Foreign welcome to do this not that, the podcast for marketers.

You'll walk away from each episode with actionable tips you can test immediately.

You'll hear from the best minds in marketing who will share tactics, quick wins and pitfalls to avoid.

Also, dig into life, pop culture and the chaos that is our everyday.

I'm Jay Schwedelson.

Let's do this, not that.

We are here for do this, not that.

And sometimes I say I'm excited and I half mean it, but today I'm genuinely excited.

Why am I so excited?

Because I have Brianne Fleming here.

Brian, you tell everybody who you are because I don't want to screw it up, but I've been following you forever.

I am a fan of yours.

You are just awesomeness for so many reasons.

But tell everybody who is Brianne Fleming.

Thank you.

Yeah, and we've bonded over pop culture, which we're definitely going to get into today.

And that's really how the Internet knows me.

I like to combine my love of social media and pop culture and teach people marketing through the things that we love through music, sports, tv, movies, all of those things.

So I have a podcast about that called Making the Brand.

And I also host a weekly Twitter chat about trending topics every Friday at 1 o' clock where we analyze some of the marketing takeaways from them.

But I also teach branding and social media at the University of Florida.

I have a newsletter.

I kind of dabble in a bunch of fun things, talking about the Spice Girls and boy bands, but putting a little marketing twist on things.

So I'm having a lot of fun and I'm excited to be here today too.

So yes, Brienne, like is is pop culture.

I literally like find out about pop culture things from Brienne.

And by the way, her being affiliated with the University of Florida is the greatest thing of all time because I am also a Gator skill Gators to all the all of our Gator family, Gator Nation that is out there.

But what Brianne and I are going to talk about today and I really want to learn from Brianne because I think this to me is really a fantastic way to get your audience engaged in this world that we live in.

Now that most content out there is epically boring.

Nobody's engaging with it.

So what Brianne has tapped into I think is so valuable for for marketers to learn from and that is how do we as marketers take what is trending and leverage it for our businesses and bring it into our content and try to drive interest in that how do we do that?

What aren't we doing?

Right, right.

Well, the magic of pop culture is that it can take an unfamiliar topic and suddenly make it familiar just by how you package it.

So the example I always think of is I saw a bunch of different law firms creating blog posts and content teaching me legal terms.

But they were saying these.

These terms and positioning them through the lens of trending celebrity divorces.

Or I remember reading one that was all about the college admissions scandal a few years ago.

When something is tre, you become familiar with that topic and it gives you an easy vehicle to learn more about something that you maybe wouldn't have necessarily clicked on.

Like, I'm not just gonna go and necessarily teach myself legal terms.

If I don't have an invested interest because of something in pop culture that I've heard about or something trending that I wanna learn more.

So it's just that magic vehicle that can give you a reason to insert yourself and bring your audience in using something that they're familiar with.

So, like, literally, would you go and be like, okay, I'm gonna go on Twitter x look at what the trending topics are, and you avoid kind of the political stuff or anything that's too, you know, crazy out there.

And then you say, oh, this is pop culture.

This is cool.

You know, Taylor Swift is trending.

I'm gonna jump in on that and figure out how to tie it into the content.

I'm trying to get this white paper downloaded or webinar registered for.

Do you literally try to marry the two like that?

Yeah, exactly.

And using Taylor Swift as an example.

I mean, she is the example, right?

I mean, she is always trending whether she likes it or not.

But, you know, I've personally made a ton of content to teach about marketing through Taylor Swift.

I've examined her songwriting styles.

I've written blog posts about storytelling lessons that we can derive from her songs.

I did a whole deep dive about her song, all too well.

And how just getting into the details of that scarf is just a storytelling hack to really get into the details and not to broadly tell stories, but to get really granular with things and paint pictures for people.

So, yeah, it's just a way to educate, but it's around a different topic that reels people in.

So, first of all, I think that that's a super useful thing for everyone to hear about that.

It's not where you're going to say, taylor Swift has great music and go to our webinar.

It's not like something that's totally ridiculous.

It's.

You might delve into a particular thing that somebody big in pop culture is doing that really you can relate to whatever it is that you're promoting.

There's a real tie in there, and it gives people that excitement that they're not just being boring work stuff.

They're talking about fun pop culture stuff.

Are there certain things off limits?

Like, if you're a brand, you know, like, well, they're not affiliated with my company, this pop culture person, or this TV show.

Can any brand just go and grab any pop culture moment and kind of, like, bring it on and talk about.

Is that okay?

Should you be avoiding certain things?

Yeah, I think it's.

It's really clear when a brand is just trying to force it.

Like, I've seen pharmaceutical companies try to jump in and tweet about the Bachelor, and if you have maybe a cheeky brand voice, that will work.

But this was not that brand.

They were just kind of using the hashtag, trying to get in on it, and it felt.

Felt a little forced.

Whereas Tarte, which is a makeup brand, they will even tweet out and say, you know, don't follow our tweets if you don't want any Bachelor spoilers.

Because from 8 to 10, we are tweeting all about the Bachelor.

So I think it has to make sense for your brand.

It has to make sense for your brand voice.

Just because something is trending doesn't mean it's the right trending topic for you.

You have to really evaluate, you know, does this suit our brand voice?

Is this a topic for us?

Is this trending topic something that our audience cares about and then go from there?

What about, like, your personal brand?

Not only your personal brand, but a lot of, you know, we're in this environment now where a lot of people, they have their job, their career, but they're also trying to build their personal brand.

Is this kind of grabbing a hold of trending stuff a good way to grow your own personal brand?

Absolutely.

Yeah.

And that's.

That's something that I learned when I left the corporate world and I was starting to freelance and try to build my own personal brand as a marketer.

I realized that I was positioning myself only as, like, this UF professor, and this is my super polished, you know, prim and proper content.

I was like, no, I want to talk about the Spice Girls and what we can learn about brand purpose from girl power.

Just, like, ridiculous stuff.

And I found that that's really what set me apart and endeared people to me, and we see this all the time.

I mean, Pat Flynn, author of Super Fans, big podcaster.

People know him for his love of Back to the Future.

And I know you are a big Bachelor in Paradise fan.

You're no stranger to helping people get to know you beyond your careers.

And that's really when you build relationships with people and foster a stronger connection.

So, yeah, I think that's when pop culture is its most powerful, is for personal brands.

And I'll tell you what I found for me personally is that I agree with you totally that the way that people were able to connect with each other and is sharing more of who we are.

Right.

But the beautiful part about pop culture that I found, like I talk a lot about reality TV or like foods I like to eat, whatever, is that it's not topics that people get upset about.

It's kind of like this happy place of.

Of topics that we could all laugh about, talk about, we're all involved with.

And it's not controversial.

So I'm a big fan of going deep on that.

You know, for a personal brand.

The one thing though is which platforms, you know, there are different.

You got X or Twitter.

You got Instagram, you got TikTok, you got LinkedIn.

Do you find this idea of leveraging pop culture for real content, that you're trying to build your brand around whatever is better on one platform versus another?

Do you avoid any platforms?

Well, me personally, I love X because it is so real time.

I mean, you first hear about a breaking headline, or you first see those pictures of Taylor Swift at the Kansas City Chiefs game on Twitter.

So I like Twitter because you can get involved quickly and you don't necessarily have to create an asset, a video, an image, or anything to jump in and start engaging with people and seeing what they're talking about in that moment.

And that's really where I think threads launched a little bit too early because they don't have hashtags at the time of this recording.

They are not a place to go to when you hear of a headline and you want to see what people are saying.

But I still love Instagram and TikTok.

And what we've seen on TikTok in particular is a lot of.

What are they calling it?

I think citizen journalism, where just anyone and everyone is taking something in the news and sharing their take.

I know that a TikToker broke the news or was speculating about Joe Jonas and Sophie Turner's divorce.

Before TMZ even broke the news, she was compiling pictures and saying, look, he's not wearing his ring.

Like, what's going on?

He was seen here without here, there without her.

So I think the visuals and the commentary that you can do on Reels or TikTok or video in general is also really powerful in pop culture.

Yeah.

And I think that people just need to get creative.

Right.

You talk about, like, Joe Jonas and not wearing a ring.

Like, you could literally be like, oh, he's not committed to his relationship.

And are you committed to your CRM provider?

Right.

You could just do subtle little things and it gets people a little bit more excited.

Rather than, please attend my webinar.

It's like, who cares?

It's so ethically like, nobody cares about it.

Yeah.

Just.

Do you ever.

I sometimes get this.

I wonder if you do.

And I don't care.

Haters can go, whatever.

I could care less about haters, but I oftentimes will get emails from people like, you don't take things serious enough.

You're just a jokester or whatever.

Do you ever get any of that hate?

Does it bother you?

I definitely think my content isn't for everyone.

I'm particularly known for talking about Y2K nostalgia in pop culture.

I am a teeny bopper at heart still.

And I know that might not be for everyone, might not be for every generation, but what I have found is that every generation has their boy band or has their artists that they love, and they can kind of relate to it that way.

So I've really been surprised, actually, at how many people appreciate what I'm doing, even if they're more of an NSync fan instead of a backstreet fan.

I'm a backstreet girl.

But we can all kind of appreciate that we're learning and having these discussions in a way that isn't as boring and maybe even academic, you might say.

It's just a little bit more fun.

And I know you're a master at that, too, with your references and everything.

So I want to hear more about that.

That brings us to the segment of this podcast that I'm most excited about right now.

Okay, forget about how we tie it into workshops.

Now let's get into the real, most important part, which is the segment of this thing has nothing to do with work or whatever it's called, since you didn't ask.

Oh, boy.

And this is where we talk about nonsense.

Love it.

So I don't care how it ties into business.

I want to ask you a question.

Okay.

Britney Spears has a memoir, right?

That's hitting Shelves.

Maybe it's out there by the time you hear this.

Are you on Team Britney?

How do you feel about Britney?

How do you feel about this memoir?

Are we worried about Britney?

As a die hard Britney fan?

Sometimes it's hard to say this out loud, but I, I am concerned.

I am concerned about her.

I definitely don't think she's the person she used to be.

As far as her memoir, I see a few things that I have thought are little red flags.

I mean, I was hoping that she would be reading the memoir and recording her.

Her audiobook.

Oh, that'd be cool.

She's not doing that.

She's not doing that.

She recorded the intro and then Michelle Williams is going to read the whole thing.

But she had a statement where she came out and said that she didn't want to relive the trauma.

But she's not doing any interviews about it.

Even like the promo videos and footage that they're using to promote it.

They're using old clips from a docu series that she did, you know, 2007.

So I don't know.

I hope she's okay.

I was hoping that she would be a bit more vocal because now we're celebrating that she is using her voice and using this platform.

But it also seems like she wants to see still keep things private.

So we'll see.

I am concerned, but I just hope she has friends to lean on and that getting all of this off of her chest will help her control her narrative a bit.

So always wishing her the best.

I love how, like in depth.

You really thought this out.

Oh, my God.

I just stopped like the hashtag free Britney.

I mean, you're like deep on all this.

So since I have you on the show, I know you're a Dancing with the Stars person and that's fine.

I'm all for Dancing with the Stars, but are you Bachelor Nation or not?

Really?

I am.

I'm caught up on paradise.

I have not watched the Golden Bachelor yet.

I know.

I don't know.

I don't know.

I've heard it's better than the regular Bachelor.

So.

Watch the Golden Bachelor.

This is unacceptable.

Okay, wait, here's my take on the Golden Bachelor.

I don't think I could handle it because with the regular Bachelor, if you get sent home, you know, you're 26, there's plenty of fish in the sea, you're going to be fine.

But like when you have, you know, these, these women or these people that have experienced loss and you know, they're feeling like their time is limited on this Earth.

And, oh, my gosh, they get sent home and they're lonely.

I can't.

I can't handle it.

Well, you're 100% right.

And then the most recent episode, one of the women, her daughter had her wedding, and she decided to stay competing while her daughter got married.

I'm like, what are you doing?

Like, what's wrong with you?

So they're having, like, real, real life events.

So let me ask you one other topic before we wrap up here.

So NSync, they just released a new song, I don't know, for the.

For the Trolls movie.

Justin Timberlake was part of singing Whatever.

And you probably know the entire backstory.

I do not.

I don't understand.

First of all, the song kind of sucks, but whatever.

Why are they aligned with the Trolls movie?

Like, in sync in 20 years hasn't released anything, and this is what they released.

What is going on?

Yeah, well, I know Justin Timberlake was the voice of a Troll in the prequel, so maybe they were planning something by the time they did the sequel.

But the whole sequel is about, like, a boy band.

It's about this guy that gets reunited with his brothers and they decide to start a band.

I haven't seen it.

I don't even know if it's out yet, but I don't know.

I think it's fun.

I happen to like the song, but I have to say, if I were an NSync fan, I think I would be a little disappointed.

It'd be one thing if this was the first step in their reunion, but to have a full reunion and it's just for Trolls and there's nothing else.

Ah, I don't know.

I feel kind of bad.

But it's.

It's a good song, in my opinion.

And anything to get them back together.

I know they were trending.

Speaking of trending topics, we had some fun moments with them at the VMAs and stuff, but I hope they keep it going for their fans because they are still loyal after all these years.

So they.

Oh, my God.

I would go in a second.

Yeah.

You have to rank these bands right now in order, and then we're going to wrap up.

You have to rank these bands.

Okay, Here we go.

NSync, Backstreet Boys, New Kids, 98 Degrees.

Oh.

Oh, okay.

Well, I'm gonna go with 98 Degrees last.

New Kids has longevity.

New Kids is kind of my blind spot.

I have to go.

It's a tie between NSYNC and New Kids because I think they're both legendary, but backstreet, they always have my heart.

They're number one in my book.

I've they're, they're still touring, they're still releasing music.

They've got their new Christmas album that came out last year that it's October.

I think it's time for me to bring that back out.

I think it's already tis the season.

So I'm a Backstreet Girl at heart.

I love how hard that was for you.

That's amazing.

That is really the essence of Brienne Fleming is how difficult that ranking was.

So Brienne, before we wrap up, how does everyone find you?

Where can they track you down?

Please follow her on everything and hit us with everything.

Right?

Thank you.

Well, check out the Making the Brand podcast.

I've got a whole new season in the works, so we're about to start that up.

I've got some really exciting guests you've got to come on.

We'll do a deeper dive on boy bands and all the things.

So Making the Brand.

I host pop chat on Twitter every Friday at 1 o'.

Clock.

It's all about trending topics and the marketing takeaways from them.

I also have a newsletter, Brianne fleming.com newsletter if you like a newsletter that kind of feels like Tiger Beat, but you might learn something, then that's for you.

Check it all out.

Amazing content.

Thank you Brianne.

You are awesome.

And thanks for being here for do this, not that.

Thank you so much for having me.

This was a total blast.

Thank you.

You did it.

You made it to the end.

Nice.

But the party's not over.

Subscribe to make sure you get the latest episode each week for more actionable tips and a little chaos from today's top marketers.

And hook us up with a five star review if this wasn't the worst podcast of all time.

Lastly, if you want access to the best virtual marketing events that are also 100% free, visit guruevents.com so you can hear from the world's top marketers like Daymond John, Martha Stewart and me.

GuruEvents.com check it out.