1 00:00:17,098 --> 00:00:19,998 DJ Sir Daniel: and welcome back to another episode of Queue Points podcast. 2 00:00:20,028 --> 00:00:21,398 I am DJ Sir Daniel. 3 00:00:21,643 --> 00:00:24,133 Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government 4 00:00:24,173 --> 00:00:29,493 as Johnnie Ray Kornegay the third and Sir Daniel time flies. 5 00:00:29,503 --> 00:00:35,653 We are back in the holiday season, the holiday spirit, sir. 6 00:00:36,298 --> 00:00:37,128 DJ Sir Daniel: Absolutely. 7 00:00:37,128 --> 00:00:38,518 It's that time of year. 8 00:00:38,728 --> 00:00:42,708 Go ahead and double fist that hot cup of cocoa that you have right now. 9 00:00:43,178 --> 00:00:47,178 And just cozy on up to another episode of Queue Points podcast because Jay 10 00:00:47,178 --> 00:00:52,138 Ray after years, and I do mean years, like especially for me after years of 11 00:00:52,138 --> 00:00:57,713 experiencing the holidays and You know, all the stuff that comes along with it. 12 00:00:58,613 --> 00:01:02,313 Does Christmas music still give you, you know, the warm fuzzies? 13 00:01:02,313 --> 00:01:05,923 And does it, you know, make you feel holly and jolly still? 14 00:01:05,923 --> 00:01:08,623 Cause I'm trying to think, does that still do it for me? 15 00:01:08,623 --> 00:01:09,283 How about you? 16 00:01:09,988 --> 00:01:14,728 Jay Ray: So the short answer to your question is yes, but I feel like I 17 00:01:14,728 --> 00:01:20,258 need to explain for because I was too cool for school for like a long 18 00:01:20,258 --> 00:01:27,868 time, I would say things like, I'm not really into holiday music, right? 19 00:01:28,658 --> 00:01:29,308 That was a lie. 20 00:01:30,118 --> 00:01:35,538 think what think what soured me to holiday music is as a person who 21 00:01:35,538 --> 00:01:39,308 worked in retail for many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many years. 22 00:01:39,383 --> 00:01:40,463 DJ Sir Daniel: Talk about it. 23 00:01:41,123 --> 00:01:46,043 Jay Ray: In November, actually it was, so back then it was like November, 24 00:01:46,053 --> 00:01:52,943 like you could time it, one, all of a sudden the dang Beatles started playing 25 00:01:53,013 --> 00:01:57,553 and would hear holiday music all day. 26 00:01:57,958 --> 00:02:03,398 ad nauseum an entire month, uh, the entire two months. 27 00:02:03,408 --> 00:02:04,608 So it was like November to December. 28 00:02:05,318 --> 00:02:10,208 so I think I internalized that experience with, I don't like holiday music. 29 00:02:11,528 --> 00:02:14,818 I do like holiday music and it does still give me the warm and fuzzies. 30 00:02:14,848 --> 00:02:18,698 But I think what's interesting about it, Sir Daniel is I 31 00:02:18,698 --> 00:02:20,168 still like the classics, man. 32 00:02:20,368 --> 00:02:21,848 The classics still do it for me. 33 00:02:22,098 --> 00:02:24,658 I can listen to them classics every day, all the time. 34 00:02:24,748 --> 00:02:25,118 Don't matter. 35 00:02:25,268 --> 00:02:30,338 Yes. 36 00:02:30,498 --> 00:02:33,692 DJ Sir Daniel: had a chokehold specifically on the black community 37 00:02:33,692 --> 00:02:39,328 since they dropped, um, last century, cause it's been, it's been a whole 38 00:02:39,338 --> 00:02:42,888 nother century since these songs dropped, but they've been recycled. 39 00:02:42,888 --> 00:02:43,758 They've been covered. 40 00:02:43,768 --> 00:02:47,308 They've been, you know, fizzed up for new generations. 41 00:02:48,113 --> 00:02:55,503 The originals still hold, hold a magic over us the years. 42 00:02:55,503 --> 00:03:01,833 And I'm talking about, of course, the Christmas song by Nat King Cole and 43 00:03:02,093 --> 00:03:04,793 this Christmas by Donnie Hathaway. 44 00:03:05,533 --> 00:03:09,713 And Jay Ray, since, uh, well, what is that hold that it has 45 00:03:09,743 --> 00:03:11,153 over us in the black community? 46 00:03:11,173 --> 00:03:17,763 Those two songs in particular, I have my, I have some theories around it, but 47 00:03:17,763 --> 00:03:21,723 you know, and you know me, I'm a, I guess I'm a theorist over here on Queue Points, 48 00:03:21,723 --> 00:03:26,383 but I want to hear, you know, your take on why these two songs in particular 49 00:03:26,383 --> 00:03:28,193 kind of have a choke hold on us. 50 00:03:31,708 --> 00:03:32,068 Jay Ray: Hmm. 51 00:03:32,108 --> 00:03:33,838 That is a really interesting question. 52 00:03:34,278 --> 00:03:36,758 So what's interesting about the Christmas song? 53 00:03:36,768 --> 00:03:39,778 First and foremost, it was written by Robert Wells and Mel Tormé. 54 00:03:40,668 --> 00:03:43,578 Um, but of course, made famous by Nat King Cole. 55 00:03:44,328 --> 00:03:54,028 Um, and I think that song has a chokehold on our community because one, it was, 56 00:03:54,028 --> 00:04:02,658 um, It was a song by a black artist released at a time when black artists 57 00:04:02,698 --> 00:04:08,458 didn't have like the cachet and like the general pop community at the time. 58 00:04:08,748 --> 00:04:12,858 So, Nat King Cole, I think, represented the possibility 59 00:04:12,918 --> 00:04:15,138 of the American dream, right? 60 00:04:15,428 --> 00:04:18,113 And so black people were like, this. 61 00:04:18,148 --> 00:04:19,028 DJ Sir Daniel: give me that. 62 00:04:19,138 --> 00:04:19,458 Yeah. 63 00:04:19,573 --> 00:04:21,613 Jay Ray: Give me more of that, please. 64 00:04:22,013 --> 00:04:25,203 And also, it's well sung, and it's a beautiful song. 65 00:04:25,233 --> 00:04:26,993 And they did their big one on that. 66 00:04:27,033 --> 00:04:29,033 So that's, for the Christmas song, I think it's that. 67 00:04:29,093 --> 00:04:33,963 For this Christmas, I think this Christmas is just like a 68 00:04:33,963 --> 00:04:36,313 quintessentially black Christmas song. 69 00:04:36,588 --> 00:04:37,078 DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm. 70 00:04:37,343 --> 00:04:40,613 Jay Ray: And I think that's why it has a chokehold on the black community. 71 00:04:40,613 --> 00:04:41,923 And it's also a groove. 72 00:04:42,243 --> 00:04:45,593 I mean, who can't did it, it did it, did it, did it. 73 00:04:45,593 --> 00:04:48,863 It's got all the stuff that black folks want in that song. 74 00:04:50,073 --> 00:04:50,253 Yeah. 75 00:04:50,583 --> 00:04:52,423 I think that's why those two songs have a chokehold. 76 00:04:52,423 --> 00:04:53,693 What are you, what is your theory? 77 00:04:53,743 --> 00:04:54,103 What is your 78 00:04:54,368 --> 00:05:00,078 DJ Sir Daniel: So I'm gonna hold my theory just a little bit because You um, 79 00:05:00,088 --> 00:05:05,333 you brought up a couple things regarding both songs, but preparing for this 80 00:05:05,363 --> 00:05:09,133 episode, Jay Ray, you and I discovered some things regarding these records 81 00:05:09,503 --> 00:05:11,233 that I don't think a lot of people know. 82 00:05:11,263 --> 00:05:12,643 And that's what key points is here for. 83 00:05:13,003 --> 00:05:17,433 Um, both songs are synonymous with the holidays, but we discovered that 84 00:05:17,433 --> 00:05:20,243 they were not immediate hit records. 85 00:05:20,558 --> 00:05:22,148 Jay Ray: Not at all. 86 00:05:22,158 --> 00:05:26,078 So a couple of quick history notes for the Christmas song. 87 00:05:26,278 --> 00:05:30,468 So the Christmas song was, um, first recorded, which might surprise people. 88 00:05:30,478 --> 00:05:35,478 It was first recorded in 1946 by the Nat King Cole Trio. 89 00:05:35,828 --> 00:05:39,578 It was written in 45, recorded in 1946 by the Nat King Cole Trio. 90 00:05:39,608 --> 00:05:45,718 And actually, the Christmas song has Four distinct recordings. 91 00:05:46,138 --> 00:05:53,448 So the first recording happened at WMCA Studios in 1946, as we mentioned. 92 00:05:54,148 --> 00:05:59,958 There was another recording at Studios in, um, so one was recorded in June, 93 00:05:59,968 --> 00:06:02,738 one, one was recorded in August of 46. 94 00:06:03,158 --> 00:06:07,088 The second recording there included the Nat King Cole trio and a choir. 95 00:06:08,378 --> 00:06:08,748 they were like 96 00:06:08,888 --> 00:06:31,387 DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah. 97 00:06:31,933 --> 00:06:36,463 Jay Ray: fourth, recording of the song, which was actually recorded in 1961. 98 00:06:38,148 --> 00:06:40,168 In the studio at Capitol Studios. 99 00:06:40,228 --> 00:06:43,278 And that is the one that we're most familiar with. 100 00:06:43,318 --> 00:06:44,398 It's Nat King Cole. 101 00:06:44,408 --> 00:06:46,518 It wasn't even the Nat King Cole trio then. 102 00:06:46,858 --> 00:06:52,198 It was just Nat King Cole, the band, the, the, the orchestra, et cetera. 103 00:06:53,803 --> 00:06:58,203 Interesting tidbit about the Christmas song is there actually are four 104 00:06:58,203 --> 00:07:01,663 different recordings of that song that all kind of have their own feel. 105 00:07:01,853 --> 00:07:05,283 We are the most familiar with the last, so that's that on that one. 106 00:07:06,083 --> 00:07:12,033 This Christmas, of course, written by one Donnie Hathaway, who is credited 107 00:07:12,033 --> 00:07:18,383 as Donnie Pitts, uh, for this song and co written by Nadine Teresa McKenner. 108 00:07:18,653 --> 00:07:21,533 Now Nadine is really important to this song because the 109 00:07:21,533 --> 00:07:22,823 song really starts with her. 110 00:07:23,298 --> 00:07:23,638 DJ Sir Daniel: Right. 111 00:07:24,503 --> 00:07:27,393 Jay Ray: She's working in, um, as the story goes, she 112 00:07:27,393 --> 00:07:29,143 was working in the post office 113 00:07:29,468 --> 00:07:30,884 DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm. 114 00:07:30,884 --> 00:07:33,157 Mm hmm. 115 00:07:33,753 --> 00:07:36,263 Jay Ray: Nat King Cole in her head. 116 00:07:37,818 --> 00:07:38,378 DJ Sir Daniel: So through line. 117 00:07:38,388 --> 00:07:39,098 Yes. 118 00:07:39,148 --> 00:07:39,728 Jay Ray: through line. 119 00:07:39,738 --> 00:07:43,868 So she's in there thinking about Nat King Cole and she's humming along this 120 00:07:43,868 --> 00:07:46,328 Christmas, da, da, da, Nat King Cole. 121 00:07:46,328 --> 00:07:49,958 We're doing a whole thing, trying to get herself through the day. 122 00:07:50,868 --> 00:07:53,018 And here comes the opportunity. 123 00:07:53,018 --> 00:07:55,288 And that's 1967, by the 124 00:07:55,788 --> 00:07:57,318 they wrote the song initially, 125 00:07:57,818 --> 00:07:58,788 DJ Sir Daniel: I think that's very important. 126 00:07:59,168 --> 00:08:00,908 Jay Ray: That is really important, right? 127 00:08:01,178 --> 00:08:06,598 So this is, what, six years after the most famous version of Nat King Cole's song. 128 00:08:06,838 --> 00:08:11,018 So that's still a contemporary song by the time they record this Christmas. 129 00:08:12,708 --> 00:08:18,618 Donny Hathaway's, uh, uh, to this song is that Donny Hathaway 130 00:08:18,748 --> 00:08:22,438 wanted a quintessentially black Christmas song, right? 131 00:08:23,188 --> 00:08:29,668 And, um, by 1970, they record this song And Sir Daniel, we learned this. 132 00:08:29,678 --> 00:08:31,558 We were both surprised by this. 133 00:08:32,728 --> 00:08:36,338 this Christmas was not a hit when it dropped. 134 00:08:36,348 --> 00:08:37,518 Like, this 135 00:08:37,778 --> 00:08:38,318 DJ Sir Daniel: paid it 136 00:08:38,948 --> 00:08:43,338 Jay Ray: y'all paid this Christmas dust. 137 00:08:43,928 --> 00:08:49,068 This Christmas did not become a hit song until after Mr. 138 00:08:49,118 --> 00:08:50,228 Hathaway's death. 139 00:08:51,228 --> 00:08:55,623 This Christmas was just like, It languished for 140 00:08:55,643 --> 00:08:58,373 years before becoming a hit. 141 00:08:59,738 --> 00:09:03,998 DJ Sir Daniel: And the thing about that with very popular songs, um, that 142 00:09:03,998 --> 00:09:11,018 sometimes really great songs essence, sometimes they don't automatically 143 00:09:11,298 --> 00:09:13,128 become a commercial success. 144 00:09:13,253 --> 00:09:13,363 Jay Ray: Mm 145 00:09:13,508 --> 00:09:14,568 DJ Sir Daniel: They're like crock pots. 146 00:09:14,568 --> 00:09:18,668 And I think a lot of producers and musicians back then wrote songs 147 00:09:19,143 --> 00:09:19,493 Jay Ray: Mm hmm. 148 00:09:19,498 --> 00:09:21,098 DJ Sir Daniel: for the crock pot generation. 149 00:09:21,658 --> 00:09:26,458 Meaning that they were, they were allowed, yeah, those songs were allowed to simmer, 150 00:09:26,518 --> 00:09:31,398 to stew, to, to, to, to double up on the flavor and really get ingrained. 151 00:09:31,708 --> 00:09:36,398 And then they have this longevity that goes on for years, so much so 152 00:09:36,788 --> 00:09:40,998 that in doing research for this, um, topic, I discovered that there 153 00:09:40,998 --> 00:09:43,778 are like 80 covers and counting. 154 00:09:45,183 --> 00:09:48,803 Of the Donny Hathaway classic this Christmas, 80 covers and counting. 155 00:09:48,813 --> 00:09:54,643 Cause I'm sure I'm certain when y'all is out there cooking up a remix right 156 00:09:54,653 --> 00:09:59,623 now that we may not need, but go ahead, do your thing, do your big one. 157 00:10:00,338 --> 00:10:00,998 it in the mix. 158 00:10:01,018 --> 00:10:01,978 You see what happens. 159 00:10:01,978 --> 00:10:03,488 Maybe it'll become a hit for you. 160 00:10:03,918 --> 00:10:07,938 But yes, there's like 80 plus covers of this Christmas. 161 00:10:08,238 --> 00:10:14,858 There are approximately 1, 709 covers of the Nat King Cole 162 00:10:14,868 --> 00:10:17,338 classic, the Christmas song. 163 00:10:19,378 --> 00:10:20,308 That's 164 00:10:21,038 --> 00:10:24,998 Jay Ray: makes 165 00:10:25,038 --> 00:10:28,168 DJ Sir Daniel: industry is all about collecting dollars. 166 00:10:28,458 --> 00:10:32,008 And sometimes if it ain't broke, fix it. 167 00:10:32,808 --> 00:10:36,408 do, you know, don't recreate, you don't have to recreate the wheel, just do what 168 00:10:36,408 --> 00:10:38,618 works and give the people what they want. 169 00:10:39,058 --> 00:10:44,328 So we come to the end of, um, as we get ready to wrap up on this episode, 170 00:10:44,788 --> 00:10:49,648 I kind of want to go back to what I was asking you in regards to why these 171 00:10:49,648 --> 00:10:53,348 songs have such a chokehold on us, specifically in the black community. 172 00:10:54,148 --> 00:10:55,398 you hit the nail on the head. 173 00:10:55,708 --> 00:11:03,343 Jay Ray: Silence. 174 00:11:03,398 --> 00:11:10,208 DJ Sir Daniel: this Christmas reflect two distinct eras in black America's history. 175 00:11:11,158 --> 00:11:35,538 Jay Ray: Yes. 176 00:11:35,758 --> 00:11:40,718 DJ Sir Daniel: of the things that affected black Americans deeply in the 177 00:11:40,718 --> 00:11:47,448 Jim Crow era, the post civil war era, the, you know, right up until the civil 178 00:11:47,448 --> 00:11:53,173 rights movement, there's this, like you said earlier, this need to feel Um, 179 00:11:53,503 --> 00:11:57,753 like you're entitled to the American dream and whatever that looks like. 180 00:11:57,903 --> 00:12:00,603 Well, back then it looked like class. 181 00:12:00,603 --> 00:12:01,783 It looked like pearls. 182 00:12:01,783 --> 00:12:05,933 It looked like, you know, a starched suit and, you know, 183 00:12:05,983 --> 00:12:08,213 mom with her pin curls and 2. 184 00:12:08,493 --> 00:12:09,653 5, 2. 185 00:12:10,123 --> 00:12:11,703 5 kids and a dog. 186 00:12:12,033 --> 00:12:14,783 All of those things that we were told is the American dream. 187 00:12:15,173 --> 00:12:17,903 I don't know that this is something that they just kept telling 188 00:12:17,903 --> 00:12:19,063 us while we were growing up. 189 00:12:19,423 --> 00:12:20,163 Jay Ray: what did that mean? 190 00:12:21,013 --> 00:12:23,173 DJ Sir Daniel: Well, I think back then you were encouraged, like 191 00:12:23,173 --> 00:12:26,372 it was, they were encouraged for population reasons to have 2. 192 00:12:26,373 --> 00:12:27,493 5. 193 00:12:27,603 --> 00:12:28,883 It's like two in a possible. 194 00:12:28,903 --> 00:12:30,163 I don't know what that meant either. 195 00:12:30,893 --> 00:12:32,523 And the dog, don't forget the dog. 196 00:12:32,533 --> 00:12:33,373 You gotta have that. 197 00:12:33,413 --> 00:12:33,883 Jay Ray: the dog. 198 00:12:33,893 --> 00:12:35,033 You have to have a dog. 199 00:12:35,503 --> 00:12:35,533 Right. 200 00:12:35,903 --> 00:12:39,703 DJ Sir Daniel: And so, so yes, that's why we get this picture of, and Nat 201 00:12:39,703 --> 00:12:45,498 King Cole fit the bill, you know, he was a, a beautiful, Dark skinned black 202 00:12:45,498 --> 00:12:47,968 man, but he had that clonk was on point. 203 00:12:48,338 --> 00:12:52,858 It was slanted to the side and he had a part, you know, he was, you know, the 204 00:12:52,858 --> 00:12:58,988 suit and tie just very classy set, you know, something that we as black Americans 205 00:12:59,338 --> 00:13:06,428 could aspire to and white America felt comfortable around, which is really the 206 00:13:06,428 --> 00:13:11,298 biggest deal is that they felt comfortable with that representation of black. 207 00:13:11,833 --> 00:13:17,033 This and yeah, and so that's why they were, they were on fine with that. 208 00:13:17,353 --> 00:13:19,723 And I think that's what propelled that song to heights. 209 00:13:20,723 --> 00:13:23,563 then this Christmas was the opposite, but go ahead. 210 00:13:23,563 --> 00:13:23,993 I see you 211 00:13:24,038 --> 00:13:24,538 Jay Ray: Yeah, 212 00:13:24,603 --> 00:13:25,202 DJ Sir Daniel: to say something. 213 00:13:25,203 --> 00:13:27,523 Mm hmm. 214 00:13:27,523 --> 00:13:29,842 Mm hmm. 215 00:13:29,842 --> 00:13:31,002 Mm. 216 00:13:32,518 --> 00:13:35,178 Jay Ray: So I know that I've mentioned this in past holiday 217 00:13:35,208 --> 00:13:36,898 episodes, but it bears repeating. 218 00:13:37,228 --> 00:13:43,848 Um, for me, the Christmas song represents like the, the start of the 219 00:13:43,848 --> 00:13:50,148 holidays because my father, he had that old tattered Nat King Cole album 220 00:13:50,428 --> 00:13:53,838 with all the Christmas, like it would be like the cover was falling apart. 221 00:13:54,158 --> 00:13:58,368 Cause he had had it since the night, this is 1961, right? 222 00:13:58,768 --> 00:14:03,868 But he would pop that neck King Cole on as we were decorating the 223 00:14:03,868 --> 00:14:06,048 tree or doing whatever we were doing around the house during the 224 00:14:06,048 --> 00:14:08,318 holidays, especially if he was home. 225 00:14:08,728 --> 00:14:12,758 Um, during that time, if he worked first shift during the holidays, we knew 226 00:14:12,758 --> 00:14:18,548 that that evening dad was going to want to do lights and do the tree and that 227 00:14:18,548 --> 00:14:19,958 King Cole was going to start playing. 228 00:14:20,368 --> 00:14:21,948 Even though I couldn't smell it, right? 229 00:14:22,038 --> 00:14:25,548 Even though I'm sorry, even though we didn't have it, I could smell 230 00:14:25,548 --> 00:14:27,538 chestnuts roasting on an open fire. 231 00:14:27,858 --> 00:14:30,998 I don't know what that smelled like, but I, I do know what it smelled like 232 00:14:31,058 --> 00:14:33,858 because we was smelling it in my house. 233 00:14:34,078 --> 00:14:36,928 It wasn't no chestnuts roasting on Wayne had no open flyers, no 234 00:14:36,928 --> 00:14:38,368 open fires other than the stove. 235 00:14:38,708 --> 00:14:42,468 It wasn't no chestnuts on there, but the feeling, right? 236 00:14:42,478 --> 00:14:43,458 You smelled it. 237 00:14:43,498 --> 00:14:44,388 You felt it. 238 00:14:45,058 --> 00:14:47,188 My father never played. 239 00:14:47,558 --> 00:14:50,078 I don't know that he even owned this Christmas. 240 00:14:51,383 --> 00:14:54,243 DJ Sir Daniel: That's wild that you say that, because from what I understand, 241 00:14:54,273 --> 00:15:02,303 a lot of, a lot of us don't include the Christmas song on their list of 242 00:15:02,323 --> 00:15:09,043 like favorite Christmas Black Christmas holiday music, I think, and this is where 243 00:15:09,063 --> 00:15:14,543 this Christmas comes in this Christmas is post civil rights era is very much 244 00:15:14,553 --> 00:15:19,373 in the, you know, the Black Panther movement is going on and we're in this 245 00:15:19,393 --> 00:15:23,643 era of I'm black and I'm proud and, you know, we're moving into the future. 246 00:15:24,523 --> 00:15:27,793 We're moving in front into the seventies and, you know, Black 247 00:15:27,793 --> 00:15:31,843 people are feeling empowered and a lot of those respectability 248 00:15:31,843 --> 00:15:33,733 politics were out of the window. 249 00:15:33,773 --> 00:15:39,653 And this Christmas, whereas the other song was patent leather shoes and pearls, 250 00:15:39,663 --> 00:15:44,993 this Christmas is definitely an Afro pick and a leather jacket, you know, 251 00:15:45,033 --> 00:15:49,483 and maybe a turtleneck because it's reflecting a reflection of the time. 252 00:15:50,073 --> 00:15:53,223 And, you know, Donnie Hathaway, of course, that image of him 253 00:15:53,223 --> 00:15:54,753 with the big Applejack hat. 254 00:15:55,648 --> 00:16:17,298 Jay Ray: Yes. 255 00:16:17,303 --> 00:16:21,083 DJ Sir Daniel: dream is starting to feel like, wait a minute, is that real? 256 00:16:21,663 --> 00:16:22,793 Or is it a fantasy? 257 00:16:23,223 --> 00:16:27,313 You know, I'm, I'm here trying to pursue it, but I don't know if I'm 258 00:16:27,343 --> 00:16:28,813 actually going to have it, but. 259 00:16:29,723 --> 00:16:36,043 it comes to Christmastime, can create this moment of togetherness, of longing 260 00:16:36,123 --> 00:16:41,623 togetherness, and longing for a feeling of warmth and soul through this song, and 261 00:16:41,633 --> 00:16:44,343 we are forever grateful for Donnie and Mr. 262 00:16:44,343 --> 00:16:49,442 McKinnon for putting pen to paper and creating this holiday classic for us. 263 00:16:50,173 --> 00:16:51,933 Black America to enjoy, 264 00:16:51,943 --> 00:16:55,693 Jay Ray: Yeah. 265 00:16:56,493 --> 00:16:59,933 DJ Sir Daniel: um, the diaspora, you know, like I said, you can't have a 266 00:16:59,933 --> 00:17:03,623 song that's been covered over 80 times and not have different flavors of it. 267 00:17:04,473 --> 00:17:06,183 Jay Ray: Sir Daniel, I got a question then. 268 00:17:06,263 --> 00:17:08,773 Let's, let's, let's, let's, let's, let's talk about it. 269 00:17:12,043 --> 00:17:14,563 I'mma just share my, my perspective. 270 00:17:15,233 --> 00:17:19,993 I actually think this Christmas is so good that people don't need to cover it. 271 00:17:21,463 --> 00:17:26,143 I feel like this Christmas as I get why people cover the, the, the 272 00:17:26,143 --> 00:17:28,013 Christmas song because it's a standard. 273 00:17:28,053 --> 00:17:30,543 Like, it's a standard at 274 00:17:30,863 --> 00:17:31,233 DJ Sir Daniel: Yes. 275 00:17:31,623 --> 00:17:33,473 Jay Ray: In the culture, right? 276 00:17:33,533 --> 00:17:37,793 It has an arrangement, you know, where the notes land, you 277 00:17:37,803 --> 00:17:39,353 know, what the structure is. 278 00:17:39,533 --> 00:17:45,113 Whereas this Christmas is a groove it could be a lot of things, but I think 279 00:17:45,113 --> 00:17:50,093 the original is actually so perfect that we should just leave it there. 280 00:17:51,083 --> 00:17:54,223 are your thoughts on people covering this Christmas? 281 00:17:54,223 --> 00:17:56,203 Cause I don't like none of the covers. 282 00:17:56,263 --> 00:17:58,823 I heard a cover of this Christmas that I like. 283 00:18:00,133 --> 00:18:00,883 DJ Sir Daniel: You know, 284 00:18:04,778 --> 00:18:07,488 I forget who said this, but it's like a running joke. 285 00:18:07,548 --> 00:18:08,668 At least you tried. 286 00:18:10,308 --> 00:18:11,148 It's very much. 287 00:18:11,188 --> 00:18:12,098 At least you tried. 288 00:18:12,108 --> 00:18:12,708 We get it. 289 00:18:13,338 --> 00:18:13,728 Um, 290 00:18:15,988 --> 00:18:19,278 that's the thing about covers and we're going to talk about covers 291 00:18:19,298 --> 00:18:21,008 in the upcoming episodes soon. 292 00:18:21,008 --> 00:18:24,238 So make sure you stay tuned to Queue Points and subscribe. 293 00:18:24,238 --> 00:18:27,898 So when that episode drops, you'll get to chime in on that as well. 294 00:18:28,156 --> 00:18:28,816 Jay Ray: Uh, 295 00:18:28,928 --> 00:18:29,378 DJ Sir Daniel: But 296 00:18:29,476 --> 00:18:30,137 Jay Ray: Uh, 297 00:18:30,258 --> 00:18:32,148 DJ Sir Daniel: the feeling around covers is. 298 00:18:32,778 --> 00:18:33,438 Jay Ray: Uh, 299 00:18:33,448 --> 00:18:35,808 DJ Sir Daniel: one of those things that nobody really asks 300 00:18:35,808 --> 00:18:38,948 for, but I believe just artists 301 00:18:39,382 --> 00:18:40,042 Jay Ray: Uh, 302 00:18:40,358 --> 00:18:43,118 DJ Sir Daniel: have this feeling in themselves, like 303 00:18:43,344 --> 00:18:45,325 Jay Ray: Uh, Uh, Uh, 304 00:18:45,418 --> 00:18:46,908 DJ Sir Daniel: that I need to take on. 305 00:18:47,306 --> 00:18:47,966 Jay Ray: Uh, 306 00:18:48,188 --> 00:18:49,558 DJ Sir Daniel: somebody else's music. 307 00:18:49,558 --> 00:18:50,958 Some might cover a classic 308 00:18:51,268 --> 00:18:51,928 Jay Ray: Uh, 309 00:18:52,208 --> 00:18:55,448 DJ Sir Daniel: and it's also, again, it also is business. 310 00:18:56,348 --> 00:18:58,188 industry realizes. 311 00:18:58,563 --> 00:19:05,113 that covers Christmas albums, generate, um, money every single year. 312 00:19:05,763 --> 00:19:07,233 McThank you, Mariah Carey. 313 00:19:07,303 --> 00:19:08,233 They, you know, we really, 314 00:19:08,478 --> 00:19:09,788 Jay Ray: out November 1st. 315 00:19:10,203 --> 00:19:13,483 DJ Sir Daniel: you know, she started out already, so she's ready to go. 316 00:19:14,143 --> 00:19:17,583 And so I think that's just something that the industry is crew 317 00:19:17,623 --> 00:19:19,563 has created for another carrot. 318 00:19:20,028 --> 00:19:22,908 For artists to, to chase after. 319 00:19:23,928 --> 00:19:27,128 a lot of times they don't even really want to participate in it. 320 00:19:27,518 --> 00:19:29,938 They just do it because it's something that they're told that 321 00:19:30,078 --> 00:19:32,408 they have to do contractually. 322 00:19:32,508 --> 00:19:37,768 So a lot of times this not even there, they're not even wanting to do it. 323 00:19:37,958 --> 00:19:41,588 So, you know, I can take or leave a lot of covers. 324 00:19:42,578 --> 00:19:45,678 It's very rare that somebody comes along and is like, Oh yeah, you know, 325 00:19:45,678 --> 00:19:49,828 you put your foot in that and shout out to people like Brandy and Robert 326 00:19:49,828 --> 00:19:51,388 Glasper and people like that, that have. 327 00:19:51,693 --> 00:19:56,073 Put out new Christmas music with different spins on it. 328 00:19:56,543 --> 00:20:00,823 And I don't know if it'll catch on to be a classic, like these two songs 329 00:20:00,823 --> 00:20:05,313 that we've discussed, but the fact that they've attempted and that they are 330 00:20:05,713 --> 00:20:12,903 inserting new, um, Christmas music in the American songbook is to be commended. 331 00:20:12,943 --> 00:20:17,863 And we hope that new artists follow suit and give us some, you know, give us 332 00:20:17,873 --> 00:20:21,443 something else, try and give us something that can become your own classic. 333 00:20:21,938 --> 00:20:23,388 Jay Ray: Yeah, absolutely. 334 00:20:23,718 --> 00:20:28,628 Y'all, thank you so much for tuning in as we wax poetic about, uh, the 335 00:20:28,628 --> 00:20:30,468 Christmas song and this Christmas. 336 00:20:31,308 --> 00:20:32,028 you all so much. 337 00:20:32,028 --> 00:20:35,038 If you can hear us, if you can see us, please subscribe. 338 00:20:35,538 --> 00:20:37,218 Tell a friend about the show. 339 00:20:37,228 --> 00:20:40,388 Friends, family, colleagues, if you enjoy Queue Points, chances are they 340 00:20:40,388 --> 00:20:42,078 will enjoy Queue Points as well. 341 00:20:43,078 --> 00:20:44,138 the question. 342 00:20:44,138 --> 00:20:48,388 And Which song is your favorite? 343 00:20:48,778 --> 00:20:49,968 Do you like the Christmas song? 344 00:20:49,978 --> 00:20:51,068 Do you like this Christmas? 345 00:20:51,118 --> 00:20:53,748 Is there another Christmas classic that you really enjoy? 346 00:20:54,048 --> 00:20:54,788 Let us know. 347 00:20:54,788 --> 00:20:57,448 You can always email us at info at Queue Points. 348 00:20:57,608 --> 00:20:58,128 com. 349 00:20:58,448 --> 00:21:03,698 Find us on social media at Definitely hop in our DMs and let us know. 350 00:21:03,718 --> 00:21:07,908 We would love to share your favorite Christmas song. 351 00:21:08,663 --> 00:21:09,143 it out. 352 00:21:09,273 --> 00:21:13,393 If you want to support Queue Points, head on over to our website at Queue Points. 353 00:21:13,543 --> 00:21:13,923 com. 354 00:21:13,923 --> 00:21:15,353 You can do a lot of things over there. 355 00:21:15,353 --> 00:21:17,153 You could subscribe to our newsletter. 356 00:21:17,493 --> 00:21:20,813 You could get additional content over on our sub stack. 357 00:21:20,843 --> 00:21:21,603 That's magazine. 358 00:21:21,833 --> 00:21:22,333 Queue Points. 359 00:21:22,493 --> 00:21:22,923 com. 360 00:21:23,338 --> 00:21:27,798 While you're over there, you can also read, um, other stories and other content 361 00:21:27,868 --> 00:21:29,408 that we have in the Queue Points universe. 362 00:21:29,638 --> 00:21:35,198 And last but not least, you can go ahead and you can shop our store at store. 363 00:21:35,368 --> 00:21:35,928 Queue Points. 364 00:21:35,948 --> 00:21:36,258 com. 365 00:21:36,268 --> 00:21:37,298 We'd really appreciate it. 366 00:21:37,548 --> 00:21:40,098 Helps to keep the lights on in Queue Points land. 367 00:21:40,148 --> 00:21:40,868 We love y'all. 368 00:21:40,888 --> 00:21:41,818 We appreciate y'all. 369 00:21:42,558 --> 00:21:43,168 DJ Sir Daniel: That's right. 370 00:21:43,168 --> 00:21:45,868 And what do I say at the end of every episode in this life? 371 00:21:45,888 --> 00:21:46,938 You have a choice. 372 00:21:47,048 --> 00:21:50,338 You can either pick up the needle or you can let the record play. 373 00:21:50,658 --> 00:21:52,298 My name is DJ Sir Daniel, 374 00:21:52,488 --> 00:21:53,568 Jay Ray: My name is Jay Ray, y'all. 375 00:21:54,108 --> 00:21:56,248 DJ Sir Daniel: and this has been Queue Points podcast, dropping 376 00:21:56,248 --> 00:21:59,008 the needle on black music history. 377 00:21:59,268 --> 00:22:00,778 We'll see you on the next go round. 378 00:22:00,928 --> 00:22:01,488 Peace. 379 00:22:01,708 --> 00:22:02,398 Jay Ray: Peace, y'all.