 3rd, 4th book is going to be publishing June 3rd and I'm going to be doing, like a book signing in person book signing event for that.

And that's on a Monday. And so I'm taking that day off, and then I'm probably going to take the next day off. And so I'm just going to tell my clients, just like I would with any other work. This launch is coming, so I'm going to be unavailable. And because I'm a contractor, I get to say that

[00:48:57] HAnnah: I wish corporate will be more like that in terms of, like, no recreating meetings because do we really need that 1 to 1 every week.

[00:49:03] Emylee: do

[00:49:04] HAnnah: I can, you know, no,

[00:49:05] Emylee: no, we don't. If we need to check in, like, message me and then I'll stick

[00:49:09] HAnnah: know. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. So, and then this, element of something has to give, like, if I'm going to spend more time here, this is where I'm going to have to take it out.

Like, we always try to accommodate and we always try to, like, make it work regardless of what's already on our plate. And so I love that something has to give, like, communicating that

[00:49:31] Emylee: to. Yes. And I think that, like, For those of you who might be feeling like that burn out in the drain and that the energy just leaving, I really want you to assess, like, how many things have you said? Yes. To some of them. You have to you have to write, depending on the different circumstances, but because of that, you have to then add, like, literally add it up, add up your time in the week out of the time that you're awake that you're working that you.

You want to be, you know, working out or meditating or writing or doing whatever else and you will start to see where those time slots get taken up and you'll see that you've probably double booked yourself a lot. And so we've got to reallocate those resources.

[00:50:17] HAnnah: find it so interesting. also thinking back at the, at the, at the second line, the hermit, do you need a lot of space in the week just for yourself? Like, where you're

[00:50:26] Emylee: So, I work from bed often. Often. so I also have pretty severe endometriosis that will just surprise me whenever it wants to hurt and be in a lot of pain and really be uncomfortable. And it affects my energy levels sometimes, I mean, in physical pain, but it also is like weird brain fogs sometimes too.

And so I have to be able to have the freedom and flexibility of being like. That that's not getting that's not getting done today because of this actual energy level, or I'm going to wake up and based on. My mood, and I mean, I can check in pretty well these days. It took a lot of effort to do that internal check in.

But if it means I'm working from bed today, great. I don't, I don't, I don't have a meeting. I have to be on for, I don't have to do anything. No, 1 knows that I'm working from bed. It doesn't matter. But there are also days where I feel like I need that connection and I need to put on, you know, my work clothes and do my hair and there's a coffee shop a half a mile down the road.

And so I'm going to go work from the coffee shop. And I feel. That's my office. Sometimes I feel like I'm out and about and I'm getting out and that also. Gives me energy in its own way, but again, I get to decide when I pull those different levers. And customize a day and week, and I think at the root of, like, going back to your question of what does success look like for you?

It's getting to decide how I need to work and function today and then being 100 percent able. To do that, and there were, there were definitely times in my old business where, you know, I would text my business partner and say, oh, I had a flare up last night. Like. I'm going to, you know, I'm not going to be able to do whatever.

Right. And it's things get rescheduled. You still have to do that meeting. It's now just on a different day. You didn't actually get out of it. Right. Right and so I wanted to create a business where there's, like. If the thing doesn't happen, I don't know. It's just you then you don't need it.

[00:52:36] HAnnah: I really, really like that. And I mean, I'm sensing that you have a lot of, you know, for one, trust in yourself because you've obviously built, lots of different businesses for yourself, you've had lots of success that almost accumulates into, you know, you having that trust in yourself and deserve at least so, you're also super in tune with what you need on any given day.

[00:52:59] Emylee: Yeah.

[00:53:00] HAnnah: Do you ever bother about what other people might think about you? Do you ever get stressed around? Oh, if I cancel this now, what will they think of me? If I, you know, don't show up, like, you know, exactly like this, what will they think of me? Because that's something that often comes up for me. I wonder if you have that too.

It's

[00:53:20] Emylee: I

[00:53:21] HAnnah: an enneagram for you

[00:53:22] Emylee: do. It is for sure something I've worked on in therapy in the past year because that there was as part of the contention of me leaving my old job was. I was starting, so other projectors will get this. If you're not a projector, you're probably going to roll your eyes at this, but projectors know.

When you've got a gut feeling and you can feel the vibe, you know it even without someone saying it, even without. Specific language or conversations we can feel when a vibe is off and when something is different. and. I had that often with my business partner, specifically around productivity, and I think she is a generator and so quite literally, like, our energy levels are designed to be different.

[00:54:16] HAnnah: you next

[00:54:21] Emylee: were some unhealthy relationships with work and productivity that she was going through workaholic like, miss and worthiness from work. And I don't find my worthiness from work. I used to. It took me a long time to separate those identities, but I, I guess, let me clarify. I don't find my worthiness in how busy I am or how how much I'm working.

I'm really proud of the results that I've gotten and that does feel. A little bit like worthiness to me, but it's not a, I'm going to burn myself out to get those results. And so now it feels worthy. That's the opposite of worthiness to me. and so I had to do a lot of. Working out with my therapist of I'm not lazy.

I do business differently than some people. I have really firm boundaries, really firm boundaries. About meetings about certain deliverables with clients, I've had to completely rework client proposals and contracts because of the expectations of deliverables that they, they thought that they needed in order to get their results.

And I know better, because I am the expert in this thing. And so if we couldn't come to terms with that, then we're not going to be a good fit. But we don't need to have all of these fluffiness to make this project seem worth it. and so if I, if I have a client who I feel like the vibe is off where they're going to be skirting some boundaries, then it's, it's not going to be a good fit.

I'm absolutely someone who's now had to learn. When I have the boundary, it's my job to hold that boundary. It's not anyone else's job. They're going to try to cross it and that's okay. That doesn't mean anything about them. It means a lot about me if I let them cross that boundary. And so I think it's a lot of. I think the conversation that I encourage a lot of people have, especially trying to start. A side hustle or a business or whatever that looks like to you, I'm really asking yourself. What is the actual end goal that you want to achieve? And what are you willing to do and not willing to do to get that goal to make that thing happen and then absolutely setting yourself up for success to honor what you said that you were going to do and what you are not going to do.

I think my list of what I'm not going to do is a heck of a lot longer than what I am going to do, like, a lot longer and that's okay. And I've had some conversations with folks, especially since leaving of, like, kind of tapping back into a couple of the peer connections that I've had. Of kind of wondering from the outside, how, how were our roles perceived in that in that company?

And it's just been really interesting to hear people's take about. The recognition that they had about my strengths and my talents that even I didn't see at that time, because I wasn't hustling as much as other people on the team. And so I was still connecting that because I didn't work as much. Then I wasn't adding as much value and I've had to do a lot of unlearning that those things are not correlated at all.

But at this point in time, outside of someone calling me lazy, which I kind of would love, honestly, like,

[00:58:02] HAnnah: Take that as a compliment.

[00:58:03] Emylee: Like, I will take that as a compliment and now I wouldn't have a year ago. so I've definitely done some work around that, but. I think a lot of us have that, especially as projectors the, and we talked about this in the Hermit hotel of being.

Seen and not wanting to be seen and then also desperately wanting to be seen and understood. And I think that that's a continued balance that a lot of us have to have to find how it works out for us.

[00:58:32] HAnnah: Yeah, it's definitely the toughest for me and all I found out about what it means to be a projector and not to be constantly doing, because I would love to be the one who's constantly doing because I know how to do that. I literally know how, you know, if success were a straight line of like the work, the work that you put in and the, the effort that you put in, would be great.

That sounds great to me because I know I just have to increase my, my work input. Whereas as a projector, it feels like, no, you have to do the opposite. You have to dial it back and you have to do less overall.

[00:59:13] Emylee: So what I do to help myself

[00:59:15] HAnnah: it's counterintuitive.

[00:59:17] Emylee: it's 100 percent counterintuitive. so I've talked, I've mentioned a lot throughout this, this conversation about experimenting and testing and whatever. Well, I am a data nerd. I love analytics and I love. Having a theory and then collecting the data to prove that theory or to disprove it doesn't matter which one.

but I like to track those things because I think a lot of times we have, whether we call them hypotheses or not, you have a hypothesis of the more that I work. Right, the more successful I will feel insert whatever your own hypothesis is. Right? Well, if that's a habit that we know that we have our way of thinking that we know that we have that we actually don't like.

Then we need to find evidence to the contrary. Right? And so I had that exact same thought, especially leaving a partnership where there was a lot of hustle and a lot of productivity. had a theory. That the more time that I give myself to write, so completely fiction, this is not work related, it's for a book, yes, it's part, it's another business of mine, but it's a completely different side of my brain that it scratches, right?

The more I honor my times for writing, so therefore, the more word count I have per month, the more money I will make in my client business. That's a theory that I have. Because as a projector, we do have to slow down as a projector. We are waiting for the invitation. And we can't rush other people's invite.

We don't know where it's coming from. We don't know who we don't know when. We have to trust that it's going to happen. And that there are reasons why it happens when it happens. Right. So, if we know all of that to be true, then we have to have a system that supports us in waiting and being a little bit patient.

I can't just sit and wait. I still want to be productive and wait, but I don't want to just keep doing client work and waiting. I want to do something that's going to fulfill a lifelong dream of mine, or I'm going to learn to insert whatever you want here. Maybe you've always

what?

[01:01:22] HAnnah: And so that's when you wrote the book.

[01:01:24] Emylee: Because that's when I write the book.

[01:01:25] HAnnah: Oh, my God,

[01:01:27] Emylee: Yes.

[01:01:27] HAnnah: that's brilliant.

[01:01:28] Emylee: So I literally, but I have a, I have a dashboard. I made it an air table where I write every single day. How many words did I write that day? And then I have a visual dashboard that says, here's how many words you wrote in January. And here's how much money you made. I notice a trend, the more those words are, the more money I make.

[01:01:48] HAnnah: But

[01:01:49] Emylee: Maybe they're not

[01:01:50] HAnnah: you're not making the money from the words that you write, but you make, because, yeah, because you spend less time on making the money or on putting effort behind making money. But

[01:02:03] Emylee: Exactly.

[01:02:04] HAnnah: brilliant.

[01:02:05] Emylee: And so whatever your own thing is, right? Like, do you, do you always, you know, you want to work out, you want to run, you want to nap, you want to meditate, but you don't do that because you feel like you need to be productive, right? Make a hypothesis. The more naps you let yourself have, the more projects you complete.

I guarantee you that would be true if

[01:02:24] HAnnah: Does it work with watching Netflix? I'm not too

[01:02:26] Emylee: Exactly. Like, what is the thing that

[01:02:29] HAnnah: But I'm willing to test that theory.

[01:02:31] Emylee: Do it. Test it. I'm like, I'm just, I'm, I'm watching TV for a, for a science.

[01:02:35] HAnnah: Yeah. But I love this so much. And I love your approach to testing because I will always be like, well, I know that I should probably be doing this, but I, but it's such a huge mountain in front of me in terms of like, oh, but then I'm going to have to do this and that, and then I'm going to have to stay consistent.

I probably don't have to, I just have to try and like, give it a good, yeah.

[01:03:01] Emylee: Yes. Yes. And so now I look back at my, my weeks and my months and I'm like, oh, we had a dip there. Like, it's because I was hustling and I was picking it apart and I was trying to perfect it. I wasn't honoring this space that sometimes things just need to marinate and to exist. And we can perfect things to death sometimes.

And it's a hard habit to break. And so go learn to knit or go take a pottery class or go for a run or go write a book, like do whatever, but it can't be related to how you make money.

[01:03:37] HAnnah: but, what I like about it is you're not asking or you're not recommending people to like, do nothing instead, because it's like, I always find the sentiment of loosening the grip so hard. It's like, how, but I'm so good at gripping, I

[01:03:53] Emylee: hold it real tight real well.

[01:03:56] HAnnah: do this so well. So it's like, okay, but then people go like, well, loosen the grip, just relax. But I can't just relax. So when, but if I find something else I can do

[01:04:08] Emylee: yes,

[01:04:10] HAnnah: like, you know, like you wrote the book, like, what does that version for me? How can I spend more time there? And then see how, yeah, what it does.

[01:04:19] Emylee: Well, and I, like, you learn so much stuff about yourself that it's literally, we didn't even talk about this, but like, so I had an e commerce business for about 2 years. So, at the very end of 2019, so right before it happened, I started making earrings with polymer clay.

It was super trendy. It still is, but like, that's when the trend was, like, kicking off. Again, it was just for fun. I'm an art. I do have an art degree. I'm an artist by nature. I consider myself an artist. And so it's not new for my, you know, people on Instagram to see me making things like, that's normal, that's fine.

But I was like making earrings. And of course they're like, oh my gosh, I would buy those and. I was like, oh, okay. And so then I, like, had a small, like, launch and it sold out in, like, 4 minutes. I was like, this was crazy. Let's see if I can do it again. And I did it again. And I did it again. And within a year, I had, I had made, like, I think it was, like, 73, 000 that year from earring sales while having my full time job at the marketing agency.

This was just for fun. This was my, I'm going to make earrings during nap time and on the weekends. And once my kid goes to bed and then we're going to have launches on Sundays, it's not going to, you know, mess up anything I'm doing with my day job. It's all nights and weekends stuff. And it just happened to make this much money.

And I shut it down because I didn't like it anymore, but it was, that was the thing where it was like. I could either keep working and, like. Perfecting things to death, or I could be creative and there's something to, you know, with your hands

[01:05:53] HAnnah: you're making and you're, you're literally actually getting to be creative.

[01:05:56] Emylee: It does. Different parts of our brain need that type of structure and and. Projects, and it, it was a fun experiment, but it taught me, even if I'm not going to keep doing that, that I can pursue something for fun. And it doesn't have to impact negatively. It can actually impact really positively.

[01:06:22] HAnnah: Yeah, and especially I think where it probably was is that your baseline needs were already fulfilled. Like, you weren't struggling financially, you didn't do this to fill a gap or to make more money. You purely did it for, like you say, like, for the fun of it. And because that baseline was already there, that you had the right grounds for it to be successful or for it to, you know, to do something, to make you money, even if it wasn't intended, but you were in the right space of mind was purely for fun.

I think that's what a lot of us tend to miss. And when we're looking for side hustles that make us money or for something that. Can potentially turn into something and we're looking to set it up, you know, with the wrong intentions. I, I might add, yeah,

[01:07:15] Emylee: Yes. Yeah, I think going in. You know, again, assuming your baseline financial needs are met going in with something that is just going to be for fun. And I think as projectors, especially if you're an Enneagram 3, that something is probably going to turn into a business. Like, that's just what we do, but okay, maybe you.

Start making homemade pasta and you sell it at farmer's markets. And you're only a seasonal business, but it's for fun. And like, it's yes, it provides extra and it's money and there's whatever, but it's just there to serve its own purpose. It doesn't have to be anything more than that.

[01:07:50] HAnnah: I could go on and on talking to you. But I know we're a little over time already and maybe we can just do this another time. We'll do a

[01:07:59] Emylee: Yeah, we'd love

[01:08:00] HAnnah: looks like. But, I've taken so much away and it feels so, so reassuring to talk to someone who is. The same I know that there is not loads and loads of projectors out there, but I know that there is a lot of my audience who can resonate with being a projector because a lot of it is about.

that space we need, that energy that has to be right, the peace and quiet. And so I, I just know it deeply resonates and, I have so many takeaways and I truly enjoy talking to you.

[01:08:33] Emylee: good. I loved doing this. It was this was a great 1st interview come back after my year long hiatus from podcasting.

[01:08:42] HAnnah: I love to be the one then, I didn't even know.

[01:08:46] Emylee: Well, and it took me, like, even 2 weeks to even message you and reach out because I had, like, written your name down from the

[01:08:52] HAnnah: I was wondering, is, is she going to reach out?

[01:08:56] Emylee: found you on Instagram.

And then I was like. Except first I was like, I don't even know what I would talk about. And I'm like, okay, wait a minute. There's lots of stuff. I'm glad I did.

[01:09:06] HAnnah: Well, thank you so much for coming on, Emily. And, yeah, I'm sure we'll do this again.

[01:09:10] Emylee: Yeah. Thanks for having me.