Welcome to we are already free.

This is a podcast I've dreamed

into being to support you on your path of self discovery,

sovereignty, and remembering that you are already free in a society

that's bred us to believe that we are anything but powerful, that we

are anything but sovereign.

This podcast is your invitation to

return to that.

The simple truth that we are

already free. Join inspiring down to Earth

guests as they share vulnerable stories and favorite strategies on

how they live lives of beauty, joy, connection and meaning with

the people they love.

I'm your host, breathwork

facilitator, empowering wordsmith, and intuitive guide Nathan

Mainguard it's an honor to be here with you today.

If you don't really get that, there's much issue at all with

mainstream medicalized birth.

Or if you'd like to both your

children outside of the medical system, today's episode is for

you. It's a confronting, challenging

and ultimately empowering.

Look at medical birth and the

alternative known as free birth.

Emily Saldivia is a founder of the

Free Birth Society, helping tens of thousands of women around the

world to birth the way humans have done forever.

They also train women in the radical birth keepers school run.

An amazing.

Podcast and a whole lot more.

Emily's experience and harrowing stories from working in the

mainstream birthing industry give her a deep understanding of how

humans are being born into captivity through this mainstream

birthing methods. May this podcast episode with

Emily Sadaya educate, inspire, and empower your relationship with the

miracle of birth.

This podcast is brand new at the

time of this recording and any help that you can give to share it

out. And more people is really

important at this point.

The more that you can share,

subscribe and leave reviews, the more chance this has to be seen by

tens if not hundreds of thousands more people through the new and

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So please take an action.

If you take any action, obviously

after listening to this and if it resonates, please share it far and

wide and let's help more people to remember that they are already

free, I think now.

More than ever is such a time for

us to support one another, to share this kind of information, to

share that there are alternatives to the disempowering stories we

have been indoctrinated with by our failing and failed society.

So this is with love, with joy.

I'm so happy to be able to offer

this episode to you.

And please do stick around for the

end where I have a few important things to share with you.

But for now, please enjoy this uninterrupted.

Episode with Emily Sardaa of Free birth society.

How is death a part of birth or how is death present at birth?

Or how does one need to confront death to birth?

Well, there's certainly no one answer, but death and birth are

the, you know, intros and outros of this time on Earth, right?

And so death is a part of birth in that, quite literally, women who

are the life bearers, you know, are also the death bringers,

meaning that if you think about it from the time there's a spark of

conception, that spark will die right it will die at some point,

whether it's tomorrow, whether it's in 12 weeks gestation or

whether it's 12 years old and so on yeah and so, you know, my old

midwife I used to apprentice under would say we come to go and, you

know, birth is the entry point and death is the exit point.

And so you don't really have one without the other in the obvious

sense that. They literally by design in

arguably go together.

Sometimes I refer to myself as a

portal dweller because when you are drawn to birth, you're also

often find yourself, you know, in what I call death midwifery as

well, holding space on, you know, the other end.

And sometimes, and it's not actually that uncommon, that death

is a part of birth.

Meaning still birth, miscarriage,

you know, chosen termination.

Obviously, people spontaneously

die at all stages of life, right? So of course stillbirth is

particularly tragic, but also really not rare yeah so I mean

part of, you know, the work that I do, which is very specifically

around. Birth work outside the medical

system, outside the medical paradigm.

There's a lot of contending with death because, well, I guess I'll

say that when you birth in the system, you don't have to contend

with death in the same way as the enormous social risk that comes

with birthing at home, birthing without medical providers.

You know, I would have lots to say, to win an argument about why

that's actually safer and produces better outcomes.

But women who free birth, which is birthing without medical

providers? Hired professionals, women who

free birth, you know, kind of kind of naturally then contend with the

possibility of death.

But it's more so rooted because

we're doing something so different from societies, you know,

mainstream. Of course the question we're

constantly asked is, well, what if something happens?

Yeah and so free birthers, you know, I that I find tend to be.

Enormously mature and, you know, taking on a layer of radical

responsibility to contend with these concepts, that when you just

do whatever your doctor says and just go in for your induction, no

one's explaining you know the likely risks and side effects.

You know, and then you have the section you never needed.

And then, you know, you hemorrhage and the baby goes to the nick you

and the baby dies and the nick you.

The framing of that is thank God we were there and we were able to

try everything right? Whereas I'm in a very different

consciousness where I'm like, well, it's very likely they killed

the baby.

You know, but my background is

attending hundreds and hundreds of births within the system and.

You know, it's just so painful.

But i have seen babies be murdered

from pharmaceuticals, from, you know, mistreatment, neglect, all

sorts of stuff.

And then, of course, there is just

the spontaneous natural death that can occur at any stage of life.

And actually what, you know, the name of your podcast is

interesting to start with birth, because we are already free, is a

beautiful idea and yet for the vast majority of humanity.

At this time, we're born into captivity.

We are born, not free, right? We are born into these.

Deeply systemic structures that keep us captive and you know in a

basically long standing sequence of consumerism and outsourcing and

all of this stuff.

And so I imagine this podcast is a

remembering of who we are outside of that.

But there's a lot of healing to do around the birth, you know of our

own births and around you know.

The global planet in the way in

which we birth, because we're not Born Free like my daughter was

Born Free, you know? But I'm a very tiny, tiny, tiny

little % of women who are birthing freely.

Yeah, I saw agree.

I mean that's one of the things I

think about is like that term we are already free.

I think about it a lot.

Of course, I think about these

kind of things.

I'm like, well, are we?

And I think for me it's like, it's like a mantra.

It's like, why do I say a mantra because I'm because I'm reclaiming

something. I'm remembering, as you say, I'm

returning to responsibility for something that is an inalienable

truth. And yet I acknowledge that within

the current physical paradigm and I just and actually this sort of.

Highways into something that my I'm a home birth my the four

myself and my three siblings from my mother were all born at home.

I'm the eldest and so I feel deep gratitude for that at that time.

My parents living in a little village on the tip of South Africa

where they got it from all sides as you more than well know how it

goes and what they had to go through just even to have a home

birth with a midwife there, etcetera.

But to navigate that and I was speaking with my mom a bit earlier

today. I was just having a.

Like, I needed a mum moment.

I don't know.

I just like was like, oh, I miss Mum and I, so I just called her up

and was chatting that up would be chatting with you.

And she thought she shared a line from the Bible.

She finds a lot of huge amount of wisdom and peace in the Bible.

It's not something I've ever really read, but I she offers me

these little Nuggets and she said this one, which I'll read to you

is from Exodus 1312 It says thou shalt set apart unto the Lord all

that openeth the matrix.

And when she read it to me, I was

like, did they really use the word matrix in there?

Like, is that a real thing? And she said, yes, let me go

check. And she checked the meaning in

Hebrew, the original what's translated as the matrix also

means womb. So that's it's one meaning.

And then if you go to the actual, like the old, what they call the

primitive route in the Hebrew, it is to love deeply, have mercy, be

compassionate, have tender affection, have compassion.

And I just, I just thought that was a phenomenal.

Meaning of the word matrix as a root, where now we think ohh get

out of the matrix.

But actually what we're in is a

man-made prison and the actual matrix is the womb is the is the

portal. So I don't know if you have any

thoughts on that, but I thought I'd share that.

Well, I'm just, I'm thinking about how in Kundalini yoga I was taught

that matrix means Maya and Maya is the physical.

You know reality and ohm, you know, is God before physical

manifestation and Maya is the physical manifestation.

So that's kind of, that's different.

But I did know that the origin of matrix in Hebrew was womb, which

is so cool, so cool.

Well, has that been changed?

Yeah, exactly. So I'm curious to know about your own journey, like

what I've known of you and seen of you through your and heard of you

through your podcast and through your page and what you're offering

in the world.

Is you seem from my perspective to

be someone who is sovereign and empowered, and you are a leader

and you are really taking profound action in a direction that you

align with. And I'm wondering what was your

life like before you reclaimed your sovereignty or before you

claimed that part of yourself? Or have you always felt that way,

or how was that journey for you? Well. I mean, in my childhood you

can find every corner of me trying to, like, carve out my space and

you know, dig my heels in about, you know who I am and make that be

known. You know, there are stories of in

my, in my childhood when I was, I let me make sure I'm saying this

right 12 just really didn't like my family dynamic.

My parents had split, things were not great and I sat my parents

down. I was really into soccer and was

playing on some big, you know, national teams.

And that was my first dream was to be a professional soccer player.

And so I sat my parents down when I was twelve, they were divorced

and I got them together and I said, look.

We all know I'm too young to run away.

That would be just not the move for success.

And so would you be willing to send me to boarding school far,

far away from all of you, where I can start on varsity, you know, at

in ninth.

Grade and I need to get out of

here, you know, and thankfully, my parents had the resources to say

yes and the willingness.

So I go to boarding school for two

years. I wind up having this really

horrific knee injury soccers out of the soccer's out of the picture

now, for me, I'm, like, relearning how to walk.

On crutches for a year.

It was really a big deal and so I

came home, I tried that for a couple of months in Florida, where

I'm from.

And then the same thing happened

again. Now, four years later, I sent my

parents, sat my parents down and I say.

Look, I'm 16.

We all know this isn't working,

you know? Side note, I was going to public

school for the first time in my life.

I had always been in private and I wasn't going and I was making

straight A's It was a joke.

It was such a joke.

The whole thing was such a joke.

And I hated it.

And I knew I was wasting my time.

And so, yeah, I sat my parents

down and I said I'd like to withdraw from school and leave.

And I had been working at this little bakery.

And I had 2000$ US saved, which felt like.

What can't I do? You know what can't I do with

2000$ when you're 16? And now?

That's hilarious.

But yeah, and so I told my parents

I'd like to withdraw from school.

I'd love your support.

I don't need it, but I'd love it would make getting an apartment

easier, and I'd like to go to LA and start my life.

And they were like, OK, yeah, that seems right.

And so I did, you know, so I went not really knowing anything i was

freshly 16 years old anyway, so there's those stories, you know,

in my in my childhood that are very obvious that I.

You know came in to this life with a lot of fire and a lot of just

determination and clarity and.

You know, I would say throughout

my twenties I've always been in birth, I've always attended

births. I started attending births when I

was 17. And I'm 36 now.

And so for what is that 19 years and?

I don't know how much you want to go into the whole Dula journey and

the medical midwifery path, but it really took me too long in my

opinion, to figure out.

How bad?

You know, the medical paradigm of birth was I was indoctrinated into

doula life, which is all about being the Savior.

All about, you know, holding the woman's hand while she's raped

with instruments. You know, and at least you're

there, and at least you're going to remember her story.

Yeah, it was really quite dark and sick actually.

And so I had a very successful dual business.

For over a decade in Los Angeles and a lot of what I do now, which

is not that is, you know, attempting to bridge that gap for

birth workers so that it doesn't take 10 plus years for them to

figure out and connect the dots and get the language provided for

not only how deeply unethical you know, the monopoly of childbirth

and obstetrics is, but also how we enable it in all these different

ways, you know, believing.

And reform fundamentally, which I

no longer do.

So yeah, I mean, you know,

sovereignty. I don't think I even knew that

word until I was probably 30.

Now it's like trending and it's

everywhere. But, you know, birth work is

spiritual. Work it's so.

It's so intense and there's so much that you have to learn how to

hold because you're working with the most inner, inner fabric of a

family dynamic. It's really intense.

And you even in normal physiological births, you know,

you're still, like I mentioned at the beginning of the show, you're

still dealing with occasional stillbirths or, gosh, so much.

I mean, family dynamics are so complicated, right?

There's abusive dynamics.

There's loss, you know, of family

members while the woman's pregnant.

There's so much that goes on within a family, you know,

becoming a family.

And you are just like right up in

that mix. So it's A and then you times that

by how many? Science you have, it requires an

enormous amount of maturity and spiritual growth, and you know

it's inside out work.

And so no one taught me that

that's what we teach about now.

But this was a pretty lonely

journey for me in my twenties, trying to sort all of the layers

of this workout.

And for anyone listening now who's

kind of new to everything we're talking about.

And he's kind of going, but I thought, you know, like home birth

is cool and but it's all like, why does this sound so intense?

And I'm curious, how did you go? Because it is intense.

I mean, if I think of if someone has to open the door to this one

thing, it's like what else has to collapse for that to become in

someone's awareness? And in your case, like you stayed

in that industry, you said for about 10 years and then how so,

like using your journey as a way to kind of.

Illustrate that shift and what happened for you within that space

and moving out of it yeah you know, so for the vast majority of

us, we're just kind of born into the mainstream.

And then, you know, I assume if you're listening to this podcast,

you're, you know, like us where at some point you start to question

it and move outside of it and, you know, look at more radical, you

know, which back to root, you know, ways of life and ways of

thinking and, you know, altering your consciousness, you know,

beyond the kind of mainstream.

And so, you know, in my, in my

earlier years. I was just being asked to attend

births. And it was an obvious, yes, it

felt like a deep calling.

You know, many midwives say that

it's just kind of with you your whole life.

And it found me really young and I didn't know any other way.

And so no one in my awareness, globally, in my awareness was

doing what I do now, which obviously I'll explain in a little

bit. So the path.

That was laid before me.

When you're interested in birth

work in the early two thousands is you take a dual of training, which

essentially a doula is a non medical woman who is kind of like

a hired friend.

She's going to know about birth,

she's going to have someone like comfort measures.

But my critique of doulas is that really, you know, the profession

is enabling an enormous, you know, industrial machine of abuse and

torture of women and children and so.

I started as a very proud doula, started going to birth.

I didn't know any better.

You know, I didn't have language

for anything I'm about to talk about.

And, you know, I remember my fourth, birth which was horrific.

And the mother was a family from Ethiopia in a County Hospital in

LA and she.

Yeah, she was brutalized with

torture instruments. She had an episiotomy cut, you

know, so very sharp scissors, cutting her perineum.

Down to her anus.

The baby was ripped out while she

was being pumped full of drugs that she never consented to,

dipping in and out of consciousness.

When she would wake up into consciousness, she would be

screaming. It was horrific umm.

And her perennial never repaired, you know, she as last I knew her,

which obviously was a while ago, but she went on to have one more

child and she never was able to experience sensation down there

again anyway. So that was my fourth birth and I

remember taking that story to my mentors, which I used very

loosely, just more experienced doulas.

And I was completely gaslit by how with how upset I was.

And they were like, yeah, you know?

This is the, I'm sure the doctors did their best.

And, you know, sometimes you gotta see some hard stuff and, you know,

you're there to help her reframe the birth because, look, she has

the healthy baby and she had a vaginal birth.

So that was my exposure, you know, for many years I didn't have

anybody validate. How horrific the treatment of

women and children, you know, was that I was not just witnessing but

being paid to witness, which is also pretty disgusting, you know.

And I believed that I was helping because I would hold her hand, you

know, when they would force instruments inside her and not

explain why. And you know, the doctors would,

you know, let me know how much they needed me to keep her calm

and. You know, I just saw, you know, 10

years of birth in the in captivity, you're gonna see some

gnarly ass shit.

And so I felt very purposeful in

my doula work.

I cared a lot.

And I had no language for.

The secondary trauma I was

experiencing and for how completely honest, unsustainable

what I was doing was, it was all pretty gross, actually.

And when I would try to talk about something horrific that I saw so

and so do, or try to rally the doulas and be like, can't we all

leave Yelp reviews like we've all seen him do.

This one thing you know, can't we all talk about it?

Like surely there's something we can do?

They would all be like, well, you don't want to get on the bad side

of the doctor.

Because then you won't be invited

into the birth and that could, you know, affect your income.

And what's interesting about this is, you know, many doulas will

probably acknowledge how horrific some hospital births are.

But there's this implication in the birth world and the mainstream

birth world that home births with a licensed, you know, medical

midwife is like as good as it gets.

Like, that's the, that's the.

That's the best thing you can get

hired to go see.

And to go support.

And so I did a lot of that.

I was The Apprentice to the

busiest. Cnn in Los Angeles.

And so I went to tons and tons and tons of medicalized births at

home. And, you know, in some ways it's

even worse. Because women are hiring women,

believing that they're going to keep them out of the hospital

system, believing that scraping together 6000$ and paying this

woman to come to their home is going to have them prevent an

unnecessary surgery or transfer or induction or what have you.

And it's not the case at all, right?

And so there's medical midwifery is incredibly unethical and lacks

transparency, and no one's really acknowledging, especially medical

midwives, that they are agents of the state by way of their license.

And so, yeah, I kind of forget what your original question was,

but the tracking of my twenties.

Was going to birth after birth

after birth. I'm talking 5 to 10 month Like a

lot of births in different roles.

Sometimes the assistant to a

medical midwife at home, sometimes as a doula in all settings,

including scheduled C sections, accidental side of the road births

where no one was there.

You know, like every setting,

right that you could really conceive of.

I've probably been there for.

And my spirit was.

Not OK.

I was not OK.

I was coming home after birth and.

You know, needing a glass of wine

or smoking a spliff and just like crying in my partner's lap, you

know, and just felt this overwhelming sense of dread and I

didn't know what to do about it.

And I think a lot of doulas are

there are in that place where.

You are making money.

You are doing your best.

You are seeing unimaginable

brutality and violence.

And for context, because again,

you know, maybe there's people listening who have no idea what

I'm talking about.

You know, obviously violence

happens on a spectrum, but I'm talking about, you know, women

saying, no, I don't want a vaginal exam and then having an entire

medical staff climb on top of her and physically hold her down.

In labor while they force their fingers inside of her.

You know, I mean that's rape, obviously.

Definition of rape is, you know, the insertion of any instruments

or body parts, you know, into an orfice that is basically unwanted,

right. And yeah, this is all totally

normalized within the medical industry and within the dual

industry, which is all wrapped up together.

So, you know, back to for someone who's brand new.

Let me think about where I want to go with this.

So for someone who's new to this, I want to say.

That the takeover of obstetrics, which has been going on for just

about over 100 years or so.

Has eradicated.

Not just authentic midwifery for the most part, but it has

completely changed how women Orient around their bodies and

around the normal biological process of childbirth which.

Spoiler alert.

We've literally been doing for

forever, right? And so for the last hundred, years

it's been incredibly.

Different you know, the white man

came over from England to America with his little white lab coat on.

You know, the first wave of physicians.

The history of obstetrics in North America is incredibly interesting

and depressing. And so they come over.

They do all these incredibly.

A successful moves to get the

birth out of our homes where it's always been and really not that

long ago, I mean just a couple generations into clinics and then

hospitals and. You know, you can watch these

horrific old videos of women being drugged and babies coming out just

so drugged, which is where the spanking came from because babies

were being born on ether like in the fifties you know, and then you

just, you move into all these different trends of drugs and

twilight sleep and, you know, and today we have the epidural, which

is widely accepted and used and it's just hardcore narcotics and

anesthesia. I mean, it's absolutely drugging.

Our mothers and our babies and babies are absolutely born on

drugs. But it looks a little different

now than it did in the sixties So, you know what's important, I

think, to say, to contextualize this whole conversation is.

How what we said about women birthing in captivity.

When you birth in an industrial setting, you are treated like.

You you're joining an assembly line.

There are.

You know, it takes proceduralism

to a whole new level.

You do not have human rights.

You do not have patient rights.

The myth of informed consent is

such a fucking joke, and you'd only know this if you worked in

it, you know? I mean, you could listen to my

podcast where there's hundreds of women also sharing their

narratives and you can start to get a grasp of the truth.

But what's so brilliant about what they've done is they've brought

birth, which was always a family.

Event you know, out of the family

they bring it into, you know, concrete walls full of strangers.

They torture and abuse and extract the baby from the woman.

And, you know, then there's a couple days of that and then they

send them home and the woman will never see the staff again.

The woman will possibly never go back to that hospital.

And so abuse in all settings really thrives in the shadows

right That's kind of how abuse is perpetuated.

It's not happening on the streets nearly as much as it's happening

behind closed doors, right.

And so this is just kind of an

industrial example of that.

Does that mean that every single

woman having hospital birth is going to agree with my, with my,

like, really intense assessment of it?

Of course not.

You can certainly find women who

love. Their hospital births you can find

women with emerging from their births with less intervention and

abuse than others.

But of a famous feminist quote

that my friend says to me frequently is if it doesn't work

for all women, it doesn't work for women and I would apply that.

To industrial birth.

It's I'm finding it so

interesting. One of the most, well, not the

most striking, but something very striking about what you're sharing

right now is just how much trauma.

You're expressing like, how much

just the worst kinds of human on human abuse.

And yet, when I look at your, when I listen to your podcast,

generally I haven't listened to many episodes, but the ones I have

listened to and specifically, more commonly when I watch the videos,

these birthing videos and the stories of women that they share

on your Instagram, I see something that is like.

It's like the most inspiring thing.

It's just on a whole.

So it's it to me.

There's a profoundly impactful juxtaposition or parrot or not

paradox, but juxtaposition of this horrific trauma and then what it

is that free birth society is facilitating in the world.

And so I would love to hear for those listening what?

What is that experience like? I know it's unique every time, but

like what is the general where you've illustrated what it's like

in the medical system? What's it like out of the medical

system? Yeah well really what we're what

we're talking about is birth like what is the design of birth and

it's quite magnificent and it really, you know all mammals

follow pretty much the same design.

So we birth like the zebras and the gorillas.

It's not it's not.

Actually very different at all,

other than our neocortex yeah and so the design of birth is meant

for the mother and the baby to experience euphoria and bliss in a

way that, you know, we could break down the hormones and all of the

physiological, you know, setup of it.

But what I want to say before we dive into that is, you know, it's

no, it's not surprising to me that in patriarchy where women have

been property and enslaved, you know, everything that we know

about the history of patriarchy, that the successful eradication of

one of our most significant power, points you know, in our life has

been not allowed, right? Has been completely taken.

Or attempted to be, I mean, obviously it's still, it's still

going on. Yeah, and so.

I guess I'll tie this into my story, which is to say that once I

started to get language to all of this and, you know, really got

clear that medical midwifery was not for me.

And, you know, understanding my know helped me find my yes, which

I think is important to say kind of in all areas of life because.

Sometimes that's how you're yes comes in is to really know what

doesn't feel good.

And so I had no idea I was going

to, you know, become who I am now with this work.

But I knew I didn't want medical midwifery because of all the

inherent sabotage and sister on sister violence and betrayal and

all of that.

And then obviously I'm not going

to be in the system.

So in my late twenties, I just put

it all down.

But I was very popular and so I

was still getting a lot of requests and I went to my first

interview. Putting everything down, and it

just happened to be a couple that wanted to birth at home, but they

couldn't afford a medical midwife and they didn't even particularly

want one. And I heard myself say pretty much

the unspoken not allowed words of Adoula, which was, well, if you

wanted to just stay home and not hire anyone else, I would totally

come and, you know, support you guys as best as I can.

And they were like, yes.

And I was like yes.

And so that was my first birth after.

You know, hundreds and hundreds of births in captivity.

That was the first wild birth I had ever seen, and I'm bringing

that up now because it was like the first time I was seeing birth,

even though I had spent almost 1010 years at that point,

witnessing humans come out of humans, you know, but to watch

birth completely unmanaged.

With no assessment and diagnosis

to watch. The woman not have to game out

when to transfer or, you know, feel worried about the rules and

regs that we're going to influence her birth.

I mean just to give birth like the wild animal that she is.

With no containment outside of, you know, the spiritual

containment that I was providing, which really is authentic

midwifery to me.

It was contagious.

It was unforgettable.

And I watched her, you know,

travel through the underworld and her self doubt and you know, all

of the stuff that pretty much comes up for all of us when we

birth and access power, you know, access like real power and bring

her baby, you know, here.

And so from that, moving forward,

just to contextualize this anecdotally, because I feel like

people always remember stories better than then, you know,

statistics and all that.

I've seen women.

Healed after physiological births.

I've seen, you know, women who

have been making themselves throw up after meals for 9 years, you

know, or since high school have a physiological birth, have a, you

know, birth outside the system.

And stop self harming.

I mean that's huge.

You know, I've seen women, tons of

women including myself stop, you know, stop shaving and stop

wearing makeup and stop wearing high heels and stop doing these

self harming. You know, rituals that we're

trained to do from little girls.

And yeah, so, like the potential

of impact is quite large when a rite of passage is met with the

reverence you know that it deserves, right?

So does that mean that if that you can have a free birth and

everything is going to change? Of course not.

But what it means is that when you experience these kind of.

Portals or rites of passage, you know that I think are intended for

the human spiritual evolution and experience.

The potential for great transformation is now there.

Are you going to claim that potential or not?

Well, I don't know.

That's up to you.

And you know, for some women I see their needle move slowly.

I know lots of women who free birth and are in abusive

relationships, for example, and it's a big deal that they did this

one thing, but they still have to really clean up their life, right?

Because they're still in a super toxic, scary dynamic, and so the

needle might move real slowly.

Whereas other women will like,

shed everything and burn their shitty life to the ground and

have, you know, major transformation really quickly.

So it's certainly not a guaranteed recipe or any of that, but you

know what I mean, that it's these like, it creates the potential for

enormous transformation.

And it's very similar, you know,

to me, it really helps.

I like to teach this through the

lens of sex because it's very similar in lots of ways, but if we

think about.

Let's say a young woman and her

first sexual experience.

Could be on the spectrum of gang

rape, which many women I love.

That's their first experience,

being drugged and raped.

Ok, so that's, you know, as bad as

it gets or somewhere in the arena.

I mean, I guess we could come up

with ways it's worse but pretty bad, pretty horrific.

And then all the way to the other end of the spectrum of a first

sexual experience could be, you know, thankfully, more what I had,

which was, you know, fumbling through with my very best friend.

My partner of five years in high school and just total love and

respect and playfulness and communication and just kind of a

best case scenario of play and sweetness and safety and the

difference of how a woman, a young woman, emerges out of either of

these ends of the spectrum.

And of course there's anything,

you know, everything in between really determines a lot for who

that woman becomes.

How she relates to her body, what

her sexual patterns become for the rest of her life and so on.

It's the same thing with birth, right?

Birth kind of makes or breaks you, just like sex does.

You know? It really determines a lot of how

you show up in the world, how you feel about yourself and what

happens next. Do you feel like that's the same

for? Because I know you've spoken about

the woman.

I mean that to for the baby as

well, right? Like so being birthed into?

A medical environment of trauma and pain and just like all the

stuff that's going on and then all being both where your mum's all

relaxed and she's laughing with the husband and then like going

through, I mean, there's got her and so how?

I don't know what do we do about that, acknowledging that most

people in the world right now have come through the portal in that

way. Yeah, I mean, we don't care about

babies in our society, you know, like babies are seen as these.

Like blobs that lack intelligence and sentience.

And, I mean, people still circumcise their sons, you know?

I mean, whoa, like, that is crazy.

Like, we are actively hurting our

babies, you know, worldwide in all sorts of different ways.

And so, you know, babies are an extension of the mother, right?

And so for as long as we're abusing mothers, we're abusing

babies. It's not, it's not gonna be, you

know, we're not going to make a distinction there because our

babies are. Us but, yes i mean i, think you're

speaking to the kind of.

Obvious and inherent trauma that

is blanketing this planet when the vast majority of.

Us are coming into the world.

Through violence, you know, and to

be clear again, like, I'm not being dramatic, what I mean, you

know, I would call incredibly violent when a, you know, when a

mother is drugged and numbed and disassociated from her body and,

you know, strapped to a bed, has a catheter inside her because she

can't walk, you know, to release her bladder and she's literally

high on fentanyl or morphine and a stranger who she's never met

before is going to come in and cut her premium.

And extract a baby with instruments and then the baby will

be cut from the mother not getting, you know, all of the

placental blood transfusion that is intended, which is enormously

important and the baby you know is received into glove latex, you

know, hands by strangers.

It's the first you know, touch of

physical environment is gloved by strangers and then cut and the

baby is taken over to a little plastic bin where strangers who

are masked and you know all look like.

And aliens are, you know, deep suctioning the baby and, you know,

putting tubes up the nose and down into the throat to clear the baby

out as if they're not about to do that themselves.

And wrapping the baby up and having the baby.

And if they're lucky, now the baby comes over to the mother, who is

now being shot full of pharmaceuticals to force her

uterus, you know, to contract while the doctor is putting his

hand, you know, all the way in his forearm inside of her to manually

remove the placenta, you know, while the baby now has no smell.

Being emitted because they're completely covered up and the

mother is drugged receiving this bundle of cloth.

And that's just like a normal birth for most of us.

That is a horrific picture.

Yeah, it's horrific.

Not even section, you know? Well, I was going to say so.

C-section like, for anyone who is listening, who might be like, oh,

that sounds like an extreme case I.

Just it's like.

30 thirty 30 % plus of births in

America. In America are C sections and in

South Africa the number is closer to 70 % are C sections.

So if, and I mean anyway it's.

All over the world.

I mean Brazil is like 90 Dominican Republic.

Is like 90 plus.

Costa Rica's over 60.

I mean, it's very high.

Russia has a crazy high.

I can't remember if I want to say the wrong thing, but yeah.

What was your question about C sections?

No, just saying that for anyone listening who might think that the

story you've shared is sounds like an extreme case.

It's like that's not that's what's happening and totally average.

It's like how important it is to note where we are right now and

then also acknowledging because it's interesting, because I hear

you talk about that and then I see the way that you act and what how

do you stay.

How have you stayed so not just

hopeful, but action oriented like you?

You have helped tens of thousands of women around the world to birth

in a completely different way.

That includes things like bliss

and safety and connection and joy like how do you?

What is it that drives you in that way?

Yeah, well, what else are we going to do?

That's not really my personality to just complain.

But before I answer that question, I just, I want to offer one more

thing I think that might be helpful for wrapping people's

brains around. This is from a biological design

perspective. You know, these babies us are not

being born intact.

And what I mean by that is there

is a hormonal matrix, there is a biological sequence for optimal

mother baby thriving.

Ok. And we can talk, we can get

back to that if you want because I'm happy to explain that, but

it's not very complicated.

It's just that when you understand

how medical birth works, it interrupts that sequence at every

stage. And so we are not born intact.

Our hormonal matrix is not born intact.

So just to like make so that can make sense, for example, with a

C-section baby. When a baby goes down through the

vaginal canal, they're getting their cranium is getting pressure,

right, it's going down through the canal, and there's all these cool

sequences that happen, but one of the things that happens is the

pressure on the cranium will essentially alert to release a

hormone that once the baby is born, the hormone will now start

to have a smell that comes out the fontanel the soft spot of the

baby's head. And so then when the.

Mother, just naturally because she's holding her baby smells that

it triggers her production of milk.

And so there's all these sequences like that.

That's just one of them.

I mean, there's tons.

And it'll just blow your mind and just make you fall in love with

life, you know, because it's so perfect and it's so profound and

it's so beautiful.

And as a as a midwife, I see the

difference in babies who have the full intact sequence right.

And then I see the difference and the challenges and I want to say

here, like, you're not just like fucked if you didn't get your full

sequence or if you had a traumatic birth and.

Yeah, exactly.

Well, I mean, you know, like we do

have to start somewhere and humans are amazing.

And we're so our capacity to spontaneously heal is always here,

you know, and so.

You know, we want.

I think that the healthy framing of this is yes be devastated and

be, you know, so upset about what's happening and what we've

missed and then move on, you know and do better and adapt and heal

and create better, you know.

So that's all we can do.

We are where we are in our story yeah and so how I keep going is

one of my favorite commitments that I work with is this

commitment that says, are you willing to be the resolution that

you want to see? And I use that a lot when I hear

myself complaining. I used it a lot during the COVID,

you know, nonsense, because that felt very terrifying to me in a

way that I had never felt before.

And I spent a couple months

complaining and freaking out and judging everyone and criticizing

everyone and creating lots of disconnect in some of my

relationships. And then I remembered that

commitment and was like, well, what would be in the resolution

look like? Like what?

What would that even be, you know? And that's what brought me here to

65 Acres of beautiful land with independent water and you know, in

a town that never masked and like, I'm living the resolution with my

family that we wanted, you know, to see we created it somewhere.

And so it's the same thing with birth, you know, it's the same

thing with everything that I do you want to complain or do you

want to do the thing? And it's not hard, you know?

It would be way harder to know about the horrors and not do

anything about it.

That's weird.

And then what we have on our side is biology.

You know, this is what I say to women all the time when they're

like, I'm really afraid of birth.

You know, what do I do about that?

Like, what's it matter? Who cares?

Be afraid.

A baby is coming out of your

vagina. One way or another, it doesn't

matter. If you're afraid, it's fine.

Who's not afraid? It's fine.

It's literally not a big deal.

Just don't self sabotage yourself

right you can totally be afraid.

Just stay home.

Your body will run a whole sequence.

Your baby will emerge, you know, from your vagina.

You will catch your baby and you will have.

You know, evolved from the fear that's, you know, 4 generations

deep in your system.

You know, it's fine.

And one of my favorite quotes is from one of my girlfriends,

Yolanda. She says I feel fear, but I'm not

afraid. And I love that so much.

Like, can we just feel the fear? But that feels real different than

being afraid.

Yeah, so I think when you know

these paradigms are so interesting because when you.

When I have chosen to actually put.

My whole life into creating the paradigm I want to see in the

world, everything got really easy.

I started making more money than

I've ever made.

The women showed up.

The clarity came like it just got really easy.

And the big psychological shift I made very purposefully because I

wanted to see what it would be like to run a business this way

was. And the kind of question I played

with at the start of FBS was what would it feel like to run a

business and do my work in the world without trying to convince

anyone? Because pretty much everything I

was doing in the birth world prior was trying to convince women not

to go to the hospital.

Which didn't work.

You know, they all still went.

It didn't work yeah and so that

has, yeah, it's been pretty great.

And it feels really different.

In my system, I have so much more creativity and spaciousness, and

boundaries are easier.

Like, everything's just easier now

that my.

Like the psychology of my work for

myself is I'm just kind of over here celebrating and doing my

thing. And whoever wants to come play

with me over here is totally welcome to.

And if you don't like, great, best of luck.

There's no savior complex anymore.

And you know, I realized

essentially that my hero.

You know, my savior was

unsustainable and it was actually fundamentally disempowering to the

women, you know, that I was trying to serve.

And so learning the tools of how to step out of that and create a

non hierarchical midwifery practice and, you know, run all

these different. Branches of this incredible

platform from this.

Like real respect and trust in

women. And that they don't need to be

saved. Like yes, it's horrific what's

happening, but. They also can choose something

else. And so I want to be a part of, you

know, the paradigm that it gets as big as possible where finding

those other options are as easy as possible.

And that's what's happened with the podcast that I've done for the

last five years is, you know, women.

Just hearing that this many women just say no thanks, I'm going to

just stay home.

Has created, you know, a level of

impact that I didn't I didn't know would happen.

You know, it's just taken off like wildfire and I think that's a good

reminder of how easy all of this is, because we have biology on our

side, we have nature on our side, we have life on our side, right?

So being in alignment with life.

Is such a personal spiritual

choice. And to enact natures biology

through, you know, a woman's body.

It's like a pretty simple choice

to make in a lot of ways.

Does that make sense?

Oh, absolutely. yeah you've given me so many little pods I'd like to

follow. I don't know if we'll which one

will stick but the one is just to reflect and say that when I heard

you speaking a moment ago, it resonated deeply around the place.

I've written these poems that I wrote over the last few years like

that we are already free poem that I shared.

Everything you've just said was exactly because I when the whole

like COVID thing kicked off at first I was like, here's these

other stats, here's these things you should know.

This doesn't make sense.

Look, it doesn't make sense and it

just caused.

So much polarity.

I was trying to convince people and show you and I realize like

it. Within a few weeks I was like, I'm

exhausted. I don't wanna do this anymore.

And I just, I just went quiet, like I just shut.

I shut up.

But then I kept feeling this thing

I'm like, well I still have truth.

That is my truth.

And how can I do it differently? And when the poems started coming

through, it was exactly that.

It wasn't to try and say you're

wrong. It was just to say here is my

story and if anyone else wants to come play like exactly what you

just said, really resonate with that so it's beautiful to hear

that impulse is such a universal impulse that if someone is feeling

that impulse in themselves, not to prove other people wrong, but to

embody fully their own truth, that that's really a valuable impulse

to follow, that that's probably the one worth following.

Well and I mean that's maturity right like that's a mature thing

to do, to just kind of focus on your own business and put that

out, right. That's like emotionally

intelligent and mature.

And so of course, good things come

out of that.

Yeah, yeah. And then you said

around like the tools and the techniques etcetera that you use

to build this business that you've done.

So just on a practical level like what are the even just one of them

a thing that has really been critical in you being able to

sharpen the world? Say that you do.

Well I work with, I worked with the same mentor since I was in my

mid twenties and she's one of the main coaches of this company

called the Conscious Leadership Group and so their website is

conscious. Dot IS so anyone can check them

out and they have lots of cool free resources and videos and

stuff. So she is in the gay and Katie

Hendricks lineage, the Byron Katie lineage, lots of amazing people.

And so essentially she has taught me a framework to.

Step out of blame helplessness, save your complex and how to be

like we just said, kind of returning to my business and

working with these 15 commitments.

So there's this book anyone can

get called the 15 commitments of conscious leadership.

And it's kind of a funny book because it's written for the

corporate world. So you kind of have to look past,

you know, the examples will be like Henry's late on the supply

chain at the factory, you know? And in the boardroom, the CEO's

upset. Like, it's kind of silly and

doesn't relate to my life at all right.

So, you know, if you can kind of get past that, it's an incredible

book and it teaches these 15 commitments, which they didn't

necessarily make up.

They just compiled a bunch of

amazing tools yeah and so there are things like a commitment to

taking responsibility and so really unpacking that concept and

understanding how to apply that to my life, certainly not just in

birth work. But in my marriage, in my

mothering, in my social dynamics, my relationship to money, my

relationship to my body, I mean, everything is material for these

tools. And I got pretty obsessed with

them in my mid twenties and yeah, just made a real commitment to

them. It felt like I was finding the

Holy Grail. It felt like.

I tried all sorts of therapies and different modalities and, you

know, I had a daily sodna practice and I was doing kundalini every

day. And, you know, I was so

enlightened and yet, you know, still had.

Still felt quite victimized by others or felt, you know, really

controlled by my own righteousness or whatever it was.

And so these tools gave me really quick, applicable ways to shift

out of those and into, yeah, radical responsibility, self

discovery. And so some of the questions I

work with that I just love are.

Like one is.

How is what's happening for me? And if you're, if you're

interested in trying on, you know, some exploration into radical

responsibility, you have to kind of go out and find it because we

are completely programmed and there's nothing wrong with this,

but we're completely programmed from a survival consciousness to

experience the world as it's happening to me, right?

We're at the effect of it.

We live in an almost entirely

reactive state, and it's not all bad.

It's reacting to positive stuff too, right?

It's not all just doom and gloom, mental suffering or something, but

it's still pretty much all.

If you track it, you'll see a

reactive state, and so this is a whole different arena to play in

of it. They refer to these three states

of consciousness. When you shift out of victim

consciousness to me, consciousness you shift into either through me

as me or by me consciousness and so.

Yeah, that's kind of just what I've been playing with now for the

last seven eight nine ten years of what does it feel like to own my

commitment to blame? What does it feel like to own my

commitment to feeling victimized by XYZ?

And what does it feel like to look for how I created this, look for

how what? You know what's here for me,

what's here for my learning and.

You know that's about as powerful

as it gets.

Because when you are living in a

bind, me through me as me, state of consciousness, you're

completely allied with your life, like everything that happens.

Can be played with, right? Everything that happens.

Every hate mail I get, every person that betrays me, every, you

know worry about money.

Every single thing that happens.

Is part of this playground right? So yeah, it's lots of fun, and it

just gets more fun the more you do it.

And that's pretty much where I hang out.

And so I wanted to see what a business would look like kind of

based on, yeah, taking radical responsibility being the

resolution, which is one of the commitments.

And I'm not saying I don't like still villainize like, obviously I

do, but the maturity and, like, the skill for me has lied in

owning it. You know?

Like, I'm not confused anymore.

I know when I'm blaming.

I know when I'm victimizing.

I know when I'm heroine.

And once you like my mentor says, conscious people know when they're

below the line is the term they use and get willing to shift.

And that's amazing like, that's all.

That's all.

That's the trick.

You know? That's the generic shit right

there. A young padawan.

Yeah, that's amazing.

That's beautiful.

So i really only have one more question for you, that is, and I'm

curious to know.

So as a man, as a penis Harrow,

sorry, I couldn't resist umm.

How do you see men?

Responding to this movement, to the Free Bird society, like, how

is it? Because I have.

I mean I actually fortunately, you know, we've just moved to a new

area here and I think all of our friends are free birthing or at

least home birthing with extreme like even one of my friends has

just done the radical birth keepers.

And so, like, it's a Baron Daniel.

Oh yeah cool yeah, you live in her

area. Yeah, yeah. So I've known Baron

and Peter. They have been hugely influential

in my life and we've been friends now for quite many years.

And my fiance and I moved to this area specifically because there's

a good crew of folks here.

It's one of the main reasons

because we just were a bit isolated where we were before,

totally. And so it feels amazing because we

haven't yet had a child and we're super keen and it's like on the

cards, definitely in the next, like, I don't know, 18 months, I

guess. I don't exactly know, but yeah.

And so to be out here and have that support and I guess for

myself, like, I'm one of the beautiful parts of seeing the

videos, and obviously I focus on this because I'm a dude, but like

watching how the men who are with their women when they're birthing

there is a there's a fucking vibe.

Like it's a vibe.

And so just from your side, like how is that for men?

I don't know if you can speak to that at all.

Well, I mean, the short answer is it depends on your level of

internalized misogyny. Ok, interesting.

Now so like the misogynists don't like this right wait,

Explain that. I don't.

I don't get that, Tommy.

Well, you know, massage, you know, misogyny is.

Yeah, yeah right so essentially anti woman's liberation, right?

So men who are narcissists, you know, entitled, run the household,

very patriarchal.

You know, everything centers

around them. They like to control their women,

you know, they run the show, you know, like, obviously I'm talking

about a lot of men out there.

They are not 13.

Yeah, they're not too keen on women or their women.

You know, going rogue, essentially, and.

Cultivating, you know, ecstatic, let you know, layers of confidence

and embodiment.

So it really does it really, I

mean it sincerely, like, it really depends on the level of misogyny

that the man carries, how he orients around this, you know, so

the spectrum is quite wide.

I mean lots of men have fear

around this and concern and I do feel compassion for like the

average bear because they were not raised.

Trusting birth, trusting women.

You know, we're in a very anti

woman culture, you know, in these respects.

And so, yeah, lots of fathers to be feel very nervous about

birthing without medical providers.

It kind of seems like men go in two different directions once

they've seen their women be traumatized in the system.

The majority of them don't understand why the woman wouldn't

go back, which is very odd to me.

But there is such a deep level of.

Ok, this is kind of a tangent, but it's like through the lens of

misogyny. I would explain it this way, that

men unconsciously, very frequently do not understand how a woman

could birth without management.

And so someone needs to be in

charge of her.

And when you take a doctor away,

then it means it's got to be him.

And so all these men, frequently I

talked to them all the time, are like, well, I'm not a midwife.

And they're completely missing the third option, which is crazy, but

she could actually be in charge of herself, right.

She's actually an adult, like it's so, it's so offensive.

But you know, we have to kind of presence that we have many

generations of this idea forming that a woman in labor is

hysterical. You know, that birth is just death

waiting around the corner.

That it's so dangerous, that you

know, and the like fabric of our society says that women can't be

trusted and women, you know, can't make their own decisions.

I mean, it's very alive today, so.

That's why it's kind of some

context under why I said it really does depend on your level of

misogyny. It's OK to feel nervousness, of

course, but birth is a woman's game.

You know, men are not birthing.

Men, if invited, have the enormous

privilege to witness something, you know, quite unique and quite

special. And it is incredible to see.

I would say most fathers I have been with in birth are quite

awkward and don't know what they're doing and so it is nice to

have. Another woman there kind of

helping massage the energetics of the house.

But also, of course, I've seen like my partner was amazing and

was the quiet tree.

Didn't say a word, but held a lot

of energetic space for me.

Never wavered.

You know, never furrowed a brow at me.

Was just.

The tree and that.

That's been an analogy.

I use a lot with fathers because I

coach a lot of fathers.

You know how to support their

women and that's the vision i you know, offer it to you if in case

we never talk again that that's kind of your role, you know with

your partner is.

You know, she's like the fairy

who's going to fly in and out of the tree and she's gonna fly out

to the cosmos or go down to the underworld.

And it's a lot.

She's got a lot of work to do and

it's going to be crazy.

And, you know, it might be very

physical. She might be pooping and puking

and crying and begging for help, or she might be like gone and she

might be, you know, having like a full on psychedelic experience or

a little bit of both and.

Your role, you know, as the father

of the partner umm.

I think of it for myself as a

birth attendant is like, to be this oak tree that is very in the

room. I'm not birthing.

You're not birthing.

And so it's not our job to fly all

around and be ungrounded and be untethered.

And we're not going to the cosmos to bring this little soul here.

We're not, like, in dialogue with the spirit world.

We're here in the room.

And so how do we hold that space

and, you know, feel our, you know, like the tether from our spinal

cord going all the way down into the earth and feeling really held.

By the physicality of your home and the earth.

And I think of this tether, you know, from the from the partner's

heart, you know, out to the woman so that she can kind of fly away.

But she still has a tether here so that it's fine wherever she needs

to go. Even if she needs, like, lose her

mind for a while, it's fine because we have her and we're

going to stay in the room umm.

Yeah, because especially now that

I've had a child that shit gets crazy.

It is very psychedelic and who it is really wild in that altered

state of consciousness and my husband Johnny really just knew

how to root down and hold and not disrupt, not ask, not disturb

ever. He just held it and it he didn't

make it about him.

And that's I see men who are used

to having things made about them.

Maybe they're very emotional,

maybe they're very self involved, maybe they're very nervous, maybe

they're very insecure and they don't know how to step out of that

and just let this be about her.

You know, and of course, like

you're having an experience, you're becoming a father, you're

getting to witness the miracle of life, like you're a part of it, of

course, but.

She's literally doing all of the

work, you know, the spiritual work, the physical work, the

social work, like all of it, you know?

And so anything we can do to.

Step back and see what happens

when a woman becoming mother is truly centered.

It's just magnificent and it sets her up for a blissful postpartum,

you know, blissful mothering relationship anyway.

So yeah, i think with good intention.

Men can show up and be really awesome, but it requires some

serious maturity to contend with, the parts of it that scares you,

and the parts you want to control.

And the parts that aren't about

you? That's kind of where I see men

struggle beautiful thank you so much.

That a lot of that resonates with me around my own work in showing

up in the world and how I show up in my own shadow.

And I can hear a lot of reflections in there that are of

value to me and I hope for any other men who have listened to

this. So yeah.

Thank you.

Thank you, Emily.

It's you're welcome.

It's a real pleasure.

And if there is any last thing that you'd like to share, just

something that maybe for those who are at the beginning of this kind

of journey of realizing that things aren't what we've been told

and that they actually have to.

Be responsible for it all.

And like, how intense that can be.

Well, yeah, it's true.

The invitation.

Once you have the invitation, it's

like it's anyway.

So yeah, just any.

Like, I would yeah i mean, I would just plug how to find me so that

if you're into this, you can just dive in.

You know, there's so many different ways to interact with my

work in the world and the women that I work with.

We've referenced the podcast throughout.

And so that's a free resource, obviously, that you can find.

It's just called the free Birth Society podcast and that has five

seasons. We're heading into our sixth

season primarily of women sharing births outside the system and

they're very redemptive yeah and how many flavors it can look to

learn to take responsibility and say yes to what you really want

and in your life and creating the family dynamic that you want.

So we have the podcast is amazing.

And then we have a private

membership where I hang out.

That's, you know, for women only.

And you don't have to be a mother to join.

And we have the complete guide to free birth, which is an incredible

course that breaks all of this down from a childbirth education,

you know, lens.

And then you reference the radical

birth keeper school, which is an authentic midwifery program that I

teach with one of my business partners.

Her name is Yolanda Norris Clark.

And it's just incredible.

And it's really breaking down a lot of the stuff and way more

detail and learning how to cultivate the self.

Authority to do this work in the world if you're called towards

authentic midwifery and yeah.

Lots of stuff.

You can just go to freebirthsociety.com

freebirthsociety.com thank you so much.

But yeah, I will definitely share all the links that you've shared

in the show notes and make sure that everyone gets total access to

all of that.

And you know, your Instagram is

also a great starting place for anyone who's kind of wanting to

dip their toes into that world.

And I don't know if you have time,

but I wanted to offer you something just as a thank you from

me to you.

I would like to play you a song

and it's totally fine if you don't have time or if you aren't into

it, but let me know.

Go for it.

I'm free till noon, yeah fantastic.

So this is a song that is called radical and it's actually a song

that connected me with the lovely Freya.

Who I think you guys are connected.

Very fair kellett i don't know how to say her surname, but anyway,

she. This is a song that I've been

thinking about for a long time.

And it was again, in response to

everything that's unfolding right now or has been unfolding for

generations, actually. And that's this last COVID thing

for me was like a real kick in the ass to actually see, like, I'm

not, I'm not, I'm not in for that.

I'm in for this.

And yeah.

And so this is the song that kind

of talks to that, and that's why it's called radical.

And also it was, it was amber of mythic medicine who told me that

the word radical is that which rises from the root.

Of that which comes from the root.

And I just think it's such a

powerful reclamation of language to reclaim a word like that.

So yes, thank you.

This is for you, just honoring you

and your work in the world.

And thank you so much.

It doesn't matter what you say or do.

I already feel true.

Blossoming real deep inside of me.

Radical is bearing fruit, so I'll say this with our love to you.

Fuck you if you think I'll uproot myself just to play a part in your

living hell.

Fuck you if you think I'll sink in

the light, I rise for light and life.

As the fruit contains a living sea, our mother will restore.

Act on this and we're already free.

Maria, raise your ears.

Raise your roar once more.

Fuck you if you think I'll uproot myself just to play a part in your

living head.

Fuck you if you think I'll sink in

the lie I rise for light.

Please don't mistake me for

replying, old fighter.

I'm the heart of love.

I'm shining brighter.

If you misplaced or misaligned

your power, join us.

Sing it louder.

Fuck you if you think I'll uproot myself.

Just to play a part in your living hell.

Fuck you think? Thank you, candlelight.

I rise for light and light.

Is that one titled fuck you?

Maybe it should be.

It's called radical, but maybe

fuck you is a more appropriate title.

I love it sketchy.

That's awesome.

Thank you again, Emily.

Thank you and blessings on the

path. I look forward to connecting again

and I hope to have you back on here someday when we can talk

about wow remember back in the old days when people used to birth in

hospitals? Oh my God, seriously, let me know

when your girl gets pregnant and we'll talk.

I definitely will.

That'll be an exciting day.

Thank you, Emily blessings all the best.

Take care.

Alright, beautiful people.

Thank you.

Thank you, thank you.

What a blessing to share this with you Emily.

Fantastic Free Birth society.

Be sure to check them out at all

the places you mentioned.

You can find them on Instagram,

free birthsociety.com etcetera. They've got loads of

free epic stuff as well as paid phenomenal memberships for women

and courses on birthing and all kinds of amazing, wonderful stuff.

So thank you for this, for joining us, for this episode of we are

already free, this beautiful simple remembrance that we can

reclaim. Our sovereignty, we can reclaim

that inalienable, inescapable truth, that we are already free,

that we are the divine experiencing itself, and we come

in through the portal of birth and it is critical how that happens,

and it is critical that we reclaim that.

And we take responsibility for that.

At least that is the invitation.

It is the choice.

So thank you again to all of you.

Please do be sure to check this

podcast out further.

Nathan dot Africa forward Slash

podcast. There are going to be amazing

guests coming up and I'm just so excited to be sharing this with

you. I wish you well.

Take care of yourselves.

Take care of each other.

And remember we are already free blessings hey there.

This is Nathan again.

Just one quick more thing.

I that previous outro i recorded just after the session with Emily

and I really just wanted to reiterate and request that this is

the time.

If you're still listening to this,

please go to Apple Podcasts.

Go to all the places where

podcasts are. You can actually go to Nathan dot

Africa forward Slash podcast and I will make sure there's a button

there so you can easily go and subscribe and leave a review and

share and all those things.

It may seem like a small action to

you. It'll take 30 seconds a minute,

and what it will mean is that this podcast.

Show up for many more people.

Someone sees a review, they go,

oh, that might be something I should listen to.

Or if enough people review and subscribe in the first few weeks

and months of this podcast, then it means it'll show up in the new

and noteworthy parts of Apple Podcasts, which then could be seen

by tens, if not hundreds of thousands of people who could then

get these beautiful messages directly into their inboxes.

I mean, what a phenomenal thing.

This is so awesome.

So please take that action.

It makes a difference.

It matters.

And that really is it for today.

So thank you.

Again, it's been a real pleasure

and I hope to hear from you sometime soon.

It's one of the strange things about podcasting is I don't know

who's out there, so find me on Nathan dot Africa forward Slash

podcast. I'll have links to my socials.

You can send me an email, you could leave me a voice note.

I would love to hear from you and I would love to collaborate and Co

create this podcast together.

So thanks again.

Blessings on your path.