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The pastor comes up and he

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prays and he prays for joy and

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It made me cry and

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Sam opens his eyes at the end of the prayer and

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he looks at me and I'm actually

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have tears rolling down my face

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which is very surprising because I don't cry very

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easily especially in public and

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So we go home and we have lunch. We put our

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children down for naps and he goes

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What was that about? Why were you crying?

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And I said well the pastor was praying about joy

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and of course Sam knew that I suffered from

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depression and I've been

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searching for joy my whole life and

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So Sam goes well, I know

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how you can find that joy.

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Well Christina welcome to the podcast

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so we're gonna get some of your story today and

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let's just start at the beginning because

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If I understand right you you weren't necessarily

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raised in a Christian home

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Tell me about your upbringing. Did you have any

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kind of religious background and yeah start at

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the beginning there. Sure

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I was raised in the city of Calgary. I was raised

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by a mom and a dad that

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both grew up in a Catholic home

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But they didn't practice

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That at all and there was no religion in our

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home. We didn't go to

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church or anything like that

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My father did read

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children's Bible stories to my sister and I when

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we go to bed at night, but that's about it

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So I knew the popular ones David and Goliath and

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Samson really stuck out to me for some reason

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I heard about Jesus in those stories

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but that's about it and then my parents separated

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when I was nine years old and

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Along with with that kind of went any sort of

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Bible talk. Yeah, I from there

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I just I grew up my it was mostly raised by my

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mom. It was my younger sister and I and

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I was taught that I should

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Pave my own way that I need to be independent

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I need to make my own money

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Even if I get married and have children which my

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mom always really wanted grandchildren

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it was important that I was able to support

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myself just because of the some of the things

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that happened to her in her life and

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Yeah, that's how I was raised

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So did you think about Christianity at all or God

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or it was I mean you hadn't

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read the Bible I'm assuming and

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How did you think about that? How

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did you think of Christianity? I

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Didn't really think about God. I do remember one

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time for sure when I was a

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child lying in bed at night and

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Wondering if God created the world then who

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created God and that was confusing

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For me and I couldn't figure it out and I didn't

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have anyone to talk to so in my own

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logical childish mind I just decided that there

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couldn't be a God because it

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just didn't make sense to me

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And then I grew up and that's kind of where I

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left it. I did think that religion

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Christianity was for weak-minded people

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It was like a crutch for them to lean on which is

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very ironic because I suffered from depression

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and

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That was something that I that

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happened when I was a teenager

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I remember this one Christmas my mom asked me

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what I want for Christmas and I

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told her I just want to be happy.

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So throughout my life. There was

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this hole that I was trying to fill and

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I would- I had the mentality. I'll be happy when

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So I'll be happy when I get married

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I'll be happy when I have

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children. I'll be happy when

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we're wealthy and these things happened. I got

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married and I was happy for a little bit, but

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that hole never got filled and

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That's just kind of how I lived my life I tried

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different things I tried meditation I tried yoga

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I have a tattoo on my wrist to remind me to be

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strong mentally, but there

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was nothing really lasting

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It was something that I always

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kind of struggled with my whole life

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So somewhere in this process

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You meet your husband and he was an ex-Mennonite

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like he left the Mennonite church and left

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Christianity and I will be interviewing him

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later, but

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Tell me about that like was that the first time

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you'd encountered the Mennonites then I assume I

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mean you had no connection to Christianity

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Really? So what was that like? Mm-hmm.

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Yeah one evening. He showed me

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a photo album of his family and

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the women are wearing cape dresses and white

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bonnet head coverings and I never had seen

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anything like that before and

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I looked at the photos and just kind of oh, yeah

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lovely and smiled and went home and I googled

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What's a Mennonite because I had no idea.

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And the next day I went to work and I talked to

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one of my really good friends

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there and I was kind of freaking out

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actually that this is where Sam came from and

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She talked me down and said it's okay. You know,

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I actually had some history with a Mennonite

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babysitter or something like that and

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So she told me that it's

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fine and everything's okay. I

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mean it was kind of probably a shock though,

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right? I mean if you have no

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context for what this is like

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Wait, this is where he comes from? Mm-hmm. Yeah

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Shortly after that we went back to his home to

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meet his family. His younger brother

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was having a wedding reception so I

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met all the family all at once and

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They were such lovely people. They were so warm

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and welcoming and lovely

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I just if you could look past the cape dresses

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and the head coverings. They were just

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people and

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I was so pleasantly surprised by that

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I thought maybe they would have to they would be

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talking to me about Jesus and try to

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You know shove their religion down my throat and

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they weren't at all. They were just loving and

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and welcoming

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You have almost no exposure to Christianity at

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this point, but somewhere that changed

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I mean, obviously so tell me about that process

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or I'm assuming it was a process

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How did you begin that journey?

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How did you come to the faith? Where did you

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encounter Christianity for the first time?

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It wasn't actually a very long

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journey and it was an unexpected one

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at this point Sam and I are married and

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we have

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one son and we moved to

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Cochrane, it's a town just outside of Calgary and

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One day Sam asked. Oh should we go to church and

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I thought absolutely not I

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don't want to go to church

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So he okay and he just left it and then a few

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months later. He asked

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again should we go to church?

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He goes we can maybe meet friends there

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Because we were in a new town.

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We didn't have a lot of friends

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We were going from our old lifestyle with party

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friends and people like that

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We wanted friends that had little children and

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have a different kind of life

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So I thought that that yes, that would be a great

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idea good people go to church. Let's go to church.

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So that Sunday we got ready and we went to church

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and the sermon was about the love of God and

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It really spoke to me,

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which was really surprising

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And all week long I thought about church and I

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was looking forward to going back on

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So on Saturday, I asked Sam are

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we gonna go to church tomorrow?

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And he goes, oh, I didn't really think about it.

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Yeah, sure. We'll go to church

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so I was excited and we get ready to go and on

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Sunday we go to church again and

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There was a one woman skit

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about the life of John Newton and

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For those that don't know John Newton was a man

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that was raised in the

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faith had a very godly mother

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and then he left the faith and he became a slave

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trader and he did some

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pretty vile awful things and

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So I don't know this but this little skit is

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speaking very much to Sam

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at this point he

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was reading

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The verse of the day on a

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Bible app that he downloaded

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We now have a second child. We

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have another newborn baby girl and

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He is believing that there is a God and he

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doesn't want to tell our

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children that there's no God

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He wants to tell him that there is a God

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And so God's been working in his life and this

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message or this little skit is speaking to Sam

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And then at the end of that the pastor comes up

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and he prays and he prays for joy.

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And

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it made me cry and

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Sam opens his eyes at the end of the prayer and

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he looks at me and I'm actually

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have tears rolling down my face

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which is very surprising because I don't cry very

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easily especially in public and

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So we go home and we have lunch. We put our

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children down for naps and he goes

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What was that about? Why were you crying? And I

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said, well the pastor was praying about joy.

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And of course Sam knew that I suffered from

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depression and I've been

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searching for joy my whole life

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and

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So Sam goes well, I know

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how you can find that joy

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and so he talked to me a little

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bit about it and then we prayed and

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We decided right there him and I together we were

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gonna follow Jesus Christ.

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So we got up and we laughed and we cried and we

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jumped around our little dining room and

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It changed everything

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That's incredible like you've never

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Went to church really until a few weeks before

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and that happened quickly. Very quickly.

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Had you even read the Bible at this point? No.

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This story is pretty wild actually to have like

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so little exposure to

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Christianity and pretty quickly

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be able to identify this is

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The answer for a piece that's

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been missing throughout your life.

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I mean what changes for you after this? Well,

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like I said, it changed everything

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that hole that I was

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longing to fill was filled and

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we had new purpose. We had a new values

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Things like how we spent our time changed.

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We didn't watch TV anymore

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You know, we used to spend a

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lot of time watching NFL football

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Especially with my mom and family we would go

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there every Sunday and that

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just wasn't important anymore

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And so we stopped doing that I stopped doing yoga

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I stopped wearing makeup and wearing jewelry

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We sold our wedding rings and then I was reading

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I put a head covering on of course

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I changed the way I dress

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And then I was reading the

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Bible for the first time which was

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very amazing to read the Bible and

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See it through a clear lens and

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just take the words for what they said and it was

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amazing to read Genesis and

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Think, "I believe this now that God

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created the heavens and the earth

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like I believe that," that was really exciting and

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it was really exciting to read the words of Jesus

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Christ as well because they are

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life-giving and they are important and

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It's what we base our lives on now

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Yeah, it's there must have been something pretty

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special about that first time

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reading the Bible, right?

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Had you even owned Bible or read any of it at

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this point? This is all

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brand new. No, Sam had a Bible

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interesting actually this one

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time before we were Christians he

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You know, he was going through some old things

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00:11:46,831 --> 00:11:48,457

and he had a Bible and his

281

00:11:48,457 --> 00:11:49,583

old Bible and he went well

282

00:11:49,583 --> 00:11:51,502

What should I do with this? Should we get rid of

283

00:11:51,502 --> 00:11:54,463

it? And I thought well, no, you can't

284

00:11:54,755 --> 00:11:57,425

we should have a Bible I guess. I don't know why and

285

00:11:57,425 --> 00:11:58,926

I'm so thankful that we said that

286

00:11:58,926 --> 00:12:01,137

because now he has his his old Bible

287

00:12:02,054 --> 00:12:05,474

but anyway, I went to the store and bought a

288

00:12:05,474 --> 00:12:07,685

Bible and I was so proud of my Bible and

289

00:12:09,061 --> 00:12:11,230

Yeah, it was very important to me. I remember

290

00:12:11,230 --> 00:12:12,481

just reading and reading

291

00:12:13,023 --> 00:12:14,400

I'm pretty sure I read through the

292

00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:16,527

whole Bible in the first year. Oh, wow

293

00:12:17,027 --> 00:12:18,571

maybe there was some Psalms

294

00:12:18,571 --> 00:12:20,739

that I didn't fully get through but

295

00:12:21,907 --> 00:12:24,118

Yeah, it was it was important. It was

296

00:12:25,119 --> 00:12:25,744

Life-giving

297

00:12:27,079 --> 00:12:30,875

So you're having all these changes in life, but

298

00:12:30,875 --> 00:12:32,835

that's also making you

299

00:12:32,835 --> 00:12:34,211

different from the rest of your family

300

00:12:35,337 --> 00:12:37,465

Tell me about that. How did that go? Was that a

301

00:12:37,465 --> 00:12:39,300

challenge for you? Mm-hmm

302

00:12:39,967 --> 00:12:41,093

Yes, it was hard

303

00:12:42,386 --> 00:12:43,888

It was hard at first when we

304

00:12:43,888 --> 00:12:45,014

first started going to church

305

00:12:45,514 --> 00:12:47,933

it was hard definitely hard

306

00:12:47,933 --> 00:12:50,478

when I put on a head covering and

307

00:12:50,478 --> 00:12:53,606

It was even more hard when I changed my attire

308

00:12:55,733 --> 00:12:57,735

But I

309

00:12:57,735 --> 00:13:01,906

must do what's honorable to God and

310

00:13:01,906 --> 00:13:03,157

311

00:13:03,157 --> 00:13:04,992

do things for his glory and

312

00:13:04,992 --> 00:13:07,828

for his purpose not for for man

313

00:13:08,787 --> 00:13:11,123

so even though it was difficult, I felt that it

314

00:13:11,123 --> 00:13:12,291

was very important that I do

315

00:13:12,291 --> 00:13:15,836

what I feel convicted to do and

316

00:13:16,253 --> 00:13:19,173

Time has helped a lot though. At the

317

00:13:19,173 --> 00:13:20,466

beginning. It was very difficult

318

00:13:20,466 --> 00:13:22,092

and now through through the years

319

00:13:22,134 --> 00:13:24,553

Which it hasn't been that long. It's been six

320

00:13:24,553 --> 00:13:26,555

years, but there's been remarkable changes

321

00:13:27,264 --> 00:13:30,184

I feel like my family accepts me and my family

322

00:13:30,184 --> 00:13:33,354

for the way that they that we are and

323

00:13:34,230 --> 00:13:37,274

Actually, I've seen a lot of work God's done a

324

00:13:37,274 --> 00:13:38,692

lot of work in their life as well

325

00:13:39,193 --> 00:13:40,861

So it's a pretty beautiful thing

326

00:13:41,278 --> 00:13:43,531

But it was definitely very hard at the beginning.

327

00:13:44,448 --> 00:13:46,408

Yeah. Yeah. I mean I can

328

00:13:46,408 --> 00:13:47,535

imagine because it's just like

329

00:13:48,327 --> 00:13:49,954

Whoa, a lot of things have

330

00:13:49,954 --> 00:13:51,664

changed quickly in your life

331

00:13:51,664 --> 00:13:54,291

It must be you know a bit unsettling perhaps to

332

00:13:54,291 --> 00:13:56,001

the people who know you. Yeah

333

00:13:56,502 --> 00:13:58,254

Yeah, like I said time will tell

334

00:13:59,255 --> 00:14:02,007

people, your family they see who

335

00:14:02,007 --> 00:14:04,218

you truly are they see that you-

336

00:14:05,177 --> 00:14:07,638

Like if you're following Jesus Christ, like

337

00:14:07,638 --> 00:14:10,057

goodness comes out of that. You're

338

00:14:10,057 --> 00:14:12,810

your parenting my parenting was better

339

00:14:13,852 --> 00:14:16,021

My children are happy and well.

340

00:14:17,064 --> 00:14:19,233

Your family sees that that's

341

00:14:19,233 --> 00:14:22,194

a beautiful testimony.

342

00:14:22,987 --> 00:14:25,656

So I'm gonna pivot a little bit and go back to an

343

00:14:25,656 --> 00:14:26,615

earlier point in your story

344

00:14:26,615 --> 00:14:27,825

You know, you'd been a career woman

345

00:14:28,409 --> 00:14:30,286

I guess you could say or you know had a job a

346

00:14:30,286 --> 00:14:31,245

career all of these things

347

00:14:31,745 --> 00:14:33,539

Tell me about the journey from that to your

348

00:14:33,539 --> 00:14:35,416

current situation. Like was that hard?

349

00:14:35,416 --> 00:14:37,501

Like what was that change what all went into

350

00:14:37,501 --> 00:14:40,462

that? Tell me about that. Oh, I liked working

351

00:14:40,462 --> 00:14:42,298

I love putting on a business

352

00:14:42,298 --> 00:14:43,716

suit and high heels and going to work

353

00:14:43,757 --> 00:14:46,552

I worked in a big skyscraper downtown Calgary. It

354

00:14:46,552 --> 00:14:47,928

was a lot of fun. Oh, wow

355

00:14:47,928 --> 00:14:49,054

But you know like quintessential

356

00:14:49,054 --> 00:14:51,015

American well, I guess you're Canadian

357

00:14:51,140 --> 00:14:53,434

But you know the American dream or you know,

358

00:14:53,434 --> 00:14:55,185

whatever,whichever country you

359

00:14:55,185 --> 00:14:56,562

haven't live in or the Canadian dream

360

00:14:57,146 --> 00:14:59,481

Yeah, you were living it, you know, but on your

361

00:14:59,481 --> 00:15:00,524

power suit and go to work.

362

00:15:00,524 --> 00:15:01,984

It's not that I was a big wig

363

00:15:01,984 --> 00:15:03,402

or anything like that, but

364

00:15:04,194 --> 00:15:04,570

still.

365

00:15:06,030 --> 00:15:08,949

Now when Sam and I got married

366

00:15:09,575 --> 00:15:13,120

I really did want to stay at home with my children

367

00:15:13,203 --> 00:15:15,080

I thought that was important for a mother to do

368

00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:16,248

especially with young children

369

00:15:16,957 --> 00:15:19,376

But because of Sam's upbringing, I didn't want to

370

00:15:19,376 --> 00:15:21,879

be made to stay at home. This is my

371

00:15:22,463 --> 00:15:23,672

You know, I was

372

00:15:24,465 --> 00:15:26,008

taught to be independent

373

00:15:26,925 --> 00:15:27,635

374

00:15:28,719 --> 00:15:30,346

When I found out that Sam

375

00:15:30,346 --> 00:15:31,639

was okay with me working

376

00:15:32,681 --> 00:15:34,266

Then I told him I actually would

377

00:15:34,266 --> 00:15:35,309

like to stay at home with our children.

378

00:15:37,519 --> 00:15:39,980

Okay. So of course he was happy with that but he

379

00:15:39,980 --> 00:15:41,065

would have been happy if I went to work

380

00:15:41,065 --> 00:15:44,693

I have a very gracious loving husband, but this

381

00:15:44,693 --> 00:15:45,444

was before we were a

382

00:15:45,444 --> 00:15:47,821

Christian. So I did stay at home

383

00:15:48,697 --> 00:15:50,366

But I did have an idea that I

384

00:15:50,366 --> 00:15:51,784

would always go back to work

385

00:15:51,784 --> 00:15:53,869

maybe when my children were in school or

386

00:15:54,078 --> 00:15:56,330

Or something like that. It was in my mind that I

387

00:15:56,330 --> 00:15:58,082

would eventually have a job again

388

00:15:59,083 --> 00:16:01,877

And now I don't think that way. I

389

00:16:01,919 --> 00:16:04,630

feel like my place is at home with my children

390

00:16:04,880 --> 00:16:06,048

and

391

00:16:06,048 --> 00:16:08,509

Being a keeper of my home being there when my

392

00:16:08,509 --> 00:16:10,177

husband gets home from work

393

00:16:10,177 --> 00:16:14,264

I just God's really placed that in my on my heart

394

00:16:14,264 --> 00:16:17,101

that I am to be a woman at home

395

00:16:18,686 --> 00:16:19,770

Mm-hmm

396

00:16:20,229 --> 00:16:23,357

So it sounds like maybe that one wasn't - Was

397

00:16:23,357 --> 00:16:25,901

that a hard transition for you to

398

00:16:26,276 --> 00:16:28,779

Come to that place or were you already

399

00:16:29,780 --> 00:16:31,240

heading that direction?

400

00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:33,951

I think I was heading that direction and

401

00:16:34,743 --> 00:16:37,663

God is so gracious when you have a surrendered

402

00:16:37,663 --> 00:16:40,082

heart and you want to do his will he just

403

00:16:40,082 --> 00:16:42,793

graciously leads you along and

404

00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:43,836

you just

405

00:16:44,586 --> 00:16:48,424

Do what he sets before you and I find-

406

00:16:50,342 --> 00:16:53,220

I don't know my heart and my mind changed so much

407

00:16:53,971 --> 00:16:57,099

When I came to Christ that that part of my

408

00:16:57,099 --> 00:17:00,060

journey wasn't that difficult.

409

00:17:00,060 --> 00:17:00,352

Yeah

410

00:17:01,145 --> 00:17:02,896

It was more difficult for my

411

00:17:02,896 --> 00:17:06,108

family though that I wanted to do that

412

00:17:06,859 --> 00:17:09,111

Yeah, if there was a if there's a family culture of

413

00:17:09,111 --> 00:17:10,320

like you make sure and make your

414

00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:11,864

way in the world and all of that

415

00:17:12,406 --> 00:17:14,491

And for you to have a pivot I can yeah, I can

416

00:17:14,491 --> 00:17:17,828

imagine that being "wait, what are you doing?" Yeah

417

00:17:18,454 --> 00:17:21,874

so you mentioned earlier how a lot of things

418

00:17:21,874 --> 00:17:25,627

changed with how you dress and so forth and

419

00:17:25,627 --> 00:17:26,670

Dig into that a bit more.

420

00:17:26,670 --> 00:17:28,130

Tell me about that process of

421

00:17:29,465 --> 00:17:31,049

Changing your view on

422

00:17:31,675 --> 00:17:34,595

The way you dress- and so all of that

423

00:17:34,595 --> 00:17:35,596

that that whole package you

424

00:17:35,596 --> 00:17:36,847

mentioned the jewelry all of this

425

00:17:36,847 --> 00:17:39,099

Mm-hmm. What was that process like was that an

426

00:17:39,099 --> 00:17:41,852

easy thing for you or did that take some time?

427

00:17:42,936 --> 00:17:44,021

That wasn't easy.

428

00:17:44,938 --> 00:17:45,731

The

429

00:17:46,356 --> 00:17:50,027

Head covering was hard makeup wasn't so hard. I

430

00:17:50,027 --> 00:17:51,361

was a stay-at-home mom at that time

431

00:17:51,361 --> 00:17:55,073

I didn't really get all dolled up that much. So

432

00:17:55,073 --> 00:17:56,074

that was a little bit easier

433

00:17:56,408 --> 00:17:59,244

It didn't go completely. It kind of went step by

434

00:17:59,244 --> 00:18:00,871

step with what I got rid of but

435

00:18:01,538 --> 00:18:04,416

The head covering was difficult Sam mentioned it

436

00:18:04,416 --> 00:18:07,336

one day. This was new in our journey

437

00:18:07,795 --> 00:18:10,339

probably a few months in. Because of his

438

00:18:10,339 --> 00:18:12,591

upbringing his mothers and sisters wore head

439

00:18:12,591 --> 00:18:15,677

coverings his mother and sisters and

440

00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:19,848

When he first mentioned I said just no I don't

441

00:18:19,848 --> 00:18:20,766

I'm not ready for we're

442

00:18:20,766 --> 00:18:21,725

not even gonna talk about it

443

00:18:23,644 --> 00:18:26,188

But he did mention that there was a series on

444

00:18:26,188 --> 00:18:27,981

YouTube that I could watch a

445

00:18:27,981 --> 00:18:29,608

three-part series about the head covering

446

00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:31,860

And that was by Finny

447

00:18:31,860 --> 00:18:33,487

Kuruvila from followers of the way

448

00:18:34,029 --> 00:18:36,740

So one weekend Sam was

449

00:18:36,740 --> 00:18:37,991

actually out of town for work

450

00:18:37,991 --> 00:18:40,536

And for some reason I was ready to listen to what

451

00:18:40,536 --> 00:18:42,788

these sermons said because I

452

00:18:42,788 --> 00:18:44,456

knew because you read the passage

453

00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:46,416

First Corinthians and you

454

00:18:46,416 --> 00:18:48,210

just try to write it off

455

00:18:48,210 --> 00:18:49,586

Well, maybe the hair is the

456

00:18:49,586 --> 00:18:52,381

covering or it was just a cultural thing

457

00:18:53,757 --> 00:18:56,343

But I knew in my heart of hearts that wasn't right.

458

00:18:57,135 --> 00:18:58,971

I knew that what the Bible says

459

00:18:59,221 --> 00:19:01,473

is true. Like you do not you don't need to read

460

00:19:01,473 --> 00:19:04,434

between lines. It's very plain and simple

461

00:19:05,018 --> 00:19:06,854

Can be difficult, but I think most of the part

462

00:19:06,854 --> 00:19:08,522

it's most of the time. It's simple

463

00:19:09,565 --> 00:19:10,649

so I watched these

464

00:19:11,358 --> 00:19:13,360

sermons and

465

00:19:13,527 --> 00:19:15,904

Felt that yes a woman is

466

00:19:15,904 --> 00:19:16,780

supposed to wear head covering

467

00:19:17,865 --> 00:19:21,201

So the next day was Sunday and I went to church

468

00:19:21,201 --> 00:19:22,744

with my children by myself

469

00:19:22,744 --> 00:19:27,541

And I wore a scarf that I put over my head during this sermon

470

00:19:27,916 --> 00:19:29,293

and I was very embarrassed by it

471

00:19:29,293 --> 00:19:31,420

My heart was pounding. I was up in the balcony

472

00:19:31,420 --> 00:19:33,463

and put it on for the message then

473

00:19:33,463 --> 00:19:35,132

took it off and no one even saw me

474

00:19:35,132 --> 00:19:37,551

Or knew what I was doing

475

00:19:38,218 --> 00:19:40,178

So I felt kind of cowardly and

476

00:19:41,263 --> 00:19:42,264

then the next Sunday

477

00:19:42,806 --> 00:19:44,558

Sam came home and he watched

478

00:19:44,558 --> 00:19:46,268

the messages and the next Sunday

479

00:19:46,810 --> 00:19:49,688

I put on a head covering like tied it onto my head

480

00:19:50,439 --> 00:19:51,607

and went to church that way

481

00:19:52,024 --> 00:19:55,068

and again my heart's pounding and

482

00:19:55,068 --> 00:19:57,654

People are commenting on it. Oh, that's really

483

00:19:57,654 --> 00:20:00,324

pretty. Oh, you look so good. And I realize that

484

00:20:00,324 --> 00:20:01,950

they think it's just a fashion statement

485

00:20:02,701 --> 00:20:04,703

So the next Sunday I come

486

00:20:04,703 --> 00:20:05,954

back and I'm wearing it again

487

00:20:05,954 --> 00:20:07,998

Then I stopped getting so many comments on and

488

00:20:07,998 --> 00:20:09,625

people I think realized what I

489

00:20:09,625 --> 00:20:11,251

was doing and they didn't want to

490

00:20:11,835 --> 00:20:13,420

Go down that road themselves

491

00:20:14,755 --> 00:20:17,007

So that was difficult there was times where I

492

00:20:17,007 --> 00:20:18,008

didn't want to wear it or

493

00:20:18,008 --> 00:20:19,635

some especially around my family

494

00:20:19,635 --> 00:20:21,595

Sometimes I would wear it and sometimes I

495

00:20:21,595 --> 00:20:22,763

wouldn't and it was very

496

00:20:22,763 --> 00:20:25,349

confusing Sam one time asked me

497

00:20:26,058 --> 00:20:28,060

Well, just take it off if this

498

00:20:28,060 --> 00:20:30,187

is such a struggle don't wear it

499

00:20:30,646 --> 00:20:34,900

But I said I have to scripture says I have to and

500

00:20:34,900 --> 00:20:37,235

I feel convicted to so I must.

501

00:20:38,111 --> 00:20:41,240

So it took some time probably about a few months

502

00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:42,950

where I really wrestled and struggled with it

503

00:20:43,909 --> 00:20:47,496

But now I wear it full-time and it's amazing the

504

00:20:47,496 --> 00:20:49,122

sense of peace that came

505

00:20:49,122 --> 00:20:50,540

over me when I wear it. I feel

506

00:20:52,542 --> 00:20:55,545

I don't know protected almost like there was

507

00:20:55,545 --> 00:20:57,839

something about it where I felt

508

00:20:58,590 --> 00:21:01,969

In the world's eyes that maybe it's a suppression

509

00:21:01,969 --> 00:21:04,179

but yet I felt freedom

510

00:21:04,179 --> 00:21:06,306

with it on so it was a very

511

00:21:08,183 --> 00:21:10,811

Interesting thing and I don't really know how to

512

00:21:10,811 --> 00:21:12,562

explain it. But there was a

513

00:21:12,562 --> 00:21:14,940

freedom of putting it on.

514

00:21:15,941 --> 00:21:18,485

How did that go for other elements of changing

515

00:21:18,485 --> 00:21:20,904

your attire again? You'd mentioned the jewelry

516

00:21:20,904 --> 00:21:22,656

the makeup that these other things

517

00:21:24,116 --> 00:21:24,825

Was there a similar

518

00:21:24,825 --> 00:21:26,535

process for those things as well?

519

00:21:27,536 --> 00:21:29,955

In a sense my engagement

520

00:21:29,955 --> 00:21:31,498

ring was really hard to give up

521

00:21:31,498 --> 00:21:33,917

We have a such a neat story behind that Sam

522

00:21:33,917 --> 00:21:35,502

proposed me on top of the Eiffel Tower

523

00:21:36,253 --> 00:21:36,837

Wow

524

00:21:37,212 --> 00:21:41,717

But what's more important? And I think God is. So

525

00:21:41,717 --> 00:21:44,302

we took that off and then a little while later

526

00:21:44,302 --> 00:21:45,220

We sold it because what's

527

00:21:45,220 --> 00:21:46,138

the point of having that?

528

00:21:46,930 --> 00:21:50,017

But the my attire that was the probably the last

529

00:21:50,017 --> 00:21:52,853

big change that I made and it was hard

530

00:21:53,603 --> 00:21:55,105

I didn't want to wear

531

00:21:55,105 --> 00:21:56,773

dresses or skirts all the time.

532

00:21:59,860 --> 00:22:04,948

But I realized that God created man and woman and

533

00:22:04,948 --> 00:22:07,325

He created me to be a woman. So I want to be a

534

00:22:07,325 --> 00:22:09,119

woman. So when you go to

535

00:22:10,120 --> 00:22:13,915

Weddings or when people go on dates, what's the

536

00:22:13,915 --> 00:22:15,292

woman usually wear? Well, they

537

00:22:15,292 --> 00:22:18,170

usually wear a dress or a skirt and

538

00:22:18,170 --> 00:22:20,922

Why is that? Because they want to be a feminine

539

00:22:20,922 --> 00:22:23,133

they want to be maybe beautiful

540

00:22:23,592 --> 00:22:25,385

and so it's still in our culture

541

00:22:25,635 --> 00:22:26,511

it's just not

542

00:22:27,429 --> 00:22:30,223

up front as much anymore, but

543

00:22:31,266 --> 00:22:33,560

Especially with all the gender stuff going on

544

00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,229

right now. That God created me to be a woman. So

545

00:22:36,229 --> 00:22:37,564

I want to look like a woman

546

00:22:38,356 --> 00:22:42,944

so I put on skirts and dresses full-time and

547

00:22:43,278 --> 00:22:45,822

honestly, I didn't want to and

548

00:22:46,656 --> 00:22:48,784

There's times where I'd look in the mirror and go

549

00:22:48,784 --> 00:22:49,910

I can't believe I'm wearing this

550

00:22:49,910 --> 00:22:51,995

right now or I look I don't know

551

00:22:52,245 --> 00:22:54,289

But I just did it and

552

00:22:54,289 --> 00:22:56,917

One thing that I learned and this is with the way

553

00:22:56,917 --> 00:22:58,085

I dress and the head

554

00:22:58,085 --> 00:23:00,087

covering is if you dwell on it

555

00:23:00,629 --> 00:23:03,840

That thought gets stronger and more powerful. I

556

00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:05,926

think it's the evil one in our minds

557

00:23:06,551 --> 00:23:09,679

Or putting thoughts in your mind. And if you just

558

00:23:09,679 --> 00:23:11,139

dismiss that thought I

559

00:23:11,139 --> 00:23:12,557

don't want to do that or I look

560

00:23:13,767 --> 00:23:15,894

Frumpy or silly or whatever just

561

00:23:17,062 --> 00:23:19,356

Get rid of that thought and stop thinking it and

562

00:23:19,356 --> 00:23:21,566

I found that it's given me a lot of power to get

563

00:23:23,193 --> 00:23:28,073

Over that and just be accepting of how I look now

564

00:23:29,991 --> 00:23:32,244

Tell us a bit more like the practical side as

565

00:23:32,244 --> 00:23:32,786

you're making those

566

00:23:32,786 --> 00:23:35,539

switches to changing how you dress

567

00:23:36,706 --> 00:23:38,792

Yeah, it was really hard because I

568

00:23:38,792 --> 00:23:40,502

didn't have anyone in my life that

569

00:23:41,044 --> 00:23:42,796

Was doing these things.

570

00:23:43,338 --> 00:23:45,215

Of course, I had Sam's family,

571

00:23:45,632 --> 00:23:47,300

but I wasn't gonna sew a cape dress

572

00:23:47,676 --> 00:23:49,427

So what was I supposed to

573

00:23:49,427 --> 00:23:51,221

wear it was really difficult

574

00:23:51,429 --> 00:23:52,889

you'd go to the store and

575

00:23:52,889 --> 00:23:55,225

things were just not modest enough or

576

00:23:56,101 --> 00:23:58,311

There were maybe too expensive

577

00:23:58,311 --> 00:24:00,063

because that's another part of modesty

578

00:24:00,105 --> 00:24:02,732

I think is being very simple and being careful

579

00:24:02,732 --> 00:24:04,442

with what you're spending your money on

580

00:24:05,110 --> 00:24:05,777

581

00:24:06,319 --> 00:24:08,822

That it was hard. It was

582

00:24:09,281 --> 00:24:12,200

a big struggle at the beginning or what's a head

583

00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:13,702

covering supposed to look like or how you

584

00:24:13,702 --> 00:24:15,120

supposed to tie head covering or

585

00:24:16,163 --> 00:24:18,999

But one thing one place that I found very useful

586

00:24:18,999 --> 00:24:20,750

actually was a secondhand store

587

00:24:21,293 --> 00:24:22,419

surprisingly, there's a lot of

588

00:24:22,419 --> 00:24:25,297

long skirts in a secondhand store and

589

00:24:25,797 --> 00:24:28,008

Layering is another thing that was very useful

590

00:24:28,842 --> 00:24:31,553

It's hard to find tops that are modest.

591

00:24:31,553 --> 00:24:33,722

But if you layer you have a tank top or a shirt

592

00:24:33,722 --> 00:24:36,183

underneath a top then the

593

00:24:36,183 --> 00:24:37,684

neckline is not plunging anymore

594

00:24:37,684 --> 00:24:39,186

or you don't see your

595

00:24:39,186 --> 00:24:41,646

shoulders and so layering is a

596

00:24:41,938 --> 00:24:44,191

good friend of mine and

597

00:24:44,858 --> 00:24:47,819

then for the head covering at first it was a

598

00:24:47,819 --> 00:24:51,072

scarf that I just had it at home that I used and

599

00:24:51,573 --> 00:24:54,284

I found I had bandanas that I

600

00:24:54,284 --> 00:24:55,994

would use sometimes too and just

601

00:24:57,454 --> 00:24:59,289

Love actually my one of my favorite head

602

00:24:59,289 --> 00:25:01,374

coverings. I found it a secondhand store as well

603

00:25:02,584 --> 00:25:03,168

604

00:25:04,419 --> 00:25:07,464

Just taking steps. Things have changed along my

605

00:25:07,464 --> 00:25:08,632

journey already and I'm sure

606

00:25:08,632 --> 00:25:09,799

that will continue to change

607

00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:11,259

And

608

00:25:12,177 --> 00:25:14,721

And yeah, another place I actually buy a lot of

609

00:25:14,721 --> 00:25:15,931

my clothes now is Amazon

610

00:25:15,931 --> 00:25:17,641

because it's very hard to find

611

00:25:17,974 --> 00:25:19,684

specific things in the stores and

612

00:25:20,685 --> 00:25:22,938

I'm also a mom of small

613

00:25:22,938 --> 00:25:24,689

children. So Amazon's my friend

614

00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:28,860

You know, this is this is a

615

00:25:28,860 --> 00:25:30,153

real part of the story like those

616

00:25:30,570 --> 00:25:33,782

practical things and it's a process and it's

617

00:25:33,865 --> 00:25:36,534

There's iterations to this story, you know where

618

00:25:36,534 --> 00:25:38,078

you're these things don't happen

619

00:25:38,495 --> 00:25:40,455

instantaneously this is what I guess what I'm

620

00:25:40,455 --> 00:25:42,374

getting at. About how long of a

621

00:25:42,374 --> 00:25:43,917

stretch of time was this from

622

00:25:44,376 --> 00:25:48,004

conversion to a lot of these changes in dress and

623

00:25:48,004 --> 00:25:49,089

lifestyle and all of that like

624

00:25:49,089 --> 00:25:52,759

how long did that phase take a

625

00:25:53,093 --> 00:25:55,136

Lot of them happened in the first year

626

00:25:56,554 --> 00:25:58,640

Most of them did the head covering came first

627

00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,810

even before makeup and jewelry and then

628

00:26:02,394 --> 00:26:05,814

My attire came last and that was probably two

629

00:26:05,814 --> 00:26:06,856

years after conversion

630

00:26:06,856 --> 00:26:08,984

where I really started embracing

631

00:26:09,317 --> 00:26:10,694

Dressing like a woman and

632

00:26:10,694 --> 00:26:13,238

being more modest.

633

00:26:13,530 --> 00:26:15,949

Yeah, I can imagine it, you know, it takes time.

634

00:26:15,949 --> 00:26:18,243

It's not just an instantaneous thing and

635

00:26:19,202 --> 00:26:20,537

So I'm gonna pivot a little

636

00:26:20,537 --> 00:26:21,997

here with this next question

637

00:26:23,540 --> 00:26:26,293

Something we hear a lot, you know emails people

638

00:26:26,293 --> 00:26:27,752

commenting whatever on this

639

00:26:27,752 --> 00:26:29,254

podcast is the question of

640

00:26:30,714 --> 00:26:33,800

Where does a woman fit into the community into

641

00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,720

church life and all of that

642

00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:38,054

that whole side of things?

643

00:26:38,054 --> 00:26:39,180

I'd love to hear you

644

00:26:40,223 --> 00:26:40,932

Comment on that

645

00:26:40,932 --> 00:26:42,726

especially are like what are ways

646

00:26:43,476 --> 00:26:45,312

Ladies can contribute to the church? What does

647

00:26:45,312 --> 00:26:48,189

that look like? A big way that we

648

00:26:48,189 --> 00:26:49,941

contribute is through hospitality

649

00:26:51,401 --> 00:26:53,820

We have homes and we're

650

00:26:53,820 --> 00:26:55,155

supposed to be keepers of our homes and

651

00:26:55,905 --> 00:26:57,907

It's easy to have people in our homes

652

00:26:58,241 --> 00:27:00,660

I truly believe that God gave us the home that

653

00:27:00,660 --> 00:27:02,329

we're living in so we need to

654

00:27:02,329 --> 00:27:04,039

use it for his honor for his glory

655

00:27:06,166 --> 00:27:09,044

So that could be church family it could be

656

00:27:09,044 --> 00:27:11,254

neighbors, strangers sometimes even

657

00:27:12,088 --> 00:27:15,133

Have people over for meals have them for coffee

658

00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:19,763

Invite young moms or moms with young

659

00:27:19,763 --> 00:27:21,598

children to come over and have a play date

660

00:27:22,182 --> 00:27:24,976

It's such a good and useful tool

661

00:27:25,685 --> 00:27:28,021

To have people in our home. It's what Jesus did

662

00:27:28,021 --> 00:27:29,064

Jesus went to people's

663

00:27:29,064 --> 00:27:30,648

homes and he dined with them

664

00:27:31,399 --> 00:27:33,902

A home is a comfortable place. It's where people

665

00:27:33,902 --> 00:27:35,862

open up. It's where they can share their heart

666

00:27:36,488 --> 00:27:38,365

and where you can build relationships

667

00:27:39,741 --> 00:27:41,826

So hospitality is a huge

668

00:27:41,826 --> 00:27:43,495

area where we can serve in.

669

00:27:44,162 --> 00:27:47,540

My husband he's out more than I am, I'm at home

670

00:27:47,540 --> 00:27:49,000

with young children and a home school

671

00:27:49,250 --> 00:27:52,170

So he often will bring contacts home

672

00:27:52,796 --> 00:27:55,465

people into our home and then I serve or

673

00:27:55,882 --> 00:27:58,927

People spend the night and I just try to show

674

00:27:58,927 --> 00:28:00,512

them the love of Jesus Christ

675

00:28:00,512 --> 00:28:03,598

through that and it's easy to I think

676

00:28:03,598 --> 00:28:06,476

when you're serving them a nice meal or giving

677

00:28:06,476 --> 00:28:09,354

them a nice bed to sleep in and

678

00:28:09,479 --> 00:28:12,899

Little things little touches of detail go a long

679

00:28:12,899 --> 00:28:14,192

way with people and

680

00:28:14,192 --> 00:28:15,318

showing them the love of Christ.

681

00:28:16,694 --> 00:28:17,237

And

682

00:28:17,237 --> 00:28:19,280

of course supporting my husband

683

00:28:20,198 --> 00:28:21,533

being a good

684

00:28:22,909 --> 00:28:24,369

Wife with

685

00:28:25,370 --> 00:28:27,497

Being there for him when he's struggling with

686

00:28:27,497 --> 00:28:29,457

things or I'm there so he

687

00:28:29,457 --> 00:28:30,792

can bounce ideas off of

688

00:28:31,126 --> 00:28:34,629

I think that we are together in the kingdom.

689

00:28:34,629 --> 00:28:37,465

We're standing side by side and we're going

690

00:28:37,465 --> 00:28:38,633

through this journey together

691

00:28:39,342 --> 00:28:41,428

so I'm his helpmeet and

692

00:28:43,346 --> 00:28:45,056

Another way too which

693

00:28:45,056 --> 00:28:47,809

scripture talks about is women being

694

00:28:48,226 --> 00:28:51,563

teachers to the younger women and

695

00:28:51,563 --> 00:28:53,064

I've always envisioned that

696

00:28:53,523 --> 00:28:56,067

That was grey-haired women teaching the younger

697

00:28:56,067 --> 00:28:57,735

women, which I believe is true

698

00:28:57,986 --> 00:29:01,948

but I think that goes for anyone that has someone

699

00:29:01,948 --> 00:29:04,367

younger than them that they could be mentoring

700

00:29:04,367 --> 00:29:06,619

them or teaching them or

701

00:29:06,828 --> 00:29:08,413

praying with them just

702

00:29:09,706 --> 00:29:12,667

Being involved in each other's lives and

703

00:29:12,667 --> 00:29:14,419

Then something else that I think is very

704

00:29:14,419 --> 00:29:16,045

important that anyone can do

705

00:29:16,045 --> 00:29:18,590

anytime anywhere is to pray

706

00:29:20,341 --> 00:29:23,511

It's kind of maybe cliche to say that there's

707

00:29:23,511 --> 00:29:26,890

power in praying but there is power in praying

708

00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:31,769

If we are living an obedient life to Jesus

709

00:29:31,769 --> 00:29:33,605

Christ, then we have the

710

00:29:33,605 --> 00:29:35,899

ear of our mighty creator

711

00:29:35,899 --> 00:29:37,734

And we should use that.

712

00:29:38,902 --> 00:29:42,280

Prayer is so important and I also know that

713

00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,782

there's a lot of power in fasting as well

714

00:29:45,116 --> 00:29:48,745

So if you have fasting and prayer that is doing

715

00:29:48,745 --> 00:29:51,039

that's doing something in your community

716

00:29:52,790 --> 00:29:54,751

Fasting was something that was

717

00:29:55,126 --> 00:29:58,713

hard to know how to do correctly or we have the

718

00:29:58,713 --> 00:30:00,089

Bible talks about fasting

719

00:30:00,089 --> 00:30:01,382

But there's not maybe a lot of

720

00:30:01,382 --> 00:30:03,760

examples around there wasn't for us

721

00:30:05,094 --> 00:30:07,180

So we just started with I would start with

722

00:30:07,180 --> 00:30:08,389

skipping a meal skipping

723

00:30:08,389 --> 00:30:10,934

usually breakfast in the morning and

724

00:30:11,518 --> 00:30:13,978

Then over time that got easy

725

00:30:13,978 --> 00:30:16,523

It was easy to just skip breakfast and fast and

726

00:30:16,523 --> 00:30:18,107

pray so then it went to two

727

00:30:18,107 --> 00:30:19,692

meals and I heard through a David

728

00:30:19,776 --> 00:30:21,986

Bercot talk that the early church typically

729

00:30:21,986 --> 00:30:23,530

skipped breakfast and lunch

730

00:30:23,530 --> 00:30:24,697

and then they would eat supper

731

00:30:25,657 --> 00:30:27,158

and

732

00:30:27,867 --> 00:30:30,161

That's been very powerful in my life and powerful

733

00:30:30,161 --> 00:30:31,579

for people that are around me

734

00:30:32,497 --> 00:30:34,541

We've seen many prayers answered

735

00:30:34,541 --> 00:30:37,794

and it's some a very useful tool and

736

00:30:37,919 --> 00:30:40,630

Something that we all should be doing hmm

737

00:30:41,548 --> 00:30:44,509

So there's probably people listening to this that

738

00:30:44,509 --> 00:30:47,428

are struggling to find where do I fit into?

739

00:30:48,471 --> 00:30:49,180

God's kingdom where

740

00:30:49,847 --> 00:30:52,642

Where do I fit into my church community and those

741

00:30:52,642 --> 00:30:54,936

kinds of questions? They're wrestling with that

742

00:30:55,603 --> 00:30:57,272

What would you say to those people?

743

00:30:58,481 --> 00:30:59,274

I would say

744

00:31:00,358 --> 00:31:01,276

Do the thing that's in

745

00:31:01,276 --> 00:31:03,570

front of you and do little steps

746

00:31:05,738 --> 00:31:06,364

This big

747

00:31:07,532 --> 00:31:09,200

Grand thing's not just gonna call

748

00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,202

fall out of the sky in front of you

749

00:31:12,036 --> 00:31:14,455

That happens to some people, but it doesn't

750

00:31:14,455 --> 00:31:15,623

happen to the average person

751

00:31:16,165 --> 00:31:20,169

So just taking little steps doing maybe there's a

752

00:31:20,169 --> 00:31:21,921

little thought in your mind.

753

00:31:21,921 --> 00:31:23,047

We'll just follow that thought

754

00:31:23,047 --> 00:31:24,924

Is it calling a friend or?

755

00:31:27,010 --> 00:31:29,804

Serving your neighbor in some capacity just doing

756

00:31:29,804 --> 00:31:32,307

those small little steps. I

757

00:31:32,307 --> 00:31:34,183

think sometimes people think that

758

00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:37,812

There needs to be a big thing for them to fit

759

00:31:37,812 --> 00:31:39,439

into the kingdom of God and

760

00:31:39,439 --> 00:31:41,024

there doesn't need to be it's just

761

00:31:41,524 --> 00:31:44,193

doing those little things and being obedient to

762

00:31:44,193 --> 00:31:47,739

the Holy Spirit and following his promptings and

763

00:31:47,739 --> 00:31:49,073

When you follow those small

764

00:31:49,073 --> 00:31:51,367

little promptings bigger ones come

765

00:31:51,534 --> 00:31:54,829

Just going ahead and pursuing it and doing

766

00:31:54,829 --> 00:31:57,123

something is better than doing nothing

767

00:31:57,832 --> 00:32:00,376

Sometimes I know I've struggled with who I'm not

768

00:32:00,835 --> 00:32:03,588

what should I do or how can I do a really amazing

769

00:32:03,588 --> 00:32:06,007

things in my community and

770

00:32:06,007 --> 00:32:08,885

If you've ever read any missionary stories or

771

00:32:08,885 --> 00:32:09,719

things like that, you know,

772

00:32:09,719 --> 00:32:11,179

it always started with something small

773

00:32:12,096 --> 00:32:13,973

George Mueller didn't all of a sudden have this

774

00:32:13,973 --> 00:32:15,266

huge orphanage with all

775

00:32:15,266 --> 00:32:16,309

these hundreds of children

776

00:32:17,101 --> 00:32:17,935

He had

777

00:32:18,311 --> 00:32:20,271

Children come to his house and he would feed them

778

00:32:20,271 --> 00:32:21,564

breakfast and there was only

779

00:32:21,564 --> 00:32:22,690

a few of them at the beginning

780

00:32:22,690 --> 00:32:25,318

So you just start somewhere really small and you

781

00:32:25,318 --> 00:32:26,736

never know how God will use you.

782

00:32:29,197 --> 00:32:30,239

Start small. Wow.

783

00:32:30,865 --> 00:32:32,075

Yeah, that's so true though

784

00:32:32,075 --> 00:32:34,160

Because sometimes we have these grandiose ideas

785

00:32:34,619 --> 00:32:37,080

of these things and maybe what we should be doing

786

00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:38,915

is just take the next step.

787

00:32:39,749 --> 00:32:41,834

Yeah, I've learned from experience that God

788

00:32:41,834 --> 00:32:42,835

doesn't show you the whole path

789

00:32:43,878 --> 00:32:46,589

Or even show you what door is open. You just

790

00:32:46,589 --> 00:32:48,800

take a step in faith and you

791

00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,177

walk and then the doors will open.

792

00:32:52,512 --> 00:32:53,096

Wow

793

00:32:53,971 --> 00:32:57,266

Well, Christina, thank you for taking the time to

794

00:32:57,266 --> 00:32:59,727

share your story with us today. I think you've

795

00:32:59,727 --> 00:33:00,853

given us a lot to think about

796

00:33:00,978 --> 00:33:01,896

Thank you

797

00:33:03,231 --> 00:33:05,066

Thanks for listening to this episode with

798

00:33:05,066 --> 00:33:07,026

Christina if you found this interesting

799

00:33:07,193 --> 00:33:09,237

You should listen to this episode we did with

800

00:33:09,237 --> 00:33:11,739

Tirzah where she tells her journey of joining a

801

00:33:11,739 --> 00:33:13,157

church community and the lessons

802

00:33:13,157 --> 00:33:15,910

She learned along the way. We also have another

803

00:33:15,910 --> 00:33:17,704

YouTube channel called Anabaptist origins

804

00:33:17,829 --> 00:33:19,747

Which is a documentary series about the first

805

00:33:19,747 --> 00:33:21,749

hundred years of the Anabaptist movement and so

806

00:33:21,749 --> 00:33:23,710

make sure you're subscribed to that as well

807

00:33:24,043 --> 00:33:25,878

Thanks again for listening and

808

00:33:25,878 --> 00:33:27,296

we'll catch you in the next episode.