1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,320 Welcome to the Relentless Few Podcast. So, 2 00:00:05,440 --> 00:00:08,400 or welcome back if you've been here before. Well, 3 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:14,160 just a fun little note. This will be the second time I recorded this 4 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:18,240 episode because I'm using some new software so I can record anywhere 5 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:22,240 and remotely. And, um, I didn't press the right button. So 6 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:26,400 I texted Lisa, who's my wife, because I said, hey, I just recorded a 7 00:00:26,720 --> 00:00:29,440 podcast. And I said, well, actually I didn't record it. I just talked for 25 8 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:33,380 minutes. But I didn't press the record button. So this is actually take 2, 9 00:00:33,540 --> 00:00:36,980 which will be great because it won't be a repeat of take 1 because 10 00:00:37,380 --> 00:00:40,340 I have no idea what I said on that one. And I have no intention 11 00:00:40,660 --> 00:00:44,340 of trying to figure it out because what I'm trying to do with 12 00:00:44,500 --> 00:00:48,260 the podcast from this point forward is I actually want it to be 13 00:00:49,700 --> 00:00:53,380 kind of a record of processing for 14 00:00:53,620 --> 00:00:57,460 myself. I don't have a clean 15 00:00:58,180 --> 00:01:01,220 script. I don't have even an outline of what I want to talk about. 16 00:01:03,060 --> 00:01:06,900 I have thoughts and I wanted this to be, I was telling 17 00:01:07,300 --> 00:01:11,140 Brett, who was my producer, that I wanted this to be kind of a 18 00:01:11,300 --> 00:01:14,980 live processing of those thoughts that aren't clear yet, that I don't have answers 19 00:01:15,380 --> 00:01:19,060 for, that I don't have systems or frameworks or results or 20 00:01:19,620 --> 00:01:22,740 anything for. I'm just going to share my thinking. 21 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:27,520 with folks because I want them, I want all of 22 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:31,280 you to do it for yourself, to 23 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:34,480 share your thinking and to think out loud for yourself 24 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:39,120 because everybody's doing it. We just don't admit to it, I 25 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:42,880 guess, because we all want to look like we have answers. So that's what this 26 00:01:42,960 --> 00:01:46,400 is. And, and I think it's a little bit, um, I actually want it to 27 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:49,920 be like a pirate radio station and those things don't exist anymore. 28 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:54,240 Because, you know, traditional radio doesn't exist hardly anymore. But back 29 00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,120 in the, I think it was the late '80s, it might've been, there was 30 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:02,000 a movie called Pump Up the Volume with Christian Slater. And he had a, he 31 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,760 was a young, young kid at the time and he had a pirate radio station. 32 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:09,680 It was like an alter ego for himself. And it was very different than 33 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:13,440 the person he was day to day. It was subversive, like pirate radio stations 34 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,000 are. And I liked it. I like the concept 35 00:02:17,640 --> 00:02:20,520 and I like the idea of having an opportunity to 36 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:25,080 talk on the airwaves in a way that you wouldn't talk face-to-face because 37 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:29,240 it's okay. It doesn't make people as 38 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:32,800 uncomfortable as if you were doing it face-to-face in a group. 39 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:36,920 And it is uncomfortable. It's uncomfortable to process life. What's uncomfortable for me, I 40 00:02:36,920 --> 00:02:40,680 don't want to universalize this to everybody. I have no 41 00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:43,960 idea if it's uncomfortable for everybody else. It is uncomfortable for me to 42 00:02:45,730 --> 00:02:49,410 to not have an outline, an answer, a product, a 43 00:02:49,730 --> 00:02:53,330 solution, whatever that is, because I spent so many years 44 00:02:53,730 --> 00:02:56,450 crafting that brand or persona 45 00:02:57,810 --> 00:03:01,410 of having the answer, the insight, the understanding, the solution, 46 00:03:02,050 --> 00:03:05,410 easing the anguish and anxiety and uncertainty 47 00:03:05,970 --> 00:03:09,690 with a solution. And I don't, 48 00:03:10,220 --> 00:03:13,980 I don't feel that's the way to go forward. That's been an evolution of my 49 00:03:14,060 --> 00:03:17,820 thinking. It's been a painful one at that because when 50 00:03:17,900 --> 00:03:21,660 you have an identity that's aligned to that, shifting your identity 51 00:03:22,620 --> 00:03:25,420 can be scary and uncomfortable 52 00:03:26,460 --> 00:03:30,060 and anxiety-producing, which is doing all of those things for me 53 00:03:33,500 --> 00:03:36,540 or to me as it were, or I'm doing them to myself, I guess. 54 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:40,800 I do think that, you know, 55 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:45,840 I'm getting to the point where I think that for my, for me, 56 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:50,480 the point of living is to play at the meaning of life. And so that's 57 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:54,160 a constant evolution for me. And I want it to continue to be, I want 58 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:57,760 it to continue to be something that evolves for 59 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:01,760 me. And that's, again, it leads to a little bit of 60 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:05,840 discomfort, but I'm okay with that because I don't, I don't want to continue to 61 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:09,840 tranquilize myself with trivial things, which I do quite frequently. I'm not 62 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:12,800 sure about you, but I definitely do 63 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:16,480 it. And I try to, 64 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:19,120 I've spent many years trying to 65 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:24,000 immediately intellectualize something for myself because it gets me out of the 66 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:27,040 discomfort and I want to be able to dwell in things. I want to develop 67 00:04:27,280 --> 00:04:31,010 the capacity to dwell in things. I don't want to dwell 68 00:04:31,170 --> 00:04:34,130 on them because I do really good at dwelling on them. Believe me, I can 69 00:04:34,370 --> 00:04:38,130 dwell on things almost better than anybody I know for 70 00:04:39,010 --> 00:04:42,450 days, weeks, months, holding 71 00:04:43,090 --> 00:04:46,930 myself horribly accountable in a negative way with a lot of guilt 72 00:04:47,010 --> 00:04:50,850 and shame. Guilt being that I did wrong and shame being that I am 73 00:04:51,010 --> 00:04:54,770 wrong. And then sometimes a little bit of despair, which is, you know, 74 00:04:54,770 --> 00:04:57,010 I'm never going to be able to change it. It just is what it is. 75 00:04:57,810 --> 00:05:01,450 And those are 3 things I want to have less of in my life, 76 00:05:01,730 --> 00:05:05,570 but those are also up to me to figure out. Nobody's 77 00:05:05,570 --> 00:05:08,850 doing it to me. I'm doing it to myself and I'm damn good at 78 00:05:08,930 --> 00:05:11,810 it. In fact, that's the thing I'm probably best at. 79 00:05:13,650 --> 00:05:17,170 And it's ironic for me because I spend 80 00:05:17,410 --> 00:05:21,170 so much of my focus when I'm working with people trying 81 00:05:21,330 --> 00:05:24,850 to make it clear to them that they shouldn't do that. 82 00:05:26,330 --> 00:05:29,370 I see that all the time in leaders. I see that all the time in 83 00:05:29,450 --> 00:05:33,290 people, everybody, whether leading is a verb, 84 00:05:33,530 --> 00:05:36,970 not a noun. It's just something we do. But I think when we get into 85 00:05:37,050 --> 00:05:40,570 those roles, we put so much of that responsibility on 86 00:05:40,890 --> 00:05:44,570 ourselves. And I am not universalizing this. I'm speaking from 87 00:05:44,810 --> 00:05:48,490 experience, which I think is different. I'm not trying to universalize something 88 00:05:48,730 --> 00:05:52,330 that I don't have experience in. I've spent the last decade talking to leaders in 89 00:05:52,730 --> 00:05:56,400 organizations and I see it. Now, I will openly admit, I see 90 00:05:56,560 --> 00:06:00,080 it through my frame, so I'm probably looking for it because I feel it. So 91 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,760 I'm, there's a certain amount of projection that probably goes on here. There's no doubt 92 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:07,120 about it, but I do hear it in people's voices. I ask them straight out 93 00:06:07,280 --> 00:06:10,720 how they feel about it. And it's so funny because I don't think 94 00:06:11,280 --> 00:06:15,040 we're okay in business to talk about shame and 95 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,960 guilt. We want to talk about failure and loss and 96 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:22,480 accountability, and metrics and KPIs. And 97 00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:26,000 we want to take that stuff out of our heart and into our head. And 98 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:29,840 I get it. I get why, because it's far easier. 99 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,360 I can attest to that. Like, it's far, far easier 100 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:38,320 to deal with those things, something that's objective, rather 101 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:41,440 than deal with something that could hurt. 102 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:46,240 And so I get it, but it's also the human condition 103 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:49,880 and there is no business doesn't exist. 104 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:54,200 You know, business is just something we made up, but it's still a bunch of 105 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:57,800 humans. And so we're really at the mercy of who we are 106 00:06:58,120 --> 00:07:01,000 and how we feel based on what we're going to achieve. 107 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:06,040 So a lot of this that I'm working through right now is really, 108 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,320 you know, based on a couple— I'm always trying to 109 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:14,290 look for new thoughts on what I'm, you know, 110 00:07:14,530 --> 00:07:18,210 learn from smarter people. So I'm reading a couple books, The Denial of Death 111 00:07:18,450 --> 00:07:21,170 by Ernest Becker and The Courage to Be by Paul 112 00:07:21,330 --> 00:07:25,170 Tillich. And I just finished Becker's Denial of 113 00:07:25,330 --> 00:07:28,370 Death, and that was some great stuff in there. 114 00:07:29,970 --> 00:07:32,850 You know, one thing that struck me, and the reason I read the book is 115 00:07:33,010 --> 00:07:36,690 because I was doing some other research in it, and the concept around 116 00:07:37,570 --> 00:07:39,330 where Becker's book came from is 117 00:07:41,570 --> 00:07:45,250 His general concept is everything we're doing, anything anybody, anybody, 118 00:07:45,490 --> 00:07:49,170 any human is doing in their life is more or less at some 119 00:07:49,330 --> 00:07:53,170 level building an immortality project for themselves because we're 120 00:07:53,170 --> 00:07:56,930 trying to escape death. And I've always thought this was interesting because, 121 00:07:57,650 --> 00:08:00,290 you know, as I dove deeper in existentialism, 122 00:08:01,570 --> 00:08:05,090 one of the core tenets, interestingly enough, of 123 00:08:05,650 --> 00:08:09,280 that when it comes to the behaviors that we exhibit, As you talk 124 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,120 about all the planning we do, because we are generally, and again, 125 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:17,120 just speaking from my own experience, we are obsessed with planning. 126 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:19,920 Like there's a lot of planning that goes on. You know, we've got to have 127 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,840 checklists and plans and 5-year plans and 3-year plans and visions and, you know, call 128 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:26,400 them what you will, you know, whatever you want to say. We have to have 129 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:30,320 big, hairy, audacious goals. I mean, God, there's the vocabulary goes on and 130 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:33,520 on for how we're going to plan for ourselves. And 131 00:08:34,249 --> 00:08:37,049 One thing that struck me, I read several years ago, was that 132 00:08:38,729 --> 00:08:42,169 all of the planning is really another way for us to 133 00:08:44,969 --> 00:08:48,489 avoid death. And that was, you know, Tillich's, 134 00:08:48,889 --> 00:08:51,929 or I mean, sorry, Becker's book, The Denial of Death. I mean, that's the title 135 00:08:52,089 --> 00:08:55,929 of the book, but the reason that plans help us do 136 00:08:56,089 --> 00:08:59,929 that is because the underlying assumption when we do any plan, big, hairy, audacious 137 00:09:00,009 --> 00:09:03,420 goal, any of those things, The underlying assumption that we never 138 00:09:03,900 --> 00:09:07,580 vocalize is that we're still going to be alive to 139 00:09:07,740 --> 00:09:10,860 achieve it or when that happens. So that's great to come up with a 5-year, 140 00:09:11,020 --> 00:09:14,620 10-year, whatever plan, because we're just like, the natural assumption is, well, I'm still going 141 00:09:14,620 --> 00:09:18,380 to be here. So we're pushing death out. Like we're stiff-arming death 142 00:09:18,620 --> 00:09:22,140 to a certain extent. And I think that's true. And 143 00:09:22,300 --> 00:09:26,140 that's what struck me. Like what struck me about Becker's book was the thing about 144 00:09:26,140 --> 00:09:29,120 the immortality project. And that really kind of shook me 145 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:33,840 to my core of what I do for myself. You know, thinking 146 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,760 about all these things that I try to work on and create 147 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,120 and what, why do I do it? So I'm not questioning what I believe, but 148 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:45,040 I am trying to question why I need to believe it. 149 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,320 And then shifting it when it doesn't align with my values, because that's the tricky 150 00:09:48,560 --> 00:09:52,400 part. The tricky part is I thought it did. Like I thought those 151 00:09:52,560 --> 00:09:56,070 things aligned with my values and then I was challenged by that because 152 00:09:56,390 --> 00:10:00,150 the thing it shakes for me, this whole thing about planning and, you know, 153 00:10:00,310 --> 00:10:04,150 the, and again, you know, there's Friedrich Hayek and his knowledge problem 154 00:10:04,470 --> 00:10:07,830 about where does knowledge reside to be able to do 155 00:10:07,830 --> 00:10:11,190 things. I keep going back for myself to this 156 00:10:11,990 --> 00:10:15,670 level of humility. And I think for me, that's 157 00:10:15,670 --> 00:10:19,510 what's core in all this. And that's why I try to now, which I 158 00:10:19,510 --> 00:10:22,920 didn't before, My God, I had answers at every turn for everybody, 159 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,520 but I never stopped and thought about how was I getting to those answers and 160 00:10:26,680 --> 00:10:29,880 why did I believe those answers were going to work for other people? Because what 161 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:33,800 I was drawing on is my own experience, my own insights with little 162 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:37,480 to no concept of what they were actually seeking. 163 00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:41,480 Because oftentimes it takes so long for people to be clear about what they actually 164 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:45,000 want. All of us as humans, I'm not, again, not trying to 165 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:48,970 universalize, but I'm just saying, my experience with myself and others is, you 166 00:10:48,970 --> 00:10:52,490 know, we, if you sit and talk with somebody about a challenge or something 167 00:10:52,730 --> 00:10:56,570 that's challenging them right now and they want to fix, we're all about solutions, 168 00:10:56,570 --> 00:11:00,330 but we're very, we, I try to do it more and more 169 00:11:00,410 --> 00:11:04,170 now, be more curious about the underlying issues that are going 170 00:11:04,330 --> 00:11:07,930 on for them so I can truly get to the, help 171 00:11:08,170 --> 00:11:11,530 them get to the root of what they're trying to accomplish and what's holding them 172 00:11:11,610 --> 00:11:15,380 up. Instead of just locking in on, oh, you 173 00:11:15,540 --> 00:11:18,500 said their first initial statement is, well, I want to fix this. And then we 174 00:11:18,500 --> 00:11:21,620 just go whole, we go no holds barred on coming up with solutions for that 175 00:11:21,780 --> 00:11:25,620 problem. And oftentimes that's not that from 176 00:11:25,780 --> 00:11:28,980 what I've seen year after year after year, after doing this for over a decade, 177 00:11:29,300 --> 00:11:33,140 is that that's very rarely somebody's first initial thought 178 00:11:33,300 --> 00:11:36,740 of, well, this is the thing I want to solve for. That thing will 179 00:11:37,460 --> 00:11:40,410 very rarely hold up. Under scrutiny. 180 00:11:41,810 --> 00:11:45,570 And so for me to exercise that curiosity more 181 00:11:45,890 --> 00:11:49,330 for myself and for other people with the 182 00:11:49,730 --> 00:11:53,570 underlying value being humility, because 183 00:11:53,810 --> 00:11:57,570 I don't know, I don't know what they're talking about. I don't know why 184 00:11:57,570 --> 00:12:01,170 it matters to them. So if I'm curious, I can, I can ask better 185 00:12:01,490 --> 00:12:04,850 questions that will help me help them. 186 00:12:05,470 --> 00:12:09,310 Because again, there's this great thing. 187 00:12:09,310 --> 00:12:12,590 It's like, you know, the bad news is no one's coming to save us. The 188 00:12:12,670 --> 00:12:16,350 good news is we never needed saved in the first place. So it's great that 189 00:12:16,430 --> 00:12:19,550 nobody's coming to save us because we don't need it. All we need is 190 00:12:20,670 --> 00:12:24,270 space and safety to explore what we're 191 00:12:24,270 --> 00:12:27,790 thinking. Because it is my belief 192 00:12:28,670 --> 00:12:32,430 that most people will get to the solution. And in 193 00:12:32,590 --> 00:12:35,520 fact, They know what the solution is, 194 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:41,040 but they've created a problem to shift away from needing to do the thing 195 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:44,720 they know they need to do because they don't want to do that thing. So 196 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:48,640 they shift into a different problem so that there's a different solution 197 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:49,440 that's more, 198 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:56,720 let's see, less taxing, less emotionally taxing, less personally 199 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:00,600 accountable, less uncomfortable. Call it what you will. And again, 200 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:05,240 just sharing my experiences here with a lot of watching people go through this, 201 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:06,520 watching myself go through this. 202 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:12,840 That's the hardest part of the human experiment, right? That's the hardest part 203 00:13:12,840 --> 00:13:15,160 of this whole thing. At least it is for me. I don't know if it 204 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:18,680 is for you. Only you know that. But actually 205 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:24,850 locking into what I know to be true. And then, 206 00:13:25,410 --> 00:13:29,170 but for me, it's taking, it's creating the space for myself 207 00:13:30,770 --> 00:13:34,610 to dwell in that for the appropriate amount of time and not jump, not let 208 00:13:34,610 --> 00:13:38,130 it jump from my heart to my head, not try to intellectualize it too fast 209 00:13:38,210 --> 00:13:42,010 because that's my superpower is intellectualizing things. 210 00:13:42,370 --> 00:13:45,730 And I've spent a lot of years honing that superpower and it provides safety 211 00:13:46,290 --> 00:13:50,050 for me. And that's what the safety is. I never 212 00:13:50,210 --> 00:13:52,930 have to do the other thing. I never have to dwell in it and sit 213 00:13:53,010 --> 00:13:56,720 with what my body's feeling and telling me. And I don't sit in that discomfort 214 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:01,440 and I need to. That's my own personal observation for me is I need to 215 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:05,120 do that. It's valuable for me to do that. And it also slows me down 216 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:08,880 and makes me more present, which is also what I would like to 217 00:14:10,220 --> 00:14:13,440 do for my own, just me personally. And 218 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:17,520 I know I'm Sisyphus pushing the rock up the hill. 219 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:22,880 And I know that, and that's a, It sounds like a grind because 220 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,200 it is, because every time the rock, at the end of the day, the rock 221 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:28,640 rolls back down the hill as it should, because I never meet the same 222 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:32,720 rock. It's like Heraclitus, right? I'm never meeting 223 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:36,640 the rock the same way the second time after I've already put— this isn't 224 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,400 eternal repetition, it's recurrence. And repetition and 225 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:44,480 recurrence are different for me because I'm 226 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:48,880 convinced for myself, I never, I might, I might run into a similar 227 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,640 challenge, but it's never the same because I'm not the 228 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:56,200 same. I don't see it the same way, 229 00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:01,200 hopefully, because I keep evolving. So if I keep 230 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,120 evolving, I'm never repeating anything. If I'm repeating anything, it's because I'm not 231 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:08,400 evolving. Because I can run into the same challenge, and believe me, I 232 00:15:08,480 --> 00:15:12,160 do. I run into the same challenges for myself. 233 00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:15,860 I hear the same challenges from other people. Yeah. And 234 00:15:16,020 --> 00:15:19,860 that's the biggest aha for me. And the thing that freed me 235 00:15:19,940 --> 00:15:23,620 up the most is knowing that I'm not repeating things. It isn't like, how many 236 00:15:23,700 --> 00:15:26,420 times do I have to solve this? Or why do I keep running into this? 237 00:15:26,660 --> 00:15:30,020 It's not the same. I'm not the same person in 238 00:15:31,300 --> 00:15:34,380 my estimation. Like, that's my goal. My goal isn't 239 00:15:37,940 --> 00:15:41,550 to change the world. It's the change. 240 00:15:42,110 --> 00:15:45,790 It's that I evolve so that I never meet the world the same way 241 00:15:46,030 --> 00:15:49,870 twice, I guess. 242 00:15:50,030 --> 00:15:53,870 Because life, in my opinion, life is an insurmountable problem. And 243 00:15:53,950 --> 00:15:57,790 it's not a bad— and problem doesn't mean bad. Problem just means 244 00:15:58,670 --> 00:16:00,670 it's always going to present itself as a challenge. 245 00:16:03,710 --> 00:16:06,740 And that's really what where I'm at. 246 00:16:08,500 --> 00:16:11,620 And I'm trying, I just want to be more okay with that because I don't, 247 00:16:11,860 --> 00:16:15,620 my goal isn't to be, let me think about 248 00:16:15,700 --> 00:16:19,300 this for a second, isn't to be strong enough to change the world, but I 249 00:16:19,380 --> 00:16:23,220 want to be strong enough to see the world differently because if I do, it 250 00:16:23,460 --> 00:16:26,900 presents me with different choices and different choices present me with different 251 00:16:27,300 --> 00:16:30,740 outcomes. So I, I'm not trying to change it because I can't change the 252 00:16:31,060 --> 00:16:34,480 outside. Like I can't change the world. And the more I try to change the 253 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,920 world, I've said for, I've 254 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:42,080 repeated this so many times over the years, the world, I recognize for myself, 255 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:45,920 the world never has, it doesn't 256 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:49,760 currently, and never will care about what I want, nor should it, 257 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:52,880 by the way. Like it isn't, not only will it not, it shouldn't 258 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,720 because I'm a part of the world. Like I have the humility to understand, well, 259 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,540 actually I don't. I'm trying to develop the humility to understand I'm part of the 260 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:04,160 ecosystem. Like I'm not above or beyond anything and that I'm just a, 261 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:07,840 I'm just a cog. Right. And I'm okay with that. Like I don't, 262 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:12,080 I'm becoming okay with that. I can't say that I am okay with it, but 263 00:17:12,080 --> 00:17:15,760 I'm becoming okay with understanding how much 264 00:17:15,920 --> 00:17:17,400 I don't matter. 265 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:23,120 And I'm okay with, I'm starting to become okay with and actually 266 00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:26,650 embracing insignificance. Because 267 00:17:27,930 --> 00:17:31,770 when it, for me, the trade-off is once I'm insignificant and don't 268 00:17:31,770 --> 00:17:35,530 matter, I'm free to act because I don't have an outside, 269 00:17:35,690 --> 00:17:38,730 an outsized understanding of my impact that way 270 00:17:39,530 --> 00:17:40,650 because it doesn't exist 271 00:17:43,850 --> 00:17:47,530 for me. And that is not the way I have always thought. It is not 272 00:17:47,610 --> 00:17:50,530 the way that I've thought for a lot of years. 273 00:17:52,580 --> 00:17:55,380 And it makes the world a more peaceful place for 274 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:00,660 me. And hopefully, ultimately, it makes the world a more peaceful 275 00:18:01,060 --> 00:18:04,660 place for people around me, the people I care deeply about, which is really my 276 00:18:04,740 --> 00:18:08,580 goal because it's, you know, I've, I want to, I want 277 00:18:08,580 --> 00:18:11,780 to be, I want to have clarity for myself about what I want most, but 278 00:18:11,940 --> 00:18:15,780 what I want most is based on the other people that I 279 00:18:15,860 --> 00:18:19,350 care about. It's in context of that. It isn't, and 280 00:18:19,590 --> 00:18:22,950 I'm wrestling with this right now on something else. It isn't what we, I thought 281 00:18:23,030 --> 00:18:25,430 about changing it to what we want most, but I don't want, it's not a 282 00:18:25,510 --> 00:18:28,950 collective. It's not, I'm not taking votes. I want to be 283 00:18:29,110 --> 00:18:32,950 cognizant that I'm impacting other people because, you know, we go 284 00:18:32,950 --> 00:18:36,630 to Maslow and it's the hierarchy of human needs and self-actualization. And 285 00:18:36,710 --> 00:18:40,310 he said later it was self-transcendence. And I want to be clear for myself that 286 00:18:40,310 --> 00:18:44,140 I am striving to, I want to become the best version of myself, To 287 00:18:44,220 --> 00:18:47,660 serve those that I care deeply about. That's what I want to do. I always 288 00:18:47,740 --> 00:18:51,100 want to— that's the humility part for me. That's where you get rid of hubris. 289 00:18:51,420 --> 00:18:55,100 I'm not trying to become the best 290 00:18:55,260 --> 00:18:59,100 version of myself for me. That's why part of it is for me is 291 00:18:59,100 --> 00:19:02,460 that I keep reflecting back on what is needed by other people, by the people 292 00:19:02,700 --> 00:19:06,460 that I serve, by the people that I care deeply about, the people I want 293 00:19:06,460 --> 00:19:09,820 to have a positive impact on. What do they need from me? And that gives 294 00:19:09,900 --> 00:19:13,200 me the motivation to keep evolving. Because 295 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:16,560 some of the things that, some of the ways I show up aren't 296 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:21,440 serving others well, and therefore they're not serving me well. They 297 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:24,320 serve me well because it's easy. They serve me well because I don't have to 298 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:26,800 think about it and it's, I don't have to expend any energy and I can 299 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:30,400 do that all day long, but it's not ultimately achieving 300 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:33,200 what I want to achieve. And that is by making a better world for people 301 00:19:33,360 --> 00:19:37,120 that I care uniquely about. And so that's what all of this is. 302 00:19:37,740 --> 00:19:41,500 in all of this effort and challenge and struggle, which 303 00:19:41,980 --> 00:19:45,580 I view as a positive for myself, that I continue 304 00:19:45,820 --> 00:19:49,580 to do is on that. And I don't have an answer. Like 305 00:19:49,580 --> 00:19:52,300 it's never, you know, one of the things that 306 00:19:53,900 --> 00:19:57,260 I came up with was, you know, the whole definition of a relentless few are 307 00:19:57,260 --> 00:20:00,380 people that they're done when they're dead. And that 308 00:20:01,260 --> 00:20:03,820 sometimes for me is just flat out exhausting. 309 00:20:05,810 --> 00:20:09,170 One of the places that's exhausting is like, you know, physical 310 00:20:09,650 --> 00:20:12,850 activity, like, you know, whatever you do, however you do it, you know, getting out 311 00:20:12,930 --> 00:20:16,530 and moving your body and making sure that you're strong 312 00:20:16,850 --> 00:20:20,370 enough, you know, to do the things you want to do both, you know, in 313 00:20:20,450 --> 00:20:24,290 all aspects, you know, physically and emotionally and cognitively. And I think we need 314 00:20:24,290 --> 00:20:27,250 to be strong across all of those and that requires effort. And sometimes, 315 00:20:28,130 --> 00:20:31,930 you know, I'm at the gym or something and I'm I'm doing 316 00:20:32,490 --> 00:20:35,530 exercises and sometimes I think to myself, I'm like, God, I'm going to do this 317 00:20:35,610 --> 00:20:39,450 for another 20 years. Maybe, you know, I'm 59 years old. So maybe I do 318 00:20:39,450 --> 00:20:42,570 this for another, you know, am I keep doing this? And the answer is yes. 319 00:20:42,570 --> 00:20:46,330 And then I look back and it's funny because part of this is, 320 00:20:46,410 --> 00:20:50,090 you know, the whole conceptual part of this is I've been doing, I've been showing 321 00:20:50,410 --> 00:20:54,010 up in some way, shape, or form. And I'm using this as just a micro 322 00:20:54,250 --> 00:20:57,850 example for myself is at the gym since I was, you know, I first started 323 00:20:58,090 --> 00:21:01,490 really working out when I was in college. So, you You know, that was, you 324 00:21:01,490 --> 00:21:04,930 know, when I was 18, 19 is when I got introduced to formally working out. 325 00:21:04,930 --> 00:21:06,850 Didn't do a lot of it, did a little bit of it in high school, 326 00:21:06,930 --> 00:21:10,370 but not like I did when I got to college. And so, you know, 327 00:21:11,010 --> 00:21:14,770 19, I'm 59 now, let's call it 40 years. So in some way, shape, 328 00:21:14,850 --> 00:21:18,450 or form, I've been doing this for 40 years already. So on one hand, I'm 329 00:21:18,450 --> 00:21:21,170 like, I only have to do it for another 20. So that doesn't sound so 330 00:21:21,250 --> 00:21:24,290 bad because it's only half as long as I've been doing it. But I will 331 00:21:24,370 --> 00:21:27,730 tell you, and I think it's just like everything else emotionally and cognitively and 332 00:21:27,810 --> 00:21:31,580 physically, I think as we age, the amount of 333 00:21:31,660 --> 00:21:35,340 effort it takes to just keep up increases. So 334 00:21:35,900 --> 00:21:39,580 the effort that I used when I was in my 20s to work out, I 335 00:21:39,660 --> 00:21:42,060 have to use a lot more effort now to get a little less 336 00:21:43,820 --> 00:21:47,580 of a result. I hope that makes sense. So it's, I got to 337 00:21:47,660 --> 00:21:50,860 try harder to just keep— so the amount of effort I have to do just 338 00:21:50,940 --> 00:21:54,700 to stay static is a lot. You know, you work out a lot just 339 00:21:54,780 --> 00:21:57,020 not to lose anything. Then you got to add on to that. And I think 340 00:21:57,100 --> 00:22:00,890 that, and I use the term workout generally for physically, stuff, physicality, 341 00:22:00,890 --> 00:22:04,570 but I'm also talking about cognitively and emotionally because there's a certain amount of 342 00:22:04,890 --> 00:22:08,330 calcification that happens on all those for me as I 343 00:22:08,490 --> 00:22:12,170 age. Again, I'm trying not to universalize, so please excuse that as 344 00:22:12,330 --> 00:22:15,130 I'm sure it's going to happen again and again, is that 345 00:22:16,650 --> 00:22:19,370 I'm not as open as I used to be to things. 346 00:22:20,410 --> 00:22:24,250 I'm a little more risk-averse. And I don't think I mean that from the 347 00:22:24,330 --> 00:22:28,180 standpoint of effort. I mean it from the standpoint of risk, 348 00:22:28,500 --> 00:22:32,100 purely of risk of identity and what I'm doing and standing in the world 349 00:22:32,340 --> 00:22:35,620 and all of those things, right? Because once we have stuff, you know, we, when 350 00:22:35,620 --> 00:22:38,420 we're younger, we don't have as much stuff. So we're willing to risk and then 351 00:22:38,740 --> 00:22:42,020 we get stuff and we shift from risk to protection. Because now I don't want 352 00:22:42,020 --> 00:22:45,300 to, it was all about gaining stuff initially. Now it's not about, now it's about 353 00:22:45,380 --> 00:22:48,740 not losing that stuff. And that's a significant different 354 00:22:49,060 --> 00:22:52,500 approach. Like if I'm risking the gain, 355 00:22:52,950 --> 00:22:56,230 Because I don't have much to lose. But then, you know, they've done all that 356 00:22:56,310 --> 00:22:59,990 work with behavioral economics and they've proven this, that, you know, we're totally more 357 00:23:00,070 --> 00:23:03,910 risk-averse. I mean, I'd rather not lose than gain. And 358 00:23:04,070 --> 00:23:07,110 I think I do that both from an emotional and a 359 00:23:07,190 --> 00:23:11,030 cognitive, not as much from a physical, although I am quite aware there are 360 00:23:11,030 --> 00:23:13,910 things I don't want to do anymore because they're too risky and it takes a 361 00:23:13,910 --> 00:23:17,430 long time to bounce back. And so I, that does creep into 362 00:23:17,910 --> 00:23:21,610 my mind there too. But I'm more cognizant now 363 00:23:21,690 --> 00:23:25,290 of the risk involved in a lot of things, which I should 364 00:23:25,370 --> 00:23:28,890 be. And I'm okay with that, but I want to balance that so I don't 365 00:23:28,970 --> 00:23:32,330 become too risk-averse and things start calcifying even more and more and more 366 00:23:32,890 --> 00:23:36,730 because then we just start, I just start allowing everything to kind of 367 00:23:36,810 --> 00:23:40,170 close in and I do less and I experience less and I grow 368 00:23:40,330 --> 00:23:44,010 less. And that's really my passion around that is I 369 00:23:44,820 --> 00:23:48,420 I don't want to be 100% grow, grow, grow, and evolve, but I also don't 370 00:23:48,420 --> 00:23:52,180 want to close myself off to opportunities and things that would be better 371 00:23:52,420 --> 00:23:55,860 for me because they help me become more the person I want to show up 372 00:23:56,020 --> 00:23:59,620 as. So that's kind of where the thinking is 373 00:24:00,420 --> 00:24:03,380 right now. And I'm sure, 374 00:24:04,900 --> 00:24:08,660 and again, I just wanted to do this as kind of an 375 00:24:08,980 --> 00:24:12,760 insight into where I was, what I was bouncing around inside my head 376 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,800 right now and where it all stands. None of it is 377 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:18,920 solidified. And I think I'm becoming more 378 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:25,320 accepting of that, that that's the state. The state I want to stay in 379 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,760 to a certain extent is constantly that subtle 380 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:32,440 churn of what am I, 381 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:37,240 how am I showing up? And is it the best version for those that I 382 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:41,050 care deeply about? And if it's not, what opportunities do I 383 00:24:41,130 --> 00:24:44,890 have? And then continuing to build up the reserves, 384 00:24:45,130 --> 00:24:48,650 you know, physically and emotionally and cognitively to do that. But it does take a 385 00:24:48,730 --> 00:24:52,170 lot of energy to do that. So I have to, that's one piece I've never 386 00:24:52,330 --> 00:24:55,850 been good at is the, we can call it whatever we want, but self-care, 387 00:24:57,050 --> 00:25:00,330 you know, being able to make sure that I show up with the energy required 388 00:25:00,410 --> 00:25:04,100 to do these things. So I am focused a lot on that, making very 389 00:25:04,260 --> 00:25:07,940 little headway in that area, trying to, but 390 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:11,860 it, but again, you know, adjusting behaviors and habits 391 00:25:12,260 --> 00:25:15,700 and activities is really what's hard for me. Like it has been really hard for 392 00:25:15,700 --> 00:25:19,460 me to make a commitment to do things that I know would provide me with 393 00:25:19,540 --> 00:25:23,140 more energy. So I'm playing with a lot of stuff, doing a lot of experiments, 394 00:25:23,940 --> 00:25:27,220 sometimes, you know, not getting the results that 395 00:25:27,780 --> 00:25:31,520 I want, but I am doing it. And that's all, that's 396 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:34,720 all we can all do, right? We just got to show up, show up and 397 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,480 put in the work and really kind of absorb ourselves in the process and not 398 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,680 on the outcome. But I think that's a topic for another day. 399 00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:45,520 So. Hope you enjoyed it. Hopefully 400 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,680 this stimulated something in you for you to think about. If not, you know, take 401 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:53,600 whatever piece did and throw out the rest or, you 402 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:57,040 know, throw the whole thing out because I understand if it's not of value and 403 00:25:57,040 --> 00:26:00,700 if you're looking for, if you're looking for a framework or an answer, or an 404 00:26:00,940 --> 00:26:04,620 insight, not sure you're going to find it here because 405 00:26:04,780 --> 00:26:08,300 not sure I have any of those to share. And when I, on top of 406 00:26:08,380 --> 00:26:11,260 that, if I do get to the point where I think I do, I'm going 407 00:26:11,260 --> 00:26:14,860 to refrain from sharing them because I don't know that that's good for 408 00:26:15,100 --> 00:26:18,860 anybody. So thanks for joining. Talk 409 00:26:19,100 --> 00:26:20,060 again soon.